Podcast
21 Nov 2025 · 23 min
Robert Kiyosaki argues the American empire is ending due to currency debasement and recommends using debt, real estate, and precious metals to protect wealth. He bought 60 Bitcoin at $6,000, warns that central bank digital currencies enable surveillance, and says entrepreneurs should exploit tax strategies while pensions collapse.
Questions this episode answers
March 18, 2025.
1971.
About $30 U.S.
Approximately 2,200 (currency implied: GBP or USD as referenced by speaker).
700% (as stated in the promotional copy).
Chapters
Is the money system rigged?
You won't get me in trouble, don't you? No. We're at the end of an empire right now. It is the end. It's the end of this. And all empires always come to an end. The Roman Empire, the Greek Empire. Chinese were the earliest. Chinese were the first guys to use paper. Right. So what we're looking at today is the end of the American Empire. So it's a very dangerous time. It's explosive with Palestine and Gaza, all the stuff that's going on is an end of times. Not biblical, but just an end of an era. And the trouble, when this comes to an end, war follows. That's what I'm afraid of. I went to Vietnam twice. I was a pilot in Vietnam. So I saw war. It's not good, obviously. I feel for both Palestinians and the Israelis, but we're in dangerous times.
So if we're seeing the end of fiat currency as we know it, where do you think money moves to?
Good question. This Here is a 1964 half dollar. 1964 was the year that this was real silver. But in 1964, the US was now from England, the torch was passed to America. That was 1944. Bretton woods and all this. And so America was the power. But every empire ends when they debase the currency. So this was 64. I was 17 years old. I remember, like, oh, that's nice. You know, and then one day I also looked up and some of the coins look like this.
And that is.
This is pure gold.
Yeah, one ounce.
Is it. But I look it up and go, oh, my God, why does this coin have copper on it? And that was the end of the empire. Every empire dies when they violate this, when they change the money. So I'm. Congratulations on your success about being a real estate guy, because this was 64, then 71. President Nixon took the dollar off of the gold standard. And the reason you're doing so well today is because the dollar became debt. Right? So real estate guys like my friend Trump and all that, we get rich using debt, whereas the average person is told to work hard. This is toilet paper. Save this. Stay out of debt. And they're going broke today. I really. I'm afraid for the average punter out there, you know, so we're in serious trouble because we're the end of the American empire. Is China going to take over for me to get rich? I use debt. But what do our schools teach us? Stay out of debt. That's how stupid school teachers are. Debt makes guys like you and me rich. And ironically, because we use debt, we don't pay any taxes. Taxes are very high here in London, very high in America. But real estate guys like Trump and I, we don't pay taxes legally. Now that makes a lot of the liberal or the conservatives or the, whatever you call them, the greenies and the academic types, angry. Because when Trump was nico debating Hillary Clinton, that criminal, the Clintons and Obamas, man, what a bunch of crooks they are, really. But all politicians are crooks. Anyway, anyway, I'm not getting political here, but Hillary Clinton, she was running against Trump, she says, and you don't even pay taxes. And what does Trump say to her means, I'm smart. And so the reason I like what you're doing with real estate is you learn to use debt and you pay less taxes to go for this. But what I'm glad about in your program is once I realized this and this was all changing, the end game wasn't real estate. The end game was gold. So today this is a U.S. silver Buffalo. You can buy this for $30 U.S. i don't know it in pounds. This is 2,200. Okay, so which would you rather have today? Would you rather have this piece of toilet paper? Would you rather have this piece of silver or would you rather have gold? The average person wants the paper. This is toilet paper. And that's why people are in trouble today, because America is about to crash. As you know, we're in serious trouble. Our debt is at an all time high. America is now the biggest debtor nation in the world. Worse than Japan. Japan has high debt, but the Japanese people are rich because they save. Americans are in debt, the country's in debt, and we have this guy Biden putting us more in debt. If you're going to be a rich man or a poor man, a rich man. Your end game is gold. This has been money for centuries. This is silver. It's the better investment. Today in the US it takes 35 of these to buy one of these. So I tell my brothers and my sisters and all that, hey, trade this piece of toilet paper in for this. Oh, no. Dave Ramsey said save money.
