How to Sell Anything to Anyone

How to sell anything to anyone. Do you think you could sell anything to anyone?

Yes, with a caveat. There's one caveat. But as long as that caveat is ticked, I think I can sell anything to anyone. I think I've proven it. I've done over a quarter of a billion in sales in information where there is nothing physical or tangible exchanged, just knowledge and experience. So, yeah, bring it on. Test me. I think I could sell anything to anyone, really. With one caveat. I'll tell you later about that. There has to be one condition.

Okay.

Yeah.

Do you think selling or the ability to sell is the most important skill that somebody should learn?

Well, I think it's either S and M or M and S. Sorry. So assuming you want to grow a business, assuming you want to make more money, assuming you want to get a better salary, then selling is everything. Well, they say build it and they will come. So some people believe that you have a great product and it will sell itself only when everyone knows how great it is. So actually build it and they will come. There's a bit missing. Build it, sell the fuck out of it. And then maybe they'll come. If you're good at selling and it's great, like Steve Jobs, if he was still alive, or Tim Cook of Apple. They don't really need to sell the iPhone anymore, but they did for years. So S and M is sales and marketing. It's not sadomasochism, which of course my jacket is giving those vibes on. And M and S is marketing and sales.

Okay?

So to me, marketing is generating the interest and the awareness, you know, I've got to know about something to want to buy something. In hardcore selling, you might call it the generating of the lead, you know, turning the browser into someone who's interested in buying what you've got. That's marketing. Sales is putting the cash in the bank, converting the lead into a sale closing you might call. For 20 years. If I ever thought about getting married, I always wanted to get married in a Tom Ford suit. Suit. I just, you know, I love Tom Ford when he was at Gucci. Just think, Tom Ford is a brilliant designer. And I always wanted to get married in a Tom Ford suit. And then, you know, I was fortunate enough five years ago to. To get married to my wife. And so I went to Tom Ford thinking, well, you know, I'll get a suit. I think that's what you need for a wedding. Anyway, I went in there. So he sold me the jacket and the trousers, which is the suit. But apparently you need a waistcoat, because you need a waistcoat, but apparently you need a shirt for the day and then a shirt for the evening. You can't wear the same shirt to a wedding. You need an evening shirt and a day shirt. You need a bow tie and a normal tie. You need a tie pin. You got, like. You can see I'm the easiest guy to sell to. Oh, of course I needed the shoes.

Yeah.

So I thought I'd get back then. I think a Tom Ford suit was. Because this was, you know, six years ago. I think it was maybe three grand, four grand, and I spent double. So that's great selling. Yeah, I, I went in for a suit and, I mean, I'm surprised I didn't have Tom Ford pants, Tom Ford socks. But great marketing was me wanting to get married in a Tom ford suit for 20 years, me wanting to look like Daniel Craig in James Bond wearing the same suit that I got married in. Obviously I didn't pull off his look, although I am taller. So marketing is the interest, the awareness, the desire. But at the end of the day, when I'm in Tom Ford, I could walk in, have a look around and leave. Or the guy could get me and double the amount of sales that I was intending to do. And that's great selling.

I wanted to do an episode around selling because it's something you don't really talk about, even when you are very good at it. And I think even if you're an employee or an entrepreneur, the best way to make more money is selling, because then you can reinvest that money. We did an episode recently. How would you invest 10 grand? So, well, if you haven't got 10 grand, where'd you start? So that made me think, well, let's do an episode about selling. So what is your first piece of advice on somebody who's never done any sales before? How do they get better at it?

Okay, so there's kind of like a process to this.

Okay.

So even though I haven't created a number or a formula, we'll kind of do it live. So the first process is you've got to see the benefit of selling, because in the uk, we don't really like it if we're honest. I was just interviewing the. The joint co leader of Reform Reform uk and he's an entrepreneur, Richard Tice, and he said in America, they embrace risk, they embrace failure. They love entrepreneurs. And in the uk, you know, you, you try and you fail and it's. You're on the hall of Shame and that's kind of in the uk, the overriding culture around selling. But you go to Dubai, you go to America, there's a more open, embraced culture, like a car salesman in the uk, you know, if you thought of a caricature around that, it'd be like someone pushy in a cheap suit job, struggling. Whereas I think it was. Was it Joe Gerard? We read the book, I think his book was called how to Sell Anything To Anybody. And he has the world record for selling the most amount of cars in, in America. And these people are loved, they're adored much more in America than uk. So step one is you've got to believe in selling, that selling makes the world go round.

I've heard you say selling a service before.

Yeah.

What does that mean?

Well, I'd go even higher. Selling is an act of love.

What does that mean?

Well, imagine if I take my time to care about what you want and need and then I swap that product for your money and you pay me and in exchange you get something you, you want and need. Do you feel grateful or resentful?

Grateful.

Well, gratitude is love.

Yeah.

