Personal Change

Foreign. Ladies and gentlemen, thank you for joining us here at JLC Media. I have a few of my colleagues with me today. We're going to have a conversation about change. We're beginning a new series on the essence of change. What is it? Where does it come from? Why do we deal with it? How do we deal with it? Today, this whole setup is really almost perfect in terms of timing. We're coming out of COVID people are generally vaccinated. The hybrid model will still be alive. And many people are looking forward to returning to face to face conversations. All of those opportunities, our opportunities to recognize change is unfolding. It has been, as we keep saying, time is our asset in the 21st century. One of our great assets that we want to hold onto and truly use well, change. Change is unfolding constantly. The greatest driver has been technology. We all know that. And at some level we're very thankful we have technology because it is aided us as we worked our way through these environments that were posed as a result of a pandemic. We're happy to be here talking about this with you. What we'd like to do today is to develop a common understanding about what are some capabilities that this team employed when they were going through a significant change. And as you are listening, I invite you to be thinking about your own significant changes and the capabilities that you employed as you were trying to deal with those changes. By the time this is done, our intention is that each of you will remember and be able to access attributes that already live within you. And if you're interested, we invite you to listen to other potential attributes that can help you through a change process. Change sometimes shows up as an event. Sometimes it shows up in a slow growing way. So that's our setup for our conversation today. And I'm going to ask each of my colleagues to do what we do all the time. Close the loop. It's close the learning loop. What did you hear me say? What did that mean to you? And if it feels good, say what it felt like as I was sharing our setup for today's conversation. So let me start with you, Joe. What did you hear? What did it mean to you? And. Or what were you feeling?

So, Ray, you're challenging us, I think, to tell some stories. And again, I think we learn a lot through stories about how we have dealt with change in our own lives. And because we're trained in this, in this art of communication and cause and effect that we try to help so many of our clients with, because we're deeply engaged in that, you know, what are the things that we did for ourselves is what I hear you asking. And so I know we're going to share stories. Do you want to hold the stories.

Until later or you let me kind of get the. Close the loop on the intention and then I'll shift the stories. But Joe just brought up one of the most important things. The stories that we tell other people and the stories that we tell ourselves are leadership opportunities. These are opportunities for us to lead more and more effectively. But I think you got that. Well, let's find out. Julie, did you hear something more or different as I set this up?

Yeah, I heard something more. That change is constant and we're always changing. We don't realize that we're being flexible and adaptable to change. And so when something really big comes, we think, oh, my gosh, I don't know what to do with change, but we actually deal with it on a daily basis.

I actually think it's been unfolding for our whole lives. And it is. There's so much in this that just feels to me like a way to live in the world. Well, to recognize and embrace change as it unfolds. Although I am guilty of resisting it when it, Ah, what is this? I don't really want to deal with that. What's going on here? So there's a whole continuum that unfolds during the change process as we hear stories from our friends. I think you're going to enjoy noticing how this process of change is continuous and sometimes needs to be looped in order for it to unfold successfully. That was great, Julie. Thank you very, very much. Nicole, what are you thinking? What did you hear me say? Did it resonate? What resonated with you?

Yeah, I heard you say that we are in the midst, collectively, as a society of a major change. We're shifting from being in a global pandemic to adjusting to what it might look like to come out of that, a little bit of the global pandemic because it's still not over. And then the other thing that I really heard you say was, you know, sometimes change is a specific event, a thing that happens around you or do you. And then sometimes it's a slow burn. It's something that, you know, you notice within yourself that has been going on for a while and you recognize it and you want to shift or change is the other piece I heard.

Thank you for that. I know. I will poke this a few times. Awareness is so important. And if, when we are aware of the stories that we tell Ourselves, we become more capable of dealing with next steps. Sometimes we are not aware. We don't notice the stories we're telling ourselves. We don't notice the stories we tell each other as really a powerful message about what's important to me moving forward. That's really nice. Thank you, Colleen. Anything more?

