Episode 515: Breaking the Cycle of Financial Stress

No need to whine, it's whiny palooza. Have some wine and join us on the whiny palooza podcast with Rebecca Greene. Welcome to the whiny palooza podcast. I'm your host, Rebecca Greene. I'm a wife, mother of 3, and licensed clinical social worker. I also have 3 fur babies at home too. My passion has always been to help children and their families. I always dreamed of being a wife and a mother. Parents are always learning through their struggles, failures, and successes and joys. I am no stranger to this wild ride of parenting, and I know behind every great parent lies a team of supportive friends and family. I want to be part of your support system. I want you to know that you are not alone. We are in this parenting world together. Join me every week for insightful discussions with experts on parenting and marriage, as well as other parents who have found the secret to successes in parenthood. You'll learn tips and tricks to make life with your family better than ever. I hope you will follow along with me while we dive into what it takes to achieve a happy family. Hello everyone, this is Rebecca Greene for the Whiny Pluza Podcast, and I am very excited today because I get to talk to the amazing Dr. Darla Bishop. Dr. Darla, thank you for being here with me today.

You're excited. I'm excited. I mean, it's rare that I get to talk with someone who has done 500 blogs, 500 podcasts. So like, I know this is going to be an amazing conversation just because you're just so freaking good at it.

Oh my God, you're making me blush. I'm so excited. I can tell how fun she is. Like, I can't believe— I was thinking before I met with you, I can't believe this is my job. This is amazing. This is a good job. I'm going to keep it and I'm going to introduce this wonderful lady who I'm so excited to talk about, to talk to, not about. Dr. Darla Bishop is a financial expert, public health leader, and author of How to Afford Everything. Known as Financist, did I do that right?

Yes.

She bridges the gap between money and well-being, showing how finances directly impact health stress, and life expectancy. Raised in Detroit and educated at the University of Michigan and George Washington University, Dr. Darla brings both lived experience and research-backed insight to conversations about financial wellness, resilience, and equity. Her work empowers individuals and communities to reduce financial stress and build healthier, more sustainable futures. So now everybody knows why I'm so So excited to talk to you. Uh, this is a really good topic. I mean, this is a really needed topic. And, you know, I know that you talk about the connection between money and health. Can you talk to us about when you first realized that those two worlds were so deeply linked?

Yeah, you know, so I grew up in Detroit, and growing up as, you know, um, early teenager, teenager, young adult, I just recognized, I remember having this feeling, right? Like we're going through all of these things, like just things that were hard, people being sick, people not being able to work, people not being able to keep jobs, having food insecurity, having housing insecurity, right? And I remember thinking like, we wouldn't be going through half of this if we just had more money because the women, frankly, who were really the holders of the checkbooks in the families, right, were super resourceful. They were so good at stretching and sharing and figuring out how to make it all work. And so it wasn't that they were bad at what they had. They just frankly didn't have enough. And I just remember having that feeling of, man, if we just had more money, my mom wouldn't be stressed out. Maybe she'd quit smoking. Man, if we just had more money, I wouldn't be so worried about whether I can go to college, even though I've been smart enough since I was a baby, right? And so when I did end up getting to college and keeping and continuing to go to school, like there's actually data that shows that feeling that I had as a young teenager. It's true that when you're stressed about money, it colors every decision you make. It colors every choice, every option, every— the way that you weigh things. So even when things get better, right, maybe you are in a better situation, it still feels temporary. And so you end up using those skills that helped you survive when you're no longer in a survival state and it gets you in trouble. Because the things you have to do to survive, the money skills you use when you survive, have to be turned just a little bit so they don't get you in trouble when you're no longer in survival.

Oh goodness, um, that makes total sense to me. Do you feel like you can give us an example? Like, how does that get us in trouble?

