Season 3 Finale

Foreign.

I'm charlie redding.

And I'm claire fudge and this is.

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Yes, good, thank you. How are you?

I am good, thank you. I'm good. I am fully recovered from COVID starting to build the training back up and yeah, I'm, I'm feeling like I'm starting to get. I'm almost back to full fitness. I would not full fitness as in kind of like my race numbers, but full fitness as in post illness.

Yeah.

And it just takes time, doesn't it? I think it's, you know, having Covid, I think it's very much about being patient and as athletes we like to kind of get to the finish line quickly, but it proves it pays off. So it's really good that you're feeling better.

Yeah, it's good to have yours. Your advice and Will's advice to, to keep me on the straight and narrow and not, not play up. And how's your training going? You've been racing again I think, haven't you? You would rate, you've raced every. Almost every.

I have been racing. I've raced a couple of times. Last week I, I did a classic. I could have won, but last week, um, I, Yeah, I went 10 miles out of my way on a middle distance race which wasn't ideal.

But still finished.

I still, I think I scraped in fourth with an extra 10 miles.

That's pretty good going.

Yeah, it was pretty hilly 10 miles. But actually, you know, it taught me, it taught me a lesson that when you're, when you're fiddling around with your power meet or with your Garmin and then you don't look at the signs properly, that's what happens.

Oh, really? You know, you're not blaming your Garmin this time like you were in the.

Oh no, that happened, that happened again. But I know the reason why now. So yeah, that, that was, that was the reason. But yeah, other than that I was just, I won't, I won't tell you what the race director said to me when I finished, but yeah, I basically was pretty stupid. But yeah, anyway, it was, it was fun. We had 40 mile an hour winds and the just dropped off down to like 20, I think something for us. Sea swim. So it was a rough sea swim.

Wow.

But yeah, that hopefully sorted the, the men out from the boys. So did you. How, how did you get on in the swim relative to your others, your other competitors?

I came out second, second female at the swim. So yeah, so I went from like competing for first place to groveling around for four the back. I, I even managed, they had sweepers on the bike course. I even managed to be behind the sweeper. That's how lost I got. And then the sweeper said, where have you come from?

Oh dear.

That's where I was in the field.

So that is, there's a lesson to be learned there. And what about the other race? You said you'd done two recently.

Oh, I, I did on. I was lucky enough to be staying on the south coast, so I did that race and then did a, a crathlon. I don't think I've ever done an equathlon. I was thinking about it. I don't have ever done one.

What is an aqua?

So see a sea swim and then a run. Oh, right, yeah. Learning, Learning point from that. I can't remember ever racing with not wearing socks. That was also a bad idea. But obviously a 5k race, you don't have time to put socks on.

And how did you get on in that race?

Yeah, fine. Actually, considering it was a few days after the Sunday race, I was second.

Very good.

And fourth overall. I mean, to be fair, the field wasn't huge, but I'll take it. Take it.

Excellent.

Well, we draw. This is the final episode of series three. And so as we draw series three to a close, we thought we'd do something slightly different for this episode. So we don't have any. One interview. We actually have some so it's a bit of a catch up of previous interviews that we've done and particularly of those in series three. So because it's always good to go back and catch up and listen to remind ourselves what the best bits were of. And we won't go through all the episodes, obviously, just a few select ones, but it's just great to go back and remind ourselves of some of the learning points and also to kind of revisit those stories or the elements of episodes that were really important. So why don't you kick things off, Claire?

What?

Pick out one of the episodes that you, you found particularly memorable, useful and just kind of remind us why.

Well, I think actually thinking about series three, that we've had some amazing, you know, mix, haven't we, of different athletes and, and also some, you know, professionals on there as well. So I think it's been an amazing like mix and for me, I think with quite a few of the athletes in there, there's quite an, like, there's a bit of a theme running through some of, some of what I kind of picked out, I guess from, from those athletes. So I was going to start with Wanda that we interviewed, the ultra runner, just like an amazing interview and she was just great to speak to but you know, really like just, you know, mind over matter that she's going to get well and fit no matter what. Like just totally, you know, defying anything that the medic said. And I just, you know, that story was just amazing and unbelievable really, you know, as to where she is now with, with kind of running, but just an amazing, yeah, amazing story.

