135. Small-Town Events with Jeremy Nelson

¡Hola! My guest on today's episode is Jeremy Nelson. He is the executive director of the Arthur Market, and he joins us today to talk all about how that event started and really kind of spills the tea, to be honest, and gives quite a peek into just the behind-the-scenes process from starting it over 5 seasons ago. They're starting their 5th season this year. And just like a lot of the things that he learned along the way, which really all translate to great things every single one of us can apply if we are trying to start either something similar or get really any idea off of the ground in, um, our respective small towns. He is warm, he's articulate, he's a teacher by trade and does all of this on the side, which again, if that's not really stereotypical of a lot of us in small communities, I don't know what is. So please enjoy this episode with my friend Jeremy Nelson. Well, welcome to the show, Jeremy.

Thanks for having me. Appreciate it.

Thanks for driving all the way down to see me today.

Oh, absolutely. It's beautiful. Nice country drive.

It's great, right? I know. And it's nice weather. It is. Like, it makes a huge difference in North Dakota when we're driving in the nice weather. Yes.

Yeah. It's very little wind, so I got, yeah, pretty good gas mileage on the way. Yeah.

That's awesome. That's awesome. Well, I'm super excited to talk to you a bit about Arthur Market.

Yeah.

So we were actually— before we hit record, we were just chatting about kind of the evolution of it. Yeah. So give us a high-level overview, like, of what it looks like today, and then maybe take us back to how it started. And just, again, the whole point being, what does one anchor or core kind of main event or festival like this— what does it do for our community? And we can talk a bit too, maybe start to— before we get into the, into the market itself, how big is the city of Arthur? And give some proximity because we were talking a bit about that.

Yeah. So Arthur is 340 ish people, give or take.

Yep.

And we're 30 to 35 miles kind of north northwest of Fargo.

Right.

I don't know exactly how many people like live in Arthur and kind of treat it like as a, like a bedroom town.

Sure.

But I know that although there are a handful of businesses in Arthur, a lot of people work in Fargo-Moorhead. So at the very least, even if they've lived in Arthur for decades, you know, they still have lots of community connections in the broader Fargo-Moorhead area.

Right.

So yeah, we, that proximity is really important when we take a look at doing community events because it's easy to draw, you know, from that larger population and have that support for those kinds of things. So, so yeah, the Arthur Market is a series of farmers and makers markets that we run 3 times a year at this point. And there's some growth opportunities that we're kind of poking at a little bit, but June, August, and October is when we do those and really focus in on like the maker side of things and those individual small businesses and side hustles in our rural communities. That maybe bigger markets might be cost prohibitive. And so just providing an opportunity for them to plug in and support them.

Yeah.

But then also bring the community together. And so yeah, we, we ended going into season 5, we ended last year, biggest market we've ever had. We had 43 vendors, attendance on that one day was 1,000 people. And we had, I think, 23 or 24 sponsors going by the end of last season that were supporting it. So that kind of catapulted us into season 5. And I always like, You know, those 5-year increments are your like celebration, right? The kind of moments. But then also stepping into kind of a new nonprofit entity and that kind of thing. So lots of, lots of great things that are happening. Lots of momentum that we have going into the season.

Right. Okay. So a few questions just about maybe our biggest, like where you're at this, like this last year, right? So you had 43 vendors. How far of a draw, like how far were you pulling these people in from? Yeah.

So if I go back to season 2. We did some giveaways and my wife had this, she, my wife's amazing and just like super creative, super insightful. And she had this idea, like when people register for these giveaways, like name and city, she's like, let's see where people are coming from.

Yeah.

Smart. Yeah. I'm like, absolutely. Yeah. Right. And so that kind of triggered something that I'm nerdy about. I love maps and charts and graphs and everything, you know?

Like dropping pins on all over a map. I'm kind of, I kind of geek out about this as well. Yeah. Yeah.

So, so anyway, she shakes her head and laughs at me that I get nerdy about this, but so I created a metric called communities of origin. And so it's where vendors and attendees have traveled from to be at the market. And so I started creating this list at the end of every market. I post the list and say, hey, if you, if you don't see your community, drop it in the comments, I'll get it added. But then I also figured out on Google Maps how to create my own Google Map. And so I can like pin all these cities, right? And so we currently have a list of towns and cities that are, I think, 120 different towns and cities across 17 different states.

17 states. That's amazing. Is that primarily vendors or is it also attendees?

The broader reach is going to be attendees.

Okay. Most of them have actually believed that, which is weird. Yeah, that's surprising to me.

Yeah. And I would love to think that families sit down. We were talking about traveling a little bit. I would love to think the family sit down and go, hey, that Arthur Market, let's put that on the itinerary. Or, and they're traveling from Boston or wherever. I know it's not that, but Honestly, what it is is something even more important, which is people in the community that have come to the Arthur Market and said, hey, this is something really valuable, really cool.

Right.

And then when they have family or friends that are in town visiting, they say, hey, you know what? It actually coincides with the market weekend. We've got to go.

Yep. 100%. And that friend is visitorship. Yeah. And that's what, again, I will call it air quotes tourism for towns that have 340 people. That's what grassroots visitorship and promotion and tourism looks like. Yep. And so, yeah, I think we sometimes forget that happy residents, or, you know, if you create an event that like the attendees, the local attendees truly love, like you have, they are your biggest champions and ambassadors and the, the mouthpieces, right? To anybody outside. Yeah. Like you said, it's unlikely— this is the truth for all of us, frankly. Unless you have a landmark.

Yeah.

You know, in our little town here, we do not have any landmarks, so to speak, right? We have great hunting and fishing, we've got a fantastic nature, we've got all these things. We're the ones that generate visitorship by saying you need to come check this thing out. So yeah, so the chances that Arthur would be on anybody's like bucket list of places to visit— and it's not because Arthur's not amazing, it's just because it's not practical, right? So So I love that you've done that because I think that also it's validating.

Yeah, for sure.

To the organizers.

Yep. And I love, I love it when people are like, oh, I, you know, we were here from, I brought my aunt this time or whatever. I love adding, you know, towns and cities to that list. And so as far as vendors, so the vast majority of those are gonna be attendees. And I mentioned Boston, we have had people from Boston, Springfield, Illinois, Santa Barbara, California, Reno, Nevada. I mean, it's just like literally it's coast to coast. It's awesome. Vendors. I think the furthest I've had a vendor travel is maybe 2 hours.

Okay.

Which to me is still like, wow, it's a lot.

Well, you got a lot of stuff. You have to carry all your stuff.

And, and that's just it, you know?

Yeah.

Most of my vendors are coming from rural communities, Fargo-Moorhead area. The vast majority of the people who come, it's a side hustle.

Mm-hmm.

And I love that. I love being able to plug into what, you know, they're passionate about, what they're create, you know, their creativity and what they, you know, and shoot, I'm a capitalist at heart. You wanna monetize that? I'm gonna help you monetize that.

Right. Yeah.

And let's, let's support you every way that we possibly can. You know, I've got, I've got a handful of vendors that have been at every single market from day one. They're just there. And that's a whole other thing that's like so important to something like that where you have that consistency, you have that stability. I even created an award, I call it the Taproot Award. So you think of a tree, it's got that deep central taproot.

Yep.

And all the other roots connect to it. Yeah. And so it provides stability and nourishment. And so whenever a vendor hits 10 markets, they've been with me 10 markets at the end of the season, then I give, I have this like laser engraved like Taproot Award that have to go for the season. So I'll probably have 6 or 7 of those that I'll give out this year too. And you know, so we promote our sponsors and do all that and I do as much as I can to promote vendors, but I also recognize that without great vendors, I don't have an event, right? You know, I need them and that's like, people don't come to the market for me. They come to like support the vendors and listen to music and whatever. And so being able to thank them in some small way to say, hey, you know, you're, investment in what we're doing and your commitment to what we've created. Like that, that's huge.

Yeah.

