102 - This Moved Me Round-Up: 100 Episodes of Moving Moments

Hi everybody. Who is this? This is Andy, Sally's husband. And you're not used to hearing this voice, any voice like this at the beginning of a This Move Me episode, but this is a very special episode of This Move Me because it's episode 100. So we decided to flip things, turn them around, mix things up a bit, and, uh, Sally became the interviewee. I was the interviewer, reflecting on the last 100 episodes of This Move Me. Uh, Sally has put a ton of time and work and energy and passion into building This Move Me podcast into what it was, and, um, we thought it was necessary and important to take a little moment and reflect back on how and why she got here. So I hope you all enjoy the conversation. I know Sally and I did. It's episode 100 of This Moved Me.

Hey everybody, and welcome to This Moved Me, a podcast about creating talks that move the world. With me, your host, Sally Koering Zimney. Together with some fabulous guests We will have a casual conversation about the art of public speaking. Because a good talk can move the world. And it'll be fun. Yeah, I would think making alien cows meaningful, that's not a small task. I love your giggle! Wow. Oh my gosh. Just waiting for everybody to figure out the alphabet.

So the tables have turned. The interviewer becomes the interviewee.

I know, I'm a little scared.

You're a little scared? Why are you scared?

Scared is too strong a word. Just, you know, it's walking into the unknown, which is exactly how all of my guests probably feel to some extent.

Well, yeah, we gotta imagine they, they feel at least as out of the loop as you are right now, right? Yeah, yeah, because it's your 100th episode.

It is. Yeah, I know. Can you believe it?

No, that's crazy. No, that's a lot of episodes.

I know it is. I, I did not think that I would get here.

You didn't think you would get to 100 episodes?

No.

Why not?

Um, well, it's so hard to see that far out into the future when you're focused on the next week, the next 2 weeks, and when, when the content schedule is as intense as I committed to it being.

Mm-hmm.

You're not even looking at the, at the big picture. It's just like, what's next, what's next, what's next? That kind of focus.

So, and then before you know it, and before I knew it, yeah, you've got a, a cent— what would it be? Uh, there's got to be some fancy word for more than a, like, fancier than 100 I'm trying to think, like, uh, like 10 is a decade. What's 100 or something?

I don't know.

Centet. You've got a centet of podcasts.

I don't know if that's a real thing, but let's go with it.

We kind of have a habit of making up words.

Yeah, that's fine.

Why don't we make it up?

Commit to it fully and then go with it.

Yeah, yeah, yeah.

I know. So that's— I, I wanted to pause and acknowledge it in some way. And I was like, I don't know what to do. I've kind of done the— I did my favorite This Moved Me moments, or not even favorites, but really, really memorable ones. And, and I've done the outtakes thing. And I was like, what, what can I do to recognize this and not bore people with— I don't know.

So we were just going to talk a little bit about reflecting on the 100 episodes. Yeah, the journey here. The journey, right? So you said you're surprised.

Because life is a journey. Someone said that once. Just kidding.

I bet a bunch of people said that at some point. Probably a bunch of speakers.

Probably a bunch of speakers.

A lot, a lot of commencement speakers. I bet you 60 5 to 68% of commencement speakers, which—

No!

Say life is a journey.

No!

No. We can do better than that. What percentage do you think it is? 30.

I mean, that's still too much.

Yeah. Then there's another 25 or 30%. If it's that low, the rest of them said something—

For sure.

Along those lines.

For sure. I mean, if we just said used clichés, then yes, let's go with 77.

I'm just thinking of like other like synonyms for journey.

I—

life is a voyage.

I was gonna try and riff on other ones. I can't think of any right now.

Life is a shuttle expedition. Chocolates. Yeah. Um, so you're surprised you got to 100. So let's drill down that beyond just the quantity. What, what is— what's been surprising about the last, uh, so it's like a couple years, right?

A year and a half or a year.

Yeah, right. Yeah, because you've been doing— start doing two of them a week. But anyway, what's, what's been, um, most surprising along the way? You know, it's happened that you didn't expect to happen.

