Doing Everything Right Doesn't Always Feel Like Winning

I spent a lot of time in Hollywood, and that's the most superficial place I've ever been in my whole life. And it still messes with me to this day. And I literally have to remind myself of everything I just said.

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From others over self, it's Hardcore and at Ease, a show about people who are keeping their edge without going over the edge. I'm host Shelly Rood. Have you been building a life that you really needed but then landed somewhere that won't let you live it? Well, I don't think that isolation like that gets solved. I think it gets learned one day at a time. Today you'll hear hear how a woman holding 3 identities at once is keeping all of them alive from one of the most remote places in the country. Hear what she's figured out about keeping her footing when nothing around her makes that easy.

This is Hardcore and At Ease.

She signed a label deal, walked into the Grammys in 2019, and built a sound that she describes as what happens if Stevie Nicks and Janis Joplin had a baby, minus the drugs. 4 years later, she's a Coast Guard Logistics Officer in Juneau, Alaska, a place with 3 hours of daylight in the winter and no roads that go anywhere anytime soon. That is Jess Muse. She applied to become an officer, got turned down, resubmitted, and now made it into Officer Candidate School only 2 weeks before her backup plan would have started. Today she's holding 3 identities at the same time: recording artist, officer, and a woman working toward a career in medicine because she just can't stop wanting to help people. She is stretching herself, trying to fully show up for more than one calling at the same time. That is something that I recognize in myself very deeply. Before we get to today's guest, I want to take just a second to honor one of my listeners. It is a beautiful day over here in Lake St. Clair, Michigan. I wanna give a big shout out to Jack Bronca with the Selfridge Base Community Council. He is helping me get into the meeting today because it's in a closed remote location, and I so appreciate his help. Jack's wife passed away unexpectedly last year, and knowing that he's still out here reclaiming his agency and navigating his own wilderness, it reminds me that I'm not alone in my quest to be hardcore and at ease. Now let's get into today's show. You may recognize today's guest from American Idol, Jess Muse. She hasn't quite figured out how to hold her 3 different ambitions. Living in Juneau, Alaska, where there's only 3 hours of daylight in the winter and no road out, she's still there and she's figuring out which door is going to open for her next. What I want you to listen for today is how Jess is staying at ease inside something that she hasn't fixed. In her own words, "You just can't win." Here's my conversation with Jess Muse.

I always go back to music helps people, and I just felt like as much as I love music and how much it helps me and it helps other people, I just felt like this itch that I could do more.. And I had a bunch of stuff going on personally that kind of made me introspect a little bit and look at my life and where I was going. And I started studying the different branches 'cause I've done a lot of nonprofit work with my music and just working with veterans and they've become some of my favorite people I've ever met, ever.

What is it that makes the veteran community so special to you?

I feel like they have. A really good perspective about life because even if you haven't seen combat, like you, you have your values set up in a certain way. And I feel like the irony of that is a lot of them, like, let's say Marines who have the empathy trained out of them, they're, they still end up being some of the more emotionally intelligent people I think I've ever met because they have that perspective. They've been through stuff, they've had to leave. And miss holidays. And I think I kind of connected with that too, because as a musician, you, you miss a lot, but people don't really think of it on that side.

Are you, what does your day-to-day life look like right now?

I like to work out. I do my CrossFit. I work a lot. I'm also in Juneau, which is super remote. So what's Juneau? Juneau, Alaska.

Oh yeah. And that is super remote.

I woke up and I got the notification that this was in like an hour and I was like, Oh crap. Because you guys are 4 hours ahead of me. Yep. And Juneau's just, it's off the main road system of the United States. There's no way to get to it unless you're on a boat or a plane. They're like, my first week of work was the Glacial Lake Outburst Flood. And I was like, I don't even know what that is. What's going on? So we—

Are you there for the Coast Guard?

I'm stationed here.

Okay.

Yep.

So it's just like people kind of don't think about it unless they're actually here, but it's super remote and there's a lot of stuff. I tell people. Everything up here, it will kill you. It will try to, and it will. So, there's a lot of search and rescue, which I'm not like directly a part of, but I'm a logistics officer, so I know what's going on, which is pretty cool, but it's also a little bit terrifying.

Did I hear you say that you're a logistics officer? Because I was reading a little bit about your background and you had an interest in going into Officer Candidate School, but it sounds like that wasn't a direct line. Can you walk us through that?

So I initially applied to OCS with the Coast Guard and I was not accepted. So I enlisted and I was supposed to go to boot camp January 2025, and I resubmitted my officer packet. And the only thing I changed in my narrative was I said, I am scheduled to attend or report to boot camp in January 2025, and I plan to continue applying to this program until I'm accepted. And then about 2 weeks before I was supposed to go to boot camp, I got a phone call that said I made it into OCS. So I figured they're like, I don't wanna pay for 2 trainings for those girls.

I love that so much. What an incredible testimony to just know what you want and let the world know, I am going after it.

Or you don't win if you don't play.

So is, so Juneau is your first duty station, it sounds like?

Yes, it is.

And how long are you gonna be there?

