1. What Is The Association of Professional Builders?

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Hello and welcome to the Professional Builder Secrets podcast, a podcast by the association of Professional Builders for building company owners, general managers, VPs and emerging leaders. Here we discuss all things running a professional building company from sales, processes, financials, operations and marketing. I'm excited to kick off our inaugural podcast today. I'm your host, Bosco Anthony and I am thrilled to be joined by sky and Russ Stevens, co founders for the association of Professional Builders. Sky and Russ, welcome.

Hey Bosco, thanks for having us.

Lovely to have you here. Let's get into it. What is the association of Professional Builders?

So the association of Professional Builders is a business coaching company for residential home builders and we help custom home builders, remodelers, renovators to systemize their building companies so that they can operate more efficiently, free up more time and of course increase their margins.

So you're kind of like the master Builders or the NAHB in the us.

I have to say we're very, very different. It could almost be a common misconception, but APB is incredibly different to any other association out there at the moment because we primarily and only and exclusively focus on business and systems training for these residential building companies.

What prompted you to start the association of Professional Builders?

Well, this goes back quite some time ago, probably 10, 11 years ago now, around about 2010, 2011. At the time I was providing different services to residential home builders. Amongst them a contract signing service where we would prepare contracts for builders and then meet with the consumers and get those contracts signed. Which gave us a great insight really into what made consumers tick and their decision making process for signing with a particular builder. And then I then came across some software in the us, some very advanced client facing project management software called coconstruct, which I was blown away by. And after a quick conversation with Donny Wyatt, we signed up the rights to be a provider, do tier one support, do all the marketing and sales for coconstruct in Australia, New Zealand and the uk. And it was that which really launched us in in front of a lot of builders all and New Zealand and actually seeing what was happening there with building companies. It really gave us a real insight into where the gaps were, what was, what was making them tick and it Was about this time really that sky had left school and, and was just getting started in. In university.

Yeah. So I had gone to university and I have to admit I was not there long. I left pretty quickly. But I was going there to obviously learn about business and I was particularly interested in marketing. And very, very talking weeks into this course, I realized, you know what, it's pretty out of date. What we were learning was not what was happening in marketing, it was very out of date. So ended up ultimately making the decision to leave university and actually learn about this and what's happening. You've got to think at that time as well, like that 10 year ago, Mark, the Internet was coming about in a big way. So advertising was completely changing and if I was going to get stuck in a course for a few years, I was going to get left behind. So ultimately made the decision to leave university and actually decide to learn about marketing on what's happening right now. And essentially shortly after that, Russ and I, we decided to start a marketing agency and it was dedicated to, and specifically for builders. And it was great. You know, we started our marketing agency, it grew, it was fantastic. We were able to generate so many leads for these custom home builders all across Australia and then we're able to go international as well.

And then, then what happened? We were generating all these great leads for builders, but nonetheless there were still, some builders were still struggling and other builders were doing really well. And the guys that were struggling were telling us things like, these leads are no good, they're rubbish. They're. Yeah, I was much better off when I was just working on referrals. You know, these cold leads from advertising, they just don't work. So we dug into that and we realized that the guys that were struggling, the one thing that they were missing was a documented sales process. So with that we decided to launch Acris sales training, which was the next step on the ladder really. So we were now generating all these great quality leads, but more importantly, we were now taking builders through a step by step process on how to take those leads through to a contract.

And it was really interesting, wasn't it? Because it's like the exact same thing happened. So while we were running our marketing agency, we could generate all the leads in the world for some builders. Why could some builders thrive and the others just run into problems? And it was the sales process, the exact same thing happened. So we could generate all the leads in the world for some builders. We even then, you know, doubled down and worked with them on the sales process, getting them Better at closing and qualifying and suddenly you could generate leads and make sales. Why were there two camps of builders? How come some were thriving and others were still battling with low margins or problem clients or lack of financial understanding or systems within the company? And that's when we really took a step back and realized we need to come at this with a much more holistic approach. And that's how APB was born and that's how it started. It was to have a much more holistic approach to running a professional building company. So we don't just cover sales and marketing, it's also business operations, financials and a lot of self development and improvement to grow as the leader of a residential building company.

Industry has changed quite a bit. But if you look back, what were some of those really crucial gaps that needed to be filled? It sounds like you've brought so much to this industry over the last few years as well.

