Jennifer Hurvitz: This Relationship Expert And Dating Coach Wants You To Cut The BS, Rediscover Yourself, And Find The Person Who Is Right For You

I do really believe 100% from every part of me that everyone has the capacity to be able to do the things that they want and not to be held back by the mental baggage that's in our head that we want to push through.

Welcome to the do the Thing podcast. In each episode, we get down and personal with people who go after the things they want to make all their wildest dreams come true. Join us as we unveil and dissect a formula for what it takes to do the thing. Here is your host, Stacy Lauren.

Hey, everyone. Welcome to the do the Thing podcast. This is your host, Stacy Lauren. So it's so exciting to me when I get to talk to people who are doing things that are aligned with the things that I'm doing. I met our next guest through a participant that was in the do the Thing dating dare challenge and she told me about her cousin who is this amazing relationship expert slash dating coach. And it's funny, one of the groups I'm in, they're constantly sharing her videos in the group and how much it's resonating with the message that she's delivering. And so I reached out to her, really wanting to talk more about what she's doing and then how she's doing the thing and then also how you can do the thing in terms of relationships. Because as you guys know, if you've been listening to do the Thing for a while, this has been something I've been really exploring is just that idea of how people kind of get stuck in that rut of just constantly needing to just do one thing. Like people are stuck in dating apps and they're stuck in just not getting out of their comfort zone. And so that's kind of been my motivation, has been really getting people to see outside of that and see the world as open to them. And so I'm really excited to dive into everything this guest is doing because this is what her full time focus is on, is specifically on relationships. So I am so excited to welcome Jennifer to the show. Hi, Jennifer.

Oh, I'm so excited. Hi, honey, how are you?

I am great. Oh, my gosh. This is exciting.

It was such a nice intro. Oh, my gosh. Thank you.

It's great when especially a lot of the people from my community, right, they've been divorced and they're over 40, some of them are even 60s, 70s, and it's great. And I, I'm also in that situation. And when I see your videos and then I see their response to your videos and you're like the light right in their day, because you see them through the way that you're able to speak to them. And I just think that's so important to know that sometimes the things you experience in your life are the exact thing that someone needs to hear at that moment, that they need it.

Yeah, I. Absolutely. You know, it's funny, I don't see the response because I didn't even know that y' all were sharing my videos, because I'm not on your. I don't. I don't have a group for a peloton.

I don't know.

So I don't know. But my cousin, I love her, Jill, she's so funny. She said we. We post your videos. And I'm like, oh, I wish I could see. Can I join? Do I have to buy?

I know it's funny when people talk about the peloton community because they're just like. Yeah, they're. They're like the bike that goes nowhere. Who knew that all these relationships, like friendships would have gotten born from this bike that goes nowhere?

But I gotta tell you, it's amazing. And you know what? You guys have a really cool community where you can meet people and relate, talk about relationships, doing relationships. Right. I mean, there you go.

Yeah. And just so everyone listening knows, in case this might be your first time listening to the podcast, I have a peloton. I'm over 40. I'm in the peloton singles over 40 group. And when I started do the Thing, I wasn't even thinking of getting into talking about dating. And all of a sudden, I just got inspired during a Covid brain moment where I saw the truth or dare game that was played on this show called Working moms. And I was like, oh, it'd be really cool to do a dating challenge around dares and daring people to go outside their comfort zone. And so I posted it in the peloton singles over 40 group. And then a lot of people just immediately joined. And so anyway, my group is actually I do the thing singles group. But a lot of the people that ride pelotons are in that group. And so anyway, that's how Jennifer and I met. And I'm really excited to get into your let's do it story and how you got into what you're doing. So, yeah, please share everything about.

