Money Mindset - Scarcity or Abundance?

Welcome to The In Between Podcast. I'm Astrid.

And I'm Alexis. And we're 2 best friends on a journey to living a fun, intentional life.

We know it's easier to share on a season of life once it's behind you, but what about when you're in the middle of the growth, confusion, and decision-making?

This lifestyle podcast is for the everyday gal who loves to travel, talk about business, relationships, fashion, and everything in between.

Welcome back to another episode of The In Between Podcast. Welcome to another episode of The In Between Podcast, friends. We're so happy you're here. I am one of your hosts, Astrid.

And I'm the other one, Alexis.

Today we are chatting about money. I am so excited about this.

Money, money, money, money.

We kind of eased into it in the last episode if you tuned into that one. And Alexis shared a little bit about her journey with No Spend September and kind of how that has taken off. And so we just figured we would dive a little bit deeper into that topic today.

Yeah. And we also had a couple episodes ago around negotiating your salary. If you have not listened to that one, 10 out of 10 recommend it. That one had a lot of, uh, a lot of downloads as well as, as well as the female friendships one. I think that's one of our top downloads, uh, from the past, uh, 4 or 5 episodes.

Yes.

But I noticed that the negotiating salaries was like right behind it. So yeah, if you haven't had a chance to listen to that specifically around Like money, you know, in the workplace, I definitely would go listen to that one. This is just going to be a little bit more like a little fun chat around personal finances, money mindset, business finances, and everything in between.

Oh, I was just thinking that. I hope you all enjoy our puns with our In Between podcast name.

Obsessed. Also, tell them, tell them what you just realized about The In Between. Okay, okay.

So I was posting about our episode this past week, and as you guys know, every Wednesday there's a new episode of the podcast. And so as I was posting, I realized that Wednesdays we are in between weekends, so we got to do something with that. I don't know, maybe some merch, maybe some mugs, maybe some— I don't know, pop into the DMs and give us your ideas.

On Wednesdays we listen to The In Between pod. Instead of on Wednesdays we listen or we wear pink. But yeah, I think that's really interesting. We didn't even plan that. We did not plan Wednesday in the middle of the week smack dab. Like, I hope that we are the breath of fresh air, the wind beneath your wings to get you through the rest of the week. We're that mid— we're like hump day. Think of Astrid and I.

I love it. Oh my gosh, we love you guys. Seriously, this has been so, so fun to create. And following along with our in-between theme, let's go ahead and do our wonderful thing of sharing what we feel that we are currently in between.

Let's do it. Okay. Do you want me to go first?

Yes. Okay.

Okay. I am in between figuring out— I feel like I have a very clear vision for For, and I'm actually going to give you a very specific example and then we can kind of like take a step back of how this could apply to you too. But I know I want to launch my membership community. I know I want to launch an online community that's not on Facebook, that's like private. And it's like, I know what I want to do. I know what it looks like. I think that I'm like, I am struggling with a bit of imposter syndrome of like, Is it going to be enough though? Like, is it going to be enough? Not even am I enough necessarily, but like, is what I'm creating going to be enough? Is it going to be valuable enough? Is it going to help them the way I hope it does? Like, there's all those little fears there. And I'm in between like working through that and just launching it, launching it imperfectly and just getting it out into the world. And if you are struggling with something like that in your life where you're like, the vision in your head feeling like it needs to be perfect and like what you're actually creating in reality is like, is it actually going to be what I have in my head? I feel like I'm kind of trying not to overcompensate and just sticking to like executing on the plan.

Yeah.

So yeah, I feel like I'm taking a lot of my own advice through this season. I feel like I am literally practicing what I preach and it's been very humbling.

It's very powerful to go through that. And it's also, I think as creatives and entrepreneurs, we are consumed, like we consume so much content from other entrepreneurs and creatives. And so we can tend to compare ourselves to them. We're like, this is the standard. And then in reality, like we already have so much to offer people and we're like, oh, but they're offering this in their program. And I'm not saying that that's happening to you, but just in general, like—

Right.

We are reaching higher, but really where we're at right now is going to be so beneficial to those around us. And I struggle with the same thing. And I heard once, it might have been you who told me this, that if you— here's some of your advice back to you.

Let's hear it.

But if you know at least 10% more than other people, Then you should create that content and you should go ahead and launch the product, launch the course and do the thing because you are qualified. And I think that was you.

That was my advice. Yes.

Well, there's your advice returning back, circling full circle.

Full circle. Yeah, I feel that. It's like trusting in the process and doing the daily steps to getting there. Yeah, I am. That's what I'm in between right now. And it's a good thing. It's just in the middle of it right now. What about you?

For me, I feel like I am in between. I have a lot of new things popping up in my life and just being able to balance everything, like new work opportunities, new contracts I didn't expect on the marketing front, and just a lot of Um, exciting aspects of life. And so just learning how to navigate that, learning how to say no too. I've realized I've volunteered a bit too much of my time in other aspects too. And so just really trying to create some focus so that I'm able to, um, yeah, really put my time and energy into the areas that I want to continue growing in.

