Oyinkro, Founder @ K.OS Visuals

Hey, Intra.

Hello.

Welcome to the podcast.

Thank you.

If you just start off by telling us a little bit about your company, KOS Visuals.

So, um, I started 3 and a half years ago. We are a strategy-first video production company, and we are based not too far from Cambridge. There is currently 5 of us. I think at our peak, we were like around 9. We've done projects all over the world. We predominantly work within the, um, I would say tech and recruitment space for the most part, but there's like maybe 20% of business that kind of falls outside of that. So in a nutshell, that is, that's KV.

And where did the business idea come from?

So, um, back in— I want to say 2015, but it wasn't. I don't know why, just, just feels 2015 just seems right. But no, back in, uh, before I— during university first year, um, I started a business called StudyFast with a good friend of mine who I've known for like 15+ years. Maybe that's where the 15 comes from. Um, 15+ years. And in short, we used to speed read, we used to teach people how to speed read, and we had like a memory training workshop, and that took us all over the gaff. We worked with like institutions, schools, high schools, you know, all over the shop. And we ended up going to the States, which is really cool. So we went to San Francisco, New York. We did a big workshop for Social Chain, which I met some of the Social Chain team. But anyways, in the midst of that, I was very inexperienced within the world of marketing and within that role when I was like working with Jordan. Yeah, in short, I started to play around with video. So I borrowed a friend's video camera for the first time. I remember doing a shoot. Of which, yeah, I don't think I ever edited the video. It was just so bad. But the point is, is that like I got a video camera out for the first time when we went to the States and we were on that trip. I was like, I really, really enjoy this and I would love to do this like more. So that's kind of where the idea of KB was initially born. I was like, when I get back from the States, I want to come up with my own business and just kind of see, you know, what happens from there. But in short, yeah, that's really where the idea of working for myself kind of was born.

I've been playing around with cameras and mics for like a year now with this podcast, and I can't say it comes naturally to me, and it's probably my least favourite part of the process, although I understand just how important it is, and I love the idea of creating like a masterpiece, you know, I made that. So what is your like, your why for doing it then? Because obviously you must identify like, I'm good at this, but like, how do I sort switch from what you were doing before to, yeah, just solely?

Um, yeah, I think— I don't think I ever had a, a day where I was like, I'm good at this. I think my family as a whole, for context, um, we're very creative. So we've got my grandma, for example, she had a, uh, like a fashion clothing store, um, back in the day. Um, my auntie has worked in fashion. My other auntie, she works in like, you know, some, some big journalist companies. Um, you know, another— my uncle has a fashion company. Like, like all, all over the gaff we have some some really awesome creative people within the family, so I think naturally we're quite a creative family, and I was always into, like, photography. However, video, it was just more of an interest. So I think when, where the shift took place, when I first, when I first started, um, I couldn't edit, I couldn't film anything, I didn't know how to use a camera. Um, so when we closed our first client project in Cambridge, um, yeah, I actually didn't edit that. Like, my friend, my good friend who I met from StudyFast, um, helped me edit that project, and he taught me everything he knew. To get me up to a point of which I was able to then continue, I guess, pushing forward. So yeah, just fake it till you make it, bluff my way through my first project.

And you studied sports science at uni, which is not related to your anything you've done really. Obviously you came on to doing everything that you're doing now with video production through starting a company. How would you reflect on that experience of starting a company while you're at university? Because obviously something I've been doing with the Graduate Guide and joining Vault too, and I feel like the ability to have the mask almost of studies where nobody's really expecting anything from you, and like, you know, you're just an underdog in every situation. How do you, yeah, how do you reflect on that process, and would you recommend people to do it?

Yeah, I think, I think what you guys have done is absolutely amazing. I think you probably were a lot further ahead of the process than we were while at university. So I think for myself, I always wanted to be a— the reason I studied sports science is because I wanted to be a physiotherapist to begin with, and then I wanted to transition into biomechanics, thoroughly enjoyed it, I did well. However, it was someone called Liz Herman who actually like introduced me to the world of marketing. So this was just before I started StudyFast, but also as well just before, maybe midpoint I'd quite figured out if I wanted to go, you know, one route over the other. And I think, yeah, so the whole starting a business thing, especially for StudyFast, I still don't really class it as, although I was co-founder to that business, I didn't class it as my business. It was more of a case of, you know, we were in Greggs, you know, my friend was, well, these are all the skills I'm really good at, as it were. Like, you can plug in these areas as it were. And we literally wrote StudyFast, very, so cliché. We wrote the whole like idea on the back of a napkin. And that's kind of where the idea of StudyFast started. However, like in terms of like my input, it was very much more so just around like create, well, learning to create content. I look at that business as an opportunity to learn. I don't really look at it as an, I didn't look at it as a business of which we didn't change anything. We didn't have massive impacts. Like, you know, Jordan like definitely did, like his TEDx talk hit like 3 million views. Like it was big, right? So, and I think that it did open up a lot of doors, but I think in terms of my experience, when I took from that business, it was more so just an experience. It was like, I learned how, to market a service. I learned the processes of running a team, and it really just set me up and gave me some confidence that, okay, if I was to do this again on my own, I have some insight into like how I would naturally approach it. So yeah, being at university, running a business, I can imagine it is like, like to the same standard I'm sure you guys are doing, it's exceptionally difficult. I think we were in a good position just because the nature of the type of business that we ran. But yeah, it definitely kept us, definitely kept us busy, but it definitely put me on a nice path when I graduated.

The attitude you had in that first business, do you think that you've been able to carry that through to this one? Because I think it's a very healthy way of looking at things, where as if you'd almost do it anyway even if you've got no, like, money or publicity or any, like, you know, credibility for it. The learning is everything you're taking from it. Like, I imagine every single shoot you're still learning, like, new ways to develop that content.

