The SECRET to starting a SUCCESSFUL side hustle

Too many times people value the education or even the school that you go to to think that that's going to make them successful. It's not true. I mean, you and I both know Ivy League people who are as broke as hell.

Covid kind of put a hamper on a lot of live events, Right? Everybody, you know, you went virtual or you pulled back or whatever. What is it about live events? I know what I. My belief is, but what is about live events that you love so much and why, why they're so important?

It's always about the connectivity. It's the in person energy that's in that room. Because Zoom, I mean, guys, we got stuck on Zoom for two years, essentially. Yeah. And I think most people are just kind of burned out. Like the Zoom, like hangover. They're just kind of done with it, you know? And I remember initially when Covid was kicking off and some of the people were canceling their live events, they would do those virtual summits and they would get a pretty good attendance. A lot of people would show up because it was kind of exciting. It was like, oh, man, I don't have to leave my couch. I could sit here in my pajamas and see this cool speaker. Like, awesome. But probably six months into that, you and I both saw like the huge decline. Like, people couldn't even fill a webinar. It was like they had to wave with their mom and their Aunt Sally for joining, you know, but it was kind of seen that way. So I also saw that it was a great, I say, a revealing. In 2020, we saw these people that were canceling their events and not even giving refunds. Get that, guys? That's a little bit sketch.

Wow. Yeah.

And so we seen a couple people do that and. And I was like, you know what? I know my audience and I think, as yourself, we know who our audience is. And I said, would my audience actually show up if I put on a live event? I think, are they so fearful of COVID and having to wear masks and have to have these hand sanitizer every time they take their hands out of their pockets? Like, is that really my people? No, that's not who my people are. They're entrepreneurs or risk takers. They like to have that adrenaline rush, like to just go do something. And after being cooped up for about nine months, we had our, actually our first live event in October of 2020. So that's the reason I called my events the advance, because most people talk about going on a retreat. I was like, dude, retreat's Such a terrible word for entrepreneurs. It makes me feel like I'm going.

To go and meditate for a while. I'm not saying that's bad. Right. There's a time and place for a retreat, but there's also a time and a place to go and get encouraged, go and get inspired, go learn something new, be around fantastic entrepreneurs that you always connect, man. I don't know. It's an incredible experience, for sure.

Yeah, dude. So you got to put these events on to get the energy in that room, because it's not the same even for a speaker. I mean, we can do a really good virtual speech, but you just don't have that energy interaction between the people sitting in the front rows.

Yeah, for sure. Absolutely. Well, look, you know, I want to give the audience some semblance of understanding who. Who you are at your core. You've been an incredibly successful entrepreneur. Right. But you didn't. It wasn't like you were born with a silver spoon in your mouth and like, you just kind of like, stumbled your way into stuff. Take us back just a little bit, because, you know, our audience is what I'm starting. What I'm politely beginning to refer to, and I stole this from Nicole Waters recently, is the everyday entrepreneur. Right? These are solopreneurs. They're bootstrapped guys and gals. They're people who may have an idea and maybe have something they want to create, but they haven't had a chance to, like, fully do that. They're people who are working on their life while working on the profession, that kind of scenario. And I know your story's pretty powerful, which is one of the reasons I want everybody to hear it.

Man. I think that I'm one of your audience if you describe us as the blue collar, the average everyday entrepreneurs, because that was me also. I mean, I grew up with really lower middle class in a suburb of Houston, Texas. I'm still a native Houstonian is what we call ourselves. And my mom was a cafeteria worker. She's a Japanese immigrant. I was actually born in Japan as well, at a military base. And my mom worked in the high school cafeterias for 30 years. And my dad, when he got out of the Marines, he worked in the chemical refineries here locally for his entire career. They're both retired now. They're traveling, doing amazing things now. But I got to see the fear that we had of just not having the bills paid. And anytime my dad got laid off from his contractor jobs, he just avoided them for a few weeks until he found A new one. It was just like that kind of a really tense money, like just scarcity mindset around money. A lot of different things. And I remember watching my dad as a kid and seeing him be angry about things, and he was definitely not abusive. He may have been verbally abusive to me as a Marine sergeant for all. But I just understand that we look at those kind of role models in our life and we go, hey, does that really how I want to be? Is that what it takes to be a man? Right? And yeah, we learn some good things, we learn some bad things, but the people that have enough awareness, and I think that I have a pretty high level of awareness, I could say, well, I don't want to be like that, but I do like to be this part of that. So, man, I just saw my parents struggle, and I was actually the first person in both sides of my family to go to college. And it's not because they paid for it. It's because I paid for it. They said, hey, do you want to go to college? It's like, yeah, it sounds like a great idea. I had good grades in high school, and I said, well, you can either join the military or get a job. And I was like, well, I'm already got a job. Had a job since I was 15, but I guess I'll just go to the military. And then, you know, as I was about to go sign up for that, my dad actually had a pretty heartfelt conversation with me. And he said, you know, getting out of the military was the best thing he ever did and that he didn't want me to join just to be able to pay for college. He's like, you can get a job, you can work, you can just pick up extra shifts. Like, don't go because it's the money thing. So I did that. I worked in the chemical refineries just like he did as a helper, a grinding pipe. I became a welder, stick rotter, and then I became a pipe fitter. And even then, when I didn't have enough money, I was still put on my apron and go wait tables on the weekends. Eventually I was managing those restaurants in my mid-20s, and it took me seven years to graduate. Dude, mechanical engineering. But it took me a long time to do that working full time.

