184. Balancing Personal & Business Life With Carmel Capuano

Welcome to another episode of Professional Builder Secrets. In this episode I interview Carmel Capuano, one of APPB's executive business coaches. Carmel has a family background in the construction industry and spent 15 years running her own businesses before getting into business coaching. We dive into the realities of work life balance in the building industry, the impact of family dynamics on this situation, and what separates those who successfully create balance from with those who struggle. Keep listening to hear Carmel's insights and practical strategies on how you can create more work life balance in your life. This episode of Professional Builder Secrets is brought to you by Apparatus Contractor Services. Apparatus provides full scope end to end QuickBooks, Precision Construction accounting and CFO services for residential builders. If you feel like you can't completely trust your your weekly and monthly financial reports or you feel like you're flying blind, Apparatus will rebuild and operate your QuickBooks accounting system and give you precision construction accounting capability you can trust. Learn more@apparatusteam.com or on the APB Rewards Partner Directory.

One of the biggest struggles I think I see is unclear expectations. Just because you're family doesn't mean you automatically understand each other's roles and boundaries and decision making styles. If these aren't defined, the tension can build up. The solution is that we created those clear decision making structures and we established who was responsible for what. In doing that, we end up understanding who's wearing what hat, empowering the right people. Reintroduce yourself as your business role as opposed to your family role.

Welcome to Professional Builder Secrets, the podcast for building company owners wanting to grow safely and securely. I'm your host, Will Blunt and today I'm joined by Carmel Capuano, one of APB's executive business coaches. Carmel, welcome to the show.

Thanks Will, it's great to be here.

Very excited to have you on today. You've been getting some phenomenal results with our builders and I've been bugging you for a while to come on. So thanks for finally coming on the show.

No, it's my pleasure. Thank you for having me.

Well, Kamal, before we get into the show today, can you give the listeners a bit of an idea of your background in business and how you got to where you are today.

My journey into business, but more so I might start with the building industry to begin with, but it comes from a definitely personal space. My grandfather was a builder and he started the family construction business in the 1950s literally with one brick wall. So that was his very first job and he basically built the business up over decades of work. Lots of hard work and sought advice from accountants and lawyers and building strong relationships. So there wasn't many business coaches back then, but that was the way to do it. But over the years the business expanded into. Well, it went from homes and units into the commercial space and developments. So I had the privilege of watching that firsthand as a third gener benefactor. But my involvement started as, you know, painting and helping with the gardening and on the weekends when we were doing sort of renovations ourselves. And it was a very close family, so lots of effort and time towards building a future for the whole family, no pun intended there. I was really just absorbing his mindset and work ethic the whole time. And what stood out was his clear vision in that he didn't want to just build homes, but he wanted to build a legacy. So all of this has pretty much led me to APB and there's lots of cool things that I can go into as to his vision, but he basically wanted to have all of his grandkids be afforded a tertiary education and I got to do that, which is amazing. But that shaped my career in that I. I've run my own businesses since the age of 20 and basically sold them off as million dollar stores. I did that over a 15 year period. And then I went into heading a franchise council for an ASX company which was really exciting. Learning lots about operations and systemization there. And after that went into business coaching. So I did an MBA and I had some kids. So that was all lots of fun personally. But in terms of coaching, it's definitely where my heart lies and I've been doing that for the past eight years now.

That's amazing. How do you feel the parallels between coaching other business owners and running a business yourself?

It's very interesting. Yeah. When you're getting stuck in the weeds of it, it's hard to separate yourself from the strategic oversight. So I can definitely appreciate what everyone's going through and just the whole perspective of pulling yourself out and having that bird's eye view.

When we spoke about what we would talk about on this interview, I think a common theme that came through for me was that balance between personal life and business. And it's a really challenging one in the building industry in particular. And because of your experience running businesses and just knowing what it's like to be in the construction industry as well through your grandfather's eyes. What are some of those big challenges that builders face when it comes to getting that balance?

