347: Storytelling, Courage, and Personal Branding with Kevin B. Jennings

Hey movers, it's Sally Z with Be Moved. Let's go create some talks that will move this world. We're going to talk with amazing speakers, share tips, tricks, resources, and we are going to be moved so that our audience can be moved.

This moved me.

What is moving You. Hello, hello, hello! I have such a treat for you. In just a moment, we will be joined by Kevin B. Jennings. Do you know that name? Maybe you've seen him around recently because he just did this amazing collaboration with Jen Hatmaker. Amazing! And that is just one of many huge names that the Kevin B. Jennings has worked with over the years, including Tony Robbins, Dave Ramsey, and Oprah.

Wow.

Oh my gosh. Amazing. And there's a reason that he has worked with some incredible people over the years is because he has so much wisdom and insight. And I feel super lucky that he chose me to be his speaker coach. That meant the world to me at the time. Here he is.

Yay!

Hello.

Hello. Hello.

Hi, Kevin. How are you today, sir?

I am wonderful. How are you, Coach? How you doing? You doing all right today?

I'm so great. I'm good. There's a little bit of things happening around us, so in advance, I Thank you for your patience while real life happens.

You know what? I got real life too. I got— so my son turned 2 this past weekend, which is great, but to celebrate, he accidentally kneed me in the eye. So, so excited. Well, I guess he wanted to rough and tumble. So I'm using this to like try to diffuse the look of how swollen my eye is. Oh, I know. So I'm going to make sure that I don't look crazy like Mad-Eye Moody from Harry Potter. I'm going to go see the ophthalmologist this afternoon so we can see what we can do. So we're, we're working through it.

I remember a moment when my son, when he was about 2, 2 and a half, he accidentally like headbutted me here, like right in the eye bone. And I also had a terrible black eye.

Yes. Yes. You get me? You get the light? I do too. Yeah, you do.

I can't believe he's 2, P.S., cuz I remember when we first started working together, he was just born. So that's awesome and amazing. Good job, Dad. And that sounds right. A blackout.

That's right. That's right. So we're gonna celebrate the entrance into the terrific twos. We're calling them around here terrific twos.

Sweet, Mary.

You know, the power of words. So we are using terrific, terrific twos around here. That's my welcome gift.

That 2-year-old who gave me a black eye is now 15, and I'm like, hey, hug me, hug me. Oh, okay. Well, Kevin, thank you so much for being here. I know you are a busy man doing all kinds of big stuff. I would love to— for you to just take a moment and introduce yourself. I gave a slight introduction before you hopped in, but tell us about what it is that you do?

Yes. So I'm a business coach and personal brand strategist. And so that means I have the privilege of helping really ambitious creatives and leaders, helping them get unstuck. And I do that by helping them get access to the credibility, the clarity, and even the courage that they may need to turn their ideas hopefully into income, but also into a greater impact in the world.

Ooh, love, love. I love all those words. I remember us working on those words.

Yes, you do.

Credibility and the courage, both of those pieces. And that courage piece is where I feel like our worlds kind of meet. I want you to talk about your own journey of courage. So we will get to that. But before that, I want to tap into your personal branding expertise and insight and can make that connection to story for us. Why do you think it is so important for people who are building their personal brand to embrace the idea of story?

Well, brand is a story, right? And I think that's the first thing. A brand is a story and it's a story that lives in your mind, a story that lives in my mind about any person or product. Right? And so, and it starts with a problem we associate with a person or a product. Now, not a problem with them, but a problem that they solve for us. You know, I don't know if you've ever seen the movie Inside Out, right? Where, so that movie where there is, you know, these emotions live in this 9-year-old girl Riley's head. And there's a section, there's a small scene where these mind workers are sucking out long-term memories that he no longer needs.

Mm-hmm.

That's what our minds do. They discard information that we deem as unneeded.

Mm-hmm.

See, the average person only remembers 3 to 4 options for any product, and that's if they are not an expert. If they are an expert, they only remember 7 to 10 options for any product. So you investing in the story people are telling themselves about you and trying to own a specific problem in their mind is not an act of vanity. It's because the human mind can't remember that many options. So I'm saying to myself, by human nature, well, what story or what problem does Sally own in my mind? And actually a mutual friend of ours, Kathy Young, and I were talking about you literally on Friday.

Oh my gosh.

We were talking about the fact that Sally owned the problem of speaking in our minds. So when I have a speaking problem or I know a person with a speaking problem, I say, you need to call Sally. Now, that's now. That isn't regardless of whatever future Sally envisions for herself. It might be more people served, might be a bigger social following. Could be more money, but even today, you leaning into the story that you hope people are telling about you when you're not around is allowing me and Kathy, when you're not there, Kathy's in Florida, I'm in Nashville, you're in Minnesota, and two people are talking with you on a Friday morning saying, yep. Yeah. If people have a problem with speaking, they should probably call Sally.

