[RTB:E30] The Incredible 2nd Act of Australia’s Former Porn King, Scott Phillips (7-Figure Mentor)

Hey, you're listening to the Road to a Billion podcast. I'm your host, Stefan Georgi, and I'm glad to have you with me here today. The Road to a Billion is a call and radio show style podcast where you can ask me questions about freelancing, copywriting, entrepreneurship, mindset scaling, funnels, relationships, money, and more. The reason for the name the Road to a Billion is because I probably just hit, or I'm about to hit a billion dollars in sales for my copy and stuff that I've done with clients and myself. And I want to make an impact in the life of a billion people over the next 10 years, whether that is emotional, spiritual, physical, financial, whatever it may be. We'll start taking calls about 30 minutes from now and the way that works is if you just put your questions into the Q and A section of Zoom. If you're here on the live Zoom recording that we're doing, my friend Ed Ray will go through, review those questions and feed them to myself and to my guests, who we will introduce in a second. Before we get to my guests though, Ed, you want to go ahead and introduce yourself?

Hey, what's up everyone? My name's Ed Ray and I help businesses get back on Facebook if they've ever had their pages, personal profiles, ad accounts, or business managers banned or disabled. So that's it for me.

Perfect. That's a good, sorely needed service at all times. Cool.

So like I said, go ahead and.

Just put your questions in Q and A if you have one. We'll get to them in a little bit. But before we do that, I want to introduce my guest. And I got to tell you, when there are, there's certain bios where you're just like, man, where do I even start? Because Scott Phillips, who's my guest today, is definitely up there with the world's most interesting people. His story is insane. We're going to spend quite a bit of time unpacking it. Scott today is a successful teacher, trader, coach in the financial space. We'll talk about that.

But he started out in a very.

Different place in his life. Scott is definitely one of the. The OGs started going on the Internet through a mosaic back when there was eight websites on the Internet. His first day of operation in 1996, he made 1,000 sales off of Organic Traffic and he was a millionaire. Four months after that, at the age of 21, he had the 25th Adult website on the Internet.

Think about that.

There's, I think, 1.3 million adult websites today. He had the 25th adult website ever on the Internet, the fourth affiliate program of any sort of. And he eventually became the third largest Internet business like in the world by 1998. This one blows my mind, but it's true. By 1998, Scott was using 90% of Australia's entire Internet bandwidth. So the entire country of Australia, Scott was using 90% of the Internet bandwidth. And he also has 33 violent felony convictions, two different FTC investigations, and has had $18 million worth of lifetime fines. He is still listed as one of the 200 worst spammers of all time by Spam House. And he ended up in prison in 2006 for an extended period of time after basically kidnapping some people while high on Crystal Met. So you hear all that and you're like, wow, that's pretty crazy. But the thing is, Scott today is.

An entirely different person than he was then. And what I love about Scott is he's one of the most kind, passionate, just inspiring human beings I've ever met. The whole thing with Scott, as you're going to see, is that the secret in life is that it's not how you start, it's how you finish. And I'm a huge believer in that. And I think that's true for everybody. And when you see how Scott bounced back from all of this to become a millionaire again and on a path to just an incredible business, I just can't wait to share. So, Scott, thank you so much for joining me on today's episode.

Man, it's my absolute pleasure to be here.

Yeah, awesome. So, yeah, I mean, God, I really. You have such a rich history. I don't know where to start. Let's start really at the very beginning. Why were you able to be like so early with the Internet? I mean, why did you just know like, oh, this is the future. What enabled you to be so early?

So I was.

When I was a kid, when I was in high school.

There was this thing called phone freaking where you would trick the phone company into getting free long distance calls. And that was my nerd hobby. I was super nerd in high school.

And.

And that was like the forerunning.

Of hacking in Australia.

And the only way you could get.

The Internet was by calling into America. MIT had a free Internet. You could dial in and use password. Yes, guest. And we used to, you know, pry up manhole covers and get a laptop and sit and use the Internet such as it was in like 1991. Sitting, used that all night. So I'd use the Internet like very, very early before there was a web, right. And through this weird series of coincidences, I got in trouble. I was. I put myself through law school as a drug by dealing drugs. And by the time I finished law school, I looked like a drug dealer. No one would give me a job, and it was a big mistake. And then I ended up in jail for dealing drugs. And through this weird coincidence, which would kind of take me too long to explain, I ended up starting an Internet porno company. And after finding out that someone else was making money doing it, I thought it sounded good. I was the right guy. I just went all in on that. And it was one of those instant successes. Like, what I didn't realize then, but I realize now, is that so much of success is the industry or the vertical or the niche that you're in. Like, it was just, you know, it was just so easy back then. You almost couldn't fail.

And then, you know, and then by the. And then by the time. By the time I really realized what.

Was happening, there was like half a million bucks worth of recurring income coming in. So I could build a real business around that and put people. And it just sort of became snowballed.

So how.

You know, because you were pretty much.

I mean, we'll get to 2006, but. But you were pretty much using drugs like, that entire time though, right? Or was it. Was there a period where you were clean and then went back to using?

Oh, I tried to. I tried to not use drugs ever. And I got through university not using drugs. And I figured it was, you know, you're a drug dealer. I was dealing a lot of drugs.

I figured not getting high if you.

Own supply was like, in the manual. And then.

And then I really, really wanted to be a lawyer.

My favorite show was LA Law. I wanted to, like, work in an office with a suit and color me important. And I couldn't get a job as a lawyer. People look one look at me and see the bug that I was, and I was just really despondent.

And one night we were at.

I was at a party with some people dropping off, and they were shooting up crystal meth. And I just held my arm out. I was so scared. And the first time I had it, it just took me like a whirlwind. And six weeks later, that was the night of my law school graduation. And six weeks after that, I ended up in prison for a string of armed robberies. Half of them I didn't even remember. And I woke up in jail and I couldn't remember being arrested.

It was like I got to jail.

And I'm like, I didn't remember. I didn't remember anything. I woke up and I was like. Like I knew something was going on and I'm just, I'm just in jail and how the fuck did I get here? There's been some big mistake.

And then from that point on though, did you, did you go back and forth between sort of addiction and being clean and addiction or was it sort of.

No, it was addiction all the way.

But I TR to manage it, which didn't work. And it fell apart progressively. Yeah, it just fell. Addiction doesn't work, right. Like it just fell apart. Progressive. It was a terribly miserable time in my life. And you know, I had this situation where I was making, you know, I.

Was making all the money in the world.

The business was doing a million bucks a month. I was rich and famous and everyone was frightened of me and I hated myself and there was never amount of any amount of external stuff that would fill the gaping hole inside me. And yeah, it was just a terrible, terrible situation to be in. And it was one of those big leap type problems, right, that you talk about.

Right.

You know, you've got all this success and then you immediately self sabotage. And my addiction just went out of control.

Yeah, because that's what I'm curious about. Because I mean like the challenge of. I mean there's tons of functional drug addicts for a period of time, right. Like, you know, people. And so having not ever done like meth personally. Yeah, sorry. I was saying I thought last year. I'm not done. There was a time in like high school where I thought I did it, but turned out it was like probably like laundry detergent or something. And it was probably good. Thank God. I know my mom watches these podcasts. I know she's going to freak the fuck out about that one. But you know, it's a.

We'll figure that out later.

But you know, I mean, I'm just thinking about how to manage the business because the business was growing though, for the first time several years. And you were sort of.

I was doing a good job.

I was, you know, and what was.

Weird is that I was sort of universally considered some sort of genius for coming up with this idea, which I stole. I didn't come up with. And you know, everyone was looking around, there was this 21 year old kid, I looked like Ed with no beard and not as good looking and I was printing money and no one could understand it. And yeah, everyone told me how smart I was. And I believed him. And you know, in retrospect, I can look back with a little bit of humility and say, oh, yeah, you're just in an industry that had, you know, 10 to 1 return on ad spend at scale. Of course you crashed it, you moron. Like, if you put any random person in the chat back in a time capture, they would have crashed it too. Right? Yeah.

I'll start with the mindset, because then one thing you shared with me, and then I kind of knew this, but it was, uh, I felt really honored. You talked about how my stuff about mindset really helped. Helped you and then kind of helps you where you are today.

Well, that's. That's actually what started me listening to you, because I just got this mindset coach and I took a look at my life. I'd been in Bangkok for five years, and my marriage is really good, and my life is amazing and. And my life is okay. And I'm like halfway back financially, right?

Like, I'm like, like I've got assets.

Again and, you know, I'm worth more than a million dollars and blah, blah, blah. But I'm. But I attracted mediocrity in my life and that. And that mediocrity was in every area of my life. It was in my jiu jitsu. It was in. It was in my business. I was making a couple of hundred grand a year, but. Which is a lot living in Bangkok. But it's not a lot by my standards. And I felt no pressure about that. I was hanging around with people who were. I was. That I was doing the best of any of my friends, doing enough that you couldn't criticize me and saying I'm doing the wrong thing. You know, just feeling no pressure. And my mindset coach said that, you know, he said, we have to get you in a room full of black belts. Where do we find guys like you that are a room full of black belts? And. And I've been following you, and you talk about mindset a lot. And I started chatting to you online and you really helped me do a launch before I gave you any money.

