Pricing With Confidence: Money Mindset, Worth, and Raising Your Rates

Welcome to The In Between Podcast, a show for women navigating the space between where they are and where they want to be.

This is your go-to holistic business podcast where we dive into strategies, mindset, habits, and of course, making a meaningful income so you can live your dream life.

I'm Astrid, a multi-six-figure luxury wedding photographer and a former corporate marketing girly.

And I'm Alexis with 10+ years in tech as a senior brand partnerships manager and business coach. Think of us as your business besties cheering you on as you level up. Let's get into it. Hello and welcome back to another episode of The In Between Podcast. This is one half of the pod, Alexis.

And the other half, Astrid. We are so excited to be back today because we are going to be chatting all about money and pricing, and more specifically, the psychology behind our pricing. And I'm so excited for this conversation because as creatives, a lot of times we We'll master a skill and a service that we're offering, and then we have to deal with all these other business things, including the pricing aspect. And it can be hard to decide how much to charge, or as you're growing, how to continue to charge more and not feel guilty about it, and how to accept that you deserve more when it comes to pricing. So we're going to be diving into all of that today. Um, but first, let's do a little bit of life updates.

Yes, yes. I'm really looking forward to this conversation because I know that we've both worked on this. We've worked on it with clients. And so we hope that this is meeting you exactly where you need it today. All right. First up, life updates. It's my birthday week. So very, very excited. I have Astrid and Jess and Kate flying in, and then we're going to meet up with some of my Houston girlfriends and we're just going to have such a fun girly pop weekend. I literally sent them a note with an itinerary of the weekend and it's labeled Girly Pop Birthday Weekend. So I'm just really looking forward to having some quality time with my girlfriends. And as all of you know, like it's a very busy time. Like you're building your business, you're living your life. And I'm in that like thick of a busy season. And there's nothing like being with my people that is very grounding to me. And I just can't wait to see you and squeeze you. I haven't seen you in months. So really looking forward to that. And then on the career side, um, yeah, I'm headed to Silicon Valley. The— when you're listening to this, I will probably be on a plane to Silicon Valley, uh, flying into San Francisco, driving down, and then I'm keynoting my very first big conference. Um, I've spoken in the crowds of like 300 and this will be 500 to 600 in a big theater auditorium in downtown Redwood City. So really looking forward to that and stretching myself. I hired a speech coach to help me with my 25-minute keynote because even though I have done a lot of presentations, I think that I'm at this stage with certain skill sets that I want to grow where I'm like, I need to invest in some coaching here. I need to like level up my skills. I need to have someone help me refine. my like content and the way that I deliver. And so that's been really interesting and, and just really great. Like I've loved the whole experience. So those are some quick life updates on my side. What about you?

Such a fun week for life updates. I am literally so excited to be with you. It's insane how much time we've gone without seeing each other. And if you listen to the podcast long enough, you might've been here in our era where the podcast was more lifestyle. And so we've been So business-focused together, which has been really fun, but I miss just my bestie, just yapping about anything.

We're not talking about work, okay, this weekend?

No, absolutely not. So I am very much looking forward to that. Yeah. And on my end, we had our April mastermind call this week and just feeling so grateful that we have that space and just feeling really proud of the girls for the hard work that they're putting into their goals into their businesses. And yeah, it's just like that good sweet spot of the mastermind where enough work has been put in, but there's still more to go.

Yeah.

So that's been really fun. I have been gearing up for my Europe trip, just like booking all the things for the different legs of the trip and trying to get organized with that as well. So lots of travel and planning and What else have I been up to? Just gearing up for the trip this weekend. And yeah. Oh, and then I shot a beautiful styled shoot yesterday in Columbia, Missouri, or Columbia, Illinois. And it's this beautiful new venue that the distillery created. And yeah, it was just wonderful to get together with a lot of vendors that I work with on wedding days, but things are hectic. You just small talk a little bit, you get along. We're more IG friends than anything, but actually having the time to talk to all the planners and know what's going on in everybody's business, literally, was really fun. So that's a little bit of my week.