She was, it was, it was a pure mind over matter. I'm going to defy the odds but also I'm going to be really in tune with my body and I'm going to listen to what I think my body's telling me, not what the doctors are telling me. And yeah, you're absolutely right. That was an incredible, incredible story that, yeah, I'm hoping to run with Wanda at some point. But what for now what we'll do is we'll, we'll just dive into a snippet of that interview with Wanda Summers.

So, okay, so at 12 weeks I had an agreement. The hospital had said that at 12 weeks I'd be taken back to Salisbury to have a scan to see if my bones had knitted, to see if from there I'd be allowed to sit up because remember, I'm lying flat the whole time. 12 weeks came running the hospital, they'd forgotten to book me in. So they said, oh, we can't fit you in for another two weeks. And I said, I've been lying flat for 12 weeks, counting down every minute every day for this day. Another two weeks is eternity. Anyway, because of that and because I figured after 12 weeks, if your bones haven't knitted by then, they're never going to knit, I called a friend of mine who's a chiropractor to come and give me a pelvic stability test to see if my pelvis was stable so that I didn't have any changes of sensation. She came over, said she believes I'm okay. I've had another friend who sells wheelchairs. She came over with a wheelchair. And I decided at 12 weeks I would sit up on my own. I wouldn't wait for this mri. So you're in one. You know, I'm in an electric bed, so you have buttons so you can, you know, it zooms up, down. So on the day. On the very day at 12 weeks, I press the button to zoom myself up. This is first time ever sat up. I got up and then I just passed out because, you know, you've been lying flat 12 weeks, all that pressure drop. So I had to do this for about an hour before I could actually sit up for at least 30 seconds without passing out. So I did that once. I could do that. I then would sit up, and then I try and take my weight and make the rest of the bed go back down. Does that make sense? It came up with me and then went back and I'd try and, you know, stay upright and see if anything else changed once I was able to do that. My friend with the wheelchair, after a lot of persuasion and my friend, who is also the strongman guy, they came over again and helped me into the wheelchair. Oh, dear, Please don't let me get arrested now 12 weeks, all these years later for doing all these things. Anyway, they got me into a wheelchair, carried me outside, took me onto the coast path, and I just went AWOL because I hadn't seen, you know, I hadn't been outside for 12 weeks, came back to the house, and Jeff, he's called, he said, right, I'm gonna carry you back in the house because you can just carry, you know, you can basically carry me in the wheelchair with one hand. And I said, well, hold on a minute, Let me see if I can take the weight on my feet. And Jeff said, I don't think that's a good idea, really, because, you know, maybe just gone outside. I said, well, Let me just see what it feels like. Put my feet on the ground. And this is. This guy's a big guy. You know, he's the sort of guy, if you saw in the alleyway, he'd be like, oh, God, you know, be terrified. So he went white as a sheik. I thought he was gonna faint because he watched me as I put my feet down on the ground. And there's a photograph of this, actually. It was the very first time I took steps and I pushed the weight off it because luckily I've been doing all these weights, remember, while I've been lying down. So I had some strength in my arms and I put myself up onto my feet, I pushed up and I managed to stand up and I, you know, it was absolutely incredible. And I took about three steps, it was before I couldn't take anymore and collapse back down into wheelchair. And I thought, well, if I can do that, I can go back and do another marathon. You know, it's the same mentality, isn't it? It's exactly the same. Do three steps, you can do 10 steps, you can do 10 steps,. You can do 100. It's the same thing. And that's, like I said, I've never got any barriers. That's all I needed. I just needed to know I could do that many, to know that I'd better do it all again.

So, Charlie, tell me a little bit about. I know I wasn't present for a couple of them actually in series three, so why don't you fill me in on somebody that you would like to kind of particularly pick up on.

Well, I think I'm going to. I'm going to pick out the Carrie Anne Payne episode for a couple of reasons. One was the safety issues kind of dealing with open water swimming safely, which I thought was really fascinating. But the bit I loved about her interview most was her tactics around open water swimming. So when she was kind of conscious that she, she'd got a couple of competitors that were going to try and really swim hard with her at the front. And, and really, because that was her strategy was to get on the front early and, and she didn't want, she didn't want them to disrupt that. So she had this amazing technique of, of like diving under the water, taking off her swim cap to reveal a different colored swim cap and then popping up somewhere else. And so I just thought the swim tactics around. Around Carrie Anne Payne. And so let's, let's have a little bit of a listen to that kerryanne Payne episode.

Now.

