Increase your reply rate with magnetic messaging

So today's presentation is all about prospecting, messaging. So we're specifically talking about messaging. Other areas of prospecting we will cover at a later point in time, but it's all about how we can increase your positive reply rate. So we'll talk more about exactly how to do that. So the main things that we're going to talk about in here, basically what you're going to be able to do by the end of this webinar, is be able to avoid the biggest messaging mistakes that we see. So we analyze a lot of different messaging from different reps and different companies, and we'll highlight some of those mistakes that we see. We're going to show you how to actually write messaging that's going to get your prospects to reply and how to combine messages into compelling sequences. So it's not just enough to send one email where you have to send multiple over a period of time. I'll show you exactly how to do that. So before we jump in, I'm going to leave you with these three numbers, 6, 11 and 250. I'm not going to tell you what they mean right now, but we'll come back to this later throughout the call. So to kick it off, when it comes to outbound sales or prospecting, there's really what we call the four Rs, which is you have to reach out to the right person with the right message at the right time in the right channel. So there's a lot of nuance within this, which says, yeah, you have to find the right people, which is how you build your list. You have to actually create a message that's going to resonate with them for that individual reaching out to. Then you actually have to hit them at the exact time that they might need your product or service. And you also have to do it through the right channel, meaning LinkedIn, phone, in person, or email. So a lot of things have to happen for prospecting to actually work. And so what we're going to focus on today, though, is how to craft that right message, how to craft a compelling message that gets somebody to respond. So when we think about what happens with an email, so you think of like email psychology, how. How do you actually decide, is this worth my time to respond? There's a lot of questions that you ask yourself. The first one is typically going to be, should I open it? And do I open it? Has to do with who's sending it, what's the subject line, or what's in that preview text window. Right. So if you're on your phone and you're using like Gmail or something, there's always that little section to show you what the first part of the email is. And if you decide, yes, I'm going to open it now you have to decide, am I actually going to read this? Which is, how long is it going to take me to read? Is it relevant to me? And why should I basically read the next line? So you're going to look at it and say, is this like a block of text that's going to take me five minutes to read through? If, if it is probably just going to delete it, then you're going to say, is it actually relevant to me? So they're going to read that first line or so and say, okay, is this actually relevant? If it is, great. Then they'll decide, should I actually then read the next line? Then the next thing is they'll have to figure out, should I actually respond? And so the way they are thinking about that is, could this actually help me? Is it actually worth responding to? And what is it that they're asking for? So if you're asking for something that's a big ask, like meeting for 60 minutes or meeting in person, or, you know, something that might be a big ask for this particular email, they may not be willing to respond. So the challenge with prospecting, and the challenge, especially with email, is that you have to basically answer yes to all of these questions just for somebody to get a response. And so we want to make sure that we're optimizing all of these answers to be yes when we're sending out emails to people. So we'll talk through exactly how to do that here. So we'll start with subject lines. So subject lines are best when they're short and sweet. And the reason you want to do that is because if you think about how it takes up the space in an email, if you have a short subject line, it's easy for them to read. They'll be able to read the full subject line and it leaves extra room for your preview text of what your email actually says. So you can combine both a subject line with the preview text to answer that initial question here on the left, which is, okay, what are in these things? Is this something that's actually worth me opening? So you want to keep them short. And if you can make it look like an internal email, so like an internal email that somebody might have sent to that person internally, you want to keep out any sort of like, marketing or sales jargon, any, like, buzzwords like Just cut those out. If you say things like accelerate or improve or any sort of these words that you wouldn't naturally use in your usual language or like you would actually put in an internal subject line, just take those out. You also want to make sure you're not using clickbait. You don't want to put something crazy in the subject line and then not actual follow through with that being relevant in the body of the message itself. But some other things that you can do is you can mention their company. So if you are reaching out to a particular company, you can mention the company or use their actual name or focus on a very specific problem that you help solve. And we'll talk about problems versus your capabilities here in just a minute and why it's important to focus on problems. But you know, these are some best practices that you can think about when you are creating subject lines. Doesn't mean you always have to follow them, but they're best practices to help you get an open. So some examples might be something like sequencing data, failed experiments, John and Harrison az, liver models, publication in Nature, delayed projects, tox question. These are