Doctor Reveals TOP FOODS You Need To STOP EATING Today | Dr. Gundry

Much of depression, much of anxiety, much of what we call mental illness is in fact a gut illness that is manifested in our behavior.

I've been studying your work now for the last several weeks, since our good friend Philip Stutz connected us. And I had not put a lot of emphasis into understanding the biology behind how the human body is actually functioning and how to make it function at optimum levels. And then that's when I first heard the word lectin. I had never, ever heard that word before. Can you tell the audience what lectin is and why it's important?

Sure. Lectins are what are called sticky proteins. They're proteins that, in general, plants make to defend themselves against being eaten by their predators. And one of the hard things people have imagining is that plants were number one, not put here on Earth for us to eat. They were actually here first. They had really good before we arrived. Nobody wanted to eat them. And when insects came, plants couldn't run, they couldn't hide, they couldn't fight. But they're biochemists of incredible ability. So they manufacture these sticky proteins that are designed to make an animal that eats them feel bad and not thrive. They do this by actually causing leaky gut, and they pry open the connections between the cells in our gut, and they make gaps. And that's what leaky gut is. These proteins can actually stick to joint surfaces. I got interested in them because they can stick to the surfaces of blood vessels. They can stick to our nerves. The original way lectins were used by plants is they paralyzed insects. They actually interfered with the nerve conduction between insects. So they're a pretty doggone good system. Now we have our own defense system against lectins. And I talk about that in my books, including our microbiome, which is also part of my new book. But we, our microbiome, the bugs that live in our gut, have been decimated by all the antibiotics that we take and has also been fed to our animals that we eat to make them grow faster. And then a new antibiotic that most people don't know is an antibiotic, glyphosate. Roundup has now been in our food supply for almost 50 years now. And glyphosate was actually patented by Monsanto as an antibiotic and not as a weed killer. And glyphosate is really good for killing off the microbiome as well. So our defense system, which used to be super bowl quality defensive line, now the third stringers have been injured, and we're asking fans to come out of the seats and go on the defensive line, and that doesn't work very well.

Yeah, yeah, we know in this term of leaky gut, you know, I had never heard. Really heard the term before, so I'm going to. I'm going to assume much of our audience is still getting familiarized with both lectins and leaky gut. I'm familiar with some of the Monsanto, I'll call it frustration as it relates to GMO products in general. You know, changing the way in which that. That. That food is grown as well as then treated with Roundup and frustration. For example, what exactly is leaky gut and why is it. I mean, how does it damage it so bad? Because I know it cost a whole host of illnesses.

Yeah. So, interestingly enough, 2500 years ago, Hippocrates said that all disease begins in the gut. And what a prophet. He didn't have our sophisticated blood tests. He somehow knew this. And with each passing year, we're realizing that Hippocrates was right. But we should paraphrase that to say that all disease begins in a leaky gut. Now, if you'd asked me 15 years ago what I thought about leaky gut, I probably would have said it was pseudoscience and I should have a flowing robe or something like that. But thanks to people like Alessio Fazano, who's now at Harvard, we know that one lectin in particular called gluten, and most people have heard about gluten, which is in wheat, rye, and barley, is capable of producing leaky gut to create these holes in the wall of our gut. What's shocking to most of us is that the surface area of our intestines is the same surface area as a tennis court. And that's a big surface area. And everybody kind of looks down at their gut and they say, there's no tennis court down there. Come on. But in fact, it's just folds after folds of cells. And these cells, the surface is only one cell thick, and these one cells are held together like, I'm old enough to remember. Red rover, red rover. And you're old enough to remember where we all walked.

Arms, remember?

Yeah. And so they're all locked, arm held together. And what happens is that lectins and other things can break those locked arms. And then there's a gap. And not only can lectins go through this gap, which are foreign proteins, but little pieces of bacterial cell walls, which are called LPSs. And I can't help myself. I call them little pieces of. Because that's actually what they are. They go through these holes, and undigested food particles go through these holes. And so what's important for people to realize is that 80% of all of our white blood cells, 80% of all of our immune system is on the other side of this border. And they're basically our border patrol, because that's where the mischief can come through. And so when these foreign particles come through, our immune system says, holy cow, we've got a war to fight down here. I need all the fuel you got. I need all of our reserve forces, because there's major warfare down here, and that's inflammation.

