The One You Feed: Rewire Your Mindset Through Daily Choices | Ft Ashley Negron

Welcome to the Optimizing Beyond podcast. I'm Josh Negron, and this show's all about sharing lessons, ideas, and strategies that sharpen your thinking, strengthen your habits, and push you to grow beyond comfort zones. Let's dive in. All right, and we are back with Ms. Ashley, my co-host here for the show today. Welcome back, Ms. Ashley.

Thank you. I'm excited.

So today's episode is called The One You Feed, and that's a, uh, you may recognize this as a Cherokee proverb. So I'll read the little excerpt of how it goes. It states that one evening an old Cherokee told his grandson about a battle that goes on inside everyone. He said, my son, the battle is between 2 wolves inside us all. The kid asked, which wolf is which? And he said, one is evil. It is anger, envy, jealousy, sorrow, regret, greed, arrogance, self-pity, guilt, resentment, inferiority, lies, false pride, superiority, and ego. That's quite a list.

Mm-hmm.

And then he said, but the other is good. It is joy, peace, love, hope, serenity, humility, kindness, benevolence, empathy, generosity, truth, compassion, and faith. He said, this battle is going on inside of you and inside every other person. The grandson thought about this for a minute and then asked his grandfather, well, which wolf wins? And he said simply, the one you feed. Right? So what is this? When you first hear this, Ashley, what does this mean to you?

I think it tells us that we have a choice. We have a decision. What are we going to allow into our lives? What are we going to focus on? What are we going to allow to grow? I mean, think about it like even in like plant terms, right? Like if you plant a garden, if you don't go in and weed out the bad things, they're going— the weeds are gonna take over your plants and then eventually they're gonna choke them out and kill them. So the same thing applies to the things that we allow into our lives. Do we focus on and allow the good or the evil to grow? Because over time, those things are gonna continue to grow and eventually one is going to push out the other, whichever way that you choose to focus in your life. And so it's just highlighting the importance of focusing on, um, the good things in life and good positive character traits and feeding those and working on those so that you don't allow the evil things to win.

Hmm. Now, would you go so far as to say that it's kind of default that the evil wolf gets fed, or do you think it's kind of more even?

Yeah, well, I mean, I would say like, if you read that list, like that's kind of default who we are as humans, right? It's those things are usually the path of least resistance. They are the things that are gonna just come a little bit easier. You think about like a toddler as they're learning things, their kind of default mode is selfish, mean, Mine, inherently always looking out for yourself. And so as you raise up a child, you have to teach them that there is a different way to do life. And you have to work to have those good positive character traits. And you, you know, you have to work to overcome what is kind of innately within each of us as a human. So for me, I just think that those things can be so much easier. It is way easier. Initially to be negative and to focus on the bad things because that's just the way life is and it's hard and it's horrible and it's whatever you wanna say, but you have to make a conscious effort to look at the other side of things.

Hmm. It's funny, I, I was thinking about kids too as you said that. Sometimes people forget that kids can be that way. It's like if you think children are naturally great, put them in a room unsupervised and See what happens after several hours. Nobody would ever do that 'cause it's just, it's not a great idea. Yeah, absolutely. And that's why, I mean, we've talked about practices before, like gratitude is my favorite, that kind of programs you to look for the good, which I think, I think gratitude honestly is probably some of the best food for that good wolf.

Correct.

Just to begin with, honestly. Yeah, for sure. One thing that I always like to remind people when I explain this concept is that Typically, like you said, the default mode tends to be the negative. I think that's probably also why, you know, when you look into, you know, this age of digital, this digital age, there's oftentimes the discussion around, you know, news and media and that what gets the clicks, what's the, what's the most popular is negative news, right? And that circulates faster and more prevalently. And there's a reason why, right? And so I think this is kind of the default mode of most people. And so, when I'm, when I'm helping someone rewire their mindset, I find they get impatient with the process, right? They're like, man, I've been doing these, maybe let's say they've been doing gratitudes for 60 days or 90 days, and they're not seeing the results that they want. And they're still having a lot of negative thoughts, or maybe not giving the benefit of the doubt, or having the law of positive intent, like we talked about before. And so, it can be really frustrating. And I have to remind them, I'm like, listen, like, you know, how old are you? You know, in 20, 30, whatever. And it's like, you've been feeding the bad wolf for a hot minute, like easily double digits. And now you're starting to finally feed the good wolf, which depending on your situation might've just been a little malnourished or he might've been absolutely starving. Right. And so I think that it's helpful for people to understand that there's kind of like a time reference here too.

