D.J. Vanas: This Former Military Officer Uses Native Warrior Principles To Get Better Life Results, And So Should You

I do really believe 100% from every part of me that everyone has the capacity to be able to do the things that they want and not to be held back by the mental baggage that's in our head that we want to push through.

Welcome to the do the Thing podcast. In each episode, we get down and personal with people who go after the things they want to make all their wildest dreams come true. Join us as we unveil and dissect a formula for what it takes to do the thing. Here is your host, Stacy Lauren.

Hey, everyone. Welcome to the do the Thing podcast. This is your host, Stacy Lauren. I can't wait for you guys to meet today's guest. We had such an incredible conversation about contribution, fulfillment, and even something new that I learned called circular mentorship. And we really talked a lot about the my people part of the do the Thing formula and how it can really impact you in your life. And I feel so lucky to be able to meet the people that I'm getting to meet through my podcasts and also doing other people's podcasts. I was actually connected to this guest from someone that listened to me on another podcast. So it's really exciting how this whole thing's sort of evolving as I move. And I'm so excited to welcome DJ to the show. Hey, dj.

Hey, Stacy. How are you today?

I'm doing good. How are you?

I'm doing great.

I'd love to just start off for the listeners and actually, I'd love to hear all about you and your story.

Well, I am the owner of Native Discovery Incorporated. I am originally from Muskegon, Michigan. I'm an enrolled member of the Ottawa Tribe. I am a former military officer. I went to school at the Air Force Academy and became a commissioned officer for almost 10 years. And I got my master's at University of Southern California. And while I was in the military, I was. I worked in the space warfare arena. And. But I also had an opportunity to. To get involved in recruiting for the Air Force Academy for a year. And it completely changed my life because I went out and I talked to different tribal communities about the power of education and making good choices, creating the right environment for success. And it kind of grew into its own thing. And so when I left the military in 2002 as a captain, I started the business I run now. And what I do with Native Discovery is I show people in organizations how to use our traditional warrior principles in action to get better results than what we do in life, leadership, and service. And that warrior role from the tribal viewpoint goes way beyond the Hollywood image, you know, that we're so familiar with, the sweaty, chiseled figure knocking down buildings and shooting bazookas. It's very much a role that is about contribution to our tribe, about serving someone else well, about leading by example, fighting for something bigger than our own personal welfare. And it's something I'm extremely passionate about sharing with other people. I think we've got some great traditional wisdom ideas in our tribal cultures that have direct impact in the way that we live our lives today. And I would argue they're more needed now than ever. So I'm also the author of three books. The Tiny Warrior, which is now printed in six countries. And my second book was Spirit on the Run, which is a novel, inspirational novel. And my third book, which just came out in. At the end of summer in 2022 through Penguin random House, is entitled the Warrior Within. And so that's what I do, and that's where I am right now.

Yeah, this is so cool, because it's. It's so neat because we were connected through someone that had actually listened to my podcast, episod on another podcast. It was a book. I'd sold books in college. Were you part of that at all?

No.

Okay. Yeah. So I sold books in college. And then he. The someone had listened to that episode, and then he heard me and was like, oh, my God, you have to meet dj, because he is perfect for your podcast. And so it's just really neat to hear you say all these amazing things you're doing, because it's. There's just so much depth to everything that you're. You're telling me. And then it's amazing how each thing has led to pretty much what you're doing now.

Yeah, it's been a crazy chain of events, but I look back, you know, when we actually take time to reflect on how we got to where we are at the present moment. You know, you look at this journey of. As a series of ups and downs. And in the moment when we're going through something, especially the hard things, you know, especially when you're talking about doing the thing that scares the, you know, out of us. But even if we're struggling through and stumbling, you look back later and you realize, oh, my gosh, that was the perfect thing that happened. And you don't see it when you're going through it. But if you have faith and you keep putting that one foot in front of the other, it can lead to some pretty amazing things.

Yeah. And I like that you mentioned that that's something that I've really noticed recently is that concept of everything that you go through, you know, ends up leading to something else. And so it does make no matter what you go through a lot easier. But I just wonder, is that age thing that helps you get there or do you think people that are younger could get there so then they realize this epiphany that you get when you're. As you go through life?

Well, I think it's both. I think you. You get it as you get older just because of what you experience. But I think as a young person, if you start to create the mindset that all things are workable, that all things can lead to something better. I wish I would have had that mindset earlier because sometimes when things didn't go right, you know, you kind of feel wo is me this isn't going to work out. You know, the doubt and the hesitation and fear all start to kind of cascade over the top of you. I wish I would have had a better understanding of that mindset, how important that is to just go into everything and realize there are no mistakes, there's only learning and everything can be added into your growth. I wish it wasn't this way, Stacy, but it really is. We don't learn a lot when things are going well. We just don't. When the sky is blue and our belly's full and the bills are paid, we don't learn a lot. We coast. But we learn an awful lot about ourselves, about the world we live in, about our capability when things get really hard or go pear shaped. And if we can embrace those moments, that's sometimes the best stuff we ever get is we, we see those that growth happen in us that wouldn't have happened in any other circumstance.

Yeah, that is so good. And then was the Tiny Warrior, was that your first book that you wrote?