Yeah, I— that, and that can be really tough whenever you're in between like almost seasons of like I'm in this, like, I was in the— you're almost like stepping into a different pace.

Yes.

Where it's like, okay, I've been operating at this pace in this capacity and now I'm like, oh, okay, my pace is quickening. And I feel this, like, it's like, do I want my pace to quicken?

Yeah.

Like, what happens to my mental health if my pace is like— like, what happens to my physical health? Like, I feel like it's trying to look at all the things you value and like, am I able to fit them all on my calendar? Yeah.

And I think it's a change of seasons, pun intended. But as the season changes, it's almost like I have to reevaluate, okay, what worked in the last season? Do I still carry that through to the next one? Because I'm okay with the faster pace, but I just think I need a more narrow focus and I need to let go of a few other things. And yeah, I just think it's I'm in a change of seasons right now, and I would love to share a little bit more on that later on, but just really learning how to navigate that change, literally in between.

Speaking of seasons, what are you most excited about for fall? What's your fall basic, like, this is what I have to do in the fall time?

Oh, okay. To be honest, as a photographer, I work so much during the fall. So I don't really get to enjoy as much of it as I want to. Like, I haven't been to a pumpkin patch in like 2 to 3 years.

Blasphemy.

I know, I know, because it's always on the weekends and then I'm shooting on the weekends. But in general, I would say just like a picnic outside, like spending some time outside is my favorite thing, just enjoying The colors. I love to just like soak in nature. So that's like my, my go-to.

What about you? Definitely the, the pumpkin patch. I don't think that we're gonna go to one. However, oh my gosh, this weekend I can't wait to tell you how it is. I'll try to remember to tell you on the pod, but we're hosting Matthew's parents this weekend.

Oh yes.

And we're gonna go to the Renaissance Festival. Oh, I've been to one. Houston has one of like the biggest Renaissance festivals in the country.

Oh wow.

It's like an hour outside of the city. It's like massive. And I'm really excited about being outside each weekend of the— and also the Renaissance Festival in Houston is 2 months long.

Oh my gosh, that's quite the festival.

It's like 2 months and it's only on the weekends. And then each weekend has a different theme. So I'm very excited. So I feel like festivals, like things like that that make me feel like we're outside, it's not hot. I'm excited about that.

Yeah. It's too cold in the fall, so I'm like shaky.

It's trade places. I'm kidding. Um, also soup. Oh, that's a hard left, but soup.

Hard left.

Yeah, a soup. I'm a soup girly, and I— as soon as it starts to become fall, even a couple weeks ago I made soup even though it was like in the 90s because it's fall in the Midwest. My body, my body clock is, is like, it's fall, it's time for some soup.

And I'm sweating out here, but I'm drinking the soup.

Literally, those are my favorite fall things. So yeah, soup and being outside festivals.

Love it, love it. Our soup girly.

Yes. All right, let's talk about cash money. El dinero, el dinero.

What is that song?

Dinero or she take my dinero?

And you've totally sang this in a different podcast before, the salary one.

Oh yeah.

I'm just living the same life over and over again. That's amazing.

I like that that's actually my default response when you say dinero though. I just immediately start singing that song. It's like a little wind-up doll. Oh my gosh.

I hope you all are enjoying our conversation right now. Okay. Let's chat money. Do we— I'm kind of thinking we go ahead and split up the convo between entrepreneurship, Money talk and then personal money talk. Which one do you want to start with?

I'm cool to start with the personal, and then maybe like we can start with just money mindset in general and how that trickles into like personal finances and business finances—all of it.

Okay.

Yeah.

Where do you feel like your money mindset is at right now?

Well, it's better than it was. I'm doing better. I am doing so much better with my money mindset. I think, um, you know, in my early 20s, it was very much like we are just thankful to get whatever we can from a salary, from a job, or even like from influencer stuff or anything, anything side hustle related. It was just like, I am thankful to get paid. And I think something shifted for me in my mid-20s when I started to build my expertise, when I started to see my value. Started to recognize my worth and see how much living a life really costs, right?

Yes.

Like, we're not just taking what we get. We need to ask for what we want. And that was a big shift for me in my mindset. But I think money mindset is not just about earning money. It's also how you steward and spend and save money. So that's what I'm learning. I think I've always been good at earning money. Like, sure, I will charge what I need to charge. I'll negotiate a salary, a salary increase, whatever. But when it comes to like the— my money mindset around spending, around saving, that's where I'm really stretched right now and doing some inner healing work on making that just not so tense. I just— it just tenses up my body when I think about it.