So at its highest level, selling is an act of service. The butcher's got to sell the meat. The world does not go round unless we sell. But in the UK specifically, we've got a warped sense of what selling is. Now, I know some people do it unethically and they're too pushy and all of that, but you can be ethical and you can have a pull attraction sales strategy rather than a push rejection sales strategy. So sales makes the world go round. Nothing moves unless someone sells something. And sales is an act of love as long as you do it the right way or, you know, selling is caring if you do it right. And that's why I've got one caveat. You know, you asked me if I could sell anything to anyone and I. I've never actually said this publicly because I don't really make it my mission and I don't really brag too much, but I'm one of the best. I'm good at selling and. But even I can't sell on this one condition. And whoever's the best in the world, there's one condition where no one could sell, but if you tick that condition and learn tactics from people like me, most people could sell very well. So first of all, you've got to value selling number one. Number number two is you've got to value yourself. Like, if you don't believe in yourself, why should anyone else? And people say often in sales, I've got to believe in the product. I've got to believe in the product. Actually, that's not the condition, but it could be a condition. You couldn't give me a machete and I'm supposed to sell this to 16 year olds to cut their vegetables when I know that they're going to go and knife people in schools. I couldn't sell that because there's a moral, ethical mismatch there. So maybe everyone needs to take the time to figure out, okay, what product or service could I either start or what company could I align with with a product or service that overall does. Does good? So you've got to value selling, you've got to value yourself, which means either believing in what you're selling or believing in yourself. Because every winner was once a beginner and every master was once a disaster. And I have people all the time that come to me because I've done more than a quarter of a billion in sales in information, in, in something ethereal and intangible. It's only stored in people's minds. So you could argue that's one of the hardest things to sell. If I sell you a tv, at least you get the tv. Imagine if I said, hey, for three grand I will teach you how to imagine seeing things. That's not a good pitch for a tv, is it? You want the thing on the wall?

Yeah.

So selling information and ideas is one of the most challenging forms of selling. And you know, I've learned to do that. Now the people that I teach to do it, they ultimately think they haven't got enough experience, they haven't got enough credibility, they're not ready. But the, the major advantage if you're quite new or not as good as the best yet is you can make up for in service what you lack in experience. So let's say I'm 46, you're 26. So let's just assume I've got 20 years more experience in mentoring. And let's say my one time mentoring is 55 grand a year. Let's say you want to do it and you're like 55 grand a year. You know, I'd like to sell it like that, but I haven't got as much experience. Well, you could start at eight grand a year and if I offer, let's say two touch points a week, you could offer a touch point a day and you could go above and beyond in service what you lack in experience. Here's another thing. When you are not that experienced yet, you don't overcook the steak. The last thing you want is well done, burnt to the crisp steak. You don't want to overcook anything. And in selling, you don't want to overcook anything. So that's why listening is one of the most important elements of selling. And many people talk themselves out of a sale, not into it, because they talk more than they listen. But I get some new guys, as you know, we've got 30, 30, 35 sales staff in that office over there. We've got what, another 65 up there and sometimes new guys come in and they're good quick. You were good quick. Why? Because you don't overcook the steak. If you'd like to make, manage and multiply more money and build multiple streams of recurring income, and you'd like to meet one billionaire and at least seven millionaires face to face, I recommend you join us at an upcoming Moneymaker summit. The link is robmore Live Money. Now, you need to be quick because we don't run many money maker summits throughout the year and we keep relatively small numbers, 150 people, sometimes 200, sometimes less. You'll learn the strategies and tactics to get your tax bill down, your income streams up, start and scale your business, make, manage and multiply money. And if you upgrade to the VIP tickets, you'll be able to have dinner with multimillionaires, you'll be able to get champagne, reception, Q and A sessions with multimillionaires. And whilst I do occasionally offer some subsidized tickets, there's just small upgrades for these special VIP tickets. So go now at robmore Live Money. I'm very excited to announce a special long term partnership with Direct Bullion. People must ask me hundreds, if not thousands of times where I buy my gold and silver. How to buy gold and silver? Can you buy gold and silver in your pension? Many people know from my content I'm a huge fan of real money. They call gold God's money. So if you'd like information on investing in gold and silver, knowing where to invest, how to invest and how to invest gold and silver into your pension, which is huge, go to robmore.directbullion.com I get my gold at under spot price. This is not an affiliate deal. I won't earn anything on any of the gold or silver you purchase. I've got a special deal where I get a good price on my gold and silver and I've also got a very special deal for you, my loyal listeners and subscribers. Spot price or better@robmore.direct bullion.com you don't really know what you're selling so you listen more than you talk. You know a few top line benefits which are quite broad and generic and not specific. And you don't go into teaching mode because this is important as well. Another tip I'll give is know when to teach and know when to sell. Because if you start teaching when you should be selling, you're actually going to unsell someone. Or if you go for the close too early when you should be teaching or guiding or informing, you could also unsell someone. So people who are quite new, people who don't have a massive amount of experience but they believe in themselves because if we don't back ourselves, who else is going to back us? So yeah, there's a. What have we got? Let's bring this up. We've got believing in selling, believing in yourself. Did we cover anything else in there?

Yeah, you touch on believing on the product.

Yeah, believing in the. So it's probably believing in selling. Number one, believing in yourself. Number two, believing in the product. Number three, because the thing is if you don't believe in yourself, you're not even going to sell. You couldn't even sell an iPhone to a 16 year old which is the easiest sell in the world. Just a thousand quid of mum's money if you didn't believe in yourself. So the hierarchy is believing in selling, believing in yourself, believing in the product.

Do you believe people should give that? Let's say it's information and mentoring. Do you believe people should start off by offering that for free if they struggle to believe in themselves?

I think to a point it can be useful. The only time you should ever give anything for free is if you're getting something in exchange. Otherwise there's a one way exchange. There's a concept called fair exchange and fair exchange is where you pay an amount that you feel you get good value for and I receive amount that I think is fair and I can make a fair profit on. If I charge too much, you'll resent me because you'll feel low value and I'll end up feeling guilty because I know I turned you over. In reverse, if you don't pay enough, I'll resent you because I'm like, I can't make any money here. And you'll end up feeling guilt as well in the end because you're getting too much. So these things can. Unfair exchange can happen over a short term period, that is days or weeks, but even look at these Ponzi schemes and boiler room scams. In the end, they always fall to shit and break down because you can't have unfair exchange forever. So the concept of fair exchange is where you pay a fair amount. I mean, if you paid £10 and you, you thought you got £12 of value, you'd be happy. If I received £10 and I could keep £2 or £3 in net profit, I'd be happy. So never give anything for free unless there's some other type of exchange, because in the end you'll resent and, and they'll either feel guilty or they'll take the piss. So maybe you get a case study, a testimonial, a referral, a review, and then at least you're building up an asset other than that. Or maybe you can swap services with each other, you know, so you could manage my podcast and I could give you a couple of speaking gigs, for example. That's a way of doing it where you don't charge, but you get something back. You know, there's a lot of people out there who run events who are like that. Rob, will you, will you come and speak for free? Well, the answer is no. My fee is X, but if I can get my fee in another value, I'll do it. And I say that to people like, I want to support these new events that are launching, and I realize that, you know, my fee is tens of thousands, and when they're launching their new event, they can't necessarily afford that, although they can, and I'm worth it. But, you know, if I, if I did that for them for free, they would just go, oh, yeah, Rob will speak for you for free. And then what about the person that paid me my full fee? They're going to be pissed off. So it's either my full fee or it's the full value to me in the fee. So there has to be some level of fair exchange. So don't give anything away for free unless you're getting something back.