Yeah.

And people, you know, now hear about inflammation. We hear about chronic inflammation. We hear about inflammation as the cause of almost all diseases. And in the energy paradox, I make the case that this inflammation from leaky gut is actually one of the big reasons we all have low energy and we've run out of gas.

Yeah. You know, it's funny. What's not funny? It's actually more interesting. My. My wife suffers with stage four endometriosis and all the things that go with it. So she's had, you know, up teen surgeries, and, you know, she's got the various adhesions that she's had to battle back from. But more than anything else, one of the things that she has struggled with a lot is the inflammation that actually happens inside of her body. Take that to another level. She has recently, just recently started to really hardcore engage in removing the glutens out of her body. We, as a family, stumbled across a GMO documentary that really scared us. You know, so we said we've been taking the GMOs out of our foods, and since then, we've both been feeling tremendously better. Now she's been diagnosed with also fibromyalgia as well. But it seems like the symptoms of the fibromyalgia outburst have also been rapidly declining since we began to really look hardcore at our food. So with all that being said, does that also mean that leaky gut can be repaired once it's been damaged, or is it permanent?

Boy, if it can't be repaired, then I'd be out of business.

Because actually, about 80% of my patient population now, and I see patients six days a week, even on the weekends. 80% of my patients have one or more autoimmune diseases and leaky gut. And there's increasing recognition that all autoimmune diseases are from leaky gut. And you can repair leaky gut. It can take a while, certainly Fibromyalgia is an autoimmune condition. Most people now recognize that it's not some mystical pseudo weird thing. It's an autoimmune condition. And actually my first book, Dr. Gundry's Diet Evolution, long ago I told a story about a woman with fibromyalgia who followed my program and it went away. And my office was inundated with fibromyalgia patients. And so we see fibromyalgia patients get. Fibromyalgia goes away if we solve leaky gut.

I love it. And I think we're starting to see the signs of that, which I think is more important in the energy paradox. You also had this piece that I feel like I struggle with. So I'm a male, I'm in my mid-40s, I've been self medicating on 5 hour energies and red Bulls and all these different things, you know, all these different things that you know, to give me a little pep in my step in the middle of a day after whatever I'm doing, the intermittent fasting, you know, so I can be more focused. But I still find myself wanting additional levels of caffeine, largely because of the fatigue that you mentioned. Let's talk a little about the fatigue side of things because this is something I'm definitely personally interested in. I know the audience will because I'm sure we have a few people like myself that probably consume a little bit too much protein or energy drinks and things of that nature. So.

Well, it's interesting. I talk in the book, I talk about a fascinating study that was done by Duke researchers and I've actually had them on my podcast, the Dr. Gundry podcast, and their study. They wanted to look at one of the last hunter gatherer tribes, the Hadzas in Tanzania. And these guys, they're very healthy. They're very skinny. The men walk 8 to 10 miles a day. The women walk 4 to 5 miles a day gathering tubers and berries and honey. They said, wow, these guys obviously are expending a lot of energy. That's why they're so thin, that's why they're so healthy. We should compare their energy expenditure to desk workers here in the United States who sit around all day. I bet you we're going to find this huge difference. And that's why the desk workers are so fat and that's why the Hun are so skinny. Lo and behold, they found out that the desk workers expended the same amount of energy per day as these guys walking 8 to 10 miles a day?

Really?

Now? Yeah, really. Huh. And they went, whoa, wait a minute. And they said, well, that just proves that all people have the same energy expenditure, no matter what you're doing. And I'm. I'm going, wait a minute. That does not pass the sniff test.

Yeah.

And what's really going on here? Well, my research and other people's research have shown that this inflammation from leaky gut, the troops, our immune system, needs huge amounts of energy to do battle. And that energy is taken from our muscles, from our brain, who are usually the real energy hogs to power the troops. It's like rationing in World War II, for instance. The troops need everything, you know, we have to cut back.

Yeah.

So the energy expenditure of these desk workers is because of the large amount of chronic inflammation that they're dealing with. And I see this in my patients. I can measure it and I can make it. I can see it go away when we repair their leaky gut.

So.