This recent budget should warn you that your pension is not safe and secure and they're coming for your inheritance. Do you even know how much is in your pension or where your pension is invested? Add to this the recent inheritance tax grab on your pensions and the risk of a market crash. You probably didn't know this and I didn't until recently, but physical gold can be added to your pension pot. Gold is inheritance tax free and has grown 700% in the last 20 years. You probably know from my content I'm investing heavily in silver and gold and that's why I've partnered with direct bullion. Myself and Nigel Farage are brand ambassadors and direct bullion can help you with gold to protect and grow your pension. I buy my gold and silver from direct bullion and I don't earn any money on any purchases of gold or silver if you buy direct from direct bullion. So if you go to robmore.directbullion.com you can get a great price on your silver and gold and you can get the pension gold investing guide completely for free. As you know, I don't do many strategic partnerships and when I do, I do them with people who are credible, who've been doing it a long time, who invested things that I invest into. And gold and silver's going wild. I'm investing heavily in gold and silver and I recommend you check out robmore.directbullion.com.
My family's broke, but they follow my poor dad. They go, I have a master's degree. What do you have?
And a master's degree can get someone 100,000 in debt, can't it? Bad debt.
I'm a billion dollars in debt. You're a billion in debt because debt is money. It happened in 1971. President Nixon took this separate them. So what became money was a US Bond. Now, Dave Ramsey and most of these financial planners down in the city of London, they recommend buying bonds. Bonds are the worst advice possible. Why they're going crashing. Three banks went down in a row because the bonds crashed. So please hear what I'm saying is our financial planners, that's what we call them in the States, they're always saying, you want 40% stocks, 40% bonds and 10% gold or something like that. They think bonds are safe. But now that interest rates are going like this, when interest rates go up, the bonds come down. Today the US Federal Reserve president, Chairman Powell, he's raising interest rates. Bonds are coming down. Our banks are crashing. When our banks crash, they can't lend this out. And when they can't lend this out, the economy crashes. So the people who will win are people who have gold and silver and mommy and daddy who are saving. This will be wiped out. Because to save the world economy, as you know, the US is going to print trillions of these. You have, what was it named Tusk or something. She was your prime minister for a short Period of time.
Yeah. Liz Truss, Yeah.
When she tried to screw all this, your pensions went down. So mark my words, the old guys like me in uk, America and most of Europe, we have no pensions.
So did you decide to.
Well, let me say it again. We have no pensions.
No pensions.
They're gone, but they don't know it yet. Right.
Most people think inflation is bad because it erodes paper money. But is inflation good if you have good debt?
It's about a financial education. Depends on the asset class inflation is good for. Look at this. The first one I ever bought was in 1972. Paid $50 for it. I still have it. It's in a vault in Switzerland. It cost me 50 of these today. That same. If I pulled it all, the vault from Switzerland, it's a South African Krugerrand. If I held it up here, it'd be 2,000 of these for one of these. So meanwhile, Mommy and daddy are, Ooh, ooh. Say all this stuff. Loser. Because our schools want us to do that.
Do you pay any tax?
No.
None. None.
You guys forget, you guys are English. You forget we're still pissed off at you guys. It wasn't me. Remember in 1773, don't hold a grudge that long. Yeah. There was a thing called the Boston Tea Party and the English were taxing the American colonies. And finally the Americans said, and we threw the English tea into the ocean. And so people say, ah, America was founded in 1776 when whatever they did, or Declaration of Independence, whatever they did, now, America was founded as a debt revolution. Debt. They threw the English out. So America was founded as a debt free country, if you know that one. So Americans have always fought against tax free. I don't pay my tax, I don't have to. But I have the best accountants and the best lawyers to make sure I don't. That's why Trump and I don't pay taxes legally. Hillary Clinton and Obama, they just steal it. You don't have to pay tax on things you steal.