Yeah. Yeah. What about you? So good. That's so good. I definitely relate to that. A lot. I think for me, I don't know. There's so many layers to it. For me, I tend to be more on the conservative side when it comes to money, and really what I've realized in the past few years is I grew up in an environment where finances fluctuated a whole ton. My dad was an entrepreneur, and so there was extreme highs. And very low lows. And I think I've shared this on the pod before, but my dad unexpectedly passed whenever I was 11. And so finances— he was like the primary provider. And so finances changed drastically as well at that point. And so it's just always been this thing for me of like, I don't know when the next shoe's going to drop. And so I just need to be prepared because you never know when— Something's gonna drop, and while that might sound like good, let's be conservative on the money. I almost held the money way too tight to where I really, especially in my business, but I really was holding myself back from growing and spending that money. And then in my entrepreneurship journey, it took me way longer than I needed to because I realized. That I had— I felt a sense of safety from that solid income from my full-time job, which is very normal. But for me, it was like a deep sense of safety.

Mm-hmm.

And so I really had to work through that emotionally and be like, okay, like, I can be creative enough to find something else. And if I need to, I can apply for a different job. But ultimately, my security cannot be in a specific job, not even in my business, not even in me. It's just like knowing that there's an abundance is very important. So that's kind of where I've been. And I feel like I'm in a healthier mindset now about 6 months into entrepreneurship. And just really learning that things are going to happen in life and I just need to focus on what I can control, being smart about it. Still have some habits to clean up for sure. I love to shop. Your girl loves to shop. But yeah, that's kind of where I'm at.

I think a lot of my dad, both my parents had steady incomes throughout my childhood. And there were some times in my early years where my parents would be kind of in between jobs. And I watched them have a bit of mailbox anxiety where like, Either not necessarily avoiding the mailbox, but avoiding opening the mail sometimes. And I, I saw that manifest whenever I was in Nashville. Matthew, he and I have been together for a long time, and I remember him seeing like a box full of unopened mail, like important things like student loans and car payments and things like that, bank stuff from my bank. And he would sit down and he's like, we're gonna open these together. Because I literally— my nightmare. I was like, don't you want to go have fun? You're here, you're here to love me and go have fun with me. Like, not open my mail. Open my mail. But genuinely, like, one of the most loving things. And he's kind of helped me see that. Um, one, like, I, I noticed where it came from. I was like, oh yeah. And it wasn't my whole childhood. I'm talking like a short season of my childhood. And somehow I internalized that. And then as an adult, I was like, uh, opening mail, that means I gotta like pay things. And like, I don't know, it's not that I didn't even have the money. I just would avoid, avoid, avoid.

Mm-hmm.

So that was an interesting like thing from childhood into now. And then the other one is like the emotional spending of like, oh, we're experiencing something hard. Let's spend money. Or, uh, we've had a bad day. Let's spend money. Or I've worked hard. I earned this. Let's go spend money, and that's very much a part of like what I am trying to rewrite right now. Is it's not that I'm not working hard; it's not that I don't deserve it. It's that is this actually the best use of my money? And and and why am I spending it? Like what's the emotion behind it? So I think I kind of unraveling some of those old tendencies from my early twenties and into things that I even saw sometimes as a kid, just figuring out like how can I create. A healthy way to navigate this now as an adult that's almost 30.

Yes. Yes. I love what you mentioned about that emotional awareness when it comes to money. And I think that's something I would invite everyone to kind of be a little bit more thoughtful about. It's like, okay, whenever you feel overwhelmed or whenever you feel anxious, what's that instinct? Because I relate to that so much. I also will do things where I will get certain things done at work and I'll be like, okay, if I get X amount of projects done by noon, I'll go treat myself to coffee. And then I'll do that every day and that adds up.

Sometimes I'll even do a— I won't even do a celebration treat. I'll do a pre-treat where I'm like, oh, I'm going to do something hard. I'm going to be working on this thing. Let me just go ahead and reward myself before I do it by buying something, usually in the form of coffee or like a pastry, which is fine.

Yes. And it's like, I—

it's this like the pre-celebration. The, the, the celebration part around money for me is really interesting. And like into, you know, booking trips as a celebration or any sort of heightened emotion. Like, oh, we're going through like a hard season, booking a trip. Oh, this like really amazing thing happened in my life. Oh, booking a trip. And so it's like detaching those. And that's actually something that I have done and I am proud of that. But yeah, just, I mean, I would literally, I'll never forget this. I am exposing myself. Okay. Here we are. Okay. I'm 25. I'm in Denver visiting Matthew and we're at this Really cute boutique, and I was like, "Oh my gosh!" Shopping. Okay. Swipe my card. Declines. I'm like, "Okay, try this. Just try it again." Declines. So I am like, get out my credit card. Love that, right? Put on a credit card, and it works because it's credit card. Right. But Matthew was with me, and he's like, "What's going on?" And I was like, "I don't know. I just got paid." You know. So what happened? So I go back to my account and I had— I, at that point, I was really, really good about savings. Like I would transfer $400 to $500 of every single paycheck into my savings account. So at that point I had had maybe $5,000 or $6,000 in my savings account, but my, but my spending in my debit account, my checking I had overdrafted. I ended up paying $750 in overdraft fees when I had $5,000 to $6,000 in my savings account. All I had to do was transfer it over. But because I was so scared of looking at my financials, I avoided checking. I avoided logging into my bank accounts. Like, that was the very first time in my adult life I was like, I actually have a problem. Like I have a real something's like going on with me when it comes to this, and that that night Matthew and I sat and this is like thanks Matt. This is like what is coming up in this episode. Thank you to my husband Matthew. In conclusion, thank you Matthew. Yeah. Also find you a partner that doesn't freaking shame you about it. He's always been so lovely about it, but he's like let's sit down and maybe we could download the app Mint.