You just use the word value. Then. I saw a post on LinkedIn earlier. They said, there's no such thing as objective value, only perceived value.

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What'S your thoughts on that?

Now that's a deep question. Because if there's no such thing as objective value, there's no such thing as objective anything. So then I'm thinking, so is there objective truth? Is there objective reality? And I think if you had a gun to my head, I mean, there may be an objective truth and there may be an objective reality, but if that's the case, which God and religion is the objective true one and which all others are fantasies and not the true God? If you like. Do you see what I mean? There's like. So actually I'd probably, I'd probably have to agree with it because, you know, you can have, you can have a brother and a sister who've been born by the same parents and they'll go through a completely different experience in life. Different school, different friends, even twins. This has been proven. So therefore, any potential client that's interested in my product or service is an individual. And so, you know, they have their own desires, wants and needs. Now I can create an ideal client profile, which we do. And I can say, look, you need to have a, you need to earn 100 grand plus in salary. So you have your podcast agency. And you know, if people are wanting to launch a podcast, you, you're going to want to know if they're going to invest 30 plus grand with you for all the videos, the audios, the longs, the shorts, everything over a year. You're going to want to know that they're going to be consistent. They're going to produce the content. So you're going to want to see a bit of history. You don't want it probably to be their last 30 grand ever. So you probably want to know that they're an invisible amount of money. You want to know that they're, you know, they're going to be patient on the revenue. So maybe there are a certain type of age, maybe late 30s to early 50s. If you demographic them, they probably would be. So you can create an ideal client profile which targets your marketing and generates a more qualified lead, but that person is still an individual. And if you think about what motivates people, well, let's do a brainstorm together. Let's do one each just to think about what motivates people. So I'll start family.

You go status Ego.

Ego is a big one. I know why you said that as well. Because if they're struggling for the money, you'll go for the ego sale on the podcast. Okay, I'll say making money.

Freedom and choice.

Oh, freedom and choice. Okay, I'll say convenience or ease.

That's why I spend most of my money. Necessity.

Oh, yeah. Basic, basic survival. All right. I'll say for mission and vision, you know, for wanting to do something meaningful in the world.

I think those are the most.

I got him. I got him. So you can just see there, generically speaking, there's at least seven different motivations, by the way. Then there could be even more micro niche ones. That someone's going through a divorce and that all of a sudden becomes a big motivation. Or someone's really upset with the system, so they might want to pay in crypto and that might be their highest driver. So, yeah, back to your question. There is no object objective, full stop. There is only subjective. I'd have to agree with that. Yeah.

What does perceived value mean to you?

Well, what it means to me is what I perceive to be valuable. What it, what, what I think it means to you, if you're my prospect or you're my potential client, is what do you perceive as the most valuable? You know, for example, with you and your podcast agency, I know that many of your clients want a sponsor, so you help them with that, and it's probably a little bit more work for you. And in an ideal world, you probably wouldn't want to do that. You just want to say, here's your assets. But you know that getting a sponsor and being monetized is important. So you, you know, we're actually doing a course on that. So we help. Help people end to end with that information. So actually, I'm going to give a tactic now, and it's one of the most simple tactics in the world for selling. And I don't think many people use this tactic. And it is to ask, like, if I said to you, what's the most important thing to you in running your podcast?

It's a good question I'm having to think about.

I think we've got time.

Most important thing to me.

Yeah. What are the three most important things to you running your podcast?

Virality. Monetization.

Yeah.

And it doesn't take too much time.

Okay. So I now know that, that if I can sell you, that I can help you go viral. And if I can sell that, I can help you get sponsors and advertisers and create multiple streams of income with the 21 ways I know to monetize podcasts. And you probably only really need to record the content, you know, three or four hours a week. And we'll do everything else pretty good.

Where do I sign?

Yeah, there you go.

Yeah.

Because I've asked you essentially. Basically I've asked you, you're buying drivers, without saying, well, you're buying drivers, because obviously that would be weird. So a lot of people, they don't take the time to ask questions and listen in the sales process. And that can be done on automation with AI Nowadays, that can be done within your funnel. Now, with AI, you can do a little questionnaire early on in the funnel and then the answers to that questionnaire, then tweak and write the copy, the email copy, and the sales copy to that individual. You can do that. Now with AI.

That's insane.

It is insane. I kind of want to tell people the one condition where I can't sell anything to anyone, but I've got a question. All right, you do your question.

So you've got your three steps we've covered so far. And before we go down the rest of the list, what is your tactical advice for somebody applying to a sales role? And then after, we'll do those hiring for a sales role.

So my top tip for someone applying for a sales role is you've got to sell yourself.

Yeah.