Yeah, I think, I think in terms of the disposition of always growing, you get to a point of which There's two things. One, you can no longer fake it till you make it. You can no longer blag your way through situations. You actually need to know what you do, what you're doing. You need to know your stuff. And that just comes with time. But still, you become increasingly more aware of the fact that you don't— there's a lot still left to learn, right? So I think for myself, it was very much driven by like learning more things, pushing myself, getting to a standard of which I felt it was similar to what we would see within the market. And yeah, every shoot we're always learning, always trying to level up the way that we do things, always trying to improve, let's just say, the quality of our work, whether that be our systems, our comms, whether that be the ideas that we can come up with. But yeah, I think from a young age I've always had the disposition of just trying to just, I guess, better myself each day. I know it sounds very cliché, but just, yeah, as long as I'm growing in some way or form and I'm challenging myself and I can look back and be like, you know, I've actually come a long way, I was here at one point, now I'm here. Like, for me, that's growth, so.

I find it interesting that you said earlier that you kind of knew what you wanted to do when you went into sports science. A lot of people don't know what they want to do, like, going into university, and even after, like, people are just like, they pick something. So, for you then to be like, even though you're quite dead set, like, persuaded into, like, by your mate, and start a business, and then, like, realizing there's something in that, it's a very particular sort of state state of mind or like person, right? Like to be like on a track and then like take that risk as it were. What do you think the decision-making process was at the time?

Um, so I think I, yeah, I did know what I wanted to do from a very like youngish age as it were. So like high school, my GCSEs were very much tailored for me to be a physiotherapist. When I went to college, exactly the same thing. When I went to uni, exactly the same thing. However, the difference is, is that high school didn't do too well. I just got average, I got C's on average, right? So, but in terms of like culturally speaking, and also in terms of what I probably could have done if I actually applied myself, the standard story, I would have been a lot better. And I think that was my first like milestone within my life where I was quite disappointed with my output. And I was like, wow, like, this is not going to affect me from doing XYZ in the future. So, and it did, right? So like, I wasn't able to get to my first university of choice, which sucked. And then I had to kind of pivot because I originally was going to just study physiotherapy. Like, that was the goal, right? So I had to pivot and I was like, I'm going to study sports science and then I'm going to pivot and specialise into then physiotherapy. So worked really hard at college, did get good grades, which I was happy about. And because I put the effort in, that same momentum and overall, I guess, just like this position carried me right through to university. And in terms of the shift, again, it was more of a case of I was still very dead set on like doing physiotherapy slash being a biomechanist right up until the time I graduated. So the only reason I decided to explore other options is because I met somebody called— like you said about doing things outside of just, you know, university, right? You're expected to go there, study, etc. Nobody expects you much. Like, I try to get involved as much as possible with everything that I could. That could be extra businesses, that could be being an ambassador, that could be events, networking, trying out stuff that wasn't necessarily like quite of you. And that did open up a lot of doors and a lot of conversation. And I think within that, I met someone called Liz Herman, who was like the head of marketing at the university. And I was able to support her with a couple of projects. And she didn't study marketing. And I was like, how did you get into it? How did you do this? Because I've got this business on the side, really enjoying it. I like, like the, you know, the sound of marketing, trying to rationalise like 3 years of university, right? I was like, it's people, it's graphs, it's creative. So yeah, in short, she She explained, and I was like, okay. So when I graduated, I applied for a whole bunch of jobs, like science-based jobs, research-based jobs, sports-based jobs, and marketing-based jobs with zero experience, right? So the— I got a job straight after university, 2 days after I graduated. I, within 1 week, had an interview at Papworth Hospital, which would be like a research exec, I think, to kick things off. And then 2 days later, I had an interview at an agency, marketing agency. So my life could have gone in like completely two different directions. Like there was— and I actually wasn't fussed at which direction because it was like, I studied my whole life for this and I would, you know, it's, it's like it meant to be. This is what I prepped for, as it were. But then the flip side, I was like, you know, this sounds fun, I enjoy it. And, um, yeah, I think in the end I ended up going down the marketing route. And I think it's just one of those things where I look back and I'm so glad that actually took place. If all the small things didn't take place and I wasn't able to pivot the way that I did Yeah, who knows, I might have not been in this place today.

So you made that decision to go down the marketing route and then see you start your company. When was it that you realized you could, you know, make a career out of this, so to speak?

So I think I started to, what's the word, started to get a few projects here and there outside of work, not too many but just a few. I tried everything from networking to like going from door to door, like in Cambridge. I did that once, never again, never doing that again. But it was an interesting experience, literally knocking from like shop to shop saying, hey, like, do you guys need any video, XYZ? I actually did get like a project, which is quite cool. And I think once, I remember when I got paid for the very first time, like independently, my own business, my own brand, I put together a whole proposal on Google Slides and I was just like, wow, like there's actually like legs to this. Like I could get paid to create content like all the time, right? And I think I enjoyed creating content for myself more than I actually did maybe for like other people. I think that's probably what the pull was more so, 'cause I was like, I get to create content all the time, right? So I think, yeah, there was no like distinctive moment. I just think I was happy just to take the risk. Like I, during the pandemic, after 2 years of being at a company, I was then furloughed like everybody in some way or form. It was the last day you could be furloughed. I was off from June until like October, then they called me back into work. I was then like, hey, can I do 3 days a week? Because like KV really started to pick up and I start— I use that time wisely. I had a month off, of course, just to chill. And then afterwards I was like, I don't know when I'm gonna go back, so I might as well just like use the time to really try to see and build that KV. So yeah, they called me back. I then said, can I do 3 days? They told me no. I said, okay, cool. They said they can do 4. And I was like, okay, but can I do 4 days within 3 days? And they said no. And so I had like 4 days to over the weekend, Friday to Monday, as to whether I was gonna turn down coming back to work, whether I was gonna kick off like KV in full. I've been off for like 3 months now, right? So like I'm used to like working for myself, even though technically I was being paid by my old company. And in short, yeah, I spoke to my— I spoke to a few people, a few mentors, a few friends, looked at what money I had available, not much. And so was my pops, and my dad was like, 'in short, everything's risk, you just have to decide on which risk you enjoy taking more.' He was like, 'So working 9 to 5 is a risk because they can let you go next week, next month, you know, you're at the, you know, to an extent there it's stable to an extent. And then also working for yourself is a risk, right? Because there's a lot of challenges that come with it.' So yeah, I decided to take the risk of which I enjoyed more, which was KV, and that was like at some point in October 2020. So, yeah, so it was crazy. Moved house, got a new job, left, yeah, got married in that year as well, and everything else in between. So very, very crazy year. Yeah.