I love when you actually get to meet and go a bit deeper with people that you work with. In a work context, you're rarely having some of those more personal connective conversations. So it's cool that you got to do that this week. Yes. Thank you for bringing up our mastermind girls. We are almost halfway through the 6-month in-between mastermind and our girl, I'm like so impressed by them. I love them so much. They're so honest. And like, I just love the way that everybody's connecting with each other and learning from each other. And you can really see the growth in 2 and a half months. And it's been amazing to witness. So love them so much. And if you're listening, hi, I love you.

We love you so much.

All right, in-betweens. So if you're new to the pod, we always start each episode sharing what we're in between, either in life or in business, because we believe that you're always in between something. So what are you in between right now?

Ooh, okay. Um, I am currently in between— this is more of a personal life one than it is a business one, but I really got in my head about just my body this past week and I've just been trying to talk myself through it. And as the weather gets warmer and I'm booking all these trips, I've been just reminding myself that I'm more than what I look like. And that as long as I'm doing and having healthy habits and that I'm cooking and I'm nourishing myself and I'm doing the things, that's what's important. And so I've been trying to focus this time around on speaking to myself or managing things how I would want my future daughter to manage things and feel about herself. And that has been really, really helpful with my self-talk. It's not fully there, but I do think it's made me more compassionate towards myself and just letting things be what they need to be while still focusing on my goals. And I think as a goal-oriented person, it just— when you're not hitting those things that you want, as far as wellness or even physical aesthetics, it can feel like failure. And that's just an area where it's not measured that way at all. So rewiring has been hard and just overall wellness things. I was just bloated last week and I needed to change my diet up. And as soon as I changed my diet, things just changed a lot. But it just felt discouraging to have been Working out so hard for the past 4 months and then feel like there was not— there was progress, but like not as much. Yeah. So yeah, a little bit of more vulnerable talk there, but I'm trying to be nicer to myself and still focus on those goals.

Yeah. Thank you so much for sharing. It is, it is difficult being a woman, and I know men struggle with this as well, but I do think like with our cycles and things, even like pre-period, the pre-period bloat and like your body's preparing, your uterus is preparing itself. Like, I've just been trying to shift around some of that mindset, but I, I totally understand what you mean getting into vacation season and preparing to like low-key be half naked in Europe, you know what I'm saying? Like, literally the back is out.

Yeah.

So when you're thinking about that and you're like, okay, what does it look like? But I know what you mean on just focusing on how you feel and focusing on the ways that you're taking care of your body. And is that enough? And where the line is for that too. When is enough enough? And when am I happy and accepting and loving to the way that I am now versus, like you mentioned, goals you have around wanting to be stronger or leaner or whatever the goal is? So, I really appreciate you bringing this up. It's something that I've been working through the last month as well, so I appreciate you sharing that.

Absolutely, absolutely. What are you currently in between?

Well, it's my birthday week. I am getting a year older, and I think similar to you on the personal side, working through getting older and continuing to romanticize that, continue to love my 30s. And as I get one year deeper into my 30s and closer to 40, like the mindset stuff that can come up with that, and really just continuing to look at aging as a privilege and ways to be excited about getting older. And instead of like, you know, my body is changing, and I'm— I have more gray hair. And like, there's all these little things that come into the realities of aging. And it's like, how do I keep my mindset young? How do I continue to take care of my body and honestly not overthink getting older? Um, because I think that there's an aspect of getting older where I'm like, have I achieved enough? Have I done enough? Also, like, am I still relevant? Like, I remember like when I was young, I was like, oh, like everything is possible. And then you get older. It's like, well, is as much possible? Like, can I still take chances? Can I still take risks? Like, I'm getting older, or I'm getting older. Shouldn't I have this figured out? Like there's all of that mindset stuff that can come up. So as I welcome in a new year, I am really learning to be so gentle and kind to myself and just loving, you know, getting one year older and being okay with that. And, and obviously I have to be okay with it because it's going to happen whether I like it or not. You know, like age is coming, the grays are here, baby. But, but the point is, is like, It's all about my mindset towards it. So I am choosing to embrace 32 and just continue to be excited about all that life has to offer me. And I really do think that my 30s are— have been so refining for me. And I feel like I've come into myself so much since I turned 30. And I'm ready for whatever this next year has to offer me. But Definitely like an in-between of, okay, we're, we're getting a little older here, baby. Like, how are we—

how do we feel about that?