But it's one of the reasons we're all so tired, because the energy that we would normally have for our brain, for our muscles, is being used for, in a way, a horrible purpose. And it's a great purpose. It's fighting all this stuff coming through our gut, but we've got better things to do with it.

Yeah. You know, it's this entire time. You know, I've always heard the term adrenal fatigue. Adrenal fatigue. Adrenal fatigue. Adrenal fatigue. Adrenal fatigue. So, you know, I would go through spells of digesting large amounts of caffeine. You know, I got seven businesses that I run, and there's a lot of energy that's required on a daily basis, actually, just flipping between businesses, mindsets between businesses, different teams can be complex at times, and I would notice that I would have a really high rise, get to the end of the week, and I would have a very, very massive crash over the course of the weekend. I didn't want to barely move, you know, maybe go to the gym, but come home and not do much of anything, you know, and then I started doing some studying online and, you know, watching some YouTube videos, and I started leaning into, oh, it's adrenal fatigue. It's adrenal fatigue. How do I correct adrenal. Adrenal fatigue? But in the. But in the energy paradox, one of the things that I've noticed is you actually call that a myth, and I'm. I'm very interested to know why.

Well, so I've been following adrenal function and cortisol levels in patients every three months for the last 21 years. And I can tell you that out of 10,000 odd patients, I've maybe seen adrenal fatigue five or six times in 10,000 people. And yet they're suffering from fatigue. In fact, we now know, for instance, that the vast majority of type 2 diabetics make far too much insulin than what we thought. We thought diabetics ran out of insulin, they stopped making insulin. And in fact, diabetics, for the most part, make far too much insulin, but they are insulin resistant. Their cells do not listen to insulin. Well, it turns out that most of us who are told we have adrenal fatigue have exactly the opposite. Our adrenal glands are working great, but we have cortisol resistance, we have adrenal hormone resistance. So we got plenty of adrenal hormones, but our cells are no longer getting the messages. And interestingly enough, since you brought up GMOs in that respect, glyphosate actually promotes adrenal resistance. Cortisol resistance cells cannot get the message of the adrenal hormone. Also, it promotes thyroid hormone resistance. And one of the sad things that has happened to us is originally Roundup was used on GMO crops. They were manipulated to resist the action of the weed killer Roundup. But now Roundup is used on conventional crops as a desiccant. That means it kills it. And then it's much easier to harvest a crop if the plant is dried out and dead. Much easier and much more efficient. So most wheat in the United States is sprayed with Roundup, even though it's not gmo. Most corn is sprayed with Roundup, most soybeans, and even the Roundup ready ones. Most canola oil in the United States is sprayed, and most oats are sprayed. And so we now, all of these conventional crops that don't bear the word GMO on them are still fed to our animals. They don't wash the Roundup off, and they're spread to us. So we are ingesting glyphosate every day, even if we completely avoided GMO crops. And that's why even a friend of mine, Dr. Mark Hyman, who is a very conscientious eater like I am, when he has his glyphosate levels measured, they're still sky high. I mean, they're in our California wine, they're in almost all of our oat products, almost all of our wheat products. Even a lot of organic crops have glyphosate because the glyphosate has drifted over from a field that's been sprayed with it.

Yeah.

So it's everywhere.

Yeah. I was like I said, you know, in that, the documentary once, that we're talking specifically about GMO and genetically, they focused a lot on the genetically modified corn, specifically.

Yep.

And you know, at the start of it, you're thinking, okay, corn, okay, how often is it produced and whatever. And then you realize the vast majority of the corn produced in the United States has the GMO modified and is treated with Roundup on a consistent basis.

Right. 95% of corn in the United States is genetically modified.

Exactly. And then on top of that, on top of that, you've got the different feeds going to the different animals themselves that are also being modified on top of the feeds that are being mixed with the genetically modified corn. So it's like, if all of that's going on, how in the world do we put ourselves in a position to eat Right. And eat well in this day and age? You know, raise our energy levels, keep the lectin problems to a minimum? Like, how do we do that?

Well, yeah, that's a good point. So we actually test.

People for gluten sensitivity, and 70% of people who are sensitive to gluten are sensitive to corn. And interestingly enough, the corn GMO protein is called the cry protein, and we test for that, and virtually 95% of us react to the cry protein. In corn, it's a lectin. And so corn is everywhere. Sadly, corn is used extensively in gluten free foods. And most of my gluten free patients still have their leaky gut and autoimmune issues because they're still eating corn and it's hard to get away from.