So, yeah, well, let's talk about what you specialize in a bit more then. So content, what are your biggest content pet peeves and what do you think businesses are getting wrong with their video branding?

Content pet peeves, I think it's a good question. Do I have time to like stop and think?

Yeah, it's worth it.

Content pet peeves, talking about just like in general?

It's more like obviously what you're doing is making a solution because brands aren't like, don't do videos well enough themselves. So like what do you think they is missing when you like consume other people's video content?

Okay, cool, good question. So, um, I think the biggest, um, content challenges or things that I see within the market that, that, um, yeah, are irritating, especially if you've spent a lot of money within some form of like video production, is just lack of direction and having no objective, right? I think before you, you embark on this, this video journey, obviously we know that within today's media, video is super important and you need to create some form of video content to either boost their presence, generate sales, build awareness, whatever it might be, right? So I think having an understanding of who your target audience is, and this is what a lot of people tend to miss, right? Who you're trying to speak to, what problem you're trying to solve, is a really important factor. The purpose of the video in itself. Video is expensive, it takes time, it's time-consuming, everything across the board. So having these pieces known in place means that you're kind of just shooting blanks, right? So we see this a lot where content is pushed from a particular brand, whether that be from their personal pages, their company pages, like minimal engagement, it doesn't land very well. And it's more of like a checkbox, right? It's not something that's actually intentional, that's contributing towards something. And I think as a whole, that's probably like the biggest thing that we see a lot of brands who don't have the guidance, the resources, or the overall understanding of the power of video. And when they're doing video, when they're implementing it, like that's where they always fall short.

Yeah, and your sort of tagline is making content irresistible, right? I mean, what does that actually look like then? What's that? I mean, without giving away your trade secrets, like, what's your process to get in there then?

Yeah, no, it's a good question. So I think the reason why we positioned it as like helping you become the most irresistible brand within your market is because every brand exists for a reason, right? If I was to say to you, if I was to ask you the question, how memorable are you as a person? What would you say?

Me personally?

Yeah.

Uh, depends on the context that they meet me in, right?

But of course nobody wants to be forgotten, naturally, right? Everybody wants to be remembered in some way or form, right? And the reason being is because I think, um, and the same— and well, the reason being is because we leave impressions with people, right? So it's one of those things where if, you know, we've just met today, um, hopefully there's going to be some impression I've left with you, vice versa, right? And the next time we cross paths, that thing might come to mind, whether that be the way that we How do they speak? Characteristics?

Laughs?

Whatever it might be, right? And on the flip side, the same questions can be applied to brands, right? Like, if you think about it, every brand exists for a reason. It exists to solve a problem. It exists to solve, to provide a solution to a particular group of people. However, those brands, when they, you know, are born, naturally they don't think to themselves, okay, cool, I want to be forgotten. Like, they want to be remembered. They want to be known for what they do, right? And the challenge is, is that you either have a highly saturated market where there's many people within the industry, of which means that getting their ideal customer's attention is a difficult thing. Or number 2, they're just not doing the right thing to get attention in the first place, right? And they're very forgettable as a brand. It's like, okay, well, okay, great, you know, fair enough, right? XYZ, you know, we hear about you today, tomorrow you're gone. So the power of video is that you are able to communicate all of these impressions in a very short space of time, build through story, through creativity, um, through the value that you provide. And you're able to provide a solution to your audience in a way of which is memorable So it's about how can you utilize video to ensure that you, one, are not forgotten. Number two, you're able to position yourself as an authority within your space, as a credible go-to solution provider, and you're able to then also position yourself as the only, the only choice, right? If there is multiple choices to, for example, invest in something like you're the only card on the table, right? And that is the amazing thing about video. So if you position yourself correctly and you use it correctly and you have a really good understanding of of what your strategy is and your overall objective, as I referred to previously, you are going to see those results. So that's ultimately what we try to help our partners achieve, because it's— that's what we say, we're a strategy-first video production agency. We don't just create videos because they look great. Like, anybody can make a video look absolutely amazing, right? But without the strategy, without the launchpad for that video to launch from, as it were, yeah, it's kind of pointless. So that's ultimately the direction and the reason why we approach it the way that we do.

Yeah, and on, on like related strategy, I think when you think of any company now, you often think of the founder as well and that whole personal brand that they have attached to the brand. And when you're telling a story and not just creating a piece of content that looks nice, I suppose tapping into the, like, the emotions and the actual person themselves, like, is a big part of storytelling. Yeah, what do you think makes like a good 'Cause you see on LinkedIn, like, you know, emojis and like these certain way of writing, but how can you actually enhance maybe that LinkedIn personal branding content through video?

Yeah, I think I'm definitely not a personal branding expert, but I think in terms of the way that video can be used, it creates a much more personal feel, right? Like, you're able to get an understanding of, let's just say it's a founder or director of a massive company, of their characteristics, their personality, their traits, their values. And naturally through video, if it's done and tailored well, you're able to build that, that more, a much more meaningful connection with those that you see on the feed. And also as well, I think it just naturally breaks up the feed, like assuming that you're doing again, because now video is becoming samey as it were, like to some extent in the way that people are using them. But I think especially if you're thinking about once again, the direction, the purpose, and how you're positioning and framing that content, I think it goes a long way, right? And your audience or whoever you're trying to speak to, gets a good understanding for that, and it will feed back into your overall personal brand. Like, it's like, you know, this guy's really funny, or I like the energy that he brings on camera, or I like his ability to tell really effective stories. And all of that can be achieved. To be fair, the only— the best way to do that is all through video.

