Why Email Marketing is Solid Gold For Restaurants with "Rev" Ciancio

Hey, welcome to the Restaurant Coach podcast. It is the cure for the common restaurant. I am joined today by the reverend of revenue, the maestro of marketing, David Rev Ciancio. Rev.

Hi, buddy.

How you doing, man?

I'm good. You want to hear a funny story?

Yeah. Yeah.

So when I started at YEXT so many years ago, which is a software company that helps restaurants to manage their online information, I asked my boss at the time, Jeff Roh. He's an incredible thought leader if you guys don't know Jeff Rors. But I said, hey, can I have my email address be revx.com? i was like, that would literally be the shortest email I've ever had. And he's like, yeah, of course. So he tells the IT department, like, give me Rev@Yext.com, right? And for the first day, I'm getting all these emails, and I'm like, what are all these emails? Well, it turns out Jeff didn't know this, but the revenue team, literally the entire sales team, used RevX.com for sales help desk. So, like, they'd want to put a deal through. They'd email, Revit yext.com and go to the help support team for sales to approve deals. So there was a lot of confusion for the first week of like, what is like, I'm like, why am I getting all these deal emails?

And like, yeah, really? Huh? You are the reverend of revenue, though.

That is why. And people ask me like, oh, why, why, why is revenue nickname? I was like, just, let's just go with that.

Or, you know, I was thinking like, you know, the maestro of marketing. That could be your new tagline. The mice.

I like that. I used to call my. When I was in the music business, I used to call myself the Maharaja of metal.

There you go. You could be the maharaja of marketing.

Of marketing. Yeah. Yeah.

I mean, you know, I have the restaurant coach tagline. I think everyone should have a tagline.

You know, the maharaja. Well, here's the one problem with Maharaja. No one knows how to spell it.

I couldn't spell it. I would be like, just ref.

Or just.

Or just change your name to just Rev.

Yeah, I mean, that's why it is just Rev. Because I grew up as a kid, like, no, I look at cnco and it seems very phonetically spelled to me. Most people, like, I got called Cicero once. I'm like, there's not even an L in there.

Like, just Rev Crazy. But I wanted to get Rev on today because, you know, it's 2021. Here we are. Things are changing. Rather rapidly. 2020 was, you know, I hate to say, a total shit show.

It was problematic.

It was problematic. What's your kind of view right now of the industry as you see it?

Well, I mean, look, and data shows this and of course I don't have a link to send you at this moment, but before there was even the whisper of a pandemic, there were too many restaurants in America for the available mouths to eat at them. Right. So, you know, what's that to say? To say another way, like, basically like there wasn't enough business available for all the restaurants that existed. So, you know, I don't want to make it sound like the pandemic was like a godsend because it was horrible. Right? It still is horrible. But there was a reckoning coming no matter what, and all the pandemic did was speed it up, like super fast.

Yep. I said it all the time because, you know, and actually I wrote a couple articles in 2019, end of 2019, not knowing that the pandemic. But I said there's gonna be in a restaurant apocalypse coming. And I predicted it. And the same thing you said, oversaturation, the bubble is going to burst. Way too many restaurants, not enough people in the market. People were fighting for table scraps. And like, just like, you just nailed it. You know, the pandemic just kind of escalated that you'll, you'll laugh. All right. It was like the snap from Thanos, you know, Totally.

You'll laugh. The. So I live in a very small town, right. There's 18,000 people in this three mile square town. Right. Right now you're thinking I'm in like middle of Iowa. I'm actually four miles from Manhattan and not Kansas. Right. Anyway, so there's. This is a very, very tiny town. I mean, we literally know all of our neighbors. Like, it's a very tight town. In my three mile square town, four miles from New York City, there are four pizza places, okay? Four. And three of them are literally across the street from each other. And I don't mean that like facetiously, literally. You can stand at one is a dominoes, the other two are independent operators. But you could stand and yell orders to the other three, like, who made that decision? You know what I mean? But like, that's, that's America. Like that's exactly what we're up against.

That's crazy. Yeah. So, you know, and if people don't know a little bit about you, tell people a little bit about your background and what you're doing now.

So I Am a hospitality marketing consultant. I help restaurants with their marketing, basically. I help them to put together marketing that both attracts and retains their guests. And then I also help technology companies that help restaurants to do that better with the same thing. I help them to attract and retain their restaurant customers. But my story is a little funny. I don't know if even maybe you probably know this, but essentially, February 27th of 2020, right? Literally, like, two weeks before we're in quote, unquote, pandemic status. I was the chief marketing officer for a publicly traded software company called Single Platform. Now, most people are like, I've never heard of that company. They were owned by Constant Contact. You probably know that company. And three months prior to February 27th of 2020, they were sold to TripAdvisor. You've probably heard of that company. So at first I was like, cool. We're like this big software company. They're like a super big company. I was like, great. We get like, you know, we get to go global and all these resources and yada, yada, whatever. On the 27th, I walked in my office. We were literally about to be in a pandemic. I was like, thinking, like, how do we keep our employees safe? Like, you know, what do we need to do with sanitizer, whatever? And I messaged my boss, the CEO, and I was like, hey, should we be, like, communicating some safety policies to our employees and our co workers? And he was like, yes. And I was like, do you want to meet about this? And he's like, yeah, come into my office in like, a half hour.

Okay?

I literally think I'm walking into his office to, like, talk about tell people to wash the freaking hands, right? He's sitting there with a head of hr. I was like.

Never good.