I'm going to be completely honest with you about where my mindset was. So I'd come from, you know, South Africa, where I'd done oak mortars before, but I'd spent, you know, from 13 to 18 swimming in the pool, getting so used to swimming in the pool. And then, you know, around about 18, that's when I got back into mortar. I did not want to swim in the pack. That was absolutely. Another big reason for me leading from the front was because I thought, you know what? I. If I'm in the front, I'm controlling the pace of the race. I know where I'm at, and I'm also not anywhere near the fighting. That can all happen behind me. Um, you know, a bit like when you're a kid and you. Maybe you won't have this experience, but, you know, I remember very specifically going from netball at primary school to going to netball in high school, and just the difference was crazy. Netball at primary school was about five fun and friends and, you know, doing things. And then literally that leap up to the next year was like, competition and fighting and tactics and dirty stuff. And I just was. It completely threw me. I was not prepared for that at all. And I dropped it because I was like, that's not the sport for me, so I'm not really a conflict kind of person anyway. So that was another reason why it worked for me to go out in front. I knew. I knew I had the stamina, I knew I had the speed. I could control the pace of the race, how fast, how slow we went. And I knew that if someone wanted to pass me down the last bit, they would have to try and pass me. And that's kind of where the tactic for Beijing came in. And then it worked incredibly well. And I thought, you know, I'm gonna. I'm gonna work on this now and keep going through to the World Championships to see how. How this goes. And there was a little bit of chatter around some of the swimmers that there was gonna be a little bit of tactics coming my way. Um, and my coach was like, you know, you should think about this. Like, what do you think's gonna happen? And the. The race was meant to be a dive start and normally dive, like, they're normally always dive stars, which are. That's where I'm kind of the strongest. From a pool. From the pool background, I would be making the most of the underwater work because I didn't want to be in the fighting. And you're faster from a dive underwater than you are on the surface. So I would swim, you know, dive in and I would swim, you know, 20 meters underwater, butterfly kick and pop out in front of everyone because I had a really good start and I wasn't in the washing machine. But this particular swim at the World Championships and they had a massive storm a couple days before and so the pontoon was completely washed away. This brand new, like, million pounds, million euro thing washed away. So we had to start in the water and my coach said, look, I've got an idea, let's roll with it and see how it works. So I was on the starting line, ready to go, and I had a black hat on because we always have to have, like, our flag on the side, black hat on. Just about to get into the water and I could. I could feel there were a couple of girls not leaving my side. And I was like, hmm, I don't really like where this is going. Maybe he was right, but maybe I was reading into it. I don't really know. Got into the water, they were still on my side, you know, tried to move positions, went under the water, they kind of got back again and the chatter was they were going to stop me from getting out in front. That was kind of what the tactics were. And just about 30 seconds before the start, I went underwater and when I was underwater, I actually took off the black hat that had on and actually had an orange one underneath. And so kind of stuck that in the back of my swimsuit and then popped up with an orange hat on in a different place. And the buzzer went and I was off. And then we kind of went. And I literally got in the front straight from the beginning and I led every metre of that whole 10k from that swim, became, you know, world champion as a result of that. So that was an interesting scenario, I guess.

And Claire, we. We've also had. We, you know, we've had, as you said, so many different people, but we've had scientists into this series as well, haven't we? And obviously you work with Dr. Nikki K. So tell us a little bit about what you took from that episode, because I thought that was absolutely fascinating.

She's always felt like she's always fascinating, fascinating to, like, listen to and talk to. And her advice is always, you know, so kind of gratefully received as well. But, you know, I think one of. One of the things really sort of take away from that is that we have these, like, little internal markers that we don't always look out for. So as athletes, we're very good, I think, at knowing how we feel. And you know, we talked about, you know, wandering that as well and you know, knowing our bodies, but actually tracking, tracking hormones are just another little metric or marker that we don't always feel. And I think, you know, that was the over, you know, the overriding theme was that, you know, we measure all these other things, but actually we can, you know, we can really sort of keep ourselves on track if we start thinking about what's happening inside. And the theme that came across with, actually, as endurance athletes, you know, it is easier for us to under, under fuel when we're doing lots and lots of training. And I think that came across, you know, quite a bit in our conversation both about kind of male, from a male perspective and a female perspective. So it's good to have the, the two sides to that conversation.

