The SECRET To Building WEALTH & Finding TRUE HAPPINESS! | Ray Higdon

You know, I posted something about the past and you know, she was like, just get over it. And I'm like, you know what? I used to think exactly that way. And because I thought I was, I mean I was successful, like what the heck? But I was blind to where I could truly grow. Like I was just looking at how do I grow my business, how do I get the bottom line higher and not looking at, well, how can I actually have closer friends? How can I actually have better relationships?

Welcome to Stuck to Unstoppable where we interview the world's foremost thought leaders to break things down in order to help you get past your hurts, habits and hangups and finally level up and move forward. I'm your host, Stephen Scoggins. Now let's go ahead and get into today's guest and our featured conversation. You're not going to want to miss it. You know, I think we're really going to appreciate today's humble confidence carried by today's featured conversation. Ray Higdon is a world renowned speaker, two time best selling author and a co founder of the Higdon Group, one of Inc. S 5,000 fastest growing businesses. Simply on a mission to help entrepreneurs achieve lasting financial freedom and the ultimate fulfillment, the Higdon Group teaches entrepreneurs how to get more leads, recruit more reps and become top earners, especially in the areas of network marketing. Ray and his wife are also the creators of the hit reality show Play to win where over 40 plus motivated contestants tackle sales business challenges simply to win a an opportunity to change their lives. Guys, please help me welcome Ray Higdon. Ray, what's going on man? How you doing dude?

Hey, I'm good. Thanks for having me on here. I got a loving the studio, man. I'm a little jealous right now.

Don't need to be jealous, man. You guys have done some really, really amazing things. In fact, you know, I was, one of the things I was very intrigued about is I have this heart, if you will, to help people kind of go to the next level. And one of the things that I know that we both share is this sense of facing adversities head on, if you will, to get to the next level. You know, if anybody does a quick Google search of your name, what you and your wife have been building and doing for a while now, they'll see that obviously you've become very successful in a variety of different capacities, you know, but what they may not know is actually where that started from. And you know, because sometimes, you know, people make this assumption that well, well they did it, but I can't do it. Tell everybody a little bit about where you come from and kind of the background about how you kind of, you know, shifted your entire life and how you kind of went from what we refer to as stuck to unstoppable.

Yeah, yeah. Happy, happy to share and hope it helps, you know, someone listening.

So, you know, like many, I didn't grow up with the ideal childhood. You know, my parents had split when I was very young, and my dad, he remarried someone that was very abusive. So that was, you know, being woken up. But being thrown against the closet and stomped was a daily occurrence for me. I remember, you know, going to kindergarten with bloody noses. I remember.

Having to wear, you know, turtlenecks in the summer because I had claw marks all on my neck and everything. And so I didn't have that leg up. I didn't have, you know, the amazing, you know, model parents or anything like that.

And, you know, I think that's one of the things, and we were talking about this earlier, I think it's one of the things that makes me fight for the underdog so much. Like, I love the underdog. I love, you know, doing things to help those who feel like they've, you know, they're powerless or they're, you know, voiceless, or they, you know, can't overcome their obstacles. And so it's definitely one of my driving forces is helping those who need some inspiration and have been through some stuff. And so fast forward a few years. I had worked my way up in the corporate world to a pretty decent salary. I think most would consider it decent, but pretty good salary. And I realized that I just wasn't very happy. The harder I worked, the more they would pay me, which is nice, but the more they would demand of me. And I had two young boys at home that I was barely seeing, you know, making good money, but barely seeing the kids. And I just didn't like it. I had some friends who were crushing it in real estate. So this is back in 2004, 2005, here in the state of Florida and killing it in real estate. And I'm like, man, I went to high school with these knuckleheads. If they can do it, I think I can too. And so I left the corporate world. No one agreed with that decision. Everyone thought I was crazy. What are you going to do about benefits? And everyone thought I. I was nuts. But I went into real estate full time. Did really good. Had my first chance of becoming arrogant, which was great.

I'm like, man, those are always fun. What's that?

Those are always fun, aren't they? I've been there myself.

And so I'm like, I'm a genius. I'm amazing. And then the market tanked and I got completely wiped out. And here's what that looks like. I mean, I wiped out my 401k, my IRA, my savings bonds that my dad had given me, sold furniture, my own furniture, still ended up in foreclosure, chased by bill collectors, over a million dollars in debt, depressed, then went through a divorce. And I was at the lowest of the low. And I really didn't know what I was going to do. And the thing is, at that time, everyone I knew had been in real estate. And no one's hiring. My credit shot. I can't get a loan for anything. I'm in foreclosure. I don't know what I'm going to do. And I had a buddy reach out to me and tell me about something that I had sworn I would never do again, which was network marketing. And I had, you know, I'd had some bad experiences with it in the past, but I looked at it and I'm like, you know, I don't really have many options. At least I didn't feel I did. And so I decided that I was going to make it work. And long story short, became the number one income earner in that company. And about four years ago, my wife got married. In 2011, my wife and I decided to focus on coaching and training instead. So we no longer build a network marketing business, but we now coach and train a lot of network marketers and a lot of other professions as well. And we love what we do. And so Built Inc 5000 company have made some moolah online and we love helping others overcome their stuff.