Well, didn't Trump say to Hillary that he is not paying any tax because of laws that she passed?
Something like that. Yeah. I just remember she was attacking him one day on camera. He says, he said, but you don't pay any taxes. He says, I'm smart. That's the truth.
And do you not pay any taxes because you're taking all your income as debt?
No, no, no. You have to obey. Taxes are incentives. In other words, if I went down to Goodwill, a church, the government wants me to donate money to a church. So if I donate this to a church, it's a tax, the tax write off. So taxes are incentives to do what the government wants you to do. So the people that pay the highest taxes are employees and doctors and lawyers. The capitalists don't pay taxes.
This recent budget should warn you that your pension is not safe and secure and they're coming for your inheritance. Do you even know how much is in your pension or where your pension is invested? Add to this the recent inheritance tax grab on your pensions and the risk of a market crash. You probably didn't know this and I didn't until recently, but physical gold can be added to your pension. Pot gold is inheritance tax free and has grown 700% in the last 20 years. You probably know from my content I'm investing heavily in silver and gold and that's why I've partnered with direct bullion. Myself and Nigel Farage are brand ambassadors and direct bullion can help you with gold to protect and grow your pension. I buy my gold and silver from direct bullion and I don't earn any money on any purchases of gold or silver if you buy direct from direct bullion. So if you go to robmore.directbullion.com you can get a great price on your silver and gold and you can get the Pension Gold investing guide completely for free. As you know, I don't do many strategic partnerships and when I do, I do them with people who are credible, who've been doing it a long time, who invest in things that I invest into. And gold and silver's going wild. I. I'm investing heavily in gold and silver and I recommend you check out robmore.directbullion.com There's a book I wrote called.
The Cash Flow Quadrant. E s b I e's pay 40% in tax s pay 60%, tax b's pay 20%, I's pay 0 and I's of the investor. Yeah, yeah, Inside investor. People who buy stocks, bonds, mutual funds are free freaking losers.
Why?
Because you pay tax.
So do you not invest in the stock market at all?
No, my stock is there from my company. But it's tax free.
Yeah.
I'm an entrepreneur. I am not an employee. I was a stupid kid in school, flunked out so many times.
Do you think that made you a good entrepreneur?
Yeah, I had to.
Had to what?
What?
Cause you had no other choice.
I had to learn how to cheat. I'm here with my team right now. My attorneys, my accountants, my debt guys, my bankers. We operate as A team. Schools, teachers. Take tests on your own, right? I take my tests as a team. So when I was going after that gold mine in Utah, you think I could do it by myself? Even though it was the richest gold mine in the world, I had to go in with a big team. The average punter out there, oh, I can't afford it. But I used the profits from my real estate to raise $2 million to buy the gold mine. The average person, well, I can't afford it. They can't afford this. They cannot afford the gold mine. The entrepreneur can afford the gold mine. Legally. Please do it. I'm not Sam Bankman, Fried and FTX and all that other crypto crap. I have crypto, but I don't do. I do it honestly.
And have people not been chasing you to try and get some tax from you? You're a very public figure. Do they not, like, come knocking on your door?
That's a very good question. An audit is called an audit. I'm audited every year. Catch me. But audits keep you honest. If I was doing something illegal, like Sam Beckman Fried or Hillary, probably does Clinton and Obama, and this guy Biden is the worst. He steals this money. God almighty. But anyway, if I'm audited, I'm doing something wrong. I'll pay my tax. I don't want to go to jail and do the hula for some guy, you know.
Do you think a big recession is coming? Big, big, big. Bigger than big.