Yeah, and so let's talk about credit. And so when you're in survival mode, one of the things that you avoid like the dickens is credit because you're like, look, I already don't have it. Yeah, I don't need to owe people on top of that. And so you worry about taking a car loan, you worry about taking loans for school, you worry about using a credit card to improve something in your house because you're like, I'm already so strapped, I can't add debt on top of this to make maybe my life easier, smoother, or to get me to a different place. Right. Or in families, we might— I see this a lot lot where, you know, maybe Grandma and Grandpa were in the position where they bought a home. So now, you know, maybe an uncle is living there, but he hasn't necessarily had the means to do all the repairs along the way. So by the time the house is being passed to that third generation, it's in disrepair. And, and there's this hesitance to renew, to renovate, to repair, because one, it's not really my house, so I don't know if I should. And, you know, I have a little money, but if I spend it on that repair, what if something else happens? And so then the house just goes down in its status, and then it can't— maybe it doesn't even make it to that third generation because the family just lets it go, right? It's just the roof, the roof, the plumbing, it's all too far gone. So we don't get to keep Grandma and Grandpa's house, right? But if we are in a place where we understand that making that investment And maybe we do take a mortgage out, even though your grand— your grandparents worked super hard and were able to pay it off. Maybe taking the mortgage out now so that you can get a new roof, so you can replace the windows, so that you can make sure that the house is in super good condition to continue staying in the family is worthwhile, right? Yes. And not being afraid of that mortgage because you're in a different place than maybe Grandma and Grandpa were.

I definitely see it's hard for people to shift their money mindset depending on how they grew up. I was even listening. I was telling my husband, I was even listening to a star talk about how she makes so much money, but she grew up with nothing. So she's still in that mindset, which blows my mind.

Yeah. And I mean, it's— think about it this way. If something you've been doing for a big part of your life saved your life, it's what kept you. It's the thing that helped you survive the toughest, the hardest, the most painful, the most difficult times of your life. On one hand, you don't even feel like you are allowed to say goodbye to those habits or those ways of being because that's the only reason you're here today, right? Yeah. Like, if, if those skills of never taking any loans out, if those skills of, you know, never spending anything, you know, is what kept us when things got super lean, then even when I have more, why would I change my habits? That's what let me get to possibly having more. But you do have to flip those on the head because some of the things you do in survival can get you in trouble. And I'll use this example. I had a relative who was a cigarette smoker. So again, this health and stress and money, right? She was a cigarette smoker. And when things were tight, And the legality of this, we're not even going to talk about. She'd go to the store and buy 1 or 2 cigarettes just to kind of get her through the day. And those 1 or 2 cigarettes were at that time maybe $1 each, so $2. But at that time, a pack of cigarettes was just 6, right? And so it would have been much better for her to find $6 to get the whole pack because then she'd have cigarettes for a few days. But she was like, I don't have $6. I have 2. And on a healthier side, right? Like, there are certain things that if you buy in bulk, like certain meats, certain shelf-stable foods that if you buy at Costco, you get a much better price for the snacks, for the beef, for the eggs, right? But if you're like, but I don't have the money to buy 36 eggs, I have the money to buy 12, so I'm going to buy 12, right? And so it's, it's those things where when you have the ability to scale and come back and to see that there's value in doing that and that it won't harm you. Because what you had to do over here when you really could only afford $12 doesn't make sense when now you can afford the $36 and it's actually just like 10 cents more than the $12.

Yeah, it's, it's a lot to learn and it's a big adjustment. It makes, it makes so much sense because we learn what we learn when we're growing up and then we have to unlearn things and it's not an easy task to unlearn things. But I want to talk about your book. 'How to Afford Everything,' which is like an amazing title because I want to afford everything. So tell us about the book. What inspired it? What's a message you're hoping people get from the book? Tell us about it. Yeah.

