Increasing your PRODUCTIVITY + PROFIT through SKILLS w/ Kirsty Knight

Okay, hello my friend! Welcome to this very special episode of the podcast where I'm going to be talking to the fabulous Morgan Gillis, who I've actually worked with recently. Um, I worked with this year to help me get more strategic with my Instagram content, so I'm excited to start implementing what we worked on because I haven't actually started implementing yet. Um, but I wanted to have a conversation with her today because I want to bring in other business owners who offer different services to me, but who have actionable advice within their specific field that can help you either save time or optimize your time, and who are also willing to not only share some of the things that they do to help them manage their own time, like what hacks they found useful for them, because everyone is different, um, but who are also open to sharing some of their struggles with creating their own work-life balance or whatever it is in their like juggling all the things, because I think that sometimes we think that we're the only ones who are struggling to juggle it all, or who are getting in our own way, even when we know what we should be doing to make it easier for ourselves. Um, so we're just gonna dive in. So welcome, Morgan! Thank you so much for joining us here today. So please introduce yourself and what you do, and then to start, let us know how you started in your business and also what your party trick is.

I love it. First of all, am I the first guest on here?

You might be. Okay, I mean, you're the first one that we're recording, so I don't know if it's gonna go out first, but yeah, potentially.

TBD.

Well, I'm making a good one regardless. No pressure.

Um, yeah, totally. Uh, so yeah, my name is Morgan, um, and basically in its simplest format, like, I help coaches sign clients on Instagram. So that's pretty much what I do, um, and In terms of how I got started, I would say that I got started from not being able to do that. Probably like why most people start their businesses. Like, that was my biggest struggle. I got certified in like health coaching and fitness coaching and CrossFit and nutrition and had, you know, quadruple certifications. And probably for 5 years I was on struggle street and just like could not figure it out, waiting tables to pay bills forever, really treating my business like a hobby kind of, and just just not knowing, just really not knowing how to sign clients. And so I think once I transcended that and really was like, wow, once I had some really big results and figured like, oh, like I think at one point it was like super dramatic, but I went from making like $1,000 a month to like, you know, making my first $20K month in a very short space of time. And I was like, holy freaking crap, like just blew up my paradigm of what was possible. And so I think like, yeah, that's kind of how I got into this is trying to do it in the health coaching side and really not figuring it out. And then once I did figure it out, I was like, oh, I got to, I got to kind of teach this. And I think the last thing you said was like, what's your party trick?

Mm-hmm.

So this is going to tell you guys a lot about me, but my party trick is just not to attend the party. Like, I just don't party that much, so I don't have a party trick. Maybe.

Maybe you've never been a party animal.

Uh, very, very rarely. Like, maybe like when I was in college in like 2011, like maybe I went to like—

I had 3 rocking nights in like 2 years, you know? Like, it's never really been a huge thing for me.

Okay, fine.

Yeah, so you like to stay in?

Yeah, she let me off the hook. I'm a baby grandma.

How old are you?

I'm 30.

Love it. Each their own. Fine. That's the whole point of the question, to let us know who you are. So perfect. Nailed it. Okay, so the first— I mean, the first reason why I want to bring people on who know what they're doing in their field is because I think that one of the best ways to optimize your time is through getting better at like different areas of your business. So the more you work on your skill sets in marketing, selling, leading a team, you know, running your business, delivering, all of those things, the less time it will take you to get good results in all of those areas. So that's why I worked with you, because I had basically spent well over a year posting shitty content on Instagram pretty much that was just whatever came to mind that wasn't really, um, sort of hitting the mark on, you know, across the spectrum of content that you need to create really to help your people go from strangers to actually knowing you and trusting you and also thinking that you have the solution to their problem and then buying from you. Like, I wasn't doing that whole range of um, marketing content. So I worked with you just to help me get really clear on like what are the different aspects and also really optimize, um, my time through knowing and understanding a bit more of how to use Instagram as a platform. Because if you're just posting one type of content on Instagram and you're not using any of the features and you're not doing any of the other things that, you know, like the ecosystem of really building your business on Instagram, then like you are going to be just wasting time and wasting effort. It's very frustrating and a lot of people, yeah, won't get the results from it anyway. So that's why I started working with you. So can you say more about that? What you see or, you know, the typical things they need to do that's different?

Yeah, totally. Like this is a— I think this is a brilliant point. I actually think to some degree you're giving me a little bit of like an aha moment of like, when you actually increase your skills, like that's a productivity hack.

Like I feel a Threads quote coming on about this, right? Um, that's a quote card right there.

Um, but yeah, like you hit the nail on the head with the ecosystem. And the interesting thing with like Instagram is like it all does really, really, really work together. Like the, like optimizing your profile, setting it up so it's like a sales funnel, like what you're putting out in your content, making sure you've got the right kinds of content. Making sure that like you're using, you know, I have like defined things like stories are for this, feed is for this, like, you know what I mean? But like selling on your stories, the backend of Instagram, meaning the conversations and the engagement, like all that stuff goes together and like it really is a whole system. So when you can like learn how to, you know, almost have it play nice together and you're using all the things, like example, if you post the right kind of content but you don't do the backend engagement type of stuff, then that amazing content that you posted doesn't go as far as it could because you didn't do the backend work. And so, yeah, like if you do increase your skills around that, um, it just makes the effort that you're putting in go even farther, you know? Um, I think like another perfect example of this is like one that's easy to share data about is like, let's say sales calls, you know, like let's say you're not that great at closing sales. And your close rate's 25%, cool. Um, let's say it's, you know, you're spending 10 hours a week on, on doing sales calls and your close rate's 25%, cool. If you got your close rate to 50%, you doubled it, you can make the same amount of sales in literally half the time. Like you just went from 10, you just got 5 hours back in your week just from getting better at sales and you're still making the same money.

Or you can just still put in the 10 hours and you just made double the money. So it's just way more effective, you know?

Right, absolutely. Yeah, and I love that because the other thing, um, I definitely wasn't used— it wasn't just the content that I was putting out wasn't great for, you know, all the reasons. I also wasn't using it like an ecosystem. I was like, oh God, that like I don't want to do all the things. Um, but you know, you can be putting out great content and then yeah, like you said, like it's not getting in front of the right people, enough of the people. Um, and if you're not making offers, then You can be creating loads of great content and it can be being seen, but then you're not actually selling. You're not actually inviting people to know how to work with you or how to get the solution.

100%. Like, it's like, what's the purpose of creating feed content? It's like mostly to get visibility, followers, visibility, eyeballs. But let's say— I always pick on Sandra— let's say Sandra saw that piece of content, right?

Amazing! You captured Sandra's attention that day and then she went on your stories And guess what you didn't do? You didn't be like, hey Sandra, I could help you solve this problem.

Here's how to work with me. Right? And so that moment when Sandra just also happened to be having a bad day, she wasn't like making a lot of, you know, she was, she was having a down month and she was like, oh my God, I really need help, you know, signing clients or whatever. And had you made an offer on your stories that day when she, when you captured her attention, she had a problem in that moment.

Like she was feeling emotional about it. She may have reached out to you and DM'd you clients, but you didn't have an offer in your stories that day. And so your content did its job, but you had no offer. 400 stories and the content just wasn't that effective, you know?

Yeah, and so it was a complete waste of your time in creating it in the first place, pretty much.

Completely, but yeah.

But it can be, you know, like if you're never making the offer, if you're never getting the sale. I think that, I think one of the things that I was taught early on was to nurture and nurture and warm people up and warm people up. And I think that that's good advice for, you know, some people. But also there are people who are ready to buy today, who are ready to buy, you know, you— if you're warming them up for a reason, you're trying to help them see that you're the person to help them, but you have to invite them in. Otherwise it's a bit like the doctor, you know, telling you, oh my god, this is, this is all the things that you need, but they're not telling you how you can actually get, get what you need. Like, they're not giving you— they're not writing you the prescription, they've told you what you need, but then they're not actually helping you get it from the pharmacy or whatever, you know. Like, it's, it's that final piece. Um, so if you could summarize— I mean, obviously you, you do a whole course on this, but like, how— what are the things, the core things that you would say you need to be doing on Instagram using the whole ecosystem? How does that work together?