And.

I did that launch. And actually I joined Copy Accelerator Lite before the launch. I used my last 1100 bucks to go to go join Copy Accelerator Lite. Like, I couldn't go to the atm. I was like.

I was like, I was like broke.

Cash flow broke for a couple of days until more funds came into the stripe. And Copy Accelerator light was amazing. And as soon as I could, I upgraded to copy Accelerator 4 and the support and the motivation that I've got from your group is just. It's changed my life. It's just. It's hard to put into words how cool it is.

Well, I mean, I'm honored that happened. And you, I didn't tell you at the time, but you, you didn't scare me, but, you know, I, you were like, I'm basically going all in on this funnel. You're like, hey, I'm going all in. You're like, I put all my money to that. And. But then your mindset was actually so good because you're like, but I know it's going to work. It has to work. And it will work.

It has to. And what I realized is the first.

Time I was successful, I'd gotten out of jail after a couple of months on remand and I was on bail. And if I didn't get a substantial sum of money, I was definitely going to jail for five or 10 years. You know, I was on bail for armed robberies and grievous bodily harm. I'd hurt was actually not. When I get charged with torture was actually not the first time I'd been charged with torture. I also got. It was like, it was like, really hard to, like, I had kind of an excuse the second time. But then they were like, but you have this track history of torturing people. And I'm like, yeah, that's hard to explain. Yeah, I'm sorry for party rocking. And, and, and, and so anyway, so I'm out on bail for these serious crimes and I needed, I needed to be successful or I was going to jail forever. And there was just this tremendous pressure. Nothing other than getting rich or dying trying was going to, Was going to do it. And, and so I needed to put myself under the same pressure that I felt back then. Like, that there's no alternative. This is going to happen. I'm not leaving any excuses left in the tank.

I'm not.

I'm going, going all out with this funnel. And, you know, it seems to me that the core skill is getting a funnel dialed in. Like, if you can get a funnel, like, like. I'd had a lot of products before, but they're all back end products, niche market products, price, you'd sell to your own list. But getting something that you can get cold traffic and get that money back on day one and scale it.

That'S.

Something that, that's a very specific thing. And you guys are the only guys in the world I know that are actively talking about that and Doing it, you know, and. And more than that, not talking about it. Like. Like, oh, yeah, we did it back in the direct response day with this package. Like, or. Or I'm doing it by selling Internet marketing courses to Internet marketing junkies. Like, doing it by exactly the same. Like. Like, you guys are doing exactly the same thing that I'm doing, just better at it. That's. And that's what I like.

Yeah, that's.

That's awesome.

Um, but it's amazing.

I mean, yeah, I love that mentality I do have from the mindset coach as well, who talked about how to get you in a room of black belts. Right. Um, I think the power of your network and the people you surround yourself with. Um, you know, it's the whole cliche about the five people you surround yourself.

With, but I think I didn't even think it was true. My. My mindset coach is this amazing guy, Itamar Morani. Itamanmorani.com and he told me that. I'm like, no, that can't be true. Like, I've got all these friends that are losers, but they're really nice. And when I dug into it, like, like, the research is there. It really is true. And having friends who are losers really was dragging me down. I had to like, cut three quarters of my social circle out and. And some of them are pissed at me. Like, why don't you return my messages anymore? I'm like, it's. It's kind of awkward.

Yeah.

When I get to Copy Accelerator, I watched some of those videos in your member section. The one with. The first one I watched was the Nick with Nick from V Shred.

Right.

And I just looked at his attitude and the way he talks about. He runs V Shred, which is the largest diet, niche selling thing. And he talks in one of his. In one of his talks about. He says a line like, how you gonna.

How you.

How you all going to let me.

Run up in your niche and take all your traffic? I looked at him, I thought, that's totally fucking gangster. Like, you can tell that if someone else came into his niche and started buying traffic at scale, that he would drop his prices or pay more or do anything to drive. He's just a straight gangster. Like, his mindset is, no one's coming in here and taking what's mine. Like, we want all the traffic. We don't even have affiliates. We want to buy it all ourselves. And I looked at that, and I looked at Tyler and I looked at J.D. bolt, and these guys have made more money than me, not just because they're lucky, but because they're actually better at business than me. Like, I had to realize that, wow, there's guys who are so much better at operations than me. And if I want to get where I want to go, I've got a huge amount of leveling up to do in every area. It's not just. It can't happen by accident. It's got to. It's got to be deliberate and systematic. And, yeah, it's a. And it's been a great process of leveling up. Like, it feels like I'm on this great trajectory, thanks to you.

Well, that's awesome, man.

And, yeah, I do love that attitude from Nick. And I agree. Even as a copywriter, one of my mentalities is, like, I give away a lot of what I do, right? And then people will be like, oh, what if somebody steals it? And even when I. When I own my own, like, how someone offers. I mean, I own stuff all the time, but, like, you know, even early on, like, my first successful kind of health supplement venture, I would just share all my stuff. And then, you know, people be like, what if someone rips you off? And I would just be like, if somebody rips me off, then I'll just. Like, I'll just take that as a challenge to be even better. I'm like, that's, like, great. All that's gonna do is make me be. But now I get to innovate, you know, like, people can come copy me, but they can't innovate. Like, I can innovate, so just that. But that mindset was, like, always, like, I think, really important because it's like, I don't care. Rip me off, I'll. I'll crush you. But not again. It's not like an oil baron. Like, I want to destroy everybody, but it's like a challenge. It's, like, fun, you know, I mean, that's the thing, too. I like to even look at it as a bit of fun. It's like, that's how you. You earn your stripes, you know, it's by having that mentality of come at me, you know?

And I used to have that attitude.

That, like, that really successful person's attitude. Like, I was a scumbag, but I was an outlier. Like, you'd walk into a room, and I would be the one that you would notice. And then I became, over time, this very average, mediocre middle 40s, white guy.

Like. Like, it can go both ways.

Like, you can. And you don't even notice the trajectory down. It's just a glide path.

You're like, I'm doing okay.

I'm doing okay. I'm doing okay. And then the next thing you know, you just this thoroughly boring guy, like.

And. And I do a lot of martial arts.

And I went. I went to the fight gym one day where.

Where I fight every day, and I.

Looked at these young professional fighters who were sparring inside the mat, and they weren't frightened of me. And it was like, why aren't you frightened of me?

Like, oh, yeah, they're not frightened of.

Me because I'm not scary anymore. I'm not.

I'm just an average fat white guy. You know, it's like. And I needed to have some humility about how far the mediocrity got. Like, how far just being average and settling and playing, playing it safe. And it's hard when you're older to.

Come back because you get fearful.

Like, when I was. When I was 21 years old, I rolled the dice. Burn the bridges. Go, let's go, let's fucking go. And then at age 46, you know, it took me a long time to.

Scrape up a couple of million bucks again.

If I lose this now, I'm well fucked. Like, well fucked. So I don't know if I got another comeback in me. So you become kind of fearful and hunker down. And that hunker down mentality was actually what was keeping me. That meant that bad mindset of, like, conserve. I'd lowered my expenses rather than increasing my income. And I've changed that last year I started to spend more like, we're living in a really nice place and blah, blah, blah. But that attitude of, I'm just gonna make it and don't worry, like, let's go, let's go.

Yeah.

Yeah.

That's awesome.

That's such an important attitude to have. Okay, so for everyone listening or watching live right now, and you know who watch the replay on YouTube or on iTunes. So we get to like, 2006 is when you get, you know, the serious, I guess, most serious charge of all for, like, the kind of kidnapping and torture. So it's funny because I know it wasn't funny at the time. Right now it's like you look back and you're like. And it's not funny. You torture.

It kind of was funny.

Okay, good. Because I still think it's like. But it's not like, in a way of like, you know, obviously you're not part of the person, you know, that did that. But at the same time, it's amazing because of who you are today. Right? So I guess what was the best.

Thing that happened to me?

Yeah, it was like, going to prison was absolutely the best thing that ever happened to me in my whole life. And, you know, I couldn't stop. I couldn't stop using drugs. Like, I would just. Like, I just couldn't. Like, never in my whole life even once had I been in a drug craving. Like, I would get the feeling, and the feeling would become an obsession. And then the next thing I know, I'd be like a robot driving to the. To the dealer. And, you know, I got track marks. You know, it wasn't like a. I wasn't like a hobbyist weekend, you know, have a few lines of coke at the club kind of guy. I was like, shooting up in toilets to be able to function kind of kind of guy. And I hated myself, and I could never stop. And the only place I could stop was in jail.

And.

Yeah, so I'm grateful for being there.

What?

So from the time that people. So I guess quickly, the story of what happened, people tried to break into. Rob you, right, and you just. You're high on meth and you caught them. Is that basically.

No.