So 'How to Afford Everything' was born out of my journey with money. Like, I really— once I got to college, I saw that I had classmates who were there, which meant that I was as smart as they were. Right? We were there together. We're in the same setting, we're in the same classes, we're, we're talking about the same things, but they had a completely different relationship, um, feelings towards and habits with money. And I was like, oh, okay, so there is a completely different way I could be with money. And I would try to ask, like, my roommate especially, also, what do your parents do? And did you work in high school? And You know, and they'd be like, these are weird questions. Like, are we going to the party or not? Like, and so I recognized like, oh, okay, these other 17 and 18-year-olds don't know why they are not poor the same way I don't know why I am. And so I'm going to have to go to books. I'm going to have to go to books to figure out money because they can't really tell me about the money stuff that I'm noticing. So I'm just going to have to read books. So I started reading books about money even in college. And by the time I finished college, I had read enough books that I was like, okay, I've got a plan. And my friends who were starting to do their job searches or going to graduate school were like, we notice you always have money. How come you always have money? And I was like, oh, because I read this book and this book and this book. And so I do this part from that book, this part from that book, and this part from that book. So here's how I do it. And I'm happy to show you because I want you to have money too, because I want to do fun stuff. And if I invite you and you don't have the money, then I have to go do it by myself, and that's no fun. And so I was like, so I kind of started teaching my friends, you know, here's how you set up your budget, and here's how you work on your spending, and here's the kind of bank accounts that would help you do that. And after a few of those conversations, I realized, oh, I needed the same information from everyone. I needed to tell them the same types of things. And so I made it into kind of like a checklist for myself. So every time someone says, oh, I think you can help with my budget, I'm like, yep, do this part first. When you're done with it, we'll talk. And I kind of follow— I followed a script. And so after several years of doing that, I started doing workshops because maybe someone recommended me. And then I do a session for our interns every time at my day job we had interns. I say, hey, I know I'm— I know it's not really about money, but we're paying you. And so here's how to make sure that that money that we're paying you this summer lasts you way past the summer because we're paying you actually really well. And I'm really glad we're able to do that. And I want to make sure that money from your summer internship lasts you to next summer or maybe even beyond. And here's the different ways you can make that happen. And someone said, well, you should write a book. And I was like, I agree.

I agree too.

And so I took all of the stories and lessons from me reading more than 100 books that other people had written. Plus all those conversations with friends and classmates and coworkers and interns and the system that I built and the presentation and said, well, if I needed to organize this into a book to make sense, what makes sense? And so I got an editor who helped me get down the story for the right first book because I probably have about 3 books in this brain. And what was so crazy about the process is once I hired the editor, it took us 127 days to write the book. That's it. Like, in 127 days, from the time I hit send payment to me holding the book baby in my hands.

That's amazing.

127 days, because it just poured out of me. I was like, oh, oh yeah, I can write a chapter about that. Oh, I can write 3 chapters about that. But you just want one, right? And it's because there were two big things missing from all those books I read, and I wanted to fill that gap. One, if you have only had bad examples— and I'm not judging our, my parents, because our parents and the adults around us when we're growing up were doing the absolute best they could, so this isn't about judging or naming them bad, right? But just if all you had were bad examples or just not great examples, doing the opposite isn't always true. So you don't know where to start or where to go next if no one has ever done it, right? You're just like, so you kind of get paralyzed, like, well, I don't even know where to start and I don't want to mess it up, so I'm just going to kind of stay here because at least I know what here is and I won't mess it up further or make it worse, right? So I wanted to put in a, like, here's where to start, here's where you go next, and here's where you go after that. And then depending on a couple things you have going on, whether you're parenting or going to school or already working, then the path splits a little bit. But these first 3 steps are the same for everybody. And then once you get past those first 3 steps, then this way for this, this way for this, and this way for that. Just so you can get over that, I don't even know where to start. The second thing that was missing is almost all the books I read were by men. And so it didn't talk about navigating motherhood and caregiving and parenting your parents, because that comes up. It didn't talk about what it meant that it was important to me to care for the family around me, right? Like so many books said, well, if you have debt, you shouldn't be borrowing, you shouldn't be loaning, you shouldn't be supporting, you shouldn't be helping. You tie your own safety net and then you can worry about those people later. But sweetie, if I don't worry about them now, they might not be here later. They might be worse off. It might be— right. But it's true, right? Like if I don't build them into my plan from the beginning, then what's the point? What's the point, right? It didn't work for my concept of family and community to just cut everybody off. It just didn't. And so I was like, so what about the other people who I know are like me? Because I have friends who are like, who, my mom has worked so hard and I got to get her out of that job where she's on her feet. But if she's out of that job, though, she's on her feet, she might be making less money because she can't get overtime, right? So like the people who I grew up with and who are, who've gone to college and are in a different place but Wayne, how do I help my family and pay off my student loans and build a future and eventually have a family of my own? Like, how do I do all of that? And so I wanted to share the framework that I use to do both. Like, here's how you pay off debt. Here's how you care for your family and the people you care about. And here's how you save up so that you have a better future. You got to do all three at the same time. And it just looks different than what these other guys have said because they didn't have to do all three. It was easy for them to say, forget my mom. Forget my cousin. Like, that doesn't work for me.