No, I heard similar to my colleagues. One thing that I'll just kind of add to what Nicole just mentioned was that sense of is change an event or kind of, is it constant? Right. Sometimes it's just these constant waves that continue to pass over us. And I really feel like when you talked about, what are you feeling? I'm feeling some change fatigue, right. I'm like, damn. These changes continue to come and we continue to adapt and be, to your point, self aware. And yet sometimes there's that sense of, okay, I'm recognizing in myself that, you know what, could we just maybe have some status quo for a moment? That'd be nice.

How to get a breath by just take a deep breath in between. And it has a lot to do with one of the features of resilience. The greater the quality of my relationships with each of you, the greater my opportunity to examine my own thinking and to become more and more aware. There is a gift in that that sometimes gets misunderstood. And in the work of helping people have a better meeting, very often what you're really doing is allowing them to cope with the changes that are unfolding going forward. That was beautiful. Thank you. So, to Joe's point from before, these are about stories. So I'm going to ask each of you to give us a little snippet of your story and of the story you're going to tell. And then we will use each of those stories. And I want all of you listening, me included, and those of you that are listening to us outside, to notice, notice and become aware of certain places in the story where the human being had to adjust how they were responding to the change. So with that said, Joe, start us off. Give us a good change story for you.

Yes. So for me, I retired from Federal Service basically right as Covid was starting up. Of course, the two events were not connected. I had planned on retiring sometime before, and the end of February was a really good time for me and for my family. So, as always, that kind of change in your working life is a significant shift. It brings a lot of reflection and perspective on what are you doing and what's the next phase. And again, it's not like you haven't prepared or haven't thought about that you have, but as we all know, when it actually arrives, then you have a lot to consider and you think about things more seriously. For me, it was nice to be off because I hadn't had a long vacation in a while, and so it was kind of nice to take a break that was without a definitive end, to adjust patterns, sleep patterns, workout patterns, Adjust lots of those things in your life that have a big impact on the quality of your life and do require some attention. But for me, there was a question then after that, after I'd made that kind of adjustment over probably 60 days or so, about, okay, what was I going to do? Because I still wanted to contribute and again, have had a lot of experience in the Department of Defense and in other places as well, but particularly the Department of Defense, and I was seeking how to contribute that. So one of the things that I've always enjoyed is helping other people figure out how to make their organizations work better. I think as an executive, I was always, as a performing executive in the government, I was always fairly driven about, how do we improve? What do we improve? How do we go about that? On what kind of a schedule, how resilient are the people to the change, how much do they understand about the change? When are we going to get there? Patience was never something that I was really big on. I wanted to see action, and I wanted to see movement, and I think that's the way many executives are. So as I thought about, all right, I'm going to shift from that environment and that kind of accountability that I held for myself about what I was going to do. I had to shift from that into, all right, if I'm going to have another role at this stage of my life, what is that role going to be? And so I came to this, to this coaching proposition, because, frankly, it was a way to use the experiences that I have in a meaningful way for others. And so, frankly, thinking about that, there were aspects of it that were not appealing at all. Part of the joy and the thrill for me was in actually performing in the federal government and actually working and the things that. In getting the results and being able to reward the team members and to support the team members in their achievement. The thing that was not appealing to me was to give that up, because there was a lot of satisfaction in that kind of reward. But frankly, realizing that, all right, at this point in my life, again, it's time to let someone else sit in that chair make those decisions, and that the best way I could use my experience going forward would be to capture that as a support mechanism and to assist others who were working through executive issues, perhaps that I had worked through or had executive challenges and frankly were in need of that, someone else to have a safe conversation with, to think deeply about their challenges and about how they are responding to those challenges. So that was a real change for me was to say, stop it, stop executing and instead get into the mode with the people you were trying to help, of genuinely being helpful, of asking them, what are you thinking about this? How are you approaching it? Is your approach based upon the facts, or have you made decisions and assigned emotions and worked on other things that we talk about in the ladder of inference that are frankly getting in your way of being an effective executive? So the thing that the challenge here in embracing the change is is to get at the why and to keep asking yourself, I think the why question, why do you want to do this? And for me, it comes back to something that I discovered a very long time ago when I first went into the Navy as a line officer, that frankly, there's a piece of me that is built for public service, that believes is public spirited and believes in the effectiveness of government to achieve certain things and those common defense and civil liberties and all of those things that are good in our country. My ability to now contribute on that is in the role where I can invite executives to think about different aspects of their decisions, where I can invite their deeper reflection on some of the points, on the science that we talk about behind conversational leadership, but that I needed to keep myself out of the frame of execution and leave that to those who have all of that ultimate responsibility today.