Yeah, no, I think it's one of the things I love most about y' all story. The other thing that I think is interesting is people look at setbacks as a reason to give up or reason to quit. You and I would share that, actually. Setbacks, failures, if you were actually foundations to build a better life, because it forces you to get innovative. It forces you to become creative. It forces you to push yourself past your limits, you know, but one of the other things that I think that you mentioned in a previous a little bit earlier was the fact that, you know, there's this element of just reconnecting, you know, so there's, you know, there's the traditional business model of a brick and mortar store. So I own six companies, you Know, and of those six companies, almost all of them are brick and mortar in some way, shape or form. In other words, they have, you know, typical team members, typical customer base, very B2B related, you know, but there's, there's freedoms that come with, in the coaching and strategic partnerships. And one of the things that I loved about some of the things that, that I've seen you do is this, this concept of dating your spouse again. So how did you, I mean, how did, how did you pivot that? Because, you know, when we think, when we look at it, relationships are by far one of the strongest things that we need, especially to get through the difficult seasons, but also catapult us past that. You know, when you begin to kind of look at your, your new wife and you kind of say, okay, we're going to build it, we're going to build this, this lifestyle together. I mean, how did you, how did you guys do it together? Because you guys are very tight, tight knit now at the hip.

Yeah. And, you know, and I don't know that there's a blueprint for all couples to work happily together every day in the same house all the time. But, you know, I'll be honest, I just feel so blessed and grateful that I found someone of her caliber and personality. You know, she overlooks all of my quirks and I admire and I'm grateful for all of her wonder because she's incredible. So that's definitely a part of the equation. Let me tell you, before Jess, my wife, I was engaged to someone that I could not work with for more than 20 minutes. And so I'm not the magic elixir here. It's really the combination. And so when we were working together.

We first kind of butted heads and clashed because I thought, I'm supposed to do these 10 things, she's supposed to do these 10 things. And the fact is, we each have different strengths. So for example, I'm a consistency freak of nature. I've done at least one video day every day without missing for 11 years. I'm a lunatic. And so to me, that's just, I run on the path and I don't understand people that don't. It's like, what do you mean? It's not that big a deal. I just do one. And so, like, I'm just a freak like that. She views that kind of thing as homework and it just makes her like, she hates her existence. But you can hand her a project and she will rock that mother like nobody's business. Right? So like me I look at a project as. That's impeding on my daily routine. She looks at it as, ooh, a project that has a beginning and an end. Fantastic. And so we learn that about each other, and so we learn that there were certain things that I really liked to do she didn't like to do. The daily marketing, the daily lead generation and things like that. Like, I like doing that stuff. That doesn't bother me at all. The connecting with leads, the relationship building. She likes to do projects. She likes to do. And so we kind of figured that out, that we didn't have to have the same themes that we could choose. Each of us could have very important roles in the. In the company doing different things. And so, you know, that's. That's one. And I think, you know, for me, I'll give you.

I'll give you how hardcore I am at wanting to be better for her. Okay, so we. And this. This has to do with, you know, inner growth and just asking yourself, you know, the right questions. So we were at a charity event. We're on a couple different charity boards, and we were at this charity event, and they were having this big auction. They raised millions of dollars in this one day, and it's awesome for kids. And so one of our neighbors comes up to us and says, hey, did you see the Belize trip? And I'm like, no, it's a Belize trip. And she goes, oh, my God, it looks amazing. It's five couples only. You're on a private island, private jet, private yacht, private chef, you know, only five couples. It looks amazing. And so my wife is like. Like, she just, like, hits all the buttons, like, checks all the boxes. Like, that is. That sounds like the perfect thing that she's ever crossed her ears. Me, I'm terrified.

It.

To me, it sounds like the most stressful thing I've ever heard, because to me, it sounds like. You mean I'm gonna be trapped with five other couples and I'll have to talk with them the whole time? I, like, that kicked in my introvertness. That kicked in my, like. But I like to escape, man. Like, I'm cool hanging with y' all at a party, but five days and I'm around you all the time, like, that just stressed me the hell out. On the way home, I was like, man, here. My wife, who's just amazing, who, by the way, was paying my bills when I was in foreclosure, right? And so, like, here's my wife, who's so amazing, who is so excited about that thing. And here's me shooting it down, being fuddy duddy, being.

Peeing on her parade. Right? Like, that's terrible. What the hell's wrong with me that I didn't also get excited to do that with her? And so I have a couple different mindset coaches I've used over the years, and I really dove into that. Why did that freak me out? Why did that stress me out? And it actually comes from something that I didn't even remember, you know, as I did go under hypnosis. And it absolutely comes from. There was an event in my life in the third grade that I was in that house of abuse, and my third grade teacher recognized that something was wrong. Something's not right here. Had me start meeting with the guidance counselor, which, you know, I didn't know. Like, well, you know, okay, fine, you're going to meet with her every week. So, you know, we meet every week and I start opening up because it's kind of nice. I've never had anyone to share, you know, my stuff with. And so I start sharing my stories and sharing, you know, yeah, here's what happened this weekend. Yeah, you know, this, you know, now, you know, share a terrible story. And it felt kind of nice. Well, one day I walk into, you know, our weekly meeting, and my parents are there. So my dad's there, my stepmom's there, guidance counselor, me. And the guidance counselor proceeds to tell every story I've ever shared with her. And because she did, she thought they were so outrageous that I was making them up. And so that was a bad day. I got home and that was just not a great day.