Yeah, I think the biggest gap, and it's probably where we always start, generally when we're working with a building company, it's in their financials and helping builders to truly understand their financials because it's a very misunderstood topic. And in our experience, most accountants and bookkeepers do not even fully understand a construction company's financials. So that really was the big gap. And in particular things like the work in progress, accounting adjustment, understanding that, calculating that so you can produce an accurate balance sheet and profit and loss report and also how to price their jobs as well. Because most builders do not understand how to price their jobs. You know, they'll get a bit of advice from other builders who, who say Maybe I add 15% or 20% onto my jobs and so they just go out and do the same. And that's, that's really dangerous.

I think what else we've been able to plug in terms of a gap because of all of that financial knowledge, because these systems have been able to roll out into so many building companies is we've been able to bring just another layer of professionalism to the industry. Now whether that's from taking a very good building company and you know, tweaking a couple of things and enhancing it and making it just even better, or from taking, you know, a very early building company that maybe didn't have as many systems in place, weren't necessarily taught any of these pricing structures when they were getting started out as a builder and really just giving them the tools to be that much more professional in this industry, which is the goal.

Let's uncover the DNA of the association of Professional builders. Who are your members, who should be joining and who are you looking for?

It's a really good question because we're very, very particular with who joins App. Now, our members, they're all the owners, directors, general managers of residential building companies. So you're building custom new homes or you're doing major remodels. Remodels and extensions. Renovations and extensions. So yeah, essentially as a builder, that's who you are when you join apb. In terms of location, we've got members across the United States, Canada, Australia, New Zealand and even the uk.

Well, that's interesting because you're based out of Australia. Both of you as co founders are based out of Australia. Do you service builders across the world, I guess is what you're saying?

Yeah, I mean, absolutely. It's interesting because when we started off obviously with builders in Australia, I think we were only something like six, seven, eight months in, and we started getting builders from the US getting in touch with us and approaching us, and we were able to see very quickly that these systems and processes, they worked and applied just as well to builders based in the U.S. obviously, we already had a lot of builders coming to us from New Zealand very early on, but you can kind of look at that and think, oh, yeah, that's very similar. But when you start going across the world, that kind of distance, there's always this preconceived idea that things are different here we do things. Things different. So it wouldn't work. But yeah, we found the opposite to be true there.

How do you keep up with the time zones with having builders? Do you have an international team?

Yeah, we do. So we've got our team members based across Australia, the US and Canada, so that it's a much more personalized service as well. Especially our executive coaches that look after our private clients, they are based locally to look after our clients. But I thought it was really interesting to go back to something that we were just talking about. It's the kind of builder that's attracted to us because I think it comes down to mindset. Again, when Russ was just saying, when we started having builders from the US start reaching out to us and see what we were doing and ask for a little bit of help over there. I think that really defines the kind of member and the kind of builder that joins APB as well. I mean, we talked about quite simply the custom home builders or remodelers and then the owners and directors of companies. But if you go a layer deeper, I think when you actually look at our member base and you get to interact with some of the builders that we've got across any of those countries, you're going to notice a whole heap more similarities. And I think the first one is mindset. It's actually being tenacious enough to go out and ask for help from, you know, the small company like quite a few years ago, all the way in Australia, asking, you know, is this going to work? Can we, can we see some of it? Can we get some help? So it's a mindset of wanting to do better, be better, not just for their own building company, but for their families, for their team inside their building company and of course their clients as well. They want to deliver a 10 times better experience than this industry unfortunately is delivering a lot of other people.

I think what's interesting as well is our members love connecting online and speaking to other builders in different parts of the world as well. Which yeah, I guess it's been surprising, but it shouldn't be really when you think about it. But yeah, we have builders in Australia, love connecting with builders in the US and, and Canada and New Zealand and just hearing about their businesses and what they're doing and yeah, it's amazing that they all face the same challenges. They're all looking to overcome those same challenges in expanding and growing their building company.

That's such a good point because even, you know, you can watch it on our group as well. When builders are connecting all the way from New Zealand to Canada, Australia to the U.S. what's even more interesting is you look at the profile of those builders. So whether they're big custom homes, you know, multimillion dollar homes like palaces that you're building and then you know, big renovators that are maybe in quite a rural area when they're open minded enough to see what they can learn from each other. You know, we're still in the same industry, we're still in the same game, but what can we learn? What can we pick up from each other? When you see that kind of interaction, that's so, so cool to see.

Yeah, we have remodelers in Queensland hanging out with guys in California building multimillion dollar mansions for very well known Hollywood stars. It's incredible.

The Internet's definitely brought people a lot closer together in this day and age as well. So tell me a little bit about these programs that you offer to the builders. Are they different in the US than in Australia?