Yeah, totally. So I would say first core thing, um, First core thing is like making sure that you have your account set up correctly. Like the biggest things for this is just like, this is like a one and done type of thing is like making sure that your account's optimized, turned into a sales funnel, what have you. But like making sure that your bio calls out who you help, what you help them do. There's a call to action there, leveraging the crap out of the, the story highlights that are beneath your profile to put tons of results and social proof there. And the pinned posts actually now are even like better to leverage than the story stuff you can have on the story covers. Um, because you see them, they're in your face all the time, right? And so making sure that you've got some like just really like power play type of posts there that you could have. Frameworks if you got it, showing your methodology, social proof, whether that's yourself or your clients, maybe your story. That's actually one that I don't have right there right now, but I probably could tell a bit of my backstory, how I got into this, etc., right?

Probably the origin story that's in my masterclass needs to be on a pinned post there, right?

But yeah, yeah.

Just making sure that like front-facing, like that is your storefront. I still don't have a website, probably did more than $500K in sales, still no friggin website, all through just Instagram and having it set up, right? But that's number one, is like you got to make sure your storefront is set up. And as a side note on that, one thing that's going to make that really, really challenging is if you don't have the clarity on your niche and your ideal client, it's gonna be really hard to write that bio. And so if you can't write a really good solid bio, it's like, hey, I help this person, like you know, I help this person, uh, lose 10 to 20 pounds of fat in, in 90 days or something. If you can't say that, then probably have some work to do. Like, as a—

not like an Instagram thing, but it's like a foundational business, right? Like, principle.

Like, you need to— yeah, yeah, for sure.

Or else your content's gonna suck going forward, right?

Um, so that's one big thing is like setting it up. Um, the next big thing comes to really, I'd say, feed content. And we can loop back around on this if you want, because I think you alluded to maybe wanting to chat about this kind of before we hopped on this, um, but like the different kinds of content to be posting, there's so many different kinds, there's so many ways to do it. Like you want to put your own flavor in there, but I would say most people really overdo it with the tips.

Um, I like to say like, you know, for, for me, I'm guilty, so guilty.

Um, me too.

Yeah, yeah, we're both— it's just, it's, it's easiest thing. It's like we just like, let me provide value, let me nurture you more, right? Um, but those aren't necessarily, like you said, those posts that really convert people, that really activate people and have them like slide into your DMs. Um, so I would say like, you know, frameworks are big because they show that you have a process. Um, probably one of the number one things I did to like, I don't know, 4 or 5x my business, probably like initially the last year, is just like posting more testimonials and social proof and telling those stories and just showing that I just continue to get people the result, right? Um, so that's another big one because people are like, oh, that's cool that you gave me, you know, some tips, Kirstie, on like productivity, but like, how do I know that you can really help me? Like, how do I know that you're just not some person posting random tips that you got off ChatGPT?

Right?

Absolutely right. So yeah, frameworks, social proof is a big one. Problem aware. If your people aren't super problem aware, like my people, like they know it's keeping them up at night that they don't have clients. Like, I don't need to do as much problem where I might need to do problem where stuff on like 5 signs your messaging is off.

Like they might not know why they're not signing clients, right?

But that could be one. And then what am I forgetting here? Oh, belief surgery is actually a huge one. Maybe people— people probably have no idea what that is, but like removing the beliefs that are preventing people from investing with you and giving them the empowering ones that they need to make those moves. Belief shifting content, really. One of my friends, good, great copywriter, calls it belief surgery and I loved it.

So I was like, I like it. Yeah, it's good. I've never heard anyone else say it. So like an example for my, for my niche, like just specifics to help people here, is that, so one of the solutions that I help people implement in their business to save time is to hire their first team member or their next team member type thing. And I coach on all the resistance and the fears around that to get them to do it if that is the thing that they need to free up time. But one of the beliefs that they have is that it's, you know, I'm not at the right place in my business yet. I'm not, I'm not at consistent enough income yet to, you know, I'm not at that level yet. I should be able to do it on my own. It's cheaper and quicker and easier if I do it myself. Or I won't be able to find someone who can do this task. They're all the kinds of things that are getting in the way, not just of working with me, but of hiring anyone to help them with that thing. Because they think that's not like— You're pulling a face. What's the face?

Oh, I'm just, I'm just, I'm just like agreeing with you and also chuckling because I, I have things to say about this and it's just funny because we talk about this a lot.

It's like every time you talk about what's going on, I'm like, yeah, I'm your ideal client.

Yeah, you could definitely hire some extra help in your business. Yeah, yeah. So that's an example of like, yeah, beliefs that you'd want to shift. So, um, to do that in your content, it would be things like it's actually costing you money if, um, you know, you're like, that VA or whoever you're hiring could be freeing up your time that you could then charge out at a higher rate than what you're actually paying them. Or, you know, it's actually not quicker and easier for you to do it yourself. Or, you know, the reason why you're not at consistent income is because you're wasting time on things that are not helping you with that consistent income. And so actually, if you took that money and you put it into having someone do some of the stuff for you, you could then focus on like the needle-moving task. So that's like an example. Totally. Yeah.

And like another, like another example for you even, and just total hack, by the way, for figuring out like what piece of content you should put out that's like belief shifting.

Belief shifting content is literally like answering objections is basically what it is. Like there's a complete correlation between what you're going to do at the end of a sales call and like the content that you're putting out.

Because like example, let's say that I get on the phone with you and I'm like, okay, well, I really need—

I haven't hired anyone. Like I'm doing everything myself.

And then at the end I'm like, yeah, that sounds good. You give me your offer and you're like, I'm like, yeah, that sounds good. And then I'm like, okay, I need to think about it.

Right. And really probably I could just, this is just a hypothetical scenario I can see myself doing.

It's like, it's like, what am I really thinking about? Well, in my head I'm like, okay, cool. I definitely know that I need to get help. But then I would be thinking like, okay, well why do I need a coach to help me hire people? Why couldn't I just hire them?

Why couldn't I just figure this out myself?

Right.

Absolutely.

That would be probably you telling a story. Like, the easiest way to break a belief like that is like you would then tell a story about how you had the same experience, you had the same thought, and here's what happens, and it wasn't fucking good.

Pardon my French, right?

And the reason for that is because you still had these subconscious beliefs that were holding you back, which is why you have whatever you do, NFT or Hypno or whatever, and you remove these beliefs, right? Right. So like the easiest way to like break these beliefs, whether it's on a sales call or it's in a piece of content. And honestly, it should be both. Like, you just got off a sales call with Sue and she gave you that— I try not to pick on Sandra, but you just like got off a sales call with S-S-S-Sally.

Anyways, Sandra is the new Karen, if you guys haven't noticed.

But if you just got off a sales call with her and that like, that's the objection she gave you, not only should you, you better have a response prepared for that for the next person because you're going to get that again.

But you best go turn that into a piece of content because there's 15 other people in your audience who are like, have the same thing, but you've never been on sales call with them and like that's why they're not reaching out to you, right?

