The Car Crash That Changed EVERYTHING | Dana Flanagan

Our car went up on the guardrail like a luge. We had a full tank of gas. All I remember is hearing scraping and then everything went black.

My special guest today is going to talk to us a lot about authority, how to actually create authority in the marketplace, drown out what the sea of noise is, and actually help you kind of move the needle. Guys, please help me welcome the one and only Dana Flanagan.

I remember hearing crackling like a fire and I thought I was sleeping. I opened the passenger door and the, the There's flames coming out underneath the car, and I jumped down this embankment. Thank God we were able to open the doors, and the car exploded 7 seconds later. We must have been in a burning car for like 6 minutes. He had the visibility, but he didn't have credibility.

Mm-hmm.

I don't know how many people could vouch for his character, but he looked amazing online. Come to find out he had no money, and when we had a big client pay us, none of us got paid. I mean, it was a lot of money, and it was one of those things that just kind of made me say, I'm done.

Do you have a number one lesson that you've learned that you've picked up on from that moment?

I think that time is precious and do it now.

Hey guys, welcome back to One Part Lion, One Part Lamb, your integrated method to rise, lead, and last. As always, Stephen Scoggins here. Love you guys. So grateful for the growth you've allowed the show to take place of. Recently, we just toppled 200,000 downloads on the audio various platforms, like mind blown by that. Super excited about that. We just tripped over 60 million views in collaboration of since the podcast's inception. So I'm super stoked about that, and we have to thank you for that. And hopefully what you're getting from us each and every time is the best possible value you can bring in day in and day out. As you know, we serve high-capacity leaders, specifically ones that tend to be more faith-aligned. They have a spiritual connection, they have something deeper that drives them forward, a deeper level of service, a deeper level of hope, inspiration. And we try to give you strategies and tactics to actually make that happen. Well, to that end, my special guest today is going to talk to us a lot about authority. How to actually create authority in the marketplace, drown out what the sea of noise is, and actually help you kind of move the needle. Now, she is not only a world-class entrepreneur, she has done professional commercial and residential real estate at a high level for entertainers, gosh, athletes, you name it, she's done it. And then she's become a media specialist as it relates to helping you cut through the noise and help you kind of build out the personal brand, all the things that go with it to make you win the day. Guys, please help me welcome the one and only. Dana Flanagan, what's going on?

Thank you for having me.

I'm super stoked. We're gonna have fun.

Oh, we're gonna have so much fun. Your beautiful lakefront property here.

Thank you. Well, it's— and here's the cool part— is your neighbor.

I know, right? How rare is that?

Yeah, no, normally people have to like fly in for a few hours and drive over for a couple— for an hour from CLT.

Yeah.

Uh, which is Charlotte National Airport. And, uh, here it is. You're like, I had like a 20-minute drive.

Yeah, it was great. You know what, it was just happenstance that we met in an event in New York and yeah. So thanks. It's a pleasure. Thank you so much.

Well, absolutely. Well, I appreciate the fact that you practice what you preach. Yeah, right. You were somebody who is a— I feel like you're like me in that you learn by doing, right? So I learned by doing it wrong the first time, then I get to learn by doing it right the next time. And then I typically learn the lesson that was in the middle that now becomes part of my infrastructure strategies, tactics, all the things. So now that you've been speaking and doing that on a regular basis and growing rapidly in that sector, now that you've been helping your clients develop a strong media presence, brand authority. What are some of the things that you're seeing a lot of times that we're probably not getting right, that we could probably shift the needle on?

Yeah, that's a great question. A lot of times what I'm seeing is people are trying so hard to be visible, but they're not really like dialing in that credibility. So they're not going to events and actually building trust with their audience. They're maybe copying what they see other people doing or what they think they should be doing, going, trying to go viral, trying to follow the latest fad, maybe online, um, purchasing like magazine covers or investing in things that really aren't going to move the needle forward for them when they should really be focusing on getting that credibility through your audience and narrowing down like your specific avatar of who you want to be speaking to. Like, whose problem do you solve?

Yeah.

Right? And how do you solve it? So I think a lot of people miss the boat Because they're trying so hard to put the cart before the horse, right? They want to get to XYZ standpoint, but they don't want to do the dirty work that comes in between. So they try to like maybe either fake their way there, fake it till you make it, or buy their way there with some visible, you know, pieces. But they don't— they lack the credibility to actually be able to back up what they're doing. And I find that a lot.

Well, and I find that unfortunately that just creates more noise.

Yeah.

So one of the things that— and I'm just being— I'll speak for me, I can't speak for everybody else— that I used to struggle with was I wanted to model the people that I enjoyed watching or learning from myself. And as a result, I don't know that I was cultivating really my own voice. So at one of the events I've been to recently, one of the speakers actually followed up with me after the fact. And we originally met around like strategies around building the infrastructure that supports the speaking piece, like call it funnels, call it client journey, all the things, right? And one of the things they, they, they Just asked me, said, "Well, you know, I'm just curious from your perspective." They they saw me as being a high-value speaker, like from me speaking. Like what what did you think about my presentation? And I said, "How honest do you want me to be?" And she and she was like, "I'd like to I'd like to know." Like I'm like, "Okay." I said, "Your intentions were beautiful, but I could tell you were performing." Mm-hmm. I could I could tell. that you wanted to be seen in a certain way, in a certain light, and you weren't being your authentic self. And now that I've got to spend the, you know, because this is 45 minutes of the conversation, whatever. So now that we've spent a good 40 minutes in this conversation, I can tell you that your authentic self is far more magnetic than the performer self. And, and she was like, interesting. She's like, well, I said, so I would, I say what I would come up with, what are the 5 major lessons that you learned That solve a, solve a specific problem for a specific person? And how could you communicate that in a way that, you know, manifests a unique or beautiful result for that person? And she was like, I'm going to go do that homework. And true enough, she did the homework in 24 hours, which I thought was amazing. Actually teaches— touches me when people ask for a little insight. You give them insight and they take it.

And they actually do it. Right.

I love that.

Right.

But what my big takeaway was, and I told her this, I said, I said, but you're not— there's one question you're not asking. And she's like, well, what's that? I said, you didn't ask me how I knew that. It wasn't because it wasn't— I said, it wasn't by watching you present. It was the fact that I've done the same thing.

Yeah.

And I had to die to the performer to be the authentic version of myself. And you've seen me present.

Sure.

Yeah. And I have nothing to prove. I'm there to be of service. If I feel like I want to cry, I cry. If I feel like I want to laugh, I laugh. If I want to make some kind of random joke about myself, I do.

Yep.

Right? I just keep it real. In fact, one of the things I've been doing recently in the speaking world specifically that has seemed to garner more authority as we dig into this is this concept of, like, just being real. Like, going, stepping up and say, hey guys, can I just— rather than giving you a canned keynote, can I just be real with you?

Yeah.

And the audience is like, thank God.

Right.

Yeah, you know, kind of thing. So what are you seeing right now? as we kind of unpack performance and authenticity? Because I find that a lot of that, that, that's hindering a lot of high-capacity leaders, whether they're presenting in a boardroom, whether they're presenting on stage, it doesn't matter. The stage is still the same. You're trying to inspire, educate, or otherwise create movement with an audience.

Yeah. So I think that, you know, we're seeing a lot of people that I think we're kind of getting away from the performance base, because it's So it's so easy to be yourself online if you just let, if you just let it happen, right? And, and I think that everyone gets that imposter syndrome where you look at somebody that's maybe light years ahead of you in business, but again, you're just looking at the highlight reel and you don't really know like what kind of work they put in behind the scenes, right? So people are rewarded in public for what they practice in private. And you don't know all the unsexy work that has to go along with—

Yeah.

getting to a certain point. And I think a lot of people put these, like, limitations or these expectations on themself that they need to be here by this age of their life or this stage. And I know we've all felt it. I, you know, I should be further along than I am, right? I think we all feel that way, especially high-performing leaders. And AI can do so much work for us now, but AI also can sound very unauthentic.

Mm-hmm.

And so while it's a great time saver and it's great for so many things, People just want real. I mean, how many times do you look at something on social media and go, is that a real person or is that AI?

Yeah, I mean, it's getting crazier.

It's getting really good now. And some ads that you see out there, it's not even a real person. So in a world where there's so much manufactured stuff around us, people just really wanna connect and they really just wanna get to know the other person. And so, No matter what, AI is never going to be able to take away the connection, that authenticity, and trust is not transferable.

Yeah.

So AI cannot build the trust that an actual human interaction can build. And so I think that you're seeing people be a little bit more real now because so much other stuff is manufactured.

