172: MMM - On How to Create a Spectacular Event, with Todd Hansen and Sarah Gillund

Hey everybody, and welcome to This Moved Me, a podcast about creating talks that move the world. With me, your host, Sally Koering Zimney. Together with some fabulous guests, we will have a casual conversation about the art of public speaking because a good talk can move the world and it'll be fun. Yeah, I would think making alien cows Meaningful. That's not a small task. I love your giggle. Wow.

Oh my gosh.

So we're waiting for everybody to figure out the alphabet.

Oh wow.

It sounds like we're on the road. Here.

You're going to hand it around? Yeah, we're going to hand it around.

Bit.

Just a little bit. Okay, cuz if we—

here.

Oh, let me try this. Do it in the round.

Yeah, this thing sucks. That must be working if it's hard to turn.

There. Oh, see, that's a little better.

Yeah, here we can— should we try to set up a—

yeah, set it up there. And, and I probably can— oops, bonk.

I don't know, we might have to, or I can move this. Yeah.

Ow! Are you okay?

Yeah, I'm okay.

Do you need to stop the car?

Sorry, Sally.

Outtakes.

Oh yeah, okay.

Take 1, outtakes. Oh, but maybe— look at this, look at that, look at what we can do.

This is going to work. Yay!

What if I do this so I'm really— yeah, yeah, you know, I could die.

Get in there, get on in there.

What better way, you know, as we talk about death stories, it'd be good to be like, oh yeah, you died doing a podcast. It was so unusual.

But I'm going to try to keep most of my focus.

Yeah, you do that and then I might—

we'll just call you like the peanut guy.

I was like, oh yeah, there's peanut gallery driving.

Oh, see, that sounded pretty good, did it?

Except yeah, she almost went off the road. Oh no, no, that's okay. Okay, you made it weird.

So you guys, here, here's kind of what I'll do.

Kind of—

there's definitely a low roar that's underneath this, but, uh, it'll be—

I think so you want to do a little bit and see if it's going to be worth it, or else you're going to be like I'm not going to do this.

We could do this in the hotel room too.

Oh, we could.

Yeah, with cocktails.

Yeah, that would be fun. I just said that.

Ding ding ding.

Oh, we could do the intro.

Yeah, we could do the intro. Okay, so here we are.

Near the road.

We're on the road. It's Todd.

Yes.

And Sarah. Say something, Sarah.

Hi, I'm Sarah.

That would be that awkward thing you were talking about earlier. Charmingly awkward, I'd say.

That's what I just wanted.

Yeah, awkward charm. We're talking about our personal brand, Sarah's Awkward Charm.

Wait, are you recording right now?

Yes, but that was so awkwardly charming. It was okay. What we're talking about, what we're gonna be talking about in a little bit, we're gonna record something later. We're on a road trip to an event that the three of us have pulled together, and this is just speaking from, this is my dream event team, right? I love these people.

We've—

Todd, you and I have worked together for a long time. How long?

13+ years.

Yeah, 13 years. Really long time. Yep. Todd is like the guru producer man, uh, and creative confidant, cohort, comrade.

You keep looking at me like I might say yes to those things.

I know, I'm looking for a better word, but you probably know what I do better than I do, so— Yeah. And Sarah is our communications creative Visual design, brilliant messaging writer, all kinds of stuff.

That doesn't leave much for you to do.

I know, what do I do?

Hard to say.

I think you do podcasts.

I do podcasts.

I'm the moral cheerleader.

No, more—

not the moral cheerleader. I just mean like the—

You are a messaging guru too. You cheer people on, you coach us to be better.

You build themes through programs and take speakers from insane amounts of words to less words.

Less words, more meaning. Yes. But it is a very collaborative experience. And last week we had a huge event, our 30th event for this organization, Youth Frontiers, that we've all worked at for a long time. And that has been a big part of my life and all of yours. So it was a really big deal. And I feel like— and we're heading off to do another event for Youth Frontiers.

We're on the road.

You can hear We are in the car right now. This is not post-production road sounds put in. This is authentic live road.

Live road.

Live road.

