8 Wildest Daddy-Daughter Beefs EVER on KARAMO

I cheated, you cheated, so what? The relationship now is about them. And they shouldn't be allowed to be a part of this.

But you wanted to be a parent, right?

I moved on with a wife. My wife is a part of my life. So being a part of me is being a part of my life.

That's not what it's about. The whole point is you could be there for them.

I took this DNA test because it was what Lavon wanted. Here's the backstory. I only had a 1 or 2 night stand with Lavon's mother, and we dated maybe twice. And 2 years later, she introduced me to my child. I was furious. So I was very angry for a while. She originally told another man that Lavon was his child. She was in a relationship with this man, but then 2 years later, she comes to me and tells me that Lavon is my child. For the record, I never denied Lavonne. She'd always had full access to me— email, phone, social media as well. I was not allowed access to Lavonne, even though the doors were always open for her, and did not get the reciprocation of what I gave. It's been about 15 or so years since the last time I spoke with her. She raised her two middle fingers to me. It was disturbing for me. It still hurts me now because that picture is in my mind as if it happened 2 minutes ago. It really bothered me. It's getting to me right now. After that, I released everything but my heart to her. I would accept her effort, but for me to reach out to her, that to me was the end. Why do you have doubts that Ryan is your father?

When I was younger, my grandmother raised me. She showed me this picture of this man and You know, I kind of see myself more in that man than I see in, you know, Ryan. I don't look like him. I was, my mom, she would tell me that he gave her a hard time because of, you know, how I look. I don't look like his other kids. I don't have any of their physical features or anything. So, you know, I feel like I've been on this healing journey for maybe internally for like the last year or two. And I feel like this is me getting over like the last step in my journey. Good job. Thank you.

Yeah, I'm glad you're taking this step. So did you and Ryan have a relationship at all when you were kids?

—your child? No, he, not that I can remember. He just wasn't there. He wasn't there physically very much. He wasn't there emotionally. He just was not present at all. And not enough for me, 'cause I'm a mom and just being a parent, sometimes it's just not enough. And I don't feel like it was enough as a child, as an adult, like ever. So when did you fall out of touch with him? Maybe when I graduated high school, I went through this, I did it without 2 Face or whatever. And then I think that was the last I actually like really spoke to him. And then shortly after I joined the military. And then after about 2 years I had spoke to him again. And then he's like, you know, what are you doing with your life? And I was like, well, I'm in the military. He just was kind of like, why couldn't you pick something else? And I'm just like, you know, it was kind of like, you know, an ill type thing. And I just thought it was, thank you.

We're proud of you for what you do. We appreciate you. You keep yourself from what you're doing.

Thank you. And I just was like, just because it wasn't what you, I don't even know what you wanted me to do, but just because it wasn't something that's ideal to you, you're just like, you just shunned it.

Yeah, you disregarded what you do. Will you try to work things out with him if he is your father? Probably not. Probably not? Probably not.

Why do you say that? Just because I know what kind of person he is. I don't feel like it's genuine.

Listen everyone, I wanna hear from your potential father, so let's welcome Ryan to the show. I don't talk over people and I don't allow people to talk over me.

Good for you. Okay. I'm not talking over you. I'm very calm, collected. Okay. You don't even deserve that, but I'll give it to you.

Then why am I here?

I don't know. 'Cause I don't know. I don't know if you're my dad or not, but we gonna find out today.

Okay, so the email specifically stated, "I don't want you in my life. I don't want you in my daughter's life." And what she doesn't know is that I didn't know she was my child until she was 2 years old. First, that's first. Okay. So every time I traveled for my job, every time I touched down in New Orleans, her house was the first house that I went to to pick her up. Whatever time I had, it was going to be with her. 3 years down the line, I'm in her grandfather's house going to pick her up. Yeah, 3 years down the line, this man tells me Stay away from my daughter. 3 weeks later, I'm traveling back to New Orleans for more business, go to her mom's house, and her grandmother's in the house upstairs, and I hear, "What is he doing here? Why is he here?" Okay? So whatever they've told you— I was a child, I don't know what you're talking about. Exactly. You were a child. So from your point of view, it sounds as if you're saying that her mother's side of the family— Mother. Granddaughter, mother, grandmother, and grandfather made you feel as if that this wasn't your child? Yeah. None of my other daughters disrespect me like this. Were you in your other children's lives? Yeah. Okay. And any one of them can tell you that she got no different when we were connecting.

Okay. I still needed you. I still needed you.

Did you express that you needed me or did you express that you felt—

I shouldn't have to tell you that I need you.

You're my dad. I can't read your mind.

You're my dad. What do you think? I know that my daughter needs me just as much as she needs me now. And then when she's He's 26. The fact that you're blaming this on me, you're blaming this on my mom, like, how is it our fault? Take some damn accountability, go to therapy, go do whatever you need to do. But to keep saying, "I tried," when are you gonna realize you trying is not good enough? I don't know where you live, you don't know where I live. Like, how am I supposed to reach out to you if I don't know where you are?

Do you have access to your sisters?

No, I should be asking you, have access to my sisters? See, here's the problem. You have access to my sisters. Here's the problem. You know You know that I talk to Brianne almost every, if not every week. You could get my number from her, but you did not. When did it cross your mind to say, you know what, I'm gonna get this number from Brianne so I can contact my daughter? Are you done? Go ahead, tell me when you did it.

Here's the problem. My God. So if we're talking about accountability, I am your father. You are my daughter.

Okay, and I don't owe you shit. There you go. I don't owe you nothing. There you go. You should be there for me. Like, what part are you missing? Are you missing it? Is it going over your head? I don't have to do shit. I don't owe you shit. You brought me into this world. You take care of me. I brought my child into this world. I take care of her. Like, what are you missing?

You have another daughter that you brought here today. What's her name? Her name's Brianne. Brianne. Okay then. Listen everyone, Brianne is here today. This is your oldest daughter and I wanna meet her and get her side of this story. So everyone please bring up Brianne. Move over, Daddy. Hi, Brianne. Hi. I can see that you're emotional. Yes. What's making you emotional? This is just really sad to watch, I guess, because I can hear equal pain, honestly. Like, I hear my sister say, "I just wish you would've been there," and I hear my dad say, I would say that he tried, but I guess like he's hurt by whatever could be or shouldn't be or would be if she is his, it's not.

And although he's never denied her, I do think that, you know, the onus is never on the kid.

You know, I've told my dad this, I've told him over and over again, you don't get to stop trying.

And did you ever decide to take a DNA test? Test yourself? Did you?

Did you take a DNA test before or ever think about doing it?

Yes or no?

We did, 99.999%. From what you're saying, you didn't know about this, that you've confirmed that this is your daughter?

Yeah. And that makes you even more wrong.

And you didn't— So wait, I mean, at the end of the day, you asked me a question, I'm gonna go back to your question. I'm gonna answer your question. You asked me when she, before you came out here and I asked her if she wanted a relationship and she said probably not.

And then knowing that you've known since I was 2 and if the results are the same, why would I want a relationship with you?

Because you've known. So when she says that to me, the thing that I hear is someone who's been rejected their entire life doesn't wanna get rejected again on this stage. So before she gets rejected, she's gonna make sure that she's gonna like protect herself from you. I'm good with that if that's where she is. I know. I am not going to make her, I'm not going to—

Just apologize. Like that's literally it.

But that's all you have to do. When children are trying to protect themselves from them, all you have to do is ensure them that you can trust me, that I will be there, that I will love you. That's what she's screaming out for. That's hitting me. I have to go over the images, the hurt, the words. As much as I want, I gotta tell you this before we can go any further. I think it's time that we saw this 30-year DNA outcome. This is what's most important right now before we can get to anything else. You said you had facts. You need the clear answers now because you are a child if this is or not your father. So I think this is your moment for you to open this to find out if Ryan is your father or not.