In my opinion, and this is from what I see daily as well as what I saw from My grandfather, I'd probably say that business never stops. You know, your, your personal life that can pause. There's those two elements. So you've got your business life and your personal life. So often we can only pick one that would drop off and it's easier to turn off personal as opposed to business. Builders, their business is all consuming, so they're managing clients, they're overseeing projects, they're dealing with suppliers and putting out fires even. So often when they go home, the stress is following them. And unlike a regular job, there's not like a clock off time. So you're actually contracted, which is. And it's a very long contract. One of the builders I worked for had three young kids and a wife, and they were feeling like a single parent. So it was your wife's perspective is one aspect. But you know, the builder's answering phone calls constantly on site, even on family holidays. He was sneaking in work. So the problem isn't so much that, you know, they're lazy or disorganized, it's more that it's a reactive space and a lack of control of time. So constantly being in survival mode. I think that the realistic part of it is that systemization, clear boundaries and those types of things become critical. If you don't fill your day with high priority tasks that inspire you, your day ends up being filled with low priority distractions that essentially don't. So scheduling time with intention and ensuring that your present, both from a business perspective and at home is a real critical aspect.

Yeah, it's an interesting way to frame it. Typically when people talk about, you know, neglecting their personal life, it's. It's in that frame of negative reference like neglection or whatever it is. But your point around pausing personal. And I'm sure it's a very common thing that builders experience out there, that work is just the number one priority all the time.

Yeah, absolutely. Builders take care of their projects very well, but they're often neglecting themselves. So things like burn out and high stress, even health scares, are super common. I know that I mentioned to you this before, but my grandfather suffered a heart attack in the 80s as a result of this. And what that did, it forced him to step back and reconsider how he operated the business. So it brought forward conversations around succession planning and starting to build or bring the family more into the business. So that it was a really tough shift for him, but ultimately it extended his life, gave him more time with his family. He ended up, which is pretty awesome, taking every winter off. So we're in Melbourne, Australia, and he spent three months every year in Queensland just enjoying himself and empowering the rest of the family. So the systems, the boundaries, the clear expectations, it's so critical to a thriving business.

I'm glad you said he went to Queensland because I was going to say, I don't know if you'd want to just take winter off and stay in Melbourne. No offense.

No, no. I've already gone from a jacket to a T shirt to umbrella all in one day.

Absolutely. I think something interesting you touched on there was having that it was an event, obviously your grandfather had was the heart attack that made him realize that he was working too hard and probably going through burnout and neglecting other parts of his life and all that kind of stuff. How do you have that without having, you know, a catastrophic health issue? Like, how can builders trigger that kind of change without having something like that happen?

That one is a very big can of worms there. It is dependent on other things coming into play as well. I'd probably start with looking at what the core issue here is like. Is it long working hours? Is it financial pressures, client expectations, blurred boundaries even? It could be a reluctance to delegate. So there's lots of things that sort of lead into that, but it's important to uncover that first you've touched on.

I mean, obviously your family relationship. Family is very common in the building industry. Whether you're working with a partner or working with a father, you know, father, son situation, or many, many different kind of dynamics in the building industry in particular, more so than most other industries in how do you balance the family dynamics with that? Personal and business relationships?

Family is unique and I guess that's because work and personal life, they become deeply intertwined. You're not dealing with employees, you're dealing with, as you say, you know, your father, your brother, your spouse, your kids, whatever that situation is. And it can either become a blessing or a curse. So one of the biggest struggles I think I see is unclear expectations. Just because your family doesn't mean you automatically understand each other's roles and boundaries and decision making styles. So if these aren't defined, the tension can build up and sometimes, unfortunately, resentment can creep in as well. A builder I coached was in business with his father and his brother, and his father was still making all the major decisions. But I should say, even though he was supposed to be semi retired, his brother was frustrated and he felt undervalued and my client was stuck in the middle. So when you're trying to please everybody, you're constantly clashing. It does take a toll on personal relationships. But what we did as the solution is that we created those clear decision making structures and we established who was responsible for what as well as what decisions needed to be made, like collectively. In doing that, we end up understanding who's wearing what hat, empowering the right people. And this is a great activity that you can do yourself as well, is just reintroduce yourself as your business role as opposed to your family role. Everyone needs an individual role. I can't stress that enough because when we double up, we end up with one of two things. And that is the first one is butting heads on the final decision or we end up doing nothing at all. And either of those is not a great scenario. So clear decision making 100% of the time.