And I wanna make sure that we recognize that. So yeah. So some, some will show up for like one event, some are there for all three and everyone that we've ever had. And that's awesome.

What is the charge for vendors?

So that's changed a little bit.

I bet it has.

Yeah.

Yeah. And I, again, I think, I hope you don't mind, some of these things are really just like, Helping the listeners consider kind of the nuts and bolts pieces of it, right? Yep.

You know, when I first started it, we put it together. Our very first market was September 19th, 2020, and I'd never ever done anything like this before in my life. And I stepped—

what's your background for the listeners?

So I'm a teacher. I've been a history teacher for 24 years. I stepped into the community coordinator role in Arthur, which is a paid city position. And kind of—

and like half-time. Or even quarter time. What is it? Do you know?

Probably quarter time. Okay. Like, it's definitely a side hustle.

Yep. Again, I think it's valid though for everybody to listen.

Oh, 100%.

Yeah. A town of 340 people. Yep. Is it because that's an investment?

Yep.

And again, it's called city coordinator. I—

what a community coordinator or community.

Sorry. Yeah. What were you— what were you coordinating?

Yeah.

So at that time, sorry, I'm kind of all over the place. Oh, no, that's a fascinating quick little— yep.

So yeah, if we start there, so I'm actually the third community coordinator the city's had. I don't remember what year. They started that this August. I'll finish 4 years as community coordinator. The person I took over for did it for 5, and then the first person was at least 5, maybe 7 or 8. So I mean, it's been a good, you know, 15 years that they've had this position. So the main duties when I took the job, the main duties were creating and distributing a monthly newsletter for the community. So there's, I think at the time there was about 300, maybe 350 people that received the households that received it. There was the people in town, there's the rural routes, and then I call them the Arthur expatriates, the people who grew up in Arthur but moved away, but they still want to stay plugged in and continue.

Yeah. We have a bunch of those folks. Yeah. Like, it's awesome.

Yeah. So a lot of people who like moved to Arizona and Florida anyway.

Yeah.

So I did that and then I inherited 4 events. We did a Memorial Day program, like a picnic in the park, which is kind of like a midsummer. We brought bouncy houses in and picnic and whatever for the community. A Veterans Day, and then we did like a Christmas kickoff event. And so when I started as community coordinator, my wife looked at me and she said, hey, you know what? I really think you should create a farmer's market. And I looked at her, I said, you know what? I think you're right. And so we just, from there, just, it kind of took off. So my heart, when I started doing the market was I honestly at first did not want to charge anything for vendors because I was getting paid from the city. This is not going to be a revenue stream for the city. This was not a moneymaker in any way. I just wanted to create a really cool thing for the community. And so I got to talking to Stacy Heising Nelson at Cottonwood Cider House, who I know that you had, right? Her and her husband Dan, and they've been a vendor with me and also a corporate sponsor, which is really cool. And so like from day one, she's been a really incredible resource as a small business owner, but also they do a ton of vendor events. And so I got to talking to her about it and she said, you know, you really should charge something just so that there's a little skin in the game. I'm like, okay, that makes sense.

I get that. Well, it's so easy. Even if it's a nominal fee, it's easy to flake out, but there's something, there is something that compels them a bit more to show up and, you know, so yeah.

So I started with, I'm like, all right, I, like, I don't want this to be cost prohibitive. I've got a couple of vendors. I mean, they're late 60s, early 70s. And you know, I just, I want you here. You only need to can pickles and make jam and stuff like that. That's awesome. So I charged $10 a market. That was it. So I said, you know what, it's going to be a flat fee of $30, period. If you can only come to one market, it's $30. If you come to all three, it's $30.

Right. Okay.

Okay.

Yep.

But then what I said was, I need people here. So I built in an incentive into it that you're going to pay me $30 up front. If you're here for all three, I refunded the vendor fee back to them at the end of the season.

Okay.

This isn't a revenue stream. I want to thank you for being here because without you, I don't have an event.

Yeah.

And so I did that. So for the first 4 years, that was basically the pattern. Is they would, you know, you, and then the agreement too was if you pay for all 3 and you commit to all 3, if you're not able to be there, you forfeit the vendor fee to me.

Sure.

So I know life comes up, but at the same time, like the logistics are, I'm banking on you being here and you not being here for any reason, but stress on the planner and the organizer. 'Cause now I gotta plug it.

Totally.

I have to rearrange things.

Yep.

I've been promoting you, now you're not here.

So yeah. Yeah.

Like there's some consideration there that's gotta happen, but life happens. I totally get it. You know, mm-hmm. Our last, like I mentioned last October, our last market was 43. It was supposed to be 51.

So that's a, I mean, and again, I thank you for just like being so transparent about this cuz I think, and may, this is maybe a shout out to people that are side hustlers. Like there is a real, that presents a real challenge to the organizer. That's 8 less people. That's actually a, I don't know if that's heavy, Tricia, I don't know, but you know, just to hear it and imagine just how that feels.

Yeah, the first— so here's the thing. I've had people ask me, it's like, okay, well, can you fit 50? Our city park is really big and I legitimately could probably fit close to 70 vendors in our park. I really truly could comfortably. We're not attendance-wise at a position where 70 vendors would be successful, right? You know, so that's kind of that balance too of how many do you say yes to? I've got space. I don't have the support there yet. And so you have to have, I don't have an equation for that. I don't have a ratio for that. That's kind of a feel, right? As you grow. So when we were at 51, I was so stressed because I had a map, I had a layout, I had a flow that was really good and it just worked really well. And now I'm like, okay, well now shoot, where do I put these people? I've never had this many vendors before. And so I was kind of like, I could kind of go here and here and here. And while I'm in the middle of processing it, I had a couple of vendors contact me and say, oh, it's not going to happen. And I honestly was I'm like, right. A little bit of breathing room. I think we're gonna be okay. Yeah. Well then, you know, two of my vendors were farmers and October was so beautiful. They just said, I've gotta be at the field. It's like, yes you do. Yeah. 100%. You know? So even the morning of, I had a vendor contact me the morning of. He's like, I just can't be there. I'm like, that's totally fine. You know, 43 vendors was still the biggest we'd had by a couple. So I was still pumped.

Yeah.

But it just kind of like, yep. That breathing space. But you're right. I mean, you know, to go from 51 and you lose 8, like, that's— I'm bummed because I've been promoting them and all that kind of thing, but it was totally fine, right? It was really cool.

So the other thing you just talked about or mentioned is like the number of people attendance-wise you need to make vendors successful. How much responsibility and ownership do you feel like you bear for their success? Because it's challenging. And I would love any perspective you can share with us because I think to vendors, there's a lot that vendors can do to make their own experience better. Do you do anything in the way of kind of setting them up for success? Like, is there anything you do education-wise? And there's air quotes around that.

Yeah.

As a teacher, you know what I mean? Are you wired for that? Because again, if like you've ever been to markets or you've been to these kinds of vendor things, how vendors, whether they sit or they stand or they're in front or behind, they're like, all of those things kind of play a role.

Yeah.

Plus the quality of their stuff.

Yeah. Yeah. Oh, good. Yeah. There's a lot there.

So yeah, I would just generally speaking, I would love like any of your kind of thoughts about vendor procurement, you know, what that looks like. Yeah. Because obviously they have to be makers. Yeah. That was something you said very clearly.

But so upfront we drew that line. That's gonna be farmers and makers.

Yep. And not distributors of other people's stuff.

Yeah. Yeah. So I've had a lot of people over 4+ years that have reached out to me that are Tupperware or Yep. Essential oils, whatever. And those are great. Those are really cool things to get plugged into. And there's definitely spaces for that. But that's been a real clear line from the beginning. I just, I've had to say no to, and I've actually had people at markets, attendees at markets find me and actually thank me for that. That they want it to be more maker stuff. And I appreciate that. That's awesome.

Yep. And I think again, quick point, it's not only an aesthetic, but there's a value system that's driving that. Yeah.