Yeah. And I also think you're starting to see the end of the, I would call it the guru theology, right? So those that, look like they've done it that may or maybe have not.

Mm-hmm.

Um, guru, like guru worship itself is dying, which I'm all for. Um, because I've, you know, now that I've been doing this a little while now, uh, traveling, speaking, being, you know, being in different rooms, if you wanna call it that, you know, it's, it's pretty easy to see who is, who has been authentic.

Mm-hmm.

Because they're, they're authentic. They're like, you see them in the green room, you see them on stage.

Mm-hmm.

You see them at the masterminds, you see them at the private dinners, you see them maybe in your home or in their home.

Mm-hmm.

And it's, you know, it's the more time you spend with somebody, you can, kind of see, or is, is who I'm seeing in the public eye, you know, authentic. And one of the things that I've discovered is, uh, and I think I've even mentioned this a couple of times at different events, is like, I understand that there's a trust recession.

Mm-hmm.

I understand that it's more difficult now than ever to garner and build trust, especially in an online environment, because so many people marketed really, really well Made big, broad promises. People, hard, you know, handed over their hard-earned money that they worked so hard to earn and then got literally nothing for it.

Yep.

Meanwhile, that person gets to go celebrate as if they're buying an airplane or a boat, some Tahiti or something like that.

Mm-hmm.

And I think people have just had enough.

Yep. Yeah. Yeah. No, I completely agree. And it's funny, what you're describing is actually what happened to me and, and why I built my company. I ended up working with somebody that had a, It was more of like a branding firm. I do so much more than, than just help people with their brands. But it was one of those types of people that looked really amazing online. And I talk about this a lot in my keynotes, that he had the visibility, but he didn't have credibility. I don't know how many people could vouch for his character, but he looked amazing online.

Yeah.

Come to find out he had no money. And when we had a big client pay us, none of us got paid. So it was, I mean, it was a lot of money and it was one of those things that just kind of made me say, I'm done.

Yeah.

And I'm no longer, I'm gonna control my own company now.

Yeah.

And so those people that were working with him now work with me. And it's like, it was a whole facade.

Yeah.

I mean, the whole time, I just remember thinking to myself, did I, how did I not see this? And you really start questioning your own, your trust in yourself.

Yeah.

Like, how did he have us all so fooled?

Yeah.

And so I think the general public Consumers are like that as well. It's, it's just, it's a wild world out there right now.

Mm-hmm.

And there's a lot of volatility. And so I think if you can get yourself to those events and in-person shake hands, you know, get to know somebody, go to dinner with them after, that goes so much further than a Zoom or collecting business cards. And don't, it's not about quantity, it's really about quality and having those purposeful conversations. There are— I'm not going to connect with everybody, and I'm not going to understand everybody's business.

Yeah.

So if it's a great connection for someone else, and I can make an introduction for that person to someone that I think would be beneficial for their business, then that's great. You know, not everybody is going— I think people go to networking events, and they immediately think of the immediate ROI instead of just building the trust.

I just, I go for service.

Yeah.

Like, I very seldom go into these rooms and say, hey, This is what I'm hoping to achieve. Can you help me?

Right.

It's always like, hey, what are you working on? How can I be of service to you?

Exactly. Exactly.

Like, I find that that ends up being, um, a really good tool to meet really, really great people. Um, I'll share with you publicly and publicly with the audience here, um, that back, let's see, we're in August at the time of this filming now. So we've got, um, let's see here, July, June, May, and probably April. So about 4 months. Um, I was running Facebook ads. Okay. Now Facebook ads are, can be effective, kind of depending on the niche. It can be super effective depending on the niche, honestly.

Right.

We had a guest on here that was crushing it. Like his ROAS was ridiculous. But he's also really good at serving the audience.

Right. Sure.

So anyway, long story short is we're, we're, we're, we're trying to, okay, well, who does Stephen really serve? How does he really serve them well? Like who gets amazing outcomes? And the first 2 months we were running ads and trying to cut through the noise and whatnot. Um, we got a great virtual turnout, which is great. Um, but the people weren't quite ready to take the steps that they would need to take to double, triple their, their, the size of not only just their business, but the size of their soul.

Yeah.

Like we, we believe that we were created to create where soul meets systems. Right. We, we want you to have a, a really strong heart and a really powerful business. Like we want, we want the, that we call that integration. We want that completely integrated, fully aligned. And what I found really interesting about that, you know, I was, it was about $10,000 a month in ads. And as we were looking at the numbers, I was like, I'm getting great people. These are great people.

They didn't have the money to invest in it.

But they don't, but they don't have the, yeah, they don't, they don't have the capacity to invest And, you know, a 2.5-day immersion where I can come in and help them 10x different things, or can help them come in and maybe save a relationship or a number of different things that we specialize in.

Right.

However, um, my, it was my team's idea, not even mine. Like, Stephen, do you realize we're, we're investing all this capital over here? Yes, we're building a strong email list, but really these people are better suited right now.

Mm-hmm.

for the free content we give away, like day, one-day seminars, 3-day seminars, YouTube, stuff like that. And they can take the knowledge you give them there and then take a step.

Yeah.

Which is the, which is the hope. Um, but what they, what they're unavailable to do right now is to really invest in themselves because of liquidity and all the things. Now, all the things we teach help them ultimately with liquidity and all the things that go with it. Right.

Exactly.

But it's like putting the cart before the horse.

Yeah.

And then he said, do you realize that every time that you just go and speak somewhere, Like every single time, like we have people come into the ecosystem who are amazing people who could really use the help to really get the outcomes when they invest in themselves, right? And can, and can afford comfortably to, you know, partner with the organization full-time. And I always tell people all the time, and I think this is true for any, any coaching keynote style business, personal brand, is you don't want the audience to stick with you forever.

Right.

Like, like, it's like you catch and release. Okay, come on into the ecosystem. Let me help you for the next 12 to 18 months. And then, hey, You know what, you want to— now you want to sell your business? Let me, let me introduce you to my— exactly, exactly, that kind of thing. And I find that that's a form of authenticity. And to not to keep unwinding here, but one of the things I also shared with one of these other speakers that was asking this for this insight, it was they were talking about how they felt when they got— when they went on stage. And I was like, okay, well, I understand the feeling. I felt it myself. But let me, let me tell you what I did differently, right? This is because this changed the game for me. I was like, I stopped focused on what I wanted to say and started focusing on what they needed to hear. So when I go up, you know, when I go put myself in a public arena, I literally want to channel whatever God has for them. You know, so I have this, this, this thing that I sometimes I say it verbally out loud, but I say it every time, even at the MentorBox event that we were at.

Yeah.

I was, I was in the room long before everybody else was having lunch and doing all the things. And I said, from you, Through me to them. And I did that to position my heart to carry authority rather than to carry performance. Right. Which changed how I looked at the entire audience altogether. Right. How I began to look at the audience was completely different. It was like, I'm here to serve you. I'm not here for you to look at me and think I'm amazing.

Yeah.

You know?

Yeah.

So I don't know. I just shared a long-winded story, but I think it goes a long way into, you know, how you actually create authority.

Yeah.

So what things are you doing right now that you find really effective with your clients? Because I know this is something you do really well to help them develop authority over time.

Right. It's a long game. I mean, it's a long game. And so that is, it's rewiring their expectation first and foremost that they're, you know, they, they're not going to have the end result that they're seeking in 30 days. And a lot of times it comes down to, I work with people on a 90-day, 6-month, or 12-month retainer typically.

Mm-hmm.

And they want like a 2-week retainer. You know, I—

Everybody wants insta-famous.

Exactly. They want instant gratification. And, and that's a hard thing is to, to rewire their expectations. Like that, what you see over here, that person took them 10 years to build that.

Yeah.

You know, and, and people, it, it's just like, you, it's where we live in that instant gratification world right now. So it's rewiring their thought process.

Mm-hmm.

And then it's really focusing on, I do a deep dive. It's everything is personalized. into their business and we look at, okay, how visible are you? What are you doing right? Because obviously they've gotten to a certain point in their business. What are they really good at? Because somebody that's, that doesn't want to be on camera, that doesn't want to make video, does not want to be on podcasts, that's fine. Like, it's not for everybody, but you need to appoint somebody in your business to do that front, to be that front person for you.

Yeah.

I even do that. So if somebody brings me on and they, they, they bring me in as a strategic partner, I will go to specific events based on who they're trying to bring in for their service or product, and I will be the representative for that specific company. And so—

How much is that— I don't mean to cut you off, but how much is that like being a solution versus not letting them outside of their comfort zone?