Oh, gosh. Okay, well, I'll start at the beginning, but if I start to get, you know, long winded, cut me off, please. Yeah, basically, I tell people I started my career by getting divorced. It was that's how it started. I was a stay at home mom and God, I was married for I think 12 years. And I just one day, like everybody else, I woke up and I was divorced. Boom. And I'm like, crap, now what am I gonna do? And it wasn't that quick, trust me. I thought about it for years and my ex and I, I call in my husband. We're amicable, we're best friends. He's still my emergency contact. I've been divorced for nine years and basically, like all relationships take work. Being happily divorced definitely takes work. And we just chose to be happily divorced. Just said, I basically said to him, look, if we can't be happily divorced, you're going to be stuck with me forever. So we ended up, we nested, we did the whole thing and long story longer, I wrote a screenplay and then screenplay kind of turned into my first book. One Happy Divorce. Hold the bullshit. And then I did what it could have shoulda. And then Recently I turned 50. I'm kind of going, giving the brief version. And then recently in October, I dropped my third book, which is called Midlife Priceless. A Dating Coach's Guide to Finally Doing Relationships Right. I think it took me about 50 years. Figure it out. But I love what I do and I tell people I wouldn't have my career if it wasn't for my divorce. So I think I took a really shitty circumstance and turned into something fabulous where I can help other people, which I love.

So it's so amazing just to know that when you can come outside of something that could be the hardest thing that you have to go through. And then.

Yeah, yeah.

And then you're able to now see it and get the benefits from going through that experience. And then other people are able to feel from your experience.

Yeah, well, you know, I started as a divorce coach. I went to, I got my certification and I was working. So my first podcast was doing divorce. Right. And I started in the divorce space and I'm a certified divorce coach and all that good stuff. And then as I started to evolve, my job started to evolve, my career starts and I started to change from once I got out of that divorce space because it was kind of, it was kind of negative for me. I got into a five year relationship that was serving me and really, really purposeful. And I was intentional about it. And I felt because it was hard after you get divorced, the dating is so different. Right. Two years post divorce, it's much different than dating nine years after your divorce. You're in much different Headspace. We can talk about that if you want, but it's just different. So doing dating Right. Evolved in. Right after Covid in 2020 to doing relationships right. And I kind of left divorce behind with my divorce. And as I evolved and changed and grew and did my own work, I kind of just morphed into doing relationships right. And now I work with midlife dating, which I love. So anybody over 40? Ish. I say 45, but it's really 50. And I love it. I love it. So that's my new.

I love how as you're evolving, then your community is able to almost see your evolution too, which I think is really cool.

Yeah. Thank you. Yeah. And I wrote about it. I'm real honest. I don't sugarcoat anything. I'm super authentic. I don't hide my stories. My clients know what I went through. People say to me all the time, well, how can you coach if your relationship failed? I'm like, oh, my God, that's the best coach ever. Right?

Totally.

Don't you want someone who went through it and then survived it? I think that makes the best coach. I don't think I would go to a divorce attorney or divorce coach that didn't go through a divorce. How could they know what you went through? They can't.

Well, yeah. And there's nothing that can trade that experience to be able to get through something like that. So do you mind first talking about the doing divorce?

Right.

And then we can kind of work through the process. So if someone's going through that right now, I mean, I just think you have so much wisdom in that area. Divorce is so hard, especially that you're able to manage co parenting. It sounds like too, yeah, I did it all. What would be some tips you might have for people that might be there right now?

Oh, gosh. Gosh. It's been a long time since I've spoken. Let me get my head straight here. Yeah, co parenting. I did. I don't know if you're familiar with nesting. It's funny because it's like everyone's talking about it now in 2023, and I. I think I did it 14 years ago. So nesting is where the kids stay in the family home and the parents live either together in an apartment or two separate apartments, and they move in and out so my kids didn't have to move. Does that make sense?

Oh, totally.

Yeah. Yeah, yeah. So. And it. Look, if you're not able to breathe in the same room as your ex husband or ex wife, then this will not Work. This is for people who can still be amicable and talk to each other. But it is definitely. You're putting your kids first. You're definitely throwing your ego aside and you're doing this for the kids because it's hard. It's hard to live in an apartment with your ex husband and every week you go into the big house and he comes out into the apartment. And we did it for nine months and it was hell, but we did it. And the kids were able to. They were 9 and 11 and they were able to get used to the changing of the parents instead of the changing of the house, which was awesome. And we also got to see what it felt like to change houses every week. So we were able to put ourselves in our kids shoes and whoa, was that eye opening? Because a lot of us don't get that opportunity, right? We just think the kids are resilient and they'll go back and forth and it's no big deal if they forget everything in their medicine, blah, blah. But I got news for you. It's not easy to pack every week and leave the house and forget your underwear or forget your this or forget your that, right? So it was really humbling for us as parents.