Technically until 2028, but I have a lot of pursuits that I'm going after and seeing which one bites first. 'Cause I know I wanna go back to the lower 48 for sure. I have my best friends down in Southeast, but just being so removed up here, like even with my music, there's only like 2 venues up here and I've worked really, really hard and it wasn't to get paid $100 for a 3-hour set where I blow out my voice. So as much as I love it, I need more connection, and I think that's why the internet's so great. But I'm looking at applying to the Interservice Physician Assistant Program. So I'm also in school right now, again, for my second degree. So I'm pretty busy all the time, always doing schoolwork. I have like anatomy and a medical terminology class. But if that doesn't work, I'm going to keep applying, but I'm going to apply to that. There's also a medical administration. Route that I can go with the Coast Guard will send you to Baylor for 2 years for a master's in medical admin. So I know I want to go into the medical field. So that's, you know, I did music because it helps people. The Coast Guard helps people. How can I help people even more? And I think that's medical.

What is your first degree in?

Psychology.

You're a dangerous woman.

Do you know that?

Yeah.

Gotta be careful. I'll diagnose you with something. That's all I say to the boys. It scares them away.

Now, where— tell me about when you were in the— you said the Southeast. Um, is that where you grew up? You know, it's obviously that's where you got your roots with your music. What did that scene look like?

So I was actually born in Texas and then I moved around all my life cuz my mom worked for the government and we've lived up in New England. So Rhode Island, New Hampshire, Massachusetts, Florida, and then kind of settled down in Alabama. And that's the longest I've ever been in one place, so I can't claim it as my hometown. There's a town called Slapout. That's the real name of the town. And that's where I'm from. And when I did all the national television stuff, that was definitely like my roots. So I love the South and I think you realize how much you love it when you're no longer in it, especially. People up here don't say please, thank you, excuse me. Like it's very socially different.. And I can wholeheartedly say, like, I miss the South. Even when people said, excuse me, and didn't mean it. Like, I miss that.

I get a taste of that because I'm over here in Detroit. And I've also traveled, you know, 16 years for the military and got to see firsthand that Southern hospitality. Like you said, bless her heart, right? Whether it's mean or nice, at least it's there.

That's like they always say, even in Nashville, they'll smile at your face and they'll throw the knife at your back, but at least they smile.

Golly. Well, it sounds like you're in a really, really good place and God's got you there for some opportunity for just deep thought and reevaluation of what you've definitely done. What has it changed your music or like what, what's going in your brain as, as you have this time to yourself right now?

Uh, it's been hard to be inspired because it is so drastically different. Like, I call it Narnia, especially with the crazy snow we just had. We just had record-breaking snow. I feel like it's just one natural disaster after another. Then all the avalanches are going off. I was like, man, this place, woo, just makes you tired. You get stuck in your house, then all the power goes out, then it gets cold. But I mean, it does definitely force you into contemplation and thinking about a lot. And like spiritually looking at your relationship with, you know, God, the creator, whatever you want to call it. Like for me, it is God, but it kind of backs you in a corner, like you have to. So as far as my music, like I've kind of been easing back into it. I'm looking at getting a PC. I'm looking at producing some of my own stuff, but even more than that, I'm looking at co-writes, opening that up with people to virtually co-write with people back at home and in Nashville.

And why do you think now might be the time for that?

I feel like what better time to start than now? Life's short. Might as well just go for it. My whole life is a testament to that. Like, if you want something, you can get it. You just go for it. And it might take a while and doors might close on you, but you're like, okay, well, it's not that door. And that's— you fail forward and that's all you can do. So if you want something, you should start today.

So if you you get the opportunity to co-write with somebody, what is it that you're going after in that process? Because I'm not a musician, so I have no idea what would be on the other side of that door.

Well, I feel like as a mostly solo singer-songwriter, you kind of get in your little bubble of comfort, and you have your style, your vibe, your subject matter, whatever it may be. So kind of getting outside of that and opening it up to different styles is a little harder because you write yourself into a hole. So when you write with other people, that's multiple brains at work who have all different writing styles. And it's really cool. I, I think there's a happy place with the amount of co-writers though, probably like 5 max, because you start losing that personality. Like some of these songs now have 9 to 12 and you can tell 'cause they sound like they're AI. They sound AI. But I think having the meshing of all the different brains and the ways they think and their life experience and how that comes together as a tangible product, as a song. I think that's the magic of co-writing.

So bringing another layer of depth into the work that you're doing. If you could, so those of our listeners that are not familiar with you or your music background, if you could give us a little recap about the style of song you sing, like what is your kind of sweet spot with your lyrics and kind of, you know, what to expect if they open up one of your songs.

So I'm definitely like Southern rock. I don't really say like pop country 'cause that's not my vibe. I grew up in Texas, so I love red dirt, so I'm more inspired by that kind of subgenre of country. So I always tell people, if you haven't heard me, I sound like if Stevie Nicks and Janis Joplin had a baby, minus all the drugs. Beautiful baby. Great vibrato for the baby.

And what about the subject? I mean, what is it that— because it's not instrumental, there's lyrics in there, and those lyrics are inspired from somewhere.