On your phone. I was just gonna mention that.

Literally, we downloaded Mint, and then I would get notifications of like spending and things, and I would be savage. Yeah, I would be able to like bucket my different spending habits and form a budget, and that genuinely helped me up until we got married. That like couple of years there where I was like, okay, I need to figure this out, and I was able to save money for our wedding. Like it that like turn of events was really helpful, but it took that kind of embarrassment of like. Wow, I overdrafted, paid so much money in fees when all I had to do was just log into my account and transfer over some money. Like, so that is like where I'm coming from with this episode of like my money mindset isn't around the earning, it's around looking at it after it's in my account.

Yeah, yeah, for sure. I think like so many of us fall into that same category of avoidance. For me, I will look at my stuff often But when I'm in a season of overwhelm or like specifically very emotionally overwhelmed, I will avoid it and I will spend, which is double, double whammy.

I don't even know how much I'm spending and I'm spending a lot.

Yes. Yes. I don't do— I haven't done that in a while. I feel like it's been more than a year since I've done that, which is great, but I definitely relate in like those very emotional lows. I'm like, all right, um, Nasty Gal. Oh my gosh, I would get so many packages from Nasty Gal. It's crazy.

I remember Jansen would be like, every day. Jansen's Astrid's old roommate. She'd be like, every day is another package. I get it.

Yeah, yeah. But I, I think it's just interesting, um, especially now that you mentioned like the Mint app. If anyone's curious, I personally love it because it gives you a good overview If you have multiple accounts too, and you have assets like you own a house or you own a car and you have a 401, I love getting the high-level view in one snippet. And I literally check it probably every 2 days or so. Um, and then, so it tells you your net worth, which is great. And then it accumulates all your debt in one. And so just seeing that big number rather than the small accounts, you're a little bit more mindful. And then you compare that to your cash and you're like, okay, I gotta like balance this out. Yeah. Um, it's also a funny savage app because it will accumulate all your spending. And so for example, I'll send you an email and be like, Astrid, this month you have spent $500 on coffee. You are in the 1% compared to other mentors. Oh no. This is just an example. Obviously that's not the specific numbers. Yeah. But it will run those numbers for you and compare you to others. And you're like, all right, geez, I spent a lot. Comparative shame.

Yeah, it'll like send me notifications. I just actually, through like my no-spend month in September, I wanted to focus on how to— and I'm trying to figure out where I want to do another no-spend actually. It's like, where do I want to— I want to do another one, but it's also like leading into Christmas.

Yeah.

And I'm like, I just, I don't know. So I'm trying to figure out where that would fit in for me. But, um, for my no-spend, it was specifically around online shopping, clothes, Like accessories, miscellaneous stuff. It's like, do I really need this? Um, and Mint would like send me notifications of like, you haven't spent, you know, or in the past it would be like, you've spent, um, a lot on this, this, and this. And it's like, okay, I don't know, it's just a nice check-in of knowing when you are more avoidant, having those push notifications on, very helpful.

For sure, for sure. I also think like Um, some practical tips too of things that have helped me is whenever I'm— I've avoided and I feel anxious, I realize that anxiousness comes from not having clarity. So I think for me, so much peace comes from really looking at all of it. And so personally, I like to have at least 6 to 8 months of my expenses, personal, saved up, and I do not touch that. And then on top of that—

Fixed.

Fixed. Yeah, for sure. And then on top of that, I have extra savings too. Um, just because personally, like, I own a house. Things happened to me this past spring that if I wouldn't have had that savings, it would have been really tough. So just kind of evaluating what are the things that you're responsible for? Like, do you own a car? Is the car newer or older? Um, if it's older, you might need to like fix it, fix it or repair it soon. Um, what are your expenses? And then from there, figuring out your savings amount. And then after that, then, okay, now I have this money left per month. How much do I want to allocate to everything? What do I want to save for? Save for a trip, things like that.