What did you find yourself doing while you're dealing with such a big transition for yourself and the emotions that come alongside that and then just being able to get through that time. What do you think has been.

And oh boy, you know what? I'll tell you, I. This also goes along with the dating too. My clients come to me often and they say, how do I know when I'm ready to date? How do I know when I'm ready to get back out there? And some coaches say, wait a year. I don't think there's a set time. I think everyone's different. Divorces are like snowflakes, right? Each one is very different. And everybody has their own time to heal and their own time to process and to go through it. And the grief. And it is. It's like losing, you know, you're losing the life that you thought you had, the dreams that you thought you were going to defense and the weddings and the babies. It's hard. It's really hard. So for me, it was just like I tell my clients all the time, like, just take your time. I think the one thing, the gift that you can give yourself is time. Don't beat yourself up. Don't feel like you have to get back out there immediately. Don't feel like you have to rush. Don't Listen to anybody else. People, they mean well. Your parents, your family, your friends, they mean well, but they don't know what you're going through. They just don't. Unless they've lived it. They don't get it. So give yourself the gift of time and just take it easy. Give yourself some grace and then you'll know when you're ready to get back out there. It's about your why. Not as much the when, but about the why. I write about that in my book too. It's like you have to know why you want to date, why you want to get back out there. Is it to Rex husband? Is it to have casual sex? Is it to find another long term relationship? Whatever your why is, just own that and take it one day at a time. My.

Do you have a good strategy for helping people tap into their why?

Yeah. You know, you're so good. You're a very good interviewer. Yeah, you know, I just, when I meet with my clients, you know, we sit down and, and perfectly honest. Like, if someone's why isn't the greatest and we're not really sure. And I can tell I'm not a therapist, but I do believe in therapy. I'm. Oh, God. I think it's the best thing you could do for yourself. I'm in therapy. Coaches need coaches, therapists need therapists. I'm a huge believer. I'm a mental health advocate. There's no shame in that game whatsoever. I really think that you should be talking to someone and figuring out your why with a therapist. And also, again, just taking the time you need to heal. You're not doing anyone any good. Your kids, yourself. I mean, I made so many flipping mistakes. Oh my gosh, so many mistakes. Because I thought I was ready. I wasn't going to listen to anybody either. I'm like, oh, no, I got this. I'll be fine. But you know what? I wasn't. So I think that's also why I wrote my books and stuff is just to like, hopefully I can help. Even if I can help one person.

Well, I'd love to. We sort of touched on the next phase of your journey, the doing dating.

Right.

But I'd love to kind of go there a little bit more. So what motivated that you realized, oh, I want to start dating now. And then how long did it take you to start speaking to that?

Okay, well, I'll tell you. So it was like doing divorce. Right. And then I went on the dating apps. I was on the dating apps for Gosh, Awful. And I Can. This is the truth of it. I get it. When my clients come to me and they're frustrated, I'm agitated. This is awful. There's no one out there. I mean, I feel their pain because it's hard. It's really hard. But there's a method to the madness, right? So when I finally figured out myself, when I finally figured out Jennifer and my attachment style and why I was so anxious and why I was. I did the work. When I did the work on me, dating became easier. Okay. So when I figured out, okay, it's not so much how to say this, right. I'm not trying to convince someone to want me. I need to go on dates and it's my job to figure out if they are the right person for me. Right. I don't really care if they like me or not. That's not my job. Too bad, Right. I want to know if they are the right fit for me. How about making myself clear? Right?

Oh, I speak to this all the time. When people say they're worried about saying something to someone, I'm like, why wouldn't you use that as a pre screener? If you can't talk to someone about something that's important to you, then they're not the right person.

They're not the right person. Right. I love that. Yeah. I mean, it's like I could go on for days, but yeah. So when I met my partner, we were together. We just obviously broke up probably six to eight months ago, but we were together for five years. We met at Match, and people are like, oh, my gosh, they actually work. The dating apps work if you're intentional and you are in a healthy space. I think it's more about dating intentionally and knowing exactly what you're looking for. Okay. If you're going into dating and you want casual sex, friends with benefits, situationship, and you're okay with that, then that's how you're going to date. If you go into dating with this, oh, my God, this sucks. I can't believe I have to do this again. Your first line of your bio is, oh, here I am again. Or can't believe I'm doing this again. I mean, that's going to get you nowhere. Nobody wants to date someone that's putting out that negativity. Right? So that's why I love what I do, because I feel like I'm a cheerleader. I just love working with my clients because I'm like, look, y', all, you've got to put out the outcome that you Want and it has to be positive or take a break. Right. You don't have to be on the apps. I don't know. If I just go all over the place.