Yeah.

Since then, I've had major trust issues, so I've really not. I have kept people at a social distance.

Because I did. I didn't trust them, like, hey, you know what? Here's how I don't get hurt. I just keep you away from me. And so the idea of being secluded on an island, on a jet, on a desk, you know, like that, that. That triggered all my alarms. And since really digging deep into that and figuring that out, we bought the Belize trip, so we haven't taken it yet, you know, which I'm able to. But not knowing, like, how come this freaks me out is a question that I think more people should not just adopt as well as just my personality, like, dig into that. Why are you that way? If it's not empowering to you, how can you improve that? And it's by digging in.

Yeah, man, I love that. Oh, my gosh. That was so good. A couple different things I heard out of that. First of all, lean into your strengths. The fact that you and your wife were able to lean into your strengths and amplify those, you backfire each other's, you know, struggles, blind spots, if you will. The one thing I didn't expect you to touch on, that you did has now got me my brain firing like crazy. Is this concept, and I believe this as well, of going backwards in order to compare forwards.

Yeah.

You know, is that is. So you guys pretty much coach everything from, from what I guess is referred to as the underdog to ultra performers. Do you have to coach them in a different way as a result of that or do you, do you take them, you know, kind of like a, kind of like the, through the process, you just walked us through of going backwards a little bit to go forwards. I mean, what do you, what do you see most often?

Yeah, you know, it depends. I mean some, sometime, you know, I definitely don't call myself a life coach, but sometimes that's needed. And I would say most of the times the person I'm working with is someone with a multiple six or seven figure business and they're either frustrated, not fulfilled, stuck.

That's who I'm typically working with on a one on one basis. And we have, you know, groups and we have courses and books and everything for those, you know, trying to get to a level of success. But I'll give you a great example. So one of our, one of my clients, you know, she's multimillion dollar a year earner and you know, does really well in her network marketing business. And her business is 99.9% women. And a lot of the women in her company have been through trauma, have been through abuse, some have been through very unfortunate sex trafficking and sexual abuse and all kinds of crazy things. And she always felt bad. She always felt bad because she grew up with money.

Yeah.

And so she, you know, she kind of shied away from letting people in because she didn't want them to find out that she was a dirty money person.

Yeah, yeah.

But the fact is, you know, feelings are feelings. How you, how you feel. The reality is that often she felt like she wasn't, she could not make her parents proud. She couldn't make specifically her dad proud. She always, like, even, even with building a multi million dollar business, dad, you know, didn't really take it that seriously. Well, that's, that's a serious feeling whether you came from money or not.

Yeah.

And so there are ways to, you know, to share your story. You know, you don't have to say I came from money. You can. You could simply say, hey, you know, I have a, you know, a dad I've always been trying to impress and just never works. I just never feel like he's proud of me. That's a feeling that, you know, raise your hand if you can, you know, relate to me and so many other people. And so sometimes it is about coaching them through some of what happened in the past.

Sometimes you'll find. Well, sometimes. Almost all the time, you'll find patterns.

Yeah.

So the pattern of someone creating success, something happens, they go do something else. Right. They get go to the next one. And that was me. And so my programming is. And it still is, even though I'm aware of it, is I'll show you. So I seek doubt. I love people that doubt me because then I'm like, yay. All right. But once I start proving myself and once I start seeing fewer and fewer doubters, I would get bored and I would move on to another thing. And so, you know, I'll show you can be disastrous because you might have been able to take something that was really, really good and made it amazing, but not if you keep on being on autopilot and keep triggering. And so sometimes it's finding, what is the pattern? Why does that keep happening? How come each relationship sucks that you have? You're the constant here. And so whether it's a business relationship, whether it's a personal relationship. And so sometimes it is digging into the past, and sometimes it's just providing more business strategy. Because I see a lot of people that are making a lot of money, but either A, are very frustrated and feeling burnt out, or B, they don't understand that their money is also a business and they're not, you know, they're not properly investing or properly being a steward for their money so that it can last a lot longer and grow. Yeah, that was a long answer.

Dude, I love it. I'm eating this up. You know, it's. I think it's always important, especially with entrepreneurs, you know, people that have been through some traumatic things.