Yeah, that was a. It was a small book. It was written as a parable. It was printed through Andrews McNeil. And it's just a short story about a young guy who is not where he wanted to be in life. He's 27. He, you know, he settled for second best. A lot of moments in his life, he's just kind of struggling, kind of just doesn't have a direction. And he finally sits down with his grandfather who starts telling these stories about a little kid who lived hundreds of years ago. And all the characters are native and of course just the main character, Justin thinks, you know, hey, these stories are for kids and I'm not a Kid. And these stories don't have relevancy anymore. We live in the space age, you know, the age of genetics. You know, these old traditional stories don't have a place in the world. And. And again, my whole argument is not only are those ideas, you know, needed, I think they're more needed now than ever. And so that's what the story is all about. But it's, it's really, you know, kind of unpacking some of the traditional wisdom concepts about personal growth, about who we surround ourselves with. And, and really the, the idea of that. It was the first book where I presented that concept from a tribal perspective on what a warrior is. And like I said, it's a servant, it's a contributor. It's not somebody who's in it for the glory, but somebody who's in it to impact somebody else's life.

Yes. So how did you actually get inspired to write that book? Was it after you left, did you. And you left the military? Right?

Yeah, it was. I started writing the book during the time that I was getting out. The book came out right about the time that I, I left the military. But no, it came about, number one, I've always been an avid reader and also have always loved to write. And. But the reason why the book came out is because, you know, you get asked over and over again, do you have these ideas written down anywhere? And after you get asked that the hundredth time, you, you start thinking, well, maybe I should. So that kind of was the, you know, the impetus to finally sit down and start putting these ideas into a written form. And I'm a huge believer of our tribal traditions, of the oral storytelling tradition. And so it was very important to me to write something that was story based. I think people learn a lot better when, you know, we hear it through story. It's the stuff that sticks to our ribs. I don't remember a lot of what I took in thermodynamics class at the US Air Force Academy when I went, but I remember stories my grandma told me when I was seven. And so that it was really important for me to use that as a vehicle to transmit the ideas I was trying to share.

And I was wondering too, do you, do you think that it had anything to do with that transition from, like, you realizing you're leaving the military and then going into a different phase of your life? Was that inspired at all by that?

Yeah, that was definitely a part of it, because I knew I was. I was going on to a different chapter of my life and career. And this was going to be something that I knew was going to be important for that journey. I was trying to, I guess, pack my bags, you know, in the right way by developing this because I had an idea of there's no time like now, you know, I'm getting ready to, to open a door and go into a new world. And I want to make sure that I have this completed. Because it was kind of one of those kick the can down the road and then you get to a point where you're like, the time is now. And so that's when I started sitting down and writing it. And it was a lot of work. Every book is tough. It's, it's a. You know, the creative processes are, are not always pretty or, or straightforward. They're messy and scary at times and frustrating. But it's always a beautiful journey, you know, especially looking back, I have a lot of fond memories of writing that book and happy it's out there in the world.

Yeah. And how did you go from like the time is now to actually doing it?

Well, I got to a point where the time, as I got closer and closer to leaving the military, you know, there was a finite timeline I was working with. And so that was kind of a good spark, you know, there, there's. I always think that there's a good motivation behind a deadline. Gives us clarity. It gives us a renewed sense of purpose. This is also why more work gets done three days before a vacation than the previous three weeks. You know, we have clarity in those moments on what to say yes to and what to say no to or not now to. And it really makes us a lot more effective and more likely to get something done when we know that we have, you know, an X amount of time to do this. And so that was really kind of a spark. It really helped. But once I started it, I got really excited about writing it. And the more I wrote, the more I, I realized, you know, maybe there's something here that's going to benefit somebody else. And. But that being said, I kind of gave up halfway through the book. That fear and doubt started to kind of bubble up and I started realizing, you know, I've never done this before and what's the point? It's probably not going to work anyway. You know, we do that self sabotage thing and I had some conversations with friends and they're basically like, hey, you're never going to know what this can become if you don't see it through. And so I finally went back and I started writing it again. And finished. And lo and behold, it attracted an agent out of New York City and then it attracted a publisher. And now the book is printed in the U.S. canada, Japan, China, Korea and the United Kingdom. So you never know where those ideas can lead you. But the important thing is you got to get them done.

So if someone else is experiencing self sabotage in that way, because that happens a lot. What, what do you, what's your advice in that situation?