Right. Yeah, I love it. And, and just, yeah, as an example for me, because that absolutely did happen to me, is I did— I didn't hire a coach to help me hire my first person, but whenever— the reason why I wasn't hiring help is because of a money scarcity within me. Um, and then every time I had an opportunity to save my £10 an hour on the cleaner I was like, 'Oh, you know, I won't get the cleaning company in today. I can do this.' And I reverted straight back into the old pattern of me cleaning the showers and the toilets and the tents at a £10 an hour job, rather than me taking that time and working out how to get more customers and improve our marketing for the campsite and do different things. So really like, that's why I needed the coach. Not necessarily because I couldn't take the initial step but that you can place like an upper limit on yourself. You know, sort of a ceiling as to what you can earn or just a cycle that you keep repeating, a pattern in yourself. So even if you get out of it, you see this a lot with weight loss, like— Yes. Yeah, you know, like, oh, I've lost some weight, but you've still kept all the same sort of limiting beliefs about yourself and same identity, all of that, that you need to shift, you need to break out of in order to keep the result that you've created.

Totally. And that right there, like, just as a side note, if you have these beliefs that you need to remove or objections you need to handle, whatever, best way to do it's through stories or analogies. And you just gave a great analogy. People can understand that, right?

Like, if that—

that's a post for you. Yeah, you could put that in the content. Like, we're doing coaching right now.

This is great. Why didn't I do interviews before?

But, but like, you could put that in the content of like— just a tip for everyone listening is like If you can give— if you're like trying to illustrate a point, but it's like harder to graft within that thing, then give them something that they already understand. That's the same thing. So if you're like, you know, like, have you— if you could literally write this in your post, like, have you ever seen people before where they've lost £100 and then they've gained it back? It's like, well, why do you think that is? Well, it's because this thing is happening, right? And the same thing is going on with your money story. Have you ever tried to hire a VA and you had them for a couple of weeks and then you reverted back to doing it yourself?

Why do you think that is? Right. Same reason that people gain weight back is because there's subconscious stuff that's there. And if you don't remove it and fix it, it will— you'll just keep running the same patterns, you know?

Yeah, I love it. Okay, so let's recap because otherwise we're going to be too much of it. Okay, so first, first step is like sort out your Instagram, like bio, like everything.

The whole—

optimize your account. Optimize the account.

Okay. Make it sexy so people land there and they're like, oh, this page is for me. This store is for me.

Amazing. Make it, make it sexy. And also to do that, you need the clarity on exactly who you serve and all of that stuff. Yes. Then the actual types of content you want to be putting out. So we've touched on frameworks, frameworks, frameworks, social proof, social, um, problem aware.

We just touched on belief surgery. And the last one's tips, but we all know that one.

That's what we all do, right? Amazing. Yeah. So don't nurture content, right? Absolutely. We're already good at that. So yeah, so this should super helpful because I think that people do not, like, like I wasn't doing, like really look at it like an, even like an ecosystem with, of content. Like it needs to be like the whole tree, not just the leaf.

Yeah.

Yeah.

Yeah.

Okay. Amazing. So what, what else?

So we, those are the, I would say the first two parts of the Instagram ecosystem. Right. Um, and then I would say more so the last two are, then you've got your stories. Right. Which I personally see your stories as being, serving two main functions, which is like connecting with people on a deeper level, showing them day in the life vibes, like letting them actually get a feel for you. That's not some curated, you know, feed post. Right. Um, well, I guess like maybe there's three. Um, the other piece would be like engagement, like engaging, like giving them polls, giving them questions, giving them places that they can interact with you. Cause then, um, I mean, there's a ton of great things about that, but you can loop those back around to conversations, which leads us to the DMs and stuff like that. But personal life engagement and the stories are the best place to talk about your offer because if you like, number one, it's more intimate in general. But like if you were to go make a very like salesy post and you were talking about here's the, you know, this program that I have and here's the benefits and the features and you made a carousel about that. It just wouldn't get pushed that far because it's a salesy post, right? Like, it's just the algorithm just won't push that out. But like, your stories are always there. Like, people can always click into that, you know, right? Um, and so they, they end up being, you know, the feed is the place really to get visibility, eyeballs. To some degree, it helps you grow your following. But once you have that and people are going to pay attention, like, your stories are the best place to kind of build maybe a deeper connection, um, let people engage with you. In a different way. But certainly to sell your offers is like the biggest thing on stories. So that's kind of like part 3 of the ecosystem. Love it. And then part 4 is the backend. And I think honestly so many people leave so much money on the table with this. And like this is, I would say I've gotten a lot honestly through the mentors that I've hired to get better at marketing this year is really what I got better was with, with attraction marketing, like content stuff. Which has helped a ton. But my, I think the way that I got successful in the beginning, I didn't have clarity on my niche. I didn't, I couldn't do attraction marketing, couldn't do that through content because I didn't have a clue on my niche and that stuff. But what I got really, really good at was like lead generation and conversations and relationships and the things that you, the front, you can't see it on Instagram. It's like the backend of Instagram. But it's like, you know, paying attention to who's paying attention, like who's liking your posts, who's commenting on your posts, who's watching your stories, who's engaging, starting relationships, like knowing how to flow things in the DMs to build relationships and book calls. Um, I don't know if anyone listening on this podcast has ever heard of like, um, you know, appointment setters, but like, never heard of appointment setter?

Really? I don't think so.

Crazy.

Okay, well, I haven't.

I can't speak for everyone, but to me I'm like, I'm like, everybody knows, like, you know, what is that? Um, it's really like You're essentially hiring people to kind of do some of that engagement, like on your Instagram account, so that they can book calls for you. Like an appointment setter is literally to set appointments. Okay. Um, and there are people who do that stuff. Um, but it's so interesting. Like I'm seeing that rise more and more and more and more. And it's like, man, I've always been doing this. Like this is what some of the stuff's in my course, you know? Um, but it's like, it just, if you're only putting out the content, like just to give you an example, really, really tangible example. Um, like this is one of those pieces that like you could be doing the other things, but if you're not doing this piece, it's a really crucial part of the ecosystem. And now all the other things you're doing on your feed and your stories or whatever is like, just, you're not getting as much bang for your buck as you could. Right. And so like total example, I do pay attention to who's watching my stories. And there was one particular girl who, um, I could see that she was watching my stories a lot and I was like, okay, so she's, she's she's more engaged than the average person. Like, your most engaged people are your story watchers, like your religious story watchers who float up to the top, or like your— they're like very warm leads, right?

Um, or friends and family.

Yeah, exactly. But you'll, you'll see, like, the people that have the strongest relationship with you will be near the top, and the people who have, you know, right? Um, and so I was paying attention to that. I was like, okay, there's something here. And I clicked to her profile. I'm like, okay, well, she's definitely my ideal client, and I— it looks like I can help her. And then I put out on my feed a piece of social proof content where I was telling a story. Here's how my client went from whatever it was, $400 a month to $7,000 in 90 days or whatever, right? And I saw that she liked it and I was like, okay, so she liked this. She saw this piece of social proof. I know that she's been watching me for a while in my stories. I have a feeling, like you start to get a spidey sense for this. It's like, I have a feeling that this person is a very warm lead, like maybe almost a hot lead, like ready to inquire. And that's when like you just start to know. And I was like, you know what, I think I just need to start a quick conversation, like engage a little bit with this person. And like they might just come out of the woodwork without me even asking. And I literally just went to their stories, saw that they had posted a recipe that they were doing, and I commented on it and just said something along the lines of like, oh my God, this looks so delicious. Or like, you know, this was These are all my favorite foods.

Like, this is all—

which it totally was. Like, it wasn't some BS comment, right? It wasn't true.

Like, it was true.

It was how I would speak to a friend, right? But just that was the bit of engagement that she needed to literally watch my stories that day where I had an offer up, right, and see the call to action and DM me clients, right?

It's a bit like— the way I look at it is it's But people are a bit funny, like it's almost like, you know, if you're walking in the street and somebody's like not looking at you, they sometimes they won't smile because you're like, you haven't made eye contact. But if you see, if you're walking down the street and you like both look at each other and then there's a little bit of a smile, it gives permission to the other person like, oh, this person is like safe for me to engage with. So I see it as like a safety thing, whereas like the slightest bit of engagement just makes them feel safe to like actually talk to you and say hi or whatever.