Yeah, but I mean, you know, it's funny, you and I joked off in air when I was on your show, and vice versa, we're always like brothers from another mother. Because one of the things that I know you and I both agree is this there's this element to the everyday entrepreneur that is this grinding thing to bring a vision, to bring a vision to life. And I know that I tend to respect those that really had a hard fought battle, right? That had the sleepless nights, that had the trying to figure out how to make payroll and what insurance is and what insurance you cover and then how to taxes and all these types of things. Not knowing how to read a balance sheet or a P and L and learning along the way and all that stuff, right? My heart goes out to those folks big time. How did you discover your own entrepreneurial journey? You know, was it something that you were pushed into? Was it something that you just found something you loved? Was it a necessity? How did you find yourself in the entrepreneur world?

So after going through that seven year period of hustle and grind and literally sleeping three or four hours a night in college and kind of going through that for so long, when I finally got my big boy salary job, you know, $45,000 a year as an entry level project engineer, I was getting home at 4:30 in the afternoon and I was like, well what do I do now? Do I just sit on the couch and watch TV like most people do? I go hang out at the bars like single dudes do or, you know, so I did a little bit of this and did a little bit of that and I just realized like, man, I'm just wasting a lot of time. And I was really honest with myself. Do I like this apartment? It was probably 500 square feet. I was like, do I really like living here? And is this really my life? Like what am I doing to make myself get a little further ahead? And I've always been the person that was really pragmatic and looking how, how do I learn new skills? How do I teach myself new things, new abilities, new knowledge to maybe earn some more money or climb a little higher on the corporate ladder, so to speak. And so I was in my late 20s and I was in that first little entry level job and I'd already been working in the field, like at the same chemical plants since I was 18. So I had a lot of experience even though I just got the degree. And I got tired of really running into that roadblock in corporate where they were thinking I was just too young. Like you're too young to go manage multimillion dollar projects because you know, you just GR graduated college. Like guys, I've been out there actually working and building this stuff for seven years now, right? And so I got tired of being told to Wait my turn. Pay your dues and looking at the desks and ahead of where you're going, where's your trajectory in the career? And I remember even going on interviews and sometimes you had to go park in the gravel lot, you know, farther away from the office. And as you're walking through and you get to the reserve spots, you're looking at the reserve cars and, like, what's parked there. And, you know, I both. We know, like, we like cars. And I'm looking at even the cars, like, in the reserve lot. I'm like, man, is this, like, what I'm aspiring to hit? Like, do I really want a brand new F150? I mean, is that. Is that really what I want to achieve in my life? And answer is no. The answer is no. I wanted more because I grew up broke. And so for me to find that creative external outlet, I started to think about what can I do to create businesses where I didn't have to go back and wait tables, because that's what I did for about two years. I had an engineering degree, an engineering job with a salary, and I was. Took a wait table seven nights a week because I wasn't where I wanted to be. And most people are unwilling to do things like that. They're not willing to do what it takes. They have this ego. They have this too much pride. I remember some of those people that worked at the engineering facility would come see me at the restaurant, and they were like, derek shocked. They're like, tony, why are you here? You're an engineer at the plant, and these guys are the factory workers. And I'm actually levels above them at the corporate level. But here I am waiting tables on the weeknights. And they were kind of surprised by that. And I said, well, it's because I'm not where I want to be. So I'm willing to do what it takes to get there. And I had plenty of free time to do this, so why not, right? So I've always been that way, dude. And for me, that creative outlet to go make some decisions, to learn new skills, new abilities, that's what I was building with entrepreneurship. And I just did that with the car businesses that I created.

Yeah. Well, let's talk about your first entrepreneurial vendor venture. Because, you know, one of the friends, Michael Gerber from the E. Myth, you know, he's become a friend, and one of the things he told me about is obviously is his signature thing is, you know, a lot of entrepreneurs, or was it a technician suffering from an entrepreneurial seizure. All right. Kind of scenario. So is that kind of how you kind of found it, or did you discover that you had a passion for entrepreneurship? And if so, what's the delta like? In other words, how did someone assess whether or not am I technician with an entrepreneurial seizure versus I am an entrepreneur?