It really is like ketchup. And it's everywhere.

It's in ketchup, it's in toothpaste, it's in plastic wrap, it's an instant coffee and instant tea. Yes, sorry about that. Goodness gracious. Yeah, that's crazy. So, in fact, I was on a millennials podcast recently, and it occurred to me that millennials are actually the first group of people that have been continuously exposed to Roundup in. In their lifetime. They've never not been exposed to Roundup. And if you sometimes millennials call themselves the lazy generation, and I think this tiredness that seems to be associated with millennials can at least be partially laid at Roundup's doorstep. They're the first of this great experiment, and they won't be the last, unfortunately.

Yeah, that's a really astute Observation. I think when it comes down to it, you know, let me ask you this. Have you had a chance to do any studies between, you know, someone in my generation versus millennial, technically, someone say.

I'm just at the tail end.

Right. But I'm curious to know, have you been able to see any studies with your patients and kind of seen the difference? And what are you seeing?

Well, one of the things that's dramatic almost across age groups is we have an epidemic of autoimmune diseases that really didn't exist two generations ago. 60 million women have Hashimoto's thyroiditis. We could count them on a handful. When I was in medical school, just to give you an example, all you gotta do is look at advertisements on TV and you'll notice that 80% of the advertisements are for an immunosuppressive drug so that you can have a happy life with psoriasis or Crohn's or lupus or, you know, and everybody's happy, happy and singing on the beach. But these things did not exist. And the, these are now, I mean, I see Crohn's disease and lupus in five year old kids, eight year old kids. And these things just didn't happen in the past. And now it's, oh, yeah, here's another one. And you know, what's, what's gone wrong. And again, I think one of the things we really have to look to is this production of leaky gut that most people didn't have a couple generations ago.

Yeah. You know, and in regards to all this, I mean, when you look at it, you know, I look at the Energy Paradox, I look at the previous books and I'm curious to know, you know, I know when you open up the Energy Paradox, you're like, this is the book I wasn't really looking forward to writing kind of thing like. Or what didn't really want to write. So what made you go ahead and go through the process of writing that when you've had so many amazing works before it?

Well, I was actually prompted by an encounter with a millennial. I was driving into Orange county, south of LA to do a PBS fundraiser. I like to raise money for PBS and I have some specials on pbs. So I was driving in and I get a call on the cell phone that says.

Judy won't be able to join us today, who is going to, you know, host your segment. And he said, oh dear, you know, something wrong? They said, no, she just didn't have it in her today to come in. And I'm Going, what? You know, I know Judy and you know, she's wonderful.

Oh, we were friends. I'm like, yeah.

And they said, well, yeah, you know, don't worry, you know, we're going to get through this. We got somebody else coming in and we'll do it, we'll be fine. And we did. And then I went, you know, I'm driving home and I said, you know, this is amazing. This is a millennial who doesn't have it in her, you know, to kind of get into work and do her job. And I said, you know, is our energy crisis this bad? And I realized that when I first started what I call restorative medicine over 20 years ago in my practice, one of our codes, you have to code for insurance. And one of our biggest codes was this kind of silly sounding code called fatigue and malaise. And quite frankly, you know, Judy was calling in with fatigue and malaise. She didn't have it in her. And over 50% of my people that I would see had fatigue and malaise. And the good news was that their fatigue malaise went away. And I kind of forgotten all that. And I said, you know, for crying out loud, you know, I've been an energy doctor, you know, in this part of my career and I should write about it and I should make people aware that is a fixable problem and that the problems are really not because we have a caffeine deficit or we have, you know, a five hour energy deficit. It's, it's actually deeper than that.

Well, I've noticed that, you know, since I've started to implement some of the strategies you talk about, I don't need as much caffeine like I've, I actually literally quit drinking the five hour energies, you know, quite a while ago at this stage in the game and, and I feel better, I feel fresher now. I used to tell myself I was self medicating because I had ADHD and dyslexic and I need, I needed something to kind of like, you know, keep me from having to go to the doctor and get, you know, Ritalin or whatever, right, focus. But I've also discovered that a lot of that confusion, that cloudy mindedness that used to come in with the ADHD side of things, since I've kind of implemented some of your processes, has already started to right size itself on its own. I bumble a word here or there if I'm having an exciting day or something like that, but for the most part it seems like doing things the way you prescribe them Eating the way you're talking about, going through the due diligence of making sure you're eating the right foods at the right times of day and things of that nature, it can make a big difference in a variety of different things. I mean, I even heard you mention that.

