The SHOCKING Truth About Your Intuition—Zoey Greco Unlocks It All!

You know you need something, you're just not sure what. You've been listening, you're doing the work, but there's still this feeling that you're circling the same place, like you're waiting for the thing that finally moves you. Now maybe you've thought about working with me one-on-one. Maybe something's held you back, the timing, the money, or you're just not sure you're ready yet. I get that. And I want you to know there's still a place for you. I built a resource for exactly this moment, guided meditations for when the waves hit and you just need to breathe. Workbooks to help you get out of your head and onto the page, ebooks on what near-death experiences tell us about the people we've lost, and whether they're really gone, a full course for widows and widowers who are ready to find their way back to living, and a full course for the evidence of the afterlife. And all of it is available for pay what you want. Nobody gets turned away because of money. I think these resources are valuable, but I don't want to hold them back because you don't have the money to pay for them. You don't have to wait until you're ready for coaching. The next step might be a lot smaller than you think. To find out, go to grief2growth.com/store. That's grief, the numeral 2, growth.com/store. And check out the resources I've made for you.

Hi there, welcome to Grief to Growth Podcast. Your host is Brian D Smith, spiritual seeker, bestselling author, grief survivor, and life coach. Brian believes that the worst tragedies of life provide the greatest opportunity for growth. Brian says he was planted, not buried, and he is here to help you grow where you've been planted by the difficulties in life. In each episode, Brian and his guests will share what has helped them to survive and thrive. It is his sincere hope this episode helps you today.

Hey there, everybody. This is Brian D Smith back with another episode of Grief 2 Growth. And today I've got with me Zoe Greco and— Greco, I'm sorry, Zoe Greco. I want to read her bio and then we'll have a conversation like we always do. Zoe was born in New York City. She was raised in rural Connecticut, and she evolved in Southern California. And she's now rooted in Phoenix, Arizona. She's an obvious amalgamation of the influence she's experienced in her personal journey. She's an Aries Sun, Cancer Rising, and Sagittarius Moon. I'm gonna ask you to tell me what that means, because I don't know.

I will.

She's a striking balance of both passion and compassion. When she isn't sharing gifts as a spiritual guide, intuitive development mentor, or sound healing facilitator, She can be found bursting out of escape rooms with her— escape rooms with her husband, enjoying the indulgent pleasures of fine dining with friends or playing with her sitar alone in her studio. Her more philanthropic focuses are centered on intersectional inclusion and diverse representation, sustainability, animal welfare, and reproductive rights. So with that, I want to welcome to Grief to Growth Zoe Greco.

Thank you so much, Brian. I appreciate it. And I'm really excited to be here. I feel like the focus of your work, what you do and what you share is really, really important. I think that grief and the process of grief and experiencing our emotions is one of the most important things that we can do on a healing journey. And as someone who grew up and experienced a very severe traumatic event in my early teens, I spent about the next decade not grappling with my grief and my emotions and my feelings around that experience, regardless of the attempts on behalf of my parents to try and remedy that. Sometimes we're not able to feel grief until we're ready. And I think offering examples to people of what it's like to experience grief, to really be in your grief, and also to transcend your grief, to know that there's something on the other side of it is, a really beautiful example that people need to see. Because when you're inside of it, you don't always know that it can end. You don't always know that it's not permanent. You don't always know that it's a temporary state of being. And I think that what you're offering people is extremely significant and transformative.

Well, thanks. Yeah, I— that's what I believe also, um, having gone through the event that I went through, my— with the passing of my daughter, uh, I know that feeling of like, this is it. This is the end of my life. It's never going to get any better. I can never get out of it. So that's why I like having people on like yourself that can help people, just offer hope to people. And I was going to ask you about your— you're an intuitive. And so was this something that was since birth? Is this something that developed maybe after that event? Or how did that come about?

Yes. This is my natural state of being. This is how I came to the earth.. And it's interesting because, and especially in relationship to the topic of grief and empathy, I held on to my intuitive abilities throughout my lifetime, which is not super common. We're all born with powerfully intuitive gifts. We're all born deeply connected to where we just came from and where we will eventually go back to. But society, our upbringing, religion, a lot of different things close us in and create parameters that separate us from our own ability and our own spiritual self. And luckily, I had influences around me that supported the idea that even as a child, I was an intuitive being. And I also feel really blessed that that wasn't capitalized upon inappropriately or kind of taken advantage of. It was just I was, I was able to exist as I was, which is a huge, powerful blessing. However, I have been in the last couple years as I came into my 30s, been reclaiming the, the deep emotion that comes with being an intuitive person. And as you even as you just said the words, the passing of my daughter, I immediately was welling up with tears. And there is a specific gift called clair-empathy, where you can feel if people's feelings. And in my work as an intuitive person, and as a person throughout my life, I've always been extremely sensitive to other people's feelings, able to feel them as if they're my own, even when they're unspoken. So I can kind of be in a room with someone, and without even talking to them, I can feel whatever's going on inside of their emotional body. It's just one of the gifts that I possess and work with. But it's been extraordinarily helpful to me in helping people to experience grief, process grief, move through traumatic events, to be seen through eyes of complete unconditional compassion. I think that's something that we really don't experience very often. And people come to an intuitive session, at least with me, not necessarily these days focused on like, what are my— what should my lottery numbers be? But rather, here's my vulnerability. Here's my pain. Here's my wounds. Here's where I'm suffering. Help me see where I can go, how I can make the best choices to come out of this place and get into a place that is in alignment for myself. And being able to feel other people's feelings really helps me to sit with them in their experience so that A, they're not alone, but B, they feel seen, they feel validated, which often we don't receive in life. So I've kind of always been able to do that. This has always been who I am. And even when I tried to deny it or remove myself from this path, the path pulled me back in. I actually went to college and studied gender and Asian culture. And I had also been interested in potentially a path in journalism, kind of really focusing on the atrocities of the world, bringing them to light, creating awareness around things through writing. And the universe had very direct, different plans for me. And here I am today serving souls through my intuitive gifts.