I think we're on the other side of this whole thing. It's the end of this. We're at the end of the American empire. The question is, is it China next? That's the question. There was a man named Buckminster Fuller. He met the geodesic domes and all that. He said civilization went in what he called a northwest spiral. So his prediction was it started in Thailand, came across Europe. So that's when the Middle east boomed. Then France boomed England boomed, US Boomed, Japan boomed China. That was Fuller's prediction. So I think it's true. But when I look at it, it seems to be that way. But China's in more trouble than we are. They have high unemployment, kids with no jobs, no financial education.
They say more millionaires are made in recessions. Do you think there's opportunity in the upcoming recession?
Of course. Yeah. Hey, I think this thing is 35 bucks today. I think in two years, it'll be 100 bucks.
Really?
That means it's going to take a. Today, it takes 35 of these to buy one of these in two years, it's going to take 100 of these to buy one of these.
And that could have gone down 15 to 20% with inflation.
That's what I mean. Which would you rather have today? Most people choose that. Sad, isn't it?
And where does bitcoin fit in all this?
Well, it's the same problem as fake money all over the world. I own bitcoin. I was fortunate enough because I took, you know, technical trading is watching market trends. So I studied for three years. Technical trading. Not very good at it. Real estate guy, real slow. And so I was watching bitcoin. It went from nothing to 20,000. I went, wow. Then it retraced back to nothing. And it started coming up, coming up, it picked up momentum. So I bought 60 bitcoin at 6,000. I stopped. So I'm in the money today.
Do you think it might become a relevant currency?
We'll see. I just know this is God's money. This is God's money was put here by God. Bitcoin is the blockchain technology. Blockchain makes it valuable because it's got integrity.
What if the governments create central digital currencies? What are your thoughts on those?
I'd still rather have this and this. I don't know what I understand. I could be wrong. Our freedom's gone. They can track you by this. Like right now, they use my credit card. Right. They know where I used it. So if you go to cbdc, Central bank, Digital currency.
That's tracking on another level, isn't it?
That's right.
Is that not 1984? George Orwell.
Yeah, that's why I'm saying this is the end of the American empire. But we don't know what the next one is.
Do you think we might go back to a gold standard, like evolution through de evolution?
We might. But my question is, I don't care what they're doing. I want to know what you're doing, what you're doing. So I'm doing this. So when I talk to my friends, I say, how much of this have you got? And how much of this have you got? Most people have a lot of this or debt. I'd rather have this. So the end result of buying property is to get back to this.
Yeah.
And pay no taxes.
And how old were you when you became a millionaire?
I don't really remember. I was just. It wasn't even in our minds. You know, my best friend and I. My best friend in 2020 sold his company for $2 billion. Since I'm a property guy. I didn't sell my properties. But we were just best friends. And we kicked each other's butts along. We played rugby together, we fought martial arts together. But one of the best assets you can have is your friend. So my friend and I always swore we'd be rich. And we just. We took courses. We studied, practiced, made mistakes. And we both met at Xerox. We called it Rank Xerox here. We both met at Xerox in 1974, and we just pushed each other along. And today we're multi billionaires.
So you're a billionaire in debt?
Yes. No. I own several tons of this. What's this worth?
Well, if an ounce is 2,200, someone can do the maths on that.
So I just stopped. This is a question. Okay. Everybody can afford this.
So that's a silver coin.
30, 35. Yeah. The average guy cannot buy the silver mine. Entrepreneurs buy the mine. So my mine is called Yamana own this.
But not in China.
No, no, Yamana's in Argentina. They played England the other night.
Yes, we just straight through.
And then this year is gold. I buy the mine. Now that's what entrepreneurs do. So the average person can afford this. But most people choose this. They'll save this. They'll work for this. They hang on to this. They will not trade this for this. Foreign.
This episode was brought to you by Disruptive Media, helping bold entrepreneurs stand out through podcasting, video and social content. Visit disruptive media.co.uk to learn more.
Foreign.
This episode was brought to you by Disruptive Media, helping bold entrepreneurs stand out through podcasting, video and social content. Visit disruptive media.co.uk to learn more.
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