I did not expect to love it as much as I did. I kind of initially got into it thinking that, uh, it would be a great way for me to share my expertise, and I knew that I could do it. I knew I had the skills to do it. It was sort of like, I don't know, let's try this. And I thought, uh, it would be interesting and for, for people who are listening. But I didn't think I would enjoy it as much as I did. But I truly love these conversations. I love— I hang up, you know, when I'm having a conversation with somebody, I hang up and I'm like, oh my gosh, like that literally— I mean it when I'm like, that was delightful. And I realize I end probably half my shows going, that was such a delightful conversation.

Do you think there's something about the— that it's a podcast? Is— are they delightful in a different way than a conversation to have just with somebody at the coffee shop?

Um, well, there's a different sort of intentionality there. I mean, I think people show up and bring their A-game, you know, so it—

so there is a sense of, um, showmanship is true urgency because, um, well, just because at a certain time you're gonna turn the recorders off.

Yeah, I don't— I mean, perhaps, but more it's just the focus of the You know, one of the things that evolved and changed as the show went on is at first I was really trying to be really strict on time and format. And as things evolved and I realized sometimes, first of all, the process of editing out if I was like, oh, I need to lose 7 minutes, that became so painful and time-consuming. And ultimately, I didn't feel like it was worth it. And that I realized I can loosen that, I can have a 43-minute conversation. If it's a good conversation, that's great. Um, that doesn't have to be less worthwhile than a 25-minute conversation. So, um, yeah, I— partly out of necessity, but also just a realization that sometimes these conversations take that path, and that's okay. It's kind of Sort of like when, when you show up to speak, you have to let it also— along with planning and being strategic and being prepared, you also have to let it be what it is. So there's some of that, right?

Letting it be what it is. Yeah, see where it takes you, right?

And I kind of like not knowing. I mean, I have to do a lot of assuring my guests sometimes that I give them a handful of questions that I might ask. I would say 10% of the time I actually ask those questions.

Really? Yeah. But you still send out the questions.

Well, and I tell them this will help you prepare for the conversation. Right. And I use this as sort of a guide, but on the whole, I, um, I let the conversations go where I'm interested in seeing them go and kind of digging in.

Um, so what— so we were talking about surprises. What about— so like, you've learned that you— it's a lot more fun than you thought.

I like it.

Um, have you— what, what's some of the big things you just learned about your craft? And, um, you know, as you're engaged in this mission to move people, what have you learned about moving people from this movie podcast?

You know, I think one of the surprising things is that the people— sometimes the people who are really doing the most moving, like, that are, I think, really engaged in the craft of it and really thoughtfully, really believing in the possibility of that, are some people who don't have the huge resume, right? That, that aren't aren't the professional speakers, that aren't, you know, the big names. But some of the most enlightening conversations I've had where I've thought, wow, this is really thoughtful and interesting, were from people who just— they themselves are so invested in the craft of it and love it. And don't love it because it's for the showmanship of it, but love it because they believe in it. And that, that was—

you said they're investing in the craft, or they invest in the craft, or they're invested in a message.

I think, uh, you know, there's been both. There's some people who are really invested in the message and are learning the craft and, and engaged in that process of it.

Yeah.

And are honest about what's hard for them about that. And then there are some people who have invested in the craft because they believe in their message so much, right?

So, but so what's the common denominator with the folks who maybe aren't, uh, is it, uh, I'm trying to— the distinction, is it the amateurs? Not necessarily, no, but not the Not as notable.

I have found myself when looking for guests and looking for people who I think would be valuable to bring on the show, I have found myself steering away from the like big-time keynote speaker who literally is a professional speaker. That's their job. And there's something worthwhile there, and I've had some great conversations there, but I've just found, in the people that I have talked to, a little different take on, you know, I am not, it's probably my own bias because I myself am not interested nor am I an expert at the business of becoming a public speaker. It's not my expertise. I am interested in the things that I have found most wonderful about these conversations, the craft of it, and why we do it. You know, I don't, I don't know how to help you get more gigs, and I don't know how to help you earn more money doing what you do. And some people want that and need that, and that's just not what I bring to the table. And so really what I found is that there's this emotional journey that's the underpin of all this work, like who we are as speakers and our development and our process and our growth that is part and parcel to the growth of your message and what that is and how you bring it out into the world. And I find that really, really fun to talk about and interesting.