Yeah, absolutely. Well, I agree with what you said. And it's a conclusion I've come to, I guess, over the course of the last several years, that we are all born still connected to the other side. And after having two daughters, and watching them grow up and hearing some of the things that they said when they were young, you know, and everybody could think about, you know, our kids saying things like talking about imaginary, we call imaginary friends, or things that they've seen, or, and we just believe the world's a magical place. And eventually, the world kind of, for most of us, kind of takes us out of that. And I know the reason I asked you about your traumatic event earlier in your life is because I know a lot of mediums who are intuitive, and a lot of them actually come from pretty tragic backgrounds. There's something about that, seems to keep that connection to the other side open. I guess it's out of necessity.

You know, there's kind of a movement right now. First of all, let me just say I've been in the spiritual industry since my early 20s. So it's been like about a decade now that I've been doing this. And it's a very fluid, changing landscape. It's a very evolving landscape being in the spiritual industry, community, field. And I would say that right now, we're experiencing a movement where there is a, almost like a mockery of empathetic people or like empaths in general, which I find super interesting. And I, you know, try not to personalize or like take in too much. I think we're all entitled to explore our feelings around things. But I've been really interested in this movement. Because basically, there's this idea that, that as an empath, you develop this ability because you experience trauma or an unpredictable parent or some kind of like unpredictable source, and you always had to be on your toes. And I think that that can be very true. I absolutely think that there's validity to that. I also think that there is validity to the idea that, that certain people are able to be and remain connected to supernatural abilities. And I do believe that there's crossover between those two populations. But I also really believe firmly that, at least for myself, I was like this before my trauma. And actually, my trauma disconnected me from my abilities because I was already so full of my own feelings of pain, of sadness, anger, that I wasn't able to take on anything from the outside world. Like, I really felt like I had to shut down what I was already able to do in order to protect myself. I don't actually— so I'm a— I host my own podcast as well. And I don't discuss my traumatic event because it impacts people who are too young to grapple with the information.

Sure.

And so I keep it privately to myself. But essentially, I've experienced a lot of trauma around my relationship with my dad and choices that he made in his life that caused a separation in my family. And the way that that occurred was deeply traumatizing and painful. And although I, you know, I want to just say I didn't experience any sort of like physical trauma from my father, a lot of emotional trauma from my father. And 10 years later, we are in a really beautiful, healthy, happy place. And even so, the trauma lives on, and it— I see it show up in all sorts of things. Luckily, it no longer manifest in my marriage, which was a thing that was going on, you know, in the early stages of our relationship when we were just dating. But I do believe very firmly that not only does it continue to teach me, like, I— it no longer controls me, but it teaches me. It, um, it invites me into opportunities of growth and self-knowledge, which I really am grateful for. It also gives me this incredibly deep power. And we all possess this through our trauma, to be able to understand other people's experiences on a deeper level. I experienced trauma as very unifying when, when we can exist in it consciously. When we exist in it unconsciously, it can be very isolating, it can be very separating. But I do believe that as we develop a better relationship to our experiences, it can be extremely unifying. And even if someone comes to me for a session that hasn't had the exact same experience that I've had, there's a frequency to each experience that we move through. And when you've experienced that, that thing yourself, you can recognize the frequency in someone else more easily. So for instance, people who have lost a child, people who have lost a spouse, people who have gone through sexual trauma, these experiences, although very unique to each person hold a frequency. And we can feel that frequency between each other. And it's actually one of the reasons that we experience, you know, traumatized people kind of being drawn to each other, and not always able to, like, have a healthy relationship. I definitely experienced that most of, if not all of my boyfriends in life before my husband had also had daddy issues. And we like really bonded through the frequency of daddy issues, like, you feel familiar? Does your dad mess you up? Mine too. And it was you know, the thing that unifies. And yet, when we were living through those wounds unconsciously, our union was, was toxic, unhealthy. But when we exist consciously in our trauma, we can, we can recognize that frequency, and instead really sit with someone and go, I know, I know what you've been through, I know what you're feeling. I felt it myself. And I like, I see you and what you're feeling. And there's something so powerful in knowing that someone else in the world can understand even just a little bit what you've, what you've gone through. And it's just one of the other ways that spirit helps us to come back into union, to experience oneness and to experience each other. We can experience each other through joy and through suffering.

Yeah. Wow. That was, I think that was an excellent observation that you made. A lot of what you talked about, because I did kind of put out that stereotype about empaths and intuitives and mediums, and there is some commonality to that. But as you said, it could also be the opposite. It can close us off. And I know people that have been that way. They were, they were intuitive. And then the world just kind of like, nobody would believe them, or they went through some other trauma. And you're just so feeling so much that you shut that part of yourself down. But there's also this, there's this kind of, it's become cliché now, everybody says I'm an empath, you know, like, so that's why people kind of make fun of that, right?

Absolutely.

I think you're right. We're all, we're all empathic to some extent. But when, we say, I'm an empath. That's what people I think are kind of making fun of.

Mm-hmm. Totally. And the truth is, like, if you can't laugh at yourself, you have a problem. Like, I think there was a time where I was a little sensitive to media representations of empaths or, you know, intuitive people. And as I've, as I've become more comfortable with my gifts, and as, as I've experienced more ownership and less imposter syndrome and all those things, now I'm able to laugh at it as well. And it is funny, like, I love— there's like a big TikTok trend right now, people like, you know, making fun of empaths in this really specific way. And I laugh every time, it's hilarious. But also, I think I'm able to laugh at that because I'm extremely secure in my empathetic self. And also, I, I also kind of avoid— there's several terms I've avoided in my life. I avoid the term psychic, because of the connotation of like, you know, the palm reader with the neon sign, you know, on the boulevard or whatever. I also have avoided the term empath, and I tend to identify as clairsentient or clairempathetic, meaning that you can feel intuitively information through your physical body or your emotional body. And so I think that, I think that it's important to be able to have humor around all things. It's a, it's a medicine, it's healing, it's powerful. But also, if there are people out there who had never heard of an empath, now that word is out there. And whether they have a positive or a negative relationship to it is okay because they're learning. And so I think it's important.