Yeah. Gerber is pretty good at saying, work on your business, not in your business. You know, fire yourself. I actually use those things with my coaching. But the thing is that, man, I just wanted to buy some cool shit. I'm just being honest here. I mean, for me, working even at age 15 or even 12, pushing the lawnmower, knocking doors, was to buy that skateboard or the newest video game or BMX bicycle. And so always think about, like, what can I do to upgrade my life or have a little bit nicer place to live, a little bit nicer vehicle, better clothes, eat, you know, actually go to a menu on a restaurant and not have to look at the prices instead of actually looking at things I actually want to eat. Right.

Yeah.

And so we take these things for granted when we're in that low point, but we start to earn enough money. Like, I don't look at gas prices. I don't look at bottled water prices and things like that. It's just so far in my past that I just kind of sort of build myself into those roles. And so for me, like, the business thing was just a necessity or a means to get what I wanted initially. Initially, that's how it was. Right. Because I think that when we're especially men, we're trying to prove ourselves. We're trying to fortify ourselves with knowledge. We're trying to prove that we can do something. What's our. What's our metal? What's our grit?

Know?

Can we go crush those hours and just make as much money as possible? That's kind of how we're hardwired, even as children, to go do that, be the sole provider, be the breadwinner. So that was.

Well, I mean, we're taught to be that from day one, right?

Totally. Totally.

Knights and shining armor and princesses, right?

Totally. Yeah, yeah, yeah. And so getting the businesses going was a way to make extra money. And I did it the wrong way. I did it like most people. Like, hey, I got this craft and actually designed this little electric circuit that was a plug and play on a Chevy Camaro or a Firebird where you can plug and play. That would fool the computer, and it would give it about 10 horsepower. It would change the reading of the.

Sensors Ladies and gentlemen, he loves fast cars.

So. So that's what I did. I was like, oh, man, I designed this. I figured it out from school. And I bought the wiring harnesses and I would get home from my job and I'd sit at the kitchen table and I would get my little soldering iron. I'd build these little circuits. And it take me about an hour to build one of those and about $25 in parts, and I could sell that for about 75 bucks. I was like, okay, I'm making this much money per hour, but I can only build two or three night. And it's like, this isn't scale. And also there wasn't a giant market for those. So I might sell five, six of those a week. And it's like, okay, at least I don't have to wait tables anymore. Kind of replace that income. But then I started thinking about, what are the things I can do to create income while I'm sleeping? Like, why do I always have to think about this mentality that most of the middle class of America is stuck with, that you think that you got to go trade units of your time for units of dollars, so if you don't have enough money, you go pick up an extra shift. If you don't have enough money, you go get a second or third job, you don't have enough money, you pick up overtime. It's always trading for money. And that's the mentality that I grew up with, and that's what most Americans grow up with. So I started to question, it's like, does really time equal money? Because we hear this our entire lives. It's all bullshit. We know it's not true now, but I didn't think that was possible to make money without having to physically be somewhere or clocking in and out. I just didn't understand that until the Internet started to come around in the late 90s and I was surfing on it at the university and I was like, this is pretty cool. Like, most people are just using it for information consumption, but I think people are going to start selling stuff on this. And how do I get more ATT on this stuff? Like, how do I make things where people will show up and I just make money and I don't have to be there? Like, that's probably where I was thinking about in the late 90s.

Yeah, well, and I think that's reason. One of the reasons I want to hit that is because I think a lot of folks who are solopreneurs or entrepreneurs that are very early stage, right. They have an idea, they're trying to bring it, they're trying to bring it to market. Maybe they're trying to work on the value proposition or position in a specific way or find their. You know, I don't know about you, I'm sure you get this too. I get several DMS a day asking me to finance various businesses and become a funding source. And by the way, guys, that's not the best way to ask for an investment. I mean, there's a process for getting an investment in your business. But you know, when people are doing that, you know, I find that a lot of folks are.

Really kind of grasping for straws. So how did you avoid the grasping for straws and looking for the easy way versus actually just doing it?

I think that part of that is, you know, my book, the title, side Hustle Millionaire. And people see that title, that really grabs your attention. It's, it's my true story. I built businesses that earned millions of dollars and I sold those for millions of dollars. As a side business. I've always been really dedicated to the oil and gas career, the profession that I was on executive path on. But that also had a lot to do with me going through those years of paying for my own college and also hearing my mom on my right shoulder like, don't waste your degree like you, you got to use that engineering degree like, you know, because like, like, why would you go waste.

Too bad you can, right?