Yeah.

Right. You literally said, look, I want to support people that are side hustling, especially if they're not doing it for any other reason than just pure passion and they love it. That is something to celebrate.

Yeah.

You know, and I love markets like that. I would rather know that a vendor show like, what am I walking into upfront?

Yeah.

So I can imagine that you've 100% had that feedback because yeah, it feels good to people to support makers.

Yeah. Our first 2 seasons, this was something so new to me. Like, I didn't know vendors. I didn't have a network. I've got a huge network now, but I didn't know anybody. And so it was very much those first 2 years. I kind of have to laugh because I would take anybody. It's like, I just, I need vendors.

How did you go about it? Like, what was your process? For finding vendors initially, especially.

Yeah, this is where social media can be such an incredible tool. You know, it was just— so my wife has a photography side hustle. And so I laugh because at times I get frustrated. It's like, why are we doing, like, making this a big thing? Like, I just need some pictures taken, you know?

Yeah.

But it had to be this thing. It had to be this production. And I thanked her for that.

Now, looking back on it, because With hindsight, you're always a little more gracious and understanding.

100%. You know, but I look back on it and we've got this folder in our like Google Images shared stuff and it's just, it's Arthur Market promotional pictures. And so like we went down to the park and we had bought a whole ton of fresh vegetables and like all these little odds and ends and things and we like set up like in the grass and she's like not bellying down in the grass and taking pictures and stuff. But like starting with those quality media pieces. And then all we simply did was we put together and said, hey, Arthur Market coming soon. And we just like dropped teasers. So when it started, it was social media-wise, it was events that I set up via the City of Arthur's Facebook page.

Okay. And so that's a good clarification too, because I think that can be hard to figure out, like where the heck and who owns it. Yeah. Yeah. So the City of Arthur had a Facebook page and then you just created an event.

Yeah. So as a community coordinator, I was admin for the City of Arthur Facebook page. Then we created an event. For those kinds of things. So we dropped some teasers and people are like, ooh, what is this? You know? And then it's like, then we created just like vendors wanted.

Yeah.

You know, so then I'm relying on the people in the community, like hook me up, connect me. And, and what I've learned really quickly was that vendors, like so much advertising is word of mouth, but that vendor community is word of mouth.

Totally.

Because they'll come to one of my events and then they go off to another event and they'll talk to somebody else and say, you really gotta talk to Jeremy.

Yeah.

Like I've gotten so many messages from people like, hey, I talked to so-and-so and they said I should connect with you. I'm like, oh, absolutely. That'd be great.

Yep.

So just that networking that's happened just over time. But our very first market, I had 15 vendors.

Mm-hmm.

And had 51 slated, you know, for October last year. And so like seeing that's massive growth.

Yeah.

It's huge. So this first 2 years, I don't know that I said no to anybody as long as they were a maker. And then as we got into year 3, The growth really started happening. And so at that point I had to start saying no. And what I've told people is I'm like, work really, really hard to maintain a balance of types of vendors.

Mm-hmm.

And I don't have an equation for that. There's no ratio.

Right.

But it's just simply, all right, I already have 3 vendors that do sewing, quilting, crochet.

Yeah.

I'm not gonna bring any more in.

Yep.

Because like, I can't have this turn into a quilt show. Because if people don't come, right, they really truly won't, right? Like you're gonna have the same small subset of people who come and that's great, but the overall attendance is, oh, okay, well it's just a quilt show. I'm not gonna come to that. Or it's like 10 people who do jams and jellies.

Yeah.

It's foods. I got that.

It's just food.

Right.

Yeah.

But then the, the other, like the flip side of that too is if there's too many of any one type, the vendors aren't successful.

A hundred percent.

You know?

Yeah.

Because it waters down profit potential.

Yeah. Right.

And so I've had a lot of vendors reach out to me. And I'll have to say, like, I give them that spiel in response. But what I do tell them is I'll add you to my list. And I do add them to my contact list. I said, if somebody cancels on me or if the growth just explodes and we can manage another one, I'll let you know. And it's interesting, every single one of them says thank you. So in my no, they say thank you for that because they've been to shows, they've been to events in which there's 12 and like, it's like, but we don't sell anything because there's like 10 others that are like doing all the same thing.

Right.

You know, so trying to find that variety.

Yeah.

Is really, really tough. I've had some vendors that wanted to come and I mentioned I'm a free market guy at heart and so I kind of look at what they have and like, uh, like I personally wouldn't buy it, but maybe people will, you know?

Right.

So like, you want to pay for space, I'll give you a space and then the market literally and figuratively will work it out. You know, whether if you're successful, hey, awesome for you.

Right.

That's amazing. And if you want to come back, have you had any vendors complain to you about their success being slower than, or like, I don't know if I would say complain. I'm constantly, I'll put on 20,000 steps on a market day.

Yeah.

So I'm just like running around all over the place and I'm always like, I touch base with every vendor at least once.

Yeah.

You know, during the market. And so I've only had a few times in which vendors would say, yeah, it's just, haven't sold much today. You know, I can only think of one instance and this made me really sad. I had a vendor tell me, I talked to her toward the end of the, of the event and she's like, I haven't sold a thing.

Not a single thing.

Not a thing. I felt really bad about that.

I bet you did.

But I haven't had anybody come to me and complain.

That's good.

Which is good. It's just one of those things where I think, I think if they've done vendor events, they get it, you know, and any vendors that have been with, okay, so here's my mindset and this is maybe a little bit arrogant, but I believe it that like, I think that the Arthur Market's the best market in the valley. And if I can get a vendor up to my event, I've got them.

Yeah.

They might not be at every single one, but they're going to get to everyone that they can. I have a brewery. I have so many fun stories, but one of my favorites is I have a brewery, Icewind Brewing out of Mapleton.

Yeah. Awesome. Yeah.

Rick and Tyler are great. And when I first started putting the market together, Iceland had only been open for 4-ish months, something like that in 2020.

Like they opened awful time to open a brewery. Right. You know?

Yeah.

Right.

And so I remember I'm like scrolling Facebook and that's like, you know, that's kind of goes with like, how do I find other vendors now that I've kind of plugged in a little bit? I just have this radar that as I'm scrolling through, I see people like, hey, I was at this event or whatever. And like, I gotta I gotta talk to them. And so I saw somebody post, oh, I was at Icewind Brewing. I've never heard of that place. Where's Icewind? Oh my gosh, Mapletown. I'm like, that's just down the road. And so it was just a cold call. I contacted Rick, one of the owners, and I just said, hey, I've got this thing I'm putting together. Can we meet and chat? I'd love to get you plugged in. So he's like, yeah, come on, stop by. So I stopped by, he poured, you know, we sat on the patio and had a drink and I just kind of like laid out my vision for him. And he said, well, I'll tell you what, he's like, I can commit to the first one. It's like the second one is our Oktoberfest weekend. Right. He's like, I don't have the staff to be able to do both, so I can't do that one. He's like, the third one, it's like, we'll see how the first one goes. I'm like, hey, that's fair.

Yeah.

Absolutely. Right. So you had asked, do I feel like stress for vendor success or something like that? I was on edge the entire first one.

Of course you were. I asked that because I've experienced it. And you do feel responsible.

Yeah.

You feel responsible for people getting there. Yep. It is. It's, it's a lift.

Have I done enough to promote? Have I done, you know, and so I just, I remember telling my wife, I'm like, I really need Icewind to be really successful today. And so I think halfway through the market event, I had asked Rick, I'm like, hey, how's the day going? He's like, pretty good. I'm like, okay, it's not bad. So, you know, we'll keep going. And we got to the end and, and I looked at him, I'm like, how did it go? And he said, you absolutely crushed this event. And he's like, anything you need, I'm there. He missed the second one because of Oktoberfest. He's been at every single one since.