Yeah, I think it's really— it's important too. And you know, when you, when you use the term psychic, and that's a term that has a negative connotation too, because when— and we think about the person, you know, in the mall or the person that's at the fair or something, uh, and they tell us very, very general things, But I can tell you from experience, some of those people are very real. I have a friend that was telling me the story, it was incredible. He was younger, and he went to a psychic just as a joke. And she said, you're going to be married 3 times, and you can have 2 children that aren't your own. And this was when he was very young. And I'm like, that's pretty specific. Of course, 30, 40 years later, turns out he's been married 3 times, and he's adopted 2 children. And that's something— so people say, whenever someone says they're all fake, I think about that story that this guy told me. And I know, you know, that, that, that was very real. So, but the thing is, in the field you're in, the profession that you're in, there are people, I would say, there are people that are fake, they're frauds. There are people who just aren't very good. And then there are people who are actually legitimate. And those other two categories give the people that are legitimate you know, a bad name. And that's what— yeah, that's what we kind of have to laugh at, right? We have to say, okay, I can't take that too seriously.

Absolutely. I think even myself, um, one of the things that I have done always, because in my career I was so lucky and so fortunate to be successful kind of right off the bat, quite early, quite young, and my books were full, and there were people who, you know, could no longer afford to work with me, or there was not an opportunity, and they would ask me for referrals. And so I would consistently try to experience the gifts of other people in order to create a network for referral and people that I could trust. And I had horrible experiences. I, to this day, people will say like, who can you send me to? And I'm like, to be honest, I haven't really found another practitioner quite yet that I trust completely. Although I do think that that's, that's shifting. I'm coming into a lot of really powerful connections right now that I'm grateful for. But, you know, I've had people be like, oh, your grandmother's talking to me from the other side. And I'm like, which one because they're both still alive. So, right, right. You know, we— the other thing that we see is a lot of predatory energy, a lot of predatory energy in this industry where people will say, oh, I see something attached to you, it's going to cost you $3,000 for me to remove this energy from you. Not only that, but now in the world of technology, in this past year, I've had almost 20 fake accounts of me trying to sell people readings through DMs. And that is an epidemic right now on social media that a lot of readers are experiencing.. And it's ruining lives, ruining the lives of practitioners, ruining the lives of people. I actually, uh, while one of the accounts was up and running at the time, there were like 10, there was 10 at a time that I was dealing with. One of my very best friend's mothers sent me like $20 on Venmo. So I reached out to my friend, I was like, why did your mom send me this money? And she was like, oh my God, I think one of the scammers tried to get her. But luckily my friend's mom had already connected with me on Venmo. So she sent it to actually me instead of the scammer.

Scammer.

Um, and so that was a blessing because I wouldn't want anyone to lose $20 in the name of trying to work with me and not, not actually receiving that. Um, but I, I'm also— I feel super fortunate because I've built a strong community. Um, so I have, you know, 20,000 people out there that are like, you're a scammer, you're not real. Um, or, you know, wonderful clients who will send me emails and say like, this person tried to get me and I told them. And I'm like, thank you guys, that's so— it's so sweet to see the way that you know, the work that I do has positively impacted people to the point that they want to defend me, that they love me, and they want to support me. And so I feel so incredibly grateful for my community and my listeners on my podcast, my clients that I've had over the past decade, and the love that we share. And I think that I've been able to develop those relationships because there's authenticity in the work. Like when people come to session with me, I'm able to see them through the eyes of their guides, through like angels, through spirit. And spirit loves all of us, whether we are, you know, flawed or perfect, which of course none of us are. And to be able to see people in their perfection because of their flaws, because of their wounds, because of their journey, I just fall in love with every person that I work with. And I remember essentially every detail about what we've talked about or what we've experienced. It's imprinted itself upon me.. And I feel extraordinarily grateful for the opportunity to like genuinely serve souls. And I can see why other people would want to be in this industry because it's extraordinarily rewarding. However, we do have those, those out there who are taking advantage. And I think a lot of us out here who are doing the real work do try to educate and talk about, here are some signs of like what to avoid. If someone says this to you, like, don't give them your money. We do try to create kind of education around that and protect people because we want them to really experience healing and not scams or further trauma. Because we love them.

Yeah. Now, most of my listeners are all on my list, as I'm pretty sure would be familiar with what mediums are, right? So, so people know that there are mediums, and we know that there are psychics or intuitives.

Yeah.

And, you know, I've heard some mediums that will say, well, all mediums are psychic, but not all psychics are mediums. No, for you, what does it mean to be, to be an intuitive? Or what kind of things can you help people with other than winning the lottery?