Well, and I love what you're saying because people can be so black and white, and I have spent 20 years teaching my husband that the world is gray. It is not black and white. So, right. So we have to look at those areas where we want to help ourselves and all of our family. I love that so much, and I can tell that you have an amazing heart.

Well, and I mean, sure, I have an amazing heart, but it was a little bit selfish too, if I was— if I'm honest about it. I made sure that my siblings, my brother and sister, who when I was in college were still in high school and at home, and, and again, those not so great conditions, like, I made sure they had everything they needed. Not because like, oh, I'm the big— the best big sister ever, but because I wanted to make sure they could get to college too. Because I knew if they got to college too, and they got to college and didn't have a million dollars in student loan debt, that they probably wouldn't have to live in my basement. And guess what? No one has ever had to live in my basement.

That is—

I've succeeded.

That is an excellent point, and honestly, I never would have thought of that.

And they are welcome. We have space. Yeah, the couch in the basement is actually the most comfortable couch in the house, and so they are welcome. But the fact that no one has to live in the basement feels like a huge win to me.

Yeah, that, that is a huge win. Really awesome. I'm curious, you know, you're talking about budgeting. I don't even want to tell you about me and budgeting, but can you give people like me like one small tip that we can—

Yes, yes, don't worry, budgeting isn't a bad word, but I know it, it can get a little warm and get a little tight, those palms get a little sweaty. So the thing about it is I actually don't follow a budget. Okay, so there's hope for you. There's hope for you, right? So I follow a plan with some limits and guidelines. Okay, so some people call that a budget because that's what a budget is, it's a plan. But maybe the budget word is what's getting you—

maybe it's a better reframe, better reframe.

And people feel like budget means limit. I remember asking my 7-year-old recently, like, oh, okay, we're going shopping for this. Our budget is this. And I was like, sweetie, do you know what a budget is? And she was like, yeah, it's a limit. I was like, sometimes, but a budget is really just a plan about how we're spending our money. And she was like, oh, right, right, a plan, a plan. So a budget is a plan for how we're spending our money. What things get the yes, no, automatic yes? What things get the yes after we think about it? And what things get the automatic no? And what things get the no after we think about it, right? And so I— the very first step that I recommend for anyone who's like, I think I need to do something different with my money, is go look at your bank account statements, your credit card statements, your Venmo feed, your Cash App feed. If you're a person who uses cash, like looking at when you took cash out of the bank for the last 90 days, for about 3 months, and review and ask the question with this deep curiosity. We're not judging on ourselves. We're not shooting on ourselves. That doesn't sound fun or hygienic. We are curious about, hmm, where did my money go? Where did it come from? Where did it go? How quickly did it go there? Did it go on the things that I think are important to me, or did it go on the things that are not important to me at all? And I got to shift that. Are there anything that I spent money on that surprised me? Did it surprise me because I didn't realize I was going to have to pay? Did it surprise me because it was higher or lower than I expected? Did it surprise me because even though I know that person has a birthday at the same time every year, I forget until the last minute and then end up having to buy something big to make up for the fact that I forgot? Did I forget that it was a holiday season and that the kids would be home and that we would probably need a few more things in the pantry or the freezer so that we could get through the week without ordering food every day? Right? Like, just like, where did the money come and go? And if there's one thing that you could change that would make it better when you do this exercise again in 3 months, do that thing. Is it that you are making a shopping list when you go shopping so your grocery bill isn't as big? Is it that you are making a schedule of everybody who's important's birthday so you just can get ahead of it? So if you know there's a bunch of— there were a bunch of birthday parties last year in May because for whatever reason your kid has a lot of birthdays in May, that in April you're hitting the toy clearance aisle to see if they've got any $5, $10 toys so that you got a present to give and you aren't at the store on the way spending $35. Right.

Right.