So what happened was these friends of one of my employees had broken into my house while I was in Bali. I had a house in Bali. And the bank manager called me up and said, there's been some unusual transactions on your account. These guys are in here right now trying to cash a check for 10 grand. And they handed their own driver's licenses to the bank manager, who just sent me a. He sent me an MMS with the thing. And I'm like, I know one of these guys. And so I just jumped on a train on a plane back to Australia. And I knew that he worked in a supermarket. Like, it's a Coles, Like a. Yeah, big supermarket chain. And anyway, it was so stupid. I walked in, I parked my own car with my own license plate right out the front of the supermarket. Walked in, tapped someone on the shoulder and said, can you point me to this guy? And I said, oh, he's packing shells on there. Walked up, knocked him out, slung him over my. Over my shoulder like a sack of potatoes on camera. Walked out, dumped him in the boot of my car, and zip. Tied him up and punched him a few times on camera. And then I drove to my office, which had 15 nerds like non criminals working there. And then I laid down some plastic on the ground and tortured him. Until he gave up his buddies. And I went and kidnapped and tortured them.

And.

This torture went on for quite some time. It was gratuitous. I definitely went over the top. I definitely deserve to go to jail for it. And they were definitely scarred for life kind of thing. It was not like a little funny, like, I scared you. Now we're off. It was like. It was like broken bones and blow torches and dig your own grave in the Australian bush in the middle of the night kind of shit.

It was like.

It was really bad.

Yeah.

And then, and then I. This is the funny bit. I took them to the police, to the police station because I was on meth and I thought they'd give me. You know, they give you the. Like the guy jumps off the bridge to save the. Save the drowning kid. Like, they give you one of those ceremonies. I thought everyone would be like, great Scott. Fucking crime fighter, junior badge. And the cops were like, these guys are like, covered in blood and all their fingers are broken. And like, there's one guy kept shitting himself. He's covered in his own shit. I'm like, look, I found these criminals, they want to confess, Confess. And I just took my name. And yeah, the next morning, Two mornings later, I was in my office and I shot up a big shot of crystal meth like I did every morning.

And I was like wasted. Like, wasted, wasted.

And staggering down to get into my car. And then the SWAT team took me down in an in car takedown as I was leaving the office. And you know, this van screeched in front. All these guys jumped out with shotguns. Get down on the ground.

Yeah, and then.

Yeah.

And then I went to jail.

So once you. I mean, that's crazy. I mean, I knew the story, but it's crazy. And again, for people watching, like, obviously not condoning torturing anybody, but it's.

Don't do drugs, kids.

Don't do drugs. Yeah. I think it really starts. Don't do crystal meth. Okay. So when you're in jail is when you get queen and silver, right? Because you have choice, which is amazing. So I totally get it. But going back to my set today to look at. I want to point that out because I think with people, the whole idea of this too shall pass and the whole concept of no matter how dark of a moment you are at in your life, like, there is a way out of it and there is, like there is a light at the end of the tunnel. I think that's something we can, you know, I like, it's Funny, because it helps put in perspective. I've had like.

This too shall pass every night at the end, at the end of the day you get another, you get, you get another day closer and you go, this too will pass like. And I gained a lot of mental strength from being in prison.

Yeah, I was going to ask, so I was going to ask, I was going to say because I mean, I've had early on in my freelancing career, you'd have some nightmare client where you over promised and you were like stuck in it and they're talking to them and you're like, hate doing the work and you're like, oh God, when will this ever end? And A, it ends, but B, it's like, then like that's your big fucking adversity. And then I've got, you know, you in prison for having like tortured the shallows people, right? And like thinking about how am I going to like get my life around. So I think there's a good perspective for people to have there as they sort of worry about their problem of like, you know, oh, this client's a pain in the butt. I'm not, you know, I don't like belittling people. Like the whole idea of like first world problems or whatever. I don't like that because like, you know, your problems are your problems, they're personal to you. And it, you know, it hurts.

Every problem you have feels like my trivial problems today feel just as significant.

As the real one.

And I think that's important to point out, but it's, but it's true. But there is a perspective to it. And then I did want to ask you, I mean, so what are the things that, what are the takeaways, you know, from, from being in prison? What are some of the biggest lessons you learned or things that helped you to sort of gain more clarity in your life while you were in there?

Well, the actual time of being in prison was like the first couple of years of me being off drugs. And so my brain didn't work. Like I had this time when I'd always thought I was a smart guy and I tried to multiply six sevens six times seven in my head and I couldn't do it. My brain was that retarded. Like, and I'm like, I got out of pen and paper and I like, I can't fucking do this. What do you mean you can't do grade five maths anymore? You've ruined your brain. And I had it up. The big lesson that I got from jail is that Wanting things, like really wanting things is the source. Is the source of a lot of the suffering. Like, what I really wanted in jail is to get out of jail. So I obsessed about my parole application. I thought about it every day. I was like, I'm going to get out. I'm going to get out. They gave me a five year sentence, but I could apply for parole after.

A year and a half.

And I put on my parole application the day I could. And I was like, come on, come on, let's go, let's go. I want to get out. And in my mind, I was getting out on the day because I was a model prisoner. And then the day where I was supposed to get out came and nothing happened. There was no response, yes or no. And I'm like. Like three or four weeks after I was supposed to get out of jail. No one had come and told me. And I was like, I was just in total obsession about this. And then they. And then I got like a. The intercom goes off. Philips, come up to the thing and get your parole results. I'm like, yes, yes, yes. I'm going home. I got the parole results. They're like, you're staying in jail. And that was the worst thing in jail. The worst moment in jail is when I thought I was going out. And then I found out that I was staying.

That was. That was bad.

That was the only time that it was real. Other than that, Joe was pretty good. Like, I got super fit. Had abs with the striations on the side.

Yeah.

I know.

He cut out.

Scott froze right that moment. Scott, you froze for a second there.

I know.

You'll be. He'll be back.

Damn.

I want abs.

I know. I'm getting, like. I got a little more definition. That Carnivore diet.

I know, dude. How's that going?

It's going good, man. It's going good.

I'm thinking about it.

It's. It's free.

It's free. Tone.

I don't have a legit six pack.

Yet, but getting there, you know, it's the same feeling right now.

I'm like, I'm happy.

I'm happy with it. You know when you go, like, you grab like, the belly squeeze and you go for it and you're like, oh, what the f is this? Right? Like right now. I don't have that. I've got like. I'm like, hey.

Oh, he's back.

He's back pretty good.

Scott, you back? There we go.

Sorry, guys.

No.

No worries, man.

We're having side Tangents all good.

Yeah, it's more carnivore diet. I mean, the abs, the ab stuff got ed. And I just kind of go into the prison diet.

You know.

I ate tin tuna for 545 consecutive days.

That's what I did.

That was my prison diet.

Wait, what was it?

Oh, tuna.

Yeah.

I refused to eat prison food because the prison is about powerlessness, right? Like, they're always telling you what to do. The only control I could have was over the food that put in my body. So it's this total eating disorder thing where you can't. You know, you might have me chained in here, but I'll choose what I eat. And I'd eat a packet of tuna breakfast, lunch, and dinner.

How about now? Do you still, like. Do you eat tuna an hour or you do.

I eat bluefin sushi tuna, but I will not aside from that. No, I'm not trying to have.

That makes sense.

Okay, so you get out of prison, you know, and then, I mean. But really, you just finally got fully back on track to, like, you know, kind of a millionaire again, like, in the last, like, six months or last year or whatever it's been?

Well, no, that was a couple of years ago, probably 2015, I'd say. I decided that I wanted to be a professional trader investor, and I hustled together the money to do try and do that and lost it. And so I had this experience of my initial comebacks were all failures. Like, I failed three or four times. Like, I'd hustle up some money, try and trade and lose it all, and then try again and lose it all. And then finally I was successful at that, and then I topped out on it. Like, by the time I, you know, my trading makes only a couple hundred grand a year, but then by the time I pay some tax and live off it, like, nothing's going up anymore. And, you know, I had a wedding and my accounts actually went down that year. It was like, wow, this just isn't getting me where I want to go.

Like, I want to be.

I want to be making millions again. You know, I haven't quite added it up yet, but I think this year was the first year that I made a million bucks in 15 years.

Yeah, it'd be pretty.

It's maybe it's not quite a million, but it'd be pretty close. It'd be like 850 or something like that.

Yeah. In your stuff. I mean, what you're doing is working right now. I mean, not to get too.

So I'm Selling a financial product, which isn't a scam, which is an unusual.

Thing to do because.

And the jury's still out on whether.

It'S not the right.

On whether it's the right idea. Like it's totally not the right buyer for a thousand. It's not the right offer for a thousand buyer a day offer. Right. Like you have to work, you have to do a lot of study, you have to pay attention, you have to commit. Like it's none of this press button.

Done for you, like Agora sidebands type stuff.

Yeah.

But it actually works and you're getting results for people. Well, I think right now too, from what I understand, going back to just seeing about Copy Accelerator and one of your most recent posts, right now the issue is more so having to go in the negative to break even.

Right.

That's sort of like the challenge is the model a little bit. So.

