Dallas Jenkins - Director of The Chosen | The Secret To Doing Impossible Things

So what if there was a secret to doing impossible things? And what if it was even easier than you thought? Oh, I'm so excited. Dallas Jenkins is going to be on the Crazy Bless show today. He's a producer director of the Chosen, the largest fan funded entertainment project of all time. Like, since pterodactyls are flying in the sky, he's going to be here telling us the secret to doing impossible things. Guys, I'm super excited. Today we have Dallas Jenkins. I know you've heard of the Chosen. Like, who has not heard of the Chosen, right? It is the largest fan supported entertainment project of all time and Dallas is the producer, the director. He is the big head honcho behind the Chosen. So we're going to be talking with him today. And Dallas, I just want to thank you for coming on board and sharing everything that you're doing. Dude, it's amazing.

Oh, well, I appreciate coming on. You got a great show and I love your background. I love the Ferris Bueller poster. I'm jealous. It's great. So, yeah, this is fun.

I'll send you. I'll send you a poster. Just leave your dress. I'll get a poster sent to you. But this is so exciting because right now the Chosen is going into his third season. How incredible is this?

Yeah, I'm wearing. I'm wearing my. My three fish, our new hoodie and T shirt. And it's. It's three for three. You know, season three. Three fish. So. Yeah.

Oh, yes. Yes. Three. It's a magic number. That's so beautiful. So this, like, going back, I remember when my husband and I first sat down, we watched the Chosen and we were, like, hooked, like from the beginning. Not just because it really resonated with us because we're believers, but the relevance of it, the humor that, like everything so real that you put into it. And I want to talk a little bit about going into this because this was. Did you ever think, like, I know you had to imagine, but did you ever think it would take off the way it took off?

So I answered that question this way because it's. I think it's a really important point. And it's because it's more than just about the show. It's about, I think, my life in general and I think about everyone's life and how they approach the future. I used to really think about the future a lot. I used to take responsibility for results. I used to care a lot about affirmation and numbers and box office numbers. I mean, the Season 3 launches in theaters this weekend. And there was a time in my life where I would have been checking every day what the numbers were and hoping that it's successful, because if it wasn't successful, then. Then I failed. And God took all of that away from me because I had a huge career failure shortly before the Chosen, which, with a movie that did come out in theaters and it bombed at the box office. And God brought me to a place where I genuinely stopped caring about results, genuinely stopped caring about people, pleasing, about being affirmed, about what the Bible calls the fear of man. And I solely wanted to be doing what God wanted me to do. I wanted to make sure, as we talk about often. And that's why, partly why you see fish on my hoodie is I want to bring my loaves and fish to God. And if he chooses to feed 5,000 with him, that's up to him. I'm not responsible for feeding the 5,000. I'm only responsible for providing my loaves and fish. So that concept is what allows me to answer your question in this way. I didn't expect this, but I didn't not expect it either, because I didn't have expectations. I didn't. I. I really was focused on. I need to make a show that honors the character and intentions of Jesus in the Gospels. And that's really, really hard. And if I think about trying to please an audience or trying to avoid criticism or trying to get it big and successful, I'm going to be crippled and I'm going to start making decisions that aren't in the best interests of the show. So that's a long answer to your question. But as I head into this weekend, I'm like, I don't know that I'm surprised, but I'm also. I wouldn't have been surprised if this would have failed. It's. It's really. I didn't think about that. I'm really focused on. On just doing the work and pleasing God. And then, of course, to my wife. Yeah, but when you get to that place, if it becomes a habit, I mean, you really do start replacing your need for affirmation with scripture. You start really working on that, and it becomes a superpower. I mean, it really is, because you. You really do. When you get criticized like we get every day, you stop caring about it. And when you get praised and told you're the greatest thing ever, you don't focus on that either. It doesn't. It doesn't matter to you compared to getting it right, to getting what God has called you to Do. Right, So I know, I know, I'm sorry that that's such a long answer to your question, but it's just, it's, it's. I can't, I can't answer. I can't say, yeah, sure, I expected this, or no, I didn't expect it without saying that I didn't have expectations.

No, that is so powerful. And you're right, it is a superpower. Because when you're talking about the fear of man, Bible says there'll be a snare to us. And so that idea of being on shaky ground, like, okay, if this gets the results I want, then I'm approved, if it doesn't, I fail. Like that kind of snare. We are setting ourselves up for this performance based work which will always implode because when is it ever enough, you know, if we, if we put that measurement over our self worth. But what you say, like this is almost, I think the secret to doing impossible things. Like when Ephesians 3:20 tells us that we can do exceedingly, abundantly beyond, like, I think you have tapped into that superpower is being completely divorced from the results. Like, like as long as it's me aligned with God, that's my source and I'm divorced from it, then and only then can I really do impossible things.