So you make a point on your own LinkedIn about being self-taught. Um, I think when you think of most, like, companies in video, whatever, they're probably trying to look the most professional and, like, the best education, like Why have you sort of given yourself that tagline and why do you stick with it?

Tagline of helping others become irresistible?

Oh no, as in like you saying like, I'm self-taught, I guess. Is that part of your own?

Oh, I see. Oh, I see. I mean, yeah, yeah. Um, because yeah, I think there are like the, the video space and the creative space, there are incredibly talented people, like amazing people. Some of these people have gone to university, studied years upon years to understand that the craft of, of which we, we work within Others are self-taught, others are just naturally very, very gifted. And I think it's one of those things where, yeah, like, I literally didn't get any lessons, I didn't go to university, I didn't study this as well. I haven't actually done a course. This is purely through trial and error, like learning on the job. I've got so many, like, horror stories of times I've been on set and things have just gone drastically wrong, right? And I think without those, like, experiences, I think like we definitely wouldn't be where we are today. And yeah, we got through them okay, and we, you know, we kept pushing forward, but it's very much a, yeah, self-taught process. Like, you know, I learned from others, which, you know, from their support, but again, you have to have that natural disposition of wanting to learn more. You have to be curious, and you have to want to continuously— okay, cool, the video is X right now, like I want to be able to look back in a couple months' time and be like, I can— my videos have just leveled up so much since, like every 2 months, we look back, all of us as a team, and we think to ourselves, like, the videos have just leveled up so much more. So, which is a really good sign. Like, it's not— it doesn't discredit your previous work, but like, you should always be looking back and be like, that was a better video, a better interview. Like, the questions we asked were even better. Like, the way this visually looks is amazing, the storytelling, the pacing. Um, yeah, the list goes on, right? So it's— it's— that's just part of the self-taught creative process.

When you say we, you're referring to your team, right? And see, that's a really important I think the success of any business is like that team building from, you know, just you setting up on this venture by yourself to then thinking, oh, I actually need to delegate some responsibility. And I guess in the sort of creative space, it's less like delegation but more people that like complement you and can help improve your product. So talk me through that whole process from the beginning to sort of, you know, your peak.

Yeah, I think so when we started, there was obviously myself and I would say Sam. So Sam was the person that I met from the previous business through StudyFast. And yeah, he kind of came over to KV to support on the sidelines. Um, Sam has always worked full-time. Like, I have no clue how he does it, but like, he's a genius dude, um, super smart. He's worked at like IBM, Google, like the big names, right? He's done amazingly. He's a data scientist by trade, and I say creative by night. And, um, yeah, like when I first started, I genuinely could not edit. Like, I could piece together a video, but I mean, like, when you edit a video, like, it's a whole different ball game, right? And he really helped me with that process. So he was the first person on the team. He's been here, still is here ever since. Um, and then I think the second— well, the third hire, or second, as I count it, um, was Jordan. Um, so the third person on the team, again, another lifelong friend. They say you shouldn't hire friends, but, you know, at the time is what we had. So we are— again, same thing, he had zero experience. Like, he was— he's a great He's great with music, super talented. But yeah, he literally sat down and was like, "Hey, like, I'm actually interested in that role that you have going right now. Like, would you be open to like helping me join? I'm a quick learner." And I was like, "Yeah, why not, man? Like, you know, just vibes, right?" So yeah, literally that's how that conversation went. We're grabbing up, we're catching up for a coffee. We did have like an interview because we thought we were like legit and sick at that point. We weren't, we were absolutely nothing. We were just like two guys just creating content. But yeah, so we did like an interview with him. Even though I already like mentally hired him in my head, I was like, of course, I'm gonna say no. So yeah, he joined, which is awesome. And yeah, again, he scaled like in terms of his growth and everything he's learned, it's been amazing to see. So that was like the first 3. And then our next hire was outside the bubble, right? So we had a few freelancers that plugged in here and there, but we use a scheme called the Kickstart scheme. It's not going right now, but yeah, it was a really popular thing a couple of years ago. And yeah, like unigrads, and super useful. Like, we, I think we hired 2 people through that scheme, which was nice. For the first, like, I think 6 months, I think the first 6 months, like, their salary ultimately is like paid for by the government, which is great. So it provides them with an opportunity to learn. It also provides small startup businesses with additional resource. That definitely presented challenges, obviously, because you can only pick from a pool of people and so on and so on and so on. However, As a whole, I think it did a lot for us and it did teach us like a lot. And then I think after that we then hired like another guy, a good friend of mine I've known for a while. Then we hired someone called Summer who kind of came in and like really just ramped everything up from like our operations and I guess HR and stuff like that. But like there was no hiring strategy. I don't know if that's where we're going with this. Like there was literally zero hiring strategy. We didn't think about who we needed. We didn't think about the actual, like we just were like, we need support and potentially there's an opportunity for somebody to do this and do this, that and the other as well, right? So I think that was probably the only disadvantage of approaching it in the way that we did. It was very much just sporadic. But I think within the first 12 months of KB, we scaled to like, well, sorry, a year and a half with KB, we scaled to like 8 to 9 people, which was quite fast, drastically fast to be over in relation to like experience, cash flow, what we knew, everything else in between. Yeah, so yeah, it was, it was interesting, it was an interesting experience.