Yeah, it was a really good learning episode for me. I wouldn't have ever sort of realized the impact of under fueling, having on, on our hormones and the impact that having depleted hormones has on our performance as athletes. So I thought it was really, really interesting and particularly talking about having just recently read a book at the time that was talking about guys with lower testosterone than they should have for that age and the solution not being just to take more testosterone, but actually fix the under fueling which is likely to be the root cause. So, yeah, another really, really good interview. So let's listen to a little bit of Dr. Nikki K. Again.

If you do what you just described, you do fasted training in the morning and you don't eat till midday, I can guarantee you your cortisol will be high, your testosterone will be low. Cortisol favors deposition of fat. And this was also shown in the study. If you do that day on day, on day, like we just described, the big energy deficit. Cortisol's up. After your body composition doesn't improve, it gets worse.

Right.

So it's counterproductive. You'll be more likely to end up with more body fat and less muscle. So it's, it's. And also it's slightly weird because I have to explain that in order to stabilize your metabolic rate and your energy balance, whatever words we want to use, you actually have to eat more. Now that sounds really weird. So I'll explain. So when you're not eating enough, we talked about the hormones adapting and saving energy, and that includes down regulating your metabolic rate, the rate at which you burn through energy. Your thyroid tests, I can see, if you test them, I'll tell you they're all low. So everything's Going slowly, you need to get that boost back. It's like igniting the pilot light. So in order to do that, you have to introduce some energy in the system to get the thing working. And then once everything equilibriates, the hormones get happy again. Then now we're in normal physiological, good working conditions. Now we can start to work on your body composition and all these other things by doing strength training, by the way, properly fueled, because then your hormones will respond and you will adapt. So, yeah, that was very interesting, the body composition. So just to, just to get rid of that myth. Now that doesn't help.

And Charlie, somebody who I wasn't able to catch up with was Charlie Spedding.

Yes.

So obviously actually I did, I did listen to that. So tell me, tell me a little bit about, you know, it sounded a fascinating interview as well. So tell me, tell me about that.

There was lots of different aspects of Charlie Spedding's interview that were really, really good. I, I loved the talk we, we had about nutrition and some of the, some of what he was saying about with regards to nutrition was controversial. And I'm not sure you agreed with all of it at the time, but, but the bit that I loved, loved from his book, love from talking to him, is about his beer drinkers guide to sports psychology. Just that really straightforward attitude of just, right, this is, this is what I'm going for. This is how I'm going to, this is single minded, single target. That's what it, what it's all about. And it's also been a concept that I've referred back to a few times since because he said, you know, he tuned himself so mentally, you know, so mentally focused on getting a medal when it actually came to the crunch and he knew he'd got the bronze medal in the bag, he couldn't quite motivate him, his brain enough. He didn't think to all questioned whether he could have motivated it more if that had been the gold medal rather than the silver medal step up. And so that just really interested me. And you know, could he have run faster if there'd been a line behind him? And he said, you know, without question he could have done so. So I thought that was a really, really lovely interview with, with him.

So there was so many different things going on in that conversation, wasn't there? Certainly for me listening to it, that was just. Yeah, it was, it was great. Different, different levels of kind of. Yeah, what he was talking about from being an athlete and, and also from the kind of science psychology side of Things as well.

Yeah, it is. And anyone that can combine good English real ale with sports psychology is. Is going into the right place in my book.

So.

So, yeah, no, I thought that was a really, really good episode. So let's listen to a little bit of Charlie Spedding.

Because I very, very much believe that how hard you can try in any situation is dependent upon context, what it means to you. Leading up to the Olympic Games, I ran some races where I ran quite a bit below what I and other people would have expected, but it was because I just wasn't committed to them. And in my mind, I was saving it all for the big race that was coming. And context is everything. People will say things like, well, I tried as hard as I could. It's something that. But they weren't really bothered about. If you're not really bothered about, you've tried as hard as you could about something you don't really care about. But if you really care about something, you can find from within you a great deal more than you can if you don't care about it. And what I proposed later in wasn't that I had settled for bronze medal, but subconsciously, when I was consciously telling myself to run harder, stay with Tracy. Don't let him get away. Subconsciously, my mind was doing cartwheels of joy because I was fulfilling my lifetime's ambition. Now, earlier in the race, I, where there was a group of about 10 of us, I committed myself to really going for it. And I really went for it and broke that group right down. And that was that move I made four or five miles away from the finish was what really won me the medal. But when it came to running around the track, consciously, I was not settling for the bronze medal. Afterwards, I thought to myself, winning a medal in the Olympic Games was always an absolutely wild dream that I never really thought would happen. So I wondered if subconsciously my mind's going, well, you've done it, you know, as if there are little men inside your head who are going, what do you mean? He wants more effort. He's won in a medal in the Olympics for 20 years and he's getting one. And now he's changed his mind. He wants something else, you know, So I didn't settle for it. But. And I think the question I posed was, if Tracy and I had been so close together, battling for first or second, I'm trying to suggest I would have found more. I'm not suggesting I would have beaten him, but I would have found more. Because winning the Olympics is quite different from gaining silver. If we'd been running for bronze and fourth, I think I would have found more. Again, I'm not saying I would have beaten him, but I would have found more because a medal or no medal is a huge difference. But if you've always dreamed of a medal, the difference between silver and bronze, yes, it's important, but it's nowhere near as big as the difference between winning in silver or bronze and fourth. So I was simply trying to explain the importance of context, what matters to you and what a difference it makes in what you can dredge up from inside you when it really matters.