And being able to like, what do I want to invest in? Am I, am I putting money in my 401, my Roth IRA, SEP IRA, depending on if you're a business owner? Yeah, it is really helpful to have that mental clarity. It's also too when you know what your vision is for your life, you can start to figure out, okay, if I want to live this kind of life, this kind of lifestyle, what what finances? What would my financial situation need to be for me to live that kind of lifestyle? So whenever I was in Nashville, I actually had a very clear vision of wanting to own a home. Just like the one that Matthew and I bought. I wanted it to look like this. I wanted it to be two levels. I wanted the high windows. Like I started, I guess you could say manifesting this house when it got to a point where Matthew and I needed to save for this kind of house, and we had to make certain sacrifices to be able to put aside money, save money for this kind of house. And I think it's like tying. What you value and tying like the vision of what you want your life to look like to your spending habits and to your saving habits. Like, and I also think that ego can play a really big role in how we spend our money. And again, I'll just lay my neck out so you can chop my head right off. I feel like this is a very exposing episode. I'm like, sorry for the graphic details, but it's like I want a new car and I want it to be like a Range Rover or I want it to be like a luxury vehicle. Nothing wrong with that. Nothing wrong with wanting that. Do I need that right now? No, I don't. Is my car— is, you know, it's going on, it's just over 9 years old and it has 110,000 miles on it. And we bought it new, you know, 9 years ago. And it's been great. Cecilia, she's a Toyota RAV4, love her to death. Right now we have Matthew's car payment and we'll have his car payment for another 4 years. And so, like, he and I sat down and I was like, you know what? This ego of wanting to have a luxury car, I'm like, I want it. I've got the job. I've got the business. Like, we've got the house. I should have a nice car. You know, I should have a nice car. It's like my ego was coming in and being like driving my behavior forward. And I needed to step back and realize, okay, I recognize that I want this vehicle. I recognize why. I'm okay with that, but I'm also needing to shift the pace around making the decision so that it actually makes sense financially. So we don't need to have 2 car payments over $1,100.

Yes.

I mean, come on. So it's like that, seeing that so clearly, I was like, all right, well, we're going to put the car, we're going to put buying me a new vehicle to the side for a couple of years now, and we're going to drive that baby into the ground. Yes. She's a great vehicle, and like just moving on. And now it's not even something that I even financially think about anymore. And it's like, what are those things in your own life that are kind of driven by ego or driven by the season of life that you're in? It's like, oh well, now I have this, so I need this. It's a complementary good. It's like, oh, I've got this, this, and this. Now I need this. It's like, okay, do you really need it? And where does it really fit into your financial goals? And If you didn't have it, what does it say about you? You know, it's okay. It's like, if I don't have the luxury vehicle, you know, who cares? Right? Besides me. Right. Yeah. Which is okay.

Yeah, it's wise that you were, and so great that you were able to come to that now before you got into the car payment rather than like realizing it when you're in the middle of it and being like, oh dang, like this is the situation. And so that's so powerful. I relate to it so much because whenever I bought the house, I felt like I wanted to fix everything at once. I wanted to paint everything. I wanted to update everything. And part of it was like, oh, people are coming over. And so that ego of like, I want to have everything put together. And my, I guess, tendency to be like, I'm a strong independent woman. I figured it out on my own because I owned the house by myself. I'm like, okay, I'm gonna show that I don't need help.

Yep.

And then I caught that feeling. I was like, you know what? No, we're gonna pace ourselves. We're gonna buy things one step at a time, one room at a time. I've been here for like a year and a half almost, and I still haven't finished other rooms. And that's okay because it's like you have to look at your finances and be— and just overall say, okay, I own a house though. Like it in itself is a great investment. Where else can I move my money to?

Yeah.

And that's one thing that I've really learned in the past year is like really identifying what are some of those things that will make you more money and some of those things that are like sunk and other things that I find valuable that might not make me any money and that's okay, but it impacts my mental health or my environment. And, um, I mean, I'm obviously not a financial advisor, but just passing along what I heard. You're not? Um, but this was really— it gave me some clarity for that vision that you were kind of talking about too. Um, I guess as someone who likes to save a lot, I'm like, okay, at what point do I stop saving? Or like, do you just keep saving? Because I keep hearing this thing of like, you know, your money sitting in the bank is just going to depreciate type of thing. And so what I've heard from multiple people is you should have about 8 months to a year, whatever you feel is the most comfortable, that if something were to happen, you have enough time to adjust. And then from that on, you have kind of like operating cash flow, right? And then from there, you should really be saving to invest because that's how you make your money grow. And so being able to categorize into those 3 3 things rather than I was looking at as instead of the investing money, I was just spending it on trips and fun things. I'm like, okay, well, I've got my savings down. This is what it like— I'm, you know, the responsible thing of like every paycheck, this is what goes into my savings, is what goes into my lifestyle, and then there's just the rest. So I'm like, let's do fun things. So being able to be specific about it and say, okay, I'm gonna take this much for a house project and then the rest just keep saving So that when an opportunity happens, I can take that.

Yeah.