all sort of things that could look like they're sent internally. Something that might catch somebody's attention. And if you're talking about, let's say you talk about not using clickbait. If you say failed experiments, you want to ensure in your message of the body that it actually correlates to failure. Failed experiments. So are you actually helping people prevent failed experiments as an example? Same thing goes for delayed projects, right? Those can be ones that could be a little bit clickbaity, but they are pretty good for subject lines. Okay, so now we're going to jump into messaging. So how do you actually create messaging in the body of the email? That's going to resonate. So the first thing you have to do is you have to avoid these common pitfalls. These are the things that we see all the time in a lot of the emails that we review. The first one is that it's quote unquote, just the facts, meaning they put a bunch of information into the email and it's all like the features, the functions, the capabilities. It's like the stuff that just is about their product or service, right? There's nothing emotional behind it or nothing problem focused. It's just, hey, here's our product. And that leads into the second one where it's really only focused about your particular offering. So instead of focusing on focusing on the person that you're actually reaching out to and making it relevant and personalized to them. You're writing this email that says, hey, here's my product, want to buy it? Or hey, here's my product or service. Let's meet. The other big one is there's no differentiation in the messaging. And so a lot of people will talk about what we call table stakes capabilities. So they'll talk about these are the things that everybody can do. And they try and like, stuff these into the email. Could be like the certification of your lab, maybe like a turnaround time, maybe something related to pricing, whatever it is. Right. There's no real differentiation here. And so you want to make sure that you are focusing on your differentiated capabilities. And we'll talk about that later as well. The other thing that we see is these messages are way too broad. So you try and send it like you're sending this thing to every single person and you're trying to hit every single application or every single use case. And. And so it's so broad that the person that's receiving it has to then do the work of figuring out is this relevant to them. And then lastly, no personalization. This one is really common, especially if people are just sending out templates. Make sure that you're adding that level of personalization or relevance as to, like, why you're reaching out to this person, because that's going to be the hook that gets them to read the next line and continue through your email. So those are the things that you need to avoid doing. So now, what are the things that you actually want to be doing? You want to be focusing on problems versus your product. So what are the problems that your customers face that your product can help solve? You want to focus on one problem for email, so be very specific. Instead of being broad, you want to be specific. So focus on one problem per email. We'll talk more about sequences, but what you'll be able to do is you'll be sequencing different problems throughout the course of your sequence, so you don't have to worry about what about this other thing that we can do or this other thing that we can potentially solve. Those will come as they're dripped out through the emails. So you want to start with that first email focusing on the biggest problem that person is likely facing. It has to be matched to their responsibilities. If you're reaching out to a VP at AstraZeneca, they care about things a lot differently than a scientist in the lab that's actually doing experiments. So you have to make sure that you're matching the level of which you're talking to the responsibility of that individual, you need to be able to pique their curiosity. One of the biggest things that gets somebody to respond or reply to a message is they say, wow, that's interesting, I want to learn more. And so if you're able to pique their curiosity around something new, something innovative, something different or unique, that's going to help them or it's going to compel them to want to actually reply and learn more about that topic. This is one we do see a lot, all the time, which is you're trying to basically sell your product or service in the email. So you're putting in all of the information about it to try and actually sell it to basically where you want them to respond. Yeah, I want to buy. Whereas what you want to do a lot of the time, unless you're doing something highly transactional, is you're actually trying to sell the meeting, which is you're trying to get them interested enough to take a meeting. And then in that meeting, that's when you go into your sales process versus trying to actually sell every feature, capability of your product or service in that email. And you want to keep it really short. Because if you think about the amount of space that you could fit on a mobile device, most emails are read on mobile. You want to be able to not have to scroll 3, 4, 5 times to get through the end of that email. So if you can keep it short and sweet all in one view, it's highly likely that your message will be actually read when it's opened. You want to focus on your differentiators, so your unique capabilities that make you different from all the other alternative approaches that somebody might take to solve their particular problem. And then lastly, you want to focus on the outcomes that the customer or the prospect is going to get versus the features that your product or service can deliver. So one exercise that you can do is to turn your features and capabilities into problems, into actual problem statements. And so the way you do this is you can list out what are all of the features and the benefits