So magnificent. Really great, great piece, Joe. Here's how we're going to do today. Julie, what did you hear him say and how does that connect to the story you're going to tell us?

Yeah, so what I heard him say is who he is, naturally is public servant and he loves to help people succeed. But then there was a change after he retired, he needed to change from being the leader out in front to being the silent leader behind and continuing to enhance the leader thinking and creating a safe space. And so it was a change because he was used to being the public figure and now he's behind and helping much more with the cognitive piece. And that's what I heard.

That's beautiful. How does that connect to the story you're going to tell us?

In a way, it's almost exactly the same in that I have a daughter. She, when she was going through school, I was very much out in front, showing her the way, and she was happy to follow it. And she was in soccer and she was in basketball, and she was this and that. And I scheduled everything, and there was very little time. And it was, this is where we're going next. And you know, okay, let's blah, blah, blah. And we, we had it. I was out in front and she was following me. And then I have a second daughter who is a very creative, front, free spirits person who does not like to plan. And so when it was time to work with her, she's an actor, so we had dance and we had voice, and we had acting, and this is the way it's going to go. And blah, blah, blah, blah, blah. No way. And there would be fights, and it would be like, if I'm paying this amount of money, then you're going to have to practice. And so I had to sort of like Jo said, stop, this is not working. What I'm doing with Skylar is not working with Caitlin. They are two separate people. So how can I be a mother? How can I lead her and create a space for her to do what she wants to do? But I'm not out in front. I'm not the one scheduling. I'm not the one. But I do need to train her with those skills so that she does know how to respond to emails, so she does know how to look up and schedule her own thing. So in a way, what Joe's talking about is very similar to what I went through.

Yeah. So there's a whole piece that we do as a team where we make invitations to people and recommendations. And we're clear, especially in the roles we're in now, that we're not the ones making the decision that is the person that we are loving through parenting or the person that we are loving through executive coaching. We make invitations and recommendations. They make the decisions, and there's a lot of letting go on that. It's almost like, how do I let go of that? And with each parent that I've ever run into, myself included, there was always a time, there was a space where I needed to let go and let that human being make their own decisions. Nicole, how is this resonating with you and your story?