I, I think it's really important to constantly feed your brain positive affirmations. Constantly. And the reason why I say that is because we are in a world where we are constantly bombarded with the negative, you know, with the, the fear based stuff, the lack that you're not as good as this person and you never will be. And we get these messages that just really derail our gifts, our potential. And so making sure that we're doing this every day, that we're, we're giving ourselves positive affirmations that we're catching ourselves in mid conversation with the way that we talk to ourselves, that's critically important. Our words can build up or cut down. And those words start with the way that we talk about ourselves, the way our internal dialogue and, and sometimes, you know, I, I've learned to catch myself over the years where, you know, you ask yourself, are these thoughts useful? Because sometimes we catch ourself ruminating and going, well, this is never going to work. And when you ask yourself a simple question like that, a lot of times you come up with the answer, no, these, these aren't really useful. These aren't building me up. These aren't helping me move in a direction. So we gotta be careful with the language that we use towards ourselves. The other thing I would recommend is surround yourself with good people. You know, I had an elder tell me years ago, our spirits are like sponges. They soak up whatever they're around. And it's up to us to be our own best environmental engineer, create the environment we want to be in the quickest way. I've, I've found to become a health, happy, healthy person is to hang out with happy, healthy people. Quickest way I've seen to become a, become a gossiper or complainer or a negative person is to hang out with that group. So we get to design the environment that we're in. And I would recommend to, don't just be selective, be picky who you surround yourself with because it matters. Zig Ziglar had a great quote years ago, incredible guy. Got to meet him a couple times and he since passed. But he really was a legend in the, in the speaking industry and writing as well. But he had a great quote. He said, it's hard to fly like an eagle when you're surrounded by turkeys. And so we have to be very judicious who we surround ourselves with. And we want those people in our corner that hold. Not only cheer us on and give us encouragement, but also hold us accountable for what we're trying to do. That's really important, too.

Okay, I'm thinking we need to go. Hearing you talk, I. I don't do this a lot because I haven't. I haven't published the formula publicly yet, but I have started to sort of speak to it with some people that I think can really connect the dots with all the pieces. So through all the podcast episodes I've done, I've uncovered a Do the Thing formula, and you've already kind of mentioned a few of the pieces. So I'm, I'm thinking we should just go through it, if you don't mind, and we can kind of talk about how you incorporate it in your life and then also, since you're working with companies, how you help the companies implement it with the employees, if that. If that sounds okay.

Yeah, absolutely.

Okay, cool. You're, like, touching on the pieces, and I'm like, oh, my God, I have to dive more. But I feel like if we do it in a more way. And so before we, before I go through it, could you kind of talk a little bit more about with Native discovery and what happens? A company goes to you and they say, like, we really want our employees to have a warrior spirit or to have a warrior spirit. We want your help kind of getting that, getting that implemented or what's kind of the typical way a company will. Will work with you.

Yeah, I mean, that's the beginning of the conversation right there is, you know, and that warrior spirit is at no quit all grit, we will find a way forward type of attitude. And I unpacked that in the programs on where, you know, our traditionally, our warriors in our tribal communities were, were exemplars of this, you know, these principles in action. I mean, they fought against incredible odds. They were outnumbered, outgunned, you know, but they still found a way to do what they needed to do to protect their people. And that's one of the things that when you, you break down these principles on, on resiliency, self care, on creating the right environment for, for success, personal courage, leadership by example, becoming an elder, you know, not just gathering all this Great wisdom and developing ourselves, but then handing it down to somebody else. I mean, all these things are the principles I teach in the work that I do. But that foundation is that. That warrior spirit or those warrior principles in action. And so it's about getting people engaged and what they're doing, understanding the importance and impact of service, realizing how important it is to take care of themselves in that arena so that we don't hit burnout or the worst thing apathy or we just don't care as much because we're so overwhelmed. So that's why I usually get brought in. It's. I, I do a lot of leadership development as well. And so that's typically what I do at keynotes or half day sessions, but in conjunction with conferences or you know, trainings to, to help strengthen their employees, to help develop them from the inside out.

I mean, it's gotta be such a huge benefit in this, especially now more than ever when everyone got so disconnected after Covid and, and just everything that happened with that. I can just imagine how much people are needing your, like your company to help them through this new transition back to productivity and being able to really focus on what really matters with their organization.

Yeah, we all not got knocked off center over the last couple years. I mean, it's been a weird and wonky time that nobody could have ever predicted, but everybody has been battered and bruised in some way and. But there, you know, our humanity got messed with. The. One of the highest endeavors we have. Our most sacred endeavor we have as a human being is our connection to other human beings. And a lot of that got affected going through what we've been through for the last couple of years. And it's, it really has left ripple effect a lot of times in a negative way as far as a debris trail. I was taught that traditionally we're a lot more like honeybees than we are like eagles. We need each other. We're better when we're with each other. We're social creatures by design. We were built this way. And so when we separate from that, all the isolation triggered a lot of things. Doubt, depression, anxiety, a feeling of disconnect that probably a lot of people have not experienced to that level in their lives. And I think we all struggled with it. But yeah, it's, it's a really important concept now because I've even been reading articles and, and listening to interviews about this idea of remote work is the panacea that we thought that's what it would be. And they're finding more and More. It's hard to have people committed to something when they don't feel like they belong and they don't feel like they're actually part of that organization. When you only see somebody once every six months or once a year in person, it's hard to have a sense of belonging in that environment. And they're finding that now.

Yeah, I. And if we go back to what we said in the very beginning, with everything sort of happens, even the bad things, and you get to kind of see your way through it as you kind of work through it, it's almost. That was the gift. Even though, like, obviously it was terrible with what happened and people lost lives and everything. I'm sensitive to all of that. But in terms of what we got from it, can having that conversation, I mean, people got to see almost wake up, right? And now there's time to have more meaningful connections and to be more connected to what they're doing and the purpose behind it. I even talk about the great. What is it? The great resignation, you know, where people finally, like, got to realize, wait, I don't need to keep this job. I could just do something else now. And I think companies got a. Like a glimpse of that the first time in a really long time. People do have choices, and I just think it was a good opportunity for everyone to be able to really explore what they really want from their life.