Like, I know what this meeting is. Well, you know, TripAdvisor, being a global travel company, was feeling the effects of COVID way before we were on the shores of US because China, Italy, south, whatever. And they. They. My boss got told, you better cut some heads. And on that day, 60% of the senior management team got made redundant. Like me, head of finance, head of it like, literally. And so here I am. It's like days before we knew we're going to be in a pandemic. And I'm like, what do I do? So I called my friend Robert, who owns Five Napkin Burger and a number of other restaurants, and I was like, hey, remember you said you wanted to work with me one day? Well, guess what? And Robert's like, can you be in my Office in an hour. Yeah, I went to Robert's office and I know this is already a long story, but basically I was like, what do you. What are you struggling with? Right? And he was like, we hate Grubhub. We hate DoorDash. Like, if I could only get my customers to order from me directly, like, I'd be in a much better place. I don't want to pay those high commissions. People are loyal to those apps. And I was like, all right, let me figure this out. And basically, I work with Robert to create a system to convert his guests to order from him. Instead of third party apps, we. We built a tech stack around that. We tried a bunch of moves, and once we got that into a system that, like, we knew worked, I started showing that system to other restaurants. And guess what? It worked for everybody.

Oh, wow.

It literally worked. It didn't matter the type of restaurant or where you were located. The conversion system worked not only to get guests to stop ordering from DoorDash, but to order from the restaurant directly and more frequently. And so I turn that into an online course and now I teach a class called the Third to First Party Conversion Bootcamp where I can teach restaurant operators exactly how to do that.

That is so cool. Yeah. And I have quite a few of my clients have been through your bootcamp and they all rave about it, so. And if anybody ever wants to get a hold of Rev, that's way to find them is get them on. I always find them on Instagram, you know, @revcionco.com or just at Revc on sale. You can find them there. You've got Instagram profiles. You got now.

So I have 23 Instagram profiles.

I know, it's like I thought I had four and I thought I was like, oh my God, I'm like maxed out.

But no, I actively manage five of them.

So that's crazy.

I got a lot of. I got a lot of content to share with people.

So, you know, one of the things that you've been really. And you know, and I follow you on all different social media, one of the things you've really had lately is you've had a really huge journey, especially with self care and about taking better care of yourself. And I think, you know, the pandemic was a shift for a lot of people. I think a lot of. A lot of it brought into perspective what's important. And you had a huge, like, you know, basically a weight loss journey. We talk about that a little bit. And, you know, because I think the number One thing restaurant owners don't do is they just don't take care of themselves. You know, eat my crap. You know, we work long hours, we're on our feet all day. What can. What have you done to kind of take control of that in your life? Sure.

Thank you for bringing that up. I mean, and I still eat those foods. Like, I still love taco burger steak, and I still eat them, but basically I've lost about £50 since November. And the story is interesting. So it was a Sunday afternoon. I was tired. It was a long week. I was. I was sitting on the couch with my wife and my kid watching tv, and I fell asleep. Like, I literally fell asleep watching tv, like anybody does. And my four year old fell asleep on my lap and my wife took a picture of it, like, oh, here's this cute picture of dad and son, like, snuggling. And she sent it to me. And when I woke up, I saw the picture on my phone and I was disgusted. Right. So here's this really sweet picture that I'm supposed to love, because me snuggling with my kid and I literally look like I'm sitting inside of a car tire. And I don't mean that, like, facetiously. Again, I'm using this word, but I literally look like I had a black tire, like, around me. And I was like, it's gotta end. Like, it's gotta end. Like, pizza's awesome, but, like, I'm 47. Do I really need it for every meal? Like, no.

Right?

And that was it. Like, that was. That was. That was the. Okay, I got. I can't. I can't continue to just stuff my face with whatever I want. And, you know, I, like, this is not a joke, Donald, because I documented it. From the day the pandemic started until November 3rd, I drank 700 beers. Oh, wow. 700. And you're like, wow, how do you get to that? Like, it's not hard, right? It's not hard. I was drinking three beers a night, six nights a week. Do the math. I'm bad at it. But, you know, and then a couple random birthday parties or, you know, backyard barbecues with the family and like, 700 beers. Like, it just had to stop.

That's crazy.

Like, it just had to stop. And honestly, like, for people that want to lose weight, the hardest part is making the decision, right? But then the second hardest part is sticking with it. And that's actually harder than losing the weight or, sorry, making the decision, like. Cause it's easy because, look, we can wake up every morning and decide to do anything. I'm gonna learn to fly. I'm gonna be the best barista. I'm gonna own the most amazing. Like, you can make any decision. It's sticking with a decision that's hard. And I think this will resonate with the restaurant coach, is that I had to find accountability partners, right? I had to find people that, like, it didn't matter what happened during my day, that, like, I could rely on them to hold me up when I couldn't, right? And so, like, it's the same thing. Like, I looked at myself like, oh, I'm that to my clients. Like, I just need the same thing for my weight loss is like, if I fall down, somebody's gonna help me pick back up. And honestly, those are the two most important moves I think you can make to change anything in your life is make the decision, get accountability partners.

That is the most important thing. Well, you know, most people. I mean, I hate to say most people, you got to hit rock bottom. You got to have that defining moment just like, you know, no more. I'm just. I can't live like this. I can't be this person. I don't want to be this person. And you had, you know, that kind of revelation, you know, when you got that picture. I think I had that same kind of thing in my life, too, is that, you know, I had a. Someone took a picture and sent it to me, and I just, like. I was just, like, totally just disappointed, Disgusted with the way I looked, and I was like, I just can't do this. I mean, I'm. I'm a lot older than you, but. But I'm like, you know, I was like, you know, I just. I gotta start taking better care of myself. And this industry, the restaurant industry, is notorious. And think about hospitality. What do we do in hospitality? We take care of other people. That's all we do. We love to take care of people. We give to our guests, we give to our team, we give to our families. But hospital? How about you? Who gives to you? Who makes sure that you have time to take care of you and your journey? To me, it was really inspiring because, number one, yeah, I seen you lose all that weight, and it is great. But then you know what really hits me? I see you're still posting that you still eat that stuff. I'm like, oh, my God. He's still eating good food, and he's still losing weight. That's amazing.