But I thought since we're the three of us together and we have maybe have a little space, we could do this. We could talk about what makes an awesome event. So that's what we're gonna do because I know if you're listening to this podcast, you're probably involved in events. You might speak at events. You You want to speak at more events, and you may be a part of pulling one together. And if you're not, you're working with people who are. And these are all really good things to think about so that you can really make the most of the moments that you have on stage. Yeah?

Yeah!

And/or you can be really critical of other events when you go to them and say, "Oh, that's why that's not happening." It's also fun! Yeah, yeah.

Yeah! Okay, great. Alright, we'll do that later. All right, so here we are.

We are.

Todd, Sally Koering Zimney. We're off the road.

Yes, we are.

We're here in a fancy schmancy hotel, the Pfister.

Pfister.

Founded by Mr. Pfister.

I didn't say anything.

Mr. Pfister.

Mr. Pfister.

We believe it's named Mr. Pfister.

Mr. Pfister. Mr. Pfister. Oh my gosh. And what I think you're going to experience in the next 20 or so minutes is the creative buzz that happens, not just when you have some wine, but also when you get people together who feel that sort of freeness and openness together to create and ideate and just dive in and have fun, which is part of what we do together.

Yes.

And part of, I think, why our retreats are our retreats.

I mean, experiences.

Our experiences, our events, I think have been so successful is because of the collaboration that happens here.

Yes.

And we've had other people who step in and have been brilliant ideators and creators with us too. But for the last several years, it's been the three of us. And there's a little note.

Building castles in the sky. Oh, that's the two of us.

Sorry. Oh, okay.

Yep. Just the two of us.

Oh gosh, sorry.

I knew the lyrics.

You know what? I'm impressed with that.

Yeah, that'll be evident.

Can you cut that out?

Yep, I can. Let me just make a mark. At 5 minutes, cut Todd.

Keep that pen handy. Just keep that pen handy.

Cool, okay.

Okay, so the frame of this conversation, because we've had so much experience putting on events together and we have, we've earned, we think we've earned ourselves a reputation. We think so.

We hear that a lot. It's your podcast.

No, I've decided.

I've decided.

But we hear this from a lot of people that there's a really unique approach that we've built and that, and I will say this, I really believe this, they're the best of the best. A bajillion, that's an actual number, a bajillion events.

It's true.

It's true. In my life and I've learned a ton and we've gotten better and better and better. And so what I wanna talk about is what makes an event spectacular. What is the special sauce that we have created as a team that is in the room that day? Like there's all kinds of elements that it takes to pull something like this off. So what does it take? So we're each going to share 3 things that have come to us that we feel like is part of that special sauce. And then we'll see where the conversation goes.

Great.

Okay. So Todd, I'm going to have you start because you are the producer. So before you dive into your 3 things, tell a little bit about what that is, because not all places and organizations and event centers have a producer like this. So what do you do?

Well, I always see it as the person who just makes sure all the pieces are moving forward. But I do some things, but I mainly make sure everyone's doing what they're supposed to do and trying to bring on the talent where it needs to be brought on and make sure the communication's happening where it needs to happen.

Yeah.

And just moving the whole thing along.

Great. But one of the things I think that is unique about you in particular is you are the— that person who's organized and planful and you've got a really clear how, like how is this going to happen, and you have a plan, but you also have this, you have a performance background. You're an actor, professional actor, and improviser, and mime.

So many talents.

So many talents.

The best mime some have ever had, I've been told.

But I won't brag. Right? So I mean, you have a really unique combination of skills that I think plays a part in your vision and your approach. Approach on this stuff.

Yeah, yeah. I mean, there's a couple— there's creative producers and there's line producers, and line producers are much more about the logistics and the organizational element, but then creative producers— so I would say there's a combination of that that's happening.

So, which is unique and valuable.

Oh, okay, I'm glad you think so. I'll keep working with you.

Yes, yes. Okay, so Todd, what are your 3 areas?

Yeah, so the, the 3 that I came up with on the road, if were pre-production, and then in the program itself it's about—

okay, well let's just—

oh, oh, not all three, just one.

Yeah, I want you to tell me your first one.

Pre-production.

What does that mean?