Before I open this, I'm just gonna let you know that this is not gonna change how I feel about it. But I need this for myself. No, I know. I'm okay with that. And for you to know all these years and then for you to just not try, that makes you a terrible person. Like, you're a terrible person. You're not a good dad because how are you gonna know this all your life and then just not acknowledge me or my existence? It's like I owe you something and I don't owe you anything. That's fair. So I'm gonna open this. You should. Bryan is Lavon's biological father. You know my sister.

I mean, I knew you were my sister. You're a very supportive sister. Thank you. I think all of us here can see that Yes, you probably had some pain that you experienced having older adults tell you like, you're not wanted, you're not around, this is not your child. But for you to confirm that this is your child and for you to still not fight for her or to be there for her and to treat her differently makes you 100% wrong. It does, it does. She brought you here because because somewhere in her heart she does want a relationship. Somewhere in her heart she does want that. And because of the fact that you have not been able to acknowledge your actions and just give her, she said on this stage, can you just apologize? And you haven't been able to give her that. Why? Well, as I mentioned.

You can literally just say you're sorry. Like you can just say you're sorry.

Okay. As I mentioned, there is a lot of demonstration of pain for me. Oh my God. I can't not acknowledge what this situation has done to me as well. Okay. There's a stubbornness in you right now and a pride that you gotta let go. I'm gonna let you know right now because if you don't let go of it, it's going to, the relationship is already ruined. But what's happening is with time, this could be mended. But right now you dying on this hill is not helping you.

Do you believe that it could be mended?

The first thing that I said when this producer asked me what was the first thing I would do when I see him, I said I wanted to hug my daughter. I know, but that won't be received well.

Right.

But can you see why it won't be received well? Clearly. Yeah. So Lavon. Okay. Let me apologize to you for these pains that I have caused you. And for me, I would love for us to have a dialogue. So I'm apologizing now. I know, and before you finish that sentence, I'm apologizing now.

Okay.

Let me tell you something. You're a great— Let me tell you something. You are a great mediator. Everything you have said and done is exactly how I'd handle it. You are exceptional, and I'm sorry that you have to be in between this, but I'm also happy that you have a sister that is hearing you and acknowledging this. You have your answers and you know, but what is sad for me is that he's always known. And I think that's the problem for you. You've done an exceptional job through that pain, still finding a life and a family of your own. So I wanna applaud that because that is a strength in you that you have and I think it needs needs to just be acknowledged that, wow, you did it and you did it very well and I'm proud of you. But I also know that there is a little girl in there that needs you. She needs her dad and she wants her dad. I'm here for her. I would change that statement to an action statement and say, I will be there for you on Tuesday by calling you and I will make sure every Tuesday I call you. I will make sure that I am there on your birthday and I will be there on every birthday. Because blanket statements about, "I'll be there for you," are not going to do anything for her. But action steps will help to build this relationship. Number 2, if he's able to show you action steps, would you be open to having a relationship with him?

Yes, yes, I would. Are you sure? I said it. I don't want to hug you, please. I don't want to hug you.

It's her boundary. She gets it. The thing that I think is great for you to take away from here is that the fact that she just said that she is willing, that is the biggest thing. She said she's willing. Big thing. Now if you're willing too to do those action steps, you know you have a willing daughter. But her rejection and her pain is deep, so it's gonna take time. So I wish you the best of luck and I wish you the best of luck and I'm glad you got answers, okay? Thank you so much. I'm really happy for you. I'm really happy. I knew you were messing with me. And I wish you the best of luck. I really do. I really do wish you the best of luck. Thank you.

So basically, Karamo, I didn't even find out that my dad was with her until I was on social media one day. And mind you, me and my dad follow each other on TikTok. Okay. So boom, I'm looking on TikTok and then I see this video and excuse my French, but they had made a song talking about they fucking each other. So in my head I'm like, this ain't real.

Like that's not how my dad is.

Yeah, this not real, yeah. So I started getting heated. I'm like, what the fuck? And then boom, My dad, he lives in Georgia, I live in Florida. Okay. So he had told me to pull up on him. So I pull up and I get in the car and the bitch didn't even say hi to me, first of all. So my dad had to speak for her and I was like, okay, first, that was the first red flag. So I'm like, all right, I already don't fuck with her. After that, she gonna send me a paragraph basically saying, oh, Like, I know how you feel, whoop-de-whoop. Basically talking about how she's in love with my dad, like, and not to feel any type of way about it. At the end of the day, we in the same generation, you feel me? I already know what type of game.

You're a year apart.

Right. I already know what type of game she trying to play, but she not about to play with my daddy, you feel me?

Okay, got it. So you believe she is using your dad? Yes, exactly. What has she done so far to make you feel that way?

Because my dad told me that she was homeless or whatever, And my dad always taking in the homeless, so I wouldn't be surprised if he picked up another one.

Okay, and Lee sent you a text message. Hey, I just wanted to let you know I definitely think about how you feel and I'm not asking you to like me. I just want you to know it was never about age between me and your dad. Actually, before I even knew his age, I knew I was in love with him. I knew he had kids when I met him. He just didn't tell me the ages yet. When I found out he had a 20-year-old daughter, I definitely didn't want to go to go through with the relationship because I knew it was going to be like this. He insisted on continuing it. So I apologize if I don't seem like I care. I respect how you feel. That's a very nice message.

I guess. Why you guess? Because at the end of the day, Karamo, it's like, that's my dad. You feel me? Like regardless of this paragraph or whatever she's telling me, at the end of the day, I already know what's up. Okay. And she stay in Atlanta. Plenty of white men to throw some money and help her out, you feel me? So it's just like, bitch, that's my dad. Like, why do you want him?

Why white men get a bullet? Y'all saw that? They got a bullet, but no, bullet, done. All right, well, this relationship between Robert and Lee upsets you. Yes, it does. And when you tell him it upsets you, what does he say?

He just be like, oh, Kalisto, I'm in love with her. Like, I can't control who I love. To me, that sounds like.

Well, Calista's dad Robert is here and we're going to bring him out in one moment. But first, let's hear what his girlfriend Lee had to say. Everyone, please welcome Lee to the show.

Just to clear the air, I wasn't homeless when I met your dad. That's completely wrong. Okay, so why do you live with him? After the club, we hung out, chilled. He told me to come back to his place, so We just, we never separated. We just been together since the beginning. And even when we started, he was actually in another relationship before we even did anything. When everything was going on, I really didn't wanna be with your dad in the beginning because of how he did me in the beginning of the relationship. Yeah, I knew. Yeah, I knew he had a girlfriend or whatever the case may be, but it's like he was telling me different things and then he, it was, it's just crazy. Got it.

How does it feel when Calista says that you're using her dad though?

She, you don't know me. You haven't been around me. We haven't had notes like this. We haven't done this before. So, you don't even know what to say 'cause you know you using him. I'm not using him though. You can't, you don't know me, you've never been around me. And it came to a point where I had to drop everything because he got evicted from his spot when I moved in. It was like, that was my birthday in August. That was my birthday. I was out in his lawn helping pick up my shit from his lawn when it was raining and all types of shit. My shit all in bags and I had to, at a point, I didn't wanna say this, but I had to go strip to keep us in a roof. 'Cause he wasn't comfortable with getting a regular job 'cause it's been so long for him. Got it.

How long have you two been together?

Almost a year now. At one year, okay. So this is the long term. At the end of the day, nobody asked you to do that though. You didn't have to ask. That's just the type of person I am though.

But hearing her say that, like, they were evicted and that she actually had to find a job where she could support them, does that make you still feel like she's using him?

Yeah, because, so what does that mean? What does that have to do with anything?