I think that's a great takeaway. I mean, that's a. It's a great insight. And. Yeah, I. I agree. I mean, we. We. And we got pushed into that realm, you know, where we kind of got forced into an arena where we realized that it's not an arena we would have chosen probably on our own, most of us, because we get so busy being busy, but we all had to restructure and pivot. Re. Pivot, pivot again. But along that. Along that journey, we learned a lot. And that was one of them, too. Is that the way that we were doing it doesn't have. That's a way to do it, but it's not the only way to do it. And that was, you know, I'll go. You know, one of the instances I had was doing virtual programs, you know, before the pandemic hit, I think that I. I had done two or three virtual things, and they weren't sessions, they were just meetings. But, oh, my gosh, I basically had to completely reinvent the business and use that as a. As a platform, one that I had never used before. You know, I had a dusty camera in the back of the drawer and pulled that out and started doing things a completely different way. And a lot of us had to do that. But we learn as we go. And that's a. That's a benefit of even going through tough times.

Oh, definitely. I think people learn to pivot and to be more flexible than ever before, because you really didn't have a choice unless you wanted to crawl under a cover, which I think we all sometimes wanted to do.

But, yeah, we had to figure it out. Right? We got pushed into a corner. And that's. And that's where creativity and innovation come from too, is a lot of times we are not. We're not plumbing the depths of our greatness or potential greatness until we run up against a challenge or a struggle. And like I said, sometimes that's the best stuff we ever produce in this life is when we go through the tough times that we go through. You know, we. Like I said, we don't learn a lot when things are easy. We can learn a lot, and we learn it really quickly when things go wrong.

Oh, my gosh, this is great. Okay, so we are going into the do the thing formula. Are you ready? Okay. So pretty much I interviewed at least 100 people, and then finally, I saw these common patterns and how they do the thing, and I really wanted to have it be an acronym. And so originally, I saw the word game come up when I put the words down of the different patterns. And then after looking at it again, I saw it's basically, I'm game is the acronym, and that's for the formula. So the I and I'm game is identify the why. So whatever thing you're doing, whether it's you want to walk more, you want to lose weight, you want to start a business, you want to join the military, whatever it is, you want to help your company out of a great whatever you're having to identify the why of why you want to do that thing. And you talked about. About it a little bit in the very beginning with that contribution. Right. Because that's a big why of why people want to do the thing. But I'm just curious, how do you approach the why part of it with the things that you're doing?

I was passionate about sharing the ideas. I teach now. I always got excited to share our culture and our cultural principles with other groups that were outside of our tribal communities. And I love sharing them within our tribal communities, too. And I found that the principles are so beautiful and powerful that they just. They transcend. You know, they transcend age and stage and race and, and environment. I mean, great principles that have impact are, are transportable. And so, you know, my belief and my passion was I want to share as many good ideas as I possibly can here walking the earth, you know, during the time that I have. And so creating a business to do that was, that was a big driver for me is, is to create something where I could go out and create a positive impact in my world and do my part in it. To share ideas on how people can be stronger, more capable, more impactful in their own world and do it in a positive, healthy way, not at somebody's expense, but in, in harmony with the people around them. And so that, that was a big part of what drove me. And, and, and it was such a passion that I was willing to walk away from the military to do it. I mean, I was 10 years into a 20 year career as an officer and that's usually not the time people leave the military. And I got, you know, kind of got it from every direction. People are like, what's going on? Why are you doing this? You know, you're all, you're halfway through your career. And it was a big motivator for me to leave at that time. And even my commander sat me down and said, is everything okay? You know, why are you electing to leave? And the answer I gave him was, basically, I found what I think I was meant to do and I want to get started. And so that was, that was a real spark. And it was scary. That being said, it was terrifying to turn in my paperwork and sweating. Waking up at night with night sweats and high anxiety, especially the 10 days before I turned in my paperwork. But I've made a lot of decisions that were just based on my head, and this one was based on something a lot deeper. This was a head hurt and a gut type of decision. And I'm glad I followed through because I tell you everything, everything in my life changed once I stepped through that portal. And as scary as it was, there was a great quote, it said, you know, leap and grow your wings on the way down. And I love that quote. Or leap in the net will appear. You know, another similar one. But I found that, you know, when you are courageous in your actions, you figure it out, you find a way. And I haven't looked back.

Yeah, I love that. And I actually haven't heard of the term stepping through the portal. That is so good.

And my favorite felt like it was, it was scary. With a Blue sky project, you know, I left the structure and stability and good pay and great benefits of a military officer's life to do something that had no guarantee, no structure besides what I created. And. But it. But it was something I believed in so deeply. I just felt if I don't try this, I will always look back and regret it. Yeah.

And what do you think when you said you found the thing that you were meant to do? What do you think gave you that confidence to be able to even say that? And where do you think that even came from, knowing that?