Such a good question. So first of all, I just want to say I've never helped anyone win the lottery, and I wouldn't. I don't— if it's not in your karma, you're not, you're not going to win. And if it is in your karma, you're already going to know the numbers. They don't need me to tell you. So that's such an important question. And I have discovered in my life that there are certain things that I'm able to do and certain things that I've been discovered that I'm able to do that I'm not comfortable doing. And so just like any other line of work or any other, you know, attribute, you're going to want to draw boundaries around your work, you're going to want to establish parameters. So to give you a short example, when I was in college, this all started to really ramp up for me. I think spirit was trying to like really push me in a specific direction. And I still wasn't quite getting the memo. I was still like, no, no, I'm gonna be a journalist. And spirit was like, No, you're not. But I was walking out of my dorm. And I saw this girl that I really did not know. I knew who she was because I was in a smaller college. I knew who she was, I knew who her boyfriend was. But I had never spoken to her a day in my life. And we'd already been in school for like 2 or 2 and a half years at that point. And I saw her sitting on this bench. And I thought, oh, her boyfriend's gonna break up with her tomorrow. And I remember being like, That's none of my business. Like, I don't want to know that. I don't even know this girl. And sure enough, the rumor mill, you know, brought to my attention within a couple days that they had been broken up and what have you. And I remember in that moment thinking, I don't like that. I don't feel comfortable with that. So I created a boundary with spirit that I don't want to be the person that just knows, like, about everyone around me. I don't want to be the person that approaches the lady trying to buy broccolini, telling her that her dead so-and-so is trying, you know, like, I personally wouldn't want someone approaching me while I'm shopping for broccolini. I don't want to be the person that comes in. And it feels to me like an energetic assault. I think there are people out there who would love to have that experience. I'm not one of them. And so, golden rule, you give what you want to get in life. And so I told spirit, I don't want to know things about people unless we enter into an exchange where they know that's what's going to happen. I know that's what's going to happen. So for me, session work is extremely important because it creates that parameter, it creates that boundary and that container in which I've agreed to receive information, they've agreed to receive information, and we've agreed to do that together. Also, in college, that was when I started being able to communicate with people who had passed on. And I was not a fan of that, because people that are— that have passed on, at least for quite some time, are still themselves. And so if your great-aunt Bessie gave bad advice in life, she's gonna give bad advice in death, at least, you know, for a while, until she begins to kind of assimilate back into just energy. And so what— I don't know, it's— it put me kind of— I felt very in the middle, it felt very triangulated in a lot of those circumstances. So I think there are people who are like, that's what I love to do. I'm not so much. However, I have done— I have— I continue to do that work if I feel really called to. So I recently just spoke with a client who her father passed away from COVID And she needed deeply to hear from him, deeply to get messages. And he did come, he did come through and was very polite about it. He was like, would you mind if I just spoke to— and I was like, you know what, you guys are both being really cool about this. Yes, I'm happy to be in the middle. There have also been circumstances where I had a, I had two clients, or a married couple that were a little older, and their beloved Shih Tzu passed away. They asked me to help find her reincarnated soul. And so I actually did, we did that. It's a very long story. But that dog also ended up dying from the exact same condition in the exact same spot in her spine as the previous dog, like, and it's a very long story. It's a great one. And one that, you know, maybe I'll tell another time. But the point being, you know, there are times when I feel comfortable doing that kind of work. And there are times when I don't feel comfortable doing that kind of work. And it's just about, you know, the same way that you would feel comfortable talking to some people and not other people like, and for me, I've discovered that energy is truly a currency. And if I feel that I'm in a situation or circumstance, where I feel that I am being drained and something is not feeling fulfilling for me, then something is out of alignment. And for me, an energy exchange can be as simple as I'm giving something to a client. And it feels good to do that. When it doesn't feel good, I know that something is a little off. But essentially, to answer your actual question, I told you I was good at talking. Essentially, to answer your question, the work that I'm primarily focused on is helping people to understand and be able to receive information from their guides to help them make choices that are in their highest alignment. Essentially, we have the ability to go down any number of infinite paths of possibility from where we stand. And there are some paths that are more likely than others, like it's more likely that I'll live a peaceful existence than that I will somehow become addicted to meth. And, you know, go like, that's just not super likely based on the trajectory of my energy. But there are still millions of paths that are possible from the trajectory of my energy. And so my job is to receive their questions, to hear where, you know, what it is that they're looking for, and to channel information from their guides to help them know what steps they can take, what actionable moves they can make from where they stand, to be able to move down the path that they desire or the path that would lead them into the highest good. So sometimes people will come to me, I'll either validate what they're looking to do or redirect what they're looking to do to make sure that they are in alignment, that they are walking toward fulfillment. And as humans, our desire, our, our sense of desire is extraordinarily strong, and can pull us away from what we need, or what is ultimately in our highest good, because we get attached to want very easily. So sometimes it's useful to have someone unbiased who doesn't know you be able to say, what you want is not necessarily the most supportive to you. And I think that happens the most around love, people being like, I really want to get back together with them. And I'm like, I don't think you do. If you really think about it, like, I don't think that's what would be the best. And spirit will support you in, in making decisions like that. So it can range from anything around love, purpose, you know, personal power, healing, moving through grief. Um, it— I can't say that there's a topic that I haven't discussed. Um, and every— I even— I have billionaire clients who will give me a list of names and say, who should I hire? You know, what, what stock prices can I expect? Um, should I buy this house? Um, you know, it can range from the minute to the, to the grand.

So this brings up a, a really deep question that's— it's a debate, right, between free will and predestination, right? So you said that you got a message, this girl's boyfriend was going to break up with her next day. So what is your personal belief? And I'll break this into a couple of parts. So the first part I'll ask is, when you get a message that something is going to happen, does that mean it's going to happen, that it's likely to happen? What does that mean?

We'll get back to Grief 2 Growth in just a few seconds. Did you know that Brian is an author and a life coach? If you're grieving or know someone who is grieving, his book Grief to Growth is a best-selling, easy-to-read book that might help you or someone you know. People work with Brian as a life coach to break through barriers and live their best lives. You can find out more about Brian and what he offers at www.grieftogrowth.com, www.grief2growth.com. Www.growth.com. If you'd like to support this podcast, visit www.patreon.com/grief2growth, www.patreon.com/grief2growth to make a financial contribution. And now back to Grief 2 Growth.

Stay with us.

We'll be right back.

You know, one of the hardest things about grief? Most of the people in your life just don't get it. They want you to be further along than you are. They get uncomfortable when you bring it up, so you stop bringing it up. And that's why I started writing. My Substack is where I go deeper. Thoughts I don't always get to in the podcast. Essays on consciousness, on continuing bonds, on what it actually means to carry a loss and still build a life. My life. The stuff that used to keep me up at night, written out in a way that I hope meets you in the morning. But here's what I didn't expect when I started it: the community that showed up. People who are doing exactly what you're doing— listening, learning, trying to find their footing. Readers who comment, who share their own stories, who remind each other that none of us are as alone in this as we feel. And that's what the Substack has become— a place to go deeper with me, and to find your people. It's free to subscribe. Find me at grief2growth.com/substack. That's grief, the numeral 2, growth.com/substack. Or just go to Substack and search for Grief to Growth. I hope to see you there.

I'm really obsessed with your questions. I have to just say that I think you're asking incredibly interesting questions. And this might be my favorite podcast interview I've ever done.

Thank you.