Look, I wish I could say we've got a portal for every single country, but the interesting thing is Russ mentioned it before. We've looked at this a lot. We have spoken to, we have worked with so many building company owners across different countries. And the most interesting thing that we found is everyone does have the same problems at the end of the day. And essentially when we build a program and we build trainings, we are teaching the overarching principles and essentially the strategy is always the same, no matter where the building company actually is. It might be very hard to believe, but the strategy is the same. Now, the tactics might be slightly different depending on where you are and who your audience is, but this is why we've been able to systemize so many building companies, because the systems are robust enough to work and then going that layer deeper, this is why we put on executive business coaches in each country so that our private program, not just our members, when they, if they want to upgrade and work one on one, privately with anyone on our executive coaching team, we have coaches in that country. So it makes a lot more sense for each of our clients.

Yeah, for years, our head coach, Andy Scarda, he serviced builders in the, in the US and Canada, from here in Australia, and still does a magnificent job servicing those guys. But there's always that degree of comfort, isn't there? When someone is in your own country, you just kind of feel that little bit of reassurance that maybe they understand your market a little bit more because they're actually, actually on the ground. So, yeah, that's been great for the guys in North America.

It sounds like you're both really focused on disrupting this space and really creating a new form of what training should look like in the industry. Tell me a little bit about this training that you offer. What does that look like for builders getting into it today?

Well, we have two levels of training, really, and the first level that we offer is membership. It's easily accessible, it's affordable. And what that does is it gives every builder the opportunity to just sample the quality of information that is available. It will help to open their eyes to a better way of doing things. And it's completely affordable to anyone in business. It's at that level. And what that does is it enables these builders to access all of our systems online, to download them, to go through our programs, to download our, our checklists and guides, and even attend monthly group coaching. And when they see really the level and the quality of information available, that's when they can make the decision to progress into full private mentoring with the association of Professional Builders, which is our next step. And that's where they get to work with their own mentor, their own coach, who they will meet with every month as well as attend a mentoring mastermind each month, as well as of course having access to all the benefits that they get as members as well.

I think what's really cool about our programs is obviously with membership, it's, you know, plug and play, it's on demand when you upgrade and you level up. And anyone in our private mentoring mastermind totally knows this. We put so much focus and emphasis on to data. Anyone who's gone through any kind of system or training with APB would know how much focus we put onto financials. Russ mentioned it just before that anyone in our private program actually gets set up with a very specific KPI sheet so that we can monitor every single figure in their building company. Because we're never going to scale an unprofitable building company. So first and foremost we work with data. And it's data driven mentoring, which is that next layer. It's not so much reactive, it's very much looking at the building company as it stands, looking at the data and seeing, well, actually what do we need to work on first?

And I think that's really what makes the association of Professional Builders so different from virtually every other coaching company out there in the marketplace, apart from the fact we only work with residential homebuilders. So all of our programs are specifically answering the questions going on in a, in a builder's mind and actually give them the solutions that they need. But apart from that, it is the data driven decision making process that we use. Because typically what will happen when you engage with a consultant or a business coach, you'll meet with them, they'll spend five minutes, so Bosco, tell me what's going on in the business and you'll pour that out and you'll talk about the challenges and obviously the biggest ones will be top of mind, mind and that's what's going to come out. And then they will go ahead and use all their years of experience and knowledge to prescribe a solution to that problem. However, when you analyze the KPIs, which we do, and you use data driven decision making, you'll find that the problem is very rarely or the biggest problem in the business is very rarely the one that the person is describing to you. Normally that is a symptom of a problem elsewhere in the business. And looking at the data, looking at the numbers, looking at the conversion metrics and benchmarking that against the industry numbers, we can tell very quickly where the real problem is in a building company and what needs to be focused on and addressed first. And that really is the main difference between the APB and virtually every other coaching company out there is the way we, we get to the, the root of the, the main problem and tackle that first totally.

Let's face it, our industry is different and unfortunately not every single general business coach is aware of that. And it is so different in this industry and construction. You make a mistake with your financials that's very painful and you can't afford to go through that trial and error. And at the end of the day, anything that we would roll out as an example, whether it's in our membership and even our private program, it is proven because we're all about the data to be able to back it up. And because we're such specialists in the industry, I might add, we know how different this industry is. The financials component is just too important to overlook because we know that we're able to set very realistic expectations as well. It's not like we're online stores, right, that you can work with a business coach and you can have one idea and suddenly you sell a lot more the next month and it's a much better month. In construction, the sales cycle is so long. Anything you implement today to actually try and increase your margins and have better profitability, anything from your marketing to then get a better lead, to then sell them at a better margin, that takes you months to realize. So we're able to set very clear expectations and guidelines and be able to track when it's going to pay off and what that actually looks like. And it's actually a really interesting topic you could probably talk for this about for another two hours. But I think when a lot of people get started in coaching, you want to see a result immediately, but we have to actually look at two different indicators. You've got lead indicators and lag indicators.