That's amazing. You know, like that is— and that's the thing, like you just made a comment like it might seem arrogant. You have put a lot of care, like you can hear it and I see it. And again, I haven't been to an event yet. I will make it to one of your— to one of your markets. But there's something really to be said about that. And what I— what I love is that this is really rooted in intention. You had a really clear intention for what you wanted for all aspects, from the people coming And for the vendors and for the town of Arthur.

Yeah.

Right. And that takes, it takes a special kind of person to think. What I can't stand is when people are like, oh, we like, we need a farmer's market. And then they just like plop up and it's, and it feels maybe disheveled and it feels maybe less structured and organized. And those kinds of things won't ever grow. No. Right. No.

It's funny. When I first started floating the idea of doing this Arthur Market, Farmers and Makers Market, I had somebody in town. Mention to me and make the comment in response like, well, we tried putting a farmer's market together and just like really didn't go anywhere. And I just remember thinking like, you don't know what I'm thinking.

Yeah. We're not thinking that you, we're not talking the same thing. No. Right.

You know, and I didn't know what that first attempt looked like. I really don't. What I imagine it being is just like local people who had some extra produce, you know, being together to sell some extra, which is great. You know, that there can be some fun stuff with that. And thinking, no, no, no. Like we're, we're talking food trucks and beverage vendors and live music and, Yes, the whole deal.

It's so awesome. So let's go to that conversation. And by the way, I want to just make a quick— and not a caveat, but I want to just update my statement. If that's what people are doing for farmers markets and they're happy with it, like, carry on. Awesome, right?

Like, carry on.

It's not at all a disparagement if that's what people's farmers markets look like. No, I mean, but it's just recognizing you had a completely different vision for what you wanted it to be. Really more of an event.

Yeah, yeah. You know, for me, what I wanted from the get-go was for people to show up and be there for at least an hour, right? You're going to come and hang out. And I've seen that we get, excuse me, the markets run from 10:00 AM to 2:00 PM and I've seen it so many times where we get to 2:00, vendors are backing up and we'll have little knots of people that are hanging out. There was one day it was 2:30, I think pretty much every vendor was gone. I had finally, yeah, I had finally turned the music off because I had to like, we had to like get the sound equipment, you know, packed up. And there's this group of people sitting at a picnic table and they were finishing the bottle of wine that they had purchased from my winery that was there, you know?

Right.

I'm like, this is why, like, this is what we want to do.

We talked about it earlier in my building, right? It's the encouragement of loiter.

Yeah.

Like the decision to stay. Yeah. That's so special, right? Like, and you created something where they don't want to leave. Yeah.

Yeah.

That's awesome.

Yeah. It's a lot of fun.

So let's talk about pivot into sponsors.

Mm-hmm.

What was kind of your initial vision for that? What are they sponsoring? What are they paying for? Because to have all of these things, yeah, food trucks and, and live music and all of that, there's real costs that go into that. Yeah.

So that was something that I had so little experience with going into this. I had a little bit with something else. Unrelated, but I had no idea. So the first 2 years it was just reaching out to a few local businesses and saying, hey, you know, we've gotta pay for some things. Would you mind, you know, sponsoring? And so I think I had one business give me $100. I had another one, I think $600 is like the biggest. So I think the first year, I think it may have raised $1,200, you know, the first year, something like that. But that was enough. You know, that was—

it covered your costs. Yeah.

There was enough to do what we needed to do.

Yeah.

One of my corporate sponsors, they print banners and signs and all that kind of stuff. And so they were an in-kind sponsor. And so they printed my corporate sponsorship yard signs and, you know, big Arthur Market banner and all that kind of thing. And so there's, you know, dollar value to that. But as far as like cash donations, it was like $1,200. Second year, I kind of operated the same way. We added a few more sponsors. So I think I had like 13 second year. When we got into the third year is when I started building relationship with Cass County Electric.

Yeah.

And they've been my biggest sponsor.

Shout out to Catskill County Electric. Yeah.

They're amazing.

They've been a great partner to us.

Yeah. Yeah.

Mm-hmm.

And so the reason I bring them up is within this generating corporate sponsorship, sort of like substream to all of this, cuz you've got all of your vendors and you've got laying out your space and like, yeah, all that kind of stuff.

You got logistics of just running the thing.

Where do the like automobile traffic go? Where's the foot traffic go? Like all that stuff.

Porta-potties. Do you bring those in?

Uh, last year we just added 2 for the first time cuz in our park we actually have like facilities.

Facilities. Okay. That's nice. Yep.

And then after the August market I had, or during the August market, I had a vendor who had sent me a message during the market and said, hey, I heard a couple people complaining about the lines. Just so happens that this vendor's father-in-law runs a septic business that has porta-potties and lo and behold lives in Arthur.

Well, what the heck? Yeah.

And so, so I reached out to him and yeah, so his corporate sponsorship now is bringing in his two porta-potties.

Those are, that's a great, yeah.

You know, so it's all those little things, you know. Totally.

Yeah.

So anyway, so the reason I bring up Cascadia Electric is when I started building that relationship with them, I was asked like, okay, so what are your sponsorship tiers? I'm like, sponsorship tiers? I'm like, what are you talking about? I'm like, I just, I'm just taking whatever, you know. But I realized, okay, so this is going to grow. I need to have something in place. And so I remember I like, I just—

along with benefits and what they get. Yeah. What they get for their levels.

Yeah.

Yep.

And so, and so I remember I just like sat down on my computer. I'm like, I have no I didn't know what to do. And so I just grabbed a Word document and just like made a quick table and did some Googling, probably, right?

Yep. Yeah. And like, just to see, look it up. And so before you carry on with this, one note I want to make about this, it's like we get really in our heads about, you know, thinking we have to nail it and get it perfect and whatever. Everything you're offering to these people is made up anyway.

Oh, 100%.

So make up something that you're excited to offer them. Yep. And use the assets you have. Yep. That's what I'll say about it. Right? Like, that's a great place to start when you're thinking like, I don't know what we should give them. Yeah, it doesn't have to be like everybody else's thing. Think about what it is that you do. Think about what ties to either the purpose or the mission of your event or your organization and use your assets.

Yeah. So I love that you brought that up. So I remember the first year it was just this little table I made in a Word document. There was no graphics, it was nothing. I just—

that was how you started. Yeah.

Yeah. I'm like, I don't know. And so it was like, well, okay, we put, we put yard signs up for everybody, but then I was like, hey, I also do the community newsletter. So I'm going to give you shoutouts in the newsletter.

The asset you had. Yeah.

Yep. So we're, we're starting there. So that grew into then, so that was going into year 3. So going in last year into year 4, I'm like, all right, I'm going to make this a little bit more formal. And so we have an upgraded like Canva subscription.

Yeah.

So like, I'm going to make a PDF, I'm going to like add some pictures and whatever. So then made it a little bit more interesting, but then leveraging assets. So what we did, we've got 4 tiers. A lot of it's just kind of standard stuff, you know, signs here, shoutouts there, whatever. Well, in wanting to support local businesses, I thought, hey, you know what we're going to do? I'm going to put together like market bags of goodies. And so one of the things we've done from the beginning is one of our local sponsors pays for canvas tote bags and the tote bags have our market logo on it. And then we put the sponsor logo on it and I give those away like X number, first come, first serve, every single market. Yeah. Just as low, little promo. So I'm like, hey, you know what? I'm gonna keep a handful of those. And then our top sponsors, if they sponsor there, you're gonna get a tote bag. Well then I like, I'm gonna reach out to vendors and say, hey, would you donate a jar of jelly? So then I've got cider house, I've got a brewery, and I've got a winery on board. And I'm like, hey, would you guys donate a date night? I'll make the—

this is awesome, Jeremy.

I'll make, I'll make the gift certificate. You know, I'm like, I'll make the gift certificate. You just sign off on it. Tell me what it would be. And so Icewind's like, yeah, we'll do like 2 pints of pizza. And Rickery Rock Winery is like, hey, we'll do a pizza and a bottle of wine. And I'm like, sweet. And so I make up certificates, you know, and put them in there. So anyway, so leveraging that. Well, then in addition to that, what I've kind of learned is I don't have to come up with every idea.