Well, I think it was two things. Number one, even since early childhood, I've always enjoyed working with people, serving people, telling stories, being an entertainer. And I look at what I do is kind of a third empowerment, a third entertainment, and a third education. That's kind of the way I look at my work. And so that goes all the way back to childhood. I mean, this has been in alignment since my earliest memory. The second reason why I think this was a discovery for me, that this is what I was meant to do is just because when I would do it, Stacy, I felt like something was so in alignment that it was almost transcendent. When I was doing the programs and I would be working with people, it was almost like it wasn't me doing it. Like you're floating on stage. It was. It was kind of a. Almost a spiritual experience. And when you're doing something like that and you. You're feeling that way, that is a big light from the universe saying, this might be your thing, and you pay attention to that, and you can build a life around something that you actually enjoy and are deeply fulfilled by. And if you ignore it, man, it's like throwing a gift away with both hands.

Yeah. I'm wondering. So I. I recently had this experience, too, and it is amazing and like nothing else I've ever experienced. I'm wondering. For me, it was my podcast that sort of released it because it was. I was able to speak things out loud, you know, and then also connect to other people in a way that was meaningful. And so by me being able to use my words, it really opened up. If you want to use the portal term, it opened it up. And I'm just curious, did you notice. Where did you. Was it the same way with the speaking thing? Or did you have a certain thing that sort of triggered it? Or do you know what that fork was that opened up?

Speaking. It. It was definitely speaking More. More so even than writing. I. I really enjoy writing, but speaking is. You know, I'm a speaker who became A writer, not a writer who became a speaker. And so I, I put speaking first and foremost, but where it really got triggered. And I, I look at this as one of those significant emotional events. As I was recruiting for the academy, I was going out talking about, you know, the officer path, you know, going through the academy or through Air Force rotc. I would go around and talk to groups and their. And students and their parents. And I got invited to go speak to a conference. It was a Colorado statewide parents coalition. And the biggest group I had spoken to was maybe 50, 75 people. Those are big, big groups for me. And I got asked to speak at this conference and I said, and it was from a friend of mine. I said, sure, I'd love to. You know, it sounds like my kind of people. And these are parents who want their kids to go to college. And it's first generation, most of them. And I can relate because I, I'm a product of that as well. And so anyways, I, I found out about a week before the event that they weren't expecting 50 to 75 people. They were expecting over 1200. And I think I died a little bit inside when I heard that number. And I could not. It. I mean, and I went through all these scenarios of how I could back out, and I just couldn't bring myself to do it. I said, I made a commitment months ago. You know, it's a week out and I'm already slated to be there. I don't want to let him down. I don't want to let them down. And so I remember the dinner that night. I mean, I'm sitting at the table and everybody's enjoying their meal, and I could not hear anything. It was like Charlie Brown's teacher in the background. Couldn't hear conversation. I couldn't eat. I couldn't swallow. And all of a sudden I hear DJ Vannis. And I walked up to that stage, Stacy, and it was like I was going to the gallows. And I get up there and my hands are shaking and I'm looking out at this sea of people. And I always enjoyed speaking, but in this moment, it just felt like terror. And I grabbed the microphone and I'm trying to adjust it and pull it up, and it popped out of the. The stand and hit me square in the forehead. And feedback all through. Everybody fell out laughing. And I, you know, in that moment, I just felt like I was melting inside. And then I realized, and it was just like a spur of the moment thing. I. I could either sit here and feel Like, I'm dying, which I felt like in that moment, or I can laugh with them. And I did. I. I started cracking up too. I was like, this is just too ridiculous to even put to words, you know? And once that happened, it was like the. The shell cracked. And I. The next 30 minutes of that was just pure magic. And it just opened up a gateway that I've been pursuing ever since.

Yeah. And it's cool because it's almost like when you picture yourself speaking in front of all those people, you think of what could go wrong.

Right.

And you hitting the mic in your face was probably not even be something you would expect, but it's that whole idea of people laughing, but you got to see that that happened, and it was actually kind of funny.

I didn't die. I didn't die. I didn't melt. I didn't ignite on fire. Yeah.

So then it almost opened it up more because that uncertainty became certain, and you're like, okay, that wasn't so bad. This is actually. Can be fun now.

Exactly. And once you get out of your own way with that kind of stuff, everything changes. It becomes a lot more fun. It becomes a lot more of a learning experience, and you just grow. You're. You're not trying to be a perfectionist anymore. You're. You're really a student of the craft, and I have been ever since. But I just realized, you know, it's. It. You know, sometimes we project those fears into. You know, we do make mountains out of molehills. And in that moment, I. It was just a great kind of splash of water in the face to realize it wasn't that as bad as I thought. And life goes on. So it wasn't. Wasn't that big of a deal.

I was also wondering. So the M and I'm game is mindset.

Yeah.

We talked about positive affirmations, which I love. And I was just wondering, what are some other really good mindset things that you've that you've used? And then also, I'm curious about the people that you're helping too, if there have been strategies that have been the most successful for you.