And just opening up those, those conversations with myself.

I love that so much. I think that maybe you relate to this, but like your early 30s kind of feel like another teenage season. Totally. You're like, oh, I'm not a— I'm not a teenager, but now I'm an adult. I'm like 18. I'm there, but I'm not. And 30s is like, okay, I'm like really, really an adult, but at the same time, I'm not old and I'm not in my early 20s either. So where am I?

We're in between. We really are.

The 30s are the in between. But I love that so much for you. I can feel that grace that you're giving yourself even as you're speaking it and you're just like saying it in a more soft and loving tone. And I love that for you. I love that you're welcoming this new year with so much love and anticipation. And it's also proof of what you have built in your life too, because I think the hard work you've put in the past 2 years makes you excited to keep going rather than like if you would've just given up a little, you know, 5 years ago and just been like, okay, well, I don't know, maybe it's just not for me. Maybe this would feel so different.

Yeah.

So I'm so proud of you and I cannot wait to see what this year holds. Also, a moment for starting 32 by being a keynote speaker in Silicon Valley. That's insane.

Thank you. Thank you so much. I really do feel like 31 was a time where I just allowed myself to take a lot of chances and to raise my hand and to do it scared and really have a done is better than perfect. I would ruminate so much on doing things and now I'm like, yeah, I got this. And I'll figure it out. And like that sort of confidence and trust in myself, I think has solidified itself so much more in this past year. And so even the opportunities that are now coming to me, it's like, okay, I am ready for this. And even if this is a bit scary, I'm gonna work my way through it instead of being almost Like filled with too much self-doubt that I kind of take myself out of the game. And I feel like that's one thing I've worked at this year is just staying really present and being open to whatever comes my way. So I'm ready for— I'm receptive, baby. So opportunities, universe, God, let's go. I'm ready.

Let the money flow. Let the activities flow. Let it all just be there for you.

Yes. Opportunities chase me down. Money flows to me. I am feeling very like in my zen about that. Speaking of money, let's talk. I love the way I—I'm always transitioning, trying to make it so smooth. Speaking of money, dinero. We have not.

I have not sung that song in a while. You have not. In like, I want to say two years.

She take my dinero. Take my dinero. Oh my gosh! If you've been a long time listener of the podcast, you get that inside joke. And if not, welcome. Welcome. Trying to sing that song whenever we talk about money. But let's talk through the psychology of pricing, money mindset as a creator, as an entrepreneur. So when it comes to your pricing journey, there are a lot of factors obviously that come into play when it comes to money. There's the internal, so your internal expertise, how you view and validate what you offer, whether that's a service or whether that's a product, there's all the internal work. And also how you grew up and your mindset around money. Are you more abundance leaning? Are you more scarcity leaning? And then there's all of the external factors. So what are people willing to pay? What's happening in macroeconomics, microeconomics? Where are you geographically located? Are you serving people IRL? Are you serving people URL digitally? So there's a lot of factors that can come into play. But with that in mind, we just want to kind of talk through some mindset junk that can come up and keep us from pricing ourselves for, you know, the value as well as what we're worth. And then some tips and strategies to help you maybe even increase your pricing if you're at a stage where you're considering, I need to increase my pricing. I've, I've been pricing this for X amount of time. It's time to increase. And then just some general pricing strategies. So I also think that it's important to start this conversation around money and being a woman running a business. I would love for you to share what your experience has been and why you think it's important to talk through this specifically as women in business.

Yeah, I love that question. I think that as women in business, I think as women in general, we have this culture of giving, of loving, of, oh no, no, that's okay. That's enough. I should just be grateful for what I have. Um, and truly, I think we need to just look at it more objectively. Like we're offering a service. We need to take out our emotions from this side of the business and being able to say, okay, we're offering a service or a product. And if it was black and white, what would this cost based off of the market, based off of the quality, based off of all the things that are included within that as well? And so I think that as women, it's just really hard for us to accept that we deserve more, that we can make money, that maybe your business could make you the breadwinner of your family and transform your family's life. There's so many incredible creators on TikTok that it's kind of turned their life around. Now they're the main breadwinners as well. And so I think being able to think bigger and think more abundance and notice those ways that as women, we might be minimizing what we can offer, minimizing what we can create, and being able to shift into What would happen if I created something so valuable that not only am I putting that out into the world and making a difference and living out and using my gifts and my talents, but people are also willing to pay for that level of service and quality. And I think that's where we're missing the boat, is that we think this should just stay so small because people can only offer this much. But really, If we expand that mindset, there's so much more than just money at that exchange, but money is at the crossroads of it.