But yeah, yeah, and those initial hires, so to speak, were your friends, right? And you say you didn't need to do an interview process and everything, but I feel like that's kind of because you are like a product of your surroundings and who you surround yourself with is kind of like dictates your ambition, it dictates like what you're working on, how happy you are working on it. So I do think as a strategy, like especially if you were talking to our audience of students, like, you know, first of all, try work out who you actually want to spend your time with, and then actually when it comes to starting a project or a business as a student, like it is like, you know, Nell said over there, like, well, it's just great to work with someone like you say you vibe with, like it makes your life a lot better. Yeah. Yeah, so that's kind of like a learning, you say, that team building process. And I am actually interested, you mentioned earlier, like these big blunders that you had on set, because I also have my fair share of them as well.

So, yeah, just for my own, like, yeah, no, no, we've had many blunders, man, from like everything from obviously like hiring, like challenges, to stuff that's actually happened on set. But like, yeah, so we've, my first ever blunder was I did a free wedding. Um, which was, which is great. And in short, this is the first time I'd ever, ever researched anything about like photography, like on YouTube. So as you do, you know, you prep for the, for the wedding, right? And then, okay, cool, great, I'm gonna do some research, learn a bunch of stuff. Okay, some new settings on my Canon camera at the time, it's like a 500D or something like that. Anyways, um, back in the day there was the SD card that I had. I never for some reason opened up the SD card on that camera. Don't ask me why, just never happened. I've had the camera for years. Like my granddad had the camera, he bought it which he never used, standard. My dad then took it from him. I was like, I'll use this a lot. And my dad didn't use it much, and I was like, oh, I'll use it. So that's where my creative journey actually started. Um, so this camera, um, I took on set. I was partnered with somebody called Hayley, a good friend of mine. And, um, yeah, we did the wedding together. She's probably— she's probably more experienced than I was, to be fair, like at the time, in reference to like all things photography. Um, but yeah, like I never opened up this camera like to look at the actual SD card. So I did this wedding in the morning, um, I changed my settings from JPEG to RAW because of course more data, you've got more control over the edit. I didn't obviously realise when you do that it means that you have like way less space and like SD cards are taken up. So yeah, there's, you know, I think we get to like the part where family and friends come together for photos after the ceremony. And yeah, I'm there, everybody's together, like 50+ people, and yeah, in short, I run out of space, right? And I'm like, and I have no backup SD card, I've got no other SD cards with me, and I'm there and I'm like, Damn. And I'm like, yeah, guys, you're looking great, looking great. And I'm actually just deleting photos, like, while I'm getting them to just smile. I'm like, yeah, looking great. Delete, delete, delete, delete, delete. And my screen was awful as well, so I couldn't even tell what was actually, like, good. Um, so yeah, that was like my first ever, like, blunder. Obviously it was fine overall, photos came out like okay. Um, but it was definitely a learning lesson. And I was like, okay, great, don't— if you have a shoot and you research stuff, don't make any drastic changes that you've never done before, because otherwise then, yeah, you could mess up. I think the other big one was when we had our first video shoot. This was when we basically, we pitched, we won. First ever proposal. I think we got paid like £900 for this. Like, and I was like, gassed. I was like, bro, like this is like, we made it. I was like, yes. Right, early doors, right? And yeah, so it was like 5, 6 videos, whatever it was, something crazy. And then I, yeah, we went, it was in Cambridge. We did the shoot. We filmed with 2 separate cameras, which again, awful because it just, they just didn't match very well. And then the second thing, we had bought like some newer lights, which, which looked okay. I was like, we had a little bit of setup, right? So it was the first time when we started to actually invest into the, into the setup. But we filmed directly in front of a TV, like, I mean, like directly in front of a TV. So like, we were gassed because it looked great, like just on set, like, wow, this is like a proper set, right? And, um, anyways, like, I think maybe like midway through, um, I realized that I could see my reflection like in the video of the TV. And I'm there like waving, smiling, giving them like, you know, I'm like, yeah, Jesha, I'm counting down, right? So like on the camera, like you can't see, you obviously like they're there, but you're seeing me in the background going like this, right? And I didn't clock until at the end of the day and I started sweating, right? Like, you know, when you're internally hot, right? And you're like, you're like, I have no clue. I don't even know how to edit, right? I'm like, I don't know how I'm gonna fix this. So basically, yeah, that was probably the biggest blunder, especially like early doors, right? So I'm freaking out and everything went wrong that day because like we hired a gimbal, which I've never used before. We tried to use it like the night before. Again, I don't know why I'm doing something like this. So again, we hired a gimbal we've never used, right? We got it the day before because I was a cheapskate. I was cheap. So I was like, I don't want to rent this out for like a week. I only want to do like the day before, the day of, and I'll return it, right? So I try to figure out how to use this gimbal within a couple of hours. And then on the day, like, this is before we had all the tools, right? So on the day of the shoot, you got the TV situation, which was just a flop, right? And then like the gimbal was just malfunctioning, and I've never used a gimbal, so I'm like, how do you get this working? I've got a butter knife on my hand trying to like tighten everything up. They're looking at me, this is like a corporate client, right? So like they're thinking this is— well, from their perspective, maybe it was okay, but from our perspective, everything felt like it was going wrong, right? So, um, yeah, like that blunder, it took us a very long time to like fix. So what Sam had to do, because I, I, I edited it, that was— I could edit like kind of at that point, but to that level of complexity, like masking stuff out, like I'd never done that before, right? This is before we had like some really cool AI tools where it kind of just does it for you. So, um, I, I said to Sam, I was like, Sam, I need your help. I was like, I have no clue how I'm supposed to do this. So he, he spent hours like— oh, the challenge is, by the way, so just for context why this is so difficult. So in front of the TV, you've got obviously the person, which is standard. You've got me in the reflection behind them, which is, you know, so it wouldn't have been too difficult because you could have put like a black, like, you know, maybe like screen on top of the TV, right? Or like you could have cut it out. Why it got complicated is because there was a plant in front of the TV on the left-hand side, all doing all sorts of spiky different movements. It was long, right? So like basically, uh, we had to— yeah, that was— Sam had to like mask every single frame for like all 6 videos out of me going, right, so just to like fix it. Yeah, and I look back at that video now, um, yeah, it's awful. Um, 100% it's awful, but like it was just, it was like a starting point and we got paid for it and I was like, there's proof in this concept, right? Like we can do this. So that's probably like the, the, um, the, the one of the biggest blunders. And then of more recent times, um, I guess as a final blunder Is there was one time I'm trying to think there was either—

I was about to say at least they're all like your first of trying.