Um, so I just, I really am enjoying this conversation. So thank you. Such a good question. So you're right, free will is huge. And there are certain aspects of life in which free will plays a larger part than other aspects of our lives. There are things that we are destined to experience. And then the way that we move through the world and respond to what we were destined to experience is up to our free will. So the truth is, most times, our trauma, a destined experience, something that our soul needed to experience and learn in order to expand in this lifetime. There are smaller decisions all the time that are less destined. For instance, I have a problem, I drink a lot of matcha. And I had the choice this morning not to make this matcha, knowing that I probably made a little too much, it was going to affect me, it's going to change my energy, it's going to change my appetite. I had the power to decide not to make this. I also had the power to decide to make it, which obviously I took advantage of. And it's those smaller choices that can ripple out into the rest of our life and shift the way that we move it. That's what kind of takes us down those infinite paths of reality, infinite paths of possibility. But ultimately, there are like milestones, things that you're just supposed to come to on the path, but your way to them is absolutely yours to decide. And I think that, at least I know that I've learned that love is one of the things that is very much up to human free will. And people are quite attached to the idea that there is like one person for us, like a soulmate. And from my experience, from my channeling and the work that I've done, I find that that's not the case. So I am a very happily in love married person. My husband is honestly my favorite person on the planet. I can't imagine that it's possible that I could love someone more than him. But I know that it's possible. It is true. There are quite a, quite a number of people that we can each merge our energy with. And we choose, I chose my husband. I could have equally chosen another person that spirit would bring into my path. But there was something that just felt like this is a choice that I feel good about making. I have many intuitive friends who are in relationships, and they can see the alternate possibilities, like they can see that there's another person that could come into their path or another person that that could, you know, find their way into their life, and they are comfortable with the fact that they have chosen their person, their partner. So that's just an example. For instance, as well, right, like, it's my destiny to be connected to my intuition. But the way that I use my intuition, the way that I've chosen to serve, is ultimately my choice. I could have devoted myself to being a, you know, a psychic detective, and I could have devoted myself to assisting the police, or I could have used it to enhance my ability as an investor, right? Like there's certain ways that intuition serves us in big and small ways. I could have chosen any number of ways to use that gift. But I had this gift, it was part of my destiny. It's part of my, my personal journey. And I've chosen to exercise it in a certain way that feels right for me. We co-create our lives, we co-write our story. And we actually have a lot of power to author this story before life. We write these things called soul contracts. And soul contracts feature some of the experiences that we've had. And we know that those are things that must, must, must happen. And everything else is, is up to us to, to come here and to experience and to navigate, which is the exciting part of life. I—

Zoe, I've asked that question of I can't tell you how many people, and that, that was my favorite answer. That was— I think the way you put it was so— and because that's a conclusion I've come to, it's not either or. And in our human way of thinking, and I'm very I'm a very left-brained kind of logical person. We think, okay, well, which is it? It's got to be one or the other. And it's got to be either it's determined or it's not. And I think it's both. I think there is free will. And I like the way you put it, we've got these guidelines or these milestones that we're going to hit, but our path between those could be different. And so there we do, it's not just an illusion of free will. No one said that Zoe had to make matcha this morning. But, you know, the bigger things I do believe are planned. I think that they're planned, not by some external force, but by ourselves.

Well, we are the external force, like, especially as we, as we come together, like in unity, we are spirit. So for instance, people ask me all the time, like, who are you talking to? Like, when you're talking to spirit, when you're talking to spirit guides, like, who who is that exactly?

Right.

And what I've learned is that we are all, whether we are visible or non-visible, energetic beings, simply different aspects of a larger energy source, which has this innate intelligence. So when, when you were created, when, when the soul that you possess, whether it's Brian, or whether it's who you've been in past lifetimes, whoever that is, right, you were created and plucked from the collective energy into an individual being. And when you were created, there were, there were non-visible pieces that were plucked and assigned to you to move with you through your incalculable lifetimes, all the lifetimes you've lived, the one you're in now, and all the ones you're going to live. They were assigned to you. And those are your spirit guides. And people have a hard time with that concept because they're like, there's pieces of spirit that are there to just serve and support and guide and love me? Me? Like, I get that. Oh, yeah. Oh, yeah, you do. You're so loved. You're so protected. You're so supported. You're so cared for. And those energies, like I said, move with you through all your lifetimes. And they have this like infinite wisdom and knowledge. There's also the piece of ourselves known as the higher self, which is the part of you that knows what it is, that knows that it's energy, that knows that it's part of the collective, and can see through every direction of time and space. And I would say that that voice, in connection with your guides and the greater innate knowledge, is your intuition. It speaks to you from the inside and goes, I really think if we go that way, we're gonna like it. And it's that— it's when we are able to discern that voice from the voice voice of our ego, that we become empowered and able to make the most wonderful free will choices that will bring us closer to where we desire to be, rather than, you know, taking us on these detours. Ego can really get you spinning in circles, can get you stuck and kind of stagnant for a long time, whereas intuition is very progressive. Like, it really moves you if you can listen to it. And if you can learn to discern those voices, and essentially, that's where my work has shifted out of client work as a focus and into this intuitive development mentorship program where I use mind hacking, positive psychology, as for which I think appeals to your left brain self, and also spiritual principles to help you override ego to help you understand and discern between those voices and learn how to hear the whispers of spirit over the screaming of ego. And it's a really cool process. And I love going through it with people. And the the variety of people that come forward to have that experience are so fascinating. Like, I mean, I'm in a current cohort right now. And I have two reality television stars, a billionaire, a trucking company owner, like I just have like a wide array of people. And no matter who you are, you want to know how to hear your higher self, you want to know how to hear your guides and how to be connected. And it's such a, it's such a beautiful gift. Because I found that I was doing this for other people all the time, right? Like, I'm, I'm like a phone line. I'm like, okay, you have this question. Okay, your spirit guides are answering with this message. Let me translate that and give it back to you. And I was like, what if I just connected the line? What if I just remove myself from the equation, and empowered people with this ability to do them do this themselves, or at least remind them that they have this ability already and teach them how to access it, how to wake it up, how to use it. And so that's become like the focus of the work that I do.

Yeah, I think that's awesome. And it reminds me again, I work with a lot of mediums who— that's what they do. They connect, they connect us to our loved ones. And I've found that many of them as they go forward in their career, for a variety of reasons, move out of just doing one-on-one client work to, I want to teach you how to do this. And it sounds like that's, that's the phase that you're in now, where It's— I'm helping people. And I don't even like the idea of developing our intuition. It's more like rediscovering it or tapping into it. I think, I think it's just, as you said, it's part of who we naturally are. And this idea of the higher self is just, that's us. That's, that's not something, you know, external to that. That's just, it's kind of like we have this image of it being out there and up there, but it's actually more like in here.

Absolutely. I actually have a question for you, if that's okay.

Yeah, sure.

Have you already written a book, or are you preparing to write a book?

I've written a book.

So one of the things that, like, I feel unavoidably around your energy is authoring. Um, and I feel like there's a lot of, of writing that's going to continue to take shape from you. Um, and I, I actually am so excited to read what you create and what you've already created. Actually, I'd love to get a copy. Um, because I think that your innate wisdom is very strong. And my impression of your energy is that like, as you, as you write, you're channeling, like you're receiving a lot from your higher self, from collective consciousness, and delivering it in a way that human beings can really receive and understand. And I think there's a lot more writing that you're going to do. So I would love to see how that manifests for you in the future.