When I interview salespeople and they're not selling themselves, they're not getting the job. In fact, you know what? And I learned this from, I love getting mentors. And, you know, I've learned a bit over 20 years, but there's still a lot more I can learn. And I remember learning from this chap if I remember his name, I'll put it in the comments. He said, what you want to do in a sales interview is reject them in the interview itself and see how they respond. And it sounds brutal. Yeah, yeah. But if you get rejected in the interview and then you yourself, well, this is a live. This is a live sales environment. You're selling yourself to me. So if you know, just say, I'm not going to give you the job. And if they just get their coat and leave, well, they can't do their basic thing. So the like. And this is actually a bit unique because I wouldn't in any other role that people are applying for, I don't want to be sold to, I want to know the reality. And I'm pissed off with people overselling themselves to me in interviews. Here's the irony. All the people not in sales are overselling themselves in interviews and all the people in sales aren't selling in interviews. Like, what's gone wrong with the world? So you've got to sell yourself. Like you can literally get your balls and put them on the table. Like that's what you can do when you're in an interview. So because that's your job, you can give it so large, you could. So that's my top tip.

Quite like that. Anything to look out for when hiring sales staff. So a lot of your audience are entrepreneurs. What are some issues that you run into with sales team?

Well, look, if you're going to make generalizations, probably the biggest issues you get in sales and marketing is bullshit. Yeah. Where, where does something draw the line between you, you sold it well and you exaggerated or you outright lied. So I, I never want to. I want people right at the line. I want someone who works for me to sell the. The, obviously the transformation, the outcome, the results, the benefits, the features, by the way, remind me to share my hierarchy of sales. There's like a six pyramid system that I've created. So I want them to. I want them to sell like it's going out of fashion. I want them to sell like it's 1999, but not lie and, and not. And so that's the fine line in selling where as soon as you and lie and exaggerate, as soon as someone finds that out, they're gone. Well, most people. So that, that's what you've got to find.

Who are the three best sales people that you've ever met?

Rob Moore, Kane, Baron.

Outside of us, obviously, who are the top three best salespeople you've ever learnt.

From oh, I've got some old schoolers. Most people won't have heard of these people, they're a bit underground. So one is called Dave Lakhani, L A K H A N I. And he was very much into language and linguistic patterns. So essentially linguistic hypnosis in selling. And one of the best conversational reframers of objections that I think I've seen.

Sorry, just explain what that means.

A reframe is to turn the objection into the reason. So if someone said to me, ah, Rob, I haven't got time to do this, I might say something like, well, it's because you haven't got time that you need to do this the most because if you don't earn enough money, you'll never buy your time back. So that's a reframe, that is you take the objection and you make it the reason. And that little line and it's because, like, if you, if you want the best tactical objection overcomer that I think there exists in the world and I've tried this hundreds of times and I've taught people who cannot. Couldn't sell anything to anyone, right? Couldn't sell fucking sweets to my daughter, right? And I've sat them in a live negotiation with someone they're trying to buy a property from and see them use this and close sales. This recent budget should warn you that your pension is not safe and secure and they're coming for your inheritance. Do you even know how much is in your pension or where your pension is invested? Add to this the recent inheritance tax grab on your pensions and the risk of a market crash. You probably didn't know this and I didn't until recently, but physical gold can be added to your pension pot. Gold is inheritance tax free and has grown 700% in the last 20 years. You probably know from my content I'm investing heavily in silver and gold and that's why I've partnered with direct bullion. Myself and Nigel Farage are brave brand ambassadors and direct bullion can help you with gold to protect and grow your pension. I buy my gold and silver from direct bullion and I don't earn any money on any purchases of gold or silver if you buy direct from direct bullion. So if you go to robmore.directbullion.com you can get a great price on your silver and gold and you can get the pension Gold investing guide completely for free. As you know, I don't do many strategic partnerships and when I do, I do them with people who are credible, who've Been doing it a long time. Who invest in things that I invest into. And gold and silver's going wild. I'm investing heavily in gold and silver. And I recommend you check out robmore.directbullion.com and it's a little phrase. I'll share it at the end because it's magic. But. But it's a reframe. So the most. You, you ideally don't want to have to overcome objections because that's combative, not collaborative. And you want to be in a collaborative scene where us, we're going to work together. As soon as it gets combative, where I'm like, you need to buy it. And you're like, I'm not buying it. And I'm like, well, you, you need to buy it and I'm not buying it. So ideally what you do is you inoculate the objections up front so they don't come out at the end.

So you're.