Yeah. I mean, it's difficult. And the truth is, I Would probably have lost another 10 or 20 pounds already if I wasn't obsessed. Obsessed with french fries. But, like, you know, you don't have to stop eating those things. You just can't eat them all the time. You know what I mean?

You can't. No. And do you track. Do you track your micros? Do you track your calories or what?

So when I originally started the weight loss, I started. You have. You kind of have to shock the system. So I did no carbs, which works. It just doesn't work for long term. So at the point that I started to plateau, I switched to calorie counting. And so I still try to eat low carbs, but, like, if I want a sandwich, I just go have a sandwich. I just stay in my calories. You know what I mean?

That's very cool.

That's it. I'm not. The cake house thing has passed me. I'm bad with math and I don't want to do that much work. I'm lazy. So I was like, what's the least amount of effort I can do to get the most amount of gain? And it was counting calories. And actually counting calories is way easier than people think it is.

Yeah. You know, and that's the thing. I use an app, too. I use, like my fitness Palm. That's the one I use. And I find when I count calories, it's kind of like. So when you work in a restaurant, it's like managing your inventory, managing your production, managing your. Your cash flow. If you don't measure it, you can't manage it. When I find, like, when I start putting those. When I'm eating something, I put it in that, you know, that fitness tracker, and I'm watching the macros. I mean, I actually, I'm a lot more conscientious of what I'm doing. And the same goes for your restaurant. If you want to really get control of your restaurant, start measuring and managing stuff a little bit better. It's like with you with the marketing, you know, you can easily throw money out there and just waste money on marketing if you're not tracking the data. What are some of the key things you track when you're looking at marketing?

You're going to love an ebook that I'm working on. I'll reveal the title. Is it all right if I curse? Because there's a curse word. I'm working on an ebook called Likes are fucking stupid, the 10 marketing metrics. You should care if you want to be a successful restaurant. Nice.

Nice.

Because I'm so sick of like Matt, Matt Plapp says it all the time. Like, I can't deposit likes. You know what I mean?

You can't? No, you can't.

It's a race to nowhere, right?

A lot of vanity metrics out there. And I think, and for me, for restaurants too, sales is the number one vanity metrics. I don't know how many times I've been in groups and there's big restaurant owners and like, they love to throw. Oh yeah, we did 2.4 million. Oh yeah, we did 2.7 million. And then I usually come back with like, how much did you put in the bank? What was your, what was your profit? And that shuts them up right away, you know, because. Oh well, 2%. Oh, yeah. Well, I mean, I'd rather have a million dollar restaurant making 18% than a $4 million restaurant making 1%. Yeah, it's.

It's rate of return, right?

Yeah. Yeah.

I'll tell you a marketing metric that everybody should care about and very few people do is revenue per email send.

Ooh, that's a good one.

I have a client that from January 18th to March 4th, right. It's 45 days. I'm bad with math. I had to look that up.

Okay.

January 18th to March 4th, they did $21,000 in revenue from an automated email. Meaning we wrote it one time and plugged it into a system and literally it's like making money in your sleep. $21,000 from an email that just sends in the background, like one email.

That's amazing. And, and you know, if you want to, you know, and I know Rev's throwing out this kind of high level stuff. If you want to learn how to add that, get a hold of Rev, you know. Yeah, I have like, you know, we talk about accountability partners. I have certain experts I go to for certain things. You know, when I want to talk about, you know, restaurant KPIs and measurement and stuff. Like I go to my business partner in Kit in, in one of my other companies, Darren Mansari. If I want someone to look at POS data, I go to another business partner, you know, Pamela Lee. When I need like someone who can help me about emails and supposed restraints, restaurants. I, I call ref. That's what I call. I mean, that's what I call, you know, use your. It's never a lack of resources, it's a lack of resourcefulness. And if you don't know the answer, trust me, there's somebody out there in the market that actually can help you but you gotta. You gotta step up and just say, you know what? I need help.

Yeah, listen, when people tell me, like, hey, I need help with my whole business, like, I know I'm not that guy. I'm like, you gotta go talk to Donald. Like, he'll get your brain into shape.

I'll get you. I'll get your mindset. Right? I'll get your. I'll get your mindset. And your habits are on track because in their culture, culture to me is like the secret sauce that actually, that's my third book I'm working on right now is that, you know, I got the two first. The first book was your restaurant sucks, then your restaurant still sucks. And my third book's your restaurant culture sucks. And then I'm done with the suck series.

Then there's no more sucking.

I gotta move on to something. I. I need a new genre. I need a new, you know, I. I figured it's like Lord of the Rings. I got a trilogy. I mean, that's it. I got trilogy, then I'm out.

I saw something awesome the other day on LinkedIn off the. Forward it to you, but do you. Do you do any of your guests or do you teach a pre service rumble?

Pre service rumble. That sounds great.

I love Josh, the CEO of Not Tap room. Pour my beer, I'll share it with you. He shared this on LinkedIn the other day. That was basically like, before the restaurant doors are open, before people can come in and do service, they get the whole gang in the kitchen. They have a rumble where they bang on the table.

Chant they do.

And I was like, oh, that's powerful.

Yeah, I have something like that I teach. I call it, you know, we have pre shift. I call it a pro shift. Have a productive shift. And so. And we do one we call lion face. Lemon face. Lion face, Lemon face.

What is that do? What's lionfish?

Lionfish, Lemon face. Lionface. Lemon faces. You get everyone in a circle, and then usually the person leading goes, lionfish.

You go.