Yeah, I think there are aspects of both Joe and Julie's stories that resonate for me. I think Jo's experience with a major life transition or change and having to redefine what success looks like, what meaningfulness looks like in your life, what the work, you know, how the work you do will impact Others in the world might look like really resonated for me about what Joe shared. And Julie, the place of unknowing that you must have felt with, okay, how am I going to be a different kind of mother or leader or person in this space? Because what I'm doing now is not working. So I resonate with both of those aspects. I think part of my change journey or my story story that I wanted to share is back from my corporate life and experience and through anyone who's worked in a corporate environment has been through change. Corporate environments, in my experience, consistently reevaluate the way that they operate and do business. And that's absolutely necessary, and it affects people. For me, it involves several transitions, major department transitions. That department that I worked in while I worked there for the 10 years that I worked within them, I probably went through two or three major transitions where my role changed, my leadership changed, my. The work that I did, my clients within the organization changed. And those had all been, you know, leading up to a place where the organization was making decisions about centralizing employees. And we knew that decision was coming. So this was several years of anticipation. So that place of ambiguity and uncertainty was alive within me and within all of my colleagues for years leading up to the point where we knew they were going to make the decision about centralizing our roles. And for me, very personally, that was a decision about do I want to move my family to an entirely different state or do I want to do something else with my life? And so that process, like I said, was several years long. And I had a lot of opportunity to think about what I really wanted for myself. But I also had a lot of space where I was working with colleagues that were having very different reactions to that change. And I ended up in a position where I could lead in a way that helped people process through the change. And I think that's so important when we think about organizations that are shifting and changing constantly, to not lose sight of that element that people need of space to process through those shifts and changes. So I organized things that were change sessions for my peers, opportunities for them to just vent and talk about how they thought this change might impact them, what would be of service and help to them. And sometimes that was, I need to build a resume, I need to be prepared that I might not get selected for a job in this new structure, or that I might need to move my family across the country. And giving people the space to have conversations with each other and process through that together was really meaningful for me. As I went through that big shift and change. And ultimately, ultimately for me, I knew that I was not going to move my family, that I was going to make a different choice for myself and still find meaning in the work that I. That I wanted to do. So redefining what. What my life and my work that I did look like was a big part of that process for me. But I think one of the biggest things that I've learned over the last three years since that occurred for me was that that change process is not linear and it may not always be over. I put a lot of emphasis in focusing on what was positive and the opportunities that existed. And I think my peers appreciated that about me, that I could focus on the possibilities. And that's a huge part of just what's core to who I am. I always see those possibilities. But I found in this, this last year, I lost a former colleague. He passed away. And in his passing, as I connected with some of my other former colleagues, we all worked very closely together. I found not only did I have grief for his loss, but also the loss of maybe that life or that former identity that I had within that group of people that I worked with. So I think that that sense of shifting and changing, big transitions in your life, there's so much to process there that I think runs through all of us as we, as we shift and change and grow. I think it'll surprise you sometimes. Like, Jo, I don't know if you experienced this, or Julie, you experienced this. Like, do you ever think back to that old life and, you know, have some sadness or have some, like, re evaluations or shifts that you feel internally about those big changes you've been through. So I guess just bringing forward that you might go through a major change, but you might not be quite done with it yet. It still might affect you in some ways.

Yeah. Yeah. I think since she called you both out. Joe, how do you respond to that thinking about your former life? And I'll do you in a moment. Julie, about your other parenting methodology.

I think you always think about the big shifts that have happened in your life, and in many respects, I think they're never over. But it's almost Eastern in a way that you don't banish those events or you don't eliminate those events from your life. You accept them as just a part of your life, but you don't make it the feature. You don't make it the mainstream. You have it in an appropriate place.

That's beautiful. There's always something to learn. There's a. You know when you're always in the newspaper and I was always in the newspaper. I was not always good, but I was always in the newspaper. From that to we don't really care who you are, where you are, what you're thinking or doing anymore. Complete change. Julie, she called you out on that, too. What are you thinking about what Nicole said?

Yeah, I think, too, that you don't really know until it's happened. You know, I was. I think about Skylar and, oh, my gosh, every. Every day there was something. And exhausted, and we wouldn't eat till dinner, you know, and then she goes to college, and then it's like, okay, now what am I gonna do? I have all this time and, you know, so in that aspect, I didn't have that sadness until she left for college. And then the anxiety for Caitlin that she won't let me plan things, so I have to wait until she decides what she's gonna do. And she usually doesn't decide it until, like, right before it's time to do it.

It always works out.

But I'm still living the Caitlin thing. I'm not sad about that, but I was sad about Skyler.

Yeah, I encourage you to hang on. And the other part of this that resonated with me when Nicole was speaking is to be a little careful because most human beings suffer from. This is very, again, Eastern. Since Joe teed it up, we suffer from a little bit of, you know, amnesia and a little bit of nostalgia. Oh, I remember when I was in charge of this. And you don't really remember it exactly the way it happened. So we lose a little bit of the reality of the moment. So. And those of you listening, you can understand how incredibly powerful this gentleman and these women are in helping people move to change. Colleen, this is your show. Now give us your story and connect to what you've heard so far. Sure.