Yeah, you know, it's, I think, and yes, we love to push people and we love to have people step out of their comfort zone and learn new skills, but sometimes, you do have to kind of delegate just like you would in any, any job or position. What is the highest and best use of their time?

Yeah.

Right? And so if they're trying to go into a networking event to meet, you know, 10 good people and they're afraid to talk to people, they're kind of standing in the corner, they can't wait to leave, like that's going to be felt from your audience.

Yeah.

And you're not going to connect. So it's kind of like a waste of time. Like you do what you're best at and you bring in resources for what you're not. And so We have the right people in the wrong positions all the time.

Business 101.

Right? I mean, we see that all the time. So really just kind of taking a deep dive, like, okay, who, you know, what does this company consist of? Where are you trying to go? Where have you been? What are your bottlenecks? And a lot of times they've got a really great service or product.

Yeah.

They are, nobody knows who they are.

Yeah.

And so they'll say to me, well, I'm just gonna run some Facebook ads. And then we go right back to the Facebook ads. If you can't sell organically, the Facebook ads are, might as well open the window and throw all your money out the window because it's not going to work. Nobody knows who you are. That trust and authority is not built. So their ideas of how they're going to scale is going to set them back even further. I think another big thing that I see a lot is that people don't want to invest in their business or themselves. They will penny pinch as much as possible and kick the can down the road.

I had that conversation yesterday.

And a year later, they're in the same spot. A lot of times people come to me, they want to be placed, uh, they have— they need to raise capital. I have those strategic partnerships that I spent years building, vetting who does what, where, where this person likes to invest, what kind of family offices invest in what. I can pick up the phone and call those people very quickly. For you to have to find that, like, on LinkedIn or however you're going to try to do it on your own, it's, it's clearly not working for them because they haven't been able to find it.

Yeah.

They need— they're, they're leverage— leveraging my years of experience and expertise to collapse time. And as you were saying, you know, the people investing in your service and business, they don't wanna do it, but it would move the needle forward for them.

Oh, in a big way.

So, and, but yet people don't do it. And I find that you gotta think about who's looking at Facebook too. If you're looking at high-level executives, I mean, my avatar is growth-stage businesses, executives, founders, CEOs, not really, I mean, startups, yes, we work with them if they have a budget.

Yeah.

And that will move the needle forward for them. But people wanna start with nothing. And I know that those people are not scrolling Facebook, they don't have time. So the biggest, biggest place for me to get all my business is LinkedIn.

Yeah.

You know, it makes a big difference. So it's really just understanding like first who you are, Who do you help? And like, what do you do? And what problem do you solve? Yeah, for that person, if you can't effectively convey that, and most people can't, they can't even give me their like, who they help statement, you know? So for sure, makes it tough. It really makes it.

Yeah, it's really interesting because I feel like there's— you and I talk a lot. It's funny, high capacity leaders can be so determined and so powerful.

Yeah.

And so driven and make stuff happen out of thin air. But when it comes to, hey, we need to take your credibility and we need to put it in an environment that people can digest it so you can continue to expand in this direction. Because, you know, one of the things I've discovered is high-capacity leaders are normally so busy doing what they do, they don't even stop long enough to do the other thing, right?

Sure.

Um, and then if they do the— if they do the other thing, they're doing the other thing in the wrong way at the wrong time, right? So, so much of it is doing the right thing at the right time in the right way, right? You know, and finally finding that synergy that actually happens. Hey there. I hope you're enjoying the episode. Look, I love making great content for you, but more importantly, we like creating great resources. So before we get you back into the episode, I want to make you aware of the Aligned Leader Index, which you can find at stephenscoggins.com/leadership. This is a one-of-a-kind tool that I wish I had when I was actually building and scaling my own organizations. Why? Because a lot of times the bottlenecks that we think are actually in our way are not really the bottlenecks that are actually in our way. And what the cool thing about this specific thing is, it's gonna let you know what the number one constraint is internally, the number one driver that's actually in your way or being disrupted, where chaos and dysfunction are showing up. And number 3, probably most important, where your leadership blind spot likely is. So if you're tired of your business actually running you and you wanna take operational control over your organization, make sure you take complete advantage of the Align Leader Index. It takes 5 to 7 minutes and it'll give you instant clarification On the thing that's holding you back right now. Let's get back to the show. I was— it brings me— I literally had a conversation yesterday with somebody, and they have aspirations to do a handful of things. They are capable of doing these handful of things. They have the credibility to do a handful of things. But in this moment in time, and I wasn't even asking them to invest in what I do, I was trying to help actually point them towards someone else that does something very specific for what they were looking for. Because I try to do that too. I was like, okay, this is not my specialty, but I know somebody else who's a Michael Jordan at this, right? And I said, but it's going to be probably this kind of investment because I know what the person asked for, for an investment to get the actual return and make the thing happen, right? It was really interesting was that— and the person was like, oh, that's great, but I, you know, I've, I've, you know, I've already committed to doing this other thing. And, and this other thing was essentially— I'll call it, call it what it is— buying a toy. I'm like, so the same amount of money over here will create more money, but you want to go buy the toy that's not going to create the money, right?

Priorities. Yeah.

So I, you know, so I, I kind of lose, so I'm a big believer in, okay, buy the assets or create the assets that pay for the toys.

Mm-hmm.

Make sure it's passive. Make sure it's repetitive. Mm-hmm. Like, you know, and I, and I find this as being, to your point early on. So we used to specialize a long time ago in helping thought leaders specifically put the infrastructure behind them to support it, what it was, what they were doing.

Mm-hmm.

Okay. Um, we stopped doing it because it became very difficult to actually serve the client. So we would say, we need these assets, we need this from you, we need this, this type of commitment, we need you to do this on camera, like to, to put these things together. And, um, many times they would resist doing the very things that we were trying to help them do to become successful. Um, or this is the big or, and I'm— this is where I'm going with this, so I apologize for taking me so long. Um, I would call it shiny object syndrome.

Yeah.

Right. Like, we got a strategy. It's a proven strategy. It works. We do this. We do A, B, C, D, E, F, G in order. We do not jump over other letters in the alphabet. This is how it works. And they would go to, they would go to an event or a mastermind, like, well, so-and-so who has a massive audience said that you should do this, this, and this. And so they would literally come in, throw a stick of dynamite. So we're going to blow everything up. We're going to start all over again. We're going to go this direction.

Yeah.

And I was like, the one, the last time this happened, I was talking to a client. I was like, So help me understand this. You've invested 6 months of time, energy, and resource putting this thing together that you've even said now is more scalable than the thing that this idea is going to commit to, right? And they were like, yeah, but I need, I need, I need it now.

Mm-hmm.

There it is. I need it now. I'm like, What you're doing is you're scaling dysfunction, which we're anti-scaling dysfunction around here, right? So how many times do you see people getting lost in shiny object syndrome? Um, whether it's the content they're providing, whether it's the brand direction, the problem that they solve, like, where do you see the greatest moving sands, if you will?

Yeah, it's when people are not seeing the results they expected within a timeframe that they put on themselves. And it goes right back to the fact that their expectation is not in line with their output. Yeah, right. So I see it all the time. Well, this isn't working. So maybe we should do this. And even with like, like, if you run Facebook ads, you've got to let them like, like marinate.

Crazy part was I learned that it takes 90 days just to train the pixel. Yeah, just to train the pixel.

Yeah, exactly. So that's the problem. They'll start posting content. Now, if they, if they have a more seasoned audience, like I've been posting content for over 25 years and attracting business, then I have a much more seasoned audience and people trust me. That authority's there, that consistency's there. If people just started posting and they, you know, had a very like, like mundane account with not a lot of followers and, and just not a lot of activity, it takes a while for your audience to trust you.

Yeah. And find you for that matter.

And find you and the algorithm to put you in front of the people that need to hear what you offer. They— it's that shot. Well, maybe I'll try this. Well, maybe I'll try that. And then they're just sort of shifting gears constantly, not giving it any time for anything to work. And the time that you think it takes and the time that it actually takes are 2 different things.

Well, I think that is with most things, right?

Yeah, for sure.

I think one of the things that I did at the event we were both at is I— and I've done this a few times, which is— it's going to stop working at some point in time because people watch the show and stuff like that. By a show of hands, who thinks, who thinks they should be further ahead than they actually are?

Oh, I think, I think you asked that and I think I raised my hand because I'm one of those people.

Yeah, I think we all are. It's like, it's, you know, but I've just, you know, I've discovered that if you can just be present where your feet are, right, and committed to a path, yes, you know, um, it can, it can make all the world difference. You know, one of the things I teach is called the 5 Drivers, right? Then the number one driver of a business ecosystem is going to be ideation, right? Ideation covers a lot of ground. It's where I think it's where high-capacity leaders spend the least amount of time, and that's where they should spend the most amount of time.