And then they say, lemon face. It's like you suck, like the most sour lemon you ever sucked on. And then you just get the whole room. Lion face, Lemon face. Lion face. Ah, lemon face. Try it, Rev. Ready? Lion face, Lemon face. There you go. Yeah, but the cool thing is like, you know, we call those in nlp, Neuro linguistic program. We call those anchors and triggers. So the cool thing is you get everyone doing that on the team. And then let's say I'm walking through the dining room and I see someone on the service team who doesn't really have the energy, I can just go like that to them. And then they start laughing just like you. And it actually kind of triggers and gets them back in a good mood. So you want things that you can use all day long to get your team kind of just get them back in, right? We call it state, Give back that energy going. Because what's energy? Energy is everything in a restaurant.

So I do. I do that as a customer.

Oh, do really?

Anytime a server comes up to me and asks like a totally off the rack question, you know, I always give like a really ridiculous answer to try and throw them. Like, yeah, yeah, you save room for dessert. My favorite answer is like, why do you have a lot of bacon?

Ah. I love to throw those questions that break state. One of my favorite ones is, I'll ask. I'll ask people. I go, do you think vegetarians eat animal crackers or is it a matter of ethics?

That's great.

So I'm gonna ask you a question. It's probably be hard for you to nail down, but I want you try to search your memories. What's the best meal you ever had?

Oh, man, I don't know that I have one. I probably can nail it to like five. Okay, I'll tell you. I'll tell you a fun story. How about this? How about a fun story? So my wife and I go to Italy, right? I'm cnc, I'm Italian. And I'm super excited because, like, I love all that food, right? But I also love after I eat a huge meal, like, if I have steak and pasta and all these other things, I love an espresso. And I take black sambuca and I pour it in, right? It coats your stomach, picks you up, like only after a huge meal. Not in the middle of the day or a small meal, but at the end of the big meal. I love that. And I'm like, cool, we're going to Italy. It's going to be at every restaurant. I'm going to drink it every night. It's going to be the greatest thing ever. First night we go to a restaurant, I forget what we order. End of the night, I was like, oh, senor, can I have a sambuca negra? And he looked at me like I was like, you know, speaking some other language, which I kind of was. But he was like, sambuca negra. Like, what's that? He's like, no, we got sambuca romano, which is the clear stuff. So I was like, all right, Whatever. I have to clear stuff. Second night, same things. Senora Sambuca Romano Negra. No idea, Donald. We were, like, four nights into this Italian. Italy trip, and it has yet to happen. I'm like, it's made in Rome. Like, we're in Rome, and my wife looks at me and she goes, don't you do it again. Like, please don't do it again. So we're in Florence, and we end up at Ilatini. You ever been to Ilatini? If you like steak. And I don't mean. I don't just mean you, Donald. I mean, if you hear this and you like steak, go to Florence tomorrow and eat it a Latini. It's like. It's an unbelievable, unbelievable experience. We show up. You have to wait in line to wait in line. It's so busy. And anybody that's waiting in line outside, they bring, like, every 45 minutes, they bring wine and cheese. So, like, you're standing out in the cobblestone street and they're, like, giving you my room, right? You walk in. The place is cavernous. There's all these rooms. It's vaulted ceilings. They have the. The legs of PI literally hanging down. If you order it, they pull it off. And, like, it's unbelievable, right? So we. We sit down, right? The guy comes over and he looks at me and my wife, and he goes, senor, senor, welcome. My family's restaurant, whatever that I do. A bad Italian. He looks at my wife, he looks at my wife, and he goes, senora, farfalla pasta nice to plum tomato sauce, and how about a pork chop to split with your husband? And blah, blah, blah. And she looks. He goes, that sounds good. And he looks and goes, senora, biste a la Florentine. Extra thick, meaty way, like. And basically, he reads us.

Like, he.

He literally reads us. Like. Like, I know what you want to order. Like, there's no menus. They literally walk up to the table and they tell you what, you're unreal. Food comes out magical. They literally put a bottle of wine on the table, drink as much as you want. Like, everybody having a great. Like, literally, like, this is amazing. This is every restaurant ever, ever, ever, ever, ever, right? So we get to the end of the meal, and he's going to come over and ask if we want after dinner drink. And this is when the wife leans over and she goes, don't do it. Don't ruin this meal. Like, this is the best restaurant experience we've ever had. Please, please don't do it. And he comes over and he asked my wife for an after dinner drink. And she orders a moscato. And he looks at me. And my wife, her hands just go like this. Mm, hands. Face ends up in her hands. And I go, senori, do you have Sambuca Romana Negra? And he looks at me and he goes, you know what that is?

Oh, wow.

And I was like, yeah, it's my favorite. He's like, oh, senor. In one moment. And he runs over and he comes back with a handle of it, like a jug. Wow. We only keep this for the very special guest tonight. It's my treat. And he, like, puts the whole bottle down and brings me an espresso. And I'm like, yeah. My wife's.

I hate you.

Like, I felt totally justified and gratified. But anyway, like, that might be the best restaurant meal I've ever had.

That's an epic story. That's an epic story.

Il Latini in Florence.

It was Latini in Florence. If I ever go to Florence, go to Elite.

Oh, my God. It's amazing. It's unbelievable how good it is. I have a picture. It's funny. We're walking out. My wife's like, I can't believe how good that is. I was like, well, why don't you. Why don't you, like, hug? You know, why don't you marry the restaurant? You know, like some snarky, you know, we've had a bunch of wine type answer. So she makes me take a picture of her hugging the restaurant.

Oh, really? Nice. Yeah. That's amazing. That's funny. That's good.

When you have a restaurant experience like that, you kind of then judge every other restaurant by, like, that. Like, well, you weren't a Latini, so.

You know, one of the things I. I talk about too, a lot is that you get to a certain level in your life, in your career, by a lot of the times, the mentors you have, who are a couple of the people that you found that you find or that you look to for mentorship still.