I think it was funny because when Joe teed us off with his story, I wrote down let Go. And then as I listened to these other stories, in fact, it even came out of your mouth, Ray, as you were close on loop. It's this sense of each of us create this vision of our life and the way things ought to be. To Julie's point, they ought to go like this, right? We like these things planned, and we like to know Joe's over there, you know, kicking ass, taking names. And now all of a sudden, he's like, I'm not executing. Wait a minute. In my vision, this is why I behaved and what it felt like to me. And now we need to almost redefine and reimagine how we behave and how we operate. And so, same thing with Nicole. You go from leading teams and executing to I'm the guide on the side providing some sage advice which people can choose to engage in or choose not to. And so very much my connected to my story of the sense of redefining and re envisioning my role. I mean, before COVID right. I'm thinking about March. Julie and I, we had our schedules for 12 months planned. I mean, we were going to see our clients. We were on planes every other week. We had it laid out, and then all of a sudden, wham o Covid hit. I'm like, all right. And I think I remember talking to Julie. Oh, we'll just postpone. Couple weeks, we'll be able to reschedule and we'll roll right through. Did that happen? Hell, no. So we had to reimagine. I had to let go of this vision of my 12 months and first, be sad, be nostalgic, and let it go, then reimagine. What might the next 12 months look like and how can I pick up the pieces and create a new vision that I can truly embrace and commit to moving forward?

So, Colleen, you just did. You tied a ribbon on this whole particular piece. And I'm going to go to a little bit of a checkout in a moment, but let me kind of just reinforce what you said. So I was part of the change in all of your lives and intimately involved in the one that Nicole brought about, talked about, as well as us responding to Covid when it hit as a community. Right. And as I thought about that, there were people I was speaking with in presentation mode in different places that were so angry about the change. It was a shock. And they were angry. And they kept saying, well, why don't they just let us go back and do this and why don't we just do that? And there were all these interesting loopy questions that were holding them in their current reality. And there are some people who I need to do that sometimes. I, oh, why can't it go back to the way it was? Okay. No, it's not so. Some people are more able to move to a new space quickly and more quickly than others. The ones that can move into this new space the way it ought to be, embrace the change, be proactive in how I intend to respond to the change. They become truly change adopters. And for them, they love it. It's like, oh, but I don't want to let. I don't want to let go. The idea that all of us go through some shock, some anger, potential sadness about whatever it is that's unfolding because I kind of like the way it was. In our next session, we're going to talk about how our self talk and mental models hold us in a very, very small space. And if we can't get beyond that small space, we keep reverting to it and the change can happen around us and we will lose our perspective and even potentially our role and maybe even our job. Much to talk about here, guys. You guys were great. Let's move to a space now. Think about your changes again. And I thought you just said that so well. What was the number one, the biggest learning? And I'd like to frame this similar to way I did one with you, Joe, recently. If there was somebody that you know is going to go through a change similar to yours, what is one thing that you'd like to share with that person that you learned going through your change process? Julie, you can think about that instantly. A parent who might come to you and say, what am I going to do about this? You know, each of you has an opportunity to say, here's someone I really care about. Here's something I learned about myself going through the change process that you really want to transfer to that human being. Somebody just hold you. They'll let you think for a couple of seconds. Those of you listening, please do the same. Think about someone you really care about that's going through a change that you went through. What is the number one key, key piece of information you'd like to share with that human being? Colleen, why don't you start us off?

The only thing we control is our response to others and to the situation around us. So that would be the one piece of advice I would share, is to really be cognizant and self aware. Am I letting go? Am I holding on? Am I how you know? So what do I feel like I need to control? So that sense of control is an illusion and how can I ensure that I am adjusting and being, being not rigid but flexible.

Flexibility and awareness that control. I mean, I do want to respond to a change. It is my response that matters. And it's just beautifully stated. We got to get beyond reaction to the change to a space where we can respond to the change. That's brilliant. Thank you. Nicole, how about you?