What can you get ahead of or make a plan plan for, um, ahead of time. And your calendar is like your best friend in doing this, because especially if you use an electronic calendar, you can go back and say, hmm, we did have like 3 birthday parties that month, so what am I— what are— what's my plan for that? Are we going to all of them? Are we giving gifts? Or are we going to like make fun little gift certificates that says, Mom Day Out, I will take the kids to an experience as long as you give me 2 weeks notice, because Parents love those gifts and don't think I'm doing anything in the mall.

That is a good idea. I've never done that before. That's a great gift.

Mm-hmm. Especially if you have the kind of friends who like are totally, you know, if they trust you with their kid, like be like, hey, I got them on a Saturday. I just need 2 weeks notice.

I love it. I love your suggestions and I love that you made it feel so manageable because I feel like I turn splotchy with the word budget.

Yeah. And I mean, and I, and I want— I don't want to make it sound Pollyanna and easy because it is, especially that very first time. It is nerve-wracking. Like, oof, where— what am I going to see? What am I going to feel? Right? Like, but I promise that's the hardest part. If you can get yourself over that initial, I don't want to do it. And then, you know, look with, again, with curiosity, like you're the, you're the investigator on the X-Files, on NCIS, on, um, Law and Order. You are a detective and you're being curious about where the money go. You're not judging it, you're just looking for information. And once you have the information, you can make a couple of decisions that might change everything.

Yeah, I mean, even when I looked, I was like, really, do I go to Starbucks that many times? So that was good for me to see with my girls, and I talked to my girls about it, and I was like, I'm not saying we can't go, I'm just telling you we're not going to go as often.

Right. Yeah. Or it might mean that we, we use the credit card that gives us Starbucks points, or we make sure that we put— maybe we put ourselves on a limit by putting money on our Star Card. So it's like, hey, once that $20 is gone for the week, oh, we're out of Starbucks money this week, but it's okay. It'll refresh on Monday, right?

Yeah. And I'm going to tell you, I let them have it this morning and I want to tell everybody it was $19. For 3 drinks. So that is not something that I want to do multiple times a week, I'm just saying. So yes, see, I'm making a little shift.

A little shift, that's right.

So tell us how financial stress shows up in our mental health and our physical health.

So in our mental health, it's hard for us to focus on other things. We're like constantly thinking, hmm, will I make rent, or what am I going to do about that bill, or oh, can Can I tell the kids yes to that? And if I do tell the kids yes to that, what will that mean? I have to change or shift or delay or stop, right? So there's just that mental load, right? Like, and this is— you talk to and about parents all the time. That mental load is so heavy for a lot of us. And so you just add more to it. And then physically it means you're tired. You're tired all the time. You're already tired from parenting. You're already tired for whatever it is you have to do to show up for your family, whether that's working whether that's keeping the house clean and organized, whether that's meal prepping and packing lunches and dropping off, right? Like, like you're already tired from the labor of parenting and now you have the extra physical drain of being worried about money and whether you can even do all those things that you need to do and that you want to do for your family. And so if you can get yourself on a plan that meets your life, not what someone says your life should look like, not what, you know, books tell you it's supposed to be, not even what your parents say, because frankly, your parents had a completely different lifestyle than you have. Just in the matter of fact that you're raising kids, you're living life in 2025, 2026, and they weren't. Yeah, that like you got to figure out how to make it work for you. And the best thing about money, and I don't think people know this, is that there are actually a million and one ways to get it. Right. There are a million and one ways to get it right. I think we always are worried about getting it wrong that we forget that the other side of that is that there are actually a million and one ways to get it right as long as you follow a few principles. Pay attention to what you earn, spend less than you earn, save for the future. Like, it— all the books come down to those three lessons. If you're reading a money book that doesn't have those lessons, you're not reading a money book, you're reading something else. And so pay attention to what earned, spend less than you earn, and save for the future. And saving for the future can look like next week we've got to take the kids to Starbucks because it's— I promised. Or next year I know someone's going to be doing this sport and we're going to have to buy all the equipment for it. Or 10 years from now somebody's going to college, and even if I can't pay for the college, we're going to have to physically get them there. So that might mean a hotel and, uh, a U-Haul and at least a few books, because maybe I'm not paying the tuition but I want to set them up to have a great first semester, right? And so as long as you are doing those things and especially the earning part, we forget that if we can raise our income, that can actually make a big relief because a lot of times you're like, well, let me cut my expenses. Well, in today's economy, cutting expenses might not be even possible. Like our grocery bill is really well calibrated. Our grocery bill is really well calibrated because one, my kids are young. I have a 5 and a 7-year-old and they're in their particular palate stage. I don't want to call them picky because it's not exactly picky, but they are particular. They're in their particularly limited palated stage, right? So there's really just a few things that I know they will guarantee eat. So that's what I cook because it turns out I'm not arguing with you about it. So this is— you're going to get this and you're going to eat your vegetables and we're fine. Right. And so that means that my groceries, you know, pretty much alternate. One week it's kind of this set of groceries, the next week it's set B of groceries, and then we repeat. And so even though I'm buying the same things, largely my bill has surely every time gone up just a little bit. Right. And so if I needed to cut my grocery budget, it turns out I don't really even have a lot of room to cut because it was already really well calibrated. And so that means that if I've got to fix something, I either got to switch where I shop and buy more in bulk so that the overall cost goes up but the per meal cost goes down. But that takes a little planning. Or I gotta go find some more money to bring into this house, which, okay, that might be easy. You know, I'm a business owner, so I can sell a few more books, or I can do a consulting gig, or I can do some business coaching. And so that might be a way that I can get a quick cash infusion just to make things flow more smoothly. So pay attention to what you're earning and if there are small ways you can increase that, because for a lot of families, even $50 or $100 a week can make a huge positive difference.