I find that the key to breakthrough oftentimes is dedicated to self awareness more than anything else. I find that even ultra performers, underdogs, like, you know, the people that have been, you know, kind of in the. In the dark places I know we've both been in. And also people that have, you know, experienced some success, like some of the things that we've done, there's always this element of Self awareness to actually get to the place. You know, I find that people that are really, I actually find that the key to self awareness is self identity, is really kind of discovering who you are. And I think part of that is digging in. You know, when you begin to look at the different things that have taught you these things, it seems like it is the process of self awareness, of becoming truly self aware. The fact that you can identify, hey look, this was a traumatic moment. Hey look, I realize that I'm the common denominator here. You know, these things I think are life truths, if you will, that you know, set up whether or not you're able to break through or not break through. Is there one specific limiting belief, if you will, or one specific type of hindrance that you see coming up over and over again? The more and more you, you know, you work with thousands of people and even your one on one coaching clients, do you see a reoccurring theme with one or a couple of limiting beliefs?

I mean they, a lot of, a lot of times it comes down to.

How were we made to feel bad.

And.

Us showing up in a way to protect ourselves from that. So the way that I protected myself was, hey, you know, with that guidance counselor I openly shared and I was free as the wind. And so I'm just not gonna, you know, I'm not gonna get close with people. And not that I was verbally saying that I was on autopilot. And that's, that's the big thing. And I actually have a very, very successful client, one of the biggest earners and in all of network marketing pulling down, you know, she makes over a million dollars a month take home. And she, you know, I posted something about the past and you know, she was like, just get over it. And I'm like, you know what? I used to think exactly that way. And the, because I thought I was, I mean I was successful, like, what the heck? But I was blind to where I could truly grow. Like I was just looking at how do I grow my business? How do I get the bottom line higher and not looking at, well, how can I, how can I actually have closer friends? How can I actually have better relationships? How can I, you know, how can I show up as the best father, right? And so these, these are tougher questions than how do I move the bottom line? That's a pretty straightforward question. And so it's usually we created a protection mechanism and by the way, that's a protection mechanism. Get over it, right? If you don't give meaning to Anything. Power past it. Right. That's a protection mechanism. Right. And so.

It'S the balance of. Let me find out why I operate this way without just being stuck there and never do anything. But let me find out and use that. You know.

There was. I'll give you an example that I think has helped a few people. Is.

There?

Man.

When was this? I remember Jess and I. Jess used to do this thing where my wife, she used to do this thing where if, you know, she would manage my bank account. So we may have just bought a home, we may have just bought a car. We may have just done this. We may have just whatever. May have just been traveling or whatever. And she would look at the bank account, and if it was less, she would say, bank accounts down. And so, like, one. That's not a good way to manage things, first of all.

Okay.

And we've learned that. We've both learned that. But she would make this statement, banks a little low. That would get translated in my goofy, you know, male brain as, I'm not doing enough. She's worried about finances. I'm not keeping up my end of the bargain. I'm not a man.

Yeah.

That's how I would translate it. And so I would work like crazy. You know, I would do. Not two webinars a day, five webinars a day. I would just work like nuts. And then she'd casually stroll in the office and say, what's wrong? Why are you working so hard? And what do you want from me? Right. Because I was translating it totally out of context, not how she. She didn't mean bank accounts down. You need to work harder. That's not. She was just making an observation.

Yeah.

And so for literally years, this went on. She.

Stressed we'd have all this conflict, and then one day I'm like, babe, when you say that to me, this is how I feel. And she's like, oh, my God, I had no idea. That's not what I was intending. And so having open communications and we did something to solve it, we're like, okay, what do we need to invest to make you feel good? Right. What percentage needs to go where to make you feel good about that you're going to be safe. Because her trigger was she saw her mom go from making a lot of money to being broke. So both of our triggers are being firing. I'm firing off me being a man and providing for her. And, you know, me also, you know, lots of things. And her afraid of losing.

Yeah.

So those are two things that were being fired Neither of us knew. Neither of us actually communicated, but when we did, we stopped fighting about it. We no longer have that problem.

Yeah. And I think that that same situation, I find that a lot of people deal with that in that, you know, their triggers might be different. They vary, especially in marriage, especially in tight relationships. Whether it's a business partnership, it's a marriage, it's a, you know, father, son, mother, daughter, whatever that is, it forces you to fight out of fear.

Yeah.

And some of the worst decisions you can possibly make are, you know, based out of fear. You know, have you been able to come up with a couple different principles or practices that, you know, outside of, obviously, the communication you just mentioned, are there some other things that you use personally to kind of stay out of fear or try to at least be aware of that you're feeling it so you can address it. Is there anything like that you've got?

Yeah, I don't know. I don't know if it's fear, but comfort, like, comfort is if you're wanting to grow like we are, we want to impact more people. We want to make a difference, we want to grow the business, we want to make more money, we want to donate more, we want to do all these things right. And so I've become very attuned to. If I'm comfortable, something's wrong.

Okay.

And. And so. And I'll give you an example, because that sounds like a terrible thing to, you know, to conclude.

We had. This was maybe two years ago now. Maybe two years ago.

We had, you know, built our events up over the years. And, you know, we'd gotten to, you know, 300, 400, 500, 600. You know, we've gotten up to maybe 8, 900 people that were coming to our events. And I had this thought of, you know what? We need to be different. We need to have more intimate events. And so we decided to do that. And so I went to the audience and said, hey, next event, we're only going to have, I think, 250 people. And whenever the ticket sells, so in 36 hours, boom, all sold out.