Totally. I love that you're just doing more analogies.

It's good, it's flowing out of me.

I would, I'd, I would agree with that. And I would say like, I also think it, it just, I think in some weird way like it makes it more real. Like it's just different when you just see someone's content and they're like talking at you with, with content, but then you're like, oh, this person like actually engaged with like just me. Right. Like they're speaking to just me right now. Like it's one-to-one. Like it's just more intimate, I think too.

Right.

Yeah. Yeah.

I love that. And one thing I will say about you and the— and we talked about this just before I came on just to make sure, but I was very anti— like not that there's anything wrong with doing it, but like for me personally, I don't love getting cold-pitched DMs and things like that where people just are like, hey, do you wanna buy my thing or whatever? Like, hey, you look like you need bleeds. Here's a free thing. I just don't love it. Um, usually they get my name wrong. That's like never a good start. They're like, 'Hey Christy,' and I'm like, 'Well, you can't even spell my name.' Um, and so it always puts my back— like, I just don't even— I, I just don't even engage with them. But the way that you, um, taught it to me anyway, um, was very much like, no, like, just, just be a human. Be nice. Like, be a normal person. Like, see if there is anything that, um, you know, you, you could connect on at a human level. Like, oh, this, you know, this person went to this same college that I went to. Like, that's like a perfect, um, thing that you showed me that makes it feel like you actually are just engaging and being social on a social media platform. And I was very anti that before because I was like, oh, that feels gross because you're like messaging them, but the truth is in all— if if you're a business owner, you have to be meeting new people somehow. You have to start building relationships with new people, and maybe they won't become your client, but maybe they will become friends. Maybe they will become people you can collaborate with. Maybe they'll— they don't need your services, but then they have a friend who says, "I'm really struggling with this," and they know that, "Oh, I've seen this person and she seems all right," like, to refer you. So I think that like you, you've got to be a bit more open-minded as to when you are, um, reaching out, that you are reaching out for— to form a connection in some way. And maybe that doesn't go anywhere and you don't have to do it in a sleazy way, you don't have to make an offer, you do— you can literally just connect and, and that way they get an opportunity to, to find you, to see your content, and then they can decide for themselves if they're going to carry on watching your stuff and then you can have more of a conversation.

I am like, I wholeheartedly agree. And like, I remember being at, um, like an event this past year with, uh, with, with who was it? Was Bradley at CoachingCon. And he literally, one of the things he said on stage is like, the more, the more hands you shake, the more money you make. And it's just like, to some degree, like it's just certain number of connections. Like it is a numbers game in that sense. But if you go into those conversations and your genuine intention is like, I'm here to connect with people. And, and lead with value first before anything, right? Um, the sale comes after that if it comes, you know, but like your, your job— my, my, my thing with outreach or reach-outs is actually like the biggest difference I think between kind of what I teach and how I teach it and like what some other people teach is they are doing reach-outs to make a sale right off the hop, right? Whereas I'm not doing reach-outs to make a sale. I'm doing reach-outs to grow my following. I'm doing reachouts to connect with people and get in front of people that are, you know, we've reverse engineered to be our ideal clients, right? And to connect with them in a way that they do click to your profile, which is optimized and it looks great and it speaks directly to them. And they're like, yeah, this chick looks interesting. I would follow her. Great. Now you're in my world. And at some point, if you, if you hate being in my world, cool. You'll unfollow me. I'll never see you watch my stories. I'll never see you like my stuff and we'll never speak again. And that's great. That wasn't for you.

You know?

But maybe you did get in there and you're like, okay, actually this is great, I'm getting a ton of value. I start watching your stories and you reach out and DM me clients one day. And so it's just way more, it's just not like, it's just a longer game I think is kind of what I play.

Right, yeah, and I love that. Okay, fabulous. So that is like, that's like the last piece, yeah? Of like really speaking to people, engaging with their content, like seeing who's in your world, like maybe making the first move just to connect. And then just, yeah, see what goes from there.

Yeah, like that's, those are pretty much, like that's the ecosystem you're running basically to, you know, in some ways, you know, bring people in, lead capture, nurture people, lead nurture, get people to inquire, you know, lead conversion. And then the only other thing is like, that's like the ecosystem that you're running. Sometimes you decide that you want more leads into the ecosystem and that might be, you might do podcasts, You know, you might run paid ads, you might double down on your organic content, like whatever. There's more ways to get people into the ecosystem, but that is the ecosystem itself for sure.

I love it. Okay. And then the other piece of this that I wanted to talk to you about, um, is really like another aspect of optimizing your time. So obviously like we want to be optimizing your time, actually making your marketing better and making the platform work for you. So not just— not neglecting areas that actually help work together to get the results that you want. So we're making the most of the time that you spend on that platform. Um, but then the next piece of that is then obviously most of those people, for most service-based, um, providers, will probably have a sales call. Um, which obviously you want to work on your skill sets. I know that you teach this too. Um, and we won't dive into this in depth, but like, you know, like how to get better at actually like selling you know, do it running a sales call and it serving the person and finding that they're the right fit for what you offer. But one way that you can, again, save time, and this is what we're going to dive into, is how you can sell in the DMs without needing to book that sales call. Because that could save you, I mean, how much time do you think that saves you if you actually learn the skills of selling in the DMs? Again, same, like, no, not sleazy. You're doing, they're interested in what you have to offer. They are, you know, they have a problem, you have the solution, they recognize that, they are willing and able to, you know, find out more about it. What would you teach or help, you know, in that area about selling in the DMs to save time?

Yeah, totally. So the first thing that I would say is I think that the selling in the DMs piece, it can— how would I say this? Like, it can it may actually take the same amount of time. That's entirely possible that it takes the same amount of time. However, I think it's just completely different because it's infinitely more flexible. Like, I just, I just don't want to be like a cat, like a wall full of calls on my Google Calendar. Like, that just gives me so much anxiety. And so, like, you know, especially like, like if you like to travel like I do or you just don't, you just don't like as much rigid stuff on your schedule that locks you into whatever, it just gives you the space, like in your day when you have free time, you can be selling in the DMs. You can be interacting. So I think it's more flexible. And I also just think it's like, it's a different quality of energy exchange. Like, I think it's different when you have to be on video and on camera and like you have to be in front of someone, like, you know what I mean? But like, I could be outside walking and getting my steps in and like, you know, selling in the DMs. And so it's just like, it's a different quality of energy exchange. The time might be the same, but the flexibility and like the, the type of energy is just different. Does that make sense?

Yeah, yeah. And I think that's, I think that's a great point to make because it's not always about, um, cutting down the hours, it's also about making it work within your life. So yeah, like flexibility in my eyes, I'm the same, I love to travel. I got fully booked in October with like one-to-one clients and I actually did do some traveling and the idea was, oh, this is going to be fine. I'm going to see if I can run this business obviously from anywhere in the world and that worked, but I also had no time for myself, uh, to enjoy my, my holiday. So I was like, actually, this is too many calls for me. Plus I have voice issues, so that wasn't great. But yeah, for me too, like, I actually do have a limit on how many clients I actually take one-to-one because I don't want the rigidity in my schedule.

Totally. And that's a good point too, like, it can be very helpful sometimes if you don't have the greatest Wi-Fi too, depending if you're traveling, or maybe for you Maybe you're texting instead of being on a Zoom call because like you're trying to save your voice. Right?

Right. So I would say, yeah. What's your advice around selling in the DMs? Like, what do you actually mean by that? Like, is it, is it literally like, oh, hey, like you've had the conversation, they seem interested. What? How does that flow?

Yeah. So I would say it's so funny. This comes so automatically to me that I actually have a post on my Instagram pulled up so I don't forget anything in the structure. Um, but I would say like truly, um, big distinction for selling in the DMs. Like selling in the DMs is not just like, okay, here's the price, right? Like I don't think that's gonna serve anyone.