That's, that's really well said. Yeah. And I think that it's a temptation for anybody. And you said it really well when you said it's never enough. Because what happens is, let's say you're on social media, let's say you don't have a podcast like you do, or a show like you do, or a show like I do, and you're just on, on social media for like as a normal human being. And you start out and you've only got, you know, five, 10 followers and then you grow to 20 and then you go to a couple hundred and, and then you start noticing, like when you do a post, okay, how many likes did I get? How many comments did I get? Well, let's say you grow, let's say it grows to a few thousand. Or in, in my case, for example, I was at a few thousand followers for several years and then the chosen took off. And now on my pages it's a couple hundred thousand. Well, when I, when I do a post and I go, oh, this post now only got a thousand likes. Well, there was a time in my life when a thousand likes would have been a massive deal. It's all relative anyway. And so you, what you do is by nature, you start comparing yourself and your accomplishments, your. The things you're doing, the posts you make, the comments you make, you start comparing them to, to the previous or to the future as opposed to just really like you just said, well, divorcing yourself from results. And I'm sure it's probably a temptation for you as someone who's got a show and you're looking at the numbers and that's how you can measure success. It's really difficult to not care about those things, but to really establish a DNA, even with our staff and our team of going, we are not going to focus on the numbers. It's not why we're doing it.

But it's so tempting though. And everything that we're taught, we're really like kind of indoctrinated to believe to focus on the results. Like, okay, when will my weight be the right weight? When will my salary be the right salary? And if we start to, I mean, that's really good about establishing a vision, but if that's why, then even when we get to that, there's still not complete satisfaction because that's still kind of the works of the flesh. When the Bible talks about the works of the flesh, the works of the spirit, we're still gauging whether I will approve of myself if I'm, if I'm performing or not. But I just love that idea of, you know, like, like you said, with your whole team not going to focus on the numbers. It's got to be tempting to want to because it's how you evaluate things in the physical realm. Right? Like we, everything has number behind it. But I think that's when God can really show up. Like, I think how he shows up through the chosen, through the projects you've undertaken, through the work that you and your team is doing. It's. I think it's just basically embodying what God can do through you when you're really a conduit. And I would love for like people, you know, watching, listening, like, what would that mean in their life if they were just basically, you know, I'm not going to focus on results. I'm going to focus on me right now. I. Operating as a, as a vessel for what God wants to do through us.

Yeah, no, it's, that's really good. And I think it's, it is difficult because sometimes you, sometimes numbers are what allow you to keep going. So for example, let's say you make a show and if you don't generate income in return, you know, you can't do more shows or more movies or whatever it is you're doing or any, any business that you start. Sometimes if it's a ministry and you need funding for that, and if you're not getting it, then you, you can't necessarily do it. Well, sometimes that, that's God saying, I wanted you to, to, to do this for me, but I, but it wasn't your, my long term plan for you. Or sometimes it means, okay, when I, when I first got called to this, or thought I got called, maybe I was focused on the wrong thing. Maybe I wasn't called to this. Maybe I heard the wrong voice. I mean, that's something that I struggled with when, when my movie failed was I thought I. It sure seemed clear that God was behind this. And now that it's failed. What, what? I guess I misread the tea leaves. I guess I didn't hear it right. Well, God showed me, of course, through again the feeding of the 5,000, that when Jesus was, was told that the people are hungry, he wasn't surprised. In fact, it was his fault. He had gotten them to that place of desperate hunger so that he's the one who'd been talking for three days. So he got them to the place of desperate hunger where the only thing left was a miracle. And that really helped me too because I thought, you know, sometimes not only does God allow us to fail, sometimes he even orchestrates it because he wants us to be dependent on him. And, and he has a different definition of failure. So we may think, oh, I failed, therefore God wasn't behind it because God's not the author of failure. Well, I think that's, I think that's poor theology because I think that sometimes, I mean, if you look throughout the scriptures, God caused, allowed, whatever your theology is, however you want to word it, failure, quote, unquote. Many, many, many times. And what you realize is, okay, his definition of failure is different from ours. And all of this is always about drawing us closer to him and making us more dependent on Him. And then sometimes he gives tremendous blessing, worldly blessings too. That happens. And that's not wrong. That's not, that's not inherently bad. But he says throughout, beware of it, beware of the success, even more than the failure. That's throughout the Old Testament. Beware, beware of the success. And the ones who had the biggest falls are the ones who had the most success. So it is just a life principle. This all rooted in your description, in your very good question about, hey, did you expect this would come no, it's so good. Yeah, but, but, but that's. It's been a real big, huge part of the chosen is our DNA is we don't focus on affirmation.