Well, unfortunately my whole life breaks down into pre-production, production, and post-production. Um, but pre-production is the, uh, the work you do before you get to the event, before you get to the actual day. And, um, so that's like, well, duh, you have to do something before get there. But what I guess what I want to emphasize is the need or the importance for a quality event to do as much as you can before you get to the day. As much of the thinking through of the details of what you might need, what might happen, what might not happen. Um, uh, yeah, backup plans a little bit. I'm not obsessed with like 7 different backup plans, but you know, just as much as you can do ahead of time to onboard people who are going to be there, to know what what the program looks like. So, um, building ramps, I guess, is another way to put it. I like to use that language, like, how do you ramp on people to the event so that, um, day of, you know, when you're putting together an event, there's always going to be something that you don't expect. There's— you, you can't— you just can expect there'll be something unexpected. So as much as you can do ahead of time, um, to think through, um, concerns, issues, details, you won't have to deal with those that day. I guess that's That's the biggest thought on that.

Right, right. So just to pivot on that.

To say it better than me? Go ahead.

No, no, that's not what I'm gonna do.

I'm curious from a speaker perspective. So knowing that a lot of people listening to this come to the conversation as maybe an element of the program or a part of the program. So if as a producer, as in like thinking pre-production, what are some things that speakers need to be thinking about from a pre-production standpoint? Like what are the questions they should ask or of an event space?

Well, I think, yeah, I mean, or a producer, it could be all, I mean, all sorts of things. Like even, you know, like how, what sort of microphone you're going to have, um, what sort of support you're going to have, whether it's, um, text on the stage or a confidence monitor, or, you know, like how is, how are you going to be, excuse me, supported in that process? Where you're speaking falls in the arc of the event, like understanding what your role is in it. I mean, I know you're, you know, you know you're speaking, but what does the event need from you at that point. So the more you're willing to understand that, I think you do yourself and the event a service to understand your role in it. And back at you, I mean, you provide that support in our organization for people coming. Take that support. If someone in your organization is willing to support you as a speaker, I would suggest you take it, you know, at least take the advice. You don't have to do everything they do, but at least take the opportunity. So that would be your pre-production, I would say, as a speaker.

Great. Okay, cool. Okay, so that's your first one, pre-production. What's number 2?

Number 2 would be beginnings, transitions, and endings. So I would say that I think you probably speak about that even to speakers.

I do, I do a lot.

So yours, your work is, I will say, a micro, but like the speaker has a role within the presentation, but expand that to the whole event. And just think about this. We were talking about this a little bit on the road on the way in here, is you want the audience to feel confident and trust, trust the program. If you've ever been in a program where you're like, oh, I'm not sure what's happening, do they know what they're doing? You've lost them, you know. So, so a strong beginning, or like, oh, this is when the program starts. It's very obvious, it's very clean. Um, it's, uh, you know, you're, you're being brought into an event, and then the transitions are important. Um, it's what happens between between each element of the event. Do people know where they're going off? Do they know what mic they're grabbing? Do they have the, the plaque they need? Whatever. I mean, if you've ever been to these things and someone's like, okay, wait, Jim, we— okay, sorry, no, not that much. You know, it's like, what? You know, like, just hadn't someone figured out these transitions ahead of time? I'm sorry if that's you, but, uh, you know, it's just, it's so much— it just takes a little time to figure out the transitions, whether there's music involved. We, we tend to like to use music sometimes to keep momentum in the room in a transition. So transitions are important, and then a strong ending. Just know how you're, how you're ending it, you know, that it's very clean and clear and it's an out and you're, and you're done. Um, the other stuff happens in between, but if you can— and some of those other things you can't control, like if someone's— if you have a guest speaker, if you— so I'm talking to someone who's producing event, you don't know what they're gonna do, but you can at least control the transitions in the beginnings and the ends, and that, that'll help your professional look.

And I've always said that a strong beginning and a strong and smooth transitions can cover up a lot of messy middles. A multitude of sins, yes. And a multitude of sins, absolutely. Because people forget quickly, they will, and all of those pieces create a polish and a feel that helps your audience trust. Like, they've got us here, this is not a mess. You know, it keeps them engaged and we're safe.

We're safe too.