So much of anxiety and depression is actually tied to leaky gut. And that's not something I would have traditionally put two and two together.

I used to struggle with anxiety and depression a long time ago, quite a bit. And I always thought it was because of my childhood, because I had a messed up childhood growing up. And then I started thinking about that and I was like, you know what? But I was also not eating right. I was eating highly, highly modified foods, fast foods even, whenever I had it. So which means when my brain needed to have the firing the most, I was eating the worst, which then would entail escalating my depression and anxiety symptoms. How in the world did you connect the dots to leaky gut, anxiety and depression when you think one's physical and one's more of an emotional.

Well, one of the fascinating things.

There'S a famous psychiatrist, Dr. Daniel Amen, who's become my friend, who really is one of the pioneers for realizing that we've known a long time that there is this gut brain axis, that the gut is in a way the second brain. But we've added another piece to that and that is the microbiome. The hundred trillion bacteria and fungi that live in our gut actually send messages to our brain. They are actually, we've discovered the language that the gut bacteria talk to the brain. So now we have the microbiome, gut brain access and Dr. Amen and I really think that much of depression, much of anxiety, much of what we call mental illness is in fact a gut illness that is manifested in our, you know, in our behavior. And the really exciting thing is we've seen so many patients on, you know, psychotropic medications, antidepressants, anti anxieties that when we stop their leaky gut, when we get their microbiome happy and we get their microbiome producing what are called postbiotics, okay, these are, this is the language that the microbiome talks to the brain with that everything just kind of, you know, levels out on an even keel. And it's actually really exciting. We wean people off of their antidepressants, we come off of the anti anxiety drugs.

So yeah, I think we're beginning in the deciphering of this language. Actually won the Nobel Prize for medicine a few years ago. And part of the energy paradox is all about how to make postbiotics.

Yeah, well, and that, I think that is really astounding because like I said, most people who are on antidepressants or anti anxiety medications have a complex issue of things that are actually created by the medications themselves. And they're kind of like, well, what's the best of two evil evils, you know, kind of thing. And what I'm hearing you say, and what I've seen in your work is that when people do take the time to go through the detoxification, if you will, of the, of the antidepressants, when you do get the microbiome kind of under control, that they do end up living happier, healthier lives without having to take what I refer to as needless medications. You know, in the United States, we're heavily, heavily marketed to. Right. All the different pharmaceutical things. And it's, you know, it's happy children and happy trees and happy life until you get to the very end. And it's like also renal bleeding and da, da, da, and like all these different other things. I'm like, I don't want any of that stuff. You know, how are you able to take that concept and then continue to communicate it in such a way that allows people to have lasting freedom? Because, you know, like, again, we met through a mutual friend and he swears by your work, literally changed his life and convinced me to start like, you know, putting some of these things in process as a result. So how are you doing that nowadays?

Well, I think years ago, one of my patients, when I, when I saw him back, they said, you know, how you doing? And he says, I'll tell you what, feeling well never tasted so good. And.

This happened almost by chance. You know, I was professor and chairman of cardiothoracic surgery at Loma Linda University, a very famous heart surgeon. And my life was changed by a patient who reversed his coronary artery disease with food and supplements from a health food store. And it was the most remarkable thing I ever saw. You know, luckily my eyes were open that day and, you know, I said, you know, I'm. I'm seeing this. You know, something did this. This is not a fluke. I'm gonna, I'm gonna figure out how he did it. So I actually started treating patients that I operated on with, you know, what is now the plant paradox and the energy paradox. And they would call me and say, hey, you know, I. And they've been on high blood pressure medication and diabetes medication, and they call me and Say, hey, you know, one of the supplements you're giving me is making me dizzy, you know, And I turned to my nurse, I said, I think there's anything, you know, this in these things that make people dizzy. I said, well, you know, come. Come in here. Let's take a look at you. And their blood pressure is real low. And I go, oh, wow. You know, let's. Let's back off on your high blood pressure medicine. You know, they're on three of them, and then they call and say, okay, that did it. And then a couple of weeks later, they'd say, oh, I'm dizzy again. You know, come on in here. Oh, your blood pressure is really low. Well, let's. Let's throw that one away, too. Or we'd have a diabetic on lots of insulin or two diabetic medications, and their blood sugars would be low following this program. Oh, come on, let's look at this. Oh, okay. You know, stop this or. And it was just like, holy cow. Somebody who was on eight medications that they needed now are on one medication or no medications, and everybody goes, wow, why wouldn't I want to do this? Right?