Like, imagine if people could incorporate that just in their own life and that. That goes out to their family. This idea, like, we're. We're going to be used by God. We're seeking first kingdom and his righteousness. That's going to be our first goal. Then all these things can be added. Like, if we just, like, I know it's counterintuitive to the way the world operates, but if we could just get that focus right, everything seems to fall into place. But I want to touch on something that you, you mentioned is this idea of failure. Because I've experienced that, like, failures in my life. I always say, God, where did I get it wrong? And I've often heard I didn't. Like, that was a necessary. Like, if we can understand what. If failure is a necessary part of the journey to bring us to the next place, then the worst thing we can do is let that failure stop us. Like, like, if we could just understand, like, okay, failure happens. Like, whoever is listening watching you failed. We've all failed. Now, are you going to stay there or move further? What did it take for you to move further, Move like, beyond that failure to the next big thing that God has for you?

Yeah, exactly. Well, and that's what season three is about in many ways. Season three, the theme is, come to me, all of you who are weary and heavy laden, and I will give you rest. Well, we spend a lot of time on the weary and heavy laden part. You'll see throughout season three that we address a lot of these questions and challenges and doubts. The disciples are like, all right, we're all in. We're following Jesus. We're following the Messiah. Oh, my goodness. This is the best thing ever. Our lives are going to be great. We're going to now get rid of the oppression in our lives from the Romans. Simon and Eden are going. Going to now have wonderful marriage. All of these things are going to be improved. And when they don't, then what? And I think that's an important thing we have to address in this show because we can't imply that Jesus came to earth and then just everything on earth just was. Was better. In fact, his. One of his primary messages was, things may get worse for you, especially if you follow me. And that's really confusing for the disciples. And they ask a lot of questions. And so we don't gloss over those questions. And some of that comes from the questions that I had when I was in my. In my failure and that this person felt led to share with me the concept of it's not your job to feed the 5,000. It's only provide the loaves and fish. And I was able to get past the failure because. Not because of new success. I had no idea if I was going to be successful again. I didn't know if I was going to make another movie or show again. In fact, I thought I probably wouldn't. But it was when I totally surrendered and when I was okay with that concept. And I really got to the point where I was like, if I never make another movie or TV show again, that's okay. When I was able to get there, that's when I believe. God said, now you're ready for the chosen. And that's when I was open to doing a short film for my church's Christmas Eve service. I had no goals with that. It was just be. It was just for a Christmas Eve service. And it was shot on my friend's farm in Illinois, 20 minutes from my house. And while I was making it, I had the idea for a show. And I thought, whoever makes this show will be. I think will. Will have. Will look smart later because I do think this could be successful. But, like, I didn't think it was going to happen. And. Oh, sorry, I hit my mic. So because. Because of that surrender piece, because I was just. I was able to find joy in this process, regardless of whether the. The success came. And the fact that the Chosen has been successful is completely irrelevant to me and hasn't changed one ounce of the work that we do when we're writing, when we're directing, when we're. When we're producing it, when I'm editing it, all that stuff, none of the fact that now there's hundreds, you know, well, not yet about 100 million people watching, and as opposed to when I first started it, there were no people watching. Doesn't change the work at all. And that is just. That is just a foundational principle that has changed my life.

Wow, you said something so powerful there. You said joy in the process, and you had to get to that place where it's like, I can let go of success or failure. There's joy right here because all we have is right now. If we're not finding joy in the process, where are we going to stumble upon it later? Like, that's. That's basically a delusion that I think a Lot of people live by. It's like, no, I'm going to get to that place where I'm happy instead of realizing if I can't be joyful in this process. Now I'm forgetting what it's all about anyway. I'm forgetting why I'm even here.

Well, yeah. And you use the word happy because there's a big difference between the happiness. Happiness and joy. You know, joy is. Is contentment and blessedness and. And pursuit of God, regardless of whether you're happy or not. And so happiness is. Tends to be based on results. Happiness is. The Bears won the game. I'm. I'm happy. The. The joy is. Regardless of the circumstance, I know my future with Christ. I am. I know that. I'm content with it with. Regardless of the process. Sorry. Regardless of the result, I'm content with what God is putting me through. And that's why you see these people sometimes around the world who. Who are being persecuted. Something we don't identify with here in the States. People being persecuted who are, like, have bigger smiles on their faces than we do because they understand that definition of joy versus happiness.