Yeah, totally. Okay, so that's your second. And your third?

And the third one I, I'll put, uh, in there is, um, different delivery methods of content, variety of content. I've always been— this is maybe the theatrical background— variety show, um, oleos, you know, like, um, this isn't unlike the work we do in our retreats where we, we change things every 15 minutes, but yeah, changing Changing voices, changing ways of presenting. So, you know, we use video. Sarah, you'll hear from, helps create a lot of our video content. We use some audio stuff. We use music. We use speakers. We've even done sketches, you know, like, but just varying the way you're delivering your message makes it much more enjoyable, I think, for an audience member.

I totally agree with you. Is there a point at which it can go too far?

Alley-oop!

Is never too much?

Well, we have experienced that, haven't we?

In our 13+ years of doing this, yeah, I mean, there was times where we had like parades going on where it's like another thing and another thing. And yeah, either too many messages or too many voices or too many events or too many, you know, segments to an event. Yeah, so I think we have gotten cleaner and refined that to try to keep a simpler message. But so there's a balance, there's a healthy tension, but yeah, definitely variety. Yes, it's helpful.

Okay, awesome.

And that helps transitions too. I mean, those they follow into each other's because if you're using video you can transition between speakers and have an opportunity to set people up to look better.

Yeah, mm-hmm, yeah. And I do think one of the unique things that I think people underestimate is thinking of the program from a more theatrical perspective. Not that it can't be really conversational, but using lights and when the lights come up and the music for transitions and all the kind of mood setting stuff that's important.

And I think people learn in different ways too. So I am not a great auditory listener always to people on stage. Like I can zone out pretty easily, but if there's visuals up there on the screen, if it keeps changing the way it's presented the same message, then I'm much more likely to remember what it was versus—

Spoken from a true designer.

Yeah, I am a designer. So obviously I'm a mostly visual learner, but I think if it's only presented in one way, people are likely to forget and not keep that message with them.

Totally. Awesome. Okay, Todd, thank you.

I can leave now?

Yeah, get out of here.

Get out of here. All right, Sarah, we just heard from you a little bit. Yes. Yes, you are a designer by trade and profession.

Yep, and I'm also in marketing. So I'm the communications and marketing manager at Youth Frontiers, so I wear many different hats in that position.

Position. And we pulled you into the event process 4 years ago? Yeah, it was probably about 4 years ago.

I've been at Ace Frontiers for 6 years.

Yeah, something like that.

Yeah, all right. And initially, because you know, you need communications so much for an event, obviously. I mean, you need communications. As somebody who was in communications for a while, you realize they are at the heart of everything. I think it's the most underappreciated under—

Thank you.

No, wait, is that good?

Is that bad?

Because good communications can make a huge difference in every aspect of an organization or company. So I'm just a huge believer in it and know how hard it is because you're managing so many different needs and priorities and stakeholders and, and trying to like find clarity in all of that. So you brought this really wonderful expertise, of course, as a designer and thinking visually and helping us totally uplevel the communication side of things, like the technical communication side of it. But then you also have this wonderful little creative, playful idea person in you too, which, you know, many communications people do have, but I feel like you have this nice balance. You're not just technically accurate, you know, but also this wonderful team player in the creative process.

Yeah, I love being on a team. It's my favorite way to work.

So what are your 3 recommendations or the 3 pieces for special sauce?

Well, my special sauce, I guess.

It's a 9-part recipe. 9-part recipe for it.

I like this.

And special sauce.

Let's sell this.

My first one would be consistency. So that could be—

You say that all the time.

I do, and I mean that in— Yeah, just in— Okay, never mind.

Can you cut that?

So even from the first time audience member gets the save the date to the follow-through at the end of the event thanking them, if everything can be kind of a consistent message and we can bring the audience along, like, that's amazing. It doesn't always happen, but we try our best to do that. And so not just the words and the messaging that's within those communications, but also just the visuals of it too, to take the audience along that journey as well. And if we can get the speakers to kind of keep with that through line as well, it's not always possible, but we try our best. And so— That is the truth. And I think we're getting better and better at it each year, kind of just guiding people along like this is the message we're trying to get across to our audience and just keeping it simple. That's another thing that I like to do just with messaging and design. I think people are much more likely to remember something if it's simple and beautifully spoken. Really easy to do.