Huh? Right.

And so that is the power of story when it comes to personal branding. And truthfully speaking, here's a secret. It's just word of mouth marketing, right? But that's how it works. It's a story people are, are pushing forward when you're not around.

Right. I love that. And that's such a wonderful big picture way of thinking about this, that people are telling a story. About you to themselves or to other people that is either helping you or hurting you, right? That is personal branding, right? But I also think about it digging a little bit deeper down into the nitty gritty of how people connect with you, how people associate with you, how they experience you and say, yes, this is a person who gets me, or this is a person who I want to walk with further, right? And to me, that lives in that story moment. And that's a personal branding thing as well. Yes.

Oh, absolutely. Absolutely. Everything that you do to influence that story is the act of personal branding. We all have a personal brand, whether or not you invest in personal branding. Yeah. We all have a personal brand and reputation. So we all have reputation. So I don't want to. Say, okay, so like, so really personal branding is how intentional do I want to be about influencing the story people tell themselves. The story's being told. You are just deciding not to influence what's being said.

That's big. FYI, team, you, you have a personal brand. It's just whether or not you are intentionally engaged in helping to shape that. And, and care for it and usher that along for your audience.

Absolutely. Absolutely.

Okay. Because, and you've said this many, many times, and this is kind of the insight that I have borrowed from you, and this is not new, but it's such an important reminder. And that is that people buy from people.

That's right.

And so even when you are repping a company or you are really see yourself as Oh, I am an expert. I'm an ideas person. It's like, no, they want to know who you are.

Mm-hmm. Who are you?

Shape that identity in the minds of your audience. So could you talk a little bit about that piece?

That's right. And, and here's the thing, from a young age, and I don't know if, I mean, for those of us who like, who have small children right now, you know, it's one thing to always know about advertising. It's another thing for the first time to say, oh, I see my kid has seen hundreds of advertisements every day because they're on YouTube Kids and they're on the Disney Channel, which means at a young age, even you are being exposed to the fact that companies are trying to sell you something.

Yeah.

Companies have a goal and they say, but people, they are looking out for me. They're looking out for a, for their own reputation when they represent or advocate for another organization. And so we, by default, trust people more than organizations and brands. That's why we still look at book reviews on Amazon, Yelp reviews for restaurants, right? We look at the comments, you know, when we, when we're looking at a post, we are trying our best to look at everyone else's stories about who we are and, and what our products are so we can trust them. And that just means at the end of the day, I'm going to look at the person behind the product or service anyway. I mean, there's a reason why people are willing to cancel companies for the act of the CEO, right? Because we say to ourselves, if I can't trust the people behind it, I don't know if I can trust it. And that, and that is the thing that goes with it inherently because of our nature as human beings.

Okay. So you have just set up a really powerful why. It is so important to invest in yourself as a speaker because your story, how you represent yourself, the way in which people connect with you or don't. P.S., speaking is the powerful way to do that because it is story in action. It is you in action, live, like a human being with a body, and a way in which you can fast-track that connection is so, so important. So you just laid that out. Really beautifully. Thank you.

Very good.

So now I want to chat for a moment about your own courage in action as you, because you've spent many, many years doing this on behalf of other people, really helping them be more courageous in their own personal brand and get the capability and credibility to do that. Your beautiful words. So how have you now done your beautiful transition to be living this out for yourself?

Yeah, I think I would say this. I'm still in transition, right? I want to be, I want to be, and I would say that the main thing was first of all, me confronting the same limiting beliefs that I have to help clients confront all the time. And that is why me? Do I have the story? Do I have the value I believe I can offer to the world? What do I wanna say? Or more importantly, how people receive me when I share it. And one, I saw one of my good friends, her name is Casey Lanier, and she's an also, also an incredible marketer. And one thing she and I would talk about a lot actually is how, because of the world we live in today, we could talk about, I don't have time. Well, there's two. Many resources available now to say you don't have time. I saw another friend of mine here who jumped on a second ago. Her name is Andrea Ballard. She's an amazing Squarespace designer, right? She can help you get a site done so freaking fast that the day of, I can't get a website done affordably or quickly, they don't exist anymore. And so, you know, we're here on Instagram Live talking to people, you know, and you're in Minnesota, I'm in Nashville. We're doing this through a free app. Right? There's so, so, so technology is taking away so many capacity issues because of your podcast and your blog and your YouTube channel. I can say, well, I don't have the knowledge anymore. Well, that's getting taken away from you, right? And so if you really want to get clarity, you can hire a coach or consultant to get clarity. If you don't, if you struggle with credibility, you can still use social media content to help you establish that credibility. You can share your portfolio online. And that's when it hit me that all I had left, all, all of us have left is courage. It was, it, and I'll be transparent, I didn't, I didn't come to this moment with a great deal of joy. It was me essentially running out of excuses.