Agreed. And I think that there are some common, and to your point, some common kind of money mindset blocks. And one of them that you and I hear all the time and ones that we've also experienced is like that imposter syndrome around, I can't price that way. I shouldn't price that way, or am I experienced enough to price that way? Or like, and when you actually get into the economics of pricing, maybe you need to price a certain, um, a certain way to be able to cover your costs and actually earn revenue. But maybe that's, that price still makes you feel uncomfortable. So I think doing some digging around why that price makes you feel uncomfortable. And if you were to increase your prices every 6 months by 5%, 10%, 15%, like what would that look like? And when would you kind of reach that ceiling? I also think one of the aspects that keeps us from pricing perhaps the desired pricing that we want to price is the fear of rejection. And as a coach, I've been coaching for the last 5 years on discovery calls where I'm with women and they're talking through what they need help with and their goals. And then we get to the pricing conversation around what the investment is for coaching. I have experienced the absolute gamut. I've experienced immediate yeses. I've experienced, oh, I don't know, let me think about it. And then they end up signing up. I've experienced a no directly on the call. I've experienced a maybe on the call and then being completely ghosted. Afterwards, after sending a proposal, so that's a wide array of of data, right? And so when I'm looking at my pricing, okay, some people are saying yes, some people are saying maybe. Like what? Why are? What makes it an immediate yes? What makes it an immediate no? And so on and so forth. But that rejection piece can sometimes I've even felt it be like oh my price is too high. Like Maybe I could lower them just because I really do want to work with them. And this is more on the services side because usually like a product price is a product price.

Yeah.

Um, but when it comes to services, you can kind of make some concessions. Um, and so I, I really think that don't devalue yourself by trying to give discounts just because you want the work when you can wait for clients who are your ideal client and an ideal fit and who are willing to pay you your ideal price, they are out there. It's just the patience piece and getting in the reps and not being afraid of rejection. That's an important component of building that pricing confidence.

Absolutely. I feel like getting comfortable with, uh, rejection is a huge component of pricing and being able to, in a way, stand your ground. And not give in when people are asking for a million discounts or not give in whenever, um, you're like, okay, this is what I should be charging, but I'm just gonna like knock it $100 just so that I can like get more clients.

Yeah.

And I think something that's really helped me with being okay with rejection is truly thinking, how many clients a year do I need to fill my books? And if you're getting X amount of DMs or, you know, 5 times that in inquiries and emails, then that gives you a good base of what you need to be doing and how many people you're going to have to turn down in order to fill those specific spots. So that's more, of course, on like the service side of a business. But if you are on the product side as well, it's like, okay, what do you need to fully make a profit? How much time and money goes into Creating that wholesale order. And then once you have that clarity of numbers and what goes into it, I feel like you feel ethical in a sense to charge that money because you're like, this is what it's worth. And that's another aspect that I have encountered in the photography industry specifically is people feel like, oh no, like I wouldn't pay that price if I were, you know, booking myself. And it just feels like too much. But then when we break it down into, okay, you're charging $600 for 1 hour of shooting, but really we break down how much it takes to service that 1 hour and it's anywhere between 8 to 10 hours. I'm like, you're making less than $100 per hour and that's not even counting like your materials. So then suddenly that guilt goes away because they're like, oh, okay, I'm really not charging that much. So I think that getting comfortable with rejection and just having clarity into your pricing can really help as well. Mm-hmm.