I'm kind of. No, no, it's great. I mean, I, I like that idea of putting out the outcome you want. And then I really think what you're really speaking to is you're taking ownership for the part that you can control, not getting attached to a specific way. It has to go. Kind of keeping yourself open.

Yes, because I have a lot of clients that come to me after they've gone to other coaches or after they've been working with their therapist and they're like, I have a timeline. I need to be engaged in six months. I want to be married in a year. And I'm like, I'm not your coach. I'm just not. Because when you put that kind of stress on yourself, you're like cruising for a reason. You're asking for trouble. I have a theory that's in my new book. I call it the theory of Dating for now. And that's how I coach. I coach in the moment, I coach in the present. I coach without calendarizing. I want everybody to be living in a kind of a threefold world. I don't know if you know that book by Mark Owens, my hero, but he talks about a three foot world. And how do you know the story?

No, I'd love to hear it.

The background. Okay, so Mark Owens is a Navy seal. He's amazing. And he was doing one of his combat mission things, practicing for one. And he was climbing. They were all the Navy SEALs were climbing, they were training this. And he freaked out. He had a panic attack in the middle of the climb. And so his trainer, coach, whatever it is, climbed up next to him and said, look, take your breath, okay? I don't want you to look up, I don't want you to look down. You're not going to look behind you, you're not going to look ahead of you. You're going to focus on the three feet around you, all sides, and you're just going to move. And by moving, just staying in your three foot world, you're going to focus on just the present, just here in the moment, and you're going to get to the top. And when he got to the top and he realized that the only way he could do it was by just focusing at three feet around him, he was like, that's how I'm going to live my life. And I loved that analogy. My Actually, my boyfriend at the time when we were dating, I was always so anxious. I was always like, well, what about next week? And what are we gonna do for Christmas? And what if we're not together for this? And you know what? He's like, jen, Three Foot World. And he gave me the book and I read it. I was like, oh, my God. But it's just perfect. If we can just focus on living in the present and dating that way. You're not going to freak out, right? You're not going to start thinking, where is he? Why isn't he calling me? Because you're secure in your relationship, knowing it's just for now, right? Totally. Right? I don't mean for now like, okay, until the next person comes along. I mean for now, like now. Jim and I dated that way and we just kept going and going until we were both like, if it doesn't work, it doesn't work. We ended up dating five years. And then at five years, it wasn't serving us anymore. We weren't in a fight, we weren't angry, we weren't mad at each other. It just wasn't working. And it was hard. It was really hard to let go of him because it was comfortable. But if it's not serving you, that's not. That's not the relationship for you.

Well, you know what's interesting about that? And I just thought of this as you're talking to me. But doing relationships, right, is also knowing when to leave it. Because if you think about people that are married too long and they are together too long and they're staying in because the ride or die kind of thing, that's not good either.

That's how. Actually, that's how I started my book. That's so funny you say that because I thought I. In my relationship with Jim, my ex boyfriend, I thought I was quitting. He actually called me a quitter and he said, you're quitting on us, Jen. And I said, no, I'm not quitting. I'm choosing me. I'm not quitting. Don't call me a quitter, I said, because quitting is for. Oh, what's that line? It's like quitting is for. I have to think of it, I don't remember. But basically saying, I'm doing this for me. I'm choosing me this time, and I'm leaving because it's not serving me, right? So it was hard. It was really hard to let go of something because there was no on paper looking around. People were like, he's amazing. This guy has been. But it wasn't. We were in different places. It just wasn't working. You don't have to stay in a relationship. Right. You don't have to. Does that make sense? I don't know.

Oh, yeah. No, it's so true. I wanted to also talk about. You mentioned the attachment quiz. So that's actually, that was the first error I gave everyone was to take that quiz and then I had them read the book. And then there's actually a book club going on in my community right now.

Come to your book club with attached.

Yeah.

Yes.