Yeah. Yeah. I love it. I love it. Curious to know, is there any correlation between your. What your work is now and cholesterol specifically, and then, you know, high blood pressure, those two things specifically. Because I know a lot of Americans struggle with specifically those two, especially men. And cholesterol?

Yeah. So cholesterol is only one. High cholesterol is only one theory of heart disease. And I think it's actually way down the list of the theories of causing heart disease. Believe it or not, I have people in my practice that have total cholesterol is over 500. They have LDL cholesterols over 300, and yet they don't oxidize their cholesterol. Their cholesterol isn't sticky. They don't have any stickiness on the inside of their blood vessels that we measure. And I happen to ascribe to the inflammatory theory of heart disease and the autoimmune theory of heart disease. And there is very good evidence, some of which I've published, that shows that leaky gut is the major driver of heart disease and cholesterol. And so cholesterol is almost an innocent bystander. One of the great original heart surgeons was Michael DeBakey from Houston, Texas. And Michael DeBakey, back in the 50s, always used to say, I don't think cholesterol has anything to do with heart disease. I think it's an innocent bystander that gets trapped in the vessel wall, and we shouldn't be blaming it. So there are a lot more sophisticated ways of looking at cholesterol as a troublemaker. The second thing, high blood pressure. We can actually measure stiffness in blood vessels. And there's a saying in longevity that you're only as young as your blood vessels are flexible. And I've published papers that show that when we ask people to take certain foods away from them to take simple supplements, like, for instance, grapeseed extract, pycnogenol, French maritime tree bark and fish oil, that we can make their blood vessels more flexible and we can wean them off their high blood pressure medications. There's a study that I mentioned in the Energy paradox of giving people 2 tablespoons a plain sesame oil per day weans them off of their high blood pressure medications.

That's easy.

And when they take away the sesame oil, their high blood pressure comes right back up.

That is crazy.

I mean, who wouldn't, you know, have a couple tablespoons of sesame oil on their salad in exchange for being on one or two high blood pressure medications?

Yeah, I think the vast majority of the people would. Like I said, I don't think. I think we, as an American culture, we take medications because that's what our doctor prescribes. We have a high level of trust in the medical community, as a rule of thumb. And I don't think that doctors are intentionally, necessarily giving us prescriptions just because they legitimately say, okay, well, here's your diagnostics. This is what you need. But I don't think everybody's taken it seriously as much as you have in understanding the leaky gut and how the leaky gut is causing all of these things to begin with. Because I feel like as your message continues to grow and expand, I'm hoping it's going to be even a more radical change in the medical community as a whole to try these other things before putting us on statins and all these kinds of things. You know, I watched my father get on statins several years ago, and we have a history of heart disease in our family. And he got on statins and his overall, like, muscle development changed, his bone development changed, his hair development changed. And, you know, at first you're thinking, okay, well, it's just, you know, it's the natural process of aging and things of that nature. But I noticed that the more he took the statins, the more.

What's the word I'm looking for? Frumpy? He became for lack Of a better word.

Yeah, I mean, I, first of all, I have nothing intrinsically against statins. I will use statins.