And just kind of taking it back to, I feel like COVID taught us a lot of how much things can change drastically. So if you're feeling a little bit maybe overwhelmed about the conversation around money, just kind of knowing, like taking it one step at a time and really tackling it little by little, but then kind of keeping that big vision of the more that you look at it, the more clear that you are, The more prepared that you might be for any unforeseen circumstances like COVID that hit us.

Yeah. Yeah. And it, yeah, feeling, feeling secure in that. And I do think like where your living expenses are and your lifestyle, like some people don't have a salary where they have a whole lot of extra. And so figuring out other ways that you can earn that income, um, can be really helpful. Or maybe you're, you lower your, Your living costs is another one too, depending on like what your savings goals are and or like paying off debt. Another really good documentary that I highly recommend is Get Smart with Money on Netflix. It just came out a couple of weeks ago. Matthew and I watched it and we used it like a neutral tool to like talk through. It was budgeting, student loans. Investment and retirement. Those are like the 4 categories of the documentary. And we, it took us like 3 hours to watch an hour and 20-minute documentary because we stopped and we talked about like our own plans and what we thought and how we wanted to spend. And, um, that can be a really helpful exercise for yourself, or if you have a partner to be able to talk about those things together and trying to look at money habits within your partnership and how that can really impact each other too. Like Matthew is also very conservative with money, doesn't really buy himself things. I swear to God, I have like most of the things in his closet are things that we've either purchased together or that I have bought him. He just doesn't— that's not the way that he likes to spend his money. Matthew just invests money. That's how he— like, that's what he likes to do with it.

So we need Matthew to teach us.

I know, I know. I'm like, um, but he looks fly though, and so do I. So, okay, I love it. But it's like figuring out how to navigate that together. And so like, I— there are benefits to my spending habits and there are benefits to his spending habits. And like looking at the ways that we can work together as a team through that instead of pointing fingers Can be really, really helpful. Something that, like from a personal finance perspective, if you're you know married or you know whatever your relationship status is, this is something that I actually heard of for the first time from one of my friends. Her name's Haley. I used to work with her at ConvertKit. Her and her husband did a split with their finances, like with their paycheck. So for Matthew. And I, 80% of our paycheck goes into the family account, and 20% of our paycheck goes into our personal accounts. And so we have personal money, and that's where I plan trips with Astrid, and that's where I shop from, and that's where like anything that I just want that's not for the family, I just buy. And then there's no conversation around it. You know, I've got to hold my own self accountable, right? We've Clearly already experienced that through this podcast episode, but then like our family expenses are tight. Like because we're you get I feel like you you skim off the foam by not ha like we don't have arguments about money because I'm not using our personal money to go on a shopping spree or to book a or to book a trip with my best friend. Like and I think that's really helped us navigate. Being in a relationship, um, together because we have those clear boundaries around our money.

Yeah. And transparency with each other too. Yeah. With that, I love that. That's such great and unique advice too for anyone that's in a couple, um, and you have a house together and you share spaces and share expenses to just have one account because it just makes it so much easier because you're both using that specific thing. Yeah.

Yeah. And every, everyone does what works for them. Some people have completely split accounts, like totally up to you. But it was about finding a path where I still felt like I had independence over my money. And there were seasons where sometimes the split is 70/30. And right now we're in a season where it's 80/20 because of like buying the house and like just needing more income going into the family account.

Mm-hmm.

Um, but that was really, really helpful for us to like figure out a system that worked for us.

Yeah, I love that. Um, one last thing. I know that we have quite a few college students that follow us, or people who have recently graduated college. And I was just thinking back to like my time in college. Finances were extremely tight. I was paying for school, I had some scholarships, and then I was working. And so basically for me, I had a very strict budget. And so somebody had gifted me a financial class. And before that financial class, I thought I would have to take out loans to be able to pay for school. Now granted, like people do have to, but personally in my case, it would have been a small loan. And then this financial class that I was gifted, I was like, well, let me take this first. I took it. I looked at my expenses and I realized if I cut out all pretty much any fun money or most of it, I was going to be able to pay for college per semester and not have to take out a loan. And so that was my personal story because I did have scholarships and I just needed a little bit more each quarter. But the overall lesson that that taught me is at that time, if you would've asked me, I would've said, no way can I pay for school. I can't afford it. But actually looking at my bank statements and adding up that amount made me realize I had a lot more than I thought I did. And so just really inviting you to sit down, look at your money, add up your expenses and see where is your money going will give you maybe some freedom and then just some clarity on perhaps like what you need to save towards based on your goal, based on paying for school, paying for loans, etc.