Right.

Right? In my, in my vernacular, ideation is vision, mission, core values, roles, responsibility, basic infrastructure. But then you start breaking apart who it is you're like, who you're gonna serve.

Yeah.

I've got a good friend of mine, Rory AJ Baden, Brand Builders Group. They're, they, they believe in getting the problem down to one word.

Mm-hmm.

And the, and then the solution in one word, and then a message behind it. What are you, what are you doing to help people really get to that new? Because I'll tell, this is public. Okay. This will be, yeah. Yeah. Um, one of the biggest mistakes that we made was I was trying to serve too many people at once.

Mm-hmm.

I was too broad.

Yep.

So we used to serve high capacity leaders. Okay.

Mm-hmm.

True. I've been working with people, 6, 8, 9, even 10 figure companies routinely for the last 3 and a half years.

Mm-hmm.

Okay. And even before that, probably that I wasn't thinking about because I was in business doing the other things. Right.

Right.

Because you meet people and you're like, well, you know, I would just do this. And I'm gonna just do that and whatever. And we went back and actually looked at who actually partnered with us the prior year. All of them were faith-aligned, high-capacity leaders. Because, and for me, what that did for me is it set me free to be far more myself.

Authentic.

Yeah.

Yeah. And where, where you, your goals and, and your, you align. And that is so true. I talk all the time about niching it down. People don't, they're afraid to do that because they think, well, I'm gonna lose business if I niche it down. I'm gonna look like I only speak to a small audience. But that specific audience needs to hear what you're offering. And there's many people in that niche. So I always tell people, speak to one person. Like when you're doing content or you're speaking on stage, speak to one person that is your ideal audience.

Mm-hmm.

And just talk to that one person.

Yeah.

And that's where you're gonna connect with the people that need to hear your message.

Yeah. Well, in, in doing so, uh, one of the things again is, is positioning, right? Mm-hmm. So most businesses that I've dealt with, great business, great people, mm-hmm, wanna do right by their clients, wanna do right by their customers. Um, that tends to be who we attract in our little, our little ecosystem and world. Um, all of those are beautiful things. But the leader doesn't want to slow down to do it right.

Right.

So even in my case, my positioning was just slightly off.

Mm-hmm.

Right. And as soon as it got to like literally on top of the, the bullseye, if you will, you know, you get rapid acceleration.

Yeah.

You know, so what would you say to a leader right now who is probably listening to this and probably like, nah, that's me too.

Yeah. Right.

Right. What could we do? tactically to help them broaden their mind to really niche down? And is there such thing as being too niche?

Mm-hmm. Mm-hmm. I don't, I mean, no, I don't think there's anything being too nichey, right? I think if you serve a specific audience and it's, it's absolutely like I was dealing with a client and she's a doctor, she has a medical practice, but she only deals with children's eczema. That's all she does.

Yeah.

Like that. And she's written these studies on it and everything. And so that is her niche. That is why people come to her. She's, she's written all these case studies and that is her specialty. So think about that, you know, think about with your business, if you go to, if you have a heart condition, you're not going to go to a doctor that specializes in cancer, right? I mean, it's just, it's just think about all these other businesses that we go to.

Yeah.

You know, I mean, you're going to a specific For a specific reason. And so think about when you're serving people, put together that framework. Like, what is your specific avatar and what is the problem that they need solved? Like, why do they lay in bed at night? What do they think about when they lay in bed at night? They're— if they could solve this one problem and you're the person to do it, how can you effectively convey that to that specific person? And you are going to attract far more people than if you say, I help everyone.

Yeah. Yeah. Well, I've also learned that, uh, at least it feels like this the way to me, that within every niche there's also a sublingo. Like there's even in your copywriting, in your social media posting, how you communicate. You know, for the longest time I was in the construction industry. That was a huge chunk of my life, right? Siding company. Um, and I realized when I first started doing this type of work that it was really easy for me to kind of be in that vernacular.

Yeah.

Right. Um, and people that are in that world understand certain little lingo traits, right? And then I got to thinking of one of the things that helped me grow the other company was like, okay, when I, when I do the copywriting, I'm going to think about a day in the life of the customer, the client. So John Doe, he wakes up at this time every morning. He goes through this part of his day. He feels this kind of way.

Mm-hmm.

He is going this type of work. He's watching this type of content. I mean, his favorite color most likely is X. Like, I really try to do a really good job of doing that. And then I went and said, okay, well, this is John Doe over here. And John Doe is looking for— then the time was a service-based business. So service-based business. What in the copy, what in the material does it need to say that speaks John Doe's language that draws him in saying that we actually, like, we are the expert.

Yeah.

Like, it kind of showcases the expert and the fact that we know you, bro.

Yeah. Yeah. It's nice to reverse engineer it for sure. I mean, it's, it's one of those things and now you have AI to help you obviously. And, and we can all tell when things are written by AI. So give it some personalization, give it that human factor behind it as well. Like humanize your audience and really just speak to them. Like you were saying, when you go on stage and you get a performance versus a, hey, I'm just going to be real. Like I believe you said that at that talk.

Yeah.

And I think, I think I may have told you that I like teared up a little bit.

Mm-hmm.

Because I really connected with your story.

Mm-hmm.

And it, you weren't up there performing or giving a lecture. I think people are over that.

Mm-hmm.

And so, you know, when you're helping somebody, just let them know how you can help them.

Mm-hmm.

Like my, my, my avatar is typically the, uh, CEO slash entrepreneurial mindset that is, Doing way too many things themselves. They either are, uh, control freak and don't want to give up, you know, don't want to give up.

We help you delegate.

Right, exactly, exactly. Or they're, they don't have the capital, so they're running around working all hours of the night trying to scale their business. They're trying, they're throwing spaghetti at the wall to see if it sticks, and they're unfortunately, they're running themselves into the ground and kicking the can down the road instead of just implementing one or two specific strategists that can help you move your business forward. And sometimes people have a whole group of employees and they have the wrong people.

Yeah.

They have family members. Oh gosh, when people hire family, like, that is the worst, you know? Oh, my sister's— there are some times where it's really good, but they just collect people because they don't want to pay them. They give them— they sell them on the hope and the dream that when the funding comes in, they're going to make all this money.

Yeah.

But they're the wrong people moving your business forward. So, I mean, just really just go back to basics. There's so much AI out there now. There's so much like fabricated, manufactured stuff online. Go back to basics and think about who you really help. What do they lay in bed thinking about at night? If they had your product or service, how would it move the needle forward in their life? And then focus on that.

Yeah, that's so good. I think, I feel like a lot of us don't go that, we don't go that deep.

No.

Like we don't really spend time. What is, you know, again, going back to John or Jane Doe, it's like, What is legitimately at their biggest concern? Like, when I, all right, we'll give you, for ex— for the example, the siding company.

Okay. Mm-hmm.

Um, and the siding company in the, we, in the remodeling sector, right? What is the client actually thinking about? Um, I was sharing this with somebody else today. I said it wasn't features and benefits.

Mm-hmm.

It wasn't, this is the best type of material for your home to do X, Y, and Z. It was like, I'm so tired of my spouse telling me how ugly our house looks.

Yeah. Right.

Right. Or, I'm so tired of having to patch another hole and get rain in some other location. I'm so tired of smelling mildew somewhere. I'm so tired of my children being sick.

Yeah. Right.

And so we began to work with that. What was the client actually saying is their problem?

You got to sell the transformation.

Exactly.

Yeah. You have to sell the transformation. And that's so important with every business.

Would you say sell or communicate?

Communicate, sell the transformation. I mean, I, you know, obviously we're not really selling it, but what I find is I can't stand when people feature dump on me. I can't stand it. I don't wanna watch a presentation of a slide deck that's gonna say, and then you get this, and with this you get this, and then—

And, but wait, there's more.

Oh, wait, there's more. You know, I just, I wanna know like the actual story of how the founder of the company created this service or product, or how they moved here, you know, completely poor from another country, lived, grew up in poverty, and then realized there was a specific need for XYZ and implemented that, and, and it's grown their business significantly. I'd rather hear that and have some humanization to it and how it helps me solve the problem and what, what is my desired outcome. So whenever I have a potential client on a call and we're kind of doing a dive into their business, and I always, I always end the call with the transfer. I don't go through and say, we have the best blah, blah, blah, we have this. I don't do that. I don't talk about who I work with or anything like that. I talk about, and this is after 90 days, you can expect XYZ. And that is always the outcome that they're purchasing, the outcome they're investing in you for, the outcome that you're going to provide to them and collapse time for them.