You mean, like, besides you?

Yes, besides. Wait, hold on. You're cheating on me?

I mean, in different ways. Different ways. Specializations, you know, I would go with the obvious answer of my dad. My dad had a huge impact on me. He was an undercover FBI agent and crazy stories. He, like, saved lost children and, like, put really bad guys in jail. So, like, for sure, my dad, both of my last bosses. So Josh Glantz, who was the CEO at Single Platform when I was there, was instrumental in teaching Me unbelievable things about how to make SaaS companies work. And really he was so customer service oriented. Like, he was so. About making sure the customer was happy that. Not that I wasn't that way, but like, it impacted about how I thought he was incredible. Jeff Rors, who was the CEO of the company I was at before that. Jeff is unbelievable. Jeff challenged me so hard. Kindest, nicest, most creative, friendly person I've ever met. Like, gentle, gentle, gentle, gentle. But, like, when you got in trouble with Jeff, man, you felt horrible. It was like, my mom, like, I was like, oh, I don't want to make. I don't make my mom feel bad. It's the same thing about Jeff, but because he was so kind and gentle that, like, when you did screw up, you felt worse about it because you're like, how could I do that to Jeff? He. Both of those guys from a, you know, learning how to market and. And software are definitely in there. And the last one I'll mention, for the. For the sake of this show, actually, I'm going to mention two. Sorry. One is my. My coach, John Shaw, who we've done some work within the league of extraordinary.

Yep.

John has changed my life unbelievably and. And is an argument for why I think people should have coaches in their lives. Like, get somebody who's. Who's seen the end of the story. You know what I mean? And the last one I would say is Robert Guarino. He is the CEO and founder of 5 Napkin Burger, as well as a number of other restaurants in New York City. He happens to be a client of mine, but he's also one of my good friends. But, man, that guy is willing to walk into any situation in his restaurant, you and be challenged. Right? Not just challenge, but be challenged. Like, he's ready at all times for somebody to say there's a better way. And you are around somebody who's willing to always be challenged. It makes you want to be challenged and it makes you open to thinking.

Yeah. You know, and that's the thing, too. Most people think that you can get to the next level by doing the same thing you're doing now. You can't. No. You need someone that pushes and challenges and makes you think. I just love my mentors and I still have the same business coach I've had since 2008.

That's awesome.

And the reason is because he pushes me and challenges me to look at things differently.

Dude, you'll laugh and you probably hear this from your clients, but you know why I Actually interviewed five coaches. You know why I chose John?

Why?

Scared the shit out of me. Yeah, See, I was so afraid of him.

Good coaches, the coaches are scared of shitting. That's a good. I am scared. I mean, after. And I've had my same coach for years, I still scared to me.

Because.

You know, I know when I get in a call, he's going to call me out and he's going to call me out. My, you know, he's going to make me stay accountable and you know, that's what I. And I try to emulate that with my clients. The same things he treats me in the way he, you know, he respects me, but he also holds me accountable. Is the same thing I want to do with my class. You know, I respect all my clients, but I'm also going to call you on your. I'm going to call you out and I'm going to say, no, you said you would do this. You need to focus and you need to get this done right.

Yeah, there's. There's nothing better than having somebody look you and go, really? Is that really what you want to believe? Like, is this today's lie that you're telling yourself? Like, that's an important person to have in your life?

Yeah. One of the things that, you know, I love to say and I have a. One of my business partner, he loves to say, that's just a story you're telling yourself every time somebody has an excuse. It's just a story you're telling yourself. Darren says it all the time. It's just a story. Yeah. So what advice would you give to your younger self?

Oh, man, you know, I don't, I don't live a life with regret. And I know that's not the question you asked me, but sometimes I wish I could go back in time and tell myself to get started on my path earlier. You know what I mean? Like, and I don't regret anything. Like, I'm happy about everything I've done and I don't think I've made like mistakes that should be taken back. They were just lessons. But like, I think that I would have appreciated entrepreneurial ship at a much earlier age that at which I found it. You know what I mean? And I think that I, I might have enjoyed things in a similar but different way had I started that path earlier. But again, I regret nothing. But that is something that I would probably go back in time and be like, I'm like, think about making money all the time.

Yeah.

And making money.

Money is great. I love money. Yeah. But, you know, if I had to go back and tell my younger self, I go back in time. If I had a time machine, I go back and say, all right, Donald, four words for you. Google, Amazon, Bitcoin, Zoom. What do you mean, zoom? Trust me, in 2020, Zoom is gonna be huge.

Speaking. Yeah. 100. If I could Biff tan in my life. Yes.

Yeah, yeah.

But I sold gamestop for a profit today, so I'm happy.

Nice. Nice. You got on that roller coaster.

You know, I'm susceptible just like anybody else, and, like, I pay attention to Internet culture, and I was like, oh, this is cool. I'm. I'm down with counterculture. I'll do this. And then, like, I totally missed the boat, and then it bounced back today, and I was like, yeah, I got out on top.

You know, and that goes to. Another thing is, like, you know, you hear these words all the time. Proximity is power. Hang out with people that push you to be better, but also hang out with people that know more than you. A lot of my friends are really, well, kind of diverse in, like, the stock market. And I don't know a lot, but I listen, you know, I take notes. And when they're talking about something, I'm not saying a lot, but I'm making adjustments to my portfolio, and it really pays off if you just, like. Interesting. I like that.

Yeah. I don't know. You know, tell me. Let's be honest here. Like, I. I get tired of this. Maybe you do too, but, like, I don't like being the smartest person in the room all the time. You know what I mean? Like, I want to associate.

Yeah.

I want to feel dumb once in a while.

That's pretty much my day. Pretty much.