And so as you're talking, I'm wondering, do you think the, um, the mission of this movement has changed or evolved at all, or—

No, I think I've gotten clearer on it and, and, um, let go, uh, kind of found my niche within this niche. And this is a pretty small niche, so to like niche down even farther is pretty— I don't know— pretty remarkable. But it's, you know, if I— when I listen to other public speaking podcasts which might be more— I do some skills-based work, like the Mini Move Me's are about skills and how we can get better at the craft, but my guest conversations are not about that on the whole. And so yeah, I just, I've kind of gotten comfortable with this is my thing and that's not my thing. That's okay.

Yeah, yeah. Um, so you said you, you did some shows on like your favorite moments, but because it's your 100th episode, um, I can't—

don't make me pick a favorite. I can't pick a favorite.

Well, what's a, what's a moment that comes to mind that—

well, I mean, I was like giddy out of my mind excited to talk with Dan Pilata.

Yeah.

So that, that's kind of been a highlight. I think he was like, whoa, this girl is too much for me, because I was like, oh my gosh, I'm so excited to talk to you, and I, you have no idea, I just, I really love your talk, it was so great. And I was like gushed all over, and really, that's not cool. I didn't play it cool remotely. There was no, there was no like, I am your peer, Well, there was none. I was like, you're the best, I love your talk, it's so good, oh my gosh.

This positivity and affirmation are some of your, your, uh, greatest strengths, right? And then you just saw those get jammed up, overdrive, way too much.

And at some point in the conversation, I remember I kind of heard him laugh a little bit, like like, whoa, dial it down. But he didn't say that, but that's what I was hearing in his response. I was like, okay, be professional, ask him something good. Like, don't just tell him how awesome you think, right, his talk is, because I do, I do think it's awesome, and I just seen it live. After having been moved by it so much on watching it on the internet as a TED Talk and listening to it on the TED Radio Hour. And every time I was like, whoa, I just thought it was so good. So that's kind of a favorite moment and simultaneously a cringeworthy moment. Like, maybe we'd go about that differently if I did that again.

Yeah, well, okay, so that's— so what's been, um, what's been the hardest thing?

Or— oh yeah, yeah, go ahead. I hope it's okay to say this, but we can edit it. I had, I had some— I had a really, um, he's never gonna listen to this, so I can probably say it, but my Julian Treasure interview was really hard. It's a really challenging interview, um, and that was another one that I felt really excited about, and it took me months of trying to convince his PR people or whatever to have him on the show.

Um, so what was hard about it?

He never warmed up to me. It felt like we didn't quite connect And those conversations are really hard, I think, for anybody at any time. And I feel like that's something that I naturally do, and usually just like, hey, I can meet you where you're at and find a quick connection.

And it didn't work.

It didn't work. Yeah, I'm talking about all of my failings.

No, you're not. This is, this is the first failing that you talked about. Well, I suppose you're talking about being too positive sometimes. My biggest fault is I'm too positive and I work too hard, and 1 out of 100 people don't connect with me instantly. Those are my biggest faults.

There you go. Uh, those are not my biggest faults.

That was hard.

What about way bigger ones?

Uh, because I'm always interested in the, the fear. What's, what's been the scariest um, things to deal with in doing this?

Well, just the battles internally of the same things we all face whenever we're creating something and putting it out there is what will people think, and will people like this, and is it valuable. Um, which is why when people reach out and send me a message or send me an email I feel really honored by that and so gratified by it because this is such isolating, isolated work. You know, I'm in my little office. I'm not talking face-to-face with people. It's happening over Skype. It's, you know, I'm such a people person. So I send it out there knowing like it's going out, people are listening. I see the download numbers. Like, I know people are taking it in, which is really important to me because that's the point. It's like connect. I want it to connect with people. So when I hear from somebody, I'm just like, take it in and hold it in my heart and print it off and look at it. And like, and as you mentioned, I am kind of an affirmations person, so It, yeah, it means so much. What was the question? Did I answer it?