Yeah.

Saying every single thing I told myself I needed to do and be who I wanted to be and do. They were gone. They were really gone. There was nothing left. And the question became, am I willing to pick myself and go? And I've just identified a few things that can help us summon courage when we need it the most. But at the end of the day, that's all we have left. So anyone who's watching who desires to be a speaker, desires to communicate, desires to tell stories, that they have to influence their personal brand, et cetera. All you have left is courage.

Yeah.

Because access information to people, to resources, even to clarity that you might need, we can get you there. Yeah. But we can't, we can't make you be courageous. That's all on you.

Yes. Yeah. People say to me sometimes, you spend so much time talking about mindset and courage and you can do this and you are worthy of the moment. Why, why do you do that? Like, aren't people, if they're following you, aren't they already there? I'm like, I, even the pros that I'm talking to, I am pushing. I am saying, yes, you can go after that bigger stage. Yes, you are worthy of this moment. The self-doubt creeps in. We are the ones holding ourselves back 9 out of 10 times.

Agreed.

It, it is. And I recognize that in you was like, You are brilliant. You are doing such incredible things. Like, Kevin, you just need to bet in yourself. You just need to let yourself believe and go for it and get determined about it.

Yeah, for sure. I mean, that's, I mean, obviously I've said this publicly so many times, but I'll say it again. I mean, I think that was your approach and your willingness to call me out was such a great impetus for this journey for me. And I mean, and I think that for you to do it after one call, I, you know, I think maybe even more because I think that sometimes we discredit those who love us the most because, oh, they're saying it because they love me. Of course, that's what they say, right? That's what they're supposed to say. They're paid to say that, right? And then you have someone who comes along and says, no, I just see it. I just see it. And I'm not going to act like I don't see it. And to me, you know, and you know, and you even said, hey, there's no such thing as good timing. And that's true, cuz it happened in 2020 and, and it definitely felt like bad timing. Yeah. But all that being said, you know, I encourage people to, to not discredit those around them who are saying they see things inside of them. That's hurtful. That's not fair to, to, to, you know, you're not, your people are not lying to you just to make you feel good. But more importantly, sometimes you can borrow someone's courage for a little while.

Yeah. I tell my people that all the time. If you're lacking courage right now, just borrow mine for you because I, I do see something in my speakers and I'm like, you gotta make good on this. There, there you, you are fulfilling a need for someone out there. Um, the, the only difference I see between people who have made it, who are out there speaking on the biggest stages and the people who aren't yet. There might be a skill gap. There might be, there might be some growth and development. There's always things and improvement to make, but the biggest difference is that person said, I'm, I'm doing it. I'm like, that's mine. I want that. And they put their nose to the grindstone and said, okay, let's go.

That's right. It's so true. It's so true. And now this, this is where I'm going to stop because I can go on a rant here. But I'm telling you, creative confidence and irrationality are like so close together.

Yeah.

I mean, it, it, it is, it is. I mean, it is so close. One of my favorite things I always think about, so I used to, I, you know, I like to write music and I, I DJ more now, but I used to love to write songs and I was writing songs and I remember one and I was like learning how to play guitar and I was like learning music theory and I played the trumpet and all this stuff. And I was listening to the radio one day, right? And you know, we all know the song Yeah by Usher and Ludacris. And so that's of course my analogy. And I, and I listened to the, like, 3 notes, you know, doo doo doo doo doo doo doo doo. And somebody said, that's amazing. That's gonna be a hit. Wait till the world hears this. Most of us would've discredited that immediately. Yeah. We would've said, We would've said, ah, fine. We would've— I mean, there's no way you would've said, get this to Usher. He's gotta record this. I'm gonna bang down every door until Usher jumps on this style. You would've discredited it as something you play for an elementary piano class.

Right.