That's so good. That's so good. Gurus focus on, look at the shiny, look at the beautiful, look at this. Guides focus on, this is how you get there.

Right.

It's literally that simple.

Yeah.

In many cases. I love that.

I love that. Yeah. And you can take that in any business. I mean, I sold real estate for many, many years, and I never went into a listing appointment and talked about how great I was. I mean, they already knew that. That's why I was there, right? I mean, my advertising and my marketing was all over town. It was, what are you trying to accomplish? For some people, they were going through a miserable divorce.

Mm-hmm.

They just wanted this as easy as possible. They were crying at the table. Or maybe they're selling to move to their dream home.

Mm-hmm.

Or maybe they're relocating to a warm, sunny state from a cold, you know, from the cold.

Yeah.

They're— everybody's destination is different. So I would try to help them and, and talk to them about the transformation. Like, if they wanted it sold quickly, what is that going to do for you?

Mm-hmm.

You know, like, if I can get this sold for you in 30 days, how's that going to make you feel versus, if we do it this way where it's going to sit on the market for 6 months. So I always worked with them on the problem that they had and the solution that we were going to implement in order for them to have the best outcome in the shortest amount of time. So, well, and they would say to me, other agents came here and went through an entire flipbook of all their awards that they got, and that's not going to help the seller move the needle forward. So I learned that at a very young age, that people buy outcomes.

Mm-hmm.

They don't And the experience shows. You don't really need to go through all your accolades and things like that.

Well, that's performance, right?

Right.

You're seeking validation through achievement.

Exactly. You can be, that's where the visibility and the credibility is so important. That kind of plays a role in the background.

Yeah.

You know, on social media, through authority pieces like podcasts, like articles, features, and it's important to sprinkle that in. It really is important because people see that and it does give you credibility going to events. But you know what? Think about when you've moved forward with maybe a big purchase or you've invested in something that was a recommendation from a friend, family, or neighbor.

Yeah.

You're much more apt to say, you know what, Joe Schmo's Pool Company, they did a great job at my neighbor's house. The neighbor said they were awesome to work with. They completed the job in record time and everything was great, versus if you just see all this crazy marketing online that they're the best company ever, call us today. Like—

Quality, integrity, value.

Right, you know, the credibility from the personal referral is going to go so much further. So take a step back, start shaking some hands, start going and asking other people what you can do for them and their business, and let them know, hey, you know, If there's ever a need for XYZ, what I do, I would love it if you would just mention my name.

Yeah.

Something like that. That's going to go so much further than all this crazy advertising and just, you know, I'm the best.

Well, in today's time, to this point earlier, it's like we stopped investing in Facebook because we were meeting people that we could genuinely serve at a high level. Just by being in person and being in front of them.

Yeah.

Um, it's almost like they could sense the authenticity.

Yeah.

They knew, they knew that they knew, oh, Stephen and the team, they've done this before.

Mm-hmm.

And they've done it well before. They've, you know, and we didn't have to get into, you know, it's always beautiful to have testimonials.

Oh, sure. Yeah.

Um, but they'd almost already made up their decision, made up their mind ahead of time.

Mm-hmm.

You know, um, I think one of the things I'd like to hit on because, all right, so we kind of talked about Credibility and visibility specifically, right? Um, I see a lot of amazing humans that do amazing work, um, that are simply not visible, right? So let's assume for a second you're a high-capacity leader. You've been so good at doing what you're doing. You have the results, right? You have the— I would call it internal credibility, maybe.

Yeah.

Like, it's not— it has— it's credibility that you have that you've earned. You've worked really hard. You mentioned it a minute ago. It's like, hey, I Sold real estate for X number of years.

Yeah.

Right. Um, but they don't have the visibility.

Right.

How, how can they start to create visibility for something they've done well without coming across like braggadocious and—

Yeah.

That kind of thing?

Well, they need to really honestly hire someone like me. Really? I mean, they can start to do it themselves, which is going to be posting online, being consistent, letting people know about your product.

Mm-hmm.

Sharing something maybe interesting.

Mm-hmm.

How it helps solve a problem. So kind of like mixing it up. Like you don't wanna be like info dumping every single time you post, but you wanna have something be informational.

Mm-hmm.

Then something maybe like, you know, questioning the audience. So kind of mixing up the content, but you're gonna get much further along if you bring in like somebody that has a public relations background.

Mm-hmm.

And that's also what we do.

Yeah.

So we can do high-end public relations. We also can do just authority pieces like For instance, podcasts, um, uh, a press release, um, you know, authority pieces that you can repurpose the content and continue to use it over and over again. If you're speaking at an event or you're attending an event, taking the, uh, let's just say the graphic from the event and saying, I'm so excited that I'm traveling to, you know, Dallas, Texas for XYZ event. Who's going to be there? Who'd like to connect? Always mixing up the content. So you're asking a question, you're getting engagement from your followers, and maybe after the, then at the event, take some pictures. Then when you leave the event, I had such a great time at such and such event. Mm-hmm. Thank you to all the sponsors. Then you tag the company names. Like there, it's a lot of work and people will say to me, oh my gosh, that sounds exhausting. Like that's a full-time job. Yes, it is.

It is.

It is. And that's why it's important to have a team behind you that's gonna give you a plan because we've done this before.

Mm-hmm.

But if you wanna go try to do it yourself, you need to give yourself about an hour.

Yeah.

Every day to dedicate to social media on multiple platforms, creating the graphics, creating the content. Don't, and you can't just post and ghost. You have to interact with other people.

Yeah.

You have to go in and engage with other people. That means that you're commenting on one of their posts, that you're asking them a question, you're sharing their content. The algorithm will pick up if you're just a poster and ghoster.

Mm-hmm.

And you will not get the, you will not be positioned.

I've never heard that term.

Yeah.

Poster and ghoster. Right.

It makes total sense. Yeah.

I mean, It's funny, I used to be one of the world's worst at that.

Well, well, it's because it takes time, right?

We're all busy. Yeah, I mean, I have my head down trying to do other things.

We're all busy. And here's the other thing. If you are trying to attract a certain avatar, you need to follow the content for that specific avatar. So if you're trying to attract, you know, women in their early 50s, Um, and you know, whatever. Um, then you, you wanna be looking at their content. Mm-hmm. You don't wanna be looking at cat videos.

Yeah.

Right. 'Cause when, have you ever noticed when you look at like a video of, of like planes crashing or something that you're gonna start to see all of those?

Or your phone's listening to you 24/7.

You know, and it's true. So you wanna speak it into existence. You wanna look at the content for the types of people that you wanna attract to your business. You are literally telling the algorithm, how to position you.

Mm-hmm.

So whatever you're posting, that, and whoever you're following, that's what the algorithm thinks that you need more of. So when you're doing social media for your business to attract clients, you are now doing social media not for yourself anymore.

Yeah.

You are doing it for your audience. What does your audience wanna see? I'm gonna tell you, one of the best things that you can do is add some little controversial Items in there.

Okay.

Whenever I do something a little sassy or a little controversial, you can't be like, you know, don't go. You don't have to go into like religion or politics or anything like that, but it's just like a little either funny, controversial, or like I can't believe she just said that. Those tend to get the most views because people share them. They're like, oh my gosh, this is so funny, or this is crazy, right? When I find when you do those like, hey everybody, just want to tell you about my business today. My name's Dane. Like Those get no views, right? Because it looks very salesy and pitchy, although sometimes it is necessary because you do have to mix it up. But you have to be careful about what you're watching and who you're following and what you're saying. Because if you want to be in front of a high-end client, you need to be following those people and then getting yourself—

Unless they just happen to like Aliens 2 or something.

You know, you got to be doing what those people are doing, right?

That's That's true. Very true. Here's an offshoot question. Have you ever had a client who wasn't ready to be seen?

Yes. Yes. And so, yes, all the time. And we have to work on their positioning first and foremost. Like, that is really more of a, this guy's just starting kind of in the idea stage, or maybe they have some sort of prototype or whatever, but they haven't They don't have a website. They don't have any sort of lead magnet. They don't have any way to even see what it is that they offer. They're showing it to me on a Zoom. It looks amazing. But they don't even have a profile picture on their LinkedIn. They don't have like a cover photo. I mean, there are some real basic stuff that we have to work on and we're happy to do it. That's also what we do. We meet people where they are.

Mm-hmm.

And a lot of times people piece these together. They'll go hire a social media manager, then they'll hire a website designer. Then they'll hire somebody.

And none of them talk to each other.

No.

And they don't follow a brand guideline.