Yeah, I wish you could. I wish you could. I mean, it's sitting there on my wall. It's got a little bit of layer of dust on top of the frame and I don't really use it anymore, but I'm thankful that I got it. It taught me a lot of things. But I think that too many times people value the education or even the school that you go to to think that that's going to make them successful. It's not true. I mean, you and I both know Ivy League people who are as broke as hell. Yeah. We know people that have, you know, a third grade education who are wealthy as hell. So it's not about education. So you know, for me, like the business dude, it was just, it was how do I grow this without having to be present. I really started thinking about that, you know, and I started building websites. I was a car guy, so I would actually taught myself. I bought a book. There's a book back there on my shelf from like probably 1996, 1997. When people ask me, hey, Stephen, what is the one book that changed your life. When they asked me that, it's like, oh, it's how to code HTML, whatever version it was from 1996. And they're like, what the hell? I was like, that's not a motivation inspirational book. It's like, you're right. I actually learned a skill and I realized that there was a missing opportunity that was out there that people weren't really building websites. And I taught myself using notepad and looking at the browsers, probably Internet Explorer or something crazy back then. And I would just teach myself page at a time. And I practice and I make these little one to three page websites that were really common to see nowadays. But yeah, so, and here's how I got fun at this. I. I got the car magazines and I would go look at the ads that were running in there, and if they only had their phone number listed on the thing, I knew they didn't have a website.

Yeah.

So I would call the number. I say, hey, do you guys have a website? Oh, no, we've been thinking about building one of those. You know, we're thinking about building a website someday and we want to get on the Google. Yeah, that was. This is pre Google, right? This is Yahoo. This is AOL, AOL. Yeah, this is all that days. Right. And so I said, well, I have this Pontiac Trans Am. I need a set of headers, full exhaust system. Maybe from you, I see you produce that. Would you be willing to trade me some of those things to if I built you a really simple website? Oh, hell yeah. Like, let's do that. So I started just trading car parts to get websites built because it would take me about 5, 6 hours to build one of those websites and I get free parts. Eventually my car had all the parts, so I started thinking like, well, maybe I need a second thing. I bought a truck. So I started putting parts on the truck. And then so I had a Firebird and a GMC truck that were fully modded out, had wheels, suspension, engine stuff and as much as you could do. And I was like, okay, now I think I should just start charging for this because I don't need parts anymore. And so I was building that skill over a couple of years and I was a member on another automotive community and they weren't really managing properly. I was like one of the biggest contributors writing these how to articles. How to make your car faster, how to make it look better, how to be a better driver. Like, I was always creating content, same as I do today, and it was being mismanaged. The owner wouldn't pay his bill, it would get hard deleted, and you wouldn't have backups. And so I would lose all this material I was making. So eventually me and a few other people went to him and said, hey, why don't you like pay your bills so they quit losing all the stuff that we're creating for you. We're doing this for free to build your website. And he threw an attitude. He said, hey, if you guys think you can do a better job, go start your own website. And so I was like, well, hey, I know how to build websites. I don't know anything about servers and hosting, but I can figure that out too. And that's what we did is I started LS1 Tech, and that grew into about 10,000 revenue a month. And within three months, we're making a probably about $400,000 a year profit. When we sold it in 2007, we sold that for a few million. And it's always something that built part time. And the thing is that me working in engineering, Steven, it taught me processes and systems because I was working for the major operators. So I understood how to scale things by just writing procedures and having roles and responsibilities and putting the right people in the right seats where I didn't have to be present. Because I was working international, I was working offshore. A lot of times where I'd just be ghost. I'd go off the grid for 30, 40 days. Sometimes people thought I was like international spy because I would disappear and come back in town like, oh, you're back. But I had to build businesses that could sustain that kind of a lifestyle, that kind of career. So by design, I built these businesses that literally made me money while I was asleep or I was on vacation or I didn't have to be there.

Yeah, no, I love it. I think it's a good reminder for all entrepreneurs too, is, you know, sometimes as an entrepreneur, you either judge your. You judge yourself by the entrepreneur you plan to be or the entrepreneur you currently are. Not realizing that that's setting you up for the journey that becomes entrepreneurship in general. Right. I want to pivot the conversation just a little bit because obviously you've had immense success, right? You can now buy what you want, go and do what you want, and that kind of stuff. I don't know about you, but for me, I had a massive pivot once that happened to me where I had a lot of freedom, right? Where I was like, this is all well and good, but this isn't fulfillment. This isn't filling to me.

What have you learned about making ultimately a meaningful impact in today's marketplace?