And I remember going to the event and.

There was no stress, there was no trepidation, there was no anxiety because I had spoken to 250 people before that really wasn't. That's not that huge of a crowd. And I realized I'm like, oh, my God. I did an upper limit belief. I hit an upper limit problem. So I was going in the right direction, said, let's go smaller. And I showing up to that Then I realized I'm like, I've made a huge mistake. And so one of the things I did about that was I hired Grant Cardone, okay, 100 grand for six hours. And in that first hour, first hour, I told him, I'm like, yeah, you know, we got this event coming up and you know, it's gonna be a smaller event, but we want to go big the next year. And he's like, well, why not go big this next event? And we're like, oh, well, you know, we got it in the hotel and it's under contract. He goes, cancel it.

It's like under contract and stuff. Grant, like, maybe you didn't hear me. He's like, I heard you. Cancel it. Go big this year. And I'm like, oh, like, that's discomfort, right? Like, I'm nervous now. And so we do that and we pay the penalty and. And we then go on to sell in less than 90 days. This was last year. We sold 2,400 tickets. So literally three, four times more than we've ever had in 90 days. And it was really stressful, high anxiety. But it was an amazing event. It was absolutely incredible. And then we have an event coming up that I think right now we're at like 3,400 tickets. And it's a virtual conference because everything's going on. But, you know, you have to get around people that make you uncomfortable. And you also have to have a self awareness like you talked about. I had that self awareness of. I'm not nervous at all. This sucks. Like, what the heck, man? I kind of want to just breeze through life. That's not growth. Growth is uncomfortable. Growth is. Ow, my calves hurt. Growth is. Dang, that's going to sting in the morning. It's not. Boy, this is super easy to do. And so, like having that awareness of, you know, are you growing at the right speed for your goals? And if you're not, if they're big goals and you're not uncomfortable, then something's wrong.

I love it. I love it. Yeah, there's a big. I have a big belief in, you know, there's. There's a talent to being comfortable in the uncomfortable. You know, nothing's growing unless you're uncomfortable. Nothing. There's no muscle tissue, muscle fiber. I was ironically, one of my little. He's taller than I am, but one of my young guys that is working at the journey principals. He great kid, loved to death. He's the kind of guy that if I get into a car ride with him on the Way to event or something like that. And you're in the car Freight. He'll pepper me with the questions the entire way there. Eight and a half hours. Love his brilliance. Love everything about him. He actually decided to work out with me at the gym this morning. And he got there, we do our little cardio or whatever, pop off the cardio, hop over to the leg machine. He's like, what? Today's leg day? Oh, man, I wish you told me it was leg day. If it was leg day, I wouldn't. I said. I said, dude, I hate working legs as much as anybody. I said, but here's the thing. You got to work legs, right? So he gets on the leg machine and he pushes through, and he's kind of like doing half reps and whatever. And I'm like, dude, full rep all the way through. He said, okay. So he does like six, and I'm like, so you just threw that six back up like it was nothing? Yeah, yeah, yeah. You know, I said, you do realize nothing happens physically in working out until the pain reps start. It's really the two or three reps after the pain starts that things begin to change. So what did he do the next set? He pushed himself.

Nice.

You know, and I think there's a lot of. It's funny.

I like to look at life and business as cohesive. I know a lot of us, you know, especially ultra performers, like to separate the two and think they can silo, but one always influences the. The other. I find that, you know, that's. That is at the meat and potatoes, if you will, of, you know, getting to a life that you can actually appreciate. What do you think the number one thing that you faced or one thing that I think maybe your greatest takeaway of creating the life you love? What do you. What do you think is one major hurdle that we all have to overcome?

I mean, something I definitely needed to tackle. I mean, I can give you one more internal and one more tangible, I guess is one was acceptance. You know, I wanted people to accept me. I wanted people to like me. I wanted people to approve of me. And.

Almost every good decision I've ever made, hardly anybody approved of. So no one thought it was a good idea for me to leave the corporate world. They're like, dude, you're throwing away seven years of your life because I built up, and you throw away your benefits. You got two kids at home. Like, what are you doing, man? And, I mean, I remember telling you know, someone I really looked up to, one of my college professors And I told him, I'm like, yeah, you know, I'm going out on my own. He's like, well, okay, but you'll be back. Yeah, you'll be back. Like, dang. Like, that's it kind of fired me up because I seek downwards, right? So, like, my personality, like, kind of gobbles. Gobbles that stuff up. But. But I had to get there because there was definitely a period where I couldn't handle that. Like.