You raise them early. I remember learning this, and don't let me forget your question about the three top people. I remember learning a sales technique called Sandler, and there's a book on it, the Sandler Rules. And they would teach cold calling. Hello, it's Rob Moore. This is a cold call. Would you like me to carry on and like that for someone like me, that's actually going to get me. Yeah, I'm going to want to know. And I'm like, this is good. So that's like bringing the objection right at the front as opposed to waiting to the end. Because if you're doing 100 cold calls a day, you know, it's probably better to get the objection. The worst thing is you, when you get right to the end of a sale that's taken weeks and then you get the objection you can't overcome, like, that is the worst thing ever. You, you've been in that situation, haven't you, where you've gone, you've literally like run the length of the world for them till right at the end they're like, don't have any money. You need to find that well up front. So a reframe is an objection overcomer. If you said, oh, Rob, haven't got time to do this, I'd say, well, yeah, you have, because we've all got 24 hours in a day. That's an objection overcomer. But it's sort of a bit like it's probably not going to convince you. It's okay, but it's not convince you. But if I made the fact that you haven't got the time. The reason you need to do this, that takes objection overcoming to another level which is called reframing. So back to the point. So Dave Lakhani L A K H A N I if you can find any of his books on selling great but nuanced and technical. So probably not your first ever sales book read. Probably your first sales book read. Well, two. I'm going to give two earlier ones. So one of them is influenced by Robert Cialdini and it's kind of like the marketers manual and it covers the six different areas. Whereas humans, we're almost influenceable or leadable so there's liking, you know, if I like you, I'm more likely to buy from you. There's authority, you know, if I think you're credible and experienced or you've got a white coat on and you're my doctor, you know, so there's things that are naturally there and then there's things that can create increase them more. So with liking, yeah, you can be a likable person or you can know how to build rapport and mold yourself to a specific type of person. So there's liking, there's authority, there's social proof that is if you've got results and experience or you've got a good CV or there's a recommendation that comes from someone that I find credible. There's others, commitment, consistency, but I won't detail them now but. So Robert Cialdini, Influence and How to Win Friends and Influence People. It's not a sales book but it's a sales book because really how to Sell Anything to Anybody by Joe Girard is more a marketing and referral book than it is a sales book. But how to in Friends and Influence People just teaches you the basics of how to win friends and influence people. So let's go with Cialdini Influence and how to influence and influence people as the, you know, the bibles but, but the beginner levels then the more advanced. I'm going to go Sandler rules. It's a very direct approach to selling to get rid of all the objections really early. The upside of that is you don't get your time wasted. The downside of that is you can push some people away. Then we've got Dave Lakhani and then this guy you're going to love or hate. So I will give you a warning about this. You're either going to love this guy or you're going to be sick in your mouth. And his name is Marshall Silva. S Y L V E R. And he's like a double breast suit wearing, chest puffed out, got his arm on his Rolls Royce, shiny shaven head. And he's a, he's a hypnotist. And he used to be a hypnotist professionally and then he learned hypnotism through selling. And the phrase that is the greatest objection reframer of all time is and it's because and I learned that from him. So if you say I haven't got time and it's because you haven't got time that you need to do this the most because then you'll be able to afford to buy your time back, you know. But I've got the confidence. It's because you haven't got the confidence you need to do this because how else are you going to build your confidence? So it's a very smart, sexy, poetic, but practical way of overcoming reframing objections. And it's because quotation marks. Drop the mic. That is brilliant.

To be fair. Okay, so who's number one?

I didn't actually say a number one because I gave five, didn't I? Yeah, you did. Yeah. So I mean I've learned from loads of different people in sales and marketing so it's very difficult to name them all. And if you ask me tomorrow I might name a different five, but they're the five. So I'm going to say Marshall Silva, Dave Lakhani. The Sandler rules, how to influence and influence people, which is Dale Carnegie and then influenced by Cialdini. There you go.

Boom. So I just needed that for the clip. Yeah, the podcast, mine's always going, why.

Are we recommending other people and not ourselves?

Well, I mean it makes more sense just to buy your one to one mentoring and then you get all of it in one go. Right. Well, maybe 20 years of experience. Okay, you mentioned the hierarchy of sales.

Yeah.

What is it?

Okay, so basically there's T, O, R, B, F, L, P and L. The.

Editor of the YouTube version is going to have to put this on screen because. Yeah.

So Kelsey, maybe you can bring up some visuals. You know, when we map through these, you know when I talk about all these hierarchies and things. So if you, if you imagine a pyramid and you slice it into six, at the top we've got T and at the bottom underneath the pyramid we've got P on a pna. I'll come back to PNA because it's a bit of a piss take really. So I'm going to. But I'm actually Going to start with B, then F, then L. So B is benefits, F is features, L is logistics.

Okay?

So if I'm selling you a car and I tell you where to park and how to park it and how to buy a parking ticket and how to get your insurance and how to put your tax on your car, that's logistics of owning a car. If you've come into the Ferrari dealership and I start talking to you like that, you're going to leave. Because logistics. Unless someone already has bought it or knows they want to buy it, they don't care about the logistics in that moment, then you've got features. So, you know, a steering wheel is a feature. A gear stick is a feature. Now, certain things, if you're selling to governments or if you're in the private sector, features are also benefits. But a steering wheel in a gear stick is not a feature. That button on the steering wheel is not a feature. But if that's the sport, sport plus and sport plus plus, maniac death mode, where you can go 0 to 60 and 2.3 and you can get the back end of that car out and you can drive that car like you've nicked it, that's a benefit. So turning features into benefits, I. E. What's in it for me? What's in it for me? Why should I care? Why should I care? So these are two good questions to ask. So if you're going through you, if you're selling what you're selling and you present a feature to someone, level one is you could ask, you could think in getting your client's head and go, what's in it for me? What's in it for me? Go. Go to a deeper level. Why should I even care? Like, if you can't answer on the client's behalf when you're designing your pitch, what's in it for them and why they should even care in the first place, then that's at best a lot. A logistic or a feature, not a benefit. Okay, but we're actually selling transformation, which is the tea. Like, you know when people buy pre workouts and fat burner pills, what. What are they actually buying, do you think?

The abs and the biceps.

They want the abs, yeah. They want the pump. So they want the transformation from skinny or flabby to ripped. So, you know, if you start buying these pre workouts and, you know, you're given all the features of everything in it, you really just want the pump and you want to lift more weight and you want to look better. So the hierarchy starts with transformation at the very top. So you know, people who learn from me to start and scale a business and to make manager multiply money. The transformation is financial freedom or complete location freedom away from banks and governments. You know, when have you ever heard the phrase you money? I'm sure you have. You know what you want, where you want, when you want. So most people actually aren't looking for money, even people who think they're looking for money, they're looking for speed, ease, convenience. It's transformative to have your own driver to take you to places so you can get there, relax. You can do work in the back of a car, but you know, it costs you 500 quid for a long term journey. It's transformative to be able to fly business class instead of economy, but it's could be five or ten times the price. So if you think at the very fundamental level with what you're selling, what is the transformation? So you know, you don't sell people on having a podcast, you sell them being the go to authority in their entire niche, you know, magnetic client attraction where clients come to them rather than having to go out and run ads. You might do the ego sell. You know, you're selling them as one of the top voices in their niche or in the country or in the world, you know, on their subject matter. And that, and the transformation of that is you generate leads and clients quicker, you build multiple streams of income, you get to meet amazing people traveling all the way around the world, essentially getting paid to go on holiday. So all of these things is transformation. So you've got transformation at the top, then you've got outcome, then you've got results, then you've got benefits, features, logistics, P and A is parking analogies. I have, I have had someone right, who's selling business courses for me who when they started selling saying, you can't park outside the training suite here, you have to go and park in Peterborough. And if you've got a nut allergy or any other allergies, don't worry, we'll look after you. Like at that point, no one gives a about parking and allergies. So the only people who are not have got a nut allergy would care about the allergies. And all you have to do is ask. So transformation first, then outcome. So outcome is what's your end result? So you know, if I'm you selling podcast agency packages, you could say in a year of working together, what's the end result? You want.