Yeah, I think most business coaches out there will tell you, well, business is business and it's all the same. You just got to follow these fundamental principles. But any builder can tell you that this industry is very, very different to any other. And it's dangerous to apply generic principles to a building company because you can destroy it very quickly. Sky and I attended a presentation not so long ago by a very well known marketer in Australia who was on stage in front of close to a thousand. I think it was actually boasting and bragging about how he broke a building company because his marketing techniques were so powerful, they were so good, that this Building company scaled so quickly, they then fell over. It was a terrible, we were horrified. It was a terrible example to use. But he was using it as a badge of honor to show how good he was that he actually broke this company. And what he didn't share was he sent seven members of one family into bankruptcy as a consequence of following that path. And this is why we always start with the financials. Because if you scale an unprofitable company, you are heading for big, big trouble.

I think that's what fueled us, actually. I remember sitting in that event and we just looked at each other absolutely horrified as he was telling this story and literally there was an applause like this was, this was such a world renown coach, such an amazing marketer and it was so scary for us. We realized this is, it's just not okay. We just have a responsibility to get in front of as many building company owners as possible and just get the information out there because I mean, really, this is perfect for an upcoming episode. He did it because one financial calculation he had no idea about. Because this industry is different, plain and simple.

Sounds like you put a lot of heart into what you do. Why do builders become members today? When you look at this growing enterprise of builders from around the world, what's that X factor that's leading to this massive growth?

I think putting all the systems aside for one second, obviously there's a lot of tangible things you can get. We've got dozens of trainings on financials, sales, marketing, business operations. Not just trainings, but all of the templates ready to go. So these are, I mean, these are ready made systems that you can just deploy into your building company. I mean, if you put that to the side for a second, it's a bigger picture. Like right now, if you were to join apb, you are joining a much bigger movement. You are joining a network of professional builders worldwide who all have the same vision as you. It's to actually improve this industry, to make it a lot more professional and to essentially change it. We're trying to ensure that it's very standard. Builders get paid to create a detailed quote for a project. It's a much more professional industry. So I think, yeah. Why would builders become a member of apb? You are, you are joining a movement and really making change in the industry. And obviously to do that, it's everything that gets offered to our members. So joining that network, you not only get access to an entire plug and play training portal, we call it, it's like Netflix for builders. You know, you can you can dive on in and choose the topic that you want to go through? Do you want to go into financial, sales, marketing or even self development? Work on your leadership skills or mindset and you get to go through a training. And I might add that as long as they need to be, some of them are 40 minutes worth of video training, some of them are an hour and 40 minutes and they all come with some sort of download, maybe a checklist, maybe a full on proposal template, maybe it's a calculator on how to price your jobs. Whatever it may be, that's what the training centered around and it's video training to actually implement it. Because bottom line, you would join APB to get a result in your building company. It's to be more systemized, increase your margins and deliver a better client experience.

It's easy to feel alone in business and it happens in a lot of industries, but especially in the construction industry. And when builders join the apb, this is the one thing they tell us. It's nice to know that we're not alone and it's nice to be treated like a professional as well. Because as we travel around the country meeting with our members, we take them out to nice hotels, we take them out to dinner, we hold high end events because we see builders as top professional service providers. We see them in the same vein as lawyers and accountants. These are professionals that have something of value to offer the community and that flies in the face of the way builders are, are thought of and treated. In a lot of cases it sounds.

Like you've built and you're building a strong legacy and foundation for builders out there from everything you shared. Can you tell me a little bit about the milestones as co founders that you've had over the past few years that you're really proud of and things that you're taking to the market?

Yes, I think the key milestones for us are our client successes. We look at builders that have come to us quite desperate in a lot of cases and seen how they've managed to turn their companies around with just a little bit of guidance and know how. And that's resulted in saving building companies. It saved marriages in a number of cases. And I might even go as far as to say in some instances it saved lives as well. Because let's not forget, you know, this industry has a terrible, terrible record in terms of mental health and anxiety and depression and suicide. So we're proud of the fact we've been able to play our part in that aspect as well.