And another interview that I really enjoyed, and I think you really enjoyed was Jan Sibberson. So tell it, tell me a little bit about what you took from Jan's interview.

Again, like, all of everybody we interview has got like, say, like I love listening to like the backstories as well. And particularly for me, I guess there were two things. One, I was actually really interested in the side of his business and how he came to set up what he did or what he has. But also he's a really good storyteller. Like telling the story about, you know, the swims that he's done and being at the head of the pack and, you know, the, the just what it feels like to be right. Right at the front, like over and over again, but not finishing necessarily at the front. But yeah, again, like just a really different. A really different interview. And I found it. I found it quite fascinating from the. From the business side of things as well.

Yeah, I agree. I think the business side of Sailfish was. Was really interesting. But I remember getting goosebumps when he told. Told us about the energy is with the leader, isn't it? You know, the helicopters hovering over the road and he's kind of head down leading Kona. You know, that just. Yeah, that just gave me goosebumps. I think he was. He was really, really interesting guy. Loads of good advice and let's dive into a little bit of that episode.

Well, I don't know where I picked it up, where I picked that quote up, but I think it was like the energy is with the lead. That that was what he said and you know, it's hard to describe and you have to like, pinch yourself sometimes. And I get goosebumps when I, when I talk about it, when I think about it, because, yeah, you get out of the water and I mean in the water you don't really realize much or you don't really see much, but once you get out You've got all the spectators and then suddenly there is TV cameras in front of you, behind you, left, right and center. And you ride through town and everybody's cheering and everybody is super excited. And you go all out.

Right.

I mean, that's what I did. And, I mean, I knew I was going to fade, but, you know, enjoy the glory as long as you can. And later on, in the subsequent years that I raised in Kona, it was important for the sponsors, obviously, to be out front as long as I could. And I think it was. It might have been the first year. And a German TV car came up to me and they interviewed me while I was riding in the front and I thought, this is really, really cool. And basically, you know, you. You have goosebumps all the way. And I think the most special moment I've ever had leading that race was when you go past the. On the bike, you go past the airport and then there's a scenic point and then there's a long, long down, maybe like two or three miles or so.

And.

And the helicopter, the TV helicopter went pretty much all the way down on the road maybe a mile in front of me. So I was riding in aero position towards that helicopter that was hovering on top of the road. And I mean, I'm. Yeah. Goosebumps all over. That was probably the coolest moment ever. And then obviously some. Sooner or later somebody would come, one of the big names and. And then it ended within a second.

So, Charlie. Mimi. Tell me your best bits about Mimi.

Marvellous. Mimi. Well, I mean, there's just. So Mimi was absolutely lovely, really, really, like, super driven lady. The fact that she nearly managed to run across the United States of America and set a record, but had to give up because she'd been run. Running on, bone on, bone on with zero knee ligaments was, yeah, just absolutely astonishing. And then how she's kind of gone from that, switching to cycling, but also doing triathlon, having never been able to swim before. There were so many good things. But the bit that. The bit that I suppose I took probably most from that episode was how she successfully integrated her family into her life around endurance sport, particularly getting her husband involved. And her husband actually had become a very fundamental part of her endurance activities when originally she'd been reluctant to let him get involved. So did you listen to that episode at the time? Do you remember? I'm sure you did, but do you remember much about it?

No.

I can't remember whether I actually did that one all on my own.

I think you did that One on your own.