You'd have never give yourself that credit. But that's the difference. It looks— it is really you just believing and your ability to move others. The person who wrote that song doesn't even claim to be the best songwriter. He just knows I create music that moves people. And of course, as a DJ, I know it moves people. You put it on, the dance floor fills up. Like, he's doing exactly what he thought he could do, which then goes to even our skill set doesn't matter as much as our ability to move parts of others, right? And of course, talking to the woman who, whose company is called Be Moved, but I think that is truly what it is. It's like maybe you will not be the most talented, skilled, et cetera. It's just saying your ability to move others might be the gift in and of itself. And, and your ability to, to take what you might discredit as simple or easy or elementary or rudimentary. Really is not the issue at all. And so I always think about that and I'm like, man, if I can just give myself a chance and give myself a little, even a, a little tiny dose of irrationality, you know, and, and it can go for, go a long way.

I love that so, so much. Yes. It was solid example. So, so true. Like when we change the goal. To, I'm gonna do this perfectly. I'm going to be the best. I want to be seen as the expert. I'm like, we, we put speaking up on this pedestal, but what happens if we change the goal to up move my audience? Then what? Then you, you yourself are required to show up with your stories, your experience, everything that you have right there, right now. Let yourself be seen in that moment, that changes everything. Like, that songwriter was not like, this is the most amazing song ever. It was like, no, this speaks to something that I recognize. And I want— get this to Usher. That's right.

That's right. That's like, when I put this on, I want to shake my hips. This is moving. Right? That's it. That's all I got. I don't know. I don't— I can't— it's not going to go down as a classic. But, oh, I feel something when I play this. Mm-hmm. Right? And so I tell all them, so there is, there is okay to say, can I find my own creative confidence to say what I'm doing and what I'm saying, it will move someone. It will move, it's moving me and I feel compelled to share it.

Yeah. With a tiny dose of irrationality.

A tiny dose. Just a tiny, just a little sprinkle. You need a tiny dose. Ow. That's right. Because, because that's what helps you say, get this to Usher. That's what says, give me that stage. Give me that microphone. Like, you know, I talk about it all the time. If you, if someone really thinks they can lead the United States, they have to have a tiny dose of rationality. They have to, like, to say, you know what? This country's going to hell in a handbasket. Give me the country.

Give it to me.

I got this. Like, it's like, are you kidding me? Like, you gotta, I mean, who thinks that in the morning? If I was in charge, Give me the country. Like, that is a— you have to have a tiny dose of irrationality to think you're going to solve the ills of the country or the ills of the world or an organization or anybody's life. Like, you kind of have to be a little tiny bit crazy.

Yeah.

And there's nothing wrong with a little bit of crazy.

Yeah. Dream a lot.

You have to.

And open the door Just enough to say maybe, or I think I can, or, oh man, I see it. I don't know, but I—

right. That's right. And sometimes, last thing, sometimes it's your vision for the future that, or for the future of yourself, for the future of others, for the, for the potential impact of your message that says, even if I look silly doing it, or I do fall a little bit short, it is worth the effort because if I'm able to even achieve a percentage of the impact that I envision, it was worth it. And, and I think that that's where many of us have to say like, what if I don't achieve 100% of the goal, but I got 50% of it? Would it make the lives of others, the lives of the organization, the lives of my audience slightly better? And the thing, the answer's almost always going to be yes. And I hope that you're willing to go down fighting, even if it's just to make a percentage of the impact that you envision.

Okay. Did you all get the call? Kevin is like, let's go. Let's do it. This is why I love you for many reasons, but I, I know that when I pull you in here, you're going to be like, let's go, people. Let's go.

And let's do it.

Thank you for taking time today. To come and offer your generous insights to everybody. Would you close us out by letting people know where they can find out more about you?

Yeah. Well, you can text me here. Let's just, let's just get to it. Let's just become friends, right? Text me 615-455-3399. 615-455-3399. I would love to hear what you're doing, what you're trying to do. I think actually I'm entering a season right now where I want to hear the dreams of others. I think that sometimes it's easy to become disillusioned in our own journeys. And sometimes just being reminded of the, of the hearts of others and everybody's commitment is such a great opportunity for me to be encouraged as well. And that's what I love to do. I have plenty of ways we can connect from there, but I would, I'm telling you beyond her being the real deal when it comes to her ability as a speaker coach, she is an amazing human. And I think that we can all say to ourselves, do you ever want to have amazing humans in your orbit? I think the answer is going to be absolutely not. So slowly but surely, she's going to call you off the sidelines like she did for me. And at the end of the day, you will be grateful that you slowly, slowly had someone who wasn't going to let you be a wallflower for many more times in your life. And that's awesome.

Thank you, Kevin. Those words truly mean the world to me. So grateful for you, grateful for our friendship and your belief in me so that I can believe in myself. Help you believe in you even stronger than you already do. So much love to you. Take care of your eyes.

Thank you.

Thanks everybody. Thanks for being here.

Bye-bye.

Bye-bye.