I mean, you know, I don't say that from an egotistical standpoint, like, oh, I'm so smart. But, like, it really be around smart people.

Yeah. Proximity is power. If you go ahead and get to the next level, there's actually. There's an old saying, you know, if you're the smartest person in the room, you're in the wrong room.

Yeah.

So let's talk about what. Let's talk about social media. What's your favorite social media platform?

You know, I've been thinking about this a lot lately because typically, you would probably expect me to say Instagram, since I have so many followers there, but, like, the algorithm has become such a chore lately that, like, I'm not in love with it the same way I used to. And so I'M actually focusing my shift away from social media.

Are you really? Wow.

Because it's about email, man. It's about having contact info. So I'm down to use whatever social media platform gets you into my email list.

You know what I mean?

Because here's the thing. Regardless of if I like LinkedIn versus Twitter or whatever, like, they're just tools, right? And so anybody that approaches a tool without a goal in mind is gonna misuse the tool. So to me, like, if I'm on Instagram, it's because I'm trying to get you onto my email list, right? And so then that helps me think about the things that I do on Instagram. Right. It helps me prioritize what I'm going to do. Because essentially, if I'm not going to get you on my email list, it's probably not worth doing. Right. And so, you know what is my favorite? Whichever one gets you on my email list.

Yeah. What's the name of your new ebook you can't about Likes.

Oh, likes are stupid.

That's exactly it. Yeah. Again, it was one of those vanity metrics. Well, look, I mean, there's some big changes with Facebook and Apple are having a big feud, so they're changing a lot of the things that they're allowed to do. You know what happens when one of these social media companies gets a wild hair up their ass and they decide they want to change stuff around? You're screwed. Your only purpose should be driving traffic to your business to get their email and have the data so you can actually do something with it. And I don't know how many restaurants, you know, do not try to capture data.

I mean, you know, I wouldn't want to say all of them because it's certainly not. But dramatic to use those words.

90, 95.

It's. It's high.

Yeah. It's hot. It's like, stupid. It's too high. And I'm gonna go on a limit right now and say if you're not. If you're a restaurant owner, you're not capturing the data of everybody walks in your door, you need to change that right away. I mean, you change that today. And if you need help with that, get a hold of Rev.

I teach a class on email for restaurants. They laugh. Right? And I like. And I love to challenge people. I probably learned this from you. But, you know, I asked them, like, can you write three sentences? Like, the answer is yes. Like, can you write three sentences about your business? Yes. Then I will show them five different emails that restaurants have written that are three sentences long that convert guests into money. I'm like, if you can write three sentences, you can make money from your guests emails. Is not hard.

It's not hard. You know what the thing is? It's just being consistent. Just like anything, you gotta be consistent with it. Most people, I think most people have misconception about marketing. Most people think marketing is about getting an instant sale. It's not. It's about keeping your brand top of mind. You know, and I use the example all the time of McDonald's. Everyone knows who McDonald's is. You ever see them stop marketing?

Never, never.

They keep their foot on the gas all the time because they, they want to keep those golden arches in your face.

You know what they do need to stop doing?

What?

That spicy chicken sandwich. What a poor excuse for a sandwich.

That thing, you know, that gets me onto this whole. The chicken sandwich war is just like stupid.

I mean I listen, I run an all hot chicken Instagram account. Like I'm into it but like I know I'm in.

I love hot. I love Nashville hot chicken. But yeah, I mean their spicy hot chicken is, it's a pathetic excuse for. They don't do chicken.

Well, no, I was like, how are you a brand that big and you have all these examples. I think you're into modeling. I'm into modeling. Like go eat Popeye sandwich and then model it. Go eat the Shake Shack sandwich and model it. Like come out with such a poor excuse for a sandwich. And I love McDonald's. Like I, we eat McDonald's once a month in this house. Like I love McDonald's. Like I'm really let down my sandwich.

You know, when McDonald's disappoints you, it's like crushing, you know, good times. So hey, what are the social media platforms I want to talk about is Clubhouse.

Oh man, we're all about it now, I guess.

Clubhouse. Has anybody. If you've never heard of Clubhouse Rev, tell them real quick what clubhouse is.

So it's like an on. It's like, it's like a live podcast, right? So you jump in and there's rooms and you can go be. You can just go listen to any room you want. You can jump in whether it's started or not. And if you have questions, you, there's a little button to put your hand up and you can like ask questions and be a part of the conversation. So it's literally, it's just, it's conversations. It's great. You know, for me, who loves doing A podcast. But, like, you know, they take work, right? There's like, no work here. You just turn it on, start talking. Right?

Yeah. And it's like. It's like a podcast with no, no, no video. Yeah.

And you can't record it either, so it's like. I guess it's like a podcast, but Snapchat, like.

All right. Yeah. Well, actually, we're doing a clubhouse on Thursday, right?

Super excited.

Tomorrow, 3:00pm tomorrow, 3:00pm restaurant.

Oh, I got in trouble for this one, too. We called it Restaurants in the New Better. And somebody's like, why? What's wrong with the new normal? And I was like, oh, quote Donald, what's normal?

Normal's a setting on your damn washing machine.

I don't want to be a setting on a washing machine.

Nobody wants to be normal. Normal is okay. So normal is being average. Average is mediocre. Mediocrity sucks. Hashtag, write that down. Hashtag, write that down. Mediocrity sucks.

I. I have noted my. Listen, I got asked the same question yesterday. Guy who. Who's doing the. The Clubhouse with us tomorrow at. At 3pm Eastern. He's like, rev, you're really going all overboard and promoting this thing. And I was like, listen, guy, my life's motto is, if it's worth doing, it's worth overdoing doing it right now.

But that leads me to the thing. And I heard. You've heard of Brendan Burchard, right?

Of course.