No, they don't. And it's just, you literally can bring one, us together in one ecosystem because it's not just me. I have a team. We can design a beautiful website for you. We can design a lead magnet for you. We can do your funnels and your email follow-ups for you. I have a whole side of that behind the scenes. Those are my people that are good at what they do. They're not somebody that I would put on a Zoom with a client.

Yeah.

Right. So that's really, What you need to think about with your business, like, what are you good at? And you need to implement the right people in the right positions to move your business forward.

Yeah, that's so good. I've been thinking too, you know, as part of a part of it, as part of being ready, I know you've done a lot of TV, right? And you've helped place clients with different programs and things of that nature as well. Um, I've discovered that not everyone's ready to be in front of a camera, like media trained, if you will. And I didn't realize there was a science to it or You know, um, a kind of a— well, I guess it is a science, just a science.

Sure.

You know, because an average TV spot, for example, like Good Morning America or, I don't know, the Today Show, you got like, I don't know, maybe 3 minutes tops.

Yeah, it's like $25 grand too.

Yeah. You know, so it's like going back to the Insta-famous thing. If I could just get on this show or if I can just do this podcast, I can just do this.

Yeah.

Um, it seems to me that the, the, the question should be asked is, is if I could just serve that audience.

Yeah. Right.

Right. How, how would you, how would you coach someone to know if they're ready for that next level of media or, um, whether or not they need to kind of maybe hire you and like work with you directly to get them ready for media?

Yeah.

So, what are some telltale signs?

I would look at what they've done in the past.

Okay.

I mean, what does their social media look like? If there's somebody that I, I scroll through their social media and they're constantly on podcasts and they're a good speaker, like if, if you had contacted me and said, oh, I just want more clients, I'd like you to, mm-hmm. you know, to be my other half and go out around the country and help with XYZ. I would look and see you clearly have those authority pieces. So obviously he's ready for the Today Show, right? If I see nothing, like you have never even posted a video of yourself, and it's also how they speak on Zooms too. A lot of, as you know, as a public speaker, a lot of filler words. I hear a lot of like ums, a lot of just—

So's.

Yeah, things like that. So as far as being prepared, I really look at where are they now and what are they comfortable doing? Because some people will say to me, I don't wanna be on a podcast. And I'm thinking, you're not even looking at a camera. Most podcasts are, they're just on a screen like a Zoom, you know? And I said, really? We're just talking like we're talking now. Nope, I can't do it. I can't do it. So I host a radio show here on Mondays for, it's called Local Biz Now. And I invited somebody to come, a good business owner, and they did not want to do it. And I said, we're just in a room talking. There's literally like one camera, like, but you don't even, you're not talking into the camera.

Yeah.

And didn't wanna do it. Totally not comfortable answering questions. And I'm thinking, what would you do if someone called you about your business? So it is important.

They'd probably take the call and talk about their business.

Right. I mean, it's, it's important to exercise those skills. And what I tell people is if you do wanna post, but you're afraid, You practice talking to yourself. You know, practice. You can use a teleprompter. You can, you know, ask ChatGPT to put together a script for you. Start talking to yourself, rewatching it back, and then post it messy. Doesn't matter. Have you, I mean, really, have you seen people on social media? I mean, there's people in their pajamas.

I've got a good friend, Jen Gottlieb.

I love Jen.

She's been a close friend of mine now for probably 3 years. I did her show. Um, probably about this time last year. And we were, when she, when she and I were talking, I was like, you know, one of my favorite pieces of content that she does at her live events, uh, she and Chris, um, cuz they, they own Super Connector now for a while. And I think they're still affiliated, does some stuff with them. But, you know, she still helps a lot of speakers and she still helps a lot with the social media strategy and some other things, uh, for her audience. But one of the things that I love is she's constantly putting up her first reel.

Yeah. Yep. Yeah.

All the time. She's like, this was me. Because now, obviously, a lot of time has gone by. She's done a lot of content.

And her book, Be Seen, is great.

Exactly. Yep.

Her book is great.

She was on the show not that long— well, about 2 years ago.

We have never met in person, but we know a lot of the same people.

I'll have to get her and Chris to come up here and say hi and hang out at the house.

You would have to. Yeah, I just love her. And so I've corresponded with her back and forth, but I really like her content. She does it right. She does it right. And so she's one of—

And she's not afraid to do it messy.

Right.

Yeah. And to that, which is what made me think of that, is like, that's something she's— it's like her— it's one of her pillars.

Yeah.

Right?

Yeah.

Yeah.

No, it's great. And she's very authentic, which I love. And she's also a great speaker. I mean, she's, you know, when I look at women speakers, she's somebody that I look up to because she's really just commands an audience and she's, She does. She's just really put together too. And she's got an interesting story. So, but yeah, I mean, it's Post-it messy. People are not sitting there looking at what your hair looks like. They don't care what you're wearing. All they're really looking at is, does this message resonate with me?

Yes.

And some of the people that, you know, Jen is a beautiful woman, but sometimes she doesn't have any makeup on and her hair is in a pony, you know, in a bun on top of her head. Or she's out walking, nobody's looking at you going, why did you post online not all done in makeup? Nobody cares.

And if you do get that, that's a hater.

Exactly. So, I mean, no. So, think about it that way. People just want to hear your message. And also, you're inspiring other people. There are people out there that may need what you offer. And if you can do it and they see you doing it, they might say, you know what? Maybe it's not that bad. Maybe I'll try it. It's just like anything else. You go to the gym, and you wanna either lose 30 pounds or you wanna bulk up in muscle, you have to literally do it every other day or every day.

Yeah.

You have to be consistent or it's not gonna happen. And you have to put in the reps, right?

Yeah.

Like quite literally. Yeah, you have to put in the reps. 30 days isn't gonna do it.

Yeah.

So, I mean, it's a standard that you set for yourself. And like, for me, I have standards that I don't care how, if I don't feel good, if I'm tired, I get up and I work out every single morning. Like, it is non-negotiable. And so, you have to have those standards that you set for yourself. So, if you are afraid to record something, do it, you know, do it, set aside a day and give yourself like an hour. Because not every day, I don't feel like recording every day. There are days where I'm just not feeling like, you know, watching myself or listening to myself or just even making the content. You have to be inspired, right? You have to be inspired.

Those are my favorite days is when I do have something that's inspiring. I have no problem picking up the phone, doing it. It's the days, it's the days it's like, you know what, I don't really feel like I have anything of value to add today.

I know.

And then the team's like, well, you promised us that you would do something for us. Yeah. Um, you know, so then I just try to tell, you know, go to a story that really resonated. Um, I want to, I want to, uh, position a little bit differently. I want to know about Burnout to Brilliance.

Yes. Okay.

So super excited about this project.

Yes.

Yes. Um, I'd love to know what inspired you to begin to write the book.

Mm-hmm.

Um, what are you seeing in the marketplace? If we go back to problems that we're solving.

Yeah.

Right. What, what problems that you were seeing that you wrote this specific book to?

Mm-hmm. So the book is coming out soon. Um, it is coming soon.

Congratulations.

It's coming soon. Yes. It's How to Rise, Reclaim Your Power, and Step into Your Brilliance. And I wrote the book because I was burned out in real estate. Mm-hmm. I had done some really great things. I worked in luxury. I, I ended up creating a, high net worth, white glove service concierge for family offices and high net worth individuals, where I basically helped them as their in-house real estate advisor.

Wow.

Because family offices have, you know, their own accountant, their own CPA, their own attorney. They just didn't have an in-house real estate advisor. So I found a niche in the market where I created something of value for them. So I was doing that and, and just really like at the time, my, my main income was coming from selling houses still. And I, we knew we wanted to move. to a lake in the South and—

Welcome.

Yes, and we're here now.

Meet me here.

Yep. And, um, and so I knew I didn't want to sell houses on that hamster wheel. It becomes very addicting and it's almost like you can't get off the hamster wheel. Like, you, once that house closes, you've got to go find it. You got to go find it. You always, there's no residual income, right? So I tried a few things. I got burned by that person that I told you about. And I tried to do like real estate coaching, did that for a little while. I just felt really burnt out and I felt like it wasn't quite clicking, like it wasn't quite resonating. I'm like, maybe I'll just go back to selling houses. And I was like mid-40s, you know, wanna do something different with my life. And I just felt really burnt out. And talking to so many women in their 40s and 50s was the same thing. They wanted to pivot in midlife, but they didn't know how. They had a great idea. Maybe they were coming off a divorce and they, now they have to generate their own income. They wanna work from home.

Yeah, transition.

And so they, they just want to reinvent themselves. And what they were coming to me with the majority of this was they don't even know the first thing about starting a business, and they don't even know what to put on social media and how to create that framework. I mean, we're talking basics. So I created a course called Standout Social to just help all these people, and it went viral on TikTok. It was literally just how to post a reel.