Okay. So like buy.

Yeah. You're just, yeah. You're just gonna get like a lot of price objections and have no clients, um, and scare everyone away.

Um, but I think like the, the key thing with selling in the DMs is like it actually should follow a very, very similar syntax to a sales call. Mm-hmm. You're just replicating it in the DMs. And so. I think like some people kind of mess this up sometimes because they're like skipping steps. Um, but like, you know, I have in front of me, like I'll roll through this really quickly, but it's just a carousel I did on like the 7 steps, um, to selling in the DMs. The first one I say is like diagnosing before you prescribe. And so like that's where when they do reach out to you, and I'm talking like, I'm talking when I say selling in the DMs specifically, I'm talking about here is when you get an inquiry, right? So if you're a you know, fat loss coach, and you have in your bio like DM me fat loss, and someone DMs you fat loss, like, this is how you go about it, right? Um, the first thing for me is like, I will diagnose what's going on. And so I'm like, okay, cool. Like, I'll put my curiosity hat on, go a little bit deeper. Cool, what's going on in your world? Like, what are you working on? What do you think is the problem? I'll often run through like their niche, their offer, their whatever. Like, I'm like, can I really help you? You know what I mean? Um, And then if I think that, um, you know, I can help them, I'm kind of like, okay, this is almost in that inquiry phase too. You're like, okay, well, what is, um, you know, like, where are you? Where are you trying to go? You're like, just like you would on a sales call. What's point A? Like, same thing, right? Right. A little bit of connection, a little bit of rapport. You're doing that in the DMs a little bit, right? Um, and then it's point A, where are you right now? Where are we starting? And then it's point B, okay, where are you trying to go? Okay, why is that important to you? What do we have now? We have a gap, right? Right. And then it's like, if I think I can help you bridge that gap, then we can start talking about the program. So like the first piece is sort of getting clarity on point A, point B, if you can even, if you can even help them, right? Right. Once you have that clarity, kind of the next piece is like sharing the name of your program if you have one and like the big dream outcome. So like for me, I would say something along the lines of like, okay, you know, it's the Full-Time Fast Track and this is a 4-month coaching program for the coach that wants to go full-time online and hit consistent $5K to $10K months, right? So you kind of share that and then like what you're going to cover. So it's like the name of the program, what the outcome is, and then like what you're going to cover. So that's where I might share a framework that I've already got in a post, pinned post. I just send it to them in the DMs. And I'm like, cool, this is the 4 parts we're going to cover, right? Niche, offer, lead gen, sales. And you're, you're kind of going through that and you're like, does that sound like what you need, right? So you're very like outcome focused. And then if they're like, yeah, totally, 10 out of 10, that sounds like what I need, you're like, okay, cool. Then you're getting into like the next piece of this is kind of like now you're almost more into like the features. Like you've already talked about like benefits, dream outcome. Now you're more into the features of like, okay, it's 4 months here's when the live calls are, here's the access you get to me, here's what the mod— you know, all that stuff, right?

Mm-hmm.

Um, you're like, does that sound good? Like, does that make sense to you? Like, all that works? They're like, yeah, totally. Um, so now you've kind of, you've, you know, made sure that you can help. You've got a gap, you kind of like diagnosed, then you talked about, um, the name of the program, the benefits. Then you talked about sort of the, the features almost, right?

Mm-hmm.

Um, and they're like bought in on the program itself, right? Um, then you're kind of getting into, okay, then you share the price, right?

Once you have the gap and they know that your program can solve the problem, right?

And they see the value, then you share the price and payment plans, payment plan stuff. Um, I like to give a fast action bonus too, like some reason for them to make a decision that could be some degree off the price or something like that, but have some sort of urgency in the offer that you make. Um, a risk reversal if you have it, if you have any sort of guarantee to kind of take away that risk for people, like just proper sales call practices. And then the last one's answering objections, which we almost kind of talked about earlier, is like, there's probably gonna be something that comes up. It might be price, it might be, I don't know if this is gonna work for me, I don't have the time, I'm moving. Right. That's the other thing.

Why could I just do this myself? Why do I need a coach?

Right, right, right.

Yeah. And then, and then permission, I would say, to share the— if they're like, yeah, I'm into it, and they're like, I want to do it, I say, cool, is it okay if I send you a link so that we— that you can pay? And like, I get permission for that.

I don't know, hopefully that makes sense. Yeah, that really does. That's very helpful. I, um, yeah, I love the way that you teach that. Um, I definitely have had my own mindset issues, as you know, about selling and, and different sales, um, tools and tactics that are used. Um, and I, I— it's funny, what helped me get over that was actually thinking about like other businesses, like supermarkets and things like this. Like, you know, they put on like 'You know, 2 bags of apples for this, you know, buy one get one free.' And I was like, why do I find, you know, it's weird in the coaching world and not in Tesco, in the supermarket? You know, because it's the same principle. It's like, it's an urgency, the offer's here today type thing. It's, you know, all of that. It's so interesting that our minds have like converted it into this is evil and bad. And so for anyone who is feeling a little bit like, 'I don't want to use any of that,' First of all, you don't have to use anything that you don't feel comfortable with, but I would definitely explore, you know, what— why? Like, why do you feel uncomfortable? Because the way that Morgan teaches it, and you know, the way that I see it too, is you— as long as you have a product or a service that you are good at delivering, like, and you're not actually a scam artist, and you are— you do have their best, you know, interests at heart, and you do want to help them, then really the sales call and everything that you're doing is because they have opted in. They want it. They're interested in it. And I think sometimes we get tripped up because we think people don't want it, and then we're trying to push it on them. We're never talking about that. We're always talking about— yes, like, they've put their hand up, they've said, I'm struggling with this, can you help me? That's who we're talking to here. And then they want to know all the details, so that's what we're doing. We're trying to find out, are they actually— you know, can we actually help them? Like, it— like the analogy with the doctor, like, it's no good if, um, you know, the person is going to the doctor and saying 'You know, this is what I want help with,' and then the doctor is like, 'That's not my specialty.' You know, like he's asking those questions to make sure that he can actually help them. And so we want to do the same thing. And then the same with objections, like it really is— it's not necessarily objections like, 'I don't want to do it, so come, you know, put pressure me into buying.' It's very much, 'I want to do it, but I'm concerned that I won't have the time. Like, can you help me find the time?' Or, you know, 'I want to do it, but I'm 'Worried about the money? Okay, let's make sure that we know for sure that we can help you.' And that's, I think, the piece that makes it okay for, you know, for anyone to be using those tools and tactics if that is— their intentions are good, if that makes sense.

100%. Yeah. And for the record, like, with the, you know, objections piece of it, that shouldn't feel pushy. It shouldn't feel forced. It should actually feel like you have their best interest in mind. And like, honestly, if I get on a discovery call, like even if I got on a discovery call with you and we were talking about your program, like I actually like, I want you to help walk me through these objections because I know that I'm going to stay stuck if I keep doing what I'm doing. And so like, I want you to lead that conversation. Like, I want you to show me a perspective that I'm not seeing, you know, like example, let's do an easy one. Like a weight loss example is like, let's say, you know, I'm, I've been, you know, under eating like crazy forever and like I, my hormones are all messed up. And like, I need to hire a nutrition coach to do a proper reverse diet and stop screwing up my hormones, right? Like, I want someone to call me out at the end of that and be like, okay, well, like, but, you know, let's be realistic here. Like, what are you gonna do if you don't get help with this? You know, like, are— like, you've been doing this for the past 12 years and we know where you're at here. And like, the more you dig this hole deeper you're digging the hole deeper, you know? Right. So like, are you going to change your behavior? Like, if we get off this call and we don't decide to work together, like, just realistically, you know, like, you kind of want someone to help you answer those things because like that's how they're going to move forward. And like they want that too.