Yeah. Yeah. So Brendan Bashard has this little. And I. I think it was on Impact Theory with Tom Baloo, and he talks about there's a difference between passion and obsession. And it says, when you're passionate, everyone's excited for you. Oh, my God, Rev, you found your passion. Follow your passion. Live your passion. But when you. When people find out you're obsessed, they're like, why you gotta be so crazy? Why can't you just, like, back off? Why do you gotta be a little. You know, you're, like, a little too nuts on this. When you're passionate, everyone's behind you. When you're say you're obsessed with it and you want to be the best, people want to talk you down, you know, like, oh, you know, just be happy with what you have. You should just settle. Hashtag, write this down. Never settle. Never.

I mean, you know, listen, we're.

We're.

We're. We're going a different direction here. But, like, I don't want to ever be the person, like, gets up at 8am, goes to the same job. I hate do the same thing every day. And I'm not telling anybody here that, like, oh, go be an entrepreneur.

It's cool.

It is. But, like, I just don't want to be that person. Like, I don't want to have the Same job for 45 years doing the same thing. Like, I'm just not interested. If that's what you want to do, like, go do it. But, like, I actually don't think we're programmed that way. Like, I don't think humans are meant to, like, walk in a circle for years on end. You know what I mean? So unless that's. What if that's what you're passionate about, like, then go, you know, do it be. Being obsessed is, like, empowering to me.

I think if you're not pushing yourself to that level where people think you're a little crazy, then you're not really to that level. You need to be at. I get all the time. And again, you probably hear it too. It's like, man, like, you know, with that, you know, the guy's like, oh, you're really pushing this marketing really heavy. You're really going overboard. There's no such thing as overboard to me. I mean, I will market. And that's the thing. There's a lot of people out there, a lot more talent than me, a lot more of this than that than me. But I tell people, you will not out market me. You know.

You know, I've said it to you. I think you're prolific. Like, I'm jealous at the amount of content you put out there.

Not out market me. I will out market everyone because I just, I. I'm. I'm an ever ready buddy on this thing. I just keep going and going and going. And that's another thing about what I think marketing is really big about and about keeping your brand top of mind. You might. Some people like my stuff. I. And actually, you know, and I think when, as you get out there more, you actually start getting a couple haters, which at first I was kind of upset, but actually now I look at haters like, you know, it's kind of cool. At least. At least I know I'm rattling the cages a little bit. But, you know, I always tell people, you might not like me, but you won't ignore me because I'm gonna make sure my stuff's out there somewhere on the Internet.

I think haters are a mark of your own success, right?

I think haters are people that gave up on their own dreams. What's that? Second place is the first loser.

Okay, well, you know what? I hate pickles. And I have no problem being outspoken about it.

So, you know, I'm not a big. Here's my thing about pickles. And you might think this is weird. I like pickles. I just don't like them on my sandwiches. I like a pickle separate. I like bread and butter pickles. I do not want a pickle on my burger.

Do you know what the Z virus is?

Oh, God, no. Now you're gonna tell me. And now I never want a pickle again. Again. Or what?

So Z virus is what people who love zombies call the zombie virus. The Z virus. Right. You get the Z virus. To me, a pickle is the Z virus of food, right? Because once it touches the food item, the whole thing's infected. Like a mouth. Like, you can't. There's no taking the pickle off. And then it doesn't taste like pickles. Like, that's it. Like, you see the zombie movies, they cut off their arm and they save the rest of their body. I don't buy that.

You're bit.

You're bit, right?

You're done. Right? Same thing. Pickle zombies. We're gonna call them pickle zombies. Pickles or zombies. We should, we should write an ebook. Pickles or zombies? Pickles are zombies. So let me ask you a question. How do you deal with stress?

Oh, man, this is a fun question. So people don't know this about me, but I am really into fidget spinners.

You are. You always have one.

I've been spinning the whole conversation. In fact, I have this one, this one, this one, this one. I literally have seven of them on my desk. And I use them for two things. It keeps me focused. So, like, it's re. I want. I have 10 emails that have come in the last five minutes. I want to read them. This keeps me from. It gives my hands something to do. So I use them for focus. But also, like, if I get blown out in a conversation or something crazy happens, like, I need to recenter. Right? And I got some mind exercises I do. But, like, there's nothing that gets me focused.

Like.

Blow into that. It calms me down. So that's definitely one way I de. Stress is, like, I have a physical activity. I do. That aligns to a mental activity. Also. Sailor Jerry.

Okay, you gotta just, you gotta explain that one.

I, I, I'm a drinker. So, like, I will have alcoholic at the end of the day, I'll have.

A drink or two.

Calms me down, helps me remove Stress. How about you? What's a stress? A stress tip from you.

I do breathing exercises. I do box breathing. It's something I learned in the pararescue teams. I learned how to box breathe, which breathing exercises always get me centered and then working out for me. I have to work out in the morning and I tell people I don't work out for me. I work out for you. Because if I do not work out, you do not want to be around. There's a different Donald that comes out when he doesn't work out. He is just cranky. It's like, it's like being hangry all day. If I don't work out, what would that be? I'm not hangry, but I'm not hungry. But I'm not if I don't work out. So. Hey, name a book, audiobook, or a podcast that you recommend.

Oh, man, what is the name of this book? Hold on, you gotta. I gotta pull up audible. Somebody told me to read this and I'm. I don't read. I don't take that wrong way. I ingest in the ear. So I love books on audio. But right now I'm listening to the Mindset of a Millionaire.

Oh, that's a good one, actually.