The big challenge for me has been dialing in the funnel. When we turned it on, it was return on ad spend 60 cents. And you need to spend money and lose money and get enough data to optimize it. And we're on the sixth version of our upsells which finally started crushing the sixth version of our webinar registration page.

Which is finally good.

Nothing worked out of the gate now. The last month we were 0.85 day.

0 return on ad spend.

So put in a dollar, get back 85 cents right away. And I think the next round of changes that we're instituting now I think will be cash flow positive day one. It's just a very difficult thing, especially the upsells. And there's been times where I thought, oh fuck, this is the wrong offer to be scaling. And what I drew on is there's a couple. There's a guy in Copy Accelerator called Jared nations who does a similar thing than me but much more successful. And he's also got a real product and for me looking and I chatted to him and he said, don't listen to the guys who tell you you need to do an Agora scan product. He's got a real product that takes real intelligence and skill to learn. It's just high touch point. Just find out what they want and.

Charge them for it.

Just held on to that.

Are you doing like high ticket stuff.

Beyond like with your funnel right now?

I did, hi. I did high ticket last year and that's my plan actually is to, is to get this low ticket done and then, and then tack on a high ticket to it to monetize the list high ticket was interesting to do. Like, it's very like it's, you know, 10 times return on ad spend profitable. But you know, somebody pays you 10 grand, they want 10 grand with service.

Kind of thing, right?

Yeah, but I think you definitely, that's, that's the place to go with it where you can really differentiate from like the agoras of the road. I mean, they're just like more and more expensive newsletters and things like that. But I mean with you and the touch points and the fact that you are looking for really, you know, smart people who are really actually doing the.

Work, you know, out of that there's.

That percentage that will separate themselves is like they really want to do the work and then they want to be around you. And I think that's the way where, you know, once you start selling this higher ticket things and even, I mean, dude, it's like you're in like, you know, like Bangkok right now, right? Bangkok, yeah. And then. But getting people to go to Bangkok or Australia or Bali or whatever it is. I mean even you ask people in the US or wherever, I mean, have.

Them come to you and do like.

A whole week, right? And you can do these high ticket sort of like workshops and things. I just think that there's. You'll make a lot of money from that and you'll help people make a lot of impact too. So just a thought.

I know you already, you're already going.

That way, but I just think you'll be really successful with that.

For sure. Yeah.

And if I can, if I can build the list, I can monetize the list because I've been, I've been successful successfully monetizing the list for a few years now. The other idea I have is for a cryptocurrency system which is done for you, like press button done for you. That trades in and out of cryptos.

That I've been working on for.

That's my backup plan. So when I started to. When I started to scale this business, I realized if I ran out of money, I need a backup plan. And my backup plan is a new product. I love launches and I love the launch process. And I love that with launches, anyone, even with a small business can just pull a couple hundred grand out of thin air in a couple of weeks.

It's just so easy.

You don't need much copywriting skill. And so whenever I need to top up the tank, I'll figure out a.

New product and gonna do a launch.

Yeah, that makes sense. But yeah, I think you die in the sun right now. You're doing the right stuff here. So go ahead.

I've had so much advice from, like, the first week I joined Copy Accelerator, Dan Ferrari was like, sending me. Sending me funnels that were exactly the same as mine that were controls. And JD Bolt was reaching out and giving me ideas and, you know, totally unsolicited, like, you know, these, you know, multimillion dollar top, very top of the industry guys, they're reaching out to me just out of. Just as an olive branch of friendship. And, like, here's all these really cool things that we've noticed that you could do in your funnel. Yeah, amazing.

Yeah, I think that's cool too, to go back to the story, your story of adversity and of, you know, fucking up a lot and then having really.

High highs and really low lows.

And I mean, it's funny because then when you join and people know, I think people knowing your story, going back to this two shall pass. And even how like, our past can be an asset, even the things that maybe you know are right. Because I think people have, like, a tendency to like you more knowing that story. I mean, you're a super likable guy anyway. But just knowing, you know, your story and where you've been and who you are today, I think that inspires people. I think, you know, people. This is a good lesson for people who listen or watch, right. About vulnerability and authenticity and being real and being truthful. Right. It's because those are the people that we're attracted to. We're attracted to flawed people. I'm not calling you flawed. In like a grand scheme of things. For people who have flaws and have, like. Because we see we're like, we can relate to that. The person, if you join and you were some, like, you've got it all.

Figured out, you know, it's like, very.

Intimidating to reach out to that person. Want to help when you're like, hey, I've got some stuff figured out. I've had a lot of success. Here's where I've struggled. And now I'm. But now I'm on the trail, I'm coming back, right? People want to help. They root for that person. I just think that's really important for folks to know.

And from a guru perspective, positioning yourself as a Sherpa just one step ahead of them on the trail is very different positioning than, I'm this guy at the top of the mountain and you're going to come to me and get the knowledge, like.

You know, people Talk about, about.

Oh, they've got to build a list. Got to build a list. But you've got to think about what are you talking about? Like, you actually have to be really good at something and you have to, like, you have to be world class at something. Otherwise what are you writing about? And you have to be, and you have to be authentic and be yourself, like, whoever that is. Like, I swear a lot in real life. I swear a lot on my email list. You know, I write in financial and I don't particularly care for Donald Trump and I say that all the time. And that's supposed to be a big no no in financial and I get very little pushback.

Yeah, but you're real and I think people connect to that. We'll start taking questions in about 2ish minutes here. Scott, what are you in the middle here? I mean, for people who we're going to keep going and do questions and answers, but for people who want to kind of like follow you or engage with you more, what is the best way for them to do that? I want to give you the chance to do that.

I have a mailing list@scottbillipstrading.com and you can, you can email me. Scottcottbillipstrading.com I'm on Facebook, obviously I'm part of Copy Accelerator and I check Justin Step and talk copy every now and again. But I try and minimize my social media because we didn't have social media when I was successful the first time. And it's just so harmful having all these little like dopamine, Like I don't, I don't have, because I'm prone to addiction. I don't have the discipline to be able to turn those things off. I need to set blockers before I go anywhere near a computer. Like, I'm just not good enough to be able to just, I'm not good enough to multitask. I need to do one thing at a time.

Yeah, I mean, it's amazing. You know that though. Cool. Scottfeldstrain.com I shared it on the Facebook live. I shared it in the chat here.

And we'll share it in the show.

Notes or anything like that. So I want to go to questions now. We've got seven in here. Ed Ray, do you have any questions you want to ask Scott before we move to the Q and A's?

I got no questions for Scott. But dude, I just want to say, like, you know, most, most people put in your variety of situations would have probably given up or let those experiences identify who they are. So just like fucking amazing for not letting your experiences define you, you know, being who you say you want to be, not what has happened to you.

Youu know, I just didn't want a.

Lot of it was just selfish pride.

Like, I just didn't want that to be the end of the story. I didn't want to waste my life and.

And like that.

What's this? What it's got to do with his life? Oh, he did. He had this incredible success. Totally fucking fucked it up. That was the end of the story. Like that's. That's not a good ending. I don't want that ending, you know, I want my daughter to be proud of me. I want to be a person that I can be proud of, not a scumbag. You know what?

And.

And I never had goals before that. Now I know exactly what I want out of life. I know where I want to be in one year, in six months, in five years, in 10 years. And I know exactly what my good life looks like in every area. I know what my. I know what my jiu jitsu looks like. I know what my meditation practice looks like. I know what my business looks like.

I know.

I know what my relationship with my wife and my kid looks like. Every aspect of my life. I know what winning is. And now I can work towards that. Like, before, I was just walking through life accepting these same random results, just getting like, oh, that guy seems cool. I'll hang out with him. Oh, let's do this. Why not? Accepting these random results and thinking that I had no control and I was just unlucky, but really I was just making shit decisions, you know, everything bad that happened to me was my fault. Totally my fault.

Amazing.

I love that. Responsibility, ownership.

It's awesome.

I know.

Even like the comebacks, like, because the resilience.

Wake up, Stefan.

I. Dude, that sucked.

That was out of nowhere, just like.

Randomly in Vegas, the bandwidth capital of the world.

I will. You know, I've got a bunch of, you know, copywriters in my office right now, all researching, you know, pain points of writing copy. So I guess it's just, you know, competing with them.

But is that your low key way of saying you're wearing a sweatshop over there?

So really? Wherever. Yeah, everyone. Very highly paid sweatshop.

But yeah, whatever.

My point was essentially just the resilience and bouncing back. I mean, from not just like, you know, jail and all that, but then even your comeback, right? Because you're like, all right, making my comeback. Oh, I failed I'm making my comeback. Oh, I failed. I'm making my comeback. I failed. And it's like, again, there's just so many opportunities to give up and be like, well, I guess my life's over. And so that, you know, mentality of, nope, that's not what's gonna define me. I get to control the narrative. I get to control, you know who I mean, that's just so beautiful about life, right? Not to get philosophical or existential, but like, you know, you get to play a huge part in what people say about you in the day that you die. And like there. How many, how many folks have just, the story's not over till it's over. You know, it's like, that's just.