What has been your favorite event message? Like if you think about a consistent message, an event that we did together? Really simple. Successfully pulled together.

I think our Ethical Leadership Luncheon this past December. We always bring in a keynote speaker and this past year it was Tim Welsh and he just was really on board with you coaching him right away and he had this message of kindness and how kindness is a good thing and it often gets a bad rap for being too soft. At Youth Ranches we're all about care character, and so that message really just connected well with what we do every day. I mean, we have a kindness retreat for 4th and 5th graders, and so that really connected well. And since we've been doing the Ethical Leadership Luncheon, that was our 9th one, we just— that's a well-oiled machine of like when things— when people first get that save the date or corporate sponsorship materials to the very end, and we just keep tweaking and making a little bit better each year. So yeah, I think that was well done.

Yeah, I agree. I— and, and Tim was so open to what we were creating, and that makes all the difference.

Yeah, and that's a speaker too who came to an event and said, I have ideas, but what, what's the event? And like, how do I bring it together?

Right?

Yeah.

So yeah, and he was so open to me, which is huge because I, I have opinions.

What?

And I have things to offer, but not everybody is open to it, which I also get. You know, oftentimes our speakers are busy people, right, who have offered their time and energy, and then here's me saying, um, would you—

how about this, or consider this, you know, spend a little more time on this, a little more time, more pre-production time.

Okay, so your first one is consistent message.

And I know when we talked earlier too, my second one was going to be about variety, which I also agree is super important. But since Todd already spoke to that, I think the other thing I would talk about is just killing your darlings, like letting go of the things that originally you loved. Like maybe you brainstorm this really great idea and you're like, "This is gonna be amazing," but then the more you kind of poke at it, you're like, "This doesn't fit." Yeah. And being able to let go of that is sometimes hard, but I think the more The more you do it and the more you just do creative work, you get better at it. But it is a process and sometimes it's harder. That's a great one.

It is.

It is.

And that's like everything from like what you were talking about, like this person introducing this person introducing that person. It's like your darlings might be those people that you want to honor, but having 4 people introduce 1 person, it's like nobody wants to see that. And/or creative ideas. I mean, we just went through that this year for sure. We had like some creative ideas, we're like, oh, that doesn't work, it's not gonna work, it's not gonna happen.

Yeah, yeah, yeah.

So it, it is this balance of, of moving through the process a little bit because there's so many people who you're trying to, um, not please is the wrong word, but yeah, or you feel responsible to many, many different people. And, and on top of that, you're trying create something, uh, that has a mind of its own in a lot of ways. So finding that balance is really hard. Okay, I really like that one. Kill your darlings.

Yes. Um, and then, uh, the last one, um, so we as a team of three, we kind of lead these events, but there's so many other people involved. Um, it really takes a village to get these events done and produced and happen well. Um, so I think just leaning leaning into people's strengths, like figuring out what people are really good at and being like, "Great, you're good at this. Can you take this on?" And just not being afraid to ask for help because you can't just carry it all on your shoulders. That's like setting yourself up for failure. So just lean on people's strengths, ask for help.

It's an incredible team effort. I'm hopping back to Todd for a quick second because you send out about, you know, onboarding all these people who have not been a part of the process of building this event, but the day of we need them to show up and execute and be totally on board with this thing that they haven't been a part of. And can you talk a little bit about your approach in bringing people in so that they're in the right place to dive in?

Yeah, well, I mean, Sarah's right, it's about looking around around you and going, okay, what are the strengths? And everybody wants, well, most people want to help, especially doing something they think they'll be successful at. So, you know, to Sarah's point, like, look around you and go, oh, in our organization, it might seem like a trivial thing, like, oh, they won't want to do this. Like, Peggy's really good at organizing food and she loves to provide, you know, lay out a table. And it's like, yeah, you do that for the staff because you, you're good at it and you enjoy it, you know. So it's, yeah, so, am I answering your question? That's part of it, looking around the room, and then, so, I assign people things and then I give them a written idea of what the role is so they can read it and go, okay, what am I being asked to do? And then if there are subgroups of people that have certain activities, whether they're greeters or something like that, sometimes then I'll just send a communication to that group. So there'll be the mass communication to everyone with assignments so they understand what their roles are, and then within groups I'll do like, okay, hey group, this is a little bit more detail about how I think your role's gonna play out. So, yeah, that's part of the approach.