More clients?

Okay, so roughly how many? Realistically?

One a month.

Okay, so you'd like 12 clients by the end of the year. Yeah, yeah. What else would be your yearly outcome?

To be able to work remotely.

Okay. So you're gonna need to find some studios around the world. You're not gonna want to build your own studio.

Yeah.

Okay. You're gonna want a mobile setup. Okay, cool. What other outcomes?

Leave my day job.

Okay, and how much is it to leave your day job? Roughly, like, minimum amount to leave your day job.

40 grand a year.

Okay, cool. So you're going to want about what, three and a half grand a month. Be able to record your podcast anywhere in the world, and you're going to want to get one sort of 30 grand client a month job done. There you go. So outcome, you basically take the client to the end of the journey. And if you're selling Mars bars, the outcome is to not be hungry anymore. Yeah, but obviously the higher the tickets and packages that you're selling, you know, but, but if you, if you consult that with the client because, you know, I've not sold to you, I've just asked you. I'm consulting to you. I'm caring about you. Remember I said selling is caring. Now if I didn't care about you, I just cared about the sale. I'd just be trying to force you to buy it. But I'm just taking time to care about you, to find out what your outcome is. And then what I'm going to do is I'm going to put something that de risks it for you. So did you notice as well? I said, what's the minimum amount you'd need to quit your job? Because I can't. You can't say, yeah, I want a million pounds a week. It's got to be realistic. But I'm guiding you to create an outcome. And then I'm going to create. I'm going to create a bespoke package that can give you that outcome. So transformation first, then outcome, then results. And results are money downloads, you know, losing weight, getting ripped, et cetera. And then like we said, benefits, features, logistics, parking, analogy. I don't think. I don't think I've ever done that, ever, on a live episode. I've been doing this 18 years and you've got some secrets out of me.

People should be paying for this. But we're live streaming on four channels. Hey. Hey. What are some of your other steps? I think you've listed three so far. What are more important things people need to know to get better at Selling. So so far you've said believing in selling.

Yeah, believe in selling.

Believe in yourself.

Believe in yourself.

Believe in the product.

Believe in the product. Then you have to have a, a compelling pitch. So either you know the main benefits and features and transformations of the product or have the consultative approach that I just shared where I find out what your greatest desires are. So your pitch is either perfected via a script, you know, if it's on a video or if you're standing on a stage, or it's perfected by. You've got essentially a questionnaire which finds the transformation, outcome and results desires for the client. So I would say that's four. Now this could be five, or it could usurp four. And that is you need to know your ideal client profile. Because, you know, I said earlier, I can sell anything to anyone with one condition.

Yeah.

And here's the condition. They've got to want it. Like if you do not want a podcast, I can, you know, be consultative and ask for your transformation, your results, your outcome. And it's because reframe all the objections. Don't want a podcast, Rob. Not interested. I'm an introvert. I'm getting divorced. I'm an introvert. I'm getting sued. I don't want anyone to know me. I just want to go and hide in a bunker. Don't care how good you are. And this is the mistake a lot of people make. They're not putting themselves in front of the right people.

I've got a great example of that. So I was at the business show with Ash looking for sponsors for some of our podcasts. I don't know if you've been to any of these expos recently.

I used to go back in the day.

Hello, Fresher everywhere.

Oh, wow. Why are we not getting them as a sponsor then?

Well, I can explain that separately, right, but they'll go to an expo and they might have six stands, but it's just an individual all over the place. And they only hire freelance sales people. No full time employees. And they are like assassins.

Yeah.

And they collared Ash and they got him and Ash gave him an objection. Overcome it. Objection. Overcome. Overcome it. And Ash said, he was like, I'll be honest, mate, you're doing a great pitch. I just don't fucking want it. And he was like, fair enough, have a good day. And it just moved on. And it was like, I don't really know what else to say to the guy. I was like, I guess if you just don't want it, you don't want it.

You don't. Now, if he could have, he. In that instance, I would have recommended the Sandler technique of finding that out earlier.

How do you do that?

Well, you have to go in blunt with. Well, the thing is, right, if you're walking down a shopping center and someone says, you know, do you want some perfume? You know, they give you the samples. You might, but if they do it that way, you're going to say no. So actually, step one is the approach has got to be in a way that stops people because you know what it feels like when you're walking down the street and someone tries to stop you. Now, at a business expo, kind of people are there to do business. But. So number one is the approach. You've got to find an in or a hook. Do you know what? Someone did this for a charity. So well, and I knew I didn't want it, but I sat and listened to him on purpose. I'm going to have to. I've go back and remember, he was so good at it. I even said to him, look, mate, I don't want what you've got, but you're good.

I had one in Peterborough City Center.

Can you remember it? Yeah, go on then.