Oh, absolutely. My husband always says he would rather try to make more money than cut things. Definitely like a different— it's a different mindset that I personally appreciate because I don't want to cut Netflix.

Right. I don't want to watch all the ads. Come on.

You know, So I feel like people get very anxious about money, and I feel like even if they're doing okay, they still feel anxious about money. Any thoughts, advice about that?

Yeah, absolutely. You know what can super help your anxiety is a gratitude practice. And the reason it's called a gratitude practice is it is something you have to practice, and then after a little while it becomes second nature. And what that does, it's— this is scientifically proven to rewire your brain to look for opportunities instead of obstacles. So when it comes to money, the way this actually looks is every night as you're getting yourself into bed, as you're getting yourself ready to rest for the evening, you're going to think about 3 things you're grateful for. They can be money related or not, but you're going to think about 3 things you're grateful for. But here's the trick. It can't be the same 3 things. And of course, I'm grateful for my family every day. Of course, I'm grateful for a safe and warm home, especially in the winter. Of course, I'm grateful for those things every day. But the challenge is each day I need to think of 3 new and different things that I'm grateful for. And they can be tiny, tiny, tiny, or they can be as big as whatever. Right. But the— by doing that each day, and maybe you can't do it at bedtime, maybe you're the person who has to do it while brushing your teeth. So pick a time in the day where it's paired with something you know you're going to do every day. So that way it's an easy habit to develop and keep. And you think of your 3 things to be grateful for. And what this does is because over the course of a month, you've now come up with almost 100 things in your life that you are grateful for. And you know that you have to look for something to be grateful for every single day. Right.

That is really good advice.

Yeah. And so it becomes part of how now your brain works and sees because we don't see with our eyes. We see with our brains. And so by adopting this gratitude exercise and paying very close attention to how you talk about money, you can change just all the things about money. So instead of being like, ooh, money's so tight, or ooh, we're broke, or we can't afford that, choose different words. Hmm, that's not in our plan right now. We have to look to see if we can make that work. I've been bad with money in the past, but I'm getting better every day. Like, just those small changes to how you talk about money paired with that gratitude exercise, in a few months you'll be like, who am I? You'll say something to someone and be like, who, who just said that?

It is really good.

Yeah.

And, and I love what you're saying about paying attention to what we're saying because I'm hearing myself constantly saying that college is taking all of our money. And I'm like, do you realize how many times you have said that? I'm not saying that anymore. I'm making a deal with you right now. I'm done saying that. Done.

Right. And right. And I mean, not that you asked for this, but how beautiful that you are in the position to put money away for college so that when your kids go—

Oh, we have one in college.

We have one in college.

Oh, great.