I think everything starts from a mindset point. I mean, that's your launch pad. And if you get that part right, everything you do after has a much better and different result than if we start off with the negative mindset. And the beautiful part about this, in a chaotic world is this is one thing we actually can control, that we actually have an influence over is the way that we think about the Thing in front of us, the story that we tell ourselves about what we're going through in any given moment in time. And it. And it matters. We have a mindset that says, whatever happens to me can be used for growth. That is a very different mindset than saying, I'm going to do this as long as it works out, but if anything goes wrong, I'm going to take that as a sign that this isn't meant to be. You know, we see that mindset at work, too, and I. I dabbled in that mindset at the beginning of the career because I kept thinking, well, if something goes wrong, that's going to be a sign. But once I started getting some traction and I started realizing, hey, this isn't going to be easy, but it's definitely not going to be impossible. Once I started getting that, it was almost. I could build from that gap, and I started incorporating more and more positive things in my mindset, which has led me to where I am now, which. Where I look at whatever happens as. I don't have to judge it as good or bad. I just have to figure out how to keep moving forward and how to use whatever experience I go through as. As a learning moment. Again, creating the environment, who you surround yourself with affects our mindset as well. Being around positive, encouraging people is tremendously helpful, especially when things don't go right. And then the mindset, and that's what I start off in my programs, too, is trying to get people to start thinking about their life, their career, their leadership, responsibility through a different lens. I was just. I just did a program last week, and. And that was one of the things. I was Talking to these 65 division directors for a tribe that I worked with, talk to them about the mindset of, you know, having a mindset that things can always, always be better, always. No matter what conditions we're in, no matter lack of budget, personnel, time, how many setbacks we've had, things can always be better. And the reason why that's so important is because the moment we lose that, all of a sudden second best doesn't seem so bad. And then third best is okay, and fourth best is all right. At least we're not as messed up as that other group. And we start getting this really apathetic kind of mindset working against us, where we scoop up the bottom of the barrel and hold up what's left and say, that's just how it is around here. It's like, no, that's not how it is. That's how we're allowing it to be. You know, the mindset starts with us that we can always improve, we can always grow, we can always do the next right thing. We can always make another step forward. We just have to keep our head up and keep moving.

Yeah. And what's coming to mind, too? Well, maybe this is from me watching a lot of episodes of the Profit lately. Have you ever watched that show?

Oh, yeah.

It's so good. And I. Because I owned a business for 20 years, and I, Like, I was in a staffing industry, and it was very. A lot of pressure and all that stuff. And I exited right after Covid. Like, got through. Got through Covid, and then that's when I exited after that. And I noticed through the watching the profit, how much I could have been better, you know, when I was running that company is like. Because you see the people, these owners that are in the fire, and they're just not taking a minute to step outside the fire, you know?

Yeah.

Like, be able to just look at things, you know, and that's what I think Marcus is able to do. The guy that is the one that invests in the company is he was able to look at it from the outside perspective and then give the insight to be able to, like, just get them to see it. Whereas if you're walking through it, it's hard. So anyway, that's just something that's coming to mind as we're, like, having this conversation.

It is. But that's why who we surround ourselves with really helps because we can get a more objective viewpoint. You know, we can get some critical feedback that's positive and. And, you know, helps us, you know, create solutions. Not just the encouragement part, but, I mean, we can. We can have people in our circle that hold us accountable and get us to see things in ways that we might not be able to see, because we are. Like you said, we're standing in the fire.

Yeah, no, totally. Okay, so the next letter. So we're. We did I'm. So that's. I is identify the Y. M is mindset. Now we're on game. And the G is goals. So G is goals.

Okay.

And I'm just wondering. I mean, because, like, so many people have so many ways that they attack goals. Right. And I think what happens is people can get paralyzed sometimes because they think they have to plan, like, every single step, and so then they get, like, stuck. Right. And so that's why I'm really trying to help them see, like, there's so many different ways that you can attack goals. You know, and so I'm just wondering, what's your best kind of strategy for that?

My, my favorite, and the one that's worked for me really well over the years, Stacy, is, is kind of just having an idea about goals, that you're just taking a big rock and breaking it into little rocks. People get these great audacious goals and we're at the perfect time of year for that. You know, New Year's resolutions. People get really fired up about this big goal they're going to do in this next new year. And what happens is a goal without a plan is only a dream. You know, we've all heard that quote before. I don't know where it originally came from, but it's so true, is we just have the goal and then we have no way to get there without creating a game plan. And it's like, it's like wanting to jump to the top of a 20 story building. Nobody has the power to do that, but everybody, if you're physically able to, can probably climb a ladder. And it's just hand over hand, rung over rung. And so breaking that big goal down into small sections and then you're just doing a little step at a time. That's where I built my business. That's way I wrote my first book, my second book, my third book. Every project I do, when I'm doing a new, new program, I, I break it down like that because then it doesn't feel overwhelming. It's doable. That's the key, is you don't have to do it all today or this week. You just have to do something today to get you a little bit closer to that goal over time. But we tend to scare ourselves away from those awesome things that we want to achieve because we make it so big and we don't build a bridge from here to there. And it's really important that we create that. And when we do, it's just one step at a time and we arrive eventually.

Yeah, and I actually really like that visual that you said with the rock and breaking it into pieces. You get to see how each piece connects to this bigger thing as it gets connected. That's really, that's really interesting. I haven't had that as a visual before.