Well, thanks. That's, that's interesting. Actually, the day after my daughter passed, I started my blog. So I don't know how many entries there are now. There are probably 1,000 entries. So there's, there's a lot of stuff I've written, but it's a matter of organizing it and getting it into some sort of a format that people can read. But I have written one, one short book about, about grief. But yeah, I appreciate that. So, so some of the questions I had written down to ask you, we've already gone through. But I'm curious about the name of your website, Merhippsy. What is that?

Yeah, I got a story about that.

Yeah.

So Merhippsy is a portmanteau, which is a— which means a word made of other words. So I developed the brand or the identity. It's really my alter ego. It's like who I am when I'm my hippie spiritual self. Because I'm also just very human, right? Like, I, I love bad television, sugary cereal, you know, I'm not like a, I'm not completely like a crunchy hippie type. But when I am, I am the merhipsy. And when I developed this identity, the spiritual world was, it had a very different climate. And I frankly, as a white person, had a lot of things that I needed to learn. And so merhipsy is actually a portmanteau of the words mermaid, hippie, and gypsy. But I've since learned that gypsy is not an acceptable word term. It's not something that I can use. And so I've removed it from the definition and kind of the expression of Merhibsi. But I have kept the name because I think there's power in ownership of the things that we learn and the mistakes that we make. And so I really, I love talking about it. And I love saying like, yeah, I didn't know that I learned that I stopped. And that's what you do. And you'd be shocked at the amount of people that I talk about this with. And I tell them, I tell it to or just like talk about it. I made like a big announcement on social media like, hey, I've been doing this, just want you guys to know, I shouldn't, you shouldn't, we shouldn't use this word. And people just so defensive over it. It's like, what the shit do you care if you can keep saying the word gypsy? Like, just doesn't really affect your life. Just stop saying it. But yes, that is what the Merhipsy is. And it is my alter ego who is like this very ethereal mermaid hippie, like wanderlustful being. And actually, I was living in Thailand and doing anthropological studies of their third gender population and sex workers careers and things at the time that I developed that identity. And actually, while I was there, I attended this spiritual festival, like yoga festival thing. And there was a woman there doing card readings, intuitive readings, using the exact same decks that I had had since I was about 7 years old. And I still have them to this day in a drawer right in front of me, along with all my other ones. And I remember thinking, This lady could like travel the world doing readings for people with these decks, these decks that I own, these tools that are accessible to me. Like, if she can do this, I can do this. And it was kind of around that time that I began to think like, who could I be if I was living this life to the fullest extent? And the answer was the Merhipsi. And so now I honestly will still get sometimes stopped on the street, or people will message me and they think it's my actual name, or they think that's my last name. Yeah, just cute.

Yeah.

But no, just a portmanteau that represents my alter ego and my, my inner self.

Yeah, I'm glad I asked. That's a really interesting story. So for people, for us, for people that say, I'm not intuitive, I can't do this, I don't, I don't get this. So what, what is it that causes that? What blocks us from, from tapping into our intuition?

Such a good question. For a lot of people, it is the misunderstanding of intuition as something scary. A lot of people perceive it as like a door that opens that you can't control. Once it's open, just anything can get through, kind of like a Ouija board. People are like, you don't know who's on the other side of it. I, in all my work, have just not encountered dark. I've encountered lost souls, I've encountered mental illness, I've encountered, you know, people who are living in their own darkness, but I haven't experienced like a demon or something, you know, like, I don't, I don't mess with that. And also, I haven't found it. So I'm not, I'm not convinced that it's there personally. So I think a lot of people have fear around what being intuitive or being connected to intuition is and what it does in your life. Especially because of mainstream media and the way that it's portrayed being a psychic person or being an intuitive person, or, you know, what happens when you're, when you're open to the spiritual realm. I think there's a lot of fear that's created there. Also, blocks as a, as a result of religious upbringing. I don't believe that religion is a bad thing. I don't believe that religion is negative or harmful. I believe that it can separate you from aspects of yourself to serve its own agenda. When, when you become reliant on someone else, whether it's a priest or a pastor or a bishop or a nun or whatever, a guru, to be your guiding source, and to tell you how to live and what to do, you do relinquish your own personal power to the thoughts of someone else or the beliefs of someone else or a collective. And so I do think that intuition is seen as outside of what is acceptable in certain religions. My husband grew up Mormon. And, you know, it's not necessarily appropriate to receive answers on behalf of other people, from what I understand, from what I've received from him. He obviously supports me and loves me and loves the work that I do. But in his upbringing, he's explained to me, oh, you know, this isn't what we learned. And I believe that's true. In a lot of different religions. And many, many, many people that I work with have experienced religious trauma, and they're trying to overcome it. And they also experience fear of what happens when you open that door. Also, just the idea that you can't— society tells you like, that's not real. That's, that's make-believe. That's woo-woo. That's for Harry Potter. That's for fairy tales and storybooks. So all of these ideas that are just put upon us and put upon us and put upon us, that can create huge blocks, as well as when we do use our intuition, and it is negated by other people. Now, you can be right, you can be clear, your intuition can be highly performative. And by that I mean functional. But if the people around you are denying your reality, or changing the narrative, or telling you that you're wrong. That can be extremely traumatic. And just like any part of us that can close as a result of trauma, your third eye, your intuitive self can, can recoil in the face of trauma and cause blocks. And if someone tells you your whole life, you're not, you're not really seeing that, that's not real, that's not possible. That's the narrative that you're going to fall into and believe. And so having someone there to say, it is possible, it is real, you were right, you were seeing this, this is totally true for you. That can almost feel even scarier, because you become comfortable with the narrative that it's not, that you're not, that it can't. And so it can actually be quite jarring for people to be told, you're intuitive, and you can do these things, you can see these things, because they're like, like, that doesn't feel safe. Last time I tried that, I got yelled at, I got told I was wrong, I got sent to my room, I got grounded, I got hit— whatever that could be. There's consequences. And so it gets associated with consequences.