Yeah.

You know, I don't have this infinite well of creativity because ultimately I want to make sure the sponsor is valued and supported. And I could come up with 10 ideas, but if it doesn't resonate with them, that's it's going to fall flat. And so being able to go to them, especially on those, those bigger tiers, the bigger donors, to say what has value to you. And so with Cass County Electric, they had asked, hey, can we be there at the markets? Like, tell me what that looks like. I said, well, like, we could bring in one of the big boom trucks. Love it. Kids love it. Absolutely.

Yeah.

You know, so that is so, so they had one of the, the big boom trucks in there. And then I had to shoot down a couple of ideas though, because It's a— Jocelyn got kind of mad at me, but she's on my board now though.

So anyway, right. She forgave you. Yeah, she did. Yeah.

So, but she's like, hey, we've got this cool like Ford F-150 EV truck. She's like, we could like plug in like a snow cone maker and like give away snow cones to kids. I'm like, all right, I love that idea. But guess what? I have a vendor who does like shaved ice, so I got to say no to that.

Yeah, right, right.

She's like, okay, well then like comes to the last market and she's like, okay, so we can plug in a popcorn maker. I'm like, OK, guess what? So I have a vendor who's going to be making popcorn.

But see what I— OK, so let's just pause for a second. Because what I love about this is that that's the question. As a sponsor, what would make this feel really great for you?

Right.

You know, because like we said, you make it all up anyway. Instead of spending a bunch of time— and I think it's hard to think outside of the box. But if the vendor actually has— or the sponsor actually has ideas, they'll offer them to you and then it's just a really cool negotiation. And what a fun way to add that meaning and that significance. And I just think that's so special and I don't think enough people do that. Yeah. On any event sponsorship.

Yeah.

We, we tell you what you get, we ask for your money. We never ask that or rarely ask that question.

Yeah. And I've had some bigger asks this year.

Mm-hmm.

Just cuz we're growing and stepping into this nonprofit world and, and what that looks like. And so like I'll send my PDF out and I always say, this is where we start. I'll make specific proposals. So I'll say, hey, this is where I would love to get you guys. This is what I would see you donating at. We can start with what's in the PDF, but I want to make sure that it feels good to you. Yeah. So I'll say like, all right, I'm going to ask for $3,000. What does a $3,000 sponsorship look like for you? Like what would we need to do to make that happen?

What would make it feel good? Yeah.

And sometimes, sometimes they've even said, hey, listen, This is a big ask. I'm still learning. So even if, even if your response is going to be to me, I can't donate at that level, I respect that. But humor me here because I'm learning what, maybe it's not this year, right? But for you, what would a $5,000 sponsorship look like? What would we need to do to make that happen? Maybe it's next year, maybe it's 2 years, but let me know, what does that look like? Is there a branding? Is there like something that goes with it. So that way, I'm starting to build up that knowledge base to say, OK. And then that kind of like sometimes you just get like 1 or 2 ideas, and that opens up 10 other creative possibilities that you hadn't even thought about before that you could kind of travel down those roads.

Right. You've done this in such a beautifully grassroots way. That's why I was so excited to have this conversation with you because, again, I think it's so overwhelming. Like you start off with something like this, And right away, oftentimes people go, why should we— should become a nonprofit? You probably don't have to right away. We're going to talk about that shift in just a minute here. But like, so just from a logistics standpoint, initially all marketed under the city of Arthur. So was there just like a separate account financially that you took money in, or how did you— or did it just come into the city and then they knew it was going for the market and that was fine?

Yeah. So, yeah, so the Arthur Market for the first 4 seasons, This was just, I just created this community coordinator. This is just like events that I did. So any sponsorship dollars that came in, it was paid to the city.

Okay. Yeah. And I think those logistics help people sometimes just to like, where does this have to actually look like?

So they paid to the city. And then when I had checks that I needed to give out on a market day to musicians or to features that we brought in, then I just made sure that, and for me, that was like the planning ahead that I needed to be really aware of because those expenses technically needed to be approved by the city council.

Sure.

You know, and so I'd have to make sure that I had all my ducks in a row, like a month ahead. And because I had to make sure then that they got approved and then the city auditor had enough lead time to get the checks cut and signed. Yeah. Sometimes there was some stress that I put on myself because I didn't plan ahead far enough. And so it's like, I got the checks, but we need to get them signed. All right, well, let's— we got to push.

Let's go. Yeah.

Tomorrow's the market and I need, need them signed. And so there was, yeah.

So just, so visiting your city council person at like 8 o'clock at night before the market, can you please sign these checks? Yeah. I, I mean, again, this, all of this is just such a good peek into like how you started, what you grew to. Yeah. And I think it's really, I love it so much because you were a person with a passion. Mm-hmm. Like you were a person that had this idea and those people exist everywhere. Yeah. Jeremy. And like, that's why I do continue to do this podcast because I want to talk to those people and say like, your idea is worth pursuing.

Yeah.

You know, and also this really cool reminder to everybody, like, you are not going to know what you're doing if you're doing things the first time. It's going to be kind of ugly. You're going to make a lot of little like hiccups and mistakes. And that's 100% what learning looks like. Yeah. And so don't confuse being new with being terrible. Yeah, because you're not the same for sure, you know. Yeah. Yeah. And I know as like, we've talked a bit like, you know, offline about just perfectionism and just really wanting to do things super well. And you have to just go into it with a beginner's mindset.

Yeah.

Like, I don't know what I'm doing and it's gonna be kind of ugly.

Yep.

Man, I'll never be dumber than I am right now about this thing. And when I get through the first one, I'm gonna be so much smarter, right?

Yep. Generating sponsors. I like, I look at those first couple of years and it's like, it was sponsorships and vendors of what we're doing. Like it was so much of a sandbox. It was just like, we're gonna try things. We're gonna, we're gonna try it. Everything we did though, even though it was new and it was kind of rough around the edges, like everything that we wanted to do, we pers— like it was, it was, we're gonna do it well. We're gonna do it as excellent as we can.

Right. With the resources you had and the knowledge you had. Yep.

We're, you know, there's certainly things that were kind of garage bandy, but I mean, like honestly, it's like, you know, the little sign I put out there that was spray painted, you know, 10:00 AM to 2:00 PM, look kind of crappy, but you know, I don't know that it worked, but hey, we're gonna, you know, we need, oh, forgot to communicate the hours. Oh no, we gotta do something about it. And there was times where, whether it was a vendor or a sponsor, I had people in the community ask me kind of baffled, like, how did you get them? And one of the first lessons I learned was because I asked. Yes.

That's such a powerful, powerful lesson.

There's the ask. And the worst thing you can hear is, no, I don't want to be a part of that.

That's bummer. Well, and then you get to ask the question of, like, why? And what would make this a yes for you? Which is the same with It's vendors, it's sponsors, it's artists, it's everybody. And you don't learn anything without that step, right? Like, you have to do the asking.

You know, I coached track and field for 7 years, and there was always students who it's like, gosh, you should really be off track. And so I would dog kids, hound them as they're like getting close to the season. Come on, come on. And it was always like, okay, well, I'm thinking about it. Oh, I'm thinking about it. And they never And I just kind of learned, I'm like, you know what? I'm going to tell them once, you should come out for track. Here's why I want to see you there. And if they do, awesome. And if not, I'm not going to waste my energy and my time and my breath trying to convince somebody who clearly doesn't want to.

Right.

And so when it comes to like sponsors or vendors, I'm going to pitch my vision. And if you tell me no, I'm bummed to hear that because I think it would be a great fit. But you're going to want to be a part of it soon.