Yeah, that's great advice. Thank you for sharing that. I feel like, um, we're all coming from different places with finances and it also shows like the privilege, the financial privilege. I feel like that's something that I personally want to talk about is like my parents paid for the majority of my college and helped me with finances in college so that I could be a student. And then in the summers I took internships. And they were paid. So like I got to have that money and I started a business in college, which helped me make money, but I didn't have that financial anxiety through college. And I feel like that's a massive privilege to walk into my career at 22 with under $10,000 of student debt. Like at that point, my, my parents had paid for the majority of my school and I had a really small student loan I needed to pay off. And it, I think like even everything with like student loan forgiveness right now, I just think that it's really helpful to come from a place of not needing to have that anxiety. And that's just not the reality for the majority of people.

Yes.

And, um, I think that's where some of like my own goals is like, okay, we need to steward this money well. We're not stewarding it well.

Yeah, that's so good that you mentioned that because I think for me, I went through such a tough financial time through high school and then through college, trying to pay every semester, wondering if I would have enough to pay for school and having that extreme anxiety that then now, as I moved on to salary jobs and everything, it was almost like I was swung to the other side and I'm like, oh, now I can get all those things that high school Astrid wanted. Now I can shop without having to budget this to a T or being like, I can't afford that. I can only get these things. And in a weird sense, I've caught myself before that I've been doing things for what I would've wanted before. And so now I've kind of come to a middle point that is healthy where I'm not, I guess, buying out of what I didn't get and just kind of come to peace with what my story was and my journey was. But it's very interesting, the relationship between not having anything and then once you have some, then you like overspend and then getting that guilt of not stewarding the money well.

Yeah. There's actually a statistic in the NFL of people that get out of the NFL end up, um, I think it was like 75% of them end up in financial trouble because they had this massive influx of cash and there's not necessarily training on how to manage that money. Right. And then they get out of the NFL because that's a very short, obviously a very short career. Like you can't do that for decades of your life. And so then it's like figuring out how to steward it well. So I think that's where I'm at is like, okay, having the privilege of not having the financial anxiety and not having debt besides like our house and our rental house. And like, again, those are privileges to buy the house. privileged to have real estate. So it's like, well, I'm in a place now of like the emotional side of the responsibility of wanting to like do the right thing. The right thing can mean a lot of different things to different people, but to me it looks like, like stewarding that well. And then on the business front, like shifting gears— did you have anything else to add on that? No, I didn't. Okay, um, shifting gears to the business front, like stewarding that well, keeping track of everything. And a big thing that helped me was Hiring a, um, an accountant whenever I started Deeper Life who would really help me understand the importance of tracking every little single thing, putting it in a spreadsheet. Because one, that helps with how much you have to pay in taxes as a business owner, but it also helps you see, like, I would go through and audit my finances and I'm like, oh, I'm paying subscriptions for your business is what really like will add up of like, oh, I'm paying for this and this and this for all these different elements of my business. How can I consolidate? How can I use one tool instead of 3? Um, and I think that financial visibility into where your money is going can really give you some, some clarity on how you might want to make different decisions.

Yes, for sure. Honestly, I think as an entrepreneur, finances and taxes overall can be extremely intense and overwhelming. And I have been to a point where there was times I almost had a true anxiety attack from taxes because you work really hard and you make this money and then suddenly it's like, oh, you owe this much amount for taxes. What the heck? And so I did the same thing. I hired an accountant and then now it's more on the proactive sense. So I have a meeting next month with him to just kind of see where we're at for the year. And if I need to reevaluate before the year closes. But that's something that not a lot of people tell you. It's like, yeah, you might be charging, you know, $100 for your service, but then like $20 or $30 or $40 depends goes to taxes, and then you have expenses, and then you have to pay yourself. And then it's like all these little things that, which is why we're so passionate about supporting small businesses. But really getting someone to help you to take that off your plate, that is, that knows all the laws, knows all the rules, you can just delegate it out and not overwhelm yourself with that, is so worth the money, so worth the investment.

I completely agree. And caveat to that is making sure that you work with someone that you really trust and that has your best interest and that takes time to educate you as you're, as you're moving through your business. You're hiring an expert to help you understand taxes and finances and profit and loss. And like, those are things that you're going to be learning as you go, right? And you want to work with someone who is going to open the door to educate you in that process instead of washing your hands of it or being condescending. Matthew and I had a meeting with a potential financial advisor, and this was Two years ago, and this was right after I had quit my job at ConvertKit to start my own business, and I was doing really, really well. I had like really solid contracts. It was like feeling really, really good. And we were explaining Matthew's work situation of like, okay, he he's going to be working abroad. He got a salary increase because of his role. Da da da da. And the guy obviously was a guy. He looked at me and he's like. So you're just going to kind of be like hanging out while he's abroad?

No.

Yeah. Uh-huh.

Oh my gosh.

And I was like, first off, if I wanted to hang out, that's totally fine. If I chose to, you know, be at the house and be our— the house— whatever you want to call it, like a homekeeper and not work, there's nothing wrong with that. But it was the way that he said it, like the condescending nature of it. Where I was like, no, actually, I'm gonna hit over six figures this year. Thanks. And I was I was like pissed jerk. Yeah, and it's like little like comments like that from financial professionals who are supposed to be helping you. Be really mindful. Be mindful of that and make sure that you really trust them and that you feel like you can ask any question under the sun, and they're not going to make you feel. Um, you know, judged or criticized for it.