Do I prioritize comfort today or my goal? Like, what's my goal? What am I trying to achieve here? Like, if I want an exceptional result, I have to be an exceptional person. I don't think there's any shortcut around. You just have to be damn fucking good at life. Like. Like, I have to be exceptional. I have to. And you know, fortunately, being in Copy Accelerator, I've got a whole bunch of models of what exceptional is. If I want to say who's. What's an exceptional direct response business running person, there's half a dozen guys who are better at it than anyone in the world there. And I can look at it and I can see how they act with other people. They're all helpful. If you notice, the most successful guys in Copy Accelerator there is so over the top helpful, like, like hellfluz motherfucker.

Yeah.

And I want to be like that. And the other thing I noticed is the very successful businesses in Copy Accelerator all treat their copywriters really, really well. I want to be. If I want to be a success, if I want to be one of them, I have to be a dream client for copywriters. I have to be able to attract the best talent.

Yeah, that's awesome. Huge points and so true. I mean, most of you at the top are really good people, you know, usually if you're an asshole every now and then, there's always the exception and the media, let's point it out. But the vast majority of people at.

The very top are like very caring.

Abundant mindset kind of people who are trying to help others and bring value and serve others. Right?

It's funny, the direct response industry, the.

Top end of it, reminds me exactly of the Internet porn industry like 20 years ago. It's almost exactly the same. Like there's like it's so small at the top, right? Like everyone knows everyone and. And you do it on your name. Like if you rip someone off, you have to make it good. Otherwise like, things get really bad for you. And.

Like, for example, I was like.

Number 25 in the adult world and the very first guy to have an adult website. Who's the biggest, He's a great friend of mine. He lives in my building. He's like, you know, a few floors up and we see each other a couple of times a week. And he was like. Because adult Internet was before Amazon was like 90% of e commerce and 80% of bandwidth. It was like the very first direct response thing on the Internet. This website called Club Love and.

Yeah, yeah.

And you just reminded me that the top end of that industry was filled with really great people. The same as. Same as the top end of your industry is.

Yeah, yeah. I think that's true of most industries too.

I really do. I mean, maybe weird, like the road.

Of like hedge fund, like managers and like whatever.

Sure. Private equity.

But even there, I mean, a lot of people. And like the venture capital people of Silicon Valley, right. Like most of those people actually like.

Get together socially and see each other and actually do share ideas. What was I reading?

Gosh, I don't remember.

But it was some really large industry.

Where they were talking about at the.

Start of COVID that a bunch of like the big like heads of them.

All got together and were like, hey.

How are we going to respond to this? And they basically just like masterminded on it.

And it was, it was like something.

That was like the banking industry. It's like really big industry. And even there they basically got like a group text going where like they were like texting each other and sharing, right?

Cause that was scary, right?

That was really scary.

Was scary. It was awesome. Ed, let's go. Let's jump into some questions. And so if you got questions for Scott or myself or Ed, pop them in there. Scott will do. Or sorry, Ed will kind of give the gist. Bring you on live. You'll ask a question and then you know, we will answer it.

Beautiful. I do need co host again because you disconnected. Okay, so it was not your fault this time.

That's good. Always nice when it's not my fault. All right, you are a co host.

Beautiful. All right, we got a question here from Max Yuria about mindset.

What's up, Max? Give him a second here. Max, you there? Surprise. Got you there.

I'm here. Can you hear me?

Okay. I always have the same problem, though. Yeah, Scott. So I just wanted to say before anything else, if I ever get to come before someone that has had some rough situations in life, I'm not gonna give any advice to them. I'm just gonna show them this video and tell about your story. Because I don't think I gotta say anything else about. Apart from that. And apart from that, what would be the biggest three mindset rules for you since you have such a unique story?

The three.

The first thing would be to know.

Exactly what you want out of life. And the second thing would be to, once you've decided what you want out of life, decide who the sort of person, what sort of person would achieve those goals. What sort of person, if you want $50 million, what sort of person would make $50 million or what sort of person would build XYZ sort of business. And you have to change your personality into the person that's that winner. And then lastly, I'd say pay very, very close attention to. To who is in your social circle, because it's a very subtle and insidious drag on you having mediocrity in your life. And I need to feel pressure. I need to. I need to feel like I'm not good enough. And every day, every day I start working 4:30 in the morning, and every day I feel like, fuck, I'm hopeless of this business. Like, these guys are so much better than me. I've got to level up. I'm just. I'm like so far behind everyone. I need to level up. I've got to be better at. I've got to be better at business, better at time management, better at this, better at that. Yeah. So that's my answer.

Thank you, Scott.

Really, thank you. Awesome.

Thanks for that question, Max. By the way, Scott, Steve Sims, who was my guest last week, just emailed me and he was like, how do I get Scott Phillips on my podcast? So I'll introduce you to him after that. But yeah, that'd be a fun conversation. Cause I don't know, I don't know if you listen to that. Obviously, no video if you have. But Steve's a guy's got an amazing track record. Like he's, you know, he's just the. Well, he goes to the episode, but he basically makes dreams come true for billionaires and all kinds of.

Yeah, I love to meet him.

Love to meet him.

Dude. And really cool. Really down to earth cusses a lot as well. I think the two of you actually really hit it up. So hit it off. So I'll do that intro once we're done today.

Yeah, it'll be cool. Sweet.

Ed, who do we got next?

Next up, we got a question from Andre Nielsen about the root of suffering.

Ooh, Andre, what's up?

What's up? Can you hear me?

Yeah, we can hear you.

How do I turn this on? Right on. Yeah. Hey there. Hi, Scott.

Hi, Stefan.

Yeah, so my question, root of suffering.

Was basically you were talking about your jail time. You were saying how like root of suffering for you was when you wanted something really bad, like when you wanted to get out and then you found out that you, you were not getting out yet. So, like the pain was coming from wanting something all the time.

So I'm just wondering, since you're still obviously somebody who's achieving a lot and have goals, do you go about goals differently now to sort of avoid that?

So that's an interesting thing.

So the root cause of drug addiction and all addiction is seeking to escape emotional pain, right? So if you're ever going to beat a drug addiction in a long term situation, not just for a little while, you have to come to, you have to come to grips with pain and like that, emotional pain, you've got to train yourself to turn towards instead of turn away. That's how, that's how it works. And I went to these 12 step Narcotics Anonymous meetings for years. And. Through that process of fixing, fixing my drug addiction, it wasn't necessarily the best thing for my business career because I was very comfortable with, with shitty position, shitty, shitty, shitty, shitty situations. So it was very, you know, I expected that I'd come back clean, I'd be twice as good as I was before. I'm not, I'm not high all the time. I'm a better person. I just naturally expected that the cream would rise to the top and I couple of years I'd be back on top and 10 years later I was still grafting it and I'd had a number of failures and it was very, very difficult to come back and extremely difficult. I never started feeling like I was, you know, I was mediocre, successful, you know, making a couple hundred grand a year, a bit more in a good year, but less than a bad year. Like, to me, that was not successful, that was pathetic. And I needed to actually come to a situation where I could admit to myself that that's, that's actually pathetic and that's not okay. And you need to start achieving what you're capable of. And not necessarily in terms of money, just in Terms of, like, building a real business, building a product you can be proud of, helping people like all that stuff. Right.

Thank you. I'm laughing because you're like, yeah, okay, okay. Accept that.

All out.

That might be true. I have to chew on it.

Yeah, no, it's good.

It's good chewing on us.

Good.

Makes sense. Cool. Thanks, Andre.

And who we got next?

All right, next up we have.

Oh, okay, here we go. I'm choosing the relevant questions. Got a question here from Chad about Jiu Jitsu.

I love Jiu Jitsu questions.

Chad, my brother. The first thing I want to say to you, Scott, is I know you've made mistakes. And what I like about you, just from reading your story, is you go handle your fucking shit. Was it wrong to go sucker punch some dude in the supermarket on camera?

Yes. It's not smart.

I'm sure you've learned your lesson as you shared with us, but most men are pussies. You aren't. And you've got the right attitude. So that all being said in your life, how has Jiu Jitsu impacted, you know, your relationships, your business, your perspective, anything like that?

Well, I was.

I came from another martial art background where I was. I was a Kung fu teacher for a long time. I was totally obsessed with Kung fu when I was young and I'm a. And I was really well known for it. I ran school and, you know, I was, you know, small scale famous for being a dangerous guy. And then I went to Jiu Jitsu and what I found is I wasn't nearly as dangerous as I thought I was. It's hugely humiliating. You know, I'm this badass. I've had like, like, I stopped counting my street fights at like, at 110, I stopped counting. I couldn't be bothered anymore. And you know, I had like nine fights in prison and. And you know, I've had ring flights and. And then I got to my first jujitsu lesson. Everyone beating up, the chicks beat me up, the high school kids, the nerdy accountant guys, everyone was kicking my ass. Oh, wow, this is so humiliating. Shaking a hot shake in a pink gate, just strangling the fuck out of me. Yeah, I was just. I was just hooked because it's legit. Like it, like Jiu Jitsu is legit. And, you know, eight years later, I still love it. And.