of what your product or service has and what it offers, and then simply ask the question, what is the prospect facing today? Like the challenges that they're facing that would make them want to actually use our product or service. So those are the kinds of questions that you need to dig into. Put yourself in the customer's mindset that says, these are the problems that my customer's facing that make my, that make them a great fit for our product service, for our offering. There's Something that you can actually do with AI with ChatGPT is if you take and list out all of your, you know, capabilities, all, and Basically then ask ChatGPT and say, hey, what are the problems that a customer might be facing that these capabilities help solve? And then that could help prompt some ideas of these particular problems that you could leverage. And the reason you want to do this is that if you can describe the problem better than your prospect, they see you as the expert, or at least as an expert, right? So if they. If I get an email and somebody is in that email talking about a very specific problem that I have and they know that problem and they know the depth of it more than I do, or at least they're talking the same language that I'm feeling, I'm going to be like, okay, this person knows me, they know what I'm going through. I'm going to be more likely to want to reply and talk to that person. Another key element that you're going to want to do with your messaging is you're going to want it to be polarizing. And so what I mean by polarizing is that it's something that attracts your ideal customers and repels the ones that you don't want. If your messaging is trying to be everything to everyone, then it's probably nothing to no one. So you want to create polarizing message to actually attract your ideal customers. And so the way you're going to do that is you're going to pick an enemy. So an enemy is going to be a process, a workflow, or an old way of doing things. It's not going to be your actual competitor. Like, you're not going to go want to call out like Illumina or anything like that. If you're up and competing against them, don't call it a company directly. You want to call out the process, the workflow, or this old way of doing things. The way people are doing stuff today, I'm going to specifically talk about that approach. What's wrong with the way people are doing it and what's wrong with the way that they're trying to approach it today? What are those downfalls, the things that they might be missing? And a great way that you can do this is you can think about it from what is the customer trying to actually get or accomplish, or what are the things that they need, but what prevents them from actually getting there, or what are those things that they actually hate doing? And so it's a great sort of framework that you can think about to pick that enemy that you're going to use and call out in your messaging to, you know, create this polarized message that's going to attract your ideal prospects and then repel those ones that you actually don't want. And so some examples that you can use of what people hate is things like outdated technology, systems or processes, wasted time, money, resources, fear, risk, lack of visibility into processes, or lack of visibility into data, bad customer service, These are all things that people hate. So think about it from your company's perspective now. What is it that your prospects or your customers are facing? What are the things that they hate currently doing as it relates to the enemy that you have chosen? And that's where you're going to want to call out in your messaging. And so a framework that you can use is a simple step, excuse me, a simple statement, which is customers need right insert the result of the outcome that they're trying to achieve. But they hate whatever that current or outdated process is. So I recommend writing out a few of these for your product or service and coming up with a few different polarizing messages that then you can test in your messaging. And so you, you're probably not gonna just plug in this specific framework into your message as it sits today. But what it'll do is it'll frame up how you're thinking about writing your actual message. And so here are a few examples where people need to use CRISPR for gene editing, but they hate having to do it themselves. They need a biologically relevant disease model, but they hate having to use primary cells cause they're difficult to work with. They need to screen proteins quickly, but they hate having to outsource the process and then wait for the results. They need to do sequencing, but hate the customer service of low cost providers. Right, so these are examples of how you can, you can see who the enemy is here, right? The enemy in the CRISPR example is having to do the pro, excuse me, having to do the experiment yourself. The enemy in the second one is having to use primary cells. The enemy in screening proteins is having to outsource and wait for the results. And then the enemy in sequencing is like low cost providers that provide a bad customer experience. So these are examples of how you can create these polarizing messages. Another key component when you're writing your message is to avoid these sort of broad claims that don't mean anything. So if I say something's fast, I would say compared to what easy to use is also in comparison to what reliable. Again, right, what are you comparing this to? And so you want to be very specific in your claims that you're making about your product or service. So if you say fast, that doesn't really mean anything. So be more specific and talk about like how a certain piece of automation can handle X, Y, Z. That makes your delivery time better. So be more specific in how you actually talk about things that are fast, easy, reliable or high quality. I think high quality is one that gets completely overused where people say we have the best quality, we have