Yeah, no, no, there's some recent ones, man. We've had, we had a situation once where like we, what was it? We like forgot, what did we do? SD card, we lost that, we lost footage once. That was peak, right? That was not the one, right? Definitely learned the importance of backing up twice or triple. Um, that was, that was a lesson learned. Um, another situation, and to be fair, I found the footage though, like, so I had to call the client. This was like a learning lesson for me. So I was like, I'm really sorry, like, I have lost your footage. Like, I don't know how, something's happened. It was just really bad, right? And he, he was, he was angry, but he was, I think because of like maybe like experience and where he knew I was at, he was quite calm. Which I respect them for, to be still good friends today, right? And in the end though, luckily, like an hour later, I somehow found it and I was like, "I found it!" You know, so it was good. But I think the biggest one was where one time I went to London and we had a shoot in the evening and we were supposed to be, I think it was like a 9, 7 PM, supposed to finish like at maybe 10 or like 11-ish, something like that, right? And in short, turn up to the shoot in the evening, shoot overran. I'm talking to Sam and I'm like, the guys, we have one of the biggest shoots like ever, right, the next day. Like one of the biggest shoots we've had, right? So this shoot for Context, this, this is like worth like 10 grand, right? So it's a big, really big shoot. So it's kicking off at 7 AM and we're like, okay, cool, everything's there, we've got this, got that, and I'm running through mentally like if you've got everything, and I realized we've forgotten a light. Like I, I, you know those moments where you just picture where you left it in a place. And I'm like, it's like 10 PM and I'm in London right now and I have to be up obviously early and we're still at a shoot. I can't even leave. I have to finish this shoot and I've forgotten like the most important thing for this, for this, like obviously for this, this project the next day. I tried to call friends. I tried to— it wasn't even like, it's like a softbox, I think like a really big one. Tried to call friends, tried to pull in some favours, nothing. So I had to drive home that night and like maybe like 12 midnight. I got home like at 2. Had to like go unlock a whole building to use the wee. It's like, get this light out, right? Then I had to like go home. I slept for like an hour and a half, 2 hours. Got back in my car, drove back to London at the hotel in which I booked. Jordan was there. I laid in my bed for 30 minutes on top of the duvet, on the covers, just like this, right? And then, and then yeah, then I did, then I did that shoot on like 2 hours sleep. And it was awesome. It was one of the best shoots we ever did. But I still don't think that's the worst one. The worst one, guys, and this— I've never told anybody this. I'm not even going to tell you what this person is because I can't expose myself like that. But in short, we had a shoot in the morning and I basically just didn't hear my alarm. I live an hour and a half away from London, so 2 hours, right? So I'm there and I had a late night, clearly, obviously, and because there was just a lot to prep. Maybe nervous. I don't really know why I tend to do that. But anyways, I'm there and my alarm goes off at like, maybe like, when I wake up like at 8 and I like open my eyes, I'm like, you know when you're conscious that you're in bed for too long? I'm like, why am I still in bed? I was like, I should not be here. So I jumped out of bed, looked at the clock, it was 8 o'clock. I had to be on set, by the way, for context, at like 8:30 or something like that. And I'm far from home, right? And I'm like, okay, so I don't know what to do. I started pacing at the end of my bed and I was like, I don't know what to do. Like, this is awful. Luckily the shoot, I wasn't taking lead on this shoot that was great for the first time. So Sam was, it was like, he was looking after it. And in short, like with this particular project, like one of the things that was really significant about it, when I called, when I opened my phone and put it on, you know, XYZ, sorry, off airplane mode, all these messages, all these calls. And Sam, you know, I called Sam and I was like, Sam, yo, like, what's the go? You know, I stayed in bed, I overslept, what should we do? And he just starts laughing at me. And I was like, why are you laughing, bro? This is so serious. This is not a funny moment. Like, you shouldn't be laughing, bro. I was vexed. And he said to me, he was like, you are like the luckiest person on earth. I was like, how? He was like, bro, the client got COVID this morning. He was like, so he was like, the shoot's cancelled. Well, the first, he was like, the shoot's cancelled. And I was like, I said to myself, I was like, you, I said, you're joking me. He was like, yeah, bro. He was like, it's cancelled. He was like, it's calm. He was like, you still come to London? By the way, I'm not sure how much you're going to include in this because there might be some parts you know cut out because otherwise you could probably piece two and two together. So, um, but, um, but yeah, anyways, yes, the client got COVID, um, so it meant that the first half of the day was cancelled, the second half of the day was on, and I just rolled up to London like my normal self. Oh, how you doing guys? It's great to see you, you know, X, Y, Z. And, um, yeah, that was probably one of the biggest blunders like as well. So I've had like, I've had many, many They're like the 3 significant ones of which I learned a lot from. But yeah, it's some good stuff, some good stuff.

It's definitely not been all blunders. I've seen, I mean, a little sneak preview on your LinkedIn the other day about a certain Arsenal football team. Yeah, Adidas.