So all of my songs are about real life things that I've worked through on my own or with my friends, and it's just me kind of processing life and my emotions because I'm really big on emotional intelligence and looking inward. And, you know, kind of like everyone you meet in life, whether you like them or not, everyone has something to teach you. So what can you learn from some interaction, whether it was positive or negative, things like that. So I, all of that's in my songs. I've got a couple funny ones. That's just me with my dark humor. And like, I like memes. So there's one, I call it my LeBron song. It's called Great Pretender, but it's like the ball's in your court, but I'm LeBron James. So I saw a meme that said that and wrote a song about it. So there's some silly ones, but most of them are pretty serious. Like, uh, I wrote a couple during the pandemic. Like Atlas, and that's about the Titan who holds the earth on his shoulders. And sometimes life is heavy. So like I write about a lot of real life stuff like that.

Can I ask Jess, is there any journeys that you've been on personally that you really feel like your audience understands or, or they've walked through that? And you know, I just kind of wanna preface this by saying like, I work in, in veteran care with military women. Depression runs high, anxiety runs high.

Mm-hmm.

We have lived a lot of life.

Yeah.

And we're not ashamed to say that, you know? You know, is, is there anything for you and for your listeners that really resonates?

I think my journey right now does resonate with a lot of people, like being a female, being an officer, and I came in off the streets of Montgomery, Alabama. Like I, I was a civilian and it's not, it's not like I was just a, a young kid that went through school, went to college, and then straight into the military. It's no, I've lived life, I've done a lot of stuff. So I came in with all this crazy life experience. Some of which are very limited to a very small pool of people like American Idol. And I've done a lot of TV stuff, which is really hard for a lot of people to understand. But I think from what I've experienced with my fans, aside from connecting with the female military community, is that they've always told me that they appreciate how open I am. So about mental health and like, I'm all for taking care of your brain. I have therapy today. Like, I think everyone should go to therapy and I think the people who think they don't need it are the ones who need it the most. Like, I'm all for it. But I have repeatedly been told that people just appreciate how real and transparent I am, which, you know, there's a boundary there. There's still stuff that people don't know 'cause people don't need to know everything, but As far as life, like I'm pretty much as real as it gets.

Can we talk about those boundaries just for a minute? 'Cause boundaries are so extremely important and you're such an incredible person to show, like when you have a microphone in your face all the time, like I do, how can you find that line of what to share and what not to share? Do you have any like rules or sets of instructions for people about like how do you know when like, okay, maybe that's TMI? It's kind of a blurry line.

It's really for each individual to assess what they're comfortable with. I know for me, there's a lot of people who throughout my life told me how I should look, what I should wear. They've called me like, when I did American Idol and I wore black all the time, cuz black is a flattering color and people would call me like the goth girl or say I looked like I came out of Hot Topic. And to be judged so harshly, like first of all, that taught me, hey, I'm not gonna act like that to other people cuz I know how it makes people feel, but putting that boundary out, like, I'm just gonna delete that comment. Gone. And not engaging with stuff that bothers me unless I feel like I have the energy and just wanna poke the bear, which sometimes is funny. But that's a boundary too. Like, what kind of day are you having? Do I wanna snap back? Is it worth it? What am I gonna get from this engagement? And there's like people who ask me to do stuff now and Unless it's job related, I'm like, no, I don't want to. I have schoolwork. I prioritize certain things in my life, which my mental health is pretty much number one. And then my physical health is number two. I don't blow off the gym. I'm going to the gym, especially on days that I don't wanna go. I'm like, I have to go. And I think once you prioritize stuff, your boundaries kind of become clear. Because you'll see what you'll compromise for and what you'll kind of push off to the side. And then I think that requires introspection to say, oh, I'm doing that and I really need to go to the gym, but I brushed off the gym 3 times this week because I wanted to go have drinks with friends or something else. And that's easy to do. 'Cause everyone's at a different place in life too.

You know, it is easy to do. And I was just having this conversation with my husband this morning. He's not military. And he's like, oh, well, when you were in the military, you had a group and you all did training together. And no, we like, no, sometimes yes, when you're in certain training environments, but especially as an officer, there's a lot of officers that PT is up to you and whether or not you make it happen is totally on you. And he was surprised to hear that mentality. So, now that you're in and you are in an environment where this use of your physical body is necessary for the job that you do, Do you find that the military is giving you the space to do that, or is it more that Jess is making this happen because she knows it needs to happen?

I mean, the Coast Guard's coming out with a lot of new stuff with the fitness assessment and the— gonna be a test. And I think that's gonna affect a lot of people very, very heavily and, and a lot of people negatively.

So is there not a test right now?

There, there is, but they're reassessing everything, like the whole baseline. So we just did, I'm part of the fitness committee at work.

Of course you are.

But it's fun. Like I enjoy it and I like to motivate my department to get out cuz we're logistics, we're logs and you know, it's very sedentary. We do sit around, we have the desks where you stand up and stuff, but it's really hard to get people motivated to go. And then you got me telling everyone to do CrossFit. But, uh, no, I think—

and let's be honest, some of 'em probably can't touch their toes.