Man, I think that you have to understand your purpose. And when we think about these really deep questions, like what is the meaning of life? What is your purpose? If you would have asked me that at each decade, let's say, of my life, I would have had a different answer. And I think that's normal. I think that especially if you're a younger listener, that you don't have those answers. And it sounds like really like far away. And you got plenty of time. And you may, you may have that time. But I would say that my 20s was really focused on gaining knowledge, trying to apply some skills, trying to get some credibility. 30 was all about stacking money. Like when I'm in my 30s, like most men, it's like, hey, I've got a career, I'm building businesses, I'm like sacrificing family time, which is not healthy, but that's what you do as a man and you disappear and you make a lot of money. And that's what I did my entire 30s. And then when it starts to approach 40 for most people, it's like that pivotal age. It's mid life, right? Yeah, I started really thinking about that. It's like, man, I missed some of my kids football games. I didn't get to see a lot of the stuff growing up. I didn't see those first steps. Had a lot of money in the bank, had all the fancy things, big house, 10 cars in the driveway, all that stuff. But it wasn't really worth all of that. Now, I'm not going to say that it was a terrible decision. It's something that I had to learn through. But really in 40s, when I started really thinking about awareness and what am I going to do to build some legacy, like how am I impacting people outside of my friend group? Because I'd helped 12 other people that were staff members of mine build seven, eight and nine figure companies over the last 15 years. And they kept telling me that you should be doing this full time, you should be teaching these people full time. And Steven, the reason I didn't do that is because I had a lot of insecurities and I didn't have a lot of confidence. And we always talk about imposter syndrome and things like that. I don't know if I believe all that, but it's really just insecurities. Let's be real, because imposter syndrome sounds like it's a. Like it's a. It's a buzzword nowadays, but it's really just insecurity and fear of criticism. That's the truth, right? We're not afraid of failure. We're afraid of what other people are going to say or think about our failure. So when you put it in that perspective, you realize, like, man, I'm putting my entire life on hold and holding myself back from my true potential because I'm afraid of what other people are going to think or say. So understand this guys. If you're on your deathbed and you're looking back in your life, let's say that you've, you're very fortunate and you make it to this old age and you're, you're at your deathbed and you know that you have very limited time and you're going to be thinking back on the things that you regret not doing versus the thing that you tried and failed. And you're going to also look at the people that are in that room and you're going to realize that none of them are your haters. The people that you're so worried about, their critical words, their negative, their naysaying, their hate. They're not at your deathbed, but you're going to let them rule your entire life up to that point. It's sad to think about, man. And I had a near death experience racing cars in 2015. I guess I was around 43 at the time and I just really understood that, hey, I could have died in that moment. I hit a concrete wall at 130 mph at the racetrack and I started thinking about why am I still here? And then I started thinking about how would I been remembered? And man, that was tough. When you start thinking about how if you're, if you were to die today, listeners, how would you be remembered? Like, write that down. Like, be honest with yourself. How would you be remembered? Would they just be like, oh, nice guy, rich, cool cars gone too soon. It's always that cliche stuff like, oh man, gone too soon. Really, what a loss. Like, dude, that's not enough. If you're competitive and you're driven and you've always pushed yourself to become better than you really are and eventually grow into those shoes, you realize like, dude, that's not enough. That's like half assing it. And so what I'd really started to do is call myself out and go, man, time is not guaranteed. We always think we have plenty of time. And I was like, I've only impacted people around me, like close people around me, former staff members Friends, family. It was like, why am I not putting this out in the world? Why am I not writing that book that's been in my mind for five years? Why am I not finding the confidence to get on stage and get in front of cameras? Because, dude, I hated that stuff. I didn't have any of that confidence. I mean, I had to go invest in speaking coaches and joining Toastmasters and showing up. I had to go invest a lot of time and effort and energy into doing that. I actually found a craft that I actually enjoy doing now, being communicator. But guys, I had stage fright. I didn't like to do that. I have a skin condition called Vitiligo. I'm literally covered with white spots all over my face and my body. And so I grew up seeing people like that would meet me and they go, hey, what's wrong with you? What's wrong with you? Like, what's wrong with your skin? Like, what is why you have all these white spots? So I got used to just hiding from the camera and not wanting to be out in public. I got really successful building logos and brands and hiding behind the logo. And there's probably some listener right now that's doing the same thing. They built, they built a successful company and everybody knows their logo, but nobody knows their face because they had the same issues I was going to. Went through.

Yeah, I want to stay here for a few minutes and, and really kind of continue to drive home and, and drive around, I guess is the best way to say it, limiting beliefs versus mindset. Because I find that most people refuse to take action because they don't believe the actions that they take will actually bring about possibilities. Right.

They.

They don't believe it's possible. They don't believe, you know, like, you're talking about the skin condition. Hey, look, I. I'm not made to talk on stage because I have a skin condition. Right. I'm not made to speak. I stutter or I can't be an entrepreneur because I can't go out and meet people. Like all these different junky things we tell ourselves. How are you able to overcome limiting beliefs and totally rechange your mindset? Because you're a very different entrepreneur today than you were two decades ago or even a decade ago.