You know, I went from.

From training something that I was very, very good at, I was elite at Kung fu and into something that I'm objectively only mediocre at. Like Like, I'm gonna be a mediocre, average black belt when I get there. I'm. I'm on the purple belt, but. But I don't quit. There's no quitting. So what is your vision for your Jiu Jitsu? My vision for my Jiu Jitsu is to be not just a black belt, but be an outstanding black belt. That's what I want. I don't want to be one of those guys that you get a black belt because you. Because you've been there for 15 years and. And it's rude not to.

I want to be a guy. I want to be a guy that's.

Scary to fight, and I am a guy that's scary to fight. Truth.

But I'd be scared to fight you.

For what it's worth. Yeah.

One eye open, Stan.

I'd be scared to fight Chad, too.

I mean, Chad, at least, you know, he's like, posting, like, three quarter nude pictures on Facebook all the time. So you always say, like, if you don't be afraid of somebody, picture them naked. Chad kind of like, inverts that because he's posting naked photos of himself on his Facebook all the time. So I'm like, I don't know. I don't know. But yeah, you know, you're shirtless all the time, Ed. Chad, like, is like, yeah, I love Ed.

Shirtless, mostly naked.

Sometimes he's upside down, standing on one hand, like, shirtless, like, a lot.

Yo, you know what's funny? I took that photo when I was 16.

It's a sick photo, dude. I wish I could do that stuff. Thank you very much. Dude, you could do it.

You could do it, Scott. I'll teach you, bro. We could do some damage. We could do some damage, Scott. We can do some damage.

Have you seen me? I'm like a gorilla.

I aspire to be a gorilla.

Yeah.

That's awesome.

Cool, Chad.

Well, hopefully that helped, man.

Yes, sir.

Cool.

Beautiful.

Go through a few more of these.

Ed, question here from Zerak Samdani about starting off earning money from an email list.

Cool.

What's up, Zaraq? Hello. Hey. Hey, man.

Thanks for answering my question. So I was basically just wondering. Well, right now I'm a freelance copywriter. I do, like, email marketing and stuff. So I was just wondering, like, I was. I do plan on starting an email.

List, but it's more of just like.

A passion project, sort of. Not a passion project, but it's just something I want to do for fun, because I'd like to send content out to People and I don't have any digital product products or a course or anything and I don't plan on making one anytime soon. So I was just wondering, is there any way to like monetize an email list like that when you're a freelancer to like get clients or maybe I'm.

Not sure you can, you can do both.

I'll start by answering then. Obviously if Ed or Scott want to jump in. I mean, you know, there's nothing wrong with just providing a bunch of value based content early on. If you actually look at my email, email list, I think it was a couple months before I promoted anything and then I just promoted the copy accelerator event that we were doing and sold some tickets through that. And I still don't promote to my list that often. But that being said, when I do, people buy because I am not promoting that often. So, you know, providing value, I think for you it's a. What does value look like? Right? Depending on where you are on your journey, I think part of it can be about your journey. The struggles, the successes, what you're learning, when you have a win, when you have a fail. Just sharing that stuff and your experiences and what you learn from them. I think that's what would be most valuable to people who are going to be on an email list of yours. And as far as monetizing goes though, yeah, I mean I think the easiest thing would just be affiliate offers, but making sure that they're congruent and you really believe in them, that they're really going to help. So like if you're selling like my RNBC method, right. I think like I'll give you an affiliate link for that. If you make sales, you get like a $500 commission for every sale. So you get, you know, a couple hundred people and a handful people buy, you can make a couple grand. But you know, Justin just did an affiliate launch for his thousand buyers a day course. So there's good, you know, good programs out there and then on the client side, I think, yeah, generally if you as you build relationships and rapport with people through your list, people are just more likely to want to hire you anyway. And you can do something where you're like, hey, I'm taking on, you know, one new client this month and you know, if you're interested, shoot me an email reply to this and we can talk. You know, just stuff like that. It's as simple as doing that. So. But I would do it if you're pretty. Depending on where you are in your career, you Know, do it because you. For the passion side of things and then over time, as you sort of build up a following and get more and more sort of, I guess, wins and things like that. Like, you know, continue to monetize it that way. That's my opinion. I don't know, Scott or Ed, if you guys want to add anything to that.

Stephanie, you touched on an interesting thing about sharing your failures. One thing I've noticed is that every.

Time I share a fuck up or a trading mistake or when I lose money, I get a tremendous response from that. Sales go up. Do you get that too? Like when you show you. When you share your losses and you.

People love it. People love the failures and the struggles way more than the wins. I mean.

Exactly.

So yeah, I say that about. Even when I got to be in that like room with like Magic Johnson, it was like 100 people. It was like small group and it was great. Magic Johnson said some really profound stuff that was influential for me. But the one kind of, I don't want to say it's like a criticism of Magic Johnson, but like he just talked about all of his wins the whole time. And I was like, this is cool, but I'm like, I really wish he would talk more about his failures and his struggles. I was like, I, I would have gone even more from it if I, if he had talked more about the times where he fucked up. Um, that's more valuable than the times that you nail it. Um, cause everyone like, great. What do I learn from that? When you're like, hey, I made this mistake, here's how you can avoid it, or here's what I learned and what you can apply, I mean that's just way more valuable to people. Yeah.

Okay, dude.

Cool.

That makes sense.

Yeah. Thank you so much, man. Yeah, absolutely. Happy to, happy to help. Sweet.

Excellent.

Alrighty.

Cool.

Next up, we have a question here from Rachel Spiel about biggest needle movers.

What up, Rachel Spiel?

Hi, how are you? Hi, guys.

Rachel?

Yeah.

Can you hear me?

Yeah, yeah.

Okay.

Yeah.

So my question is just. I wrote a sales letter for a client that's to going to cold traffic on. It's a clickbank sales letter and I just want to know, I want to help him dial in the funnel a little bit. What kinds of things would you recommend to improve conversions other than the obvious, you know, change your lead headline, stuff like that.

What, what niche was it in?

It's in like the spiritual niche. Like, like it's not tarot, but like that kind of whole thing Chakras Is.

It a VSL or a tsl?

Vsl.

And what's the funnel structure? Is it lead magnet to the sales letter or is it not just straight to the sales letter?

It's.

He's just doing emails straight to the sales letter. I'm in the middle of writing a quiz funnel for him also.

And what's it converting at now? Like how's it going?

I've already gets to here. Right now the letter is just doing like 1.3%.

Not bad.

What's the price point on it?

37. The upsell is doing really well. The upsells first upsell he's testing is 25%.

I guess one of my first questions would be like why? Why not the headline in the lead? Because there's kind of are the biggest needle movers. That's why they always come up first. Have you tested a bunch of headlines and leads?

I'm about to. I'm about to write a new lead in headline tonight. So other than that, I was just wondering is there anything else that I may be missing?

I mean, yeah, the whole letter. Every part of it can be optimized. I mean if it's a vsl, even just silly stuff like, you know, is there a button timer and you know, does it show the buy button the entire time or does it show it when you say hey bye now?

It shows when you say hey bye now.

Okay. And this synced up to the first. The first time basically.

Okay.

Yeah.

Is there music in the background?

Actually I'm not sure. I haven't seen the actual video yet.

Yeah, I mean beyond the headline, the lead, like so I can vary at 1.3%. I mean, you know, you can mess with the clothes, you can, you can mess with like trying to like go a bit heavier, more emotion in it and stuff like that. But I'd really be looking at even the production side of things personally. Like you know, with the vsl, is it like a high production value, low production value test music versus no music? Is there like footage? You know, I think you can probably from video editing get another half percentage conversion boost I would guess. Scott, be curious to hear your take as well though.

I got a significant boost from just.

Going to an audio studio and having it professionally recorded and all the little like pauses between taking out. It took like 10 minutes off the webinar and I get a significant boost from doing that. I don't know if other people have felt the same.

Okay, yeah, that makes sense.

What do you say, Scott?

VSLs are so hard man, it's so much harder than text sales.

I know. That's why I'm such a fan of starting for text sales that are in.

The moving to VSL testify.

Yeah, I told him, but he didn't listen.

A lot of clients because they see like some other VSL doing well and they're like, I want that. And they're like, yeah, but that VSL that's doing well probably wasn't the first VSL those people created. Right, exactly.

The on camera guru. Like, oh, it just sucks. I mean, you've done so much on camera stuff. It's hard.

Yeah.

Especially if you're not used to it.

That's another thing I took from the V Shred video in your member section is that Vince from V Shred was crap on camera when he started. And so when I read that, I've been going to acting lessons, which is awful and traumatic and it's terrible. I hate it. And, you know, if I want to be better on camera, I have to go to acting lessons. That's just what I have to do. Right. Like, it does make a difference, not being retard on camera. Yeah.

Makes a huge difference. Well, Rachel, hopefully those are some ideas that do help.

Yeah, thank you very much. They do help. Thanks a lot.

Of course. All right, beautiful.

Next question here from Jessica Baines about finding success.

Is she still on?

I think she said she. I think I saw on the chat.