I don't remember if I sent it to you, but I recorded an episode with Kate Middleton. Yeah. And that. Oh, my God, she did such a great job of explaining ways to handle that. But basically, for anyone listening, it's just a whole nother way to learn about your attachment style. And it was a game changer for me and my relationship. And I love that you talk about that because I do think by you getting to know yourself on a deeper level and then also you kind of understanding what these styles are, it helps you relate better to the other person. So not only are you figuring out yourself and tools and techniques to help yourself, but you're also able to almost not pre screen someone too early. Because if you think it could be his attachment style, there's just a different way to communicate that.

Yes, yes, I know. It's interesting is that when Jim and I broke up, I had said to him along the way, look, I sent him stuff about avoidant attachment dial and blah, blah, blah, and he never wanted to talk about it. Right. Because he's avoided. And at the end he's like, I am avoidant. I absolutely agree with you. And I'm like, it's too late now. Yeah, it's unfortunate because you can do so much as a couple by knowing each other's. It's just like love languages, right? By knowing each other's attachment style, you can tweak things. And when you find someone that you like, I'm anxious, typically. But unless I'm in a secure relationship, which I am now, but let's say that I'm anxious and my partner's avoidant. You can tweak things in your relationship so that you both become secure, which is exactly the relationship you want. So people say to me, well, can you change your attachment style? Well, yeah, you don't always have to be anxious in that relationship. And I think people think they're always going to be anxious their whole life. Well, sure, yeah. You know what I'm saying? Like, your underlying attachment style is anxious. But when you find that person that you can be honest with and vulnerable with and talk about, hey, I'm a little bit anxious. That's my tattoo style. Do you mind shooting me a text every now and then?

Right, Totally. And actually, it's funny you kind of brought this up, too, because I didn't know anything about this stuff until I was in my relationship. I think within six months, he heard about this book, and he was the one. He was the one that had me read it, which, I mean, is kind of humiliating, but also great.

No, it's not. It's wonderful.

Yeah, it was amazing. But it was because my anxious kept activating. And so then we read it together, him on his side, me on my side, and we talk about it, and now we have the language together. And it's been such a game changer because I can speak for my needs, which has helped me in other areas of my life, too.

Wait, are y' all still together?

We are, yeah.

Oh, my God. That's fabulous. I love him. I loved him. Give him tops for me. That's really sexy, that. I'm sorry. That is sexy.

Yeah.

It brings in the Jasher style book. I'm obsessed with him.

Yeah, he was already great, but it was. It's cool to have someone that you could grow with also.

I love it. I love it.

I would love to hear more about now doing relationships. Right. So I know I've seen a lot of your Instagram videos, and that's what's been resin. I mean, literally every time one of those videos is posted in the group, there's usually at least 20 comments from people.

I want to come to the group.

That's a different one. Natalie runs that one. It's called. What is that one called? Pillow Singles, no rules or something. It's so fun and really, really cool. But, yeah, so I would love to hear what got you to start that and then also how you work, typically with clients and things like that.

Okay. So doing relationships. Right. Came when I found my relationship with Jim and I started a dating. I started feeling really solid and good, and I realized that I had to be more positive because it was hard. It was hard to stay in that negative space and know when you're working. I feel like I'm a positive person. But sometimes when you're working with so much negativity and high conflict, divorces, it's not my jam. I had a really hard time with it. I needed to be in a More positive space. So I flipped from. I just rebranded, completely rebranded in 2020 and took hiatus and came back as doing relationships. Right. And did some work myself and did some work researching and studying and taking classes and learned. Took a course from Alexander Solomon called Loving Bravely. Yeah. So I really just dove right in and that's when I decided I'm like, you know what, I'm just gonna. Relationships are not my jam. And it just made me, I feel like a better coach, a happier person all around. And I kind of just left the divorce part behind me because I was already divorced at this point, almost eight years. And I had to get away from the divorce stuff. Had to do it for me. Yeah.

And I think it's great when you're able to kind of step away. I love the word hiatus because when you're able to really do that, so many people, right. They just keep going, walking through the fire, walking. And then at that point you're numbing. Right. And so when you take hiatus, that gives you time to self reflect, to figure out what you really want to do.