And it's, it is hard for a lot of people. There's mobility issues, there's injuries, there's age-related, just wear and tear. And that's okay. I have a neuroma in my foot and sometimes it really hurts, but you do what you can to not hurt it more. And I've gone to the doctor, I did it by the book, and people just need to keep doing that. But I do think that the Coast Guard I don't know, I can't speak for the other branches, but they have made it a thing where you have X amount of minutes, like you leave work early to go to the gym. You will go to the gym. And we, with the fitness committee, are doing, I wanna say it's monthly kind of group events that it's not mandatory, but they're group fitness events. And each department hosts, one department hosts it like every other, every month or so. So, like, we have one coming up that is a CrossFit-style workout. And of course, I'm gonna really push that one 'cause it's at my CrossFit gym. But they do, like, ultimate frisbee, or we did flag football, and I almost died, but it was a lot of fun. So, I do think that— I know the Coast Guard, at least up here, is definitely making the space for people to do that kind of thing.

And you can choose to embrace it like you are, or you can choose to have an attitude about it. You get out of it as much as you want to.

Yeah. They're gonna start implementing the test, I wanna say, 2 times a year. And that pissed off a lot of people, which I'm like, I don't care. My mentality about it is I should be able to look at you, say, do the fitness test, and you should be able to knock it out and pass at any point. That's just the readiness part of it.

Can I ask you about nutrition?

Yeah.

Because I know that's a huge blocker. For many people. And, um, did you grow up with a good idea of healthy eating? Is this something that you've fallen into? Are you fighting with it even today?

My dad used to cook like Paula Deen and it was butter. I remember that. And I also remember I was a little chubby, awkward kid and I was picked on very heavily for that in school. And because of that, I stopped eating in high school and I lost a lot of weight really, really fast because I was just sad because I had no friends and all I had was my grades and my weight. So I took control of what I had control of and I stopped— I started learning about all the different nutrition values and basically how to read a label. And I realized that all the butter and everything wasn't really that great for me. And I definitely didn't have a good relationship with food for a while, but since then I have gotten my NASM certified personal trainer. I have a nutrition coach cert. I have the USA Weightlifting certification, and I believe in an ongoing education at all times. Like, I'm also still in school. I'm in school for medical, so I do have an idea how the body works. And I also have an idea how a brain works. And I think it's really important to pass on that education to people. Like when people ask me for advice, I will tell you, and I don't eat perfectly. I'm getting better. I mean, it's really hard when you live in Narnia and they're like over the winter, there's 3 hours of sun and you're like, and it's night again.

So, and I would imagine you just wanna sit on the couch and eat chips bag after bag after bag.

It's, it's tough. It's tough because you go outside and it's— it'll like, it'll snow a lot and then it'll melt, but then it'll immediately freeze again. And now it's an ice rink outside and you can wear your little metal spikes on your shoes. But if you forget to take them off when you walk inside, you'll bust your ass inside your house. So it's like you just can't win. So yes, for the most part, I've watched a lot of movies, but I have made it a point, like going to the gym, I always tell people, you never regret showing up at the gym. Like, just go. Even if you— I ran 3 miles yesterday and I was like, okay, I did something good and I had a good time. You don't feel bad about going. And with nutrition and stuff, I always tell people like supplements help too. I think creatine is a sleeper that a lot of people like Especially cuz you can gain some weight, but it's mostly water weight and it'll saturate your muscles. And I forget what the timeline is for it to like fully be saturated in your muscles and then they actually start building more. Your brain will work better. It helps with cognition. Creatine is really awesome. So like I tell people, don't be afraid of creatine. I've gained weight from creatine, but I have to tell myself it's water weight or weight. It's fine.

Well, it's such healthy conversation for women to have about gaining weight the right way to do it. It's okay to gain weight in some instances. It depends on the type of weight. Uh, you and I are, are like sisters from afar. I also have a National Academy of Sports Medicine personal trainer cert from back in the day, and I definitely have my CrossFit trainer, and there's just so much that I wanna get into with you. And something that you said really stuck with me, and it was when you were talking about when you were younger. And you felt like you had little to no confidence with your body. So that is something that I'm seeing with our women veterans, as you know, 'cause you're Modern Vet. The average age for a female veteran now is 46. And so can I ask you to share how old you are just comparatively?

Yeah, I'm 35.

So 35 at the beginning of your military career, and I'm 42, so I'm still younger than the average veteran. And what I see is happening with women like us is that as we get out of the military, we're actually losing confidence. Some of that has to do with, you know, our jobs and things, but it's also about our bodies and moving and using our bodies. And we don't look the way we did when we were in. Can you share with us some words of wisdom so that maybe my vets that are no longer serving can just really tap in to this ownership that just because you're not in the military doesn't mean that you can't have body confidence?