I Think. Yeah, if you think of actual milestones, a couple come to mind. You know, some clients were literally thinking of leaving the entire industry before they just stumbled on an ad at the right time, and it inspired them enough to realize it can get better, they can keep keep going. And now they have taken their building company to a completely different place in the next level and enjoy running it again because they are enjoying the network of people that they're connected to. You know, we've been able to help triple and even five times the size of a building company profitably and enjoyably for our builders. Like, they're. They're the kind of milestones. We actually get to hear that kind of feedback and, you know, familiar relationships as well. Taking family businesses or even just husbands and wives and actually seeing that transformation is actually really, really honoring for all of our executive coaches. It's definitely stories that get shared quite a bit when they feel very honored to be able to guide these building company owners through potentially some of the toughest times in their lives to. You know, we got a lot of builders that are already very successful when they come to us. It's getting them to the next level, maybe even leveraging them out of their own building company. That's a true success as well.

Are you able to give us a snapshot between someone who is a member that is a professional builder and someone who's your typical builder that's not heard of the association of Professional Builders that typically is just trying to make it work in this industry?

Yeah, I mean, the main difference between any kind of APB member or any professional builder and a very average builder, I think bottom line is going to be systems. It's having a solid financial understanding, having systems in place in the building company so that it's not all dependent on one. And, you know, you're not stressed, you're not working evenings and weekends, and you just got to do it all over again because you're just on this hamster wheel. Professional builders, they know that the way forward is systems. So they are making time every single week to work on their building company. They have a mindset of, how can I do this? Not I can't do this. That's just the way the industry is. It's too hard. That's very much an average kind of builder. And they don't fit in well with apb. Because members of APB are professional builders. They're looking for a better way, not looking for an excuse.

They have a much stronger financial understanding. Professional builders, APB members, they have a Very clear understanding of their financials. And what that does is when they understand their financials, they then value themselves because too much of the time when they don't understand their financials, they look at the cash flow or they look at the, the amount in the bank account and they don't always value their time in the way they should. So really, understanding financials helps them to value their time. And that leads to a change in mindset which leads to a different pricing model in what we've seen.

Hard question. Are you building a cult?

Well, this is a movement and we are looking to transform the construction industry. And I guess the word cult, it comes from culture. So. So yes, we're building, we're building a strong culture because we have very strong beliefs on, on how a business should run, how a building company should operate. And that's because we really, we truly want to improve this industry for both builders and consumers. We believe that builders deserve to be earning more money than they're currently earning, but we also believe that consumers deserve a far better service than they're currently getting in this industry.

I think humans are very curious about visions and visionaries as well. And it sounds like you're on this mission, on this path as well. What is the future of the association of Professional Builders look like? Where is it going in the future?

I think what we've built at the moment, we're exceptionally proud of it, is it just needs to be a lot bigger. The members that we do have across the us, Canada, Australia, New Zealand and the uk, it's just growing. It. It's getting so many more members because that is how we will transform the industry in terms of what is to come and what's happening. It's connecting those builders worldwide. We have the ability to do that online and through the Internet, actually connecting builders from all different countries and states with each other. And the next next level beyond that is actually getting that physical connection back, actually bringing these builders together at our live, we call them networking events where we get to bring builders all together, all of our members, where they can network in person with each other, because that is just so invaluable.

Yeah, it feels like we've spent the last seven years really documenting all the processes and building the systems that builders can easily implement into their businesses to free up more time and increase their margins. And now the next thing that we need to do is get this information in front of more building companies. And that's truly exciting when you look at the potential, really, of how many builders out there that we can help.

My follow up question, and this is a really good one to ask, especially with all the changes in the world, is where is the future of the industry going? For the builders out there that are listening to this episode, what can they take from this and what can they hope for in the future?

Make no mistake, this industry is getting more professional every year and that's driven by the fact that consumers are now more educated than at any point in history. And that can be a little bit dangerous, but also it pushes us all to be better so we see a future where this industry is. In this industry, professional builders are the norm rather than the exception. And that that's going to be a major change coming 100%.

It brings it all the way back to why we're here to improve the residential construction industry, not just for builders, but consumers as well.

Well, that marks the end of our episode. I'm really appreciative for your insights, your time and sharing this amazing story. And I look forward to picking your brain some more and getting into some of these systems in the coming weeks as we shed some more light into the residential and construction industry as well. Thank you sky and Russ for being here today with us.

Thanks Bosco.

Thanks so much, Bosco. Really enjoyed chatting with you.

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