Yeah. Well, and that's just it too. Like, people do come around. Yeah, people do come around. Like, you had an example, right, of somebody that initially that was a local business owner, didn't get it, didn't really love it, or whatever, for whatever reasons. And then after a couple of years and seeing it, sometimes we actually do just need to build it and people will come along.

Kind of Field of Dreams.

It's only Field of Dreams. Yeah, when I was building this thing, my spouse was like, that's not a strategy. And I was like, well, that's the one I'm making on, so I hope it works. Yeah, so Let's pivot into what made you feel ready and that the time was right to actually form a nonprofit because a 501 designation is not really that enjoyable to pursue and to get and then the structure of all of it. So what made you feel like that was a shift that needed to happen?

So, all right. So I'll, I'm gonna be transparent upfront. I am still waiting on my 501.

Are you really?

Yeah.

Oh, when did you— wow.

Yeah. So January 5th is when I had submitted all of it. And the IRS had indicated on their website, it's 180 days is the possible turnaround, 6 months.

Wow. That's a lot longer than mine was.

Yeah.

But again, that was, mine was 5 years ago.

So we're still, yeah, we're still waiting on that. So we are a nonprofit LLC in the state of North Dakota through like Secretary of State's office. Got all that. We have our tax ID number and all those things. We have bank accounts.

Yeah, sure. You just can't, you can't offer tax deductions.

Right.

So sponsorship.

Yeah. So that's where the city of Arthur has continued to be a really great support and partner. So they're kind of working as kind of a financial partner intermediary for me. Yeah. So I probably waited maybe a smidge longer than I should have because I was just crossing my fingers that that tax exempt letter would show up. So we'll get it. I know we will. It's just, we're still waiting on it.

So, and first market is when?

June 15th.

Okay.

I mean, I've got stuff I need to purchase because there's some other sort of infrastructure things that I want to add because as we've grown, I just kind of need to add some extra things, parking delineators and flags, like whatever. So I need some upfront money for that. So our, the city partnering with us now to kind of help with the financials. So starting to line up sponsors and those dollars are starting to roll in. So then it goes to the city, so that way it's a donation to the city and then the city makes the donation to the market.

Sure.

And so it's just an extra step and it works great and it's fine. Yep. You know, so next year at this time we won't have to worry about it.

Absolutely.

It'll be all good. So yeah, it's just a, take a breath and yeah, that is not a big deal.

But what was the trigger in your, in your mind or in, you know, because again, like, I don't know how much people really get it right, but you have to write articles of incorporation, you have to write bylaws, you have to put a board together.

Yeah. Yeah.

You know, it's a lot of effort.

Yeah. Year 1 was, was GarageBand and it was awesome.

I love that analogy, by the way. Everyone can relate to that.

Yeah, for sure. Year 2, Okay. So year 1, we did 3 markets and successive Saturdays, and it was very modest, but it was strong enough growth that it actually, I didn't think about this, it actually put pressure on my vendors to only have a week to restock when we were talking side hustles. You know, I've got a full-time job and family, and here I sold out two-thirds of what I had and I have to, so I'm like, okay, well, year 2, let's do one a month, but hey, let's do 5 instead of 3. And so we did 5. June to October, we grew a little bit more, but it felt kind of watered down. And so then going into year 3, sometime during year 2, I started to think about the nonprofit step. I was like, okay, I'm like, okay, well maybe. And I floated it. The only person I talked to is my wife about it. And she's like, well, I mean, maybe, but maybe quite yet. And I was still kind of wrestling with like, okay, why would we do that? What would be the purpose? But it just kind of rattled around the back of my head. I got some feedback from vendors at the end of season 2 and they said, hey, why don't we go back to 3, but then do every other month so that way we, we can do more with less. And so it was year 3 that we really hit our stride and doing every other month, each one we can kind of make a little bit different and then we can take those dollars and really kind of focus them in on adding features and things for families to do and to plug into.

And Are they themed?

No, I mean, not really. Yeah. So like our June one, I just call like season kickoff.

Yeah.

Okay. Like our October one is our season finale, you know, whatever. But we add, we add things for families here and there, which I mean, we could talk about later. But so during season 3, it's kind of that analogy with when you plant flowers or shrubs in the first season, they sleep the second one, they creep in the third day. And so that third season like took off. And so then I really started thinking, okay, maybe maybe nonprofit, but there wasn't anything that was a specific trigger. There wasn't anything where it's like, now it was just kind of a gut feeling. And I was really stuck on, I love numbers and statistics and I was really stuck on growth and like what would be the benefit of stepping into nonprofit status. And what I realize now is that my focus was far too narrow because I just saw it as the number of attendees, the number of vendors, how much sponsorship dollars, and that's all really important. But that's not specifically nonprofit. That's always going to be there. And so I just kind of shelved it for season 3 and didn't think about it. So then as we moved through season 4, we got to, got through with our second market in August of 2023 last summer. And I just went, okay, now I think now, and I don't know what it was. I just saw the growth and I saw just the growth, you know, just the attendance had boomed again and the number of Vendors continued to grow and sponsors. I had people reaching out to me to be sponsors. I mean, like, that's the sweet spot when you've got people saying, hey, we want to be—

we want to be a part of this. Yeah.

And then just that communities of origin and where people were coming from. And so I just thought, I think we need to start looking at that. But I just also kind of, I didn't shelve it, shelve it, but I just kind of put it on the back burner. So then we got to October and as we rolled into the October market, I just thought, I think now, I really think now. And so I had 3 conversations during that market, one with a sponsor, one with a vendor, and then one with someone who's a vendor and a sponsor. And I just said, I'm thinking about this right now. Give me feedback. And all 3 of them without any hesitation said, yeah, I think you should do that too. So I went, okay, there's confirmation there. This isn't a harebrained idea. This isn't something that's way out of left field. If I would've talked about it like season 2, then it would've been really premature.

Sure.

It just, yeah, it just like the longevity wasn't there. The foundation wasn't there yet. Well then I thought, all right, so what's that step look like? So I started, I connected with you a little bit. We've got, my wife and I have another acquaintance who runs a nonprofit in Fargo. It's only a handful of years old. And so I connected with her just to get some more feedback too and thought, okay, let's pursue this a little bit. So then I started talking to a few people that I thought might be board members. And they also, without any real hesitation at all, said, yeah, that'd be cool. That would be a part of that. Yeah.

And so that's, again, like helping people kind of step this out. This is a great approach that you took. You're asking the people involved. You've demonstrated a real openness to feedback, which is learning. That's all it is, right? And positioning it as— and you don't— again, like when we're doing things like this that we've never done before, we don't have to say like, I have no idea what I'm doing and I'm a blah. You can say, I've never done this before. I'm absolutely doing my best guess. This is my best effort. I need a lot of feedback. And so being open to that feedback, oh my gosh, it's so critical when you're doing something new.

Yeah. And then people feel like they're valued.

Right.

You know, so then it's like, oh, I've got to say in this and be a part of it and that kind of thing. So yeah, I just like getting feedback from people. Taking those steps and saying, okay, this is, this is what we're going to do. So the shift for me from like year 3 to 4, the mental adjustment, the paradigm shift for me was recognizing that logistics in those numbers are always going to be there. Trying to figure out how do I fit 50 vendors, 60 vendors into my park? Like where's the foot traffic going to go? Is parking going to become a problem? And like, how do we deal with that? And generating sponsorships and dollars. All those things that will always be there. For me, I was looking at it originally as, okay, I've gotta solve this equation. It's always gonna be in flux. And so the best thing to do is to come up with an approach that allows you flexibility to adjust as you need to. When you have vendors that suddenly cancel on you, right? Okay. So what mechanisms do I have in place to be able to adjust on the fly and to, you know, to be able to do that well and with some fluidity and grace, right?

Yeah.