Kind of, yeah. I was just, I was, I was just reflecting on, on, on, hmm, is she answering the question? It was what, I mean, it was sort of, you were telling me, yeah, like what's scary about it.

Yeah.

And you were, I mean, you started to talk about how just anytime you're putting something out there, um, it's still scary.

I mean, it's so much work. And if I didn't enjoy it, and if I didn't feel like it had helped— this whole experience has helped me connect with a community of people that I would not have connected with otherwise. Just, you know, I feel like I have some friends out there in the whatever internet world that I would never have met unless through this show. So that makes it worthwhile. Um, but it's a lot of work, and so it can— you can just get like tossed around by watching download numbers and how many people clicked on it and how many people whatever liked it on— that stuff is crappy and horrible, and I hate that, but it's part of it.

So, right, so I'm kind of getting back to where you're going with the affirmations piece is as soon as you have a very visible scorecard on anything, and then once you give that the power of your measure of whether or not what you're doing is worthwhile, if it's affirming, right? Yeah, it gets dicey. Um, so So what's, what's next, do you think? As you're thinking about the next 100 episodes. Mm-hmm.

Well, this is a good question, Andy.

Yeah.

I'm not sure.

Do you—

I'm playing with maybe dialing back from 2 shows a week to 1. Yeah. And I'd love people's thoughts on that.

Yeah.

If people have strong feelings about that, only because I, I have created so much content and there's such good stuff out there that I think there's more I can do with what I have and what I have created. So if I can slow that process down a little bit, I think I might be able to bring more people into the community, right, into this moved me. So maybe thinking about doing some YouTube stuff. I'm thinking about creating some— I'm really, really, really excited about this, and I almost hesitate to say it because it's off in the future, but I really want to create a intensive, personalized, like, lab experience for 7 people maybe, and bring them in and hang out with you, hang out with me, and we workshop your talks. We take it from the good work you're doing to polished and wow and connection and authenticity and you standing in your story in a way that feels really good and really right. Um, and I just had a vision about it a few weeks ago, and I was like, oh, that's what I want to do. So, um, it's out there. It's an idea right now, but I'm really excited about that. So there's some other things I want to do, and the— I will always have the podcast as long as people still find it valuable, but it— I may be adding some other things into the mix.

What about as far as the podcast goes? Do you have, um, some dream guests?

Oh my gosh, yes.

Who's on your— I was listening to Chris Hardwick on, uh, The Nerdist the other day, and he was talking about how he's got— he has— he's had Bill Murray's phone number. For months and months and months and months, but he hasn't worked up the courage to call it yet.

Yeah, I've got 4 dream guests, actually 5, and literally I've gotten so close to reaching out to them, but you know, fear. Yeah, here's the fear thing. Okay, so I want to— I mean, how great would it be to have Brené Brown on the show and talk about vulnerability? Yeah. Hello, Brené! It'd be so great. Glennon Doyle Melton. I love her dearly, and she's been talking— I pitched her, so if she's listening to this or if anybody out there has a connection to her, I did send her because she's coming to Minnesota and I'm going to see her speak. And I was like, you're gonna be here, I'd love to talk with her. She talks about how she has grown into speaking, but she still battles fear with it. I'm like, ooh, let's talk about that. I would love that. I would love to have Rob Bell on the show. I've become a huge Rob Bell fan and love his— the way that he connects to audience. I think that would be amazing. And Elizabeth Gilbert. Hello, big magic, creativity. Let's talk about the roadblocks to bringing our work out into the world. Hello. Uh, can you tell how excited I am?

No.

I was like, what?

Yeah, no, I can tell. Okay, that's a good list.

I know there's more. Those are the kind of big ones. Cheryl Strayed. Yeah, she's a Minnesota gal. You see, she's a Minnesota gal. Did I say that like as Minnesota as possible? Yep. You know, creative geniuses.

Well, of course, Barack Obama.

Yeah, well, yeah, I'd want to talk to Barack about authenticity.

Mm-hmm. Mm-hmm. Sounds like you've got some notes for him.

I've got some notes. Yeah, for Barack.

Mm-hmm.

Because I spotted Barack.

I spot Abraham Lincoln. You should interview Abraham Lincoln.

Yeah, sure.