Yeah.

How to, how to create an engaging hook. Where to center it on the screen. Like basic, I mean, I'm telling you so basic stuff.

I probably need to watch the video.

So, you know, how to use CapCut. I mean, and I'm not a pro by any means, but enough where it's attracted business my entire life on social media. So in multiple different, I've done that with network marketing. I have several different verticals that just pay me residually. So I started helping. I had a coaching program for women called Burnout to Brilliance. it was just women that just needed help with the basics. How to get their offer out there, how to create an email list. Like maybe they had a little boutique, but they'd write the emails down like in a sign-in sheet and they don't know what to do with them after. Like it was really basic stuff.

Yeah, yeah.

But it was empowering them to take control of their idea and their business and really Move it, kind of move the needle, like move it down the train tracks, right? So I wrote the book because there was a few things that I tried that didn't work out. I call it failing forward. I failed forward many, many times, as we were talking about that earlier.

Leadership 101.

Right? And just how to like reinvent yourself, but also to slow down and take a step back and evaluate. Like, you don't need to do the same thing for your entire life. If you don't like what you're doing, you literally can create a new life. Like, you can create a new business. There are so many people, and I'm mostly talking to, at that point, I'm talking to a lot of employees who are miserable.

Yeah.

Absolutely miserable in their, in their job or their, their life, but they don't know how to go from employee to entrepreneur. And that's a really scary place for people to be. You see a lot of it online with people trying network marketing, or they're doing like peptides on the side, or they're doing some side business.

Yeah.

Um, you know, supplements or whatever. But they can't even make that move forward. So how are they gonna completely start a new business? And so it's simple things like being consistent every day, gaining the trust of your audience, which if you were an employee, you never had to do that before. So now you're shifting gears and they don't like the fact that they haven't done anything in 30 days.

Yeah.

Right? So I wrote the book. There's several stories about several different women in there, which, you know, characters and names are made up, but I'm referencing like, the mom that—

Yeah, we did the same thing in the new book.

Yeah.

I couldn't, I didn't, it would be disrespectful for me to call out the people directly.

Yeah.

So we mixed a lot of things up.

Yeah, it's just like, okay, like, I've got, you know, I've got friends like that. Like, I've got, you know, the mom that's literally like, her husband is just like, like, out, like, when I say like, he's not even, he's so disconnected. And, you know, she's doing everything. And it's like that story of her wanting to get her business off the ground. Then I've got like the really high achiever that lives in like New York City that, is absolutely killing it in real estate, but then has like a medical problem that stops her in her tracks. And, you know, it's like, we all experience different levels of burnout, right? I mean, you can be burnt out with your family, you can be burnt out with your friends, you can be burnt out with your job.

Or yourself.

Right? I mean, I was literally burning myself out trying to force something that wasn't authentic to me.

Yeah.

And I thought I wanted to be a real estate coach. I thought that's what I was going to be on, because I was on stage all the time talking to real estate offices and real estate agents. I still can do that. I'm still, I still have a broker's license and I still speak to real estate offices, but I don't, I need to focus on, I'm my best and I shine the most when I'm doing something that's authentic to me. And the high-level executives and leaders, that have done some extraordinary things, but still need to take a step back with some of the basic things is really where I shine. And so that's, and that can be anybody. I mean, it could be a real estate brokerage that hires me. It could be, you know, I've got people that are creating video games. I've got, I've had hotels. I've done a project for Ritz-Carlton. So it just depends what they're looking for.

Oh, this is so special. You're on the lake. We need to jam one day.

Oh, I know.

I got some ideas.

Oh, I would love it. I would love it.

So, well, I'm curious. All right, so, uh, one of the things I discover in when I go to write a book is books tend to write themselves at the right time, right? So, um, and I'm saying this from my personal experience, obviously. We have a new one coming out next year, uh, which I'm super excited about. The audience is excited about. It's gonna be great. Um, but there's— it's funny to me, there's always, there's always chapters that are just super easy to write because they just flow.

Mm-hmm.

And then there's other chapters that are tougher to write, not because of the flow, but because of maybe the circumstances that were going on or the reminders of the circumstances or— but I also find that those chapters tend to be the best ones. Maybe it's authenticity, maybe it's that magnetic approach from that.

Yeah.

In your book, I'm just curious, what was the toughest chapter you had to write?

I think for me, it's more of the teaching chapters. The ones that flowed are the storylines. that I was able to create the picture with the character and be able to flow where you don't— like, what happens next?

Yeah.

Right? And because I had never written a book before, so I thought originally I was going to write a self-help book where it's like I'm constantly teaching you everything. But as I started to write the book, and then some people said, oh, is the book about you? I'm like, no, it's really not. The first chapter tells you my story, And which is— we could save that for another day, but I'll go back to that in a second. Um, but then I kind of shifted into, what if I had, like, 5 characters that I keep cycling back to? Like, one chapter's about this one, and then we go to Jessica, and then we go to Rachel, and then we go back to Amy. And it's like, they all have different problems, but I wanted them to be able to relate to the different types of women that are out there.

Yeah.

Where people can go, oh my God, I'm this girl.

Yeah.

Right? And so that's where my book started to go because it just flowed that way. I don't know why. And I actually like writing that way better, but I have some of the chapters where we talk about consistency and we talk about letting go and we talk about different things. But my whole burnout to brilliance moment was, and I still think I'm achieving the brilliance, First of all, it's having the guts and the courage to keep trying, right? And when you keep falling on your face and keep trying, but we were, we'd always talked about moving to the South and living on a lake, and it was just our dream. And in 2021, we were in a really horrific car accident where our—

I was gonna ask you about that.

Yeah, so our car, it was just started to snow, and we were sliding in the sharp, sharp curve that we go by every day. And we hit the guardrail right where the guardrail starts, where it meets the road. So it literally, it's like a slope.

Yeah.

Our car went up on the guardrail like a luge. We had a full tank of gas. All I remember is hearing scraping and then everything went black. And I remember hearing crackling like a fire, and I thought I was sleeping. So I must have been knocked out by the airbags is what I figure happened, because there's no way, the car was completely charred. You cannot tell anything. But, I still have questions. My coat didn't have any— I guess there's powder and stuff from an airbag, but my coat was fine. It was really weird. So, we were up on this guardrail. Obviously, there's an embankment. I opened the passenger door and there's flames coming out underneath the car. And, I jumped down this embankment. My fiancé got out. Thank God we were able to open the doors and there wasn't like—

Yeah.

We weren't trapped inside the car and the car exploded. 7 seconds later, like, in the biggest fireball. And it was so quiet where we lived. It was like a country road in Connecticut. And just hearing that, vroom. And the cops were there by then. But the cops got there, we must have been in a burning car for, like, 6 minutes is what we think, like, 5 or 6 minutes while the car—

Just, like, basically knocked out?

Yeah, yeah. Because I remember, like, kind of feeling like my head was to the side. And I remember my feet were getting hot because I had, like, dress boots on. And then I heard, get out of the car. And I remember saying to my fiancé, gosh, the cops got there really fast. Now, we lived in a little country town where there was 2 cops on at night, 2 police cars. That's it.

Wow.

And so he's like, no, I think we were in the car for a while and the neighbor saw the car burning and called the cops, because no cars went by us.

Wow.

And so I thought to myself, we got driven home that night from the police. And you come in your house and you're expecting to come home. Right? Like, our dogs were at the door all excited that we were home. They want their food. You know, there's mail on the counter from earlier today. There's dishes in the sink from breakfast. And I thought, we almost didn't come home tonight. And I said, that's it. I'm doing everything I want now. I'm not waiting. Because when you think, like, when you're in your early 40s, you're thinking like, oh, when I retire or when I get older, I'll move, when I have more money.

Yeah.

And I just said, nope, we're putting the wheels in motion and we're doing what we want now and we're going to make this work.

Yeah.

And so it was a scary thing. You know, I was walking away from a, I was number one agent in my town. And, you know, it was, it's one of those things that I've tried several things and I've, I'm so resilient that I found what works for me. And now I wanna help other business owners be able to, I can see the gaps that they don't see. Because some people are so, they're so excited about what they're building that they don't see the tremendous gaps in their business.

Yeah.

And they really need somebody from an outside view to come in. So, so that's, you know, that's— sorry for the long story, but—

No, it's great. No, I wanted to ask about that a long time ago. I just got lost in other parts of the conversation because we do— a lot of us do have awakening moments where things just get super clear, super fast. Yeah. Um, they happen at different times. A lot of times it is connected to, um, a traumatic-style event.