Mm-hmm.

In that, you know, the same way in that, like, if you've been programming, or should I say, if you've been feeding that particular wolf for a long time, that it's going to take a decent degree of intentional feeding on the other side to get the result that you want, right?

Absolutely.

And so this, this is so important that people have realistic expectations of it. And so much so, this, this concept, I mean, you know why this is close to our hearts, like, I mean, I even, even have a tattoo, right?

Correct.

There's 2 wolves there. There's the fiery one, and then there's one that's blue. I wanted both to be fierce looking because so many of the images out there were— it showed this fierce, aggressive, intimidating wolf on one end, and then the other half is this like docile, almost worthless looking wolf. I really was like, man, like, I don't particularly like that illustration.

Right.

And so when I worked with my tattoo artist, I was like, hey, like, I think I want to have a united, relatively symmetrical image of a wolf snarling, even for the good side, because I think you can have a lot of those qualities and do it with very intense intentionality and passion. And so, and I was like, and I want you to, with color and different accents, I want you to kind of illustrate one side as being evil and the other side being good. And so we kind of took it that direction. I'm happy with it. I think it's a great reminder for me to remember the wolf that I fed for many, many years and then the one that I've been feeding intentionally now. So in that, I think, I think the reason why this concept works is it's starting to be proved in science, right? Like neuroscience is doing so much of this. Like Dr. Caroline Leaf leads this a lot. I know that we talk about a lot in, in a lot of psychological programs that neurons that fire together wire together, right?

Mm-hmm.

Kind of walk us through what that concept means to you.

Yeah, I think you think about like Dr. Caroline Leaf refers to our habits and the practices that we have and the way in which it works in our brain. And you think about each habit like a tree, right? And so over time, that tree is growing and getting stronger and bigger, and the branches are getting bigger around and they're getting longer and they're growing. Well, the same thing happens in our brains, right? And so whatever habits that we've picked up And we've developed, they're creating these tree branches within our brains. And our brains are going to take the path of least resistance around the ones that are already there and head down those branches. And so what we have to do is make sure that what we're feeding our brains is, is healthy things. Um, you know, it's interesting, I actually just got done listening to Joe Rogan's podcast with Jelly Roll, which literally came out Yesterday, and him talking about rewiring his brain, um, to lose all of this weight, right? Like, he's lost like 200+ pounds. I think it's getting close to 300 pounds at this point over the last couple of years. And so him talking about like, he— the things that he had to do to rewire his brain to not be addicted to food, right?

Mm-hmm.

He's like, I had to change my algorithm. I had to start praying for different friends. I had to change the way that we ate. I had to ask my wife to hide the food. I had to make a different decision about when I was going to work out and who I was going to work out with. And I mean, everything to literally change and rewire his brain to be able to lose this weight so he would be around for his wife and his kids, right?

Mm-hmm.

And realizing that like, oh, there's not really any 500-pound 40-year-olds. And if I want to make it to my next birthday, I have to take control of my life and do that. So extreme example, but also an example of someone who said, I am no longer feeding the evil bad wolf inside of who I am. I'm going to shift and change.

Mm-hmm.

And do that. And so, um, it was just super cool to hear him and he talked so much about his brain and, and that rewiring and having people around him to help him be able to do that. And honestly, like he talked a lot about his circle and having to find a new circle and having to start to surround himself with different people. who would help keep him on that better path and who would help in that process and aiding him in doing that. And so that was just— I would encourage anyone to go and to watch that. It was such a cool 3 hours just listening to him talk about that journey.