If I broke my leg, I put a cast on it. Now once the bone healed, I wouldn't be in a cast the rest of my life. And so I'll use a statin as an anti inflammatory until I can correct the eating issues, the gut issue that got that person in the place where he had a heart attack or needed a stent. But then once we correct that, you know, there's no need for this. The other thing that people should realize and well meaning physicians should realize is for instance, there's a popular test where you get a CT scan of your chest and it's called a coronary calcium score. Now Medicare and insurance doesn't pay for it because there's no true correlation between coronary calcification and plaque on the inside of blood vessels narrowing. But hilariously, these people are put on statins, they go, oh look, you got coronary artery disease. Here's the proof you need to take a statin. In fact, statin drugs increase coronary calcification. And it's like, well, wait a minute, if you think coronary calcification causes heart disease or is a marker of it, why would I put you on a drug that's going to make it worse rather than better? And yet that's the literature. I'll give you one more example, which is unfortunate. I'm in a lipid discussion group and about every six weeks we get on a phone call and there's half of us are on the east coast and half of us are on the west coast and we have very widely divergent philosophies about lowering cholesterol. East coasters in general are aggressive. LDL cholesterol lowers. West coasters. We tend to look at the bigger picture. Just that's a generalization. There's one physician, big academician, very famous, won't mention the name, who drives LDL cholesterol down to 50 or 60 with massive statin drugs, a second drug, and, and their cholesterol gets so low that they have to go on antidepressants and they have to go on testosterone replacement because you need cholesterol to make these hormones. And he's proud of the fact that he now has somebody on, on four drugs.

And he's got a low cholesterol and we're going, what the heck?

You know, it's causing all the problems. I don't understand.

Yeah, that, that didn't solve.

And just yesterday I saw Two commercials back to back for. People on antidepressants often get this condition called tardive dyskinesia, where your hands and feet all of a sudden do very funny things. And thank God, there is now two new prescription drugs that can treat the tardive dyskinesia that comes from taking the antidepressant figure. Isn't this great news? You know, two for the price of one. And if you act now, you know, you might be able to get it for free for a month, and then it'll, of course be $1,000 a month. And, you know, it's like, oh, my gosh, what have we done?

You know what? I'm just. I'm just thankful, you know, doctors like yourself take our lives seriously. I thank you that you've taken the time to do the studying and do the research and spend the time investigating the patients and looking for the common denominators and all the work that goes into that, because I know you had to spend hours upon hours upon hours upon hours making these bridges, right? I mean, seriously. I mean, it's what the research that goes into all of your books, especially the Energy Paradox that just came out recently, is, like, unfathomable. The amount of time that you've put into understanding this. And then I, again, having mutual friends that have said, he saved my life, like, he literally saved my life with the methodology that I've been doing. And I don't know, I think it means a lot, and it means a lot to me, which is why I was so excited to have you on the podcast today, because I think more people need to know more about everything that you're doing so they can begin to apply that process to their own lives, including getting the Energy Paradox wherever that. Wherever books are sold, for sure. But for the meantime, where can people find more about you and find more about the book?

Well, so you can follow the Dr. Gundry podcast wherever you get your podcast. We're now part of Podcast one, the largest podcast system in the United States, and we're real excited about that. They can come to drgundry.com, they can go to gundrymd.com which is my supplement and food company. And.

You know, I see patients six days a week, and we'll get you in.

Find the Energy Paradox. Please visit your local bookseller. I got news for you. They were slaughtered by Covid, as so many other things were. And, you know, give them your business so they'll have the book. It's been a bestseller, so they'll have it.

Yeah. And it's continuing to climb from what I can see.

Yeah. Yeah.

Number nine on Amazon. Just what, yesterday you said.

Yeah, yeah, we're number nine on Amazon yesterday, so. Yay. Hey.

Hey. No, I mean, so people are getting.

The message, you know, that's the message.

And it's a valuable. I mean, it's. It's not like a read. You like, you. You pick it up and you put it down. It's like you pick it up and you change your life with it. That's.

Yeah, it's.

That's. That's, you know, 25 bucks or whatever it is to, like, change your life.

I think it's 15 on Amazon right now.

Yeah, exactly.

But please go to your local bookseller.

Absolutely. Well, Dr. Gundry, thank you so much for coming on and spending some time with me today. I'm enlightened. I know the audience will be. I know people are going to continue to follow your work and learn more about it and absolutely get the book. The new book is going to be amazing. So thank you so much for coming on.

I really appreciate it and hope to connect in the near future.

Sounds good. Take care, my friend.

See you. Thanks a lot.

If you love that interview, go ahead and check out this next one right here. So this is something to consider. Where in my world might I be imposing ceilings on my achievement?