Right. But that, that they are there and they are able to study and be a student and not, and not worried about, will I be able to survive when I leave here? What a deep gift that you're giving to your family and to your child.

So sweet. Thank you for saying that. I'm going to take that with me. That's going to help me. You're— you're—

and write that check with, with like cheerful. The next time you got to write a check or deposit some money or electronic transfer, say, oh, it felt so good to pay that bill out loud. Out loud.

Okay. You're so good. I think you're so good. I'm learning so much. What do you think the biggest myth is that people have about money in general, about success? What, what kind of myth do you think we have?

That you need more money in order to be financially stable. You can be financially stable at any income. It just means you have to do things in a different order. And so part of the reason I named my book How to Afford Everything is one, I wanted people to— it to grab people's attention, but two, you really can afford everything in is, is that's important to you. But there's a few things that you need to know. One, you need to know what's truly important to you, and then design your life and your money, the way that your money is spent and comes into your life, around the things that are important to you. And then also know that, okay, we want to do these 5 things, but the best order to do it might not be 1, 2, 3, 4, 5, or all 5 at once. That maybe I got to do 5 first and then 2, and then 3 and 4 will go together, and then I can do that last one. Because by doing it not now but next means it's on the way, but it fits in your budget, it fits in your life, it fits with your family, and you know you're working towards it. And so you don't feel like, I'll never get that. No, I'm going to get it. I just have to do this thing first. And especially if you're in a relationship or in a family— my husband and I negotiate this all the time because of our managing our careers. Like, okay, I'm thinking about going to this school or getting this training or, you know, going for another degree. How does that work with you? Because that means that I'm going to be around for the family less, and so you'll have to pick up some of that, or we'll have to spend the money. So when do we put it in? What order do we need to do it in so that we can still have a life that feels really close to what we said was important to us?

I love that you're negotiating that together, and I love that you brought up it doesn't need to be instant gratification. Like I said to my husband I would love for us to be able to take our kids to Universal. They want to go to the New World. So we both know that it's in the future. We're going to plan for it, and we'll see when we can go. And it doesn't need to be tomorrow.

Yeah, I mean, back when I was planning my wedding, we were engaged for nearly 3 years. And when we told our parents that, they're like, okay, so when's the wedding? You know, they're so excited. We just got engaged. When's the wedding going to be? And we're like, oh, about 28 months from maybe 32. And they were like, 28 to 32 months? What is going on? We're like, well, because we went and got quotes for the place we want to have our wedding, and because we don't want to use credit cards for it, we know that what, what we can put aside every month into our special wedding bank account, we're going to be somewhere between 28 and 32 months to save that amount up. And, and so then they were like, that's a long time to be engaged. We're like, okay, Yep.

I am really impressed with you guys. That is some good planning.

And so it took us about 3— like when we finally got married, they were like, we've been waiting for this wedding forever. I was like, but isn't it glorious? I had a horse-drawn carriage. We were at a privately owned mansion. We got to spend the night with all of our friends and, and party and had a DJ. Like I paid for all my friends' dresses because that was important to me. Right? We, we covered a couple of family members. We covered a few family members who were like, well, I don't know if I'll be able to make that trip, it's kind of expensive. Like, no, we've already put you in the budget, right? Because that was the thing that was important. So we had this epic wedding, and yeah, it took us 3 years to save up the money, but it was epic.

Wow, your sense of community with your loved ones is really touching me. I want you— I just want to give you— we women don't give ourselves enough credit, so I'm just passing some on to you.

Oh, thank you.

So I do want to ask you before I let you go, some advice for us parents talking to our kids about money. Can you give us some healthy tips?

Yes. And so my favorite thing to tell is for the next like 2 weeks or so, right, you know, we're almost the middle of January, so maybe until February, just pay attention to what things you say to your kids kids or around your kids. And what you might— you don't think, you know, you talk— it sounds like you have some kids who are the older teenage, so you probably believe they're not listening to you.

I tell you, oh, they're always listening to you.