And did he propose to you?

He has asked me to marry him, yes. Okay. Did you know that? That's the first time I'm gonna even find this out, Karamo. Yeah. Like, I didn't even know they was about to get married. At first you already a little girl. Now you telling me y'all about to get married, but you can't even take care of your own daughter? Like, I don't get that. Okay. From my understanding, I can't really speak too much on it, but when he was trying to be in your life, it's like you didn't even want him to be in your life. And you can't use the, but that's what I'm just saying. That's why I just said I can't really say too much on it, but from what I'm getting brought into, that's what I'm saying. That's how I feel about it.

Leah, are you concerned about the 20-year age difference?

Somewhat, but not really. Not really? No. Why not really though? Like why does that concern you? It's just something I've always been, I've always done. I've always been with somebody older than me.

Do you call your father dad or Robert?

I call him Robert because after I found out about them two, it's like you not, until you act like a father, I'm not gonna call you dad. You feel me? Like, that's just how I feel, honestly.

Do you call him as a pet name Daddy?

Yeah, 'cause what do you call him? 'Cause I know I don't even call him Dad. So what do you call him? Daddy. Okay. Babe, baby. Okay.

Well, I think it's time to bring out Robert, or Daddy, and hear what he has to say about all this. So Robert, come on out. Why does she have to find out about the relationship I'm in a relationship on TikTok. Why didn't you just communicate with her like I'm in a relationship and I'm happy?

Right, like why am I the first daughter at that, your first child, and you can't even have the common decency to let me know regardless if we talk or not?

Because Calista's mad disrespectful. So I gotta say one thing. Lee, I actually do respect the fact that you sent that message. Exactly. It was just a respect thing.

Like it was nothing more than that.

I understand her point of view and I understand your mother's frustration the anger and where that's coming from and how that's causing more tension in this. But what she was trying to do, what she didn't have to do, was trying to at least acknowledge like, I understand this is awkward for you, I understand our same age. And I think it was actually a very mature thing for her to do to show respect that she didn't have to do. And I appreciate you doing that because it shows your character. So thank you for being here. Of course. I wanna talk to them. Yeah.

Yeah, get out, get out. And I don't know why you gonna kick him away. Get the fuck out. I don't wanna see her again.

Like real shit, Karamo. Well, the thing is, unfortunately, that's not a decision you can make or I can make. Your father's the only person who can make that decision if he's in a relationship with her. But at the end of the day, the reason I asked her to leave is because I didn't need her out here in the first place. Because this is about you two. This is about a daughter who you, out of your own mouth, felt abandoned, felt disrespected by her father leaving, was in a hard situation with her mother. The mother has feelings of anger. And unfortunately, when we're in relationships, those, especially our oldest, they pick up on like what it is because you in the house being the oldest, I'm almost sure, had to then become the protector of your mom. But that's not your fault. What is the fault is from you because once you started picking up those feelings, Dad should've been right there to say, "No, I'm sorry for what I did. I'm sorry that I wasn't there to tell you that I still love you, to tell you that I am there to support you." I'm gonna ask you right now, what do you need from your dad?

I need you to be there for me. You already missed hella years. You can't take them back. Nobody can go back in the past. But if you gonna be here now in my life, I'm gonna give you an ultimatum. It's either you with me and you leave her or you go with her and you never speak to me again.

[Speaker:KARAMO] So hold on, let me tell you this really quickly 'cause I'm gonna respond for you for this. I'm gonna respond for you in this moment because if you respond, it's gonna seem more like rejection. It is not fair for you to make an ultimatum to your father in that way. And the reason being is because what you just said are not your own feelings. Those are your mother's feelings. But what she can, and she's right for, is that I can understand completely how it would feel. And I want you to put her in your shoes and yourself in her shoes. My father was not there for me between the ages of 3 13 and 19, critical ages for a young woman. Critical. And even outta your mouth, you flippantly made a joke that like, well, you know, she over here mad 'cause I'm teaching this young girl how to drive. Like those jokes, like in your mind might be fun, but for her, she did miss out on dad teaching her how to drive. Yeah. And she did miss out on everything else. And so she has the right to be fully pissed about the fact that like, you got somebody who's almost my age It's not about Lee. It's about the fact that she's saying, Dad, you didn't give me what I deserved. Can you talk to your daughter about that? I'm not going to take your ultimatum. Obviously, you know that I'm a very stubborn, selfish person. You know me. Trust me. Okay, so I'm definitely gonna stay with Lee, okay? Because she makes me happy. I'm sorry. Yeah. I can't do this. Yeah. I gotta tell you this. I was trying to help you to understand that bringing up Leah or any of these things, I was trying to model and give you the tools. See, what you need to understand is that your daughter sees that you're capable of giving love because you're giving it to love to a girl that's over the same age. Correct. She needs her father to say, no matter who else I'm loving, I'm always going to love you. No matter if I'm with her, I'm gonna make sure you're a priority. I'm gonna make sure that you see that you're a priority from here on out. Out. I wish I knew all this before she walked off, Karamo. I know. This is a learning process. It's a learning process. It's a learning process. It's a learning process. I blew it. You didn't blow it. You didn't blow it. Okay, I'll get her back out here. I'm not gonna get her back out here 'cause what I want you to do, what you should have done when she was 13, is you go after her. Go for it. Mentioning her name, period, when this is your chance to heal. But what I will tell you, just like Karamo just told me to tell you, no matter who I'm with or what I'm doing, I'mma love you more than I love the check, okay? I'm sorry that I haven't been there, but I'm here now and I'mma work every day, every second, every hour. Don't close your heart out to me, open it up. I'm here, I'm your father. I love you, Calista. Okay. I'm sorry. Okay. Thank you. I'm sorry. Can we go back out here? Okay. 'Cause I mean, obviously Karamo's the best of the best and— I love you, girl. How you feeling right now?

I just feel overwhelmed with emotions right now. Yeah. I'm just still, it's still gonna take me time to get used to the fact that I'm sorry, but your bitch is the same age as me. Yeah, yeah.

So can I encourage you to do this? If you really want a relationship with your father, you can't worry about anybody else. So I get it. But if you really want to see this relationship be built, y'all both have to, this is where you have to meet him. I made sure he can't win and got you because no longer you chasing after him. But this is where you, this is where you as a young woman get to show your maturity. You deserve love that you did not receive. And yes, your mother gave it to you and you had all the support, but you deserved him to be there. To be there. My baby girl. And he's, what I've noticed about you, and I'm gonna give you your flowers, is that I know you came here to learn. You came here to grow and I see it. You're like everything I'm saying, you're processing it, receiving it, and putting it into clear action. And I can tell you, I can tell you something as a young woman, I've been doing this many years with many men And men are normally the hardest to learn, to adapt something you teach them, and to grow quickly. It's just the truth. The fact that I saw him do it in real time shows me that he does love you and he wants to be there. Do you wanna say, "Dad, I'll let you in"?

Robert, I will let you in. And hopefully one day I'll stop calling you by your government And I will accept this relationship, but right now I just need time, but I will let you in. Good.

And will you commit to say, "I will show up for you"? Daughter, I will show up for you day in, day out. Stick with that and it will help y'all to have a good relationship, okay? All right, I really do wish y'all the best of luck. Let me give you a hug. Ariel, tell me, so Kaylee has recently been suspended from school. What happened? She got into a fight.

Okay. She's been bullied. She has osteochondromas along with epilepsy. She's been bullied pretty much her whole life. Been talked about how she walks, talks. She just got sick of it and she swung and beat up a girl at school.

Got it. So these, 'cause I'm not familiar with those conditions. Are those familiar conditions that are physical conditions? Yes. Okay, so kids are making fun of her physical conditions. Yes. Okay. When did this outta control behavior start in your opinion? About 6, 7 years ago.