the highest quality, but again, it's all comparative. So it's like in comparison to what? And so be more specific where maybe you talk about a specific QC test that you use, why that's more valuable over an alternative method. Right, that other enemy that you're talking about. So remove the broad claims and make it more specific. You also need to not talk about your table stakes features and you need to talk about your differentiated capabilities. So table stakes features, we talked about this a bit earlier, but it's if you're ISO certified lab, if you say things like we run this particular QC test, but everybody else does that as well, those are going to be table stakes capabilities that you provide. Whereas you really want to be thinking about the differentiated things. What are the things that only you can do that are going to still provide value to your customers? Because those are the things that are going to make them realize or think that you are different enough or interesting enough to then want to have a conversation. So think about differentiation and if anybody else has those capabilities, don't really talk about them. The other thing that you're going to want to do, I highly recommend making this little table for yourself as well. But you're going to want to turn your features into outcome based messaging. So the example that I like to give here is at my previous company, Synthego, we had this 200 point transfection optimization for identifying the best conditions to edit a particular cell type. And so what that 200 point optimization did was it allowed the, you know, basically the customer to get high editing efficiency across multiple cell types. So that's nice, it's a great benefit, but it's not, it doesn't really mean anything. Like just because you can get high editing efficiency, it's not really outcome oriented. So the outcome that it actually drives is it allows them to conduct research in more biologically relevant cell types. So you can actually work with these more difficult to edit cell types that might be more relevant to your studies. So that's an example of how you can turn the features into outcomes and So I would recommend you do this with all of your different features that you have. What is the benefit and then what is the actual outcome that benefit drives? And then those are going to be the things that you're going to want to talk about in your message. It's not going to be that you don't want to Talk about your 200 point optimization, or if you do, you want to talk about it in the context of how it can help them conduct research of biologically relevant cells. And so before you actually hit send on any message, you want to ask yourself this question called the messaging test, which is if any other company could write this exact same email, then your message is too vague. And you want to make sure that your message is so specific, nuanced and different or unique in some way that your competitor or some other company wouldn't actually be able to send that same message. And so here's a messaging framework taking all that stuff that we've talked about so far and actually putting it together in a qlik framework. So you're going to want to have your introduction or your hook, and that's going to be that personalized sentence or that personalization that you're going to put at the beginning of the email that's going to show up in the preview text. Then you're going to want to identify their problem. So what is the problem that you've called out that you say, this is the problem that I think this person's having. You're going to call out now the solution. It's not always going to be the solution doesn't have to be your product or service is the solution. It could be that your approach to solving the problem is the way to solve their particular problem. Right? So that, that could be. It could be agnostic to your tool or solution and how you talk about it. And we'll show an example of that here in a sec. But the second part is all about how do you provide the outcome to solving that particular problem? And then you want to follow it up with what we call a soft call to action. You don't always want to be asking for a meeting because that's sometimes a big request for somebody to take, which is, I'm not always going to have time to spend 30 minutes to want to talk to somebody, but maybe I'll reply and ask for more information. And so a soft call to action. Are you interested in seeing the data? Can I send over some more of the information? Interested in learning more? Is this worth a discussion? Those sorts of Softer call to actions are more likely to get a reply. So if you look at it like this, within a body of an email, be like, hi, first name Hook, body one, body two, call to action. Short, sweet, fits nicely within an email. So let's look at a couple examples here real quick. I'm not going to read all of it, but you'll see the structure is very similar, which is first line, I was on your services page and it looks like you don't have anovaseq. Right. Personalized. It's relevant to that individual. Now next with Hike, trying to call out the problem, which is have you noticed any of your customers going to cheaper providers for the sequencing needs? If they have, great, that's now a trigger in their mind. They're like, okay, this is a problem I have. This person gets me, right? So then we talk about the solution and then a soft call to action, it's like, is it worth a discussion to see how we could partner together? Here's another example. How are you accurately modeling Wilson's disease in vitro? Right. We know this person is working in Wilson's disease. We've done research on them. So we're able to say, okay, this is personalized and relevant to them. We talk about the problem, which is if you're using Hepg2s, you could be missing out on critical data. And then we're talking about the solution, which is these new protocols for IPSC derived hepatocytes. And so you see the same