They're always listening, right? You're like, how did you even know that? How did you hear that? Where were you? And so just pay attention to how and what things you're saying to your kids about money and make a note in your phone. Like, because we always have our phones with us, so like just start a little note and just be like, okay, I said this, said this. And then after a couple roll through what you noted down and say, okay, if that's the voice my kids have in their head about money, is that the voice you want them to have? And if it is, great. You don't have to change anything. If you're like, ooh, I don't want them to be walking around thinking that this all the time, then change what you say. Because again, your voice becomes their inner monologue before they truly develop theirs in their mid-20s. And so if you can be mindful and intentional about just what things you say, how you say it, what questions you ask, and instead of, instead of rushing to answer a question, ask them some questions to see what they're getting at, then it gets you really far. And if you want more tips, you can actually check out Madelyn's Money Adventure, the book I wrote with my 6-year-old about teaching kids about money.

Oh, that's amazing. That was so smart of you to do that because I am paying attention to, I don't like some of the things that I say. I don't like the expression money doesn't grow on trees. So I don't like the expression, like, you think that we have endless pocketbooks. Like, I don't like the things that I hear coming out of my mouth. So I would definitely like to shift it to a healthier place. I don't want them to think that they get everything they want, but I, I just want better words to use.

Yeah. And so you could say, hmm, okay, do you happen to know how much that costs? Because we got to make a plan for That's not something that's in our current plan, in our current budget. So how much does that cost and when do we need to have the money? And so what could we do to come up with the money? What do we stop doing so that we can free up the money? Or what do we need to do to earn more money to be able to do that? Or, you know, as a family, we decided that it was really important for us to plan this Universal trip and we want to do that at this time of year. So if we say yes to this thing that you're asking for now, that'll either delay or cancel that trip. So which is more important? If this new thing that you learned about is more important, great, we'll shift it. But if Universal is still important, then we got to stay on this path and we got to find something else to do.

I like that because you get them thinking about money and learning about money. I like that a lot. I definitely, you know, my kids are 13, 16, 18, so they're at that age where, I mean, you can do it at age 5 with your kids of course, but my kids really need to learn about money. And I want to tell you something that's going to excite you. We went to high school orientation and they told my youngest that they're now requiring a personal finance class, which is new.

Yes, you must be in one of the 30 states that have adopted that legislation in the last 2 years. So congratulations for being in one of the 30 states.

I mean, I was shocked because 2 kids through high school and they didn't do it. So this is new and exciting.

Yeah. So maybe that kid will be the other, the other kids like advisor, which is great because you always need one. You always need one person who's like, don't be stupid with your money. Right? Because as the mom, you can't say it, but the sibling is really effective. Yes. That's why I named myself Finance Sis, because I'm like, not everybody listens to their mom. You do listen to your sister.

Well, that's— I was going to ask you. So thank you for answering that question. I was like, where did she get that from? That's so awesome. I love it. Well, I mean, I've asked you so many questions. You know, I could ask you a million more. Do you feel like there's something that I didn't cover that was important to ask you that I didn't ask you?

Oh, I'm so— I love this question and thank you so much. I just want the person who's listening to know that in case no one has ever told you, there are a million ways to get it right. So build your life and your budget so that you feel good. You deserve to feel good. It's your right to feel good. And so go do it. Like, you are the only person who gets to, has to, whatever, live in your body and live in your life. The other people are co-stars in your movie. And so design it. And if it's not what you want it to be right now, make small changes so that you get a little bit closer to that every month, every year. And then a few years from now, your life could feel and look exactly how you want it to.

Love it. You're full of so much good advice. I'm, I'm literally eating it all up. Will you tell everybody where they can find to?

Yes, please find me at darlabishop.com. There you can get all the links you need to find me. And then if you're more of a social person, it's my_finances, S-I-S on the end.

Love it, love it. Well, I feel very blessed that I got to talk to you today. You are full of so much wisdom, and I learned so much. So I have no doubt that the people listening are learning so much from you. So thank you so Thank you for having me. This is Rebecca Greene, and I want to remind everyone to spend every day laughing, learning, and loving. Thank you for tuning in to the Winey Palooza podcast. If you like what you heard, please be sure to subscribe so you never miss an episode. While you are there, leave a review. I love to hear your feedback. Thank you so much for listening. Until next time. This show has been produced by Market Domination LLC. To discover how you can have your own show completely done for you and turn it into a real published book and become the authority in your marketplace, go to www.marketdominationllc.com/podcastoffer.