It was a. It was a knife crime charity and I'm walking, you know, from Queensgate to Starbucks and he's in the thing, he's, oh, mate, you just dropped. You just dropped it. I've turned around. He's like, your smile. I was like, oh, anyway, now I've got your attention. I was like, fuck's sake. And he went into a pitch around, like, donated to knife crime. I was like, I just love when someone's so good at something. I was like, yeah, go on that, like, absolutely.

Well, do you know what a salesperson equally loves and loathes being sold to? So when we're sold too badly, we hate it when we're sold too well, we love it. Well, that's how. I don't know if you.

I'm the same.

Yeah. So the approach has got to be good and then, yeah, you've just got to get out straight and early. Look, just so you know, this is what I do. I don't want to waste your time. I just want to check is there any level of interest, even just a little bit? And then Ash would have said no. Yeah, I'm just not interested. Do you see what I mean? But here's something I learned from Richard Denny. Rest in peace, you know, he passed away a few years ago. Richard Denny says you only ever sell one thing at a time. So when you're approaching someone, if you're doing it cold or if you're cold calling, you've just, the first thing you're selling is their attention. So if I go, what's the perfume now I'm selling that too quickly. So what that guy did really well that said if you drop something, blah blah, blah, he's just, he's stopping you then he's just getting your attention. So you only sell one thing at a time and people are selling too many things too quickly or upfront when they, when they sell. So yeah, that's how you get better. Essentially the, the step one is the pattern interrupt. You know what, what gets someone's attention away from their day to day distraction. Once you've got there, that's the only thing you're selling at first is attention. I mean I don't know if any of you have heard of ada. It's quite an old school marketing model. Attention, interest, desire, action. So step one is just getting the attention which is this is a sales call. Feel free to hang up if you want to but if I've got something I think you'd love if you want to stay on, give me two minutes. That's it, you know, that's attention and then interest is then you've got not much time to build the interest. That's why you know, I said so we're on step five I think and you know a compelling pitch or an ideal client. I'd probably put the ideal client before the compelling pitch. Okay, well if you think about. But the thing is with ideal client is that's kind of marketing, it's lead generation. So here's the thing. If, if that business expo when in the middle of a football pitch in the middle of nowhere, it's not going to get any clients. If that business expo went to some business hub heart in London or New York, it's going to have the right people. So I'd probably change my order probably four, you know, ideal client, attraction and reach. And then five is the perfect pitch and then six is the closest. So the golden rule with the close is one or one which is the letter I is you've got to ask for the money two or the two I's is then you've got to make it easy for people to pay. Why is Apple Pay so popular? Click, click. You might not be old enough for this. And Kelsey, I don't know if you are either but back in the day on Amazon when you had to Go and buy something. On Amazon, you clicked, clicked, clicked, click, click. And then you've got a fucking form, Name, email address, 15 lines, age, sex, this, that, this, that, this, that, and then you click and then you get the wheel of Death. And then, oh, it didn't process and you've got to go back and you've got to do it again and then you finish and then you're like, bollocks, I wanted something else. And now on Amazon, everyone just takes it for granted. In the, the younger generation just click to buy and then you want something else, you click it again. And the, the, the one click order upsell button was an amazing feat of engineering. We, you all take it for granted. You just go click, click, click. But think about all the security involved, think about all the information exchange involved. If you have to put all this level of detail in and to be able to just click a button and buy something else or click a button and pay, or double tap and pay. What that did is completely remove the friction and completely increase the speed and the security of purchasing. And Apple Pay and the Amazon order upsell button is a feat of innovation because what it did was it removed the friction. It made buying easy. So you have to remove the friction and make buying easy. If they want to pay in crypto, they pay in crypto. If they want to pay in instalments, they pay in instalments. However they want to pay. You make it easy for them. And then there's one final rule. This is a fundamental rule of selling when you ask for the order and when you close, you then shut the up.

Yeah.

And then it, I remember doing, I remember learning this and I was selling a 25 grand plus a deposit of 25 grand. So selling a 50 grand product. And I was face to face across the desk with someone and I'd done all my stuff. I knew a bit back then, and then I said, so, do you want to move forward? And we just sat there looking at each other and I really, really, really in every cell in my body. And anyway, after about what felt like a week, he said, oh, are you doing this bit where the first person to speak loses? And I said, nothing. And he bought. So you, you know, the amount we, we speak ourselves out of selling. You get on the phone, you get face to face. What's most important to you? What's your, what's your outcome? What would be the ideal scenario with us working together? I've got an appointment now, so I'm going to finish on the one thing that backs up My proof that I can sell anything to anyone as long as they want it. Every human has a hierarchy of values unconscious to most people. But you hear people talk about values a lot, where there are certain things that are very important to them in their life and they're actually really easy to extract out. And how someone dates and where they live and what lifestyle they want and what jobs they do and, you know, how they perceive money and how they experience life is all filtered through their values. That's why if you really value business, you might vote conservative or reform. You know, if you value sharing, you might vote for a more socialist party. It's unconscious. So imagine if you could get this little script where the prospects inbuilt highest core values of how they live their life. Imagine if you could get that information. Now, what a lot of people do is they sell how they want to sell. But what you've got to do is sell how they want to buy. And that's very different. Like if you've got an M4, if you were selling me that, you'd sell it on how you'd want to buy it, but not necessarily how I'd want to buy it. So your goal is to find out how do I want to buy it so you can sell it how I want to buy it. There's one way to do that. It's guaranteed to work. Like I said, the only way I can't sell anything to anyone is if they don't want a car. And that is the following script. And I'm going to do it as a demo. So what is most important to you in and whatever you're selling, you put the outcome. So if I'm selling podcast packages, what is most important to you in becoming a podcaster? Now, I already know you want clients, virality and 40 grand a year, because I already did the question earlier on, so I already know. So all my other features and benefits and logistics, they come out of the pitch. They're not, they're not, they're not relevant to you. I'm selling on these three. And no one cannot buy something or be attracted to something that's highest on their values. No one can. It's impossible because it's what you value the most in life. So, Kelsey, Kaney, are you up for a quick demo? You can say it quietly, Kelsey, if you don't want it to come through. Kelsey's the fucking brilliant editor, I just like to say so I'll start with Kane, just so you can see how it goes. So, Kane, what's Most important to you in your life?