Yeah, dude, I think that we do a lot of self sabotaging. Even when I wrote that book, it became a bestseller. I sold thousands of copies the first week and it's continued to do so the last three years. But here's the thing is that I Actually started admitting this in interviews maybe a few months ago when I decided to write that book was actually the most cowardly way for me to get my message out there. And nobody likes to admit that, but it's. Man, we all know that there's New York Times bestsellers out there that you would never even recognize if they walk by you on the sidewalk. Yeah. So it was a way to potentially make impact without ever being famous or known or anything like that. Because I wasn't interested in that. I just wanted to impact the world. And here's where it shifted for me. I wrote the manuscript of the title of the Hustle because I used to be a compete competitive nine ball collegiate champion and billiards. So I thought, like, it's a play on words. Like it's hustle like entrepreneur and it's hustle like playing pool, Right. And I was a chapter called Masse Dude. Yeah. And I was telling my editor that I was trying to sell him on the title and he's like, like, Tony, that title's bullshit. Like, what are you doing with that title? I said, so what do you think it should be? He goes, well, I read it. He goes, you're the side hustle millionaire. And I was like, ah, man, that sounds really arrogant. It sounds kind of pompous. It's just not who I am. And he goes, which of those two words do you disagree with? Did you not become a millionaire? Well, yeah. Did you do it as a side business? Well, I guess I did. He goes, well, then what are the people going to say? Like how they're going to dispute the title? So I said, let me sleep on that. And the next day I said, you know, man, that's, that's a, that's a big character, like side hustle millionaire. That's a big character that I need to become. And, and then he's, he's reading the, he's doing the final edits. He's like, man, I think people are going to want to interview you. You might be on the radio, you could be on tv, I bet you get invited on podcasts. And I was like, oh shit. Like the whole thing I was trying to avoid, it's confronting me again. Like, I can't avoid it. So at that point, Stephen, that's the point that was like, like, okay, I need to call my own shit out and I need to just go invest in finding. How do I get past that? So you do what most people do. You go on Google and you go, how do you get over stage fright? Well, it says, join Toastmasters, join a Rotary Club, hire a speaking coach, do social media videos to practice the reps. And I was like, okay, none of that's going to kill me. So let me go just do that. And when I joined the Toastmasters, I sat in the front. I didn't hide in the back. I said, if I'm going to be here, I'm going to make this as most painful as possible. And I'm just going to raise my hand every meeting and I'm going to participate. Even if it's for one minute or five minutes or whatever, I'm going to just do that. And I would learn something and I would go back and I would do these social media videos, and I did a video every single day on Facebook and Instagram for a year. So that 365 driven is really. That beginning of that was like, I'm going to go do this every single day because I was learning something and I had to get on the stage, but I didn't have a stage. So my video of my phone was my stage. And I improved and I improved and I started inspiring people and they saw that I was improving and I was willing to suck. That's the most thing that kind of goes back to what are you willing to do to get what most people don't have? I was willing to suck. And that's what most people that don't understand success. They're not willing to go knock themselves down a few notches and actually be a beginner and embrace that they're not good at this and be willing to climb. And most people are unwilling to do that because they get embarrassed. It goes back to the fear of criticism again. So, dude, I had to go invest in that. So that was the pivotal moment for me. It was like, I have to go become the right person to carry this book and this story.

Yeah, yeah, not so good. I mean, I was. I had another friend of mine, AJ Vaden of Brand Builders Group CEO, on a previous episode, and one of the things that she brought up, which I thought was interesting, is a lot of folks don't start because they think if they start, it has to, like, skyrocket. If it doesn't skyrocket, then it's a complete failure. And she. And she had this interesting thing that she brought up. She said, you know, it's interesting to me that, you know, if we go to a. A Facebook Live or an Instagram live and only 25 people pop on, right, and they're hanging out, maybe they're chatting and hanging out or whatever.

That's a lot, by the way. That's a lot.

Yeah, exactly. Right. I'm using her numbers from her analogy. Right. But, you know, you go on and you pop on and. But then you think, well, you know, I don't know, Tony Robbins gets a hundred thousand people on or whatever, and you blow it out of a portion in your mind. But she said if you go to a local. A local event, like maybe you've been invited to speak at the local chamber or rotary or whatever, and 25 people show up and you do your presentation, and all 25 people, or even half the room comes up to you and, like, shaking your hand. That's so important. It meant so much to me. Thank you. Straight tears streaming down their face. Right. Like that. I mean, all these types of experience we've all had, and in this world, we get filled up by that. But then we put ourselves out on the social side of things, and we're not all of a sudden, it's not enough. Right. I'm curious to know, at what point did you decide that what enough was as far as an audience? Because I know that a lot of people use the word audience, and one of the things I hear about from you a lot of times is it's not audience, it's community. And I know there's a big difference. So talk to me a little bit about audience versus community and what matters. How do you know you're making a meaningful impact in those categories?

Yeah, that is a big community difference. I think that actually I was in a clubhouse room maybe earlier this year, back when I was frequenting it, and the topic came up, what is followers versus community? And there's a lot of people on there that would be perceived as influencers that were in the room. They have big followings. They have hundreds of thousands of followers or millions of followers on Instagram. So they feel like they're. They're leaders. They feel like they're leaders because of that. Not all. Now, here's the thing is, not all of them are.

Yeah.

You know, maybe you got a, you know, a rocking body, or maybe you're. You just. You got some fancy flash that people are following. It's always ask my. My people, like, are they following the things that you have or how you look, or are they following you as an individual? Would. Would you be able to lead them into war and to combat and, you know, would they actually take your advice and their life matters? Like, then. Probably not. It's probably a superficial relationship. They're Getting some entertainment value maybe from you. And so the difference between a follower base, which is what everybody talks about now, because everybody's like, gets really sad when they don't get a lot of Instagram followers, right?