Well, I would suggest you do go back and listen to it at some point because she is absolutely brilliant and really, really lovely. And yeah, there is lots of really good advice in there for endurance stuff. So let's listen to a little bit of marvelous Mimi.

I'm going to listen to this bit as well.

So when I did the Kalahari for the first time, my youngest and my husband then came out and we then had a 10 day holiday afterwards. So that was great. My son, I've never done anything with my eldest actually as part of my racing. My youngest has also come out and been with a friend and she's been part of the crew whether you didn't really need crew, but, you know, so they had a mini holiday there. My son came out to the Arctic as part of the crew with me and my husband. Now, bless him, he crude. When I did my John o' Groats, Lands End world record, that was the first time he'd ever crude for me. And initially I didn't want him there at all because I thought he's never seen me in pain to that extent and I wasn't quite sure how he would react. You know, he's either going to put on crew hats or he's going to put on husband hat and go, no, she can't go any further. Which I knew he sort of wouldn't do. So he came and crewed with that and he was brilliant and sometimes I had to remind him that he could put on husband hat and, you know.

He didn't have to be crew all the time.

But after that he did actually say to me when we got home, he said, you know, Mimi, you know, it's been very selfish. You're running and you haven't really involved the family. And I hadn't done that intentionally, but I think because it was something that was mine, it wasn't part of the family, it didn't involve them. It was my thing, you know, my husband's got his thing, I had my thing. And he said, you know, if you want us to get more excited about it and get more involved, you need to involve the family. So he said, I have made a decision, I'm going to come and crew for you. But crew in races, if I don't need a crew, he goes and helps at the race. And my heart sank, absolutely sank. I thought, no, no, no, no, no, no. I quite like anyway. But he came and we've never looked back. It's the best thing he ever did, you know, so he's been everywhere with me, which is great.

And then our most recent episode. Claire, what about Jody Stimson? Tell me a little bit about what you took.

Yeah, it was, it was really good. It was really good to catch up with Jodie. And I think again, you know, this ties in with. With a couple of other athletes that we've talked to in terms of, you know, the, the. Her changing from doing short course to kind of long course. And actually the real difference between what it feels like to almost, and these are kind of my words, but what it almost feels like to be in that environment where you're support, it seems like almost supported a lot more to kind of being out in the kind of competing world on your own. And that's kind of what came across to me is suddenly she's gone from this supported environment to kind of going to 70.3 distance and actually trying to find her feet there. And, you know, she talked about learning to ride a TT bike as well. You know, some of the things that when we do longer course, to be kind of take for granted a bit. So all those new things that she's sort of learning about and, but also the experience that she's taken from, from short course as well. But again, you know, for me, a lot of what comes across in these professional athletes is. And a number of them have said, you know, the, the pressures of being a professional and actually sponsors and winning and, you know, and that, you know, that for me, I just think as an athlete that's, you know, you've got, from a psychological perspective to be able to hold onto that and be able to still race and be able to come out the other side of days where you just don't have a good race. So I think, you know, that she just picked up on another theme that I found in a number of other episodes, like, you know, speaking to Morgan and Elizabeth actually as well.

Yes. Yeah, absolutely. And it's. Yeah, I would agree. I think what struck me was, yeah, like you said with Jody, it was so many kind of different aspects that. Going from short course to longer course really, you know, just, you know, I didn't expect it to be as dramatic. Like the whole sponsorship thing that had become really challenging when, you know, previously she'd kind of got it nailed at shorter distance. So. So, yeah, lots of, lots of really good takeaways. And so, so let's, let's listen to a snippet from Jody Stimson.

I think the, the biggest change that I have struggled with is so I've obviously ridden A road bike all my life and kind of going onto a TT bike like going in front of. When I was itu, I, I would put myself as one of the strongest cyclists out there like in the IT Ewings field and I just couldn't translate that power over to tt. I just. And to be honest it's only been the last six months working with my new coach that things have started to click into place. And that's why I was so frustrated at the previous 70.3 I've just done. Because like everything in training has been yes, this has changed. Yes, it's moved forward. That's I suppose definitely going from a road bike to a TT bike. That's been my biggest annoyance because the actual training from Olympic distance to 70.3. Yes. Some of the run sessions have to be a bit longer, the bike intervals have to be a bit longer and obviously you have to stay in aero. It's not massive amount of change. Like the swim program is probably the same. The run volume at the minute is low just because super nervous about getting injured at the minute. So me and trust with my body at the minute is not ideal. It's getting there but it's not ideal. But bike wise like I, you still need to have that top end. Just because 70.3 has got so much faster at the minute, I think which is a great thing for me because I love that head to head battle, I love that race and I think that's why I wouldn't want to go any longer at the minute because Iron man becomes a different, a whole different event. And I think that 70.3 at the minute you still get that head to head gripping battle.