And that's actually like the first part of you coaching probably is right, answering objections.

It's really showing up for them.

Yeah, I love, I love that you say that as well. I mean, the one thing again that like helped shift it for me was thinking about a doctor example. Like if somebody came in and they were, you know, gonna die, they're gonna— they're on their road to dying basically and they've got, you know, and they're smoking and they're drinking and they're sending themselves to an early grave, like it's the doctor's responsibility to be like, 'Hey, like if you keep going on this path, this is what's gonna happen to you. You know, I can— I'm guessing this is probably, you know, it's probable that you're gonna end up here.' And they're trying to convince— they are trying to persuade the person to take a different route. Like that is what they're trying to do, but it's for the person, it's not for the doctor. The doctor, you know, it's not solely for the doctor to have a job type thing.

Totally. Yeah. And so if you lead with that intention, you will feel really good with your sales and your objection answer— answering, because it's just like you're just— you have like— they're your number one priority, right? Not the sale. Yeah.

Yeah, I love it. Okay, amazing. So thank you so much. So that's— so that's awesome.

So really, um, Do you want me to do a quick recap on those steps?

Yeah, that'd be amazing.

Okay, so I'll just say 7 steps to selling in the DMs. The first thing is diagnosing, which is the same thing that you'd be doing in the first 40-ish minutes of a sales call, right? Yeah. Cool. How are you? Connection, you know, like, where are you now? Where are you trying to go? What's the problem? What's the gap?

Right, right.

If you think you can help, you proceed. If you don't think you can help, you stop.

Right, right.

Um, so number 1's like diagnosing.

Number 2 is you're kind of presenting the name the big dream outcome that they're going to get, lose 20 pounds, you know, hit $10K a month, whatever. And then like sort of like the benefits or like what you'll actually be working through, which for me is like, hey, we're going to work on niche offer, lead gen sales, right? Yeah. Then you kind of get into the third piece as you get into like the features more so community access, Slack support, da da da, right? What time the group calls are, etc. And then the fourth part is price and payment plans. The fifth part is like a fast action bonus if you have one, which I totally 18 out of 10 recommend that you do.

The sixth part is a risk reversal, which I also 18 out of 10 recommend that you do.

And then the seventh part is answering objections and obviously getting permission if they say yes to send the link. So that's kind of the 7 steps, but it should literally mirror the exact same thing you're doing on a sales call.

Yeah, but it gives you the flexibility to be, yeah, to be essentially selling your offer to people who want it, who've inquired, without you having to find the time. I think that's super useful because a lot of, I know a lot of the business owners that follow me are mums and they don't have like loads of free time in their calendars. So basically rather than risking losing the sale, or not knowing what to do when somebody messages you and they say, I'm interested in this, and then either not getting back to them because they don't know what to say, or them saying, yeah, we'll have to book in a call, and that's the first thing. Um, this is a way that you can start that conversation and then actually make a sale.

And as a total side note, like, just to— I think this is maybe important just so people realize, like, how much you can use this. Um, but when we started working together, when I did the January launch of the Full-Time Fast Track, like I did that all through sales calls and like honestly, like I'm running everything, you know, I have no help, which we need to talk about. And like I'm running everything. And then I had to do like 30-something sales calls in the span of a couple of weeks as well. And that was like a lot. Very taxing, right?

Yeah.

And then like, that was great, you know, that was awesome. But then when March came around, I was like, to frick if I want to give up my life again like I had to do in January, you know, I was like, I just don't want to do that many sales calls. And so I was like, I'm going to do a masterclass launch instead of, you know, doing all the sales calls. But what actually ended up happening is I, I, I think I like, I like double sold out my launch and 80% of it was from selling in the DMs. Like it was like $120K sales month and like 80% of it, like 20% came from the masterclass, sure. But 80% came from selling in the DMs.

And the only way that I could do that in such like that was in the span of of—

there's a very short space of time, but the only way that that was possible is because I did so much of it through the DMs. And so like, it can be like, like wildly impactful if you, if you do it right.

If you're just giving them the price, then like, don't say that it didn't work, you know?

Right, right, right. Yeah. And I love that because I think that, um, particularly for people who are not just— don't just have one one-to-one spot and, you know, they're trying to find, you know, space for that people who are trying to fill a group, if you are a coach or if you have an online program or whatever that you're trying to sell people into, then yeah, if you're trying to find 30— space for 30 sales calls or even more because yeah, if you're not 100% conversion rate on your sales calls, like you need to do even more than the numbers that you want in there. So this is a really nice way to leverage your time.

Totally. Can I do a total free thing shameless plug right now since we're here?

Of course you can. I said you could.

It's, it's for the absolute benefit of the audience.

We know that.

But, um, I would just say like, if you want a training on this, I literally filmed an actual like full-blown mini training that's on Kajabi for frick's sakes, with like an actual— here's me breaking down the 7 steps in a training. Here's me actually doing it. Like I literally screen recorded my DMs and I'm like, here's what I said here.

Here's why I said this.

Here's what they said.

Here's what I said back. Like you can see everything.

I love it.

And then there's a checklist. So like, you can't mess it up. So if you want that, I'm just going to say legitimately pause this podcast, right?

Well, I guess you have to still be listening to this, but like, open, open, open your phone and click on the friggin Instagram app and literally type into the search bar @iamorgangillis and just hit message and just DM me the words selling in the DMs and I will give this to you for free and you can go do it. So hopefully that's helpful, but that's my gift.

That, that's lovely. They will appreciate that, I'm sure. Um, okay, amazing, thank you so much. And then the last couple of things before we dive into you, um, was batching content. Um, this is some— anything that you can talk about regarding saving time, like, you know, batching content, and also making your content easy. Um, so I know one of the things that I, I loved about you, and actually gave me permission to do my Reels a little bit more, like, I'm just gonna talk at the camera. I was already doing it for Facebook Lives, but I hadn't started doing it on Instagram. And, um, yeah, your reels are always very much just like, yeah, you, your head talking to the camera. Um, so whatever. There's like a saying that's like, head to the camera or something. I can't remember. I don't know. What it's called. But anyway, yeah, talk about batching content and, um, making your content easy in terms of like helping them create in less time.

Yeah, so I would say like with making your content easy, you know, if you, if you follow me on Instagram, like you'll see that most of my content, I usually filming content just on a walk and it's because like I get great ideas when I'm out walking and like I'm already going for a walk anyways, like I was already going to do that.

And so I just combined my steps with like, same with selling in the D. I'm always combining steps with everything. This is why I hit my 10K steps every day. Because I'm selling in the DMs and I'm creating content when I'm doing them.

But if you can do things like that where you can kind of like feed two birds with one seed, for lack of better words, and like you're doing something you are doing anyway, like that, that's easy for me. Like sometimes I could go on a walk and come back and have an hour walk, feel great, and have like 6 pieces of content filmed, right? And so like that is actually possible if you, number one, don't make really difficult things like these reels that people do with like 17 outfit changes.

I'm like, why? Like, why? Like, what if that real flops? Which it—

like, yeah, you have so much invested in that one thing. It's like, just don't pick hard stuff, pick stuff that's easy. Pick a reel with like no outfit changes. Pick one that's 7 seconds to do a dancing thing to instead of 90, right? Like, right. Um, for me, like, I just know myself well and I know that it's very easy for me to get on camera and just give you what you need to hear. And the only thing that I have to think about when I'm creating a reel like that is structurally, is this structurally set up to capture attention and like get visibility? Which really just means, is the friggin headline good enough? Like, that's pretty much it, right? I get an idea when I'm out walking and I'm like, cool, this is valuable. I can teach people something about this. How do I turn this idea into a hook or a headline? And then when I speak that reel, That is the first sentence that's out of my mouth and that hooks people in and I just tell them what I'm going to tell them, give them the steps, give them the story, give them whatever. And at the end I make a call to action. But that's like in the easiest way to make your content is those 3 steps. The hook and the headline is the most important, but just like you could do it while you're walking, you can do it whatever, but just don't, just don't pick hard things I think is the biggest thing.