Yeah, I love this. Another common mindset block that I think can come up is you're doing comparative pricing. So when it comes to obviously pricing, you want to know what the market is at, like what's the market rate, what's the market standard, and then are— where are you in comparison to that standard? Are you higher? Are you like— what percentile essentially are you at? Are you lower than market rate? But At the same time, it's used as a reference point, not as a reason to underprice yourself. So in this case, if I'm looking at other coaches and I'm saying, oh, this person actually only charges $100 an hour and I charge $300 an hour. Okay. Well, that's okay. Let's look at their experience. What, where, what specific areas of expertise do they have? How long have they been doing it? And then I look at my expertise and I'm saying, okay, I've got 10+ years doing I have this experience. I've worked with these kinds of individuals, these kinds of entrepreneurs. All right. Wow. Okay. So my, my expertise is, is added into the pricing. And then you look at that. And another thing can that can be helpful for this is ChatGPT or even Claude AI if you're trying to do some price research. If you not only ask like what are industry rates for this product or service, but then you yourself put in your, you know, entire CV or resume of what you do and all the expertise and experience you have. ChatGPT can also help give you some kind of guardrails or like, hey, you could price this per hour, this per package, and so on, just to have a bit of a, of a reference. But I think it's helpful to look at the market and look at other people doing things similar to you. And at the same time, don't fall into the trap of needing to price the exact same way that they have. So I'm curious for you in the luxury wedding space, like how do you, how have you worked on your pricing psychology? Because I know that you've raised your prices because your clientele has slowly, like you've niched down even more than whenever you first started your photography business.

Yeah, yeah, I definitely have raised quite a bit. And I'm starting to hit this very interesting point where there's like the, the, um, mid-level market, which is really where I land. And then there's like the luxury market space. So in the mid-level, I'm on the higher tier of pricing, but I'm also too low to be luxury. And sometimes you don't get booked for some of those luxury weddings if you're too low because they just assume your worth. And I know that we're gonna like chat about that a little bit more, but that was something that I learned from an incredible photographer, Annie Graham. She has a great pricing course and it made sense. Like, I got a really cool inquiry for a wedding in Italy and I was one of the top contenders. They loved my work. And then when they got multiple inquiries back, it just like fell off the face of the earth. And that was right around the time that I took that course. I was Interesting, like how that can all work. And so I think whenever it comes to pricing, something that really helped me is when I first started, I did look at what my competition was charging. And I knew that my expertise did not match their expertise. So I was charging low, which allowed me to get my foot in the door and get enough workflow going so that I could build a portfolio. And then after that, I was just more heads down. And I like made a commitment to myself that I was not going to look at other photographers' portfolios and pricing because it just, it was just, yeah, a rabbit hole of messing with my brain with that. So I did it more based off of just supply and demand. Like if I only have 10 weddings a year, which is what I took on back then as I had a full-time job, if I only had 10 weddings a year and I was charging X amount and I was turning down 300-some inquiries a year. I can raise my prices. So I would just like every month I'd be like, okay, let's up them $100. Next month, another $100. And until it went to a point where I was getting a good balance of nos and a good balance of yes. And that's pretty much what I've just continued to do throughout my career. And a big thing too has just been have a wild package on there that you think people might not book. And that has actually, over time, my wild package has then become my class, like my middle one. And then I'll add another wild one. And it's just like a good progression because I'm like, oh, someone actually booked it.

Um, that's a great idea. It's kind of that like over time, your, your brand continues to grow as well. And so naturally your pricing and packaging should match. the level of your brand and the level of your portfolio too.

Mm-hmm.

Um, so let's talk about the, the luxury photo market and, and this theory as well around like luxury and the, the perceived value matched value. I think there's a reason why people are drawn to luxury goods. Um, me being one of them, I will like call myself out. I love the idea of like having something that's quality. I don't mind paying a premium for quality. There's also an aspect of buying higher quality things or investing, like invest. I know people that have invested in $20,000 masterminds, $40,000 masterminds. And there's an aspect of that, that their mindset has gotten to a place where they are comfortable and want to invest in these higher priced experiences, services, products, because it's also a reflection of their growth. There's like an aspect of status to it. There's also an aspect of I'm leveling up. And so I want my coaching to level up. I want my products to level up. I want my, I want to invest in a mastermind, cars. Like there's just this like level up to pricing and the consumer's experience with wanting to invest in something that matches their expectation and their perceived value of that item. So in your case, like the luxury photo market being on the lower side, people are like, oh, maybe even though I know that you would absolutely kill it and you would deliver and maybe even better than all the other photographers, their perceived value of your experience because of your price point was like, oh, she might not be able to deliver a luxury experience, but I know you will. But I'm like curious how that has come into play with some of the clients that you've come into contact with.