So talking. I know I just mentioned Elizabeth. So she, I mean she was again fascinating on such a number of levels, wasn't she? To listen to or to have on the podcast. So what did you sort of really sort of take away from, from that, from that interview?

I think that there was a couple of key takeaways for me. There was the heat acclimatization which I think was really interesting, particularly given that she comes from Sweden. So the fact that she can race effectively in the desert more so than in the cold was interesting. But I also really loved the end of that episode where we started talking about what she sort of left ultra running to go into the whole piece around relationships. And it really got me thinking particularly after the, the podcast where she was talking about consensual non monogamy. So you know how, how that is treated in society in a day and Age, where, you know, so much is. Is expected to be liberal around whether it's transgender, whether it's sexuality, whatever it is. But. But yes, consensual non monogamy, which is really, really difficult to say, is. Is something that still stands out as a really interesting conversation for me, but I know. What did you take from Elizabeth?

Well, I didn't, unfortunately, I had to hop off before the interesting part at the end. I mean, the whole thing was interesting, don't get me wrong. But yeah, I think, particularly for me, you know, that overriding theme that I talked about in terms of racing professionally, and it just really struck a chord with me, actually, the psychological pressures that professional athletes have because she did talk about, you know, racing for many years at the top and what's expected of you as well to race at the top. And where does it stop being fun? Where does it stop? You know, and where do you stop as well? So that for me, you know, her talking about the amazing races she's done and kind of all of the races that I was then just jotting down, adding to my long list of places to go and things to do. But, yeah, that for me, tied in with a lot of the other athletes from the series. Yeah.

And you're right, and the same with her living in a van. So there seems to be something about ultra runners and them living in vans. Sophie Grant was doing the same thing. Robbie Britton wasn't living in a van, but he had moved across to the Alps. There just seems to be that, you know, that. That freedom to just live a life of exploring and kind of, you know, and obviously in this day and age, it allows. That's, you know, it's much easier to do that. So. So yeah, I thought. I thought it was. That was a really lovely episode to listen to, Elizabeth. So let's take a listen to a bit of the Elizabeth Barnes episode.

I think what we. We traveled a lot before COVID and.

Of course, then Covid kind of put.

The halt to the traveling. And then it was this spontaneous idea that we had. We said, oh, why don't we buy a campervan and travel and travel around Europe? You know, I think I said it and my husband were like, yeah, let's do it. And we were lucky enough to be able to do it. And. And so it was born out of COVID in a way, because I think Covid has changed the way we travel. And there's definitely been a boom in traveling with campervans and motorhomes. And so that's One part of it, the second part is that Covid has.

Enabled the sort of the digital remote.

Working and of course it was already possible. But it's one thing if you are open minded yourself, but if your clients aren't, it's difficult. Right. So now what we've seen with COVID is that more and more people are comfortable with, for example, doing therapy via video call, coaching via video call. Okay. So you don't have to sit face to face in the same room. And that's why I can do it. But if all my clients would say, no, we only want to see you, if we can come and see you in person, well then that would be much more difficult. What's also great about this is that I can work with clients all over the world, which is interesting. So it provides a lot of opportunity, I think. So.

One final episode that I just wanted to pick out was the Morgan Pearson episode. What did you make of Morgan, Claire?

Well, as you know, working with Morgan, so I've been working with him for a little while, so it's really great to get him on the podcast. And actually I found out a little bit more about him from the podcast as well. And isn't that interesting when you work with somebody and you know, lots of other pieces of information about them, but actually him properly telling the story from the beginning, which I didn't like fully know. So that was really great to hear. And again, just like some of the background that he gave to kind of him going into the Olympics and his background in running and again him just trying to find his feet off the Olympics and the pressures that these big races bring and actually what do you do after that? Where do you go? Where's your next step? You know, so that, that for me was, was really great because I got to know him a little bit better as in like his background, the things that we just don't talk about necessarily, but also hearing him talk about where he, you know, where he is now as well.

Yeah, no, really a really interesting episode and particularly around the running, his running performance and yeah, absolutely. Really, really going great guns. So, so let's listen to a little bit of the Morgan Pearson episode.