Absolutely. And I, I want to point out here, because neurons that fire together wire together, that, you know, you talk about food addiction, Alcoholism is another one that's, that's easily plugged in. Any, any sort of like repetitive unwanted behavior like that, a lot of times that can be linked towards, you know, trauma or something in the past that causes someone to have the propensity to do something like this repeatedly. And so it's important, you know, we're talking about optimization and trying to make those changes depending on the background and the cause of those things that you're trying to change. It's important to note that sometimes you may need to see a professional. To, to unwind and unravel those, those negative thought trees or that evil wolf per se, depending on what illustration we want to use to help you kind of understand where that's coming from, understand your triggers, which can help you, you know, you know, why, why was Jelly Roll dependent on food? Like, I'm sure he's told you that.

Correct. And he said he had to, he had to go back to, to the basics and to really start to understand that and dig into that Mm-hmm. Root cause and to not just go, well, this is just who I am.

Mm.

He had to, in addition to changing food and starting to move and do all of these things, right?

Mm-hmm.

He had to actually go back and, and get to that root, root cause and to really dig in and yeah, get that professional help. So, um, you know, we would always tell someone if there's something that you're dealing with, I mean, any of us can use help in processing. The things that are going on in our minds and in our hearts and in our souls. And so I would always recommend for someone who has been feeding that bad wolf for so long to go get help, take those next steps, put good people in your corner who are there for you and who want to help you rewire your brain.

Yeah, for sure. I've got a dear friend right now that, that decided, you know, for the month of December, he's like, I mean, he's, he's not an alcoholic or anything, but he's like, you know, for the month of December, I don't want to drink for this month and just proved to myself that I don't need to. And it's kind of a personal journey for him that he chose to do. And I, I totally support it. And in that, randomly, there was a reel that showed up from the Sean Ryan Show.

Mm.

And he says, one of the things that I— this was Sean talking. And he was like, one of the things that I get a lot of crap about is that I have so much alcohol around the studio, because he's sober. He's like 5 years sober, I think he said. And he's like, so I get a lot of crap for like, well, if you're like, If you're proud of being sober, why you got so much booze around in the studio or whatever? And then what if you have somebody on the show that is trying to be sober and then you've got all this stuff? And he goes, you know... And he said an interesting take, because we talk about make sure— it's kind of like different strategies for different people per se, right? Early on when somebody's trying maybe to be dry or to be sober, Wouldn't recommend them to have a bunch of alcohol around or go to the bar. Like, you know, it's the, you know, the people that you surround yourself with, all those things count, you know. But he said, and this is 5 years in his journey, so it's interesting, you know, he's felt he's fed that other wolf for so long. He's like, it's actually, he's like, I actually like having it around because it makes me feel stronger.

Hmm.

He's like, 'cause it's right there, I can see it. And I'm like, I don't want it. I don't need it. That's not me anymore. So it was really like, and I sent that to my friend and I was like, hey, this is cool. Like, he, and he said a couple other words that just like kind of hit home with him. And he was like, man, that's like, I love that. That's how I feel. Like, that's how I want to be. So, so yeah, it's just, it's so entirely powerful to just know and look back to figure out where those things are coming from. Right. Because it all is, is, is driven by certain things in our lives, right? So one interesting thing that I've heard Jordan Peterson talking about is this concept kind of makes it sound like if you stop feeding the negative wolf or the bad wolf or these dark trees in your mind, that, uh, that they'll go away. And he's like, they don't actually, they don't ever fully go away.

Yep.

In most cases, now we're talking, he kind of always talks in general terms in his, in his vast knowledge of, uh, psychology. And that initially was was kind of troublesome to me. I was like, man, like that that kind of sucks. And what he meant by that is like be careful what you expose yourself to because when you open certain doors, you can never fully shut them again.