The way you look does not reflect your worth. And I think that society has been very, very toxic in promoting that it does. And I think that if people understood when we doom scroll, that even when we scroll past something, cuz we don't like it or mute it or delete it, your brain still subconsciously takes all of it in whether you read it or not. And I think that that's part of how toxic it has become, but we are addicted to it. And I think that our worth should be more evolving around our character and the things that we do to serve others and help others. 'Cause I think that's why we're here is to help each other because we're all suffering from the human condition. And that can be hard. Like sometimes it really sucks. So just imagine if everybody forgot about the way they looked and cared a little more about their character. And I'm not dismissing it because I have problems with it too. I spent a lot of time in Hollywood and that's the most superficial place I've ever been in my whole life. And it still messes with me to this day. And I literally have to remind myself of everything I just said. So put your worth on other things and your body. You can fix so much stuff with your body. It's, if you don't like your nose, you can get a nose job. If you don't like your boobs, you can get boobs. That's how superficial that is. You can get fillers, you can do anything now. So your looks really, you should just be happy and do what makes you happy. You wanna get, I don't care if people get plastic surgery, I'm all for it. I understand. And I'm, I like fillers too. They're fun. So you can change all that, but I think you should just work on yourself as a person cuz that's, that's what's up to you. Everything else is easy fix.

When you say that you can have work done in plastic surgery, to me that sounds like hard work. It sounds scary. It sounds like a medical procedure.

Mm-hmm.

Do you think that that's the perception or, or do you think that some people do see that as the easy fix?

I think for a lot of people it's an easy fix to do because you just pay some money, they knock you out, and then you get what you want for the most part. And some come with complications, but you know that beforehand. But like I said, I'm all about if you feel bad or you need reconstructive surgery or whatever that may be, I think that plastic surgery is a great option and I think it's wonderful that it can be there for people. But it also, at the same time, there is a line where it should not be glorified as, oh, I'm gonna be this perfect person if I do this. Like that girl who got ribs removed cuz she has, that's a different level of body dysmorphia that I don't really understand. And that's fine, but you have to put it in that category as like, is this becoming a mental illness now? And that's fine. But I think again, like instead of judging. Approaching with curiosity and being kind toward people and like, you have to figure out what's right for you.

So you do, do you have friends that you've kind of walked through that shared journey with?

Yeah, I have friends who they do like the weight loss injections and stuff. And, and I know weight is a really big part of it, especially for women, more, more so than features. I think weight is probably the number one for most women. I know my weight bothers me all the time. I moved up here and I'm like, oh my gosh, I'm turning into a polar bear. Actually, I like the same weight as one. Like, I feel bigger and it's, but it, it messes with you and it, it makes you feel weird. But then the other, the benefit of going to the gym is like, I'm moving more weight than I've ever moved in my life. So I tell myself, just don't freak out. There's, it's gotta be lean muscle. Because you're pulling so much weight now. So, and fat doesn't do that. But I think that's why there's a balance there too. There's so much we could unpack here.

You're listening to Hardcore and At Ease, powered by Others Over Self. We'll be right back after these important messages. Are you a woman who has kept everyone else standing while your own foundation cracked? Perhaps in your life as a veteran, you've made choices where both options cost you something. And you keep questioning if you did the right thing. You know what it's like to be the one in the room who carries the weight that nobody else sees. You're built for that, and you deserve a community where you embrace who you are when you're not performing for others. Mission Wildflower is a newsletter built by and for women with military experience. Twice a week, bring a little joy and understanding into your life. Take part in real conversations about the situations you're navigating, the choices that don't have good answers, the permission to build a life that's truly yours and not just what the terrain around you demands. We publish twice a week. Go to shellyrood.substack.com and subscribe. Mission Wildflower is powered by others over self.

I do wanna talk about the weight issue, um, specific again to our military women, because when we start getting into premenopause, perimenopause. Um, military women enter menopause at an earlier age than your average civilian. And weight is a big issue. And as you grow older, the woman actually stores her adipose, like, fat tissue deeper inside. And so she gets like that barrel stomach and starts to lose the figure 8. It's amazing to me that you and I are able to have a conversation about the same thing, and we might not be able to get that figure 8 back that we had in our 20s. Um, but we can definitely try our hardest to have the healthy body, right? And we can hit the gym and we can do our crunches and, and all of that— crunches, but those are not very healthy actually. Different types of, of ab work.

Gosh.

But the weight thing, you know, how, how do you deal with it? So like, I know I just went to a gala and I try, and I, I have 3 children and I'm past the third, and I'm, I definitely have a solid 15 that needs, just flat out needs to come off, shouldn't be on Shelly's body. And trying on dresses for the gala, it's like, who is this body? It's not mine, you know. Am I ever gonna get it back? What are some of those questions that you have in your, your mind as you kind of go through your daily wardrobe?