All right, so I'll just, I'll just ask. It's a really good question. Do you think that other people who have been convicted and in prison can achieve financial freedom slash career success in the copywriting industry? And do you feel that the population of those convicted would struggle more or less with other things that would hinder slash help?

Getting into copywriting? It's.

It's really difficult when you get out of jail.

Like, I was a guy who was used to. I was used to money, been to university, all that. I was like a normal person in some respects. But getting out of jail is extremely traumatic. Like, it's so different. Like, the first day I went food shopping, I went into. I ended up with like six different types of cheese and like three different types of olive oil. And didn't have. And all this other stuff and didn't have milk, eggs and bread. I couldn't make a meal when I got home. Like, I would have panic attacks, like trying to choose between a plain black and a plain white T shirt. And, you know, some bus driver would. Would be rude to me. And, and I think, like, I was still in prison, and anyone who's even slightly rude to you is about to attack you. Like, most prisoners aren't going to leave that life behind just because it takes some time. And. And when you've been in jail a while, even the basic things like setting up a mobile phone plan and getting a house lease and setting up your Internet connection, those things, they're really complicated if you've spent a period of time where your food just comes on a trolley, Right? So, yeah, most people who've been in jail are gonna be institutionalized. And I experienced a number. I had this weird. The first night I was out of jail, I'd. I'd gone to my favorite French restaurant. I'd eaten steak frites and creme brulee and lobster bisque. And I had my first blow job after being in prison for a couple of years, which was awesome. And I'm.

And I'm lying on my bed in.

My own house, which I owned with my cat and my dog and my girlfriend next to me. I'm like, wow, this room is really nice. And then a little voice in my head said, yeah, but your cell was nice, too. I'm like, motherfucker, my cell was not nice. It was a fucking prison cell. But in my mind, it was all I had, so it was mine. It's very weird. It's very weird. Becoming institutionalized and insidious. It's very hard to come back.

Interesting. Yeah, it makes sense. But it is interesting because there are. There's.

There's, you know, people.

I mean, just over the population.

There's.

There's a lot of, I don't know, like a minority people in direct response that have been institutionalized who are, you.

Know, really a couple of guys in the top end who are from Duck game, like.

Like big.

Like big people. I won't mention their names, but yeah, you know, guys selling courses and stuff like that.

Yeah, yeah, that's awesome. You're totally right. I mean, I got.

Yeah, but I won't go too deep. I won't blow anyone up.

But there's some people. Yeah, there's people. You never know, too. That's the other thing. There's a lot of people out there you, like, would never know. And then we're successful in our industry and it's like, oh, yeah, she went to jail for, like five years for this. Or if you're like, oh, wow, you know what I mean? I mean, I think there's a stigma around that just because there's a stigma around everything. But Again, my whole. My pat. I mean, I'm not comparing myself to that at all, but, like, just even writing, like, dodgy, shady copy and like, you know, when I was in my earlier mid-20s. And then, you know, there's some people out there who can, like, try and define me for that, but it's like, okay, great. Like, I'm not that person.

Yeah, that was. That was me then.

Yeah.

I'm a totally different person now, so. Exactly.

It doesn't touch the sides anymore, right? Like. Like, it doesn't. It's like. Yeah, yeah, you're probably right. I was just gonna.

I'm like, I don't care. It's like. It's like talking shit about, like, a stranger. You know what I mean? It's like, oh, yeah, I don't know. I don't know who that stranger was. So go for it.

Yeah. 2009, Stephan. He was a big. He was a bit loose.

Yeah.

It doesn't exist anymore.

Like, it's. But I think it's so important. Right. And again, that's why I really go back to, like, not letting your past define you and why I think that, you know, one of the main reasons your story is so inspiring, because you've done a great job of that.

And then I can feel that big leap stuff coming in all the time. Like. Like every level of success that I achieve, I can feel part of me wants to sabotage. I can feel part of me, deep down feels I don't deserve it yet and wants to fuck it up. Like. Like, it's like it's a constant effort to keep ascending to new levels of success and abundance all the time.

Yeah. And ever.

I don't know.

It doesn't really go away. It goes away for periods, but. But. But then you can rent again. And there's this always.

So you did this amazing turnaround in your life, like, from being in an average guy that was amazing in copy to being a guy that's like, amazing in every area of your life. Like, what did you do? Mindset wise? Like, how did you do it?

I don't. I mean, it's a great question. Trying to think of the best way to do it. It was, I guess, like, being aware of it. Awareness is really important. Right. Because I think, like, having success, like, once you start, like, making money and having success, like, there's. There's a nice part of that that it takes some pressure off of you to be like. You can't immediately point to that and be like, oh, okay, like, I'm not good Enough, because I am broke all the time, right? Because you're like, oh, no, I can't say that. But you just immediately you find other ways to sabotage your life and still hate yourself. So for me, and I've talked about like, even when I was in Vegas in 2015, 2016, and my company started going well, and I would go out and like get drunk once or twice a week and like play blackjack and I would lose every time. I wasn't. It wasn't enough to like lose all my money or anything like that, but I would like, you know, lose enough to like hate myself a little bit. Why did I do that? That was stupid. And then, you know, stay out late and then not be effective the next day at work. But I realized it was because I had this money coming in and felt like I didn't deserve that money. And so I was immediately. It's so obvious. But at the time I didn't realize it's like, then, so I'd go give away the money, right? And I do it in this like weird self destructive way. And then realizing that I think as a man, like, what other patterns do I have in my life, you know, that I'm doing as well? And then I think reading like books, like, obviously helps like the big leap and things like that. And then genuinely like just being really doing something that you just really like, you make it easy to love yourself, right? Like if I'm, I'm doing so much value creation and I'm helping so many people and I'm sharing stuff and I know it's, it's authentic. And I had to get past the whole fear though, of like, okay, well, people are gonna think you're a fraud or a phony or they're gonna think you suck or you're a fake. Now you know you're a fake guru or you're just trying to like there's all that shit, right? All the. And there's. There's people out there who think that.

About me for sure.

There's. I, you know, mostly I just see the people who like me, but there's for sure people who think I'm just totally full of shit and they hate me. But it's like, there's no point in focusing on that because what am I gonna do for those people? But then the people who I am helping and I'm hearing and I'm sharing all this stuff, like, you know, and it's helping people that makes me feel so good and motivated. That gives me way more like, confidence and Happiness than money does, right? Every time. Like, I like money a lot. Like, we've talked about that, right? Like, I'm. I'm not that. I'm not the. The minimalist person. Like, I've, you know, I've got like a. Like a Bentley. And like, I have like, a nice, like, house and two houses and all this shit. And like, I love that, but I'm not tied to it, right? That stuff can go away and I'm fine. Like, I don't. I don't. I don't need that stuff. I like it. It's great. But what I like even more is generally helping people. And as I do that and see results like that, that brings me more confidence than just about anything else. I think so, yeah. I think that's. That's my mindset. And then just realizing. But again, then constantly being aware of checking yourself. I mean, I was telling. I had dinner last night with an NFL running back, Austin Eckler. He's an agent or he's a client of our sports agency. They own 5%. So I was with him and my friend who is the majority owner. And it was super cool because a. We talked a bunch about mindset, and, you know, Austin is this, like, you know, kind of like, tiny guy. Not at all prototypical running back. There's, like, you look at him like, you know, I don't know what he is, like, 5, 9, 5, 10. You know, that guy's a starting running back in the NFL. I mean, his arms are, like, jacked. Like, we were playing, like, roulette. I'm, like, looking and come back from the bathroom looking at his arms. I'm like, the guy's jacked. But he's like, you know, 5 foot 9, 5 foot 10, you know, 25, from, like a. Not from a Division 1 school. Started on a practice squad, you know, and then got like, a $26 million contract with, like, the LA Chargers. And it was like, literally the starting running back for the LA Chargers. And, like, you know, just seeing his mindset was so tremendous. But I was telling him and my friend about how, like, I definitely had a thing like, a week or two ago. I'm like, yeah, you know, I want. Kind of want more money. And, like, I just feel like people should, like, give me money. And I was like, what the fuck? I had to check myself so hard on that. I had this entitled feeling of, well, you know, I'm doing a lot of stuff, so, like, I should just have money, like, show up for me. Which is like, there's one thing to do, Law of attraction and be like, you know, like, oh, I'm gonna put the work in. I'm like, people should pay me because I'm providing a ton of value and, like, doing the work for them and stuff like that. And you can invest to get passive income, and that's great. But this idea, I just felt myself feeling kind of entitled. Like, money should just be flooding into my bank account because I'm so great. And I literally, like, cussed myself out on that super hard because that's a super dangerous way to feel. That's getting, like, fat and complacent and, like, it's a little embarrassing to share that, but I will, because it's important, because the feeling is, whatever. We probably all have those feelings of entitlement sometimes. But the important thing is that I checked myself. I had the wherewithal and the knowledge to be like, hey, wait a minute. That's a really, you know, crappy way to think. Like, the entitlement doesn't do. Like, you know, that's not gonna get you anywhere. Like, you'll be able to give you more money is to create more value. Right. Keep writing copy, you know, do new products like, you know, like. And do things that create more value. If you want more money, don't just. You don't just. You're not owed anything. And so having that mental check. Not to go on a tangent on it, but I was. I was really happy that I had that. That my mind was least evolved enough to kind of think about that. So I think kind of constantly thinking about your behaviors and your desires and your beliefs and things, and then checking them and seeing if, like, they're actually congruent with the person you're trying to.