Okay. She reached out to her biological father to come down for Christmas. I wanna say it was either Christmas or a birthday. He said he would come. He never showed, didn't call. She just got to this point where she just doesn't care anymore.

So it started at that point? Yeah. Do you have any other kids?

Yes, I have two other. How old are they?

3 and 1. 3 and 1. Yes. Okay. And she's the oldest, obviously. Yes. And you've been married to Isaiah for 2 years, correct?

Yes.

What's Kaylee's relationship with her stepdad?

She's asked him to adopt her. Okay. We've brought that up with Kaylee's biological father, Desmond. Said that's not gonna happen. She's, their relationship is like oil and water sometimes. Sometimes they get along and sometimes she has that mentality of love is just meant to hurt. She's told him, you ain't my daddy, I hate you, hope you die. It's been a lot of different things, but it all still stems from her actual father not physically being there as long as it's been.

And so Kaylee's biological father, his name is Desmond. Yes. Desmond's missed out on a lot in your daughter's life. A whole lot. Like what? Everything.

First steps, first words, first day of school, first surgery, hospital stay, dental, father-daughter dance. Everything.

It's tough on you.

He's been to one birthday in 11 years and she was, 8, and he was only there because I drove to Michigan and picked him up and took him.

What does Kaylee say about her dad not being around?

She actually got submitted a picture, a drawing she did. Me, her, and Isaiah, we sat and we did some artwork. Yeah. And she wrote how her dad makes her feel.

I feel unwanted by him. I feel upset when he lies. I dislike how he disrespects Woman, did you help her with this list?

No. Really?

'Cause some of this language sounds a little bit more adult. Mm-mm.

Wow.

Well listen, Ariel says that her daughter Kaylee's out of control behavior is just a cry for attention from her absent father Desmond. Desmond is joining us now from Michigan. Everyone help me welcome Desmond to the show. How y'all doing? Desmond, welcome to the show. Is there anything Ariel has said that you feel isn't true? Fair or true? Uh, to be 100% honest, no. Um, when she's speaking, uh, when it comes down to the behavior of my daughter, the relationship with daughter as far as not being around and things like that, that's 100% facts. That lines right up with, you know, what she's speaking about. Um, it's just the back end of why is totally different than what it is that's be spoke. So you're admitting that you're not involved, that you haven't been there for your child? No, not in the context of how you're speaking. And what I mean by is when a man calls, you have to pick up the phone. And then when the man, you know, sits at the bus station and he's being denied, you know, there was the times where I will come up there and I would make those trips.

You came to my house and caught a bus. Once, and she was what, 3? 11 years, and I can count on one hand. You've seen her 5 times.

Okay, 5 times physically, I would say right around 5, 5 times, 6 times. And honestly speaking, maybe 4, to be, to be realistic. It may, maybe honestly being 4. And the reason why I'm saying that and not denying most of what she's saying is because those are facts and those are true. What the problem is, is what's missing with the story is, is when the man is sitting at the bus station and he's called and his phone calls is being denied and he's spending nights at the bus station. Well, that man is not going to spend too much of his money too many times to sleep at a bus station.

When your daughter laid up in the hospital from seizures for 5 days and her daddy doesn't answer the phone, then whose fault is that? When your child is having surgery for the bone disease, you never show. Whose fault is that? When she fell off that bike and I helped her get back up, where were you? Ariel, what you speaking from? No, 'cause if you're gonna talk, speak facts.

Desmond, what is the facts in your eyes then? Oh, the facts in the matter is poor communication. Well, why do you think that Kaylee is fighting, stealing, and acting out? Because she's dealing with the emotions from what we're seeing right now. That's not Kaylee's battle. That's the energy that was transferred from the mother down through the household.

So where were you? Where your energy?

Okay, Eric, where we speaking from right now is a point in emotion and that's the problem. But Desmond, regardless of what communication you and her mother have, your daughter has not seen you. And I'm asking you why? You said that— My daughter has not seen me because of the lack of communication and the constant fights and the battle, lack of addressing. When the man said that he spent time sitting on a, sleeping at the bus station. When a man is sleeping at the bus station, okay, we make this travel, we make this trip and he calls and he's like— Desmond, Desmond, I really appreciate you trying to tell—

Can I ask you something real quick?

No, one second. Desmond, I really appreciate you trying to tell this story, but I'm telling you right now, that is not a case to why you haven't seen your child. The two things that you're saying for me right now, of me and my daughter's child couldn't communicate. And then also I'm sleeping at a bus stop. I did try to show up once. That's not enough of a reason for me. And I'm trying to figure out what y'all do. The reason why, okay, and I also wanna, I wanna object what you're talking about. The reason why it's not enough for you, because you're not walking the path. It's hard to explain to those who don't walk it. I don't understand. Hold on, no, no, no. Before we go anywhere, I don't understand why I constantly have, particularly brother, why you come on this show and say I don't know because I haven't walked the shoes. Y'all need to go Google me real quick, okay? Professionally, this is what I do. And then secondly, I literally have a child. I have two sons that I have to communicate with their mother and their mother and I don't see eye to eye. Yet I am there for my children always. And I wanna put this out here. That's TV talk. In the reality of things of walking, that's not how it goes. If you're walking the path when y'all say that—

That has nothing to do with what he's talking about.

Desmond, I'm gonna ask you this. Do you think you're being the best father you can be to Kaylee? If we're speaking about Kaylee, no. That's what we've always been talking about is Kaylee. That's what we always been talking about is Kaylee. But so this is the thing because Kaylee is here today and she's younger. So I've decided that I'm not gonna be bringing her out on stage. I'm actually gonna go backstage and talk to her. How's you doing today? Good. It's a little nerve-wracking with all the cameras, right? I know even for me sometimes I get nervous with it. Have you ever done something like this before?

Yes, I did plays and my mom had told me I did pageants when I was little. Oh wow, you're exceptional then. Did you enjoy it? Yeah, I enjoyed the play. It's just I did one night. It was a one night only because I did not want to go again.

Yeah, okay. If I can be honest with you, your mom told me that you kind of got into some trouble at school. What's been going on?

This girl kept messing with me and bullying me. Yeah. To the point that I got ticked off. Yeah. And I just beat her up.

Yeah. You got really angry. I understand that. I get angry sometimes too, so I understand that. When you get mad, who can you talk to? Basically, I have this— Are you able to talk to your mom or your dad?

Yeah, but sometimes I'll just go home and scream. Scream in a pillow, and then walk downstairs and do whatever it is to be done. Yeah.

So when are you able to talk to your mom and your dad?

Like, I like talking to my dad in front of my mama, but most of the times I really— sometimes I really don't talk to my mama. But when I talk to my mama, I like being alone with her. Like, sometimes I ask if we could— me and her could go out sometime. Even though you probably would sometimes never do it.

Yeah, but you still ask. You want to know. That makes sense. So when you say you talk to your dad, is that your stepfather that you're talking to or— My stepfather. Your stepfather. You and your stepfather have a good relationship? Mm-hmm. Well, if your dad was here today, what would you want to say to him?

That you're deadbeat. Do you miss him? Nope.

Why don't you miss him?

Because he never been there, so I don't know you.

So you don't know him to miss him. Yeah. Would you like a hug from him? Why not?

I don't know him. I don't really trust a lot of people. And if I don't know you, I'm not gonna go. I'm gonna scream, yell, I'm not finna go.

That sounds just like some stuff that your mom said out there. Your mom told me that too.

It's, I don't, like, stuff really bad happened in my past to where it's kind of hard to tell which people to trust and which people not to. I get that.