It's not the same at all. Because a follower, a followership, let's use that word, a followership is a one way communication line. It means you're sitting at the top of the pyramid and you're saying, hey, this is me and I'm super important and I'm entertaining you and like, here's my post and you go, oh, I like it. Like, cool, Rock on. Like, you see these one way conversations right now. A community leader is different because it's my duty as a community leader. And I built communities with 500,000 combined members. Like big, big communities. It's never my job to put myself at the top of the pyramid. I always think about an upside down pyramid where I'm standing on the ground and I'm holding the pyramid above my head because my community is bigger than me. And I understand that. And that's the role that I accept and I actually enjoy because I want to embed myself in the community as an active participant. Everybody knows who owns it or who's the leader is, but I don't want to be the, hey, that's Tony. And he's super awesome. And like he's, he's better than all of us and he's talking down to us like, no, guys, like, it's my duty as a leader of a community to embed myself within the community and also facilitate that. There's lines of communication that form between each and every member on an individual basis. So Steven, if you're in my community, and let's say like Dennis Yu, you know Dennis, he was a speaker at my last event. So like, if you guys are in my community and you didn't know each other, I would want to make sure that you guys introduced each other and you guys built your own line of communication. It didn't have to involve me at all. So it's like I want to build the virtual bar. You know, we grew up watching the movie, like the show Cheers. You know, everybody knows your name, right? These communities that you build. I want people to remember where they met the greatest people in their lives and have that reason to go back and go back to that bar and see the people that know them has nothing to do with me. I'm the bar owner, right? It's not about me. So I think that people that pursue followers, it's a lot about ego. They think that having a large amount of followers somehow validates who they are or justifies who they are and it's more about self importance. But I think that we also see people that have large followers that are just really giving and they're really just helping people. It's not about them. And those are the kind of people I want. I know that I will have millions of followers eventually. It's just a matter of time. And I'm really consistent. That's the thing. If we show up every day, you are the same way. We know how to amplify, we know how to be around the right people to help get our message out there. It's going to grow. It's a result. It's not the objective.

Yeah, well, it seems like the. Especially in the thought leadership category, the areas that are growing are the people who are the most authentic. And if you're open and honest with your audience, community, when you're just being you. I'm the same Stephen on camera as I am off camera, right? I'm like everybody else. I pass gas every now and again, right? I kick back and watch a TV show with my wife. Like we, you know, we all. I have to go pick up dog poop in the yard from time to time. Like, you know, like there's just, you know, it's. It's just life, right? But the. I think one of the things that comes, that comes out of everything is when you're able to share experience based on actual experience. Right? And it comes across as authentic and natural. Big time. Big, big time. You know, I know you get tugged in a lot of directions nowadays. A lot of folks are pulling at you, trying to get your attention, trying to spend time with you, trying to get mentorship by you. I know that's part of the reason why you built the coaching practice in the, in the live event space. I am curious.

I'm a big believer there's a right way and a wrong way to build relationships with people, whether they're notable or not notable. Like there's a right way and a wrong way. I'm curious to know your feedback on somebody making an ask of you versus someone adding value to you. What do you see nowadays? Where do you actually want to invest your time?

Man, that's a tough one. I think that you're in the similar situation. People always want to DM you and ask you about investing money in their business and things like that. And it's like, what made you guys think that I'm doing that. Is that the neon light that's blinking above me? It's like I'm out here just giving money away and people I don't know, I have no relationships with. I mean, I don't even understand where the courage to ask someone for money like that is. I just, I can't even do it. I have a problem just having call to actions after anything I say. Like, I don't, I don't like to ask people for money. And I think it's because I learned how to make it myself. And so I realized that early on, like, I'm just not that type of person. I'd rather create the value and understand that to me, money is always a scorecard. It's a, it's a, it's a creation of the value that you put out in the world. Right? So I've never focused so much on the money. It's like, hey, if I go create these value and I entertain people or I change their lives or make their businesses better, the money's going to come. It's inevitable. If you're creating value, the money will come. I mean, even the websites I created, hundreds of thousands of members that did not pay to be there. But hey, hundreds of thousands of people showed up through that website every single day and saw the ads that we did get paid put there. And therefore I got paid based on creating value for those companies that advertise. It's the same business model as social media nowadays. So I think that for me it's just all about what do I want to achieve in my life? Like, where is this going? People are just asking, is it for good intentions? Like, you and I were probably pretty good at just seeing character within people and is it for the right intentions? If, you know, I sit on the board of a nonprofit for anti bullying of teens. Like, I like contributing those things, things that matter to me. I had bullies as a kid too, so I want to help things that help themselves first. I don't like to do the handout thing. I always like to. I like to help the people that have shown that they're actually trying to do something for their situation. And then I help them, I give them advice because I think that several years ago I got tired of just feeling frustrated when you're always trying to give people advice and you can see the potential in other people that they don't even see for themselves. And you give them the advice and you come across their path a couple years later in the same situation still, and you're like, dude, why did you not do what we said? Like, you gave me the roadmap. Like. Like you would have been in so much a different place. And they're like, oh, yeah, you know, like, all the excuses start. So that used to really frustrate me. And I used to take that personal. But then I realized when I started getting in this personal development space is that I don't have the time to help people that haven't raised their hand. I need to be focused solely on the people that have raised their hand. Say, hey, I want to change. I want to go create something in my life. I'm seeing these issues. I'm willing to do what it takes to get these issues past me. Like, those are the people we got to be focused on because our advice will help anyone and everyone that hears it, but it's not going to change anybody unless they do it. Yeah. So. So I had to focus on, like, guys, the analogy I like to use is, like, I like little puppies even though I don't have pets because my wife is allergic dogs. I love puppies. Right. And I would love to be able to save every single puppy in the pound in the world, but it's just not realistic.