Yeah, it's honestly, I'm still figuring out quite a few things around it. I feel like this year is, has been a consistent, the luxury or like the more higher end weddings in Chicago, Miami, St. Louis are confidently booking my top package. And so once I see people confidently booking that, I'll give it like a good 6 months and then I'm like, okay, this could become my middle package. And then pop back into there. But yeah, I think overall people associate a lot of things with your pricing. And when you're looking at a luxury wedding, if someone is spending half a million, a million dollars on their wedding, and you are charging less than 10%, like you're literally charging like 1% or 5% of their whole budget for photography when that is a top priority for them. They may assume that you can't deliver on a top item for them. And because their planners do make those recommendations to them, like you should spend 10% of your budget or 20% of your budget on photography. And a lot of times that means that you have third, fourth shooters, you have drone, you have multiple days of coverage, you have rehearsal dinner, like adding a lot of things. Um, and so it's very interesting how it works for sure on the photo side, but I'm curious in the coaching world, like. What is considered low, mid, high? And then how have you navigated that too, from the start of your business to now, 5 years in?

Yeah. Yeah. So I used to charge $300 a month for 2 sessions. So they were kind of priced at $150 per session, but you would get 24/7 access to me, voice notes, texting. So you would get this ongoing support in between sessions. And at first I was just like, yeah, just sign up. But I wasn't doing packages either. So now it's 6 months. I'm working with clients on a 6-month retainer. Um, now my pricing is $800 a month for 2 sessions with ongoing support and all of that included. Um, part of that is because my clientele has shifted as well. Before I was serving women focused on growing their careers or kind of just trying to figure out what was next in their life. They were in, in the middle of a pivot. And now I really focus on serving female business owners or women who are at an executive level in their career trying to pivot, who want to invest in more high touch. Um, and also just my experience in the last 5 years on my career and on the business side, has scaled exponentially. And so then the expertise and the, and honestly the level of coaching I'm able to provide is so much higher value than it was 5 years ago, as it should be, like as you're growing. So something that I also wanted to bring up around pricing is when you give things away for free, people's expectation and their willingness to show up and put in effort is very different. So if I, I've run lots of free challenges and there've been, and they're always free because I'm like wanting to serve. It's also a great pipeline for people to hire me as a coach. And the level of commitment that people are willing to put in for something that's free versus something that's paid is obviously different. Matthew right now is considering investing in a mastermind for a real estate program. And we had this whole conversation around accountability and what he really needed from it. And the price point was at a place where it was just painful, doable, right? We're not like paying for something that we literally can't afford, but it was just painful enough to make him take action. And he was like, I think that I need to pay for this level of accountability and this level of program at this like high-tiered price, literally to push me to take action. Whereas these lower-ticket things that he's done, he isn't as invested. It's like, oh, it's $100 a month, like, which I know is a privilege, but he's at a place where that it's not enough pain in a way that there's not discomfort around the pricing. So then you as the consumer aren't really making any change. And I think there's also on the business side, making sure that you're able to deliver to the level of your pricing.

Yeah.

So I have invested in coaching before that was very, very expensive and the experience did not match the coaching. And it wasn't the— The math ain't mathing in a way. And so I gave that feedback and I was able to end my contract a little bit early. But at the same time, I just think it's important to feel ethical in your pricing and feel like you can really deliver on your promises. But to get into some practical pricing strategies for you, when you're thinking about value-based pricing, 3 questions to ask yourself are, what problem does this solve? And what is that problem costing them? So the customer, and this kind of helps them quantify the pain point. It's like, what is the pain? How much would they pay to make the pain go away? And then how does your service help obviously deliver that in XYZ way? The second question, What transformation or outcome will they receive? And this is like trying to make it as tangible as possible. So if you can communicate, I'm going to help you go from point A to point B, I'm going to help you go from an insane inbox to a specific inbox management strategy in under 30 days. That's going to take you from inbox anxiety to feeling calm, cool, and collected and feeling in control of your inbox in less than a month. Sign me up. Like it's, it needs to be clear. It needs to be tangible. And then the third question is, what would they be willing to pay to achieve this outcome? So not what you think it's worth, but what, what people would actually be willing to pay. And this is where we need to talk to people. We need to ask people, this is what I'm thinking of building. What would you invest for this? And just getting uncomfortable, but asking people around Asking your ideal customer too, um, what their input is on, on pricing.