Freedom of choice.

Okay. And then what else is really important to you?

To do what I love. Okay.

And what else is really important to you?

Maintaining my relationships.

Okay, cool. Freedom of choice. Do what you love. Maintain your relationships. Okay, cool. Kelsey, what would you say is the most important thing to you in your life? Relationships and connections and passions. Okay, now you can ask me the same question.

What are the three most important things to you in life?

Okay, so if I was conversationally doing this, I'd just say, so what's really important to you in your life? And if you know, as opposed to, so what are the three most important things? So for me, growth and progress is definitely one of the most important things in my life. I would say being successful at what I do. Yeah. And I would say meaningful relationships with. Interesting people. So now you know that, how would you pitch me buying your podcast packages?

Oh, that's a good question.

So my first highest value is growing progress. Right. Okay, so that's all you need to know, is it?

Yeah, see, that's really weird you say that because immediately I would have defaulted to the third one, which is meaningful relationships of interesting people.

Yeah, well, that's so, you know I love doing my podcast and meeting interesting people.

Yeah.

You know that. But if I did that and got no views, that would be a killer for me. So the way you pitch to me is, hey, look, Rob, might take a bit of time and we'll have a few bumps, but we're going to blow this shit up, and we're going to make you the biggest podcaster in the world. When we get the formula, we're going to rinse and repeat it, and we are going to grow a massive brand for you. Tens of millions, hundreds of millions of downloads. I mean, where do I sign? Because it's growth and progress.

Yeah, so.

So if I'm selling to you, I'd be like, look, we'll be able to have you run your podcast anywhere in the world. However many episodes a week you want, you can do it. Doesn't really matter. It's up to you. You know, you'll choose whatever guest you want. You. All we'll do is all the boring, nitty gritty stuck in an office stuff for you. We'll do the editing, the show notes, the. The hosting, all of that, all the analytics. You can basically just go where you want, when you want, interview who you want. How does that sound? Of course it does, because you already told me, and I know that we need to leave it on this because I actually have got an important interview and I don't want to, don't want to go over time. But yeah, this was your idea to do this content. Hopefully everyone thought it was valuable and useful.

I think so.

Did you learn anything?

Yeah, a lot. This is one of my favorite episodes I've done.

Ah, excellent. Before we go though, if you want to learn more stuff like this, watching us on a zoom, 3 inches tall is fine. People always say to me, rob, you're taller in real life. Yeah, because I'm not 3 inches tall, I'm 6 foot 3 inches tall. We do about three days worth of content like this, granular, tactical and detailed at the Moneymaker Summit. So I'm very excited to say that the, the next up and coming money maker Summit, we actually have someone who's in the top 50 businesses in the UK, built a multi billion pound business. There's only 57 companies in the UK that have grown to multi billions. He's very disruptive, very dynamic, very outspoken, very controversial. And I've got him as the keynote speaker at Moneymaker Summit. And you're doing episode, you're doing keynote speeches on, going viral with content, launching a podcast. I'm doing five keynote speeches. Have to go from zero to six figures, six to seven figures. They're two different speeches. I've got a private session on how to get your tax bill down. Investing in silver and gold, being decentralized, starting and scaling your business. We've got all of this at the Moneymaker Summit. So the link is robmore Live Money. Go there right now. Robmore Live Money. I don't know how many tickets are left. I know one of the dates is coming soon and then there's one a little after. I know one of the locations is Peterborough, one is London, but it's live, face to face, where the real business is done. But you can see the dates, the details, the agenda, the ticket options on the page. We've got call VIP and VIP Gold upgrades where you can have dinner with us. And I think there's seven multi millionaires that speak. I think we've got about 150 years of experience in business between us. Obviously you've got about three months because you're 15, but I'm 46. I've been doing this 20 years. Hey, but the. Anyone who's under 30, you need to learn from this guy for sure because he's living the dream age 26. So basically you've got the strategies and tactics, the mindsets and skill sets of making managing and multiplying money over three days. It's a lot of giving back from us because, you know, I became a millionaire 15 years ago, a DECA millionaire 10 years ago. I've done quarter of a billion in sales. So if you go to the link robmore Life Money, you can see the ticket options, you can see we've got special offers there because we're celebrating a lot this year, aren't we? 10 year anniversary of Disruptors podcast, 18 year anniversary of our company. You just became legal, so this is just great. So, yeah, robmore Life forward slash money. Basically I'm on a mission to help as many people on this planet get better financial knowledge and I'm giving a lot back. Obviously, it's my business as well. We've got some amazing speakers, some amazing content, amazing networking because you know your net work is your net worth and the more you learn, the more you earn. So, robmore Life Money, make a note of that because I think in about 10 seconds Kelsey's going to hit the kill switch. I always like to end my content with saying, if you don't risk anything, you risk everything. How would you like to finish us off, Kane?

You'd like me to finish you off, wouldn't you?

Yeah, you can edit that.

What a way to end. Thank you, Rob. This has been awesome.

This episode was brought to you by Disruptive Media, helping bold entrepreneurs stand out through podcasting, video and social content. Visit disruptive media.co.uk to learn more.

Foreign.

This episode was brought to you by Disruptive Media, helping bold entrepreneurs stand out.

Through podcasting, video and social content.

Visit disruptive media.co.uk to learn more. Sa.