sort of structure in this email as well, even though it's two completely different products and services. And then the same thing goes here, right. In this particular case, we're kicking it off with the problem right away, which is how are you dealing with the of your T cell leukemia lines, talking about the problem and then diving into how you can actually solve that problem. And one thing you've noticed probably with each of these is not once have we talked about or mentioned like our company name, right? We're talking about the approach that we take or the way that we can deliver the solution to their problem. So these are some examples of how this framework can be put together. And you'll notice they're all short, sweet, and they're easy to be read on a mobile device or fit on a screen. Okay, so now coming back to this particular these three numbers, we've got six, which is 80% of opportunities that were created in outbound sequences came after six touches. And then an additional 50% of opportunities came after 11 touches. And there's a 250% increase in reply rate when personalized versus templates. So point that we're making here is that you can't just send one email and move on. You have to use multiple touch points and you have to use personalization in order for your message to stand out. And so to do that you're going to use sequences. We're about out on time. But essentially sequences are a framework where you want to tell a quick story, solve multiple problems, you want to use multiple touch points and use multiple channels. So multiple channels, again, it might be a phone, email, LinkedIn, in person, events, direct mail, all sorts of different channels, but you want to use multiple channels to try and get through to someone. And the way you can structure these sequences is in bursts. So you focus on one problem, one topic, one value proposition per burst, and you then have multiple bursts that go over a period of time. So this solves the problem of needing to have 10 problem statements in one email or trying to solve it for five different application areas. Because you're just going to be dripping out this information over a period of time and then when one of those problems resonate with that individual, you're going to be able to get that reply. And so a couple examples of those follow up emails, you want to keep them short and sweet because you've done your time, you've done your, you've done the research already to personalize that first email. So you want to bump this back up that first email into their inbox. So things like, hey, any thoughts on this? Hey, but here's some more information on a quick video of me going through the data around this. Or hey, you can even include a screenshot in the follow up of some additional data. I think adding some additional context to that first email is what gives that second email a great reply rate. And we've actually seen over a bunch of emails that we've sent that the second email gets the best reply rate because it references the first one and adds additional context to it as well. And then when it comes to the value deposits, it's a great way to share something and expect nothing in return. You're just trying to give value to your prospect as much as possible. So you could say something like, is this an issue for you at the moment? Share a resource, a protocol, a case study, whatever it is that's going to help them solve it. But you want to be specific and call out the page or the minute or the paragraph or the area that you think is actually most relevant to them. Right? A lot of people can just send content, very few will actually call out specifically how and where that content is helpful. And that's the part that people will appreciate because it allows them to quickly go and learn that piece of information and consume that content. If you send a 20 page publication, somebody's probably not going to read the whole thing. But if you point them to page three about something very specific, they might just go there and read it. And then lastly, how do you actually improve your sequences is you want to create your standardized set of messaging. First AP test different angles, run it for 30 days, analyze the results, look at that qualitative feedback and then update the messaging based on what's working. And then now you have a new set of standardized messaging to continue forward with. And then if you need a tool to do all of this stuff, I highly recommend Apollo as it's a great tool for being able to find leads, find information, create your lists. You can also use it for sequencing so building these sequences that I just messaged mentioned. And it also integrates with LinkedIn, it's got a chrome extension. And so it's just a great tool that you can use to bring all of your prospecting under one roof and under one tool. All right, and I know we're up on time, but I do want to share. So we talked a lot about messaging today, but we also have launched a prospecting challenge. I think everybody that signed up here might have had a chance to see this, but it's essentially challenge succession bio. This is more of like the how of how you actually go about prospecting. So each day you get one email with one action over the course of 20 days that will say, hey, go do this thing. They're normally short and sweet and easy to do, but it'll be basically a way to take action on the information that you've learned here. So you have the messaging structures that you can use and then the prospecting challenge will be how you can then go apply that information. And then lastly, if anybody wants to go into any of this any further, come join Succession. We've got a bunch of other training courses, resources, we do live workshops and training and there's a bunch of other reps in the community as well. So come and join. And there is a seven day free trial for anybody that wants to give it a go. All right, that was what I had to present. What questions do we have?