I don't know how much you can say on that, but no, no, it was yesterday. It was good, it was really good shoot, really, really good shoot. It was for a, um, it was a last-minute project, to be fair. It wasn't like a, there's no like, I wish there was some free gruelling story where I pitched, you know, my heart away, that it wasn't like that. It was just a case of, um, I knew the founder of one of the organisations, Gradfuel, and worked with them early doors of KV. And yeah, we started talking briefly last week, he was like, listen, this is happening, everything's moving really quick, it's a really, really big deal, are you able to come through support, do XYZ, XYZ, bring everything to life. Yeah, so in short, it was big, like definitely big, there was over 250+ people, there was an Olympic gold medalist there, which is awesome. Adidas reps everywhere, Adidas merch everywhere, Adidas branding. Yeah, the branding was all over the awesome screens. It was really, really cool. Event went really well, really successful, and definitely an awesome name to have on the roster. So yeah, it was really cool stuff. So I'm looking forward to, like, that's all I can say at the moment, but I'm looking forward to piecing everything together. So yeah.

But when you're on shoots like these for companies like, you know, as big as the likes of them, are you getting that imposter syndrome? Because I mean, you're still young and early on that project, and like you said, like, things have been happening very quickly, and that's kind of the nature of the startup world.

But yeah, um, good question. I think in terms of, uh, I guess imposter syndrome, I think the more— like I said, I think I blag my way through a lot of situations, like, um, through confidence Just on my confidence, right? And smiling a lot like this. Um, so yeah, so I, I think up until a certain point of KB, I was able to get away with probably more things purely just because I was new, I was inexperienced, and like, you know, it wasn't large clients. But I think as we've grown more, like, knowing your stuff is becoming more increasingly important, right? And I think what's interesting is that I got to a place— I don't mind sharing this either— like where I was like, you know, charisma, confidence, or blagging my way through stuff, or just figuring stuff out as you go along, can only take you so far, right? Before you really need to like learn your stuff, because otherwise there's going to be a cap. You're going to cap, right? It's like you're only going to get to a certain point, and then afterwards you either just cap out, the journey ends, or you just stay stagnant and you're always going to exist within this like, this like area, for example, right? You have to learn, you have to implement, you have to take risks. So I think what's interesting, when I've made that transition and I'm like, I really want to keep learning, I really want to keep growing, and I'm trying to, to really become an expert within, within my personal space, um, I feel way more imposter syndrome than I did like early doors. And I think that's because the nature of people that I'm finding myself like around, right? So it's like I'm speaking to like really big founders, really big directors or CEOs, people who are raising like millions of pounds of investment, and they're asking me questions of which which I do know the answer to, but it's, I think, I just, I'm like, I shouldn't be in this room. Like, you know what I mean? It feels like there's one time I was in a boardroom of like, like 6 people and they are like, you know, C-suite individuals, right? And, you know, like loads of money and they're asking me questions and I was just there and I'm like, interestingly, I know I know more about you, more about this than you guys do, but I still feel like I just should not be here. Like, I feel like I'm inadequate to say these things. I think, yeah, I definitely feel more imposter syndrome now, imposter syndrome now, than I did.

It sounds like it's almost become your superpower in that, like, it's, it's prevented you from, you know, having that mismatch in confidence to actually ability before it actually becomes a significant problem. Yeah, yeah. So like, that imposter syndrome, the thing that's actually maybe causing a bit of trauma or like, you know, some mental health difficulties in your head, like, that's actually making you a better Yeah, it pushes you forward.

Yeah.

Yeah.

I think you have the— there's the level of like, the way I look at it is that there's like a no— there's like a no turning point, right? Of course, there's sometimes in life where you need to be like, hey, call it quits, right? But I think with anything, whether that be any goal, habit, project, business, it doesn't matter. Like, it gets to a point where if you've invested a certain amount of time and energy, it's like, you're like, you have to, you have to make it work. If you stop now, it's like everything before is kind of like just like— not that it's not worth it because you've learned, but it's like why did you go through all that hardship? Like, if you knew you were going to stop anyways, like, why push yourself as much as you did? So for myself, um, yeah, like, it's— that's always the driving force. So like, even though I might feel like anxious, or I might feel like stressed about situations, or I might feel like I don't know how we're going to pull this out the bag, like, we always end up doing it in the end, and we seem to like thrive relatively well under that type of pressure, and it grows us, you know, always, always growing. So yeah.

And do you have, um— I mean, I don't know if there's any sort people or companies that act as inspiration to you for your company, but, but more like, more so pieces of work or content where you're like, that's the levels that I'm trying to emulate. Like, do you have that?

Um, interestingly, I would say yes, but I don't think I could like tell you specifically in terms of like this brand or, or this overall look and feel. I think, I think just collectively I just have like a, like inspiration I've kind of pulled from everywhere, right? Like, I love music, I love fashion, I love, I love art, I love photography. So like, I'm pulling— I love interior design. So like, if you see on my Instagram page or like my saved collections as well, my YouTube, you know, playlist, like, it's just a combination of like so many things. I always say like, I want KB to be like an aesthetic fashion brand, even though we're a video agency. So it's like, that's like the vibe that I would love to like be able to create for KB. Um, but yeah, like, there's no, there's no, like, I guess, specific person or, like, I guess, type of work. I think for me, I was a big YouTube head back in the day. I still am, but, like, I just watched a lot of, like, YouTube creators, like, like, just creating video content. I just love their look, love the work. Everything felt really cinematic. And right now, like, I can't— like, the content on Instagram right now, like, that— I don't know, I'm not sure if that's just my feed, but, like, you know, um, but, like, it is absolutely amazing. Like, every time I go in there, like, I genuinely feel like inspired and I want to create something.

Do you follow Eye Candy?

Oh, I know about Eye Candy, but I don't think I follow Eye Candy.

Yeah, so it's a favourite of mine. They like break down music videos.

Oh yes, yeah, yeah, yeah.

Shots and transitions. Yeah, yeah, yeah. I mean, again, I go back to like with myself, I mean, obviously I've got these brands and I really, I understand how important visual engagement is for becoming synonymous with a brand and etc. But for me, like I said, it all comes down to like, there must be something that no matter what, with your success, it's like that idea of making a masterpiece, you know, like something that you can't really emulate in another career path. And it's kind of that, maybe going back to that risk, that moment, like the ability to do that and have that piece of work you're proud of, that must still be like such a driving factor.