Yeah, and small steps matter. You know, it's like I, I tell, you know, people can eat a, you know, a human being can eat an entire buffalo by themselves, just not at one sitting. Well, a bite at a time and you can get it done. And that's the same thing. With, with the goals is, you know, you break it up into small pieces and it becomes not only realistic, it becomes exciting because it becomes doable.

So good. Okay, so we, we did the. I identify the Y, the M is mindset. Now we're on game. So we did G is goals, and then A is accountability. So that one's interesting because I've been learning, even just about myself since I've really uncovered this formula. I've been really trying to pay attention. What I need. I think everyone needs a different way to hold themselves accountable. Like, for me, once I announce something on the podcast that I'm doing it, I'm done. Like, that's all I have to do is say it out loud, put it.

Out into the universe. Yeah.

Oh, yeah. Like, and it's like, it's gonna happen. So I'm just kind wondering what's been your. Your best strategy. And then also as the people that you, you help too.

Yeah. Well, as far as. What's always worked well for me is, is you get. You have to have a brutally honest internal dialogue, is if you're setting a goal and you say, this is what I'm going to do, you know, at the end of the day, whether you did it or not and to what level you did it, and you have to be able to say, and if you fall short, it's not about beating yourself up. It's just saying, hey, didn't quite get where I wanted to be today. It's okay, I came up short here. And this is what I'm going to do differently tomorrow to get myself there. So you have to be able to be able to call yourself out, but do it in a compassionate way that actually spurs you forward, not beat the you know what out of you and crack the whip, because that, that just becomes unsustainable. Jacks up your stress. It also starts to affect your self image, where you. How many times can you kick yourself in the rear end and feel good about who you are? I think we can cheer ourselves to higher levels of performance, but we need to, you know, and it's about tough love, but it's. Let's not forget the love. You know, that's. That's what sometimes gets dismissed. The other part of accountability is again, who we surround ourselves with, having people that will give us honest feedback and that when we announce what goals we're working on, they'll check in with us, hey, how's that going? And you'll be able to talk to them about it, you know, whether it's going well, or you're, you're struggling. Just being able to have that sounding board is, is critically important to our success because we, we shouldn't be doing it alone. And if we are doing it alone, we're doing it wrong. Like I said before, we're violating the laws of nature. We were meant for connection. We were meant to be in company of others. We just have to make sure we're surrounding ourselves with the right people.

So. Good. And then we are. We've talked a lot about the M in game and I am like excited to hear if you have anything else to add because we, I mean you, the way you, the way you spoke about this, I have so many great visuals in my head. But the M is my people. So my people is different than like minded people. Because a lot of people talk about having the. Being the average of the five people in your life. Right. And being around supportive and encouraging people. But my, my thoughts are if you want to run a marathon and you just have cool, supportive, encouraging friends, but they don't run, it's really hard to get motivated to run the marathon. And so my people is really being around people that are doing the same thing as you, that want the same thing and that give you that community and the connectedness uni. And I think this is what your whole brand speaks on, is that tribal mentality and being able to support each other. So I just love to hear if you have any other thoughts on that, on that idea and why that helps you do the thing.

Yeah, I mean, that's the thing. You want to be around other people who are doing the thing. Yeah. Because you're going to be able to have these quality conversations that are, that are coming from a credible place. We can have the cheerleaders in our life that like you said that you know, you want to run a marathon, but you're with people who aren't running one or never have or never want to. But if you're training with other people who have run a marathon before or want to, it's a very different type of dynamic, a very different type of. A different type of environment to be in. Because what we get as far as feedback really feels a lot more significant because it feels a lot more real. And so when we're surrounding ourselves with people like that, I mean I, I have great friends who are also speakers, writers, friends that when I'm talking about changing my, my workout patterns, I'm hanging out with the, the friends that are actively doing that now or have done a lot more than I Have. That's a great person to put in your, in your mix too, is somebody who is doing it at such a high level that it helps guide you to higher levels of your own performance. It's also important, I think, to have people in. In your mix that are. That you're able to mentor. I love that process. I write about it in my latest book. I wrote about circular mentorship. Not just being mentored by people who have more skills and abilities than you have, but also mentoring people who are coming up behind you. And that way you stay in the state of Evergreen, you know, where you're, you're helping people get higher in their goals, but you're also allowing people to lead you to higher performance in your own life and career. And so I think that's a beautiful thing when you, when you have that credibility of people who are doing the same things or working on the same activities, because it's just. You're able to talk shop. Much more gritty, realistic level.

Yeah. And I'm sitting here smiling because the E in game is educate. And a lot of people talk about that. Right. Getting a mentor, educating yourself, listening to books, podcasts, taking courses. But I am so excited because a few weeks ago I interviewed someone that had done Alan on the 12 step program and she was talking about her big key on educate is when she's able to teach others and help other people. And I love, I hope you're okay with me using this. I love that wording because it is so true. It's like the more that you're able to, once you take it in, even when you're not an expert yet, even if you're just two weeks ahead of the other person that just started, you're still. And you can still give them so much value. And so that's the, it's your, the way you, you articulated that was so right. And that evergreen component, I think it really, really speaks to this concept so well.