Right. And I think that helps with consistency as well. Yeah. Because you either batch it, you either decide like, all right, I'm going to plan it ahead of time and then batch it and then I'll have 'Have the content that I can schedule so I don't have to be showing up every day.' Or you're— and you could do that, you could do both. But if it's either or— or you show up naturally with an idea every day and you just put it out there. But again, and I love that you taught that because I was very bad at that. Like, I was very good at coming up with something helpful that I can talk to them about on my dog walk, but hopeless at giving them a headline. Like, a hook that pulled them in. And you said to me at the time, and it was like a real like time optimization thing of like, there's really no point in you even creating the rest of the content if you can't hook them in in the first few seconds because, you know, they're not going to watch it. And I think I was creating a lot of content that people just weren't watching, and then that's super frustrating as well. Yeah. And demoralizing and all the rest of it. So I think that making sure that structurally it is sound Yeah. Also making sure that it falls into one of those buckets that we talked about, like, not— isn't just tips, like, not just doing tips.

I was just gonna say something. Um, one thing that's interesting about the, the content that I do walking, the reels, usually they're tips. Um, because like, that's mostly what I get the ideas for when I'm out walking. So I, I think that a lot of the walking reel ones tend to be more that nurture tips content. Like, if I'm gonna write a social proof piece of content or a framework piece of content, I'm probably going to do that in a carousel. And like, I have to sit there and think about the headline for that and like pull the screenshots for the client stuff or go create the thing on Canva. So I would say like social proof ones sometimes work a lot better on carousels. Same with the frameworks. Um, the belief shifting ones, you know, funny enough though, they can actually work great if you get an idea like in your head of like Oh, like kind of how to shift a belief or something like that. Like, honestly, you can— some of the posts that do so well for me, I just pull out my Notes app and like I literally just like type my thoughts into Notes and like I'll type like one little bit and space it down a ton.

Oh, I do that.

Type a lot and then space it.

And I just take screenshots of my Notes app and just like upload it to Instagram and like they do so well. So like that's another way that you could like— they actually get some of the best engagement in those, just, just thoughts.

Straight to your tags.

Yeah.

I love that. Yeah. So, um, yeah, but make sure that if you're not— if the only thing that comes to mind is tips, make sure that you are sitting down and planning the rest of the content and then— or batching it or whatever so that you can show up with the other stuff, I think.

Yeah. I would say something along the lines of like, I would aim to have like a solid testimonial, social proof, and like maybe a solid belief surgery shifting type post like once a week, you know. Like if you can aim and you can hit those once a week, so like you have something like that, but also you've got tons of nurture in there, like I think that's a good cadence. But like if you're not doing that, like, you know, probably missing the mark.

Yeah, right. Okay, amazing. All right, is there anything else you want to share regarding like your expertise around optimizing time? We've talked about loads of things.

I think just the last thing that I would say is, um, in terms of like, are we like, are we still talking about content batching stuff? Are we sort of on my own personal stuff now?

Uh, before we get to the personal stuff.

Okay. So I would say the last thing is in terms of batching and just a couple other random things that make things easier for me. Um, in terms of batching, one thing that you really need to have, I have an app on my phone. It's called Todoist.

Oh yeah, I used to have that.

Yeah, it just allows you to have some boards. I have one, um, I don't even know, I have one project with a bunch of different boards. Like, it's one project called content, but there's a board for Reels, there's a board for Care Cells, there's a board for emails, there's a board for podcasts. And so when I'm out walking, let's say I can't film that thing, or I'm on a client call or something, like, I just need a place to document that idea because I'm inspired by it in the moment. But if I don't just create— like, the easiest time to create is right then and there, but sometimes you cannot do that and you will lose it. It if you don't document it. And so having a spot where you can have that documented so that if you are batching your content— like, let's say you decide, I'm going to create all my content, I'm going to film all my reels on Friday mornings, cool— then you don't show up to film your reels and you're like, I have no idea what to talk about. So have a spot. Like, it can be very— like, actually, I'm not even saying it'd be helpful, you need to have a spot to like document your ideas. And if it's helpful for you, um, you can have a designated like day per week to batch your Reels, batch your emails, whatever. Like when Reels first came out and I was super awkward, like Bambi on ice with that, like Fridays, all day Fridays was like, let's figure out Reels. So batching can be really helpful. Definitely have a spot to record your stuff. And if you are doing Reels, one, the one person I actually do pay to help me with things is my video editor. And that's been very, very helpful. So it is nice just like not having to— like having him put fancy captions on there and like not having to do it myself.

Right.

You can just get away with the Instagram captions and that can be also really quick to like just put a headline and put captions. But I do kind of like having the editors. It's really great to just— looks a little sexier and I don't have to do it myself because I— editing videos is just not the highest use of my time.

So no, no, it's definitely not. Amazing. Okay. So personally, then just anything that helps you with the juggle, like the work-life balance, making time for you? Any tips or anything that you found to be super useful the way that you do it?

I think the biggest things in terms of like personal tips or advice on kind of the way I structure things is like— this is almost like a bigger picture strategic thing for like how I organize my time. But I try not to take any client calls until later in the day. Yeah, like I try not to take any client calls until like 12 PM or later. Now that I'm in a different time zone, like almost all my client calls are at like 4 o'clock. Like I have like nothing on my calendar until like 4. It's like incredible. It used to be at 12 o'clock and it's in Pacific time, but in Atlanta time it's like way later. Um, but what that allows you to do is it allows you to have— have you ever read the book The One Thing? By the way, yes, right. Okay, so I'm a huge believer in that, is like, do you have a 4-hour block of time? And some people are going to be like, they're going to be like, like a mom listening to this, they're like, they're like, no, I hate this chick, right? Um, and so sorry if that's you, but it's like, can you find blocks of time in your calendar where you can do deep focused work?

Yeah.

Um, because like continually context switching from I'm filming a training to like I'm in the DMs to I'm posting content, I'm filming this, I'm back to my— like, it just, it's a nightmare. It's like my worst— it's like a nightmare for me. Um, so I try to have clear calendar space for like 4 hours in the morning, don't— not taking calls before like 12. Um, that's one big thing. If there's tasks that I really don't like, um, I actually do set a timer. I actually do love the Pomodoro timer. Like, if I'm doing taxes or something. Yeah, yeah, it's like cool if I just set 25 minutes. I just— it's hard to start, but once you start, you're halfway done, right? Yeah. So it's like if I just set 25 minutes, that's like more approachable for me, and I can just hit start, and then I'm like, okay, cool, I'm into it. Maybe on the break I'll do like 10 squats or something just to, you know, liven myself up, try to get some—

it's again, feed two birds with one seed, like, you know, get some—

by the way, I love that saying. It's like so much nicer than kill two birds with one stone. I'm like, this is lovely.

I tried to make it positive, you know. Yeah, trying to spread positivity, not violence here, you know.

Um, so, uh, yeah, the Pomodoro works well. I don't always— like, it's not as good for creative tasks. Like, if you're like into a creative, you're in flow, not as good. But if it's a task you don't really want to do when you're just like, oh, I find it really helpful.

Amazing.

And then the last thing would just be using some sort of planner. Google Calendar is great, but also I have a paper one all the time, and I try not to put too much stuff on it. And like, if I can have that set the night before, or at least the morning, I think that gives my brain like priority of like, okay, I'm working on this, I'm working on this. And then you get the fun dopamine of like checking things off.

You're like, oh yeah, so accomplished.