Hmm, fair.

It's kind of like you can't unhear something, right? And so you can't unhear, you can't unlearn something. And so he's like just just. He was saying that encouraging people to be judicious about what they took in, what they listened to, whether that be music or, you know, movies, TV, those kinds of things.

Correct.

Even, I would say social media is probably the biggest one, you know? And so that was a very key thing that brings forth a sense for me of responsibility of what I ingest and listen to, right?

Yep.

There's a movie that I watched recently, and I was like, I'm not even gonna mention it. And I was like, man, I'm fast forwarding through this more than I've ever fast forwarded through something. And it's not even like super bad per se, right? And so just, just that taking inventory and taking stock of that, because he's like, those things never fully leave us. And they're, they kind of build. So just be wise and careful. Because he always likens ideas and thoughts to like living things.

Mm-hmm.

And he's like, they're very similar to living things. And the illustration he gives for that is, is like, imagine when you have an idea and someone shoots it down. He's like, you actually feel some form of like emotional pain. And he's like, that's the idea dying, which is just crazy. You know, you don't typically think of, think of it in that way. So if that's true, if they are like kind of in a way in your mind living things, because those neurons, neurons are alive.

Correct.

If they're, if they're nefarious or not healthy or not good, then you're kind of just making things harder for yourself. Right?

Right.

Which is, which is crazy. And then here is the crazy, craziest layer added to this. They're starting to see how they call this epigenetics and how genetics can potentially have some of this encoded in them and what you pass on to your children. So I talked to another friend very, very recently who was saying like, my childhood was entirely different from my son's. It was much like— his is so much better than mine. And I'll keep it vague out of respect to him. But he's like, I'm seeing— nevertheless, I'm seeing a lot of the same traits.

Hmm.

Where I link— he's like, I linked my, my negative traits to my negative experiences, but he didn't have those. So why in the world is he dealing with that? Right? And so it's crazy, 'cause I've looked into some of this and how you can potentially inherit bad habits, addictions, and struggles from your parents. That is crazy town.

Oh man.

So how much more responsibility do you need to feel to really, you know, like you don't wanna pass these things along to your loved ones, right? That is just intense. Uh, what does that make you think about when you hear that?

Well, I think it's one of those, like, there are things that are going to be, like we talked about earlier, that are going to be innate within us, and we're going to have to work to overcome them. It can be really easy to blame a lot of things either direction, right? Like, well, that's just, um, that's just who I am, or that's just the way I was raised, or whatever. Or on the flip side of, um, you know, maybe it's you, you blame everything on your circumstances, right? Or Whatever that looks like. And so you have to work both ways to overcome those things. It is interesting, the older that I get, that I'm like, now I understand why I do that the way that I do, or why I see the world through this particular lens about this topic or this subject. And so I think you just really have to be very self-aware and be able to stop and pause for a second and evaluate.

Mm-hmm.

Which, which wolf am I going to feed in this circumstance and in this situation?

Right.

And then again, back to that root cause of those things and figuring that out. And that's some ways that we rewire and, and change those neurons, is it has to be that acknowledgement and that stopping. It also happens in reps, right? Like you talked about earlier, like it's not gonna just be this quick, super easy kind of a thing, right? Jelly Roll actually talks about, he's like, man, I wish that people losing weight wouldn't give themselves just like 60 or 90 days, right? Everybody wants this exact thing right now. And he actually talked about a Tony, I think it's a Tony Robbins quote that talks about that people grossly overestimate what they can accomplish in 24 hours or even in a month and severely underestimate what they can accomplish in a year.

Hmm.

Right? And so we want that new habit now and to take effect now, and we want to see results from it now. We are instant gratification people. But just like it took all of this time to rewire and to grow this tree branch, it's gonna take lots of time to build this new one and to have the neurons go and fire to this smaller branch, which then over time is going to grow while the other one shrinks.

Yeah.