Be and who you want to be.

That helps me to keep a pretty good mindset, too. Cool.

Let's do.

Let's do one more Ed. Because I want to finish right on time, especially for all the people here in my office that I'm. That I'm helping and everything like that.

So let's do one thing.

You want to pick the last one?

You know, I don't even. Yeah, yeah, sure. Give me a second. Find my.

Of course.

Then I have to, you know, piss off everyone who doesn't get picked. You know, you rather.

You rather let me be the bad guy? Do your dirty work.

I got you the goal there.

You know, I always think we could do rapid fire.

Okay, let's do it.

Then you read off the rapid fire ones.

Cool. What are some mistakes in Research that copywriters should avoid.

I mean, just thinking, you know, the market and not actually doing the research would be one. Not thinking there's forums when there are. I mean, so much of good research is just like typing the right search phrase. I was just talking with somebody who's here for this intensive that I'm doing and they're like, yeah, there's no, no forums for what I'm looking for. And I was like, really? And then I just googled a bunch of phrases and it was just like page after page of just gold. And it's like, oh shit. I guess there are so. But he was, he was googling the wrong thing. That's the thing, right? So ask a wider ranging questions. Like I'll. This is like a moms who want to side hustle, essentially, right? So all the things he was googling about were like, you know, moms who want to side hustle forums, like side hustle mom forums. And like he. Which I. Something like that. Which you can find forums for that too. But as we start talking about like what's their pain point? And it's like, well, feeling disconnected from their children because they're either working all the time and they don't see their kids or they're seeing their kids, but even then they're disconnected because they're worried about money because there's not enough money coming in. So it's like, you know, and there's a guilt about that. So then it was like googling like mom guilt for putting kid in daycare. And suddenly there's all these forums about how moms feel so guilty when they have to put their kid into daycare. So it's like think about deeper level. Like not just, I guess like the second and third order consequences of these things. Like not just like the very specific like mom with the pain point I'm trying to solve. It's like, well, what are the other things that are associated with that pain point? And then how do I search for forums and conversations about that? That's really the secret to super effective research.

Wow, that's really good as usual. I don't know why I'm surprised. Okay, here's a great question from Ibrahim Yousef. How do I start making 100k a month consistently in the next 3 years from our third world country with copywriting?

Scott, what do you mean?

Shit, you have to be the best in the world.

That's the type of money that a handful of guys make. You either have to be an offer owner because a mediocre Offer owner makes more than a world class copywriter. Or you have to be the best in the world of copy. How do you get the best in the world of copy? Well, shit, I don't know. You do it. You do, you write. Look at how Stephan did it. He wrote like so many sales letters until he really was like, the reason you're better than other people is you've done what.

It's true. Yeah.

Repetition, putting in the reps, writing a ton, becoming the best in the world. I mean, you know, God, if I don't, if you're a third world country, I don't know how good your English is, but you basically study English until you're as good as a native English speaker. That's one thing. You run into people overseas and I love everyone who is part of our community in like, you know, Nigeria or India or whatever it is. But you've gotta, like, you've gotta be able to trick me because otherwise if you're into the US market or the English speaking market, you've got to be like perfectly fluent English. You can't make weird little mistakes. You can't sort of have type. Like, why would. No one's ever gonna pay you. Like your ideas are never be good enough. You have to be a great writer too. So like really mastering the craft.

And even as an Australian, I don't.

Understand Americans at all like at all. Like I would really struggle to write purely for the American market.

Yeah, yeah, totally. I think you have to really, you have to master that. So that's the best we got for that one, Ed.

Beautiful. How do you come back from the dark times or worst moments in life?

You can go first on that one, Scott.

If I think about the things that.

I felt were like the worst things that could ever happen to me, like me going to jail was, was just like the start of a process where I lost it. Like nearly all my money. Where, you know, that first of all the tax office and then the people I tortured wanted some money. And then there was all these other fines for all these other greasy scams I'd run. And. In retrospect, 15 years later, I can barely even remember that stuff. Like, however bad it gets or however good it gets, however good it gets, it's going to be shit soon enough. However bad it gets, it's going to be good soon enough. Like all you got to do is stay in the game. You know these, there's, there's absolutely nothing that's permanent. And the stuff that was like that, that I really, really Obsessed about that I really, really thought mattered. Doesn't matter in retrospect, you know, none of it matters in retrospect.

Yeah, I love that. I totally agree. I mean, that's. I think that's the secret.

What was the. Oh, next question.

There you go.

What was the biggest lesson you learned from martial arts?

I guess that's me.

I learned the biggest thing that I.

Learned from martial arts is it's this kind of thing where you learn 80% of what you're ever going to know in the first two years and then every year after that you get like 2% better. So I learned about sticking with something over decades and getting better at something over decades and sticking with it. And I needed to take that into my drug recovery. I needed to know that if I was going to make my brain work again, it wasn't going to happen straight away, but I was going to get there. Awesome.

Excellent. And then final question here. Hi, Stefan. Wanted to ask a question. Do you ever get that deep gut feeling of letting down a client? Like shit. You want to get clients, you know that you can help them, but there's that constant small nagging fee. You can't make huge shifts for them that you self sabotage yourself to reach out more. Any advice?

Yeah, so. So I'm trying to read through this again, just make sure I fully understand it. So like you want to get clients, you know that you can help them, but there's this constant small nagging fear that you can't make huge just for them and you self sabotage to reach out more. I mean, assume. Cause there's two parts that there's laying down an active client and then a fear of not being able to execute for a client. Feel like you're not gonna be good enough. I think the biggest thing that would help though is if you look at even most of the most, like the top, most successful marketers out there, you know, which are your prospective clients. There's a million things that they're not doing that they think they should be doing and that you can help them with. I mean, the little basic stuff, specific examples. You know, I asked about the buy button with Rachel because I wrote that first, you know, Burn sales letter for V Shred and Sculpt Nation. And it was like they were. They basically didn't do button timer tests. So they showed the button the whole time and then they're like, oh, this isn't being the control. And I'm like, well, what about, you know, putting the button on timer so you have to wait to Hit the buy button until the product's revealed. And it says like the price and says to buy now. And like Nick, who's the CEO and Vince were kind of like, I don't know about that. I'm like, oh my, oh my God, I've been doing this for forever. Do it. And they did it and the conversions were like three times better. And this is a company that they were already doing like 100 million a year at that point.

Right.

Another person who's in Capex Target, I won't name them, but doing over a thousand buyers a day. And as of a couple months ago, it was like, oh, what are you doing for your email data? Like, oh, we sell monetized the list. And it's like, dude, you're doing this huge offer. A lot of people. One of the people here for my intensive thing was talking to their Uber driver on the way to my office today and they were talking about this offer because the guy just randomly brought up that he'd seen it. This offer is a really well known offer and as of a couple months ago, the guy wasn't monetizing his email list at all. And you know, like 20, $30 million offer scaling to more. So when you think about that, I mean, for my own stuff, there's always like, even when I, like whenever I'm, there's always a huge list of things that I'm not doing that I should be doing. And so even like the really top people don't have it all figured out or they don't have the bandwidth or they don't. They're not doing a bunch of stuff that they think they should be doing. And so there's always opportunities to help them. And part of it is just talking and finding out what aren't they doing that they wish they were doing and can you help them to do it? That's my take on it. Make sense?

Good.

Yeah.

All right, cool. So awesome. Let's wrap up.

So Scott again, if you want to get on Scott, your email list is scottphilipstrading.com Scott, thank you so much, man. I really appreciate this conversation.

I really appreciate pleasure and an honor.

And I'm indebted to you for everything you've done for me. You helped me so much. Before I ever paid copy Accelerator Ascent, you were right there in my corner. Stefan was talking me through my launch before we even really knew each other. He's chatting to me every day. I'm so indebted to you guys and everyone.

Yeah, yeah, yeah, man.

Well, it's a pleasure, man. I mean, it's just I'm happy to helps and I'm just happy for you and where you're at, where you're going and I'm happy to support you and yeah, man, can't wait to see where you go from here.

Just huge fan.

Huge fan.

Thank you.

All right, awesome.

See you guys.

Thank you, Scott. Later. Awesome.

And thank you, Ed, too. So that wraps up our episode of Road to a Billion today. If you're listening on itunes, make sure you subscribe to me on itunes. Leave a review if you can. If you're on YouTube, make sure to leave a comment. Let Scott and I and Ed know. Did you enjoy this episode? What were some takeaways? Make sure to subscribe to me on YouTube. And other than that, I'll see everybody next week. So thanks so much for listening to the Road to a Billion everyone. Bye.

See you guys.