There's one in the chat already. Are you sure about the 80%? We reach out to lab scientists on our opening date. Data shows most Use a computer at university and company emails. Yeah.

I mean, if you have that data, it's great. Yeah. Most people still have stuff on their phone as well. You know, a lot of people also use their mobile device for it, but if you have specific data that shows that most of them are being opened on a computer. Yeah, you can leverage that as well. But I would still say keep it short. Right. Because nobody still wants to sit and read an essay whether it's on their computer or on their mobile device. Yeah.

I think one of the quotes I like, we also run a podcast at Succession, and one of the guests we had on said, whenever you're reaching out to anybody, remember that you're interrupting their day to get your point across. And I think that's another reason to keep it short.

Right.

People don't want to take endless time reading that.

Yep. Any other questions on. On any of this stuff? Maybe Any other questions about other stuff related to Prospecting? Yeah. Okay. Six touch points over 30 days. You don't always have to make them all emails. Six touch points doesn't mean emails. It could be a LinkedIn connection as a touch point. It could be you give them a phone call. It could be showing up in person. It could be you connected with them for an event. All of these different touch points are. Don't need to be emailed.

Even commenting on their posts and stuff on LinkedIn. Not even just a connection or message, just subtle touch points.

Yeah. If. If they do post on LinkedIn. Yeah. That's another great thing that you can do.

Is there anything anyone wish was covered in this talk that Harrison gave? Because we can make sure he's added in the next time or as we go through the course.

Okay, this is a good one. So when you write your messaging, do you aim to make it specific to a group of people? 10, 20. I can imagine you can't really write such tailored messages to a hundred. Okay. There's a couple ways that I would think about this, which is, do they all have a similar problem that you can solve? If they all have a very similar problem, then what you're personalizing around is the information that you can gather about their company or them individually that makes that seem like they're a good fit for your product or service. You're not necessarily customizing a hundred emails word for word. What you might do is you might have your template that you start with that has the problem statement and the second part, which is the solution and the call to action. And then all you have to do then is Just find that piece of information on their company page. Maybe it's around one of the drugs that they're. That it's in their pipeline and maybe it's a cancer target. And so if that's relevant to you, you could call that out in your message as an example. And so that way you're just doing that one at a time. But you could do that for all of them pretty easily. And then add to that. What I would recommend is just do a little bit every day or you don't do a hundred all at once. Don't think about this as like this big ask of like I have to prospect like a hundred people today. Do it in bite sized pieces. If you do five a day or you start even with three a day for an entire week, you start to build this habit and then over time you'll be able to get faster and more efficient at it. So in that same hour that it used to take you five people, now you can do ten in that hour. And so that's what I would recommend. You got a couple more. If the product is not that special, let's say a centrifuge and not dedicated to a certain problem, how would you build messages to create brand awareness? I might. So it's interesting. This is obviously a tough one because there's not much differentiation to it. The way that I'm. You might have to figure this out is who are the people that need a centrifuge or need your specific centrifuge? Who are the groups that don't have them? Or maybe it's something when they're spinning up a new lab or opening a new location or whatever it is, that's when they need to buy that. So I would look at that as your like trigger event that says I'm going to reach out to this person because they fit this criteria that would need a centrifuge. Because I don't think you're going to be able to. I don't know, maybe it might be really tough to reach out to a broad audience about centrifuges because I'm guessing a lot of them probably have them already.