But you say something in that email, and I don't remember exactly what it is, but it's like, show up.

Present, prepared, and—

Present, prepared, I don't know. Bring your best.

Punctual, present, prepared. I don't know. I use that phrase a lot, the 3 Ps.

It's really stuck with me.

It's really effective.

It's really impactful.

And I mean, straight up, I copy and paste that email every year now, so I don't necessarily, I haven't read it, because it's like, oh, this worked well, so I'm not gonna reinvent the wheel here. Yeah, I mean, I thank people in advance for being, yeah, I think I say thanks for being where you need to be, —and solving problems. Yes. Thanks for being ahead of us.

Thank you in advance for showing up and being a problem solver.

Coming with solutions, not just problems. That's a favorite phrase of mine.

Bring solutions, not just problems. Yeah. Great. OK. Cool. So leaning on people's strengths, number 3. Love it. OK. So it's my turn. Some of these are going to be echoes of what we've already talked about. So Sarah was just talking about leaning on people's strengths, and they both see this event from— any of our events from this really wide perspective. And I just focus on the program because you bring me in to just write and develop the program. So I really think of like, what is the special sauce in a program? It's what is the talent pool that I have to draw from? What are the really stunning videos? What are the moments? What are the stories? Who are the musicians? What can they do? So that's really fun for me, is just really paying attention to the talent and the things that move me, right? Yes, hey! Hey, hey, hey! Very nice. Very nice. I should use that. I should use that. I should name this podcast that. But I just feel like your event— you might have a great vision for something, but if you don't have the people who can create something of significance or something that has that authenticity and that is real for them and for the audience and what the audience needs and wants, then there's only so much you you can do. So that's a real limit for a lot of people. When I've worked with other organizations on their events, it's like, you know, we are so lucky at Youth Frontiers because the talent is just astounding.

And so let's be real about that, like, we, we put it together, but it's— I always say it's like I, I find the puppet master. It's just, it's bringing all this incredible talent forward. So we are very fortunate.

So lucky. So lucky. Um, but it's worth, you know, if you can find one spectacular thing like one wow story. And I think a lot of time people spend time jamming in a lot of mediocre stuff. And in my mind, it's finding just that key moment is sometimes all you need. So if you can find that kind of magnificent that talent, then you're good. So that's my first one is talent. The second one is— Can I say one thing about that?

Yeah, for sure. Because we're so fortunate, I think, in our organization, it's just, it's leaning into their strengths too, like realizing what you have and then not trying to be something that you're not. Yes. You know, so, you know, we are fortunate, but if your organization or your event, you're like, this is what's there, then work with that, but then figure out ways to make it, you know, You're absolutely right.

Yeah, you're right, because you can't, you can't, like, let's, I don't know, if you're an organization that has a quieter brand, it's not gonna make sense for you to put a band up on stage. Yeah, yeah, yeah. You know what I'm saying? Like, what is the thing that you have that you want to highlight? Yeah, okay. Sorry. No, no, I think that was good. Okay, my second thing is about about time because I am astounded at how much time it takes to really pull something off. And I think most of the time people are underestimating how much time or are crunched for time, and that is real. But you just, you have to give yourself time and make space in the calendar for it, whether you're whether you're an element of an event or you're helping pull the whole thing together, it's a lot of time. Yes, yes it is.