Yeah, I do. You know what? Every summer I take a break from the podcast for. Just for the summer. And I kind of figured out what I want to do and I always come back in the fall and I whatever. But this time I was like, no, I was ready to hang out my microphone. I was really in a dark kind of with COVID and I'm like, I try to do something that makes me feel good and relationships, that was just it. Helping people find healthy relationships was. That was a turning point for me. A pivot that was big. It made me happy to help people. So with the happy thing.

So how do you typically work? Someone will come to you and are you doing one on one coaching or.

I am. You know, it's funny, I have video courses that are really inexpensive and I. I don't know, probably shooting myself in the foot here, but I really feel like stuff should be inexpensive. I want to be accessible. And if I could talk to everybody, I'll do, I probably would. So I have to. I'm not so great at setting boundaries, but I have to. So, yeah, I have some really great courses that are inexpensive on my website. But then I have something called Ask me Anything. So it's a 99 session and it's a Zoom and it's like 30 minutes and you can call me with a list of questions and just rattle them off and they seem to be the most popular. And yeah, I spend time and just ask me anything and Then I have coaching packages, basic coaching packages. I also have gone text package where people, when you're dating, sometimes you just have a quick question or you don't really need coaching. Like on, you know, your bio is good and your pictures are great and you don't need help online, but you need help during dating someone. Maybe you've been dating for six weeks and something happened and you don't know what to do. You can actually buy the texting package with me where you get a week of texting and you can text me whenever you want, which I think is great because I get calls from the bar.

Oh, yeah, I'm sure. And I'm sure sometimes them even just pausing for a minute and getting to think about what the. What they want to do is helpful too.

Yeah. Or like, if you get a strange text. Yesterday I had a client who got a text. She was dating someone for like four, four and a half weeks, and they. She thought it was going great, and she got a text out of nowhere that was just so disconcerting. It was awful. And she, like, you know, quickly, quickly signed up and like, you know, whatever. And she's like, I don't know what to do. She sent me the text and we talked for an hour. So it was really helpful to her to be able just to have a coach to get through that one text. So.

Yeah. And it also helps them not get reactive. Right. And. And act from a place of more certainty.

I tell people all the time, text me as your coach, instead of sending that impulsive text that you want to send to that guy. How many times are you like, da, da, da. And then you're like, crap, I wish I never sent that. Right. So it's better just to text me and then I talk you down from the ledge because especially if you have an anxious attachment style, I tell my clients, put your phone in a cookie jar and duct tape it. It's hard not to be impulsive when you want to say something so badly.

Yeah. And just for people listening, I mean, the reason why that's important is because a lot of times, especially when you're dealing with the over 40 group, that's worse. There's so much trauma and so much healing that is being done, and you can't possibly heal everything before you start dating again. So.

No, that's such a great point. I love that. That's such a great point. You cannot. Yeah, you can't.

And so things come up that then can re. Trigger you, and then you want to send that reactive thing or Be reactive. But having that minute to just kind of like pause, talk it through, process. It really helps.

Yes. Because there's a difference between. I'm really big on using your words. So there's a difference between using your words and saying what you want in a relationship and then being overreactive, impulsive in the beginning of a relationship. I'm a firm believer that you should say, look, I'm looking for this X, Y, or Z. But three weeks into a relationship, it's not okay to double text, triple text, blow up his phone, blow up her phone, say things that are inappropriate, cross boundaries. So it's one of those things you hit. There's a fine line between too much and the right amount. And you're right, it does stem from things in our past, things that trigger us, and we want to say, look, I'm not going to take this. Or this is not how I. Sometimes we just have to take a breath and it's hard. So.

And I'm wondering too, do you help with any kind of communication framework? You mentioned a little taste of it. That's why I was curious. Do you help people with that as well in terms of just healthy communication in a relationship?

You know what? I don't do as much. I have someone that I work with that like, if they want to do. You mean like couples therapy or even like.

Like, you could either set boundaries in a clearer way by getting some kind of framework, or let's say you don't like something that's happening in a relationship versus saying it reactively. There's some kind of framework to be able to speak to that.

Gotcha. No, you know what I do? I just tell them not to do it. I don't really spend any time bullshitting around. I'm like, look, it just that. I'm more of like, here's my. Here's my framework. Don't do that.

Just don't do that.