He was a respected speaker in his day. Yep.

Yep.

Much higher voice than people think.

Really?

Oh yeah. Yep. Everyone like—

Are you making this up right now?

No, no. Everyone imagined he had like this deep gravelly voice, but he was actually known for having a very high-pitched kind of screechy voice.

Seriously?

Yeah. But still, people would come from everywhere to hear him speak. Yeah, I guess before he was like a president, like he was just like when he was traveling as a lawyer. Yeah, yeah. People would just show up at the bar because they wanted to hear him tell stories.

Wow, tell stories. Not even like public policy kind of known as a really great storyteller. Oh my gosh, I guess I need to do some Abraham Lincoln research.

Yeah, yeah, cool.

Good to know. Yeah, and I, I think if I— and I'm not convinced that I will dial back I usually dial back for the summer, and we're getting close to summer, so I, I— last summer I took a few months off. I'm probably not going to do that, but I want to open up some space for some more creative projects. Um, yeah, my kids are around all the time, so I can't imagine being quiet enough to do any kind of recording, but, um I don't remember why I started talking about that. Okay, great.

Well, you're just talking about what's next. Yeah, whatever it is, it'll be exciting. It'll be great.

I have a bajillion ideas. I am never short on ideas. Yeah, well, which is part of the reason why this is such a huge deal, because as you know, Andy, I've got a ton of ideas and I start projects. I'm a great starter. I'm like, woo! Yeah!

So this is why 100 episodes is a big deal.

Yes! Yeah, consistency, man. Yeah, pat myself on the back. Focused. I'm focused, and I committed to it, and I did it.

That was a high five, people. Well, congratulations. It's pretty awesome.

Thank you.

Nice work.

What was your favorite episode, Andy?

What was my favorite episode? Um, you had that guy who spoke about the creative process. That was nice, huh?

You haven't listened to any, have you?

No, I have listened to— yes, I have. I have.

What's your favorite one?

I haven't listened to— I haven't listened to some of the recent ones. Um, well, I enjoyed, you know, I will say that, um, because I did listen to your interview with John Capecci because I met John and there were tidbits in that that I use.

Yeah, you still talk about that. So great.

Yeah, so, um, yeah, so that was helpful.

It's great.

Um, yeah, what else? What are the other ones that I enjoyed? I don't know, you need like a guest list for me to—

I'll let you off the hook.

Yeah.

You know, you've known many of the guests who I've had on the show too.

So yeah, I sent some guests your way.

Many, many guests. Yeah, and there have been a handful of people out there who have sent me guests and who have sent me questions, who have been so supportive and reached out on social media, who have connected with me in, in this wonderful, profound way. And I'm so grateful for every single one of those people because it has helped me keep going and keep doing the— this work. And I, I, you know, it's so good to know that you have an audience and that someone's listening, right?

Right. Yeah, one that's certainly been one of the lessons I've taken the last couple years as I'm building some other projects. You go into it thinking like you're doing it all on your own, and then you realize, well, it says, yeah, the whole kind of paradox of, um, you like, in the end, you can't do it outside of community. Period. Like, and you're building the community as you go, but you also, you need to lean into the community, right? Especially when you're trying to move— I mean, you're trying to move people. It's all about people.

It's all about people. And I love people. I want to feel connected and be connected to people, right? It's really important to me. So I just want to send out my thanks to those people, and you know who you are, because I hopefully have let you know how much I appreciate everything that you've done to stay connected with me and to share. This moved me because I think it has moved me, really, honestly, it has moved me to watch the— and see how people have intersected with the show, like that something has struck them. To be connected to people from all over the world. How cool is that?

It's super cool.

From my tiny little office here in St. Paul.

Yeah.

Love it.

All right.

Okay.

It was great. Nice work.

Thanks for interviewing me.

My pleasure.

Beep boop. So what do you think?

Where will the journey take us?

Where? It's a dest— not a destination.

There you go.

Anyway, what do you think I should do? Like, what's the I told you, Abraham Lincoln. Right, right.

I mean—

Do you have any contacts? Any way I could get a hold of him?

Um, yes, I do.

This is where we are. Mm-hmm.

Meat room.