I mean, I don't fit in a lot of my stuff anymore cuz I've gained, well, I've gotten more consistent with all the weightlifting too, but it's weird cuz dysmorphia is able, because like I'll even look in the mirror and I'll try to dress girly for lack of a better word. And I just don't feel like myself, but I have to tell myself like, that's okay. It's okay to dress comfortably and I can dress nice and I will find something that works. But I'm not gonna go out if I don't feel comfortable in it. And the other thing is, is like, I'm not dressing to impress other people. So I'm at a place in my life where I just don't care anymore. And I think that it's not like letting go or anything, but like, I don't care about impressing other people and them saying, oh my God, she looks so good. She's so beautiful. I'd rather do good things and just feel good with myself at the end of the day. Like if I can go to sleep and be like, okay, I helped someone today. That's all I need. I need that. I've moved past a lot of external validation, not all of it, but most of it. And I think part of that was also being on TV and being heavily criticized for literally everything. Like I remember getting made fun of cuz my nail polish was chipped because I play guitar and someone was like, she looks so trashy. Look at her, blah, blah, blah. And I'm just like, Who are you? Like, this is crazy. But people will always find a flaw. You could be the most beautiful person in the world. You could do so many good things and be drop dead gorgeous, and someone will still find something that they just decide they don't like about you. So I don't know. I just, as far as like looking in the mirror, I try not to be too hard on myself, which is way easier said than done. But I try to remind myself like, my body keeps me alive. And the more I'm learning, even just in school with anatomy and physiology, your body created its own electricity and makes itself alive with sodium potassium pumps. And you have a personality and that's crazy. I think that is so mind-blowing, like your fart. The, all the little cells in your heart, they first start just going crazy and firing and they learn how to work together and start a heartbeat. And that's how you're alive. That's crazy. I think that's crazy. And I feel like when you have that kind of perspective, the superficiality, and it's not necessarily a bad thing, cuz I understand looking at yourself with a critical eye. I do it every day. But when you put it in that perspective, you're just like, that's wild. I'm alive. That's crazy. And it helps. But also I think like it means more. There are like, well, I was gonna say like, even if you can't get rid of like a little pooch, like I have a tummy. It's in right now. It's like Venus, the Greeks and the Romans and everyone that meant you were fertile and beautiful and everyone wanted you. So I'm all for the little tummy. But also like, if that's something that you have, you can be like, this is because I got to have a family. So if you change your, you reframe it, it's reframing thoughts and it's hard to do, but I think the more you do it and realize like the gifts that your body has given you, then it helps a lot more.

Well, moving away from that superficiality, you're such an incredible person. To have lived on that extreme of it and share the wisdom with us of what that can look like. 'Cause as you know, even in the military you're still compared, right? You still have PT tests, you still have marks that you have to hit, right? Rank, all of that. Can you share a little bit about the comparisons that you're seeing now and how different they are from what comparisons were in the civilian life?

I think the most that I've noticed in the military is that I have senior enlisted who've been in way longer than me, and I'm just this little 01. And they're, I wouldn't say they're like significantly older than me, but they have the, they're more menopausal and have the hormone fluctuations that come with being closer to middle age, which whatever, I have to get ready for it too. And they come to me asking for help because they know I'm in all the fitness and everything. But I think the biggest thing that I've noticed too is preexisting injuries and things that limit the mobility and ability to work out and do certain things that they used to be able to do. So they feel like— I, I think a lot of people are uneducated about regressions. So they don't know how to back down with certain movements, so they just don't go because it's very discouraging that they can't— you can't do a pull-up. And I'm like, do ring rows. And they're like, I don't know what that is. I'm like, I'll show you. But they need that push, that education. And it's kind of like not knowing what to eat because you don't know how to read the nutrition value, which a lot of people don't. When I was a personal trainer, my first session with people was teaching them how to read the nutrition label.

Working with people who are older than you and even outrank you in, in some sort, how is it personality-wise? Do you, 'cause that's a whole different ballgame than it is in the civilian world.

I think for me, coming in from a civilian, not prior enlisted, I am an officer, which I outrank a lot of people automatically, which is crazy because like I said, I've got like I've got a senior chief who's been in his whole life. I've got my command, well, she's about to be a master chief. She's been in her whole life and she's freaking a master chief. Like, there's not a lot of those. That's crazy. But I think if you're not arrogant and you're not full of yourself and you're just a genuine person and you, you want to learn, which is, I strive to just be curious all the time. I, people use acronyms, I'm like, what's that? I don't know what that is. I'm not afraid to feel stupid. I'm not afraid to look stupid. I'll just be like, hey, I have a really dumb question for you. My senior chief's like, there are no dumb questions. And I'm like, yep, you're right. Just dumb people. And I'm one of them. Hey, can you answer this? But no, I think that your attitude, if you're someone like me in my position, that attitude is what sets the tone with how people perceive you. And we are social animals. We all wanna be liked whether we're introverted or not, which I'm incredibly introverted. But like, I go in asking questions. I want to understand. If I need help, I will ask for it because I want to do well at my job. I'm in an O3 billet, which is crazy. I'm in a lieutenant job.

So I ask— I know, that's really hard.

I ask for help a lot. I have a lot of responsibility that I was like, I don't, I've never even heard of this. I don't know what that is. And I just ask. And I think that because I'm not, I mean, I try not to be a butthole, then I think like that's because that's why they have respect and they want to help me because that's, the Coast Guard's really small. And I think that especially these people who've been in for a really long time, They understand that for a lot of, like, especially senior chiefs, you're supposed to take junior officers and you make them into better officers as they progress in their careers. That's kind of the whole chief-JO relationship.