I understand that. So you make sure that you have to be tough to protect yourself, right? I get that. Well, I have to tell you this. You are a very smart and fun young woman. I have had a lot of fun talking to you. Before I go, can I have a hug? Is that okay? Thank you so much for opening up. I appreciate it. Desmond, I wanna start with you. How did it feel hearing the things you heard Kaylee just say to me? To be honest with you, it does not surprise me at all in the least. Your daughter said that she feels like you give excuses. You're not there for her. You're a stranger. How does that make you feel? No different. I'm not moved by it. When you know yourself and you know what you're doing, you know who you are, you know who you are as a man. Desmond, can I ask you this? And this is sincere. 'Cause I see you got a defense up and I see that you— No, no, no. I wanna be honest with you. It's no defense. I'm unbothered. I'm not gonna sit up here and pretend like I'm moved. Desmond, you should be moved. Let me tell you something right now. When you have a father that's saying, I'm unmoved by the fact that my daughter could be developing these things. That's an issue and that's a you issue. That's a no one else issue.

When Kaylee was writing the letters and stuff and I told him, I said, I found a letter in Kaylee's room about how she feels you don't love her. And it broke me because—

Do you love your daughter? If I heard my daughter tell me— Oh, if that's the question, I'm 100% a dude, you know. I'm gotta be real with you. I've been trying to be very calm with you and really get to your thing. But it gets under my skin when I see a man sitting here talking about his daughter who is saying, "You're giving me excuses, who is not being there for me." And you are sitting here over nonchalant. Brother, do you think you look cool right now? Like, what do you think? No, no, no. You keep making the smug faces because you hearing cheers and stuff. Dude, at the end of the day, this is your little girl. That's your seed. All of us, this is none of our children. That's your child. Listen, I'm sitting here and you sitting over here relaxed, rolling your eyes and stuff. You think this is good? Come on now. I'm gonna be honest with you. That's why I'm unbothered because I'm the man that knows my daughter and knows my family. You don't know your daughter. Brother, wake up. You don't know your daughter and you're not doing enough for your daughter.

I don't know a thing about her.

And why are you sitting here so smug?

Do you wanna see your daughter in issues? He does.

To be honest with you, like I said, I'ma say this again. Y'all just cleared it up. He's unbothered, right?

Like I said, you wanted to come on here so people could stroke your ego. Forget your ego. My daughter back there hurt, bro, and it's on you.

No, it's not. But either way, like I was saying, when y'all asked the question about A-Dez, would you tell your side of the story?

I'm done. I'm not putting all the footwork in because I ain't make her by myself.

Ariel, Ariel, you have not for 11 years. And I'm gonna be honest with you about something. A lot of the problems that's going through is because you have not let go your internal pain. No, no, no. I can't. No, Desmond. Desmond. I gotta stop. Desmond. What you're gonna do is you're gonna start attacking her, and that's not gonna be healthy communication, either of you. I just heard it. I just heard it. No, no, no, no, no. So listen, Desmond. I'm telling you what I hear. Desmond, I Only repeat back what I hear. One of the things that I want you to leave with. You keep saying I am a good father. And I know I am. And let me tell you something. The only person who can make that decision if you're a good father or not is your daughter. And your daughter right now has clearly just told me that you are not her father. Well, honestly, and I wanna reject that, and I want the people to hear this. That's a bunch of BS.

Lemme tell you why. Because the moment that you don't buy something, this is something that a good man—

Y'all cut his feed. Which I had a father in my life. Cut his feed. Cut his feed. Seriously, cut his feed. Cut his feed.

Cut his feed.

Cut his feed. I'm sorry. No, give me your hand. I'm sorry. I am so sorry. If you've been dealing with that for 11 years, I was with that for about 45 minutes and I'm exhausted.

This is every conversation.

I can imagine. I know.

She's been begging and crying for it for years. I know. My daughter wants to block him. She don't know him.

I know. This is what I gotta tell you because it's the only advice I can give you at this point. You gotta stop trying to reach out to him. And so I'm telling you that so first of all, you can release some of that pressure, you can release some of that pain. You are doing everything you need to do. You are trying, you're stepping up. You gotta release him. You have to then now focus on helping Kaylee to grieve him. Oh, help me. No.

When I say helping, counseling sessions. It's a lot of anger in her.

Yes. That's why I asked her, when was the first time you felt anger? 4. And she said 4 years old. You have to start to help your daughter to start to grieve the relationship that she will never have with her father while also telling her not to compare herself and letting her know that vulnerability is actually gonna be her strength. Yeah. Because the thing is that she needs to learn to be vulnerable. If you can do those things, not only are you gonna start practicing that with yourself and start to heal in some ways, you're going to set your daughter up for the best life she can possibly have voided of this man who can't step up and be the man that she needs him to be. You're doing a good job. You're doing a good job. You're doing a good job.

I'm so sorry.

So why do you think your best friend is sleeping with your father?

Okay, so for one, it's they're too friendly and it's too much flirting. Always them two on the side, she'll be laughing in his ear, you know, kitschy-kitschy-cooing, like, "What's funny? 'Cause I wanna laugh too." Okay.

You know? What's the kitschy-kitschy-coo?

Right, exactly. I need to know. I caught her going to Columbus, is where my father stay at.

Oh.

We've been friends for a long time, so we have each other locations. We share locations, you know, for safety reasons.

Of course.

She turned it off. Why is you turning off your phone while you going to Columbus? If you ain't going to see my daddy.

So when did the suspicions begin?

I'd say about 4 years ago. And I'm like, what is going on? I know how my friend is, you know, when it come to, you know, her male friends. Like, girl, you not about to use my daddy as no sugar daddy. Oh sweet.

So from your experience, Janae takes advantage of men sometimes. Yes, very much so. So how did your friendship begin? How did you meet her?

10 years ago, we exotic dancers. Ever since then, we've been inseparable. Every day, we kicking it on the phone, talking. I'd have been there when her kids was born, all that. It's just like our relationship grew so crazy. You're like sisters. We like sisters, literally.

It makes sense, it makes sense. So have you ever just tried asking him the truth and say, just tell me, What do you mean?

Actually, I have. Yeah. I do all the time, even like, 'cause I know she plays like that a lot. So I had asked her a couple times, like, you know, what do you and my father got going on? Like, y'all playing too much. And then she'll be like, we ain't doing nothing. I feel like it's gonna affect us really bad because like, I share my hot chicken wings with you, but I'm not sharing my daddy.

Well, listen, we all know that there's two sides to every conflict, so I think it's time to meet Janaye. Janaye, come on out. How do you feel about Kiki's accusations? Fuck Kiki accusations.

'Cause first off, why do you think that I'm I'm messing around with your daddy. Because you mess with men that's the same age as my daddy, so of course. But Kiki, we're family, we're like sisters. Why would you ever think that I am messing with your dad out of all people? Why would you think that I would ever cross that line? Because why is he sending you money then? Why is he paying for you to get your car fixed? Maybe that's something you need to ask your dad.

Well, do you think you've ever acted inappropriate with Kiki's dad?

Yeah, I feel like I have. Okay. Just 'cause I be drunk and I just be having fun and we just play around like that. Do I do that to your daddy? You never been around my daddy. It don't matter, but I wouldn't do that.

Okay, so we heard that when y'all at the barbecue, y'all got the Kiki, the ha ha. How do you think that affected her? You said y'all sisters.

I don't think she care. Well, I didn't think she care. Why would I not care? I don't know. That's a bit much. I mean, you didn't say nothing until like later on. And to be quite honest, I'm dating somebody right now anyways. Because after I start seeing him Cash Apping you and stuff money, of course I'm about to start asking 'cause now I'm putting two and two together. Okay, well, he did Cash App me money, but he did it outta the kindness of his heart. But I never slept with— We're living in 2022. I never slept with Jodea. What makes you know that you about to sit up there and send money to anybody he ain't in no relationship with and he ain't messing around sleeping with.