I know as a, as an Olympic distance triathlete, the Olympics is, that's when people are going to care about our sport the most. Going into the Olympics, you know, it doesn't matter. It doesn't matter if I go and win a world title next year or this year. I guess, like people are still going to care more about the Olympics. Like it's just, it's just the way it is. And I honestly like that. Like, I think it's really cool, but. And I kind of realized that and I did let it stress me out in the sense of like, I was like, oh, like I'm not going to be, you know, I can't think of a better word. But there's not going to be a hotter time for me as an athlete. You know, sponsors are going to be interested. And like, I was like, I think it stressed me out, like, because maybe I wasn't getting the sponsors I thought I deserved. And so looking back, it's just like, same thing. I almost wish I was just like, just like chose to not let it bother me. I mean, I'm not saying if a good, a really good opportunity didn't arise, I wouldn't, I wouldn't take it. But at the end of the day, like, if I had gone to the Olympics and done well, like, it would have been life changing in that sense. So I wish I had that, you know, that foresight of just like, don't let it bother me. And I'm just, you know, it's. I've made some changes with some, some stuff. So I'm really working towards it and working on this stuff and trying to like, you know, the stuff outside of the training is almost just as big of effect on your racing as the actual training itself. So I think that's kind of what it comes down to.

So that's pretty much a wrap for series three. Have you enjoyed being a part of the trinobathlon podcast?

Been.

It's been fantastic. It's been. It's been great to kind of co. To not to kind of. To co host, you know, with you on the triathlon podcast. I'm really looking forward to series four and all the exciting things that will bring and the new interviews that we've got lined up, which I'm really excited about.

We have got some really good interviews lined up, haven't we? I'm. I'm really excited about some of the people we've got lined up, but we're going to have to. You're going to have to wait and see as to who, who we have managed to sort out for Series 4, but there'll also be a bit of a revamp of series four, so we're going to have a bit of a break. So this, this episode is going out in July, but we're going to have a bit of a break because it's race season for Claire. It's race season for me, thanks. Race season for everybody. So it's just a nightmare organizing at this time of year. So we have a break until September but come back with renewed vigor and a few new format changes and a few tweaks and everything else. And if any of you got any suggestions as things that you can, you think we should bring in on series four, then please do share them with us. You can find us on Instagram or on the, you can find me personally on the, the usual social channels. So please do share any ideas that you've got with us because anything we can do to make series four even better, then you're really keen to do that. And please also, if you, if you really liked it, then please do share it. Share it with friends, review it on the Apple site. That would be amazing. And if you know people that you think we should be getting onto the podcast again, share that with us as well. So Claire, when's your next race? Let's just kind of wrap things up for the people. Is it like tomorrow or the day?

It's definitely not tomorrow. Um, no. Next race is August. Um, yeah, so we'll, we'll see how that one goes. Definitely not planning on going the wrong way in August.

No. Well, and then, then you're building up to the big race.

Absolutely, yeah. Try not to think of it as the big race. But yes, sorry.

Well, I'll just keep bringing it up for you.

Holiday is what I'm building up.

Holiday with a sort of kind of smaller race in Conevoir.

Yeah. Just a short distance away.

Yes.

Excellent.

Well, good luck with the planning for that until obviously we'll be back before you, you race there. So yeah, so good luck with the training between, between now and then and.

You and I'm super excited about the next series.

I think, I think it's going to be a really good series. So, so look out for Series 4 as of September. Look out for some amazing guests that we've got lined up and good luck with your training, Claire with yours and we'll. Thank you very much.

Series four, we'll be talking about Ironman Wales.

Talking about Ironman Wales and Kona Hawaii.

Excellent.

Great things to talk about. And for everybody else, keep on training. And remember this podcast was sponsored by 33 fuel so rethink your sports nutrition with 33 fuel award winning natural sports nutrition for your performance, health and a fitter Future. It's the 33 Fuel Fuel Osophy. Get yours@33fuel.com and if you use the discount code Tribeathlon or the link in the show notes, you'll get a discount at the checkout. If you enjoyed this podcast, please do review it and share it because it helps other people find what we think is really valuable learning lessons from amazing athletes. So please do that. You can also find the whole back catalog@tribathlon.com and you can also find out about the Tribe Athlon app, which helps people find events find people to train with and enjoy their events through their tribe. So check out tribathlon.com.