Just don't do that shit. You're too good. I'm like, I just told that. So I'm like, look, it's. You can't fall down.

Yeah. So what do you suggest for somebody that is maybe wanting to kind of move forward, they'd gotten divorced or. Actually, you know what? Let's not even speak to that person. Let's just speak to someone that wants to do relationship right. Let's pick from that place. What would you suggest in that way?

Oh, I love that person. Who wants to do relationship right. I love that person. You know what? Let's do it. I mean, I'M really. Here's the thing. You're never going to be the perfect version of yourself. So a lot of people, my friends included my clients, by whoever, they're like, no, no, no. I have to do work on myself. It's going to take me three years. I want to go to yoga every day and I want to lose £25. Please, please, just know. No one cares about the £25. No one cares if you've gone to you. People are so hard on themselves. When you're ready to get back out there, jump, do it. Go. Look, I'm never going to be the perfect version of myself. I hope I never am. I hope that I'm always growing and evolving and changing, and I hope that everyone finds someone that wants to grow and evolve and change with them. So I think that people put so much pressure on themselves and I think sometimes it becomes a big roadblock and they use that as an excuse, like, I'm not ready yet because I'm not the perfect version of myself. And then you get stagnant, you get stuck, and you don't want to date. But people that do that are, like, you said, that want to get back out there. Yeah, come on, do it. Take that first. Get that first dab. Do you want to know specifics on the dating that I think or.

Oh, sure.

Yeah.

No, I love what you just said, but I'd love to hear more, too.

Yeah. I mean, I think you should start with three apps at the most. You should have one that pumps up your endorphins and dopamine, which is those swiping apps you can either do. I like Bumble. That's. What am I? I don't get paid by anybody, so I just like the ones I like. But Bumble is nice because women, if you're a female, obviously you're in charge. I like Bumble. I like Hinge. I like okay, Cupid. All for different reasons. I think Hinge is really. They've up their game. They've added a lot of video things. They have a new poll thing that's really cool. Not poll like stripper pole. The poll, like. Sorry, sorry. You pick three things and you have. Whatever. Yeah. It's just. I think that the dating apps are just far superior to what they used to be. When I was dating, I just say, do it, go for it. And you know what? You can always stop. You're not tied to these dating apps. Right.

I notice a lot of people, too. It's not that they're not ready, they're Ready. But they're scared of getting out of their comfort zone because it's nice and safe. Right. To sit with Netflix and whatever else you got going on.

I love Netflix. I would sit there all day. I watch Love Island. I can't stop addicted. I'm totally addicted anyway. So, yeah, I think that that's right. And you talk yourself into the fact that you are comfortable and you like it how it is. And I'm fine being alone. That's my favorite. I'm totally fine being alone. That's okay. If you truly are fine being alone, Rocket, that's great. But if you're not really finding alone and you want to get back out there, just do it. You know what I suggest? Really following a dating coach or relationship coach, that resonates with you. And look at. There are so many of us. There's different strokes for different folks. And if you get on Instagram right now, there is no way you're not going to find a coach or an expert that you like that resonates with you, that you, you watch a video and it clicks with you and you follow her or him and you learn stuff. It doesn't have to pay for it. Everything's free until you give me your card and just get the information, suck in the information before you make a commitment and do some research. And I think the most important things really, you know, you need that good bio, you need strong pictures and that's it. And just give it a shot and take the pressure off. Don't think people feel so much pressure. So much pressure. And I just don't. I think you don't need it. I think the pressure is too much. And also, like, I don't even call dates dates. I call the first date a meet. My clients, when they go on first dates, they go on meets and they're not allowed to stay out longer than half an hour on a first date. They have to come home. Yeah.

And what do you think is something that you've noticed in common with the people that are doing relationships? Right. They've gone through your system, your coaching, and then they actually are succeeding with it.