Let's be real. So does Mark text and call you? He only did that one time looking for Keke 'cause she wasn't answering her phone. Got it. So he sent you money for car repairs. Tell me about that.

Well, Keke dad always been like a very generous guy. He a lookout. Like he does that for anybody, not just me.

Does it upset you that Keke is accusing you of this?

Yeah, it's upsetting the fuck outta me. Like I'm very upset. Like why do you think that I'm trying to use your daddy? Because that's what you do.

Okay, well, Kiki asked you to unlock your phone so that I could see if you have ever contacted her father or had anything, and you agreed, right? Yes. Okay, good. It is time to see what is in your phone. We checked your phone and we're looking to see if there's any interaction between you and Kiki's father, Mark. Are you ready, Janey? I'm ready. Are you ready? I'm ready. Okay, so when it came to text messages, we found zero suspicious texts between Kiki and your father. Okay, okay, okay. When it came to locations on apps, we found zero suspicious locations. I love you. And DMs, we found zero, and we found zero photos. Okay, okay, okay. Your father's contact information was not even in her phone.

Okay, okay, okay. I'm sorry. No, no, I'm mad. I'm mad. All right, I'm sorry. I'm mad. It's good to erase them, but okay. We ain't got trust no more.

Hold on, but we do have a bit of a ping that's come in. Kiki's dad is actually here with us today on video chat. Mark, I want you to come on out. Karamo, welcome to the show. So I understand that you, there's something you wanna say to your daughter. Yes, I do. Kiki, you need to stay in your own lane. What?

You need to stay, you and your sister always, you need a woman, you need this, you need that. We gonna find you a woman. Right, your age? Okay, well let me tell you, in 2017, me and Janay, we was going out.

We did a couple of walks on the beach and I took her out to dinner, seafood. Hold on, Mark, are you saying right now that you did have a relationship with Janay? A platonic one. So Mark, I know you're a player from the old school, but walks on the beach ain't platonic. When did this happen? In 2017. I wanted a relationship with her. But Kiki got in the way.

What?

Yeah, you got in the way. So there was a seafood restaurant. Tell me about that. Oh, we went out and had like a nice little dinner and talked. Did you kiss?

Yeah, we kissed a couple times.

And on Thanksgiving, when you seen her sitting on my lap, I was playing Santa Claus. And she was trying to tell me— Hold on. So when did you get your phone? When did you get that phone?

That's a, I got that phone in 2018.

2018. And so this happened in 2017? So that's why we couldn't find anything. Okay, so Mark, have you ever sent Janay money? Yeah. So how much money did you, how much money have you sent Janay? Like $500 or $600.

And that's a lot of money. Two times.

Two times. So almost $1,200 has been sent. This was your fears, Kiki, that she could be using your father just like she use other men because she's got $1,200.

Exactly, that's what I'm saying, exactly. And look, you falling for it.

So why didn't you tell your daughter, Mark, the truth? It's none of her business.

Okay, but that's still my best friend. She is not about to be my stepmother.

Well, I think the bigger question is here that Kiki, Janey said nothing happened. We thought nothing happened 'cause we found on the phone. But clearly you've kissed her father and received money from him. The fears that she had. Is there anything you wanna say to your friend?

No, 'cause I tried to put that behind me. We both tried to put it behind us.

Oh no. Come on, Janaye, you've now been caught. Is there nothing you wanna say to your friend? If you say she's like a sister, your twin, there's a moment here that you could salvage this relationship because what happened is that— Yeah, I already did. Her issue is that there was no honesty. Honesty. And if she's looking at you right now, Mark has already told us now, y'all have kissed, y'all went on dates, there's been money. Can you be honest with your friend now? I mean, all we did was kiss.

It wasn't like I slept with him. Don't be defensive.

Talk to your friend. Are you using my father?

No, I am not.

I'm trying to make sure you can salvage this friendship because I do believe that you feel like this was your friend, your sister. You don't want us to look at her and say, hey, I'm sorry?

I do wanna say I'm sorry. I'm sorry, Kiki. I'm sorry, Janaye. You probably ain't gonna trust me after this though. I'm not. That's why I didn't wanna tell you. Exactly. I can't, mm-mm. Y'all both, if this gonna continue or y'all wanna have something going on, y'all can leave me out.

I would've said it earlier if I could.

Leave me out of it. No, you could have not, Mark.

Mark, I appreciate you coming on the show. Giving us clarity. So thank you so much. I think you need to do some work with rebuilding your relationship with your daughter because at the end of the day, even though you are the father, this is your daughter's friend. And I think that transparency would've made this a lot easier. And so I think it's important that you model that behavior for your daughter. So thank you so much, Mark, for being here. But I need to talk to you two now alone. What is your reaction to hearing all this?

I'm shocked because I mean, I kind of figured something was going on, but it was like I didn't want to believe it. Because these are two of the most important people in my life. So it's like, you know, believing her and then he's telling me something else for the first time is like, it's shocking. 'Cause I really thought that she wouldn't. Are you mad? Yes, I'm mad as hell. I feel betrayed for sure. Like, especially 'cause we talk about everything. So even if it was to happen or something, I'm shocked that you didn't even come to me and talk to me about it. Yeah. I was afraid of this, your reaction. That's why I kept it to myself.

The trust has been broken now. And this is sad 'cause I heard how you were talking about her. I could see that you love her and I could see that's your sister. Key, it only happened one time.

Only one time. I never slept with him. But he said that he gave you money twice. Because he wanted to help me. I didn't ask him. He was asking about what was my financial problems. Well, you was telling him your problems. So if you telling him your problem, then that means that you needed some help. So that's basically asking. No, we was just having a mutual conversation and he offered to help. So I'm like, oh, okay. Okay.

Kiki, do you think you can rebuild this trust with Janey or is this friendship done?

I don't know if I can build this relationship again because once you'll lie to me one time, you'll do it again. I think I would lose my mind if I ever lost you.

Do you believe this?

So hearing her She seems like she's speaking from the heart.

I'm gonna tell you, for moving forward, it's gonna take her some time to rebuild the trust. If you really want this relationship, you don't need to be defensive. Don't make anything and say like, "Well, you know, like it was in the past." Just say, "I know I messed up," and be as vulnerable as possible. I do trust everyone admitted that you didn't sleep together, and I think that's a big thing. That's great. You know what I mean? Because I think that would've been maybe a breaking point for you. But the fact that you just got a little money, you was playing, yes. She already knew that you was a hustler. So I think she was already aware. It's just the point of you keeping a secret. You keeping a secret is the betrayal for her. And you already knew that. So do the work. Do you forgive me? Really, you do?

I mean, it's gonna give me a little, I might need a little time, but right now I just need to. You forgive her? I feel her though.

You feel it? Understandable. Look at that. Listen, that, that got mended up easy, that quick. Okay, that, that vulnerability wall. I need Karamo's help getting my family back together. I know I made mistakes in the past, but I love my kids. When they were young, we was happy, but when I got incarcerated, everything had changed. I blame myself because I should have been there, but I also blame Bri. My kids don't call me, check on me. I didn't even know Makayla was wasn't even pregnant. I just feel hurt and I just want everything to come back together, period. I'm 51 years old and I want my family back. Well, before I talk to Leighton, I'm going to talk to his daughter, Ariana. Please everyone, welcome Ariana to the show. Oh, stunning. Oh, she's stunning. How are you? Hi, Karamo. Nice to meet you. Hold on. I didn't know we had a supermodel coming out today. You look gorgeous. Thank you. You really do. Okay, so I just saw that video for the first time of your father. How do you feel about what you just saw?