And so, um, I think there you have to— you have to be very self-aware, and you have to do a lot of like pausing and evaluating and be willing to genuinely be honest with yourself with yourself. Because until you can do that, it's so much harder to feed that good wolf.

Yeah, absolutely. Now, you had a very specific instance where the rubber met the road, if you will.

Yeah.

Share that with us. How was that for you? Yeah.

So this is kind of one of those, I laugh and say it's pre and post. There's one of those kind of defining moments In your life. So in September of '20, um, you and I were on a trip with some friends out in Little Sahara, in, in the desert out there, playing on ATVs and UTVs. And in, in the course of everything, ended up rolling our ATV, and it rolled the direction of the seat that I was sitting in. And I don't know if I reached out, if I grabbed the door handle, you know, everything's a bit of a blur at this point. But ended up dislocating my elbow, which by the way, is one of the most painful things that you can do. And so as a byproduct of that, fortunately didn't break any bones. I did have a small tear in one of my ligaments and had to, you know, work through that. But in that moment, like there was so many things that I could have spiraled, so many ways in which that I could have just decided to feed the negative wolf, like living in a pity party of why me? I was the fittest I had ever been. Obviously, like, that was towards the very end of COVID And so we had spent basically from March until that September working out every day with friends, sometimes, you know, 6 days a week. You couldn't go out to eat. We were cooking at home. Like, I was fit, right? And so, um, you know, that, that pity party of why me? I'm never gonna get this back. What is, what is this gonna look like? How am I gonna do everything? Fortunately, it was my non-dominant And so that was, that was helpful, but like, how am I going to work? And so I had to make a conscious decision. Never mind the fact that you were driving. So am I going to blame you, be mad at you, stonewall you, hold a grudge against you? Like, there's so many ways that that situation could have gone and could have headed, and the mental spiral that could have happened. post-accident, right? 'Cause yeah, well, I went to the hospital and got my arm reset. Then we're talking about months of PT and having to do that every day and the pain and the hurt, and then rebuilding that arm to be back in the gym, to pick up a barbell, to be able to even like be active in any form again, right?

Mm-hmm.

And so I had to every single day make the conscious decision To feed the good wolf, to go, okay, well, what can I learn today? What did I accomplish today? What new little skill did I get back today? And you know what? It presented an opportunity for me to allow people to love on us, to take care of us, to humble myself and say, I need help. I, I can't do everything anymore. Right?

Mm-hmm.

And we developed this routine in the kitchen cuz I had done all of the cooking and And so we had to just develop this new routine. And I look back now and go, man, like our marriage is different for the better because of that season post-accident, right? And my reliance on other people and being willing to accept help and to go through that situation with a smile on my face, to not grumble and complain and to be angry. Right? Like, old me— bitter. Yeah. Old me would have just leaned into that, into the bad, and would have been, you know, emotionally destructive. I would have been— I would have been unkind to you, unkind to people around me, because I was in a lot of pain and I hurt, and I would have let that affect everything around me.

Mm-hmm.

But because—

Like a Dr. House situation.

Yes, like a Dr. House situation. Exactly. But because of all of the work that we had been doing mentally, you know, and this was Honestly, like, before I knew this concept of the Two Wolves really existed, right?

Mm-hmm.

The thing that we had been doing was working on gratitude. I, up until that point, that was the really the only major habit shift that I had made in my life was starting the habit of gratitude. That's it.

Mm-hmm.

That's really the only one. And so it's amazing what even one little habit and one little step will do and how it can change your outlook on, on hard situations. Because the reality is, is that life is going to be hard. But it's going to be what you do with those circumstances and how you handle them and how you respond to them that define so much of who we are and the way that we view ourselves and the way that people around us view them. I mean, we can all think of people who have had some of the most difficult things happen to them. I mean, I think about, you know, our friends that lost their, their adult daughter in a car accident, right?

Mm-hmm.

Like, but you see them and even through it all, like the joy And, and the choosing to focus on the light that their daughter had brought to those around them, and to honor her in a beautiful way, and to, you know, support other people who were going into the same profession that she was going into, right? And to, to look for the good that could possibly come out of this deepest hurt of their entire lives, right?