Yeah, because we're getting, we're receiving and giving and when we do that, we stay in that circle of growth and development. It's a. We want to be. We don't want to be a vessel. We want to be a conduit. We want to be a pipeline. I think that's the best way when we talk about our own development because then we're not hoarding information. We're not storing knowledge way for ourselves. And our elders in our tribal communities are wonderful examples of this. And I write about them in my book too. It's a whole chapter dedicated to becoming an elder in your tribe. Our elders put themselves on a path to gather as much wisdom, as much knowledge, as much insight, as much life experience, the good, the bad, the ugly as they possibly could. Not so that they benefit themselves and store that away just for them, but so they can share it with other people in their tribe and empower them to higher levels in their own life. And there's a difference between becoming an elder and becoming an older. You know, elders put themselves on that path of continual development and sharing purpose with purpose. Getting older is automatic. You know, getting better is not. And so that's why our elders are such a great example of this. And we can be an elder in our tribe, too. Like you said, Even if you're two weeks ahead of somebody, let alone two years or 20 years, be able to help somebody, coach them, guide them, encourage them. And when we do that, we're also humbling ourselves. When we're allowed, when we bring mentors into our own life where we're willing to learn from somebody else, we're asking, how did you do this? How did you get there? What advice would you have for me? Oh, my gosh. We can shave so many years off of our learning curve if we just have the humility to. To allow that education process to happen.

So good. Oh, my gosh. I'm so glad I went through this with you. I feel like you added a lot to this.

I love this system. That's. That's. I really like it. That's great.

Thank you. Yeah, it's been fun. And then I've been kind of doing challenges in my community to use the formula on the people, and it was funny. One of the girls in the group was like, I love being your guinea pig, you know, because.

And the thing is, if we're serious about getting better at what we do and who we are, school is never out. We should constantly be in a state of education that should never end. Until we draw our last breath, we should still be trying to gather and learn as much as we can again so we can share it with other people. That's. That's what makes life fun.

Totally. Yeah. It's so great. Okay, I'd love to hear your number one piece of advice for the listeners on doing the thing.

The number one piece of advice on doing the thing. Have courage. Have courage. Be willing to step forward even if you don't see a clear footfall. You know where you're going to put your foot. Have courage. Have faith. Believe in yourself the things that are. You will amaze. Yourself when you start down a path that you've never been down before, that the things that were so scary aren't that bad. And even if they don't work out, you learn something valuable in the process. But it all starts with. With courage. Being able to take that, that leap of faith is critically important. But we never. We're not put here on this planet to be safe. We're put here to grow, to see what we can be capable of, what we can develop, what we can create. I think that's why we were put here. It's not to play it safe. It's not to play it small, hide in the shadows and hope for something good to happen. I don't think we live long enough to have that philosophy. But if we're ever going to grow into what we're capable of, where we're going to get, you know, to the other side of that fire and see what, how good things can be, we have to have courage. No risk, no goodies. That's another way to look at it. We gotta be willing to step forward even when it's scary, even when it's hard. Because those are the things ultimately that lead to pathways that will completely blow us away. Your. Your older self will thank your younger self for the courageous steps that you take today. Because I'll lead. Lead you to where you end up tomorrow.

Wow. I'm ready to like, go for a run right now. You look at me. All right, Got me all fired up. I'd love to have you share where people can learn more about you and, and what you're doing.

Yeah. Thank you. Our website is native discovery.com. that's the best place to get a hold of me or kind of get a snapshot on what I do, who I am, where I'm from, got videos there, information on my books, my programs, and then the Warrior within is my latest book, and that can be bought anywhere books are sold. Like I said, the publisher is Penguin Random House, and the Warrior within can be found on Amazon, Barnes and Noble, all the places you get books. It's also. There's also an audio version. I spent four full days in the recording studio, so I read the whole darn thing. If you're too busy to read, I'll read the whole thing for you. And There's a bonus 90 minute session at the end where I'm interviewed by one of my great friends who's a director at the National Medal of Honor Institute and a classmate of mine from the Air Force Academy. And we go deeper into some of the material, tell some new stories. And that's at the end of the audio version.

So good. I am excited. I'm going to check it all out, too. This was so great. Thank you so much for. Yeah, for being on here and sharing your wisdom. I'm really excited to listen back to this, take notes and. Yeah, if I'm a company and wanted to reach out to you, what would be the next step for them? Are you. Do you do like an introductory kind of a thing with them or what would be something they. They can look forward to?

Well, if they get on the website, that's the best. I mean, there's a contact form for, for possible for programs, but no, I mean, it would be a conversation that we would have about what their needs are and what I can do. I'm always looking for a great fit. I'm never looking to talk anybody into the work I do. If there's great message alignment, that's, that's the most important and we can find that out when we talk. But that's, that's always the first step I take.

Okay, perfect. All right, well, thanks so much for coming on. I really appreciate it.

Thank you so much, Stacey. Have a great day and thanks for the opportunity to be here.

You too.

Thanks for listening to the do the Thing podcast. We hope you enjoyed the show. But even more, we hope you'll be inspired to do the Thing. Do you have a burning question on Doing the Thing that you'd like answered? How about an inspiring do the Thing story of your own that you'd like to share? We'd love to hear all about it. It just leave us a voice message at dothothing callcast. Co or email us at hello at dothethingpodcast. Com.