So, you see that happening as you, I mean, you, you are so young, you've only been in, I mean, young, like as in green in the military. You've only been in what, like a year, a year and a month or something.

Almost a year.

How do you see that ability to mentor others happening for yourself? I mean, there's gotta be people looking up to you already. There are.

And I've even talked to my senior enlisted about, like, that's where I think the lives I've lived, like, as far as my psych degree, and actually I used to work with the Lone Survivor Foundation, so I worked with a lot. I went to the retreat. I saw people who had dissociative identity disorder, which, if you've ever actually seen that in person, it's interesting. It's fascinating. It's terrible, but it's also fascinating. But I think that my background in that, we've all been able to help each other to some capacity. I have had senior enlisted ask me life questions, which I'm just like, first of all, flattered that you think I'm smart enough to answer that. But I also come from that background of, I have, I've been through a lot. I always tell people I might be new to the Coast Guard, but I'm not new to life. And I've had some younger enlisted who, think about it, like they're pretty new too. They might have been in like a year more than me, maybe two, but they'll, sometimes they have attitudes and that's okay because I tell myself, I'm like, look, they're really young. This is an opportunity for me to lead and show them that leadership doesn't always, isn't always toxic, that I want them to succeed.. And my hope for them is that they stay in the Coast Guard and that they have a good experience when they leave this command. So, I think, again, priorities. You just have to prioritize what you want. And at, in the morning, I ask myself like, "What kind of leader do I want to be today?" And at the end of the day, kind of reevaluate and be like, "No, I feel good about today." And I think it's easy for people to not do any of those things, and probably a lot of people don't. But I overthink everything in life.

Well, Jess, I wanna take you back to your decision to go into bootcamp. And I wanted, I want our audience to feel what that feels like. Do you remember the moment? Did you get on a plane? Did you get on a bus? Where did you go? What was ahead of you?

For officer school? 'Cause I did not go to bootcamp.

Yeah. So for the very first thing that you ever did that was military related, tell me what it feels like. Like for a grown, mature woman to have her first day in the military?

Well, I think my first real interaction with the military was MEPS. MEPS is so terrible. I have a friend whose son is getting ready to go, and I'm like, don't tell him anything. Just let him go.

Just let him experience MEPS. So for our listeners who don't know what that is, it's the Medical Processing Center. For anybody who is even thinking about enlisting, you have to get a very, very thorough medical exam. Thorough.

Thorough is a great word. But I just remember, like, all the docs had a terrible attitude. And I told myself, I was like, I guess I would too if I had to handle pee cups and look at buttholes all day. But it was also really interesting because there were so many younger people who were were like straight up 18, just joining right outta school. And I already had my degree and everything. I was just jumping through the hoops and doing medical, but you could tell they were pretty anxious. This was all new to them. They didn't have that life experience. I've done a lot of stuff. Like they, there was that little locker line of lockers and then they had this little curtain out like that big and people were trying to get into their underwear so they can go see the doctor and they're like squeezing in between it. And I was just out there like, I'm like, oof, because I'm like, I don't, 30-something, I don't care. But it was interesting to see the difference in how people acted during that time, especially because I was the only female Coast Guard officer going to MEPS. There were 2 other guys going enlisted. That was it. 3 of us. And I was like, wow, Coast Guard is small.

Yeah, probably a lot of Army in there.

Tons of Army and then a lot of Air Force 'cause it was Montgomery, Alabama. So it was at Maxwell. But my first real military experience, getting to New London, Connecticut to report at the academy, and then reporting at the academy, they just immediately started, like, we all ran down a hall. No one knows what to do. I'm just like, I have no idea what's happening right now. And you go downstairs and they just immediately start screaming at you. Everything you do is wrong. It's just wrong. It's all wrong. You're breathing wrong. What are you looking at? Keep your eyes straight in, in the boat, they say. So I was like, "Okay, this is going to be a fun 12 weeks." And you made it. I did it. I was like, "It's finite. It has an end.

Just keep going." That experience of walking into the wilderness of the military. We talk a lot about experiences of wilderness where you're thrust into things that either there's no training manual for, or it just totally wasn't expected, or situations where you have to make some type of moral decision and there is a no win when you come out of it. Is there any other story that comes to mind that you'd like to share with our listeners when you think about just moments in Jess' life that have just been nothing but pure wilderness, and by golly, she made it through?

That just sounds like my whole life in general. I feel like I've been in— what are the weird woods in Siberia with the strange electromagnetism that makes all the trees grow crazy, and when you go in it, you just get lost? That's my life. It is that woods. I don't remember what they're called, but yeah, I never knew that I was gonna join the military. It was always, I, I remember as a kid I was like, I'm gonna be a famous singer. And then I realized the price of fame and I was like, I don't know that I wanna do that. I love making music on my terms and I will continue to do that and I'll do it my way.

And what is the price of fame, Jess?