Yeah. To add on to that, I think the one thing you're looking to do here is make sure they want to reach out to you based on your messaging. If it's brand awareness as well. When they are ready to buy. Right. Because like you say, centuries and centuries, unless you've got something specific about yours or credibility around your name is going to be difficult. But if you've added Value in the process of your outbound. You've given them content specific for them. Maybe they culture a particularly hard to grow sale line and it's part of the process and you've given them a protocol for that. You've built credibility in yourself and you so they're likely to come back to you when they need advice on buying.

A. Charles, I might need you to give a little more context here, which is your question was what would your best advice to coach someone in this direction who currently has a very different style? I guess my question would be what style are they doing? Is it working? Is it not working? How do you know? Yeah, just trying to get a better understanding of how best to under to how best to respond here.

Yeah, no, thanks for that Harrison and thanks for the presentation. Very useful. A style which is essentially a bit more of an information dump like you were saying, a lot of the don'ts as opposed to the do's. That style almost fits more in the don'ts at the moment which is not receiving the response rate which is desired.

Yeah, I would think in that particular case it sounds like you already know that it's not getting the results. First step would be, okay, we're not seeing the results from this particular approach. Let's try something different. If you didn't have that data to say it's not working, I would say everybody here has probably been a scientist at some point. We love data. So if you show the data is not working, it should be clear that okay, we have to try something different. Whether that be you need to target different people, that you need to change the messaging, whatever it is, I would recommend doing that. The other thing that you could do is you yourself or other people could also take this approach, show that it's working and then use that as evidence to say, hey, this is another way for why you should change the messaging.

Indeed. Thanks that advice. Would you also be able to share the deck as well? So I have that as a tool at us, if that's all right. Thank you.

Yeah, we can do that.

Charles, quick question. Are they also kind of wed to the idea of volume sending lots of emails?

Indeed, yeah.

Yeah, I wondered if it was sort of a proxy problem as well. So normally people are wed to the issue because they think, well more people I get to, the more likely I am to get responses. So even if I get to a thousand, I'd still get some responses. You might in that scenario point out to people that actually every person you touch with low quality information is somebody you can't go back to. So to hit a hundred with high quality messaging like Harrison shown in the presentation would be better because you're still left with 900 to hit with quality when you get there as opposed to burning 900 and only getting a response from 100. Do you see what I mean?

Indeed.

And it's going on that journey of intensive R and D to get to understand your prospects a layer deeper to give them useful information as you said there. So no thank you. That's all good. Thanks.

I think the other thing that you can mention too is like a lot of the most useful information should come in the conversation that you have or post the interest that you generate. So it's like you don't need to give them every single thing about your product or service of what it does as like useful information before you've even piqued their interest. It's like the point of a cold email is to just get their interest. Then you can give them the information that they need later in the sales process. Because I would also say too, if you could just send. I don't like giving this example because I think it's harsh, but if I could write a template and send it to a thousand people, then I don't need like I don't need you as a rep. Right. Like I could do that. Automated I don't need you. You don't need to exist. So like you have to be. You have to basically like up level yourself to say, how can I be different than an automated bot that can push a button?

Yeah, definitely. And that's where the RNI piece is, what a bot can't do. So that's where that really comes in importance, isn't it? No.

Thank you.

Cheers champs. I'm gonna have to jump but really solve presentation.

Thanks. Any other questions while we have the rest of you here? No. All right, this was great. Thank you all for joining Asking questions. Hopefully this content was helpful. We'll go ahead and share the recording so you all have it and we'll also make sure you get access to the deck. And if you do want to jump into the prospecting challenge, it is just challenge succession bio. Awesome. Thanks everybody.

Thank you.