And then I would say the second thing that really, I think was a major turning, like a fork in the road for me was I was working for a county government and I was a lowly project manager. And my boss, who I really respected and looked up to, she said, hey, I'd like you to come in and give an update on the project you're working on. And I'm like, you know, what? What do you mean? She goes, you know, you know, just in front of the department, just, you know, kind of go through and maybe create a presentation. And I'm just like, like, speak in front of these people. Like, oh, my God. And I was just so terrified because, you know, I didn't know this at the time, but at the time I felt like I was a really hard worker, but I was stupid like that. That's what I identified with. Everyone I worked with, I thought was really, really smart. And I thought I was kind of faking it because I was not as experienced as all of them. I was newer to that industry. And so, you know, for three days, I barely sleep. I read like, the Idiot's Guide to Speaking and Dummy Presentations, whatever. And I just. One thing that was consistent was in all these books that I read two or three books in that time span, it was like. And just know that when you screw up, nobody knows. So I really clung to that one. And I remember that morning, my hands on the phone. Back when you had a landline, right? And my hand was on the phone and I'm like, you know, I'm just going to call in. This will pass. They'll forget about it. I'll just work hard. And just. Something was like, you gotta go in, man. And so I go in, I somehow develop a stutter. I spill water all over myself. But I finish, I do it right. I'm like, yay. And afterwards, my boss, Maggie, she's like, hey, Ray, can you come? And so I go. I go in there and, you know, I don't know, she gonna say I did okay. She gonna say, oh, my God, that was amazing. And she said, Ray, are you on drugs? And I'm like.

Right? I mean, I just. Apparently I was a complete mess. I was a total nightmare. And so afterwards, I'm just crushed because now it's been confirmed I'm an idiot, right? I'm not as smart as anybody else. And so I remember sitting in the parking lot, you know, I drove a green, like a forest green Hyundai Sonata back then. And so I got my hands on the steering wheel. I'm just like, you know what? I'm just going to leave. I can get a job in construction. Like, I can, like, I'm ready to totally change my identity, grow a mustache, something. And just like, you know what? I got to face this fear. And so the next day I went to a local college there and said, put me in every speaking class you have. And the register was like, well, that's interesting. Usually that's the last class people take. And so I took speech. I took critical think or strategic thinking, and anything that made me get in front of the, in front of the group, that's what I wanted. And so joined Toastmasters. And so, you know, I tackled that fear head on. And it was about two years later that I was speaking on the Vegas strip at Planet Hollywood, had left the corporate world and was doing real estate stuff. And so it was, it was wild, man. But that was a fork. If I would have crumbled, if I would have, you know, chosen something different, I mean, we definitely wouldn't be here today, that's for sure.

Yeah, for sure. I mean, it's. And I think there's, I think there's fantastic lessons. One of the things I just want to thank you of is being so vulnerable and transparent of the things. No, seriously, I mean, of how terrible.

I've been in the past.

Well, I mean, I'm finding more and more that people don't want gurus. They want guide. Right? They want people who have been where they've been. They don't, you know, they. It's very easy, especially in a social media world, you know, in a video world or, you know, media world, if you will, to very easily put on your, your prettiest face, if you will, and show your best stuff and, you know, highly edit stuff and make sure the lighting's right and the audio is perfect and, you know, all this kind of stuff. I think that.

There'S more than wisdom and understanding that comes out of this. There's, there's transparency and a sense of, I, yes, I can do this, you know, and that's one of the Things I appreciate about what you guys have been building all this time. And, you know, I look at that as the deep driving heart behind everything that you guys have been building. I mean, the live event. Well, the live event is now virtual because of COVID of course. I'm sure. You know, Rank. Rank Makers Live. Right. Was. In many ways it's kind of developed out of that. You know, it's kind of developed out of this. Hey, look, I sincerely want to help you win.

Yeah.

You know, for those of you, for those who are listening, who haven't actually don't know what Rank Makers Live is, give us a little bit of insight about what that event is and kind of what it entails for most people in case they're in that, in that, in that modality of needing some help.

Yeah, I mean, I think at, you know, time of air, it'll probably be passed. But rankmakers Live is our three day virtual experience where, you know, we going up to a studio. We're actually working with the same team and software and company that worked with Russell Brunson and Tony Robbins for his big virtual experience. And, you know, so we're excited about that. And it's just, you know, we have a lot of amazing speakers that help people profit on social media, but also create the internal breakthrough that they're looking for. And the term Rank Makers is for our private community. So we have a little bit over 14,000 people in our private community and that's a $20 a month membership where I go live every single day. I give an action step in a training and help them create breakthroughs in their business.

Wow. Wow. Yeah.

I like the fact that you guys, the approach is to come alongside of people. I like the fact that you mentioned this way early in the show that, you know, you make a video every single day and you've been doing that consistently for 11 years. You know, I find that one of the greatest tricks to breaking through and to have a personal level transformation is that consistency. You know, are those some of the things that you guys really hit on really hardcore at your, at your live events, whether the live or virtual, you guys hit on the, you know, process for consistency?