Yeah, I think that's really important. And it brings me back to something you said at the, at the very beginning, this, this energetic connection that sometimes we have because of a shared or similar traumas. I'm part of an organization called Helping Parents Heal. And it's for parents who have had children who have passed on. And the connections that we have were just so amazing and usually like immediate. I mean, you meet somebody, we've had one, we had one conference, it was in, it was in Phoenix, in Scottsdale, about 3 years ago. And just the connection that we all had there, people in the hotel were like, what is, who was that group? What's the group over there? And it's like, oh, those are the parents of the dead kids. But we were all just so thrilled to be around each other. And, but the thing is, there's so much fear. Like, people want to connect to their child, you know, you want to connect, but religion tells you, no, you can't do that. That's not right. You know, I had a dream about her, you know, the other night, and people tell me, well, that's not real. So it's really important to get with people that will validate your experience. And that, that's what I wanted to get around to. It's like, stop listening to people to tell you it's not real.

I can't even tell you how powerful that is. And in fact, dreams and the dream space is one of the easiest spaces for spirit to communicate with us. So many times a deceased loved one will come through in your dreams and tell you things. They really— they just know it's one of the easiest ways to get your attention.

There's—

you're not doing anything, right? Like, there's nothing you're doing. They know that they can get through at that time. It is so powerful. And there's so much healing in the messages and the experiences that you can share with someone in the dream space. So absolutely, that's a real, real, real experience. But you're absolutely right, that there is like we talked about unity, sometimes in trauma, trauma can be so unifying, because there's, it feels, it feels like when you're going through trauma that no one in the world can understand that no one else has ever been in so much pain that no one else has ever gone through what you're going through. And I myself, you know, felt very isolated in my teen years as my family was falling apart, thinking I'm the only person that is going through this because I was the only person that I knew that was going through that. But as I got older, it was like, oh, your family went through that? Oh, your family had this? We are so good at tucking our trauma away, tucking our wounds, putting away our messiness. Hiding it behind closed doors so that we can look normal. But the truth is, having a messy life is normal. My— I use my husband as an example all the time because he had a very peaceful, loving, joyful upbringing. His two— his parents love each other. They still hold hands everywhere they go, like sweet, beautiful couple. He's the freak. I don't know anybody who's had a bad upbringing like that except for him. And all of my friends and I were always like, oh, our trauma, our childhood, or this and he's like, yeah, that seems— that sounds like it was probably really hard. We're like, nah, shut up. You don't get it. Like, you don't know what it's like to have family trauma. Like, yeah, shut up. You know? And I always think it's so funny to kind of almost like, to almost like pick on him and like single him out as like, oh, you had a normal, happy, healthy childhood. Because when we're going through our wounds in childhood, and we're going through that like family trauma, we think, oh my god, no one goes through this too. So when you do finally find it, when you do finally find people who can validate your experiences, it, it is such a healing moment, because you realize you're not alone anymore. Not alone in your pain, even though that person didn't go through exactly what you went through, and vice versa. There's something that you can share in that experience that makes you feel a little less alone, a little more understood. And it brings us back into unity. And unity is our subconscious goal. That's why we're so obsessed with love. That's why we're so obsessed with family. That's why we're so obsessed with these ideas of like how we can connect to people, because all we want to do is get back to oneness. And that's the closest we can get in this lifetime, because we don't really get back there till we die.

So yeah, well, it's such a— as you said, I thought about when I was a little kid, I hated the fact that we're like all separate beings. I was like, when I was like, why are we separate? It. And I just, I just really didn't understand that as a kid. But as we grow up, we kind of learned to accept it. But you're right, I think the one thing we're always seeking is getting back to that oneness, making that connection with other people at a really deep level that we rarely experience while we're here in the body.

Yeah, you're absolutely right.

So I wanted to ask you about your, your Intuitive Development Program. What is that like? And So we'll start with that. So what's, what's your Intuitive Development Program like?

Absolutely. It is a 30-day immersive experience. It's experienced virtually. And it is a group experience because we love community, we love oneness. And there are people all over the world who want to do this stuff, want to experience this stuff. And there's nobody around them that they can talk to about it. So bringing people together to experience this, this journey was very important to me. And it's been so beautiful to see these cohorts one after the other after the other, just be friends and love each other and support each other. So for 30 days, we have a morning and an evening routine that is based on mind hacking, positive psychology, as well as practices of spirituality. Your brain recycles 90% of its thoughts from day to day. So if you can begin to infiltrate that very like automatic way of thinking with the things that you want to be thinking about, you're actually able to form new neural pathways. There's a lot of different ways that you can do that. And so because society, because life tells us constantly, you're not intuitive, you can't, you don't, you blah, blah, blah, blah, blah, it's not real. That's the neural pathway that we've developed. So this whole protocol is actually based on developing a new neural pathway. There's a series of 11 lectures that talk about mindset, the power of the mind, neuroplasticity, understanding concepts like your ego, your intuition, your intuitive type, And then over those 30 days, you have 24/7 access to me through an app where we can talk to each other and I can answer questions for you. Because intuition isn't like a one-size-fits-all thing, we all experience it a little bit differently. And so my goal is to sit with each individual as much as I can and help them identify how they receive intuitive information so that they can become habituated to it, they can recognize it more easily and therefore act upon it more easily. There's also certain tasks you have to do each day as well as a daily assignment, because it's It's been found that you are able to create new neural pathways 400 times faster through play, through games, through fun. And so there are daily activities and assignments that are based on some of those principles, as well as the idea of play. So for instance, today their assignment is to work with Zener cards, which are these cards that have 4 or 5 different sets of 5 shapes. And you have to kind of practice your precognition of knowing which one is on the other side, which shape is on the other side. And I think it's, you know, although it's one of our more playful assignments, I think it's so important. Play is just such an important part of reclaiming your intuitive self, especially because our inner child, who we were as we came to this earth, is powerfully intuitive. And play connects you back to your inner child. So it brings you back to your most authentic, automatic self. So for 30 days, we do this morning-evening routine, these daily activities. And there are also weekly lectures where I teach you about reading oracle cards, interpreting and understanding auras, using a pendulum as a divination tool, spiritual hygiene, crystals, different tools that you can use as an intuitive being to care for yourself or work with others. And I have to say, it's probably my favorite thing I've ever done in my career. And I've done a lot of really cool things that I'm really grateful to have experienced. And this is by far my favorite.