Mm. And joy is. Joy is a. Well, like. Like, happiness is that cup of Kool Aid. You know, joy is that. Well, that we can tap into at any time. And I love that you just had the idea, I'll just do a short film for my church. And I think sometimes we get so grandiose in our thoughts and that we. That we miss what's right in front of us. Like, even when Jesus was feeding the 5,000, you know, they came to him. They like. They're like, all right, we got to send these people home. They're hungry, and Jesus totally, like, blows them away with, like, you feed them. And sometimes I think that if he was like, hey, Dallas, what do you want to do? And you're like, hey, I'll just do the short film. What if that was the critical step that was like, now you're ready. Like, now it's just like, hey, you feed them. Okay, I can do this. I can do a short film. Even though it's challenging, even though I don't know how, even though I'm not setting any results that I want to come from it, I can serve right here. I think everyone has that opportunity work where Jesus is like, okay, you feed them. What can you do next? What is right in front of you?

Right? And. And he. He said, find the. Find the food. Give me. Give me some food. And that's what's interesting about it. Is Jesus could have waved his hands and had loaves and fish appear in the laps of everyone in the crowd. But he still used the disciples for everything that they didn't need him for. So he still, excuse me, he still uses us for the things we don't need him for. For example, we don't need God's hand to make loaves and fish like we, we have the ability to make loaves and fish now. We need to make them the best that we can. We need to make them healthy and safe. But he's like, you do that part, you do your part. The truth that was given to me by this, by this man who felt led to it when I failed was, it's not your job to feed the 5,000. It's only to provide the loaves and fish. Well, providing the loaves and fish is not a part that you gloss over. You do provide the loaves and fish. He used it even though he didn't need it. He said, I give me, bring me loaves and fish. And then when he multiplied it, he had the disciples go distribute it again. He could have done it himself. He wants us to participate in that process. He just doesn't want us to feel responsible or to think we're result we're responsible for after it happens, the actual multiplication. I mean, if the boy who provided the loaves and fish would have gone home and said, mom and dad, you won't believe it. I fed 5,000 people today. That would have obviously been ludicrous. It's just as ludicrous for me to say, hey, look, look what I did with the chosen. It's now around the world and reaching a million, you know, 100 million people. Isn't that awesome? No, I've made it. I've made a show that I'm proud of. But the multiplication, the success is not something that I'm responsible for.

Wow, so powerful. All we need to do is what's next? Just provide the loaves of fish. And we can all do that. Like, if we allow God to do what he wants to do, then we could do what he's told us to do. Because I've realized the pattern of God working with man is he likes to work in cooperation with man. Like, he doesn't do things apart from man. He's like, no, let's. We're going to work together in this. And when we sometimes take on the God part, I'm going to, I'm going to be in charge of the results, the multiplicity. That is not a burden that we're supposed to carry. I love that. That. That kind of, like, sums up the whole theme of season three. It's like, no, no, this doesn't have to be my burden. He has said, cast all your cares upon me. Yeah. That's so powerful. So what's next for you?

Well, Friday night or Friday. Well, starts actually Friday afternoon. What's funny is I'm not. There's nothing I'm doing. I've already done it. I've already made episodes one and two.

Yeah.

They're now going into the theater, and now people just need to look around their local theaters and see if the Chosen's playing there and if it is, to try to see it, try to get to it, because this is the way to watch it for now. It's the. The Chosen app in December. Sometime in December. We'll announce that eventually. But. But in the meantime, it's in theaters now. What I'm doing right now is episodes one and two are done, but I'm still editing the rest of the episodes for season three, because those come out later, and I'm writing the episodes for season four. So all of that, like, what. You know, in. After I talk to you, I. You know, this afternoon and this evening, I. The hand remains on the plow.

Yeah.

Because we've got to start filming season four early next year, and the train keeps moving. So while I'm not focused on the results, I am focusing on those floats and fish, and they do take a lot of time to debate. I always try to tell people it takes longer to make the show than it does to watch it, so you got to be a little bit patient.

So powerful. Dallas, I want to thank you not just for being on the show today, but also for just being obedient and pushing through even, you know, pushing through failure and being willing to provide the loaves of fish, because out of that, God's been able to just. I know it's probably beyond what you ever anticipated, but be able to reach the whole world with this message. So I want to thank you for being on the show today, and it's going to be amazing. Thank you so much.

Thanks for. Thanks for watching. I hope you enjoy season three. I think you'll. I can predict. I think I can safely predict you might need a few tissues, so you might be able to kind of handhold your. Your viewers and listeners through the process because they might come. Come with some tears.

Fantastic. We're ready for it. Bring it on. Tears of. Tears of pain. Joy. We're good with it. All right? That's what we're here for.

Good. Well, thanks for having me on.

Yeah. Thank you so much, Dallas.