Yeah, that's a great tip. Actually. Just getting really clear roles. I imagine that'd be common in like when a company is getting handed down in the generations, that either the previous generation might struggle to give up control or maybe they just give up control too easily and then there's no systems in place. I don't know.

Yeah, spot on, Will. Absolutely. In our family business, we ended up having to stick to business meetings in business hours because every time we met up for a family function, a birthday, Christmas, we ended up discussing business. And that is never where you want to be. So we have to make sure that we stick to the schedule and the structure is there in place.

No business chat at Christmas lunch. Is that the rule?

Yeah.

That must be hard as well though, because I guess if you're so. If business is your life, like it's something you're very passionate about and takes up a lot of your time. I mean, that's what else you're talking about.

Yeah, absolutely. Especially when it's a family legacy you're trying to build, you know, and you're trying to create financial stability for generations to come. The boundaries are very hard to maintain. Yeah.

Okay, well, shifting energy a little bit and moving away just from the family dynamics. What are some of the biggest differences you've seen builders make which have had a huge impact on their work life balance?

The biggest difference, and I would probably say this is hands down the biggest, most impactful would be a strong, clear vision. The reason why I say that is because many builders I work with are reacting to their business rather than leading it. They're caught up in that day to day chaos. No clear direction as to where they're actually going. So not having that clear direction, you end up feeling trapped in the business rather than in control of it, and then the business essentially starts to run you. So, and I can give you my grandfather's example. He was very clear in his vision. He wanted to build a business that would support his family for generations to come. But he structured everything around that goal. In his belief was knowledge, was power. So in saying that, he wanted us all to have that tertiary education, so that was such a clear vision for him. He knew the financial outcomes we needed to achieve in order for all of his grandchildren to achieve that. But in the same way, most builders today have struggled with the clearly defined goals. And so if you ask yourself questions such as, do you want to step back from operations in 5 years, 10 years, 15 years, do you want to transition the business into a new niche or maybe even scale the business, there's so many options that you can take, but everything needs to align to that vision. And that vision then helps with delegation and knowing what you need from other people in the room if you don't know where you're going. And I could probably use a different context here, which is easier to relate to. If we were going to go on a holiday somewhere in Australia and I didn't tell you exactly where we're going, how would you know what we needed to travel there in? So, a car, a boat, a train, a plane, how would you know the time frame? You know, what month are we going? What season? Do I need to bring bathers? Do I need to bring snow gear? Are we going to Mount Bulla? There's so many aspects that come into it. So without knowing exactly where we're traveling to, we're not going to know who's coming, how much money we need, et cetera.

And like you said about Melbourne, if you go to Melbourne, you'll need all of those different clothings.

Yeah.

Is it fair to say with that vision that it's important to have a personal aspect to that? Because it sounds like you could have a business vision. What seems to have been very powerful with your grandfather's example is the fact that it was connected to his personal aspirations as well.

Yeah, absolutely. The personal and business as they are intertwined, and you've gotta be very clear on both. And the personal vision is first, whereas the business vision is what's going to support that personal vision to come to life.

Talk to me about how a coach can help a builder improve their work life balance.