Yeah, it sounds, it sounds awesome. I'm actually in about the middle of a 7-week coaching course course. And it's similar, that there's an app, there's exercises all during the day, and then, you know, different things like that. And I think it's really, really important to— you can't just sit down and hear something one time. You can't just, you know, read a book. It's really got to become a habit. It's got to be something that you do. So I like the idea of this 30-day thing where it's something every day. It's really intense. And it could be really uncomfortable. The thing I'm doing right now, there's a lot of shadow work involved in it, which I'd never really done quite at this level before, uh, because at first it feels like, okay, I'm falling apart. But, uh, yeah, but that's the way you, you make the breakthrough. So I really love the way that that's designed. And, and you're right, the, the science of it really appeals to me, the mind hacking, because our brains, we do tend to think a certain way, and you've got to, you've got to break that cycle. You got to say, okay, no, we're— this is the way we're going to think from now on. And that requires daily practice.

Absolutely. You also brought up an important point. And as I was listening to you, I was just moving through every step of what you were saying. And so I've actually lost my train of thought around it. But something you just said really struck me. And when I listened back to this episode, I'll remember it and I'll, and I'll message you. But it was very powerful.

That sounds good. So tell me about your podcast.

Oh my gosh. I am the host of the Mystic Rebel Podcast. I've published 2 oracle decks, and my product line is called Mystic Rebel. So it made sense that my, my podcast would be called Mystic Rebel. And I share real client sessions, because when I was doing these sessions, I found that there were so many, like, patterns in what people were going through. And I thought, man, I know this other client I just had would have had such an important breakthrough from hearing that, or it really struck me like this medicine is for the masses, because we're each a microcosm of the greater. So So people do agree to share their client sessions. I'm not just like picking my favorites and putting them out there. It's all anonymous. I protect people's identities. And so two of the sessions each are— two of the episodes each month, because it comes out once a week, are client sessions. Then I usually feature an interview similar to this with a practitioner who I think is doing work that people might not have heard of, helping people to become more familiar with modalities that exist out there for healing.. And then I also will do monthly a solo episode where I pick a topic that I feel like is worth tuning into and discussing. And it's based— it's usually predicated on some sort of spiritual topic. But I just find that it's, it's medicine for the collective. It's just about hearing yourself in, in other people, recognizing your own journey in other people's journeys, again, about feeling less isolated. And then also having pathways to understanding how you can begin to approach your healing through this wide array of modalities that exist that are so supportive and helpful, that we may never even have heard of. But I think being a fly on the wall in a spiritual coaching session is also very powerful. Because there are so many people out there who are afraid to have that experience. And when they hear what it's actually like, they're like, oh, that's exactly what I've been wanting. And for me, especially, it's changed my relationship to client work, because people who do now want to have a session with me, I'm basically only doing sessions for the podcast. They're almost like these perfectly pre-qualified leads of exactly the type of person that I would like to work with, because they hear what I'm putting out there. And they're like, that's what I want. And they just come in with like, this open, loving, positive energy that's so easy to tune into. Again, just fall in love with them. So that's the focus of my podcast. I've been— I'm on season 5, if you can believe it. And I feel like every season, I just get more and more excited to do the work. I'm just loving it every second.

Yeah, that sounds— I love that. Because, you know, again, sometimes we're like, what is this about? You know, because I actually did a past life regression not too long ago with someone. And I did it for the podcast because she, she follows me for the podcast. And she said, I want to do this with you. And I said, great, that way I can tell people what it's like. And I was like, I don't know if that's really, you know, if I really want to do that. And it was awesome. It was a great experience. But and so when people can see this, can see what the session's like without putting the risk of going through it, that's a, that's a great way for you to give that to people. And sometimes we can heal just by listening to other people, because we realize that we're all, we're all unique, but we're all the same. We're all very much a lot, a lot more alike than we like to believe we are.

Very true. Absolutely.

Zoe, we're coming to the end of our time. Um, I, uh, really enjoyed meeting you. Um, it's been, it's been just a great experience having this conversation. I'd like to give you the chance to say anything you'd like to say before we close today.

Wow, it's a very open invitation. I appreciate that. Um, I just want to tell your listeners that I love them, that what they're moving through, what they're going through. The fact that they are tuning in and going on this journey with you is such a courageous step for them to take. It takes such deep courage to face our pain, to face our grief, to want to heal, to expand, and to grow through pain is so incredibly courageous. And I really know and believe and feel that when you do the work, work, you come out on the other side of it in a very profound way. And I also would love to thank you, Brian D Smith, for being here, for doing this work, for facilitating, for creating the space, because you are a container for healing for many, many people. And it's a selfless thing to do. You could keep all this knowledge and wisdom and experience to yourself, but you don't. You share it. And that is, again, a courageous thing and a loving thing and a selfless thing.. And I just am grateful that you exist and that you're doing this work. And we're all luckier because you are here.

Thanks. Great meeting you. Have a great rest of your day.

Thank you so much.

Thanks for listening to Grief to Growth. Brian hopes that you find this episode helpful and will come back for future episodes. Brian's bestselling book, Grief to Growth: Planted, Not Buried, is a great resource for anyone who is coping with grief. Grief or know someone who is. If you enjoy the podcast and would like to support it, there are 3 things you can do to help. The first is to share the podcast with someone that you think it will help. The second is to go to iTunes, rate and review the episode. The third way you can support the podcast is by becoming a patron. Head over to www.patreon.com/grief2grief Growth. That's patreon.com/grief, the number 2, growth, and sign up to make a small monthly donation. Patrons get access to exclusive bonus content and knowledge that you are helping to spread the message of grief to growth. For more about Brian and grief to growth, visit www.grief2growth.com.

Hi there, I'm really excited to tell you about my latest ebook. It's 4 lessons that you can learn from the near-death experience without going through all the trouble of dying to learn them. I've been studying NDEs for several years now. I am completely convinced that not only are they 100% real, but that there's some very universal wisdom that we can get from the near-death experience. And I've distilled that down in this book into 4 short lessons. And I've also given you all the reasons why I believe the NDEs are absolutely real. So go to www.grieftogrowth.com/NDElessons to pick it up for free. www.grief2growth.com/NDElessons. I hope you enjoy it.