I would say find space to celebrate and honor what was and then give yourself space. Space also to define what success looks like for you.

That's beautiful. So I will insert a very brief story. You're all probably, except Joe. And I probably remember this. Remember when Ma Bell was taken over Joe, and a whole new company came in and took him and the current employees of Bell Telephone, Ma Bell, right, were experiencing and demonstrating incredible problems, personnel problems, sadness, anger, fights, people. Right. A colleague of mine was hired by them to do an assessment and do something about it. The assessment was they were sad and they didn't have a chance to say goodbye to Mom. He hired a whole bunch of other people to go around the company and let anybody that wanted to on video say goodbye to Ma Belle. Within a month, the entire culture of sadness, upsetment, response to change shifted dramatically. It's one of the most incredible stories I've ever heard about, and I've used it forever. When I watch one school change to another school building. What are you going to bring from the old school building into the new one? What are the artifacts that represent what you loved about where you were? It is such a powerful piece and one I have used in my consulting practice for as long, ever since I heard the story. Joe, what's one thing you're going to tell your best friend who is going through the same thing you did?

Yeah, so somebody. Awareness has been mentioned a couple times, but I will bring it up again because I think it's such a key executive skill. And I think there's a process that goes on. In my observation, when you're in an executive position and you're performing in that executive position, you develop an awareness around the things in that position. And it's my belief that when you go to another executive position that your instincts that you developed in that first position, they don't atrophy, they actually become more and more refined. And so it's sort of like Malcolm Gladwell's 10,000 hours. The more you practice the awareness, the more of an expert you become at it. And so I think it's very important then, with this very refined sense of awareness, that you have to use that effectively in your big transition and to understand, all right, I'm angry, sad. Why? Ask those five why questions that I referred to earlier and really look down deeper to see why you feel that way. But then I think it's also. And again, it's not that you just consider where that came from, it's that you consider what is the best response for the situation you're in. And again, and as many executives know, if you're angry and you speak in anger and you didn't really think about the consequences first. You're going to rock the boat and probably sink a couple boats that you really wish you hadn't done. If, on the other hand, you've thought it through and you understand the context and the situation and anger is an appropriate emotion to demonstrate because of other circumstances, then you've made a calculated and informed decision and you can live with that. But I think this awareness around how are you doing with the change and working on your coping mechanisms is very important.

Notice those of you listening, Joe went through two incredibly important iterations. It's important to say, why the hell is this happening? Why am I feeling like this? Why is this going on? But notice how he shifted to what can I do differently to enable this to move forward? That distinction is enormously important. Otherwise we end up in a kind of a sad place around saying, why, why, why, why, why me? What's in it for me? Blah, blah, blah. Notice how elegantly Joe shifted into what can I do about this? And if I'm. If I need to be pissed off because someone needs to know I'm pissed off, that's okay. But to choice, I chose to react that way. Brilliant, sir. Thank you, all of you. Julie, what are you going to tell your buddy?

It's dangerous to want something for someone else. So I hear that all the time from my coach and from you guys and from my therapist. Caitlin is not like you. She is not like you, so stop trying to make her like you. It is not working. So, yeah, it is dangerous to want something for someone else.

Yeah. So that is always part of our practice. And every. Everywhere we go, we try and help people and they're like, what do you mean I have to want my salesperson person to make more money? Do they want to. I really want this person to do that. Do they want to do that? So the matching of personal vision of success with the big why that Joel teed up at the very beginning is incredible because we are in this together as a community, the five of us. And there's more of us that are rambling around together because our whys, why we do this, all matched. That's why we're here. Ladies and gentlemen, thank you for listening. This has been a JLC Media. You can find us on Spotify, Apple, YouTube. This work is all about the essence of change. And I sure hope I got so much out of this from my colleagues. I hope you enjoyed it and found a way to think about how can I respond to change? Notice, not react, respond to change. More effectively. To all of you listening, be well. Sincerest thanks for listening to this episode.

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