If we gonna come on here, let's be like, let's come correct. We're all grown, so to blame other people for like stuff that you did as a man, as a father, is just like, So what did he do that's causing him to feel like he's lost his family?

Or in your opinion, what did he do to lose his family?

Well, for one, I mean, he's never really been in my life. The only memories that I have of my father is like traumatic experiences. Got it. And so I'm transgender and I don't really know how he feels about it, but it's like, it's wishy-washy. It's like, I want my family back, but at the same time, you need to acknowledge me as your daughter. "I'm not your son." Yes.

So does he still interact with you as if you were his son? He doesn't respect your transition?

Well, to my mom, he still refers to me as his son.

How does that make you feel knowing that your father is still not in a space to respect you?

It hurts my feelings because it's like I fought so hard to be here and I've been through a lot. I feel hurt that I can't have my mother and my father.

When was the last time you saw Layton?

I saw him at my sister's wedding. My sister's graduation. Okay. Not my graduation, my sister's graduation. Guess he want his son back, but he's dead and gone, so.

Yes, yes. So what was it like when you saw Leighton at your sister's graduation?

It was, I felt like he was just another person off the street. So why would I?

So did you ever have that bond like at all? No. So why do you think in his mind does it feel he thinks that you all had that relationship? Because I'm watching the video the same way you did and it sounds like like, hey, I'm a dad, I wanna be there and like all these things, but I'm hearing something different from you.

I mean, maybe when I was younger and he had his son, like, but I can't recall a time where it was like, yeah, my dad, like I just remember the bad memories. Yeah. So. Yeah, yeah. What were those bad memories? Well, I could recall him coming home, being drunk and taking drugs taking it out on me like physically and emotionally and stuff, so. I'm sorry. Thank you. Very sorry. I'm sorry.

And so at the graduation when you saw your father, did you two speak? What happened?

Well, he came up to me and his first words were, "You can't speak to nobody." And it's like, that's how you approach people? Like if you're so, "I want my family back and my child, my child." Hi, how are you? How you been? What's up with you? What's going on in life?

Does your sister Makayla the same relationship with your father?

I think he wants to be in her life. I think that's like his little girl. So I think for her it's just like, dude, we don't—

Does she wanna be in his life?

I can't speak for her. I don't know.

Got it. Okay. Everyone, please welcome Leighton to my show. How you doing, Layton?

Good.

All right, please take a seat for me. What's going on? All right, Layton, so you want your family back. What do you mean by that? What I mean by that is I mean talk to them and everything. I don't talk to them. So what's your response to what you heard Ariana say? I mean, it hurts. Why does it hurt? 'Cause they my kid, that's my blood. I mean, I watched them grow up. I mean, I wasn't there all the time. No, I wasn't. I blame myself for that. So tell me, how did you feel when you saw Aryana at Mikayla's graduation? I mean, it hurt because it's like, looked at me like I wasn't daddy. Like didn't talk to me nothing like that.

Mm-hmm. But what did you expect me to say? Like the way your approach is everything. It's not what you say. It's how you say it. We haven't seen each other in how long? We don't talk to each other, we don't call each other. So what were you expecting?

But I mean, but that's not my, I'm not blamed for all that though. Us not talking to each other. I try to call.

The phone go both ways. I try to talk.

Every time I try to call, I don't get no answer, nothing like that. So that made me to just stop calling. Layna, I got a question for you. Ariana said that when you saw her prom picture, you deleted it off the phone. You tell me about that and why? Deleted it? Yeah. I ain't delete no pictures. You didn't delete the photo. So I wanna ask you point blank, do you accept Aryana as your daughter? Yeah, I do. She could be a dinosaur, whatever. I still, that's my child. That's mine. The fact that you said Aryana, I do accept you as my daughter. And she says she doesn't know if she can believe you, which that's her experience. But she also just said that your ex-wife has also shared with her that you still refer to her as a boy. How do you respond to that? That's not true. I mean, if that's the case, I would call him Isaiah. I call Ariana, that's what I call her. Ariana. Ariana. You taking everything as a joke right now.

That's what's making me mad. That's my name.

That's my legal name. That's what's making me mad right now. You got everybody laughing. That's what's pissing me off. Because I'm funny? The hell, man. Leighton, what do you wanna say to her? Right now, I don't even know what I wanna say. But what are you frustrated about?

I'm confused. I didn't sit here and call you a liar. I didn't say nothing derogatory to you. I'm respecting you. Like, I'm confused.

What is frustrating you? Because I'm giving you, I don't know if you noticed, I wanna make sure you're having an opportunity to share your point. It's just, I mean, like I said, I just don't feel like I'm getting respected as a father.

I just remember you coming home drunk and I don't know what will be going on with you, but you would take it out on me.

Ariana's little sister, Makayla, is also here and she sees things very different than her father. Makayla, please come on out. Hi.

Can I get a hug?

Nice to meet you. You too. Yes. All right, so I see you just walked past your father, so I'm assuming that you don't have a good relationship.

There's not really much of a relationship there. I mean, I don't really feel like I have a father. Yeah. Why? He was never around.

So did you want a relationship with your father?

I would be open to it, but there's boundaries and things that I want from you. I want you to respect my sister as Ariana. I want you to respect my mother. You don't do that.

How am I don't do that though?

So you don't be calling her Isaiah still? He claims that he never did that and he never deleted the prom picture. He never called me Isaiah. He doesn't ever call me Isaiah.

I mean, at the beginning, I probably, I mean, I called you Isaiah because I wasn't used to calling you Ariana. Ariana? I can't do this, man. On my life, I can't do this. I'm done.

Okay, well, you haven't been doing it for how many long? So continue. Oh well. Keep it up. Now it's oh well.

Oh well, go on. You doing it like, look at me, I'm doing fine. Look at the way you talking to me.

I'm good. I've been good at you my whole life.

I've been good.

Do you see me?

I'm gonna ask you, Makayla. You were just pregnant, you had a child, right? Yes. Did you tell your father about your child? No. Why?

What would I be telling you for? I just don't feel like that was something that you needed to know. I mean, if you were present, if you were around, yeah, you would've known about it, but who needed to know knew.

How do you feel that you have never met your grandchild? I mean, it hurts. I mean, it just hurts. Late, when did you find out that Makayla had a child? My brother told me. Is this your first grandchild? Yep.

But can I ask why you felt like you needed to know?

'Cause you my daughter.

But if I'm your daughter, then why aren't you around?

I'm in a different state and I try to be around, I try to call.

I'll give you that. You call and we don't answer. I don't answer. Because the times I have picked up the phone, you blame everyone else but yourself. How do I blame anybody else? You blame my mom, you blame me, you blame Mariana. All right, joining us now is Bree.

She met Leighton when she was a teenager and they got married. She's telling her side of the story with hopes that Leighton will finally listen to her and their daughters. Welcome everyone. Bree to the show. How you doing today?

I'm nice, how are you?

Thanks for coming to the show. Yeah. Please take a seat. So I'm hearing a lot of confusion on Leighton's part. What was your experience?

Leighton just was not there. Whether he was physically in our home, He was not mentally, emotionally available for me, for them. But he puts a lot of the blame on me and I'm not the one to blame. Like I was there, I stepped up to the plate to fill your shoes and my shoes.

How was y'all's marriage when y'all were together? Non-existent.

It's a piece of paper.

So why are y'all still legally married?

Why? Why? Layton has made it perfectly clear. On several occasions that I will always be his wife. He's, oh, I'll never divorce you. And I've tried, just not for a lack of effort. I have tried.

Like, right, so I want to hear your perspective because I'm hearing a constant from 3 people, and I'm not trying to say that you're lying, but there's an inconsistency with what you're experiencing and what 3 different people are experiencing. They're all saying they experienced the same thing. You were not there. You were emotionally unavailable. You were physically unavailable. You just were not there. So they don't know you. They don't have a relationship with you. Listen here, I got it perfectly clear now. I know for sure now. Trust me. So what do you wanna do to rectify that? Because you said you want your family back. Can you look at your family and say, "I'm sorry"? I'm sorry and I apologize.