So what settled on me was like purpose. What settled on me was mission and vision, which I love talking about. You know, and so that's where, that's where I thought like we're in a position now. The market is now in a position at the end of the fourth season to step into and leverage what we have, step into something bigger. That's what clicked with me was that shift from this, not just a community event. We're not just drawing X number of people, raising X number of dollars. I have X number of vendors and I gotta map out the space 10 times because it's not quite right. And I obsess about the details. It's like, how else can we be a resource in the community? And, and so what I realized is that all of the opportunities that I see and those that are gonna come up, if I simply keep the market as an event underneath me as a community coordinator, I'm not gonna be able to do those.

Right.

You know, I've got businesses that have donated to the market, but they donated it to the city. It's like, like I've got pop-up tents or I've got parking stuff. Okay, well that's a donation to the city. So if I step out to say, hey, there's a neighboring community that I could maybe partner with and help them put on a vendor event, it's not Arthur Market stuff. It's like city things. And those sponsors donated to the city, not for— so there's like blurry lines and—

yep. And well, it becomes that they aren't your assets, right? You know, you'd have to borrow them.

Yeah. Yeah, exactly. Yeah.

And so, right.

And so treating that with integrity and making sure that, yeah, stewardship, it's good stewardship of, of the gifts of the donations and then of the things, the fun things to do, to buy.

Yeah.

But I also see those opportunities and like, and I want to tap into those. I want to support those other small towns and there's opportunities there. And so it just kind of made sense to take a lateral step, right. You know, and to take a lateral step. Away from the community coordinator position, but then that allows us to go forward further and faster. So this year it was interesting. I've had people when they've learned that, that it's a nonprofit, I had not expected this question before. They asked me, so the vendor events, are they going to stay in Arthur? And I hadn't even thought about that. Like people were like kind of concerned, like this nonprofit step meant that we're leaving Arthur.

Yeah.

It was interesting to me. I'm like, I didn't even resonate with me. I never thought about that. So just to reassure people, it's like, no, no, no. Like, like this is where we are. Like, this is the commitment and we have at least these 3 markets every single season, but then there's potential for growth outside of that. Right. I've had some vendors the last couple of years ask about adding a spring event. I've had vendors ask me about adding a November, like Christmas event kind of thing, which, you know, this year we're not going to just because there's so much that has to be done to get the nonprofit going. I don't want to like too much too soon kind of thing.

Right.

So we get this going and so then next year, you know, those opportunities are there and I know that, you know, doing a, putting together another vendor event somewhere to that cultivate that thriving rural community.

Right.

You know, so starting in Arthur and we kind of like maybe create the blueprint or the format, the structure and the framework for what we want to do and then to be able to step into other communities and bring what we do and bring what we have to support other local businesses and side hustles and that kind of thing. So, Like I said, it was just kind of that shift for me from being focused exclusively on growth numbers to what the mission and vision looks like.

Like impact. Yeah. Yeah. Which is a different, it's a different language.

Yeah.

The language of impact. Yep. But it's important. That's important for your, your sponsors or for your supporters, your partners, you know, especially this maintaining nonprofit status. It's, yeah, you have to have impact. Mm-hmm. So, okay. Has there been any lesson that you felt like you really learned the hard way that you would like love to try and help our listeners avoid? You know, like any one, gosh, I wish that I had just known that and didn't have to like learn it the hard way.

Gosh, that's a good question. I don't know if this is a hard lesson, but like kind of being in a sandbox phase, your mindset's gotta be, we're gonna try something. And if it doesn't stick, yeah, I mean, you just have to be willing to accept that, hey, you know what, this isn't gonna work.

Yeah.

And that's okay.

Yeah.

You know, we, I tried 2 years in a row to get a, like a car show, like a, a drive-in.

Sure.

You know, cruise-in.

Yeah.

Thing going connected with it thinking, hey, this would be really kind of cool. We could, like, I've got tons of space. We've got vendors on one end of the park. We could have all these like cool, like 40, 50 cars, like on the other side, you know? So we got all the car owners hanging out. We've got another demographic of people coming to the market and they're gonna hang out. Sure. Whatever, you know? And so we tried it our second season and I had maybe 20 cars show up and I'm thinking, hey, all right, okay, this is good. I had spent a few hundred dollars and had flyers printed and I went to car shows and like distributing them and whatever. So I thought, hey, season 3, let's do it again, but I'm going to ramp up. I'm going to do more. And so I had spent more hundreds of dollars and had more flyers printed and I went to more car shows and I had less cars show up. My number of cars went down by almost half. And I was really bummed about that. And then some of the drivers that showed up were only there for like an hour. And I remember turning around and seeing cars like drive out of the park. I was like, what? No, no, that's not what we wanted.

Yeah.

So I was bummed, but at the same time, I just kind of shrugged and went, okay, it's not going to take.

Yeah.

And I'm totally fine with that.

You basically invalidated the idea. The reason I asked the question is just because like I think most of the lessons we kind of learn the hard way. That's how they stick. You know, you just go, oh, but I think that trial and pilot or, you know, like beta testing mindset is so important. It's an entrepreneurial mindset. It's what it is.

Right.

And so I think the more that we can apply that lens to a lot of things we try and then that decision of like, how many times do we have to try it before we know it's not an idea that'll stick? And you did it twice. You said two times for two different markets.

Yeah. Yeah. 2 years.

Yep. Okay.

In this, so our, and our 3rd season when I tried it the 2nd time at that, so it was our August market and do the cruising. Well then I also thought, hey, let's add a cornhole tournament. And so there's like a league in Fargo called North Dakota Cornhole and a coworker of my wife's is a part of the league or whatever. So I kind of had him in or whatever. So I'm like, hey, I'd love for you guys to come up. So I talked to them and you know, we talked about the market and the vibe and what we want to be about. So it's okay, we'll put together a Switch Partner Tournament. So you just sign up by yourself. You don't have to like come with a partner. Yeah. And people are guaranteed 8 games. You're gonna play with somebody different every time. And I'm like, this sounds so great. So I paid them $300 to come and do that. They bring the boards, the bags, they bring like the monitors.

That's totally reasonable. I mean, yeah. Yep.

So they're gonna come and run it for me. Well, I spent almost $300, uh, like having flyers created for my car show cruising thing. Went to 4 different car shows 4 weeks in a row. Passing these things out. And the cornhole tournament was significantly more successful and had a far greater impact on the market to the extent that I had them back again for the October market. And I've got them coming back for June and August this year to do like, you know, Switched Pardoner tournaments. So it's kind of like looking at it and going, well, if I'm going to put my resources anywhere, it's going to be there. Yeah. You know?

Right.

So, so your question of like the hard lesson, wasn't necessarily like a hard lesson, like, ooh, I got put through the wringer. But like when you put something together for the first time, it's kind of like you have an idea of what could work, what could catch, what could stick, what people might enjoy. And maybe in your mind you think this is going to be great. And if it doesn't, you really have to be willing to kind of step away and go, you know what, I'm okay with that not working out.

Yeah. Like let your ego step aside. And that's really— it is really hard, you know, especially if you, you were like this should have been great. Yeah. And for whatever reason, it just doesn't. And to be able to, like, being able to just humbly say, okay, like, we tried it and for whatever reason it's not, it's not a core part of what we're going to do. Yeah.

And what's interesting is then going into, so last year was the fourth season. So we did try to do the car show season 2 and 3. So then going into last season, I had one or two people reach out to me and ask me like, hey, can you do the car show again? I'm like, they just started laughing. I'm like, no. No, we're not. But sign up for the Gormhul tournament.

Yeah, right? That's awesome. Well, Jeremy, I absolutely love this conversation. I think this kind of an event— and again, I love that Arthur's 340 people. I think that's fantastic. Yes, you have good proximity. Oh, before we wrap, one other question. What was your general marketing technique? How did you reach into the draw from the Fargo Mort? Did you have any partnerships with, their CBP or a chamber or anything? Like, how did you tap into that population?

Yeah. So year 1 and 2, I don't know that I did any advertising really at all. It was just like free social media stuff.

Sure.