I think. You know what, I think they're common thread really with me, is I think they're positive. I think that they're having fun. I really do feel like if you put out a positive, I don't know, maybe that's so cheesy. But if you're positive and you feel good about what you're doing and you just breathe and enjoy and, and take a step back and you just have fun. Dating sounds so dumb, but people want to be around people that are positive. Right. If you're gonna go on a first date and you are not happy being there, stay home. You're not gonna have a good time on a date. And neither is a person you're acting. Anybody. My people that are doing relationship. Right, they're fun and they're chill, and we don't get excited about things. We kind of let them go. We also don't waste our time. I'm very, very strict about that. We just don't waste our time. Someone is on a dating app and they're in a situationship or a tech station ship longer than a week, and their pen pals with someone, they're done. They're done. I move quickly on the apps. We move real quickly. We moved from match with somebody. You text them a little bit, you get on a video call or a phone call, and then you have a date. I meet. And if it doesn't happen quickly, it doesn't happen, period. At this age, who wants to waste their time talking to someone? I don't need a pen pal.

Yeah. And I think for people listening, what happens a lot of times with the dating apps is because there's so many people that are on them, it's easy to get addicted to them. And then it becomes like window shopping, where it's like they window shopping. And so it's almost like you're wasting your time at that point. If the person isn't going to be actively participating in the dating mold or the me.

Yes. If it's a textation ship.

Right.

Where you're texting all the time, and what's happening is the person that you're continuing to text with, he's texting other people or she. Or they're dating other people at the same time. And four weeks goes by, you're still texting, and you're wasting your time and energy on this person texting him and having this great text relationship. And you've never met the guy. Oh, gosh, no. That is just my biggest nightmare. So you just end that. You end that relationship and say, bye, I'm not looking for a pen pal. And you move on and you find someone who's interested in meeting you immediately. And then people say to me, well, oh, my God, it's too soon. I. I don't even know this person. Well, of course you don't. He's a stranger. This person's a stranger. Would you give your keys to your house to a stranger? No, that's why you go on a 20 minute date or a half an hour date. You meet for coffee, you meet for a drink, you don't go out and then go to his house, you go home.

Right.

I mean, yeah.

And then what you're doing, I like the strategy because you're getting them to not burn energy on these other people. So by freeing up your energy, that gives them. Maybe we'll go now into the window of opportunity. They then go into the window of opportunity.

Absolutely. Yep. And then also if it's a great date, clients who are like, well, I know, Jen, you told me half an hour, 45 minutes. But it was so fun. I stayed for three hours. No, please. If it's fun, you end on a high note. It was amazing. You go home and guess what? He wants you and he's excited and he calls you and says, let's go out again. Right. And then you have time to settle down. Maybe it was just a crush, you're not sure. And then you ask yourself questions like, did I really like him or was that just fun for half an hour? And I'm not really. You actually check yourself before you wreck yourself. And you sit and you take notes and you write down how you felt. And then when he asked you out again, you go for an hour or two. Right. But the first date, no one needs to stay on a first date for three hours. I mean, I used to do that and. Doesn't work. Doesn't work. There's too much opportunity to mess up or fall out of. Like with someone in a three hour period at a first date.

And what would you say would be your biggest piece of advice for people on doing the thing. And doing the thing could be anything in this context. But just wondering what you would think.

Oh boy. You know what I think of being upfront and being honest about your intentions. Saying what you want, using your words and. Yeah, just saying what you want and being upfront in the beginning and then you. Setting the expectation, setting your personal boundaries and starting off on the right foot and just being positive. Just being positive. Just being someone that people want to be around. Be interesting on your dates, but also be interested, which I think is really important. And have fun and just give yourself some grace. It's not easy, but it shouldn't be so difficult where people are upset and they hate dating and they don't want to go out. Well, it should be fun. If it's not fun, take a break. That's a long one.

I'd love to also have you share for the listeners where they could learn more about you and also see all these things that I'm referencing.

Yeah, it's easy. Jenniferherbert.com Everything is there. Everything. Everything. Links and books and website everything. Jennifer herbert.com thank you.

Thank you so much for coming on and I really appreciate you sharing your story, sharing your wisdom. I love the fact that you were able to get that 10,000 foot view on the things that you've been through. So now you're able to help other people go through those things as they walk through hard.

Oh thank you for having me. You're awesome. I appreciate you.

Thanks for listening to the do the Thing podcast. We hope you enjoyed the show. But even more, we hope you'll be inspired to do the Thing. Do you have a burning question on Doing the Thing that you'd like answered? How about an inspiring do the Thing story of your own that you'd like to share? We'd love to hear all about it. Just leave us a voice message at do the Thing callcast Co or email us@helloothethingpodcast.com.