If we're gonna do anything today on this stage, please be for real.

He just said, "I'm sorry and I apologize." What do you want? Tell him.

Me personally, I want you to understand how you made me feel. If you are going to be in our lives and try to make a relationship, you need to prove your acceptance of Aryana and not be calling her Isaiah and referring to her as your son. And just stop blaming everybody else.

And Bree, what do you need?

To piggyback off of Makayla, I just need you to accept that, or just respect the fact that you have two beautiful daughters. Like, you know, for me as a mother, like, I adore her. I have the utmost respect for her, and I just wish everybody would. And I get that it's not for everybody, but that's your child. That's your daughter. And I know that.

And I accept it. And I accept it. She's living her truth, and I respect it. I respect your answer.

But you don't show I really do respect you.

Layton, I do believe honestly from today, and I will say this, I didn't know anything about you beforehand. I didn't know who you were. I didn't know how you were gonna react out here. I truly do believe in my heart of hearts and in my professional opinion that you wanna do better and wanna be here for your children. I do. I truly do believe that. But I believe that it's also very hard for you to hear all of these things and the pain you've caused. Yes, it is, it is. And it can feel like this is a never-ending cycle where you're always the bad guy. But the truth of the matter is, is that you won't always be the bad guy if you do one thing, and that's just own anything they say. The thing of the matter is you've already started doing that right now. You've already said, "I accept you as my daughter. I'm sorry that I wasn't here for you. I'm sorry that I did this." But what they're telling you is that it's not enough. So what you have to do right now is you have to tell your family that I'm willing to go on the journey of taking however long you all need to heal. I could be here, I could wait for y'all to gimme time. I mean, just forgive me. I apologize. It hurts me and everything and I know it hurts y'all and I'm sorry. I think that's a big step. He clearly is letting y'all know he's not perfect. So if he's saying I'm sorry, you gotta give him a chance to believe him. If he says I accept you, you gotta give him a chance to believe you. And if he does something different, call him out. And that's the way y'all gonna heal. I actually wanna see y'all be well. I truly do. Because I'm gonna tell you right now, you got a beautiful family. So I believe y'all can heal. I believe y'all can be a family together. You've taken a very big step today and And I honor you for that. Now's the time for y'all to do the work as a family. I can see the emotions, they're boiling up. I see the tears. It's important for you to get this relationship back on track. Yes, it is. How long have you felt like this relationship with your father has been off track?

All my life. All your life?

Yes. Tell me about it.

Oh Lord, where do I start?

What happens when you try to talk to him?

Every time I try to talk to him about how I feel, it turns into an argument. It turns into him blaming my mama. Okay, got it. And he don't want to take the blame or responsibility for nothing. Yeah.

When did you last see your father?

I saw him yesterday. Okay. But other than that, last time I saw him was in August. In August? Yeah, August when my grandfather passed away.

Okay. And your father has another daughter, Terra, what is their relationship like?

They close. He live with her.

Oh, he lives with her. So why does your father, 'cause you said this earlier, why does your father blame your mother for the distance in your relationship?

I'm just gonna be honest. My mama, when she had me, she stopped dealing with him. She closed that chapter and said, "We ain't gotta see each other. You can see your child." Okay. My mom, she didn't say anything bad about him until I turned 18. That's when she started telling me the truth.

But up until then it was like—

She protected him. That's interesting.

Does he know that? Probably not. Got it. Okay. How do you get along with your mom? My mom is my best friend.

I love my mama. Yeah. Okay, good.

So my producers tell me You said that sometimes you're unhappy with your sister, your stepsister, Shaterra? Yeah, my half sister. Your half sister, excuse me, your half sister. Why are you upset with her sometimes?

'Cause she always throws it up in my face that her and my daddy close. Like when she had her last child, she was like, he cooked for me, he cleaned up the house, he did all of this and all of that. And I'm just like, I'm like, he ain't do that for me. Yeah.

Well, how are you hoping that the family dynamic will change? What do you want?

I just want him to love me.

Got it, I hear you. Well, I think it's time to meet Takya's sister, Shatira. So everyone please welcome Shatira to the show. Hi, Shaterra, how you doing? Take a seat for me. What do you think about what Takia's just been saying?

I think a lot of it is true, but the part about her mom just cutting my dad off and saying, you know, you can have a relationship with her and not me. I can tell you from the way that she did me, me trying to pick up Takia, trying to talk to her on her birthday, trying to go see her see her. Her mom never allowed it aside from my dad, you know. I guess she didn't want them, you know, her to be exposed to the, the bad side of him or get her feelings hurt or whatever. But when I would try to call when I became an adult, her— it was always some excuse. Did you know this?

Did you know that your mom stopped your sister from seeing you? My mama didn't trust my sister.

She didn't trust the sister. It's like she didn't trust anyone, like I was one of her friends trying to come to play instead of her family that she should spend time with. My dad was in and out of my life as well, and he was married to my mom for, for, for years. When she was born, they, they were married. They, they were married up until I was like 12, 14.

Hold on, so let me get that. So when your mother— your mother and your mother and father were married and did your father have an affair with your mother? And so that's, okay. And did they stay married? Yes. So they stayed married after the affair? Yes. This makes more sense, okay. And so he was in and out of your life that entire time. Yes.

Did you know that? He's been in and out of prison. It's been a lot of situations to where we would have to leave. Like they all, my mom and dad always fought all the time and it's him, Coming to my house now and being with me, giving birth to my last daughter and cooking and cleaning and stuff for me, this just happened. My daughter is 7 months old. Got it. And so he just, 'cause he felt like he owed that to me because he knows that he's been in and out of all of our lives. Yeah. He knows this.

How does that make you feel knowing that she didn't get a relationship with your father either?

She saw more than I did. Got it. And that's not all on him. Like I said, her mom kept her away from us. Oh Lord. Why do you say, oh Lord? Can we please stop blaming my mama? Please, please stop blaming my mama. We cannot stop blaming her. Yes, you can. Yes, you can. You can stop blaming my mama. Stop it. Not the whole thing. Stop it. Stop mentioning my mama. Stop it, Shaterra. Yes, you can. Stop it. He got his part, but she also done— Stop it, stop it, don't mention my fucking mama, bro, stop it. How am I supposed to not mention her mama? Stop it. How? Stop it, for real, stop it. I'm telling you what she did to me, not him. What did she do to you? Kept me from seeing you every time I tried to call you for your birthday. Okay, my mama was protecting me. Well, she was protecting you then, that's the reason why you don't have a relationship with him. My mama not the reason I don't got a relationship with him. Let's just put it out there. My mama is not the reason. He is. He's the reason. Him. Not my mama.

It sound like you don't wanna hear the truth. So when it comes to your relationship with your sister, I understand with your relationship with your father, your father's a grown man. He should have his own choices. Do you believe that your mother could have had some part to play in you two not being close? Do you believe that?

My mama is very overprotective. Okay. She didn't allow me around nobody but my grandparents. I'm sure. My grandparents didn't allow me around nobody.

I get that. But this is your sister, and if your sister's trying to reach out to you, of course your father's a different situation, but I'm looking at your sister right now who's saying she didn't have a relationship with her father. I can tell even through her calmness, she has just as much pain. And that's not to compare the pain, but it's saying she's had her own experience where she didn't have a father in her life and she tried to reach out to you and she was stopped. So— She wasn't stopped like that. Okay. You know, Takaya's mother, Lele, is joining us right now remotely from Arkansas and I wanna talk to her right now. So everyone