Year 1, I didn't at all. I didn't spend any money advertising. Year 2, I may have promoted a Facebook post.

Did a little bit of like, yeah, like boosted posts or something on Facebook. Sure.

A little bit.

A little bit of paid advertising.

Cass County Reporter, is the newspaper. And so I know that they would kind of just run a little ad for me. It was just our, our market logo and then it would just have the dates.

Sure. Yeah.

So I don't know to what extent that was like real significant, but going into last year is when I made the first step to like really dedicate dollars towards advertising. Mm-hmm. And so going into our June market, I had budgeted $1,100. To purchase radio time.

Okay. And so on a Fargo station?

Yeah. So the group of stations, FM Radio Media. So they have Bob and the Eagle and stuff. And so I spent $1,100 with them. Part of that then, so my wife works for that group of stations.

Okay.

And so I know like management and stuff like that. And so they were really, really generous with me. So part of that $1,100 running ads, for the whole week up to, but part of it was also giving away a pair of 3-Day General Admission WeFest tickets at our June market. And so that was huge, just the reach, the promotion on our social media stuff to say, hey, we've got this giveaway. And then going into October, I think I spent $200 before our October market for just promoting the event like 2 weeks prior. And that gained a ton of traction. Oh, and then the other thing too, I totally forgot about prior to the October market, I was able to get a brief amount of time on Valley News Live.

Sure.

In the morning.

Yep. Like they're today, they're Valley Today or whatever.

Yep.

Yep.

And then they have like an online Valley News Now, I think is what they call it.

Mm-hmm.

And so being that it's like kind of nonprofit municipality thing, you know, so I didn't, that, that was free and they just, they helped me out in that regard. So I know, I know for a fact that people at the October market had approached me and said, hey, we learned about it because of, you know, the TV stuff or whatever. So this year, And my plan is to grow that. And so I'm going to try to, try to do the TV bit before all three. I'm working with the management at the radio station to spend the same amount for all three markets. So we'll have WeFest tickets again that we'll be giving away in June and we'll have concert tickets for August and October as well. Yeah, that's kind of what it looks like. So it kind of just started like again with the resources that you have, you know, so I'm going to. I'm gonna leverage social media and all the free things that I can do. And then you just can't ignore, kind of going back to what I mentioned early, like the network that vendors have.

Yeah.

And so like vendors have, a lot of 'em will have like their personal page, but then they'll have like their business page.

Right.

You know, so now they're promoting, hey, catch me at Art Market.

Right.

And they're gonna tag the market.

Yeah.

And then I can, I can tag them when I promote them and then people who follow them. And so like kind of just that exponential growth that happens. And how we get to leverage that as much as you can.

Well, and, and to that point, for anybody listening to this that wants to do anything like this, right? It's recognizing that the more you can direct people on what you need them to do. So vendors, right? Especially if you do a communication or you send out an email or however you're communicating with your vendors to be really specific about what, you know, like we're posting on this date, or if you're posting something and you want them to share it, like we need to tell people how to help us sometimes. Like, and they're always willing to because it's good for them. And I think another thing that people can consider too, and I don't know if you did any of this, but social media can be so powerful if you have like a handful of ambassadors that just sign on to like help share your stuff. And there again, if you would enlist the help of people like that, tell them exactly what you need them to do because people don't necessarily know how to share it, right? And so just enlisting, and like you said, all of that's free. And you can really make a pretty good dent, especially your first year. So that's awesome. It's awesome to hear that you're, you know, again, just kind of on all levels ramping up logistics, ramping up, you know, actual doing paid media. It's super valuable, but it's expensive. And so again, like helping everybody realize you didn't do that until year 4. And you have to build a good base to kind of, kind of start.

And it kind of goes with like what vision you have for the event you're creating. You know, for me, I see community on two levels. There's the immediate community of Arthur, and then we draw from like Hunter and a few other small places. We kind of consider that our immediate community. And so when we do things like Memorial Day or Veterans Day or our Christmas event, you know, whatever, that's for the immediate community. But then when we're talking about the Arthur Market, that's the broader community, right? It's the region, right? And so, you know, for our Christmas kickoff, you're not going to promote that and spend $200 to boost a Facebook ad.

Right.

You're not gonna go on the radio, right, to do that kind of thing. And so you have to be really intentional and aware of what is the goal with the thing that we're creating.

Yeah.

If you wanna draw people from a bigger area, like we're trying to do with the Arthur Market, well then, you know, spending the, you know, the radio dollars makes absolute sense.

Yep. You know, it's thinking like, who are the people we wanna have there and where are those people?

Yeah.

You know, where will we find them? And like you said, with a smaller community, you don't necessarily need to, to invest dollars. You're, your newsletter was probably a great place to share a lot of those things to local people. So anything else you want to add to just kind of wrap our conversation again, thinking about our listeners and just any encouragement, any words of encouragement or just general advice that you would give to somebody that might be considering?

Yeah, pursue the harebrained ideas. Talk to people that you trust and bounce ideas off of them. Have that we always kind of use the word your tribe or whatever, but you know, have the people around you that you say, hey, I've got this passion for this. I have this idea. What do we think? Right. You know, and if you get positive feedback right away, kind of broaden that out and, you know, and so if you're looking at doing an event in town, it's going to cost dollars, you're going to need sponsors. Okay. So then talk to a few people, right? And just say, hey, you know, what does this look like? And again, the worst you can hear is, nah, I don't know if that would really work or I'm not interested. Doesn't mean the idea is dead.

Right.

You just really kind of have to evaluate it and say, okay, well, I talked to one business owner and they said no. Well, talk to 4 more, right?

Right. Don't let the first no be the final answer.

Yeah, I need data points. Like, I'm just— I'm a guy that needs data points.

Yeah.

And so one person, that's not going to make or break. 7, uh, okay, now let me just start to listen.

And the other thing I want to commend you on is that you were having real conversations. I really want to illustrate You know, again, how important that is from like a human perspective, because what I don't want to encourage or hear people do is like write a form letter.

Yeah.

And then send them to all your businesses. It isn't the same. And here's why. Even if the business has the money and they like your idea, what's missing is the sense of significance and that they matter. Yeah. Where you're reaching out to people, sitting down with them and saying, I want you to be a part of this. Like, it would mean a lot to us and we would love to have you there.

Yeah.

Those are different words and they hit people differently. That's why personal asking is so important in, like, a lot of aspects of community development. I think it really is just make it personal because it is. So when people say it's not personal, it's business, I'm like, it's all personal. It's actually all personal. I understand what they're trying to say, but at the end of the day, people get moved to action because of that feeling that they matter.

100%. And they want to be able to plug in. Sometimes people don't even know, like, I want to volunteer, I want to help, right? And they don't know where, and they don't want to step on toes to just like assert themselves because maybe someone has a process in place and they don't want to offend. And so people a lot of times are just waiting to be asked, and whether it's a business that's waiting to be asked to get plugged in and support, but just pursue those ideas and take advantage of where you are right now. Like there's a whole other like career backstory to like where I'm at right now. And part of it revolves around recognizing the opportunities you have right in front of you and like plugging into those and investing in those and making something awesome out of it. And regardless of whether you think you're going to be in a certain spot for 6 months, 6 years, you know, 20 years, you know, to take those steps and and do it.

Make it the best you can right now.

Absolutely.

And it doesn't have to be something that you commit to for the rest of your life. It doesn't. Like, right, it can make a serious impact. Your idea, garnering the help of everyone around you. Like, it's, it's been so, so fun to hear the entire story. We will absolutely link in the show notes, like, Arthur Market. And if we've got people that are listening that are like, I'm a vendor and I want to be there, well, we'll make all of that happen. We'll get all of those connections too. Best of luck with the market this season, this entire season. And I can't wait to come because I'm coming. It's happening.

Love it.

By the way, more than likely we'll have to have you back. Just saying.

I would love it. Yeah, that'd be great. I appreciate it so much.