Yeah, that's— I think that's a really— that's really nice. Um, I think that's just nice insight, and I think that's a nice way of looking at things. I think it definitely is. Um, every piece of work that I do, or that we do, there's like a level of pride behind it. Like, I know that our work is always getting better, and it's always going to be like, in 3 months' time we'll look back and be like, yeah, like, we could have done way better on that project, right? But I think as a whole, I'm always trying to get myself and the team to just set precedent. Like, every time it's like something like that, maybe it could be the grading of the audio storytelling. Um, so yeah, like, there is, there is that, can I make this the best video that I've ever made? Like, like, that's, that's— I was going, like, like yesterday, you know, with Adidas, like, there were some challenges throughout the day, throughout the evening. Um, but overall, I was like, I have no clue where this could potentially lead. Like, this could lead, lead into bigger opportunities or whatever it might be. And I was like, how can we make this, like, the best video, like, ever, right? Um, and yeah, so there is that sometimes pressure that you put on yourself. And I have to say, sometimes it sucks. Like, sometimes you, like, you are disappointed. Like, there's stuff that we've done that I've gone in with the expectation of this, I really want this to be amazing, and it just hasn't slapped. Like, it's just, it's been like, I don't know, boring, or it just hasn't come out well, or we haven't produced it very well. And, um, but yeah, I guess you just learn from it and you kind of push forward. But, um, yeah, you always want to try to level up where you can. That's the driving of course.

Is there an element in that of, obviously I know you'll take some of the responsibility for maybe not being as good, but like now that you are growing and you have got more credibility and bigger brands approaching you, you have to sort of decide who you want to actually take work from now. In the early days, you would have been like gassed with anyone, like you said, £900 was like a mad payout, and then now you're actually having to be selective, I imagine. Like, yeah, what does that process look like?

I think, um, I actually don't think I've got there yet in terms of being like super selective. I think there's only a couple of clients that we've turned down. I that we've not been able to support. But I think I'm, full transparency, I'm still in that space and we are still in that space of which we're really finding our feet and we're really like understanding like the specifics of the value that we provide, how we frame and like that value as it were. Like we definitely come a long way, but I think it's, we're not, there are some projects which we just can't do or that we don't want to do, but there are things for the most part that if it's interesting, we like the brand, and there's just an overall good vibe, and it's something where, as weird as it sounds, we can grow from it, like, we'll always say yes. And obviously if the commercial is obviously right as well, right? But even so, I would say sometimes even if commercials aren't right, but it's super interesting, it's an awesome opportunity, and we think we can make just, you know, amazing stuff with it, like, we'll do it still, right? So I think, yeah, when you're in a startup, we're still very startup mode, like, you know, we've only been going like for 2.5 to 3 years. So even though that is a period of time, yeah, I would only say the past 12 months is where we've really started to find our feet, as weird as it sounds.

So yeah, and as we near towards the end of the episode, as a question I ask every single one of my guests, and I think it'll be particularly interesting with you given that you were so— you had such an idea of what you want to do with your career from a young age. What is your idea of success now, you know, a few years on from graduating and making that big leap? I mean, obviously, yeah, like you said, you had that in your mind for so long, a bit like monetary or like what, or, you know, people you aspire to be like or whatever, but now it's probably completely different, I imagine.

Yeah, I'm not sure I'm going to give a generic answer or not, but I'm going to just be very honest and transparent. So I would say at the age of 26 years of age, I'm running a business, um, with a team of 5. Wasn't planned, wasn't the direction, never cared about money that much, um, never had an idea of who I wanted to be like. I didn't have a goal in that sense. It kind of just happened. However, a lot of the goals that most people will have, a lot of the goals that, you know, like, yeah, I'd like to do these things I did achieve and I've done within quite a short space of time. And yeah, like, it's one of those things, interestingly, it doesn't bring as much satisfaction as you naturally think it does. And it's like, okay, cool, fair enough. So what I've learned is that balance is absolutely everything, right? So if you can actually find— if you can do something you enjoy and have balance within your life, and that means you can spend more time with family, friends, do things that energize you as an individual, right? Whatever that looks like. That is genuinely what success looks like. Success isn't necessarily about reaching certain goals or objectives, it's about feeling fulfilled, right? So the more fulfilled you feel as an individual, the more successful you'll actually feel, regardless if you have a business or that you don't have a business. So if you're at university right now, you've just graduated, like, it's one of those things where my sister, she's 21, right? So she's graduated, she wants to be a data scientist, well, she wants to be a data scientist, and she's, you know, lost in terms of what should I do the next X, Y, Z. I keep telling her, I'm like, you have so much time. Like, you don't have to get your life figured out before you hit the age of 25, 26, even 30. Like, I can't wait for 30. Like, I'm gassed, right? So I feel like, I feel like, yeah, anybody who, who is currently doing X, and, you know, be open to trying different things that don't quite fall in line with your plan, because you never know what doors could be open, number one. Number two, um, I would say, yeah, find fulfillment in what you do, because that's where success genuinely actually lies. And then number 3, you— it's okay to change your mind. You know, that can mean you start something and then you're like, you know what, I don't like this, I want to do something else. But don't get caught up in what social media tells you is success because it genuinely isn't. Like, it's all about fulfillment. And I know it's a very cheesy thing to say, but as I'm getting older and the busier I become and the more that we do, it's just one of those things I'm just finding that it's super evident. It's like the more fulfilled I feel as an individual in my life, the more successful I feel.

So yeah, I'm personally very excited to see what you've achieved by 30 as well. So thank you very much. Yeah, you've been amazing. Thanks so much for coming on.

Thank you so much, man. I really appreciate it.

Thank you.

Cheers, mate. Thank you, guys.