Yeah, it's awesome. For anybody who hasn't heard of it, basically, like Bob Proctor and the guy that wrote Chicken Soup for the Soul and a couple other people basically came up with like one hour audios. Like, here's how to change your life into being a millionaire. And like, they compiled it into one audio book called the Mindset of a Millionaire. And so like, you don't spend any more time than like an hour with one person, one thought leader. But they're all kind of talking about the same thing in different ways. I love it. I listened to it last night. I don't know if you know who Tremendous Jones is. Oh, my God. Like, I was exposed to Tremendous Jones last night for the very first time. He's no longer with us, but like, he's a motivational speaker that speaks to people who want to be millionaires. But he has the cadence of Rodney Dangerfield, who's my favorite comedian of all time. And so, like, imagine like being spoken to about how to Be a Millionaire by Rodney Dangerfield. I'm like, you were made for me.

Like, what's his name?

Tremendous Jones.

I gotta write that one down. That's a good one. Tremendous Jones.

Yeah, he's like. Again, I've listened to one hour of Tremendous Jones, but like, instantly I was like, how do I get more of Tremendous Jones? Like, he was awesome.

Yeah. The audiobook I've been listening to lately is. It's the Bar Stool NBA.

Really? Talk to me about what that is.

Why Running a bar Beats Running to Business School. I'm telling you, when I saw the title, I was like, you know, this is like, rev, what are the lessons you learned running a bar that you could not afford that you couldn't learn in business school? So, yeah, it's a really great book. The Barstool mba. Why Running a Bar Beats Running a Bit by Running to Business School And Arrow. Right. Let me see what it says here. As far as. Usually they have a definition of what it is in there. I doesn't have anything in there. But, yeah, the Barstool mba. I thought that was a great one.

I. I don't know if I've ever shared this with you, but, like, I used to own a bar in New York City, and people ask me about it all the time, and I was like, oh, most people go get an mba. I spent the same amount of money getting street cred.

Exactly, exactly. So what's it. What's kind of a quote you live by?

Oh, this is my favorite one. Be awesome at two things and outsource everything else.

Right.

There is no master of everything. Just go master, like, the two things you're really good at and find other people to support you in getting the rest of it done.

And how many restaurant owners do you know to try to do everything?

I guess, again, comes back to all of them.

Everyone thinks that they can do everything. Yeah, you can't do what you're good at. Outsource the rest. Especially if you want a life. I know so many restaurants that their restaurant just has them in handcuffs and it runs their life into the ground. You know, it doesn't have to be like that. There's people out there like Rev. There's people like. They're out there like John Shaw, our friend John Shaw. We got friends like, you know, Doug Racke, myself. We're all here to help you, but you gotta ask for help. We're not gonna come to your house and drag you out.

I thought about it sometimes, but nah, I'm from Detroit. I have a baseball bat like Detroit, man.

We were old school on you, you know what I mean? Yeah. It's gonna go down old school, Detroit style. I didn't know you're from Detroit.

We used to. So when I own the bar, you'll laugh. We. We kept the baseball bat in the bar. Just like, you know, we never used it. Like, we would take it out once in a while. Be like, there's a baseball bat back here. But, like, I still have. I don't have the bar anymore, but I kept the bat.

You still got the bat. Do you have it in your office?

It's in that closet. Along with my machete.

So what? Your machete I have is.

I have a zombie blade.

A zombie blade. Nice.

So half of it is a machete, like a traditional machete, and the other side has, like, rigid teeth. The idea is the machete is for removing heads, and the rigid teeth is for clearing brush.

So you and I have a lot of props. I have, like, I have a Thanos glove in here. I got the infinity glove. Yeah, I got the glove in here. You know, I've just moved. Everyone knows I just moved to Scottsdale from New Mexico. So my office is, like, told us already. But I got Wolverine claws, too, Actually real. It's why I ordered these things. I thought, you know, is. I thought it was gonna be like, these plastic. No, they were, like, real metal. I mean, you could actually. I mean, they're, like, super. I mean, you could actually. You could actually stab somebody with these things and kill them. That sounds dangerous. It was pretty crazy. I was like, oh, these things would be pretty cool. And I got the box. Like, man, this is, like, heavy. What the hell? I open the box up, and they're like, these real Wolverine claws. I'm like, oh, my God. This is, like, crazy.

You want. You want to see one of my favorite props?

Yeah. Yeah.

I almost never bring this on the call, so let me. Let me just grab it.

I see. Where. Where are my Wolverine clothes at? Find. Now find my Wolverine clothes.

I love that we're. You're unpacking as we. As we talk here, as we're talking on the phone.

I mean, this is crazy stuff, right?

Well, I don't need to wait for you to tell everybody else who's listening, but this is one of my favorites, the golden.

There you go.

There's your Thanos club. My golden potato award.

This is, like, my favorite prop in my office.

Ah, the Stay Puft Marshmallow Man.

He's gonna. He's gonna find a spot on the back wall when I get my new bookshelves in. Hey, man, I want to say thanks for jumping on the call today.

Thank you.

Podcast. How can people get a hold of you?

Best way social media. At revcncio, I have the same screen name on every single platform. And if you're like, if you're listening to just the audio version of this and you're like, I don't know how to spell that. I run an. The largest French fry themed account on Instagram is called Fun with Fries. You can remember how to spell that? And there's a link to Rev Cnto in the bio.

There you go. Fun with Fries. What's your what? I know you have quite a few different Instagram accounts. What's your. What's your. Kind of. The one that is, like, has the.

Near and dear to your heart of my own accounts.

Yeah. Yeah. Which one's like your one that is, like, your favorite?

Oh, the one that's my namesake, Revc Anzio, because it's all. It's almost all entirely original content. The other ones are repost accounts, so.

Oh, cool. Cool.

They're fun. But, you know, my main account is where I do the Rev thing, so.

Awesome. So, Mr. Potato Head and Stay Puft Marshmallow man, we want to say thanks for showing up today, thanks for tuning in, and we'll catch you on the other side.

Thank you.