Yeah, I love these questions. I think being able to get clear on these and then also using that language within your marketing is huge. I have built some of this, uh, language into the response whenever people inquire with me and I clarify right away, like, this is the style of photography that I do. Editorial mixed with documentary. Why? Because like that's a big fear for people that they're going to show up to their wedding day and it's going to be like super posey and awkward. And what do I do? Right. So here's the style. And then like, what if it doesn't turn out the way that I wanted? Well, here's some example galleries that you can look through a full wedding day so they can click start to finish, look at all different kinds of lighting scenarios, look at different types of brides, look at different types of grooms, like all of it mixed in there. And you address that and then like. What are they willing to pay for that? So then there's like the pricing of everything that's included for assuring them. So maybe in the product that you offer or the service that you offer, again, like how can you clarify that in your product description and your social media messaging and being able to say, I can, can solve this for you. Here's how. And one thing that I wanted to mention on this is For my clientele, people getting married are stressed out. And so you have to keep in mind, what is the environment of the person that you are addressing? You're coaching executives. They're busy. They want to get to the point. They want to grow. They want to have tangible results. And so for me, something that is important into my pricing is that I invest in solid systems that doesn't make my client jump through a million hoops. And have to like chase after me and be like, "Oh, are we? What's the timeline? When are we meeting again? When do we schedule our engagement session?" Like I don't want them to have to work for that, and part of the price that they're paying with me is that experience that I'm going to be on it, and it's going to feel stress-free, and I'm going to be the leader on it, and you just follow my lead. I'll let you know when we're going to plan everything. Everything's going to be ahead of time, and you can just relax. And that has made things. So, so like whenever people inquire with me, that's one of the things that they'll mention as a referral comment. Like my friend used you and she loved your photos, but also like how organized you were and how you led them through that. So include the problem that you solve within like your marketing as well.

Yeah. If you're at a place right now to kind of shifting topics where you want to increase your pricing after this conversation, you're like, okay. I need to increase my pricing. Another indicator for that as well is if everybody says yes and no one has any pricing concerns or they're like, oh, I can't, that's outside of my budget. That means that your pricing is probably too low. So something to consider, but something that when you're communicating, when you're communicating a price increase, It's important to do that with confidence. And so instead of saying, I'm so sorry, but I have to raise my prices because of XYZ, it doesn't communicate confident value that you're in control as well as, hey, I've got confidence. I know how to execute this. But when you come at it with that kind of insecurity and that kind of tone of apology, People are like, I don't really know. Am I? It kind of makes them question who's in control, especially on the services side. So something that I've worked with clients on when they're increasing their pricing is something along the lines of like due to consistent results my clients are achieving, my rates will be increasing on X date, or I'm excited to announce some changes in my business that reflect the growth and transformation my clients have been experiencing. And therefore my pricing will be X moving forward. Let me know if you have any questions, happy to jump on a call and talk through this with you. But like really communicating it as a growth opportunity for you, as well as you're expanding your business, you're learning more. Therefore they're getting that value and getting that access to you. And they're going to invest a little bit more money, um, to match your rates. It's a little bit different. With, I would assume, wedding inquiries, because you can increase your pricing without necessarily having to have that conversation. But in less services retainer kind of experience where you're doing retainer consulting or social media management or coaching, and you've been working with clients for a long period of time, maybe even 6 to 12 months, having that conversation around pricing. Is a great way to stretch. And also it's in service of your long-term relationship with that client, because there's nothing like the resentment that you can feel of doing a lot of work for not very much money because your expertise has grown, your client load has grown, but now the, the money that you're getting from the client isn't matching the effort and the, um, Mm-hmm. I would say expertise that you've put into, into the relationship.