Yeah.

It's not going to happen. So see what I mean? Like, people are kind of the same way.

Well, speaking of lifelong impact, obviously, you know, you just finished up a live event. I can't wait for the next one. That's going to be amazing. I am curious. What. What is next? What's next for you? What, what is it? What is the mark you hope to leave on the world at this stage in the game?

Man, I think it's all about amplification of a message. And to me, if I could give people a little bit of confidence and understand that they need to put their purpose ahead of their fear. Most people live with their fear, but out of their purpose. We see that a lot in this world right now. Yeah. Media driven. And people, like, all ppd out and just looking with fear in their eyes and living with this fear all day long every single day. It's got to be terrible for their health. I mean, just think about all the hormones that are being released. The fear, like the entire cortisol.

All of it.

Yeah, yeah, Cortisol. Like they're living on cortisol 24 7. I like to live on adrenaline 24. 7 if I can. Right. And so I think that if I give people a little bit of confidence and see the potential within them that they don't see for Themselves. And I also give them the tangible, tactical takeaways because I've done it. We have a pretty good recipe for success. I've helped a lot of people become multimillionaires. It's kind of fun to do that because early on they have that self doubt just like everybody. But the ones that always get the results, you and I both know they're the ones that just show up and they don't have any excuses. They're like, hey, we talked about that two weeks ago. We did it. Actually. I did more than that. I actually went above and beyond. I was like, hell yeah, dude. Like, this is the kind of people that you need to have. And I just need a little guidance and a little bit of. They need a little bit of just here's where you're going, here's what the trajectory looks like. Here's what you got to do. Don't do this. Like, it's all about mistake avoidance. When you hire coaches or join a group, right, you don't want to learn. You want to learn from the mistakes of your mentors. And so the next thing for me is I get, I just signed a television show contract. It'll be on Amazon Prime. They're actually going to come here and film me on an episode on December 10th. Congratulations, dude. That's the things that's going to grow, you know, and it's just, just, it's about just putting the value out there. People will come across your path, they'll discover you and they'll say, hey, hey, we want you to be on this show. And you'll see when we can talk about the show in more detail. But there's a lot of big names involved and it could definitely change my entire career. It could like, literally, like year from now, we could have this conversation. I could be in a completely different place if I do this the right way.

Rock on. Well, I can't wait to actually get you on the show when you're, when you're officially allowed to talk about it.

So that would be amazing. But dude, man, I've enjoyed having you, man. You're amazing. You spend a lot of, lot of time serving a lot of people. You're one of the people that I refer to as has, has done the work right. Not every, not every person that people follow has done the work. And I'm always very grateful of people who have done the work right. And we're just talking about, you know, somebody trying to coach somebody through. I'm like, did you do your homework? Like, did you actually take the one step, because I always give them one step. Did you take the one step? If you took the one step, you get my attention. You didn't take the step up. I move my attention to somebody who's taking the steps, right?

They're raising their hand. They're raising their hand. There it is again, man.

So where else can everybody else find more about you and your live events, coaching, all that stuff, man?

I would say that the best way to define me is my website, 365-driven.com. that's also the title of my podcast because you're probably a show listener yourself if you're watching or listening to this. And we've been a show for about three years now, got 227 episodes. And, you know, you were actually one of those about three episodes back, so.

We had a blast, too, man.

Honored to have you on there, man. It was a fun. It was a fun, very fun conversation.

Rock on, dude. Well, dude, I can't wait to do this again, especially when you get the time to come tell us about the new.

The new.

The new thing coming up the pipeline. Be amazing.

Good stuff, man. Thank you for having me on. I'm honored to be here and you guys reach out to me. I'd love to hear from you. I actually do respond to my DMs, and I'm not one of those people that has a VA that does everything for me.

It. All right, dude, we'll rock on. We'll see you in the next one. Peace. If you love that interview, go ahead and check out this next one right here.

No matter how absurd a thought is.

If I think it enough, I will believe it. And we now know that those thoughts turn into actions, and so these absurdities.

In our head become reality.