I just, I can't become what other people want me to be. I don't wanna sell out. And I'm not saying that everyone who is famous is a sellout. I'm just saying that for me, I like, I went to the Grammys in 2019 and there's a lot of really dark stuff in Hollywood. And I started meeting some of these higher up people and it gave me the creeps and it didn't feel right to me. And I don't want to be associated with certain people. And there are some wonderful people too, don't get me wrong. But there is a dark side. And like I said, Hollywood is the most superficial place I've ever been to in my life. And I've had people tell me that I needed to lose weight. I've had people very stealthily, like, try to change lyrics in my music. And it always starts with one inch, and then they work their way up. And then all of a sudden you realize it's not even your song anymore. And when I say I wanna do it my way, I'm gonna write songs the way I want to. I don't need someone telling me, "I don't like this word here." I'm like, that's about something I lived through in my life. Like, I have an ex-manager who took all my copyrights to my last album and put a really bad taste in my mouth. And I'm just like, I don't want anything to do with that. I'll do my own stuff. And I wanna surround myself with people I trust and people who are like-minded, people that are creative, people I— believe in, who believe in me, and that's it. I don't, I don't need the same.

That's such a deep betrayal. How do you deal with that? How do you think of that person and not wanna throw something against the wall every time you think of them?

We went to, I don't wanna call it court, it was like a hearing, but it nullified the entire management contract because it was, and you can look this up online, it's me versus LA Entertainment or Warrior Records. He was, he had a bunch of DBAs and he didn't have any of the stuff for it. But, uh, lied outright like 5 different times. Refuses to, still refuses to give my copyrights back. But the way I look at it is this world is a broken world and you will reap what you sow. And I will have, I'm just gonna live my life and try to be a good person. So you're, yeah.

Knowing that some— somewhere he's gonna get his. That's the promise that God gives to us.

But the thing is, is he's already miserable. If you don't do that to a singer-songwriter if you're not already miserable. So you can take all the little Greek vacations you want. You can try to run away and fill that hole, but that's, again, that goes back to the superficiality. Like, money doesn't solve all your problems. It can help with a lot. I love money. But it has its place, it has its time, and I care more about my character.

That's an incredibly powerful testimonial. Thank you for sharing that with us, Jess. Before we wrap up here, I wanna ask you something that we ask every guest, and that is what makes you so hardcore? What is it in your life that are, you are just deeply dedicated to that if it disappeared from your life, you wouldn't be Jess anymore? What makes Jess so hardcore?

Oh gosh.

I really like hard rock. And I, and people don't realize that that's like all I listen to. Because I write this country music, but a lot of my inspiration and my vibes and the depth of my lyrics is inspired by really heavy music.

Such as?

Like, Shinedown's my favorite band. And that's more, that's on the, that's a tamer side of things. I like Beartooth. But then on the really heavier side is this Russian band called Slaughter to Prevail. And I swear when I listen to them, I lift a lot heavier. But if hard rock were to disappear, I would not have catharsis. I would probably just be a bundle of nerves and freak out because it's such a relief for me to just be like, oh, and listen to my angry music. And people are like, oh my gosh, are you okay? And I'm like, believe it or not, this calms me down. So that would be my, my hardcore thing, I guess.

I love that. And then opposite of that, I mean, you have figured out how to be at ease. It seems like you really are in such a positive path and it's a joy that I get to connect with you when you're in this stage of your life. So please tell me, how do you stay at ease as you walk this very complicated walk that you're on?

Read your Bible. Read it a little bit every day, even if it's just one verse. It helps.

All right. Straight from Jessica Muse. Thank you so much for joining us today.

Thank you. It's been awesome.

And that was my conversation with Jess Muse. You just can't win. That's the line she gave us. And it wasn't bitterness coming through. It was clarity. Most of us who are trying to hold down more than one ambition at once, well, we know what she's talking about today. The version of her, of the music career, the job, and the calling to help people— will those 3 ambitions all fit together without friction? But that's not happening where she's physically located in Juneau. And you might be facing that same quandary. Maybe you have incredible ambitions that you know you're holding dear, but they just might not be moving for you because of where you physically are. Here's what I want you to take away from this conversation: Leaving something unfixed isn't the same as failing at it. Jess is still holding her 3 ambitions. She just stopped waiting for the friction to disappear before she let herself feel whole inside of them. So this week, pick one ambition that you've been putting on hold until everything calms down. That moment of calming down might might never come. Choose which ambition, and then choose the smallest version of it that you can do today. For Jess, that's one verse of scripture. For you, it might be 10 minutes with the instrument you haven't touched in months, or the phone call that you've been meaning to make. Just do the small version. Don't wait for the big one to make sense first. That is how you stop waiting to feel whole and start being whole right now, in the middle of everything that's still unresolved. Whatever you're taking away from today's episode, come and tell me. I want to know how you're moving forward to better the world. You can find our online community at join.othersoverself.com. I'm host Shelly Rood. Thank you for spending time with me today. Another Tuesday brings another unwinnable situation for us to navigate together. Until next week, stay hardcore, be at ease, and trust the process.

You're listening to Hardcore and At Ease. Keep the conversation going at join.othersoverself.com.