Oh, yeah, yeah. I mean, we talk about, you know, here, here's the question. It's the question is, does your daily method operation make success inevitable? You look at what you do each day, if you share that and you're real about it, not what you plan to do, what you actually do each day, and you share that in front of a group, would everyone in the audience say, well, that'll work. Or would they be like, might might work? And so you have to ask yourself those tough questions because life is. Life asks you those questions. If you're not consistent, life is asking you some tough questions. It's not giving you what you want. And so you got it. You got to be tougher on yourself than life when it comes to, am I doing what I should be doing? Am I taking the right actions if what I do? So when I got serious about, for example, that network marketing company, there were three things I did every day. I got 20 no's a day before my head hit the pillow. 20 people told me no, period. I didn't matter. Raining outside, upset stomach, didn't matter, right? 20 people are telling me no today, right? And So I got 20 no's a day. I did a video a day. I did self development every day. I've never shared that story. And someone say, huh, that really worked. Like, no work. That worked for about anything. If you're in insurance, if you're in real estate, go get 20 no's a day where you're actually asking people, hey, will you take a look at my product service opportunity? Hey, are you open to hearing more about my life insurance or whatever? You do that every day and you do marketing videos every day and you do self development every day. You're going to create success, period. And so, like, just, you know, let's get to it and let's really cut to the chase. You don't. I didn't have a beautiful logo. I remember. I remember I went to an event in 2000, I think 11, and at the time, you know, I'm. I don't know, I mean, I bounced back from foreclosure because I was in foreclosure in 2009, so I'm probably doing maybe 60, $70,000 a month at that point. And I remember a guy went on stage and said, hey, you guys should be blogging. And it doesn't have to be perfect. Just look at Ray Higdon's. It's the worst site I've ever seen.

Are you saying worst site?

Like no one told me.

Did you realize I'm here in the audience, Ryder, Right here.

It was an ugly site. And I asked, I'm like, hey, is my site ugly? They're like, it's pretty ugly, Ray. And I'm like, oh, man. Like, I was a little bummed out, but it made me a lot of money. And so that's. What's funny is you don't have to have everything perfect. And I think that's something a lot of people suffer from. They take two years to develop their brand mark or their logo or their slogan, and in the meantime, no one's being impacted, no one's being helped. And so, like, move forward imperfectly, Have a daily method of operation that makes success inevitable, and you'll get there wherever you want to go.

Awesome. Yeah, I mean, it's, it's. It's. Consistently part of the process is just creating momentum. You know, I'm a. I'm very much a doer. Like, I. I want to create something, I just do it. And my. I don't know, fear. Call it experience, call it whatever, call it stupidity. I'm not sure which one it is, but, you know, I just believe that it's possible. I believe anything that I put my mind to, with enough work, enough consistency will bear fruit. You know, it may not be the perfect on the first iteration, but by the time I get to the 10th or 15th iteration, it's. It's looking pretty good. It's. It's becoming really consistent. You know, taking that muscle memory, you know, what I want to do, if it's right with you, is I actually want to pivot to your new hit TV show, reality show, Play to Win. Tell everybody what Play to Win is. I caught a couple of clips, and now, now I'm hooked. So now I have to watch all the episodes, like, tell us all about Play to Win and then how that's actually transforming people and then what you're seeing as part of the, you know, obviously leading that effort.

Yeah. So, you know, we like being different and, you know, so, for example, in our, you know, space of, you know, training a lot of network marketers, working with a lot of solopreneurs and things like that, for years, we did what everyone else did, which was do an event, launch a book, sell a course. Right. And then offer some coaching over here somewhere. And so in 2017, we wanted to be different. So that's when we launched our membership. And, you know, I'm very, very proud of those guys. In the last two years, they brought in over 200,000 new customers, 49,000 new reps, and achieved 9175 rank advances in their companies. And so, like, we track, you know, production and everything. It's awesome. And so we got presented with this idea of, hey, what about a reality show? And we're like, well, that's definitely different. And so for, you know, season one, we had, and we have two seasons Actually, season two will be fully rolled out by the time, you know, this airs. But.

It'S, it's where people, people came from. We had thousands of people apply, narrowed it down to, I think about each season is like 40, 45 people that, you know, paid their own expenses to fly in and battle for either a job with us or coaching with us.

Okay.

And so we didn't know what would really happen. We put them through the wringer. We had some of them selling, you know, purses on the street. We had some of them doing fundraisers. We had some of them, you know, doing physical things. And what really came was.

One, an amazing amount of people had been through incredible amounts of trauma. One of the finalists from season one, you know, he was doing magic tricks on the street at 8 years old because his mom was on crack. And he was doing that for food for both of them.

One lady who's amazing, Renee, she was, I don't know her exact age, but she is early 50s.

And she had been sex trafficked. She had never shared her story to anybody.

Wow.

Comes on that show. And just something about the magic of the show, she shares that story. And so in my point to her, and this was from season one, my point to her was, hey, that's, you know, I'm sorry that you went through that. Obviously you didn't deserve that. But you're a survivor. That story needs to be shared. What can you do to help some people who've gone through similar experiences? And within a month or two, she was speaking at women's shelters. Now this is someone who didn't share it all her whole life. A couple months later, she's sharing it at women's shelters, she's speaking and, and she just last week she was one of the speakers who shared her story at the 17th annual Human Trafficking Awareness International event with 19 countries attending for the University of Toledo. And so like so many amazing breakthroughs, but we basically, it's on air coaching to help them improve, have breakthroughs and help them get to their next level. And so there's definitely some entertainment factors in there.