Absolutely. I, I want to touch base here on the fact that in the past 5 years, our cost of living has gone up so significantly. And in the recent months, there's been a lot of tariffs that have also occurred in the US. And I know within the wedding space, there's been a lot of vendors affected by it, florists and wedding dress designers and lots of different Um, businesses are affected by this. And so this is also an opportunity where you can increase your pricing that may not affect your bottom line, but you can practice like how you can say that more confidently. So you can say, due to market prices going up, you know, this will be happening, but we're excited to offer 24-hour, you know, turn, like rush to you, or what can you offer that maybe just takes a little bit more time? That's a fun little bonus for your customer that feels like I'm getting something extra, but also recognizing that the market has shifted. And so if you have not increased your prices since 2020, 2021, or even in the past 2 years, I think this is like a very important call to action because you truly are giving yourself demotions every year. Every standard job will give you at least like 3% per year raise. And so at a bare minimum, I think as business owners, we need to be giving ourselves, you know, 3 to 10% raise to the prices every year as well.

Yeah. Great point. And yeah, you're right on the demotion piece. Like you're demoting yourself every year by not allowing your prices to increase with the growth of your business. A few things to help with your confidence and helping you refine these conversations is recording your sales calls, recording your calls where you are talking with prospects, talking with potential clients. If you can watch those back and look at ways to improve the conversation, notice when you start to get nervous, notice when maybe communication breaks down a little bit. When you watch those things back, And kind of mirror. All right, this is where the conversation could be stronger. This is where I could show more confidence. This is where I could bring in testimonials and experiences other people that have worked with me. I think that watching that back, while it's uncomfy and it makes us feel vulnerable, it's how we grow. And it's also how we continue to expand and ask for what we're worth while also communicating confidently and competently with a client. And then also when the rejection does come, which it will, and that's normal and it's okay, can you have a like wins folder or an evidence folder where you can keep track of client wins and, and kind of like transformative things that have happened because of your work with clients, just to remind you of like, okay, this is the work I'm doing. I love this. I can do this. I have worked with clients that are getting results. Or I think that just reminding ourselves when we're in that state of feeling rejection, how can we kind of lighten the sting of that by reminding ourselves of the impact that we are having? And yeah, I think those are my tips for now. Any else, anything else that you want to add before we wrap up?

Yeah, I just have one more tip, which is along the lines of your sales call, if you have like a consult call with clients, and it's how can you not just practice how you're delivering that message, but also once you get to the pricing, make it so simple for them. And people just stress out whenever things are very overwhelming or it feels like too much. And so for example, if they're booking a $10K wedding photography package, they might be like conflicted because they want to book it and they want to work with me, but like it just feels like a lot of money at that point in time. And so one of the things that I say towards the end of the call is I let them know, hey, since you are 2 years out from your wedding day, um, we can create the pricing, uh, breakdown would be 4 equal payments between now and your wedding day. And if it's anywhere between a year and a half or less, it's just all split within 3 even payments. So right now it's just a third that's due or a fourth that's due, they're like, okay, perfect. Like, I can save up for that by then. And like, things just feel a little bit more digestible. So same thing with your services. Like, can you be as clear and concise with your pricing and how they're paying it? And then just be confident whenever you're saying it and not give away right away like that I can give you a discount or I can offer more payment plans. Just be comfortable with the silence. And that has been painful at times for me because I love to fill the silence, but it's been great and it's worked out, um, whenever I've let the clients just lead with some of those questions when it comes to pricing. Um, but yeah, that's pretty much all that I have as far as tips for pricing and more on like the money man or money mindset, um, side of things. So hopefully you have some great takeaways from this episode, different ways that either of us Um, have done the pricing as well as just taking a second to evaluate if when it comes to pricing, if you feel like you're in a scarcity mindset or if you feel like you're in abundance and how we can foster that even more, um, as a year goes by.

Yeah, I love this conversation. Let us know if you want us to talk about this more, if you want us to dig deeper into any of these topics. Like, we love this, and this is always in service of you and what you need. So, um, share your input on, on this episode, and you can do that on Instagram @inbetween.pod. And you can always connect with me personally @alexisteichmiller.

And you can connect with me @astrojohannaphoto. We love you guys, and we'll catch you next time.