Yeah, for sure. I have asked my accountant so many quote unquote dumb questions, and he's been so graceful in answering all of them and in depth and just being like, oh no, yeah, like that's a valid point. And I, because of that, because he's so open to even like the silliest questions, I'm like, I feel comfortable asking him anything. And that's the relationship that you should have because it's your money. It's there's a lot of legality around it too. You want to make sure things are ran well. Um, and one thing that I did want to share too with entrepreneurship is the importance of stewarding your money well so that you have enough savings or enough cash flow to then invest to grow your business. Like the reality is at some point you're going to have to, you know, you're going to grow and you're going to need a team or outsource certain items. And at first you're wearing all the hats, but really that growth happens and that massive growth happens when you can delegate some of that stuff that, um, yes, you can do and yes, you're good at, but it's not essential for you to do and delegate it out. And then you can really focus in your zone of genius and the things that really only you can do that truly bring the company more revenue. And I think the most beautiful part about that is not necessarily the bringing in more revenue. It's that now you can employ people or you can work with other people and outsource them and support their graphic design business or their website design business or photo business and work together. And money is truly such a powerful tool if you know how to use it well. And I think that if you're someone that likes to have that leadership and wants to have impact, being able to generate something that now you can Use your dollars to support certain organizations, certain businesses, is just such a privilege and such a gift to be able to do that.

Yeah, I agree. And even speaking of like where you spend your money, um, you do vote with your dollars too. Like where you put your money matters, the companies that you give it to. And you can go as deep into that as you want, but that is something that I've really started to think more about as well. And even like with everything with fast fashion and trying to decide where I— like, do my values around that actually match the way that I'm spending money?

Mm-hmm.

And making sure that there's like congruency and real alignment there, um, has been something that's like been on my heart for a long time, like wanting to buy more from more sustainable brands and wanting to be more mindful of Plastic and just all of that. Like, oh, I see a company doing something that's really mindful of the environment. Oh, I want to support them and trying to bring the values into the way that I spend.

Yeah, I love that. I think for me, I noticed in the past 6 months that I've been working with more small businesses on like marketing consulting. I have shifted my spending, even if I have to spend a little bit more, to spend that locally or with a small business, even if it's a virtual business. Because I realize as entrepreneurs how much time and effort goes into the business, how much of it goes into taxes and what it takes. And I just feel like there is so many talented people and I would hate to see them just not thrive because I'm not getting that that business. And I'm obviously just one customer, but I think just really being mindful of where we spend our dollars, like you were saying, that is support and it really does carry a lot of weight. And, um, yeah, it's something to, to really think through is the locations you spend your money, not just the amount.

Yeah. It's like being intentional with it. Um, intentionality in all aspects of finances. Um, this has been great. I have really enjoyed this convo. Is there anything else you'd like to add before we wrap up?

Um, not really, not really. I think that this conversation could go in a million different ways. I think we covered a good, a good chunk of it, and I'm sure in a different time we'll revisit it. But I think it's just really interesting how money mindset can change so much through your 20s. Yeah, from the conversation that we've shared today, like Early 20s, mid-20s, and then now. So I love kind of touching base on that.

Me too. And if if you're in a place where you're listening and you're not really sure where you where you land on all of this, maybe journal or think through like how do I feel about money? Do I feel more abundant towards it? Like I know it's coming for me, and I like there are limitless ways I can earn it. Or is it more scarcity? You want to hold on to it. You feel like you're never going to have enough. And how does, how do those mindsets influence your behavior, your spending, your saving? And that's a really great place to start. I'm not even asking you to go and log into your bank account and print off your, you know, your balance sheet. Like, I think it really does start with our habits and our mind and our emotions around it. And then that influences the behavior, but we can't expect behavioral change if we don't go to the root, which is the mind.

Yes.

Spend a little bit of time figuring out your mindset around it, figuring out where you land with it. And let us know. Let us know if this episode resonates with you. Astrid and I are always bringing up topics that either come up naturally because we're both navigating them in our own lives, or topics that you have suggested. So thank you so much for the community that we're in. Thank you for being here. Thank you for listening. We wouldn't continue doing this if it weren't for you. And if this episode or this podcast in general resonates with you, please leave us a review. They make our day. They help with the algorithm into the cloud and the space. It just, it just helps. So leave us a 5-star review or whatever you feel. And follow us on Instagram @theinbetween.pod. We love whenever you tag us whenever you're listening, and I love continuing the conversation with you there. If you'd like to follow me personally, you can do that at Alexis Teichmiller.

Or you can follow me @astrejohannaphoto.

All right, friends, thank you for being here for another episode of The In Between Pod, and we will see you next week.