Yes, it is. Like I said, I watched one episode, now I have to watch all the rest of them. Another binge worthy environment for sure.

But it's especially season two, we transformed it in that it's really, it's honed in on how to get what you want in life. And we take them through a series of steps of what questions to ask to really get what you want in life. So the viewer gets to ask themselves that same Question to help them get closer to what they want in their life.

Dude. It's just really amazing. Not only just the testimonies, but the sheer power of how mentorship, no matter how great or small, can make an impact on somebody's life.

For sure.

I think far too many times we, you know, we get hung up in that. Well, I'm not, I'm not, you know, I'm not called to be a speaker. I'm not called to write a book. And you know, as a person of faith, I'll just mention this really fast. My grandfather, who coached me a lot with my faith, you know, just kind of really poured into me over time. He asked me one question, you know, he's like, you know, from a, from a faith perspective now and again, no one has to believe like I believe necessarily. But my grandfather asked me one time, he goes, he goes, you know, in my era, Billy Graham was the best evangelist in the, in the, you know, in the world. Yeah. He goes, I never want you to, never want you to downplay the importance of one person because, because while everybody knows Billy Graham's name, somebody led Billy Graham to faith.

Yeah.

And that dawned on me. I was like, so that means no matter how small, how small we perceive the story to be. Right. How small we perceive our meaning to be and our significance to be, there's a greater use for it. Right. Catapulting moment for it. Right. And the fact that you guys are able to showcase that on camera is just incredible.

Yeah. Yeah, it's, it's you. I still cry, you know, when I see the episodes because there's, there's, there's always some touching stuff in there, man. But you know, we, we've kept in contact with all the contestants and seeing what they're now doing in the world is just really inspiring.

Now you're already a best selling author and it's okay for me to toot your horn because you put in the work, obviously. You put in not only just the work to develop in the person you are today, but also to change and transform lives. You've been actively doing those reps for years now. My understanding is you got a new bestseller on the way out. Is it any closer to coming out yet? When can we get our hands on the new book?

Yeah, I believe the Official date is November 17th. And so, you know, we, and thanks for asking. You know, we've, my wife and I, we've been best selling authors by being self published. This is our first like major, you know, publisher. It's with Hay House, who's published, you know, lots of amazing. And so, you know, we're really honored. It's called Time, Money, Freedom. And it is all about how to. How to analyze your life. Of what areas do you want to completely alter, transform.

Upgrade and strategies with how to do just that. And so, you know, we talk about, you know, why it's ethical for you to make more money, why.

You should take the time to do what we call pluck the weeds of looking at your life and what are the areas that you just like or what are the areas in your life that you resent and how to actually do something about that. And, and so, like, we're really proud of it. We think it'll do really well. But yeah, it comes out November 17th.

I have no doubt it's gonna do really well. The heart behind it's legitimate. The experience behind the words and the typing is legitimate. And like I said, I think people right now, they want gods more than anything else. You know, there's a lot of, as our good friend Steve would share with us, there's a lot of people who are out there trying to reclaim their hope, reclaim their identity, reclaim the. The next step. And it's coming out at just the right time to hit people right square in the heart, you know, to actually start their own transformation. So I appreciate you actually taking some time to with us today and actually sharing a little bit about everything. I love the fact that you took the time to share real stories because it's. People need that. I mean, they need the real stories. They need to be able to see themselves in the journey of someone else's journey, to know that it is possible. And I applaud you and Jess for taking the time to do that over and over and over and over again. And I have no doubt that you guys will continue to be highly successful in that area and change lots and lots of lives around the country. Well, actually, no. You guys are worldwide at this point, so all over the place. But for those of who. For those listening who want to stay connected with you and learn more about what you're doing, maybe, you know, and check out everything from the live event to the, obviously the reality show to the upcoming book, what's the best way for them to kind of stay connected?

Yeah, I mean, you'll find most of our stuff on any social media platform. Just searching. Ray Higdon H I G D O N We first premiere our reality show releases on our facebook page@facebook.com rayhigdenpage but we also have those on YouTube. We eventually put them on YouTube as well. And so, yeah, thank you for having me on here and hope someone hears this and gets inspired to do something.

I know the more and more we all step out on faith a little bit to help most people, it is going to happen so. Well, I appreciate you actually taking the time again today to spend some time with me. I know there are tons. I am going to have a show note heyday when I get time to actually type up everything that we discussed and all the ground that we covered. There is so much wisdom in what you brought today and I really appreciate you again taking the time to do that with the audience.

Hey, my pleasure. Thank you. Thanks for having me on.

All right, my friend. I'll see you again. Take care.

I absolutely love humble, confident leaders and Ray Higdon, dude, you were a rock star. Now, if you guys really enjoyed that, you're going to love this one right here. So check it out. Do videos go viral just to go viral? Yes. All day, every day. If you're at a party and you throw up on your friend or in the lawn, it's going to go viral. If you're in a fight video, it's going to go viral. If you're saying race.