So I love it. That's amazing. That is, that is completely in line with what I teach. I teach all of those strategies. Yeah, amazing. Love it. Okay, and then lastly, um, just to, um, because we're all human and I want to make sure that we normalize the struggles of You know, things that we're not juggling so well or things that we definitely could be doing better time-wise in our business or whatever. What do you think is the biggest thing that you have that's holding you back from either getting to that next level or, you know, creating the work-life balance that you want?

Totally. I would say the biggest thing holding me back from getting to that next level right now is I do just need to hire more people. Like, I just need to— like, I've been doing everything myself up until this point with the exception of the video editor, and I have had a couple VA-type things that I kind of did hire and then kind of did take over myself.

So maybe again, yet again, it's like, maybe you do need her help.

Um, but, uh, yeah, I just— I probably need to hire more people.

What do you think is getting in the way of you doing that?

What, um, Part of it— this is so strange, uh, in, in some ways I have like, I love my money beliefs and they really, really serve me in some ways. Um, in some ways I think that I— my margins are incredible right now and it's like, I don't want to give any of that up. Like, I just like, I don't, you know. Um, but I think that's again, it's like, well, there's probably some belief surgery that needs to happen there. And like, logically I get it and I think it actually is starting to sink in now. Um, like, I think I'm actually making progress in this direction. But yeah, I think, I think that's one reason. Um, some of it's like just not taking the time to like make like, cool, you want help? Yeah, you need to. You don't know how to hire people yet. Like, do you think that maybe like sales calls, that's a skill that you need to learn?

Probably.

But instead I'm just like, I just want it done, but I don't want to do the work of getting it done.

Oh, I hear you. I was totally there.

Yeah, so it's, it's one of these things where it's like, I want the help, but I don't want to make the time to do it. And now I'm starting to understand, um, like, hey, this, this is, this is not some extra thing on your to-do list today that's whatever holding you down. This is the work that you need to do to get to the next level. Like, this is the work. Like, what else do you need to be doing today?

You need to be hiring someone, right? You need to be getting these skills.

So I think there's, um, probably some money beliefs there, probably some just not having the skills and it being new and uncomfortable for me, you know, be like going to the gym and being like, I'm so intimidated because I've never worked out before in my life, and there's some resistance. Um, and then I'm sure there's some degree of control there, you know, like even with my taxes right now, like I know that I have everything organized the way that I want, and I'm like, I don't really want someone to come in here and eff this up, you know. I don't really want someone to be responding to these comments and like do something stupid that I wouldn't do responding to these comments, you know? Like, just stuff like that.

That's so good. And it's like so common. That's like, yeah, I've coached on that numerous times with different people. It's either usually a money scarcity thing, a control thing, or yeah, like I don't want to do the work to streamline, to create systems like SOPs that I can then have someone come in and just take over. Because that requires a certain degree of time and effort to sit down, it's very tedious, it can be tedious, can be boring, and that is something that I help people with in my programs, basically, because it is, it's like, sometimes you need handholding to do certain things, I definitely did, and at the time I would have loved if a coach had offered that to me. I didn't have the handholding early enough, really, to do it, and so, you know, sometimes you just need a little bit of hand-holding to, to make yourself sit down and create an SOP, to then be like, right, 100%, you can take over now, you can do this job.

Like, sometimes that resistance is so high because it's new and uncomfortable that you just never get around to it, right?

Because like, you just don't want to do it. And so it's like that person to kind of nudge you in the right direction and be like, hey, you know, like me with my clients being like, so listen, I don't see any sales stories this week, like what's going on, you know, uh, to make a move to that uncomfortability and just do the thing and get the result.

Yeah, I love it. Amazing. This has been so good. Is there anything else that you want to add before we wrap up?

Um, I think that we covered most of it. I will just say this is definitely a new big next step for me, is like hiring some people. And the next—

I've already kind of taken a baby step today. I'm like, okay, bookkeeper, here you go.

Oh, this is amazing.

What, today was literally the first day that I emailed her yesterday.

We met the hour before on this, and I was like, so listen, I've taken this as far as I want to take this. Here you go. Um, and I started working on some SOPs today to hire a VA to do something.

Oh good, look at that! I'm happy. I'm impressed. This is excellent. Yeah, a bookkeeper was the first thing that I needed, um, to, to really properly outsource. Um, yeah, and, and I had I mean, your accounts were at least in order when you gave it to her. Mine was like a complete mess.

You think? They're, uh, getting there.

Let me tell you, there's some stuff going on with that.

Like, I've got USD currency, I've got Canadian currency in the same thing, I've got 3 different personal cards, 4 different business accounts. Like, it's just— it's legitimately a nightmare.

I'm sure they'll be able to manage it. Pumped. She's like, favorite, new favorite client. Yeah, yeah, I love it. Okay, well, this has been lovely. Thank you so much, Morgan, um, for coming on and having this conversation with me. I think it's going to be super helpful for everyone who's listening, um, to this. Yeah, loads of good nuggets in there. Um, so just to finish, what is the best way for them to find you? Um, if they love the sound of what you do, obviously they probably will, um, and if they're potentially interested in your offerings. And I don't, um, recommend people lightly. Like, I don't— unless I've actually worked with someone, you'll very rarely hear me say, "I recommend this person." Like, I will say, "Oh, I know someone who does this," like, if I can make a referral type thing. But, um, but I absolutely really loved working with Morgan, um, and she's very good, as you can tell if you're listening to this, about— she knows her stuff in marketing, selling. So, um, Yeah, and you've helped me. So basically, if they're interested, where can they find you?

Totally. First of all, thank you.

Appreciate the lovely words. Also had a blast working together.

But yeah, I would say if you are— I would even say, who knows if you're interested. I mean, maybe you already are. Cool. DM me, clients. But like, I would just be like, hey, just come into my world and consume some of the content and get some free value and like, look at how I have my Instagram account set up and look at how I sell in stories and like, Just take some value.

And if I ever speak to you in a way and you're like, okay, cool, I need your help, great. Um, but I would just say like, um, be an action freakin' taker right now and actually take out your phone. Hopefully they're listening. I don't know if they got their phone somewhere.

And go to the Instagram app and at the very least just follow me. Like, just literally go open the Instagram app right now, type in search bar @iamorgangillis, just hit follow. I'd love for you to say hi. If you want the Selling in the DMs training, just DM me Selling in the DMs. But otherwise, just say hi and let's have a chat. And I'd love to meet you. And who knows, maybe I can find some other mini training that might be really valuable for you that I can pass along. But that's the number one place I am. I have no website, just Instagram.

And I love that because it shows that you get your clients through Instagram. People find you through Instagram. I found you through Instagram. And actually, And you never like snuck into my DMs and were like, hey, do you want to buy my thing at all? I think a reel got pushed to me. I watched your reel and then I think—

What was the headline?

I can't remember what it was, but I do remember that you liked a story of mine, I think. And then I had seen like, yeah, some more of your content.

Right.

And then I reached out to you. So it's not—

I just want to—

I just want to recap on this for everyone listening so that they understand how the ecosystem worked right here. One reel went to her, she probably liked it, and I was paying attention. The headline was good, it got pushed to her, she probably liked it, I was paying attention, I made one comment, and then the algorithm was like, oh, these guys are talking, and then they sent her more of my content, and then she slid into my DM. So like, right, total shameless plug for everything that you just learned in this thing. It all freaking works together.

Absolutely. Yeah, for sure.

Um, yeah, and it was— yeah.

Seamless. And I hired you because I was like, oh, she knows what she's doing. Um, yeah, so absolutely. So, okay, so go check her out. I'll put the link to, um, your Instagram on the show notes. Um, uh, yeah, thank you again so much.

This was a blast. Thanks for having me.

You're welcome. And thank you everyone for tuning in. I will be back next week, so have a good one.