Coaching, yes. Coaching is crucial from my perspective. I obviously do it every day, but I believe that it needs to be growth Focused coaching can only work if it's growth focused. So I say that from my lived experience. But this is watching real builders trying to achieve work, life, balance, a coach. They're not just there to give advice, they're also there to ask the right questions and challenge your assumptions. They need to hold you accountable. That's a really big piece there. Many builders I work with are stuck in patterns that they didn't even realize. They're making decisions based on fear or people pleasing that short term urgency rather than strategy. So coaching can help in the sense of a lot of the elements I've already spoken about. So clarifying the vision so you stop feeling stuck identifying blind spots that are holding your business back and even just around creating systems and processes so that you get freedom, that accountability to follow through with that change is such a critical piece. And one of my favorite quotes which I actually got on the APB website is from John Maxwell. I think about it all the time. Change is inevitable. Growth is optional because change is going to happen whether we like it or not. The business will evolve, the industry will shift. You know, you're going to be thrown many curveballs in your life. So we always need to ask ourselves, am I going to grow through this or am I going to resist it? Because either way you need to make a choice as to being agile or stagnant and that change is coming whether we like it or not.

Yeah, I love that quote and I do remember it being on your profile on the app website. Yeah. Something you mentioned earlier, Carmel around how builders, they can kind of get lost in working all the time and putting out fires and getting caught in the day to day and all of that kind of stuff without coming up for air and having a perspective. The other thing you spoke about was within a family business dynamics, when you've got multiple different, I guess, priorities, for example, generational changes and things like that, and unclear roles of what role each person's playing. I imagine having a third party in those situations would be quite helpful 100%.

When you're stuck in the emotion of decision making, it can be quite challenging if we start to think about that. The coaching is an objective assessment. It's really about offering an unbiased perspective on everything you're currently doing and helping to identify those areas of improvement. So this can be things like goal setting and defining those clear, achievable goals. It can be around skill development, you know, through targeting, well, obviously enhancing your skills, but also with management, delegation and planning. Planning. Then the accountability aspect, I can't stress enough how much this makes major differences to the business as well as actually supporting system changes. So we are there sometimes as an emotional support around that motivation. But to navigate those challenges and maintain that focus for the wellbeing, that's very important.

Yeah. And I think if any builders are out there that are struggling to set those roles and expectations with partners or family members, if you've got someone else, a trusted third party who can help bridge that gap and allow the trust to build with someone else, then it's going to make those conversations a lot easier for you.

Yeah. 100%. Business is so interesting in the building industry. The mindset and leadership aspect and creating that balance. At the end of the day, success isn't just about the revenue. It's the time and health of the individual. You know, having the relationships that you want to enjoy. Money is never enough of a motivator. So it's what we choose to do with that money that's the real key.

Yeah, absolutely. And hopefully it doesn't take a big health event or something like that or a big business event to make builders make that smarter choice and try to engage with someone to help them out.

Yeah, yeah, exactly.

All right, Karmal, the million dollar question now. What's it like to work with you as a coach?

Million dollar question. My coaching style, I would say I'm very patient, but I'm very results driven. I will definitely ask tough questions, but I do like to put things in perspective and make sure that the top priorities are being driven first and foremost. So getting results every session is what's most important, as well as being heard and understood as an individual. It can be quite isolating in business. So I think being there as an ear and a sounding board is another really important aspect.

I can just to visualize it now. You'll sit there smiling at me and then call me out on something and I'll be like, wow, I really need to do that now.

Yes, I'll definitely hold the mirror up for you.

That's great.

Absolutely.

Well, Kamal, thanks so much for coming on Professional Builder Secrets today. I've loved having a chat to you and I hope for all the builders out there, you know, got to know you a little bit more and got some great tips on how they can balance work and personal life.

Awesome. Thanks, Will. Thanks so much for having me.

You're welcome. And a big thank you to our listeners wherever you are in the world. If you like the show today, please subscribe to Professional Builder Secrets on your platform of choice. And if you're feeling generous, leave us a review. But until next time, have a great day.