Yeah, sure.

Which is, which is pretty wild. Um, I'm curious, did— and I know it— so obviously it changed you and it awoke in you. Uh, did it change your I guess spouse now?

You know, it's so funny. He's, you know, we've been engaged forever. It's a long story. Just like, we have a second marriage. You know, we got engaged right before COVID happened. And then we wanted to move. And so, we just never really moved forward. We had other things we were doing. I said to him, you know, I didn't want PTSD, 'cause I'm like, I'm not one of these people that has like any like sort of like issues or anything. So, I just didn't want any issues. And I said, are you okay? Like, do you have any like PTSD? He's like, no, I'm fine. And I guess like men keep their feelings inside, I think a lot. There are men—

We tend to be more closed off.

Yeah. And so—

We're not as good at processing the emotions.

Yeah. So I don't, I mean, he never really talked about it after. I mean, it was a total pain because we had to go get a new car and everything. But he never really like, he's, he did. Yeah. He just never really like talked about it. And so I wonder sometimes too, like, if that, like, bottles up inside. Like, his family didn't— he shares feelings with me. Like, he's super, you know, emotional and everything. But his family never expressed their feelings when he was younger.

Yeah, we feel safe with you.

Yeah. And so, it's like, I think sometimes he's never really come to me with, like, a problem, right? So, I think it's just how men are. And I mean—

I don't know about all men.

You know, but I did— I had, like, a Reiki energy healer.

Yeah, yeah.

And I called her and I said, I've gotta tell you what happened. And I said, I wanna know what my purpose is. And she said to me, you may never know. And she said, someday you, something may happen and you might just be like, wow, this is my purpose.

Yeah.

And so I never really felt a purpose with real estate. Like, is my purpose to sell houses the rest of my life? Like, I didn't know what my purpose was and I don't have kids, so I don't, I get my fulfillment through work.

Yeah.

And so that kind of was like, why did we live and why was everything okay versus people that die every day in accidents? Like, why were we saved? We don't have kids. And I wanted that answer. And she's like, I can't give you that answer.

Yeah.

You may never know.

Yeah. So I have a— my answer of the purpose statement has always been, it's been this way for about 5 years now. First time I came out was 2019. Um, we were getting ready to do a new event we were, we were doing at the time called Transform Me Live. Um, we ended up having to reschedule to 2021. But in, in process of doing that, I was doing a speaking event, and out of me came this phrase that is— it rings true. There's actually technically, I wrote down 3, but the greatest purpose in life you'll ever have is serving the person you used to be. That used to be my number one. And then as I looked at other purposes, like, uh, Mothers Against Drunk Driving, MAD, Mm-hmm. Or, um, environments that deal with cancer.

Mm-hmm.

Or, uh, Susan Batts, who was on the wall downstairs that you missed. So she's the one that talked me outta taking my own life when I was, I don't know, 21 or 22.

Oh my gosh.

Right. Um, ironically, her grandson is gonna deliver a, a, a watercraft here. Oh, 'cause he work— he works part-time for Lake Norman.

Um, oh wow.

Team Powersports.

Oh, awesome.

So, uh, so it's been kind of a full circle, but anyway, it's a little sweet moment, but But another purpose is serving the person you once lost or loved, right? Or serving in a capacity that allows you to give to someone who can't give for themselves.

Yeah.

I find that those 3, and the number one is probably the one that resonates with me the most, serving the person I used to be, because I realized there's like 18 versions of me.

Yeah, for sure.

Right?

Yeah.

3-year-old, 9-year-old, 12-year-old, 18-year-old, so on and so forth. And all of them were different versions of myself. Um, and, uh, when you, when you share stories like that that, um, are so instrumental and pivotal, um, that make you like really lean into, okay, I'm here for something.

Yeah.

Right? I think we sleepwalk through life a lot of times and we just kind of fall into the thing we fall into. And especially if we're good at it, it's hard to give it up.

It's autopilot.

Yeah, it's hard to give it up. Uh, ironically, Katie, Um, my longtime girlfriend now, we've been dating for about a year and a half now. Um, she, she's a, she's her own business owner. She owns her own brokerage, um, property management company, home builder in her area. And, and it's wonderful. And she's at times said, um, the, the real estate portion is very easy for her now. Like she has the ability to throttle up and throttle it down.

Yeah.

You know, but she's like, there's a part of her that just still wants to do a bit of design work.

Yeah.

Like, she's, um, she got an iPad about this time last year, and, um, she, she, she loves Pixar. She's like, she wants to do stuff like that.

Yeah.

Yeah. So it's interesting. It's interesting on the purpose statement because I feel like we've— I feel like we don't discover what our purpose was until we've lived it.

Yeah.

Like, it's like we live it, right? So close to us, we can't see it.

Yes.

You know?

Yeah.

Because we can't see it, you know, we get lost in the loop of like, what is my purpose? Why am I here?

Yeah.

What if you're only here to be here to experience?

Right. That's so crazy. Yeah. Well, it's just one of those moments where I truly, I mean, it's such a cliché, right? But life can change in an instant. It was seconds, like seconds. And it happened so fast. And people say that, oh, it happened so fast. And it does. And it literally can change your life. So thankful that, like I said, we weren't hurt at all, and that somebody called the cops. And because we would have— had we not gotten out of the car, it would have exploded with us in it.

Yeah.

And so, I mean, there is just nothing left. My phone was on my lap when I jumped out, and the phone ended up on the seat. And all that was left on the— I mean, the car was completely burned out.

I'll just call it guardian angels.

It was just— you could see the circuit board from my phone right on the seat.

Wow.

And, um, yeah, it was, it was, it was like traumatic. But I wanted to— I specifically, because I've done so much self-help and like, and, and, you know, work on myself through the years, that I was like, what am I supposed to learn from this? Like, I wasn't— I'm not one of those like, poor me, why did this happen?

Yeah.

It was like, what am I supposed to learn from this? And how do I take this to apply it to help other people and then also move my, my life forward too? So yeah, yeah, it was one of those crazy Traumatic things.

I'm just curious, do you have a number one lesson that you've learned that you've picked up on from that moment?

I think that time is precious and do it now. I mean, I'm so thankful. We live in a beautiful place. I mean, I say to people, we live on vacation. I don't think I would've moved. I think I would've been— I was on that hamster wheel of just going through the motions every day. And it's been a lot harder to come and recreate ourselves in a new location, but it's been the most rewarding.

Yeah.

So it's, I think that that was sort of what it redirected us to.

Well, we're so glad that you and your fiancé are here and thriving and all the things. You're doing such good work.

Thank you so much.

People absolutely love working with you. You've got a fantastic reputation in the marketplace for all the things that you do, which I think just goes to show the excellence that you put towards Like really trying to serve people at scale.

Thank you.

Thank you. Yeah, absolutely.

It's so great. I'm so glad that we met, and I appreciate you having me on the show.

Absolutely. Well, one thing we haven't told people is where they can get the book. You said it's coming out soon.

Yes.

When and where and all the things.

Okay, so it is coming out. I'm a little bit behind on it, and that's my own fault. And I will say, I lost a little bit of inspiration for like the ending of the book, and I had to pick that up.

Had to get away from some flow.

Had to pick that up again. But you can find it at burnouts So that's burnouttobrilliancebook.com. You can get on the waiting list, and I hope to someday be on the Today Show with that. Um, but also, if you wanna work with me, uh, at the Authority Architect, you can find me at danaflanagan.com. And, uh, if you have a business inquiry, there is a popup page that pops up when you go on the website. You can fill it out, it'll come straight to me. I'll review it and see if we're fit to work together.

Love it. Love it. Well, Dana, thank you so much for coming on the show. I really appreciate it big time.

Thank you. It was a pleasure being here.

Awesome. Okay guys, that's gonna do this episode of One Part Lion, One Part Lamb. I hope you really enjoyed that episode. Would you do me a favor, pretty please? Uh, if you got any value from the show whatsoever, would you please like and share it and give me a comment if you're listening audio-wise, uh, on the different platforms? This stuff really helps. I know it seems silly. Uh, I'm like every other person who's out here trying to do good work on it in a marketplace and, and provide great content. Um, I don't like asking for it either. But we are so grateful when you do do it. It lets us know that you're part of the— our kind of a community, I guess you call it. So please subscribe, please like, please share, please comment. And specifically, if someone comes up during this episode, like literally you're listening to the episode at any point in time and someone's magical, beautiful face pops up in your head, to me that's an indicator that this episode could be just right for just them. Would you do me a favor? Please share it with them. Until then, we will see you in the next one. God bless. Peace out.