I have to speak if you say time because I think, is it Ben Franklin they attribute to, I'd have written you a shorter letter if I only had more time. Yeah, yeah. And I think that's true of a program. Like if you wanna, and talk about time, like how many programs or events you've been to that it's like, really, they said 8:30 and now it's 9:15, you know? Yeah, well, go back to pre-production, go back to my recipe item, but, um, ingredient, but time. It takes time to create something that's the right amount of time so that people will come back again, time and time again. Let's just—

yeah, and that, that sort of ties me into the— my third piece, which is to keep a loose grip on a tight program. Yeah, yeah. Because, uh, and it has something to do with something we talked about in the car actually, was this creative attitude and an openness. Like any creative pursuit, it's finicky, and working the process before the day of is a roller coaster. You just never know really what it's going to be like. You've got to just take what comes and collaborate and hope, hope the magic shows up in the room. Shows up in the room at some point, and then you get the day of and it's live theater. You just don't know what is gonna happen. That's what I love about it, but it can be crazy-making for people who have invested so much time and energy, and this means so much to them, and you wanna, you wanna, yeah, hold a really tight grip on a tight program. And the truth is that that sometimes the best moments happen when you can just loosen that grip a little bit because who knows what's going to happen in the moment. Now, the only way you can loosen that grip is if you have the pre-production in place and it is a tight program and you've done everything you can to set people up for success and you've, you know, whatever. When you tell a speaker they have 5 5 minutes, just know they're going to take at least 8. Just know it. You've got to plan for that and build that into your program. But it starts out with getting to a place where you're like, we've got this locked down and now we're going to show up the day of and see what happens.

See what happens. Let it breathe.

Yeah. And let it breathe. And be in the room. So at Earth our 30th event last week, our first speaker after the founder spoke was a former staff who— we love you, Zuul. But he's a showman and he's a really fantastic speaker and he loves being on stage. And I had said, bring your fun energy. Energy. And he interpreted that like he just really, I think, soaked in the moment. They were doing call and response between him and the audience and a little cheerleading, and he split the audience into three. And it was like, that was not on the radar, but it was this really wonderful surprise. Yeah, um, that beautiful moment. Yeah, it was great, but it ate up, you know, 3 or 4 minutes that we weren't and I was like, "Loose grip. You just gotta have a loose grip on this and appreciate what it is." Because I wasn't predicting that. It was great. It was great. Okay, so, um, Neni—

Put it in the oven, these 9 ingredients.

Put the 9 ingredients in the oven. How long?

30 minutes. 30 minutes, okay. I think that's about right.

Cool, that's it. Not a whole lot of time. Not a whole lot of time. And we are— we're going to sign off because we are heading to an event tomorrow morning.

Next one up.

The next one up. Uh, an event here in Milwaukee.

Another fabulous luncheon. Loose Grip.

Yeah.

Tight Timber. Is it tight enough? I don't know. I got to go work on it a little bit.

We have to do a little—

We have a little bit more for production.

Cheers. Cheers. That was brutal. I love that, that's great. Thanks, Sally. Hey, thanks for joining me, you guys. It was fun.

It was really fun. Cut this, Alec. Don't cut this. Don't cut it. What's going on? Why are we— what? Ready? Oh, really? And— Thank you so much for listening to this podcast, this version of This Move Me. Hope you've heard something you enjoyed. If you did, please spread the word. If you didn't, just keep it to yourself. Next week, we will be having Matt Abrams. Nope. Nope. Matt Abrahams. Next week we will be having— cut! Next week we will be having Matt—

see, I'm not going to be able to—

Matt Abrahams. Next week we will be having Matt Abrahams from Stanford University School of Business who will be talking about not freaking out when you're speaking, how to calm your nerves and how to be prepared to answer anything that's thrown at you, to be improvisational, to think on your feet while you're a speaker. So that's coming. Also, please go to the website, thismoveme.com, where you'll find some freebies and some preparation packs for next week. No, no, no. What do you find there? And please go to the website, thismoveme.com. I'm moved just talking about it. You'll find some freebies there, and, um, maybe you'll meet Mr. Fister. No, no, wait, what's there? Freebies. Freebies, downloadables, and freebies. Downloadables, great things.

There's downloads that will help them in their journey.

Oh, oh, okay.

Yeah, and then they'll give me their email address.

Ah, do you want me to be that?

No. Yeah, sponsored by stamps.com.

@AbrahamSams. Maybe stamps.com will start sponsoring. Oh, well, yeah. That's worked before. Yeah, I've heard people— yeah. Is it stamps.com? Okay. Okay. And also, ple—