Mm-hmm.

But again, it's that conscious choice, and it's that choice to feed the good and turn the hard Hmm.

Yeah, so true. And as you were talking about the accident, I was thinking about the, the self-destructive mental patterns that I had to fight against too. The feelings of, you know, I was driving, so the feelings of guilt that I had hurt the, the person most important to me. And I remember, you know, my best friend, you know, just as I was packing up, and really, you were being consoled by other people, and I was packing up so we could go to the hospital. And he came in and just stopped me for a minute and just hugged me for a minute. For, for quite a while, 'cause he knew, he knew the self-blame that I was, that I was wrestling through. And, uh, I was glad that I didn't let it consume me, right? 'Cause then it would've been similar, like, woe is me, like, I'm the worst, I hurt her. And, and it would've been very, very self-destructive. I had already worked on, uh, fighting negative self-talk and, and starving that wolf for, for a long time. So I had some habits already built up, uh, where I could fight the words in my head, uh, that were trying, uh, to come out. In, in, And when, you know, like we said, when rubber met the road, you know, when something mild happens at work, that's annoying. You know, it's one thing to choose to feed the good wolf, you know, uh, but when something tragic happens, that's, that's when you're tested more. And, uh, you have some, some tough choices to make. And I, I just remember that as you were talking, where key people that even that day were like, hey, it's not your fault. You know, you didn't do it on purpose. Obviously, you know, stop. Don't, don't even go there.

Yeah.

Nothing good goes down that path.

Right.

And so I was just so thankful for those words of wisdom. And, and like you said, I chose, I chose what path to go. And it was, it was the good wolf. And I fed that one intentionally. And, and it's still something we talk about today. Like you said, it was pre-post.

It— Right.

Changed how you work out even now.

Right.

And so that's something that you and I both have to live with and, but not have to have resentment and bitterness attached to it. And that is, that is super key. And I feel like that event was responsible for bringing us closer together when it could have definitely done, done the opposite, more than likely done the opposite, to be honest.

Right. Correct. And I think if we both hadn't individually been working on those things, there is a high likelihood that it, that it would have driven a wedge in our relationship. And so there's those key defining moments that you look back and you go, I am so glad that I made this other decision and started working on this other thing ahead of time so that, like you said, when the rubber met the road, we were, we were to fight.

Absolutely. Absolutely. So guys, we hope this, this concept can really speak to you in the choices that you have before you. You know, what, what wolf choose today? What wolf are you going to choose to feed? Think, think about your thought patterns and the things that you consume that they, they do have the ability to stack and grow upon each other. And so if you're constantly reading, ingesting things that are toxic, negative, hateful, those kinds of things will build over time. And, and what, what goes in will also then come out. That will just be a product of the seeds that you're planting in this little guy right there. Uh, so it's such a, such a powerful thing. And then, and then something you can even pass on to, to your kids, which is which is just crazy. And I mean, even out of the epigenetics, they also see what you do and monkey see, monkey do.

Right.

And they're gonna, you know, if you're highly anxious 'cause of the things you read on social media, they're probably gonna be highly anxious too, you know? It's the most anxious time in history these days. So I don't think that's by accident. So hope you found something useful here, guys, in this conversation and a powerful illustration In the 2 wolves scenario and helping you keep that top of mind so that you can try to take hold of even if it's just one, one meal that you're feeding in a different direction. That's what I want. That's what I want for you. Just that extra meal, shifting it from one wolf to the other. That's gonna, like we say, compound over time and gonna make a big effect in your life overall. Like we talked about 5 years ago accident, and now it's like, man, this is crazy. Right? So thanks for listening to the Optimizing Beyond podcast. Remember, growth happens when you take action. So subscribe, share this with a friend, and most importantly, put what you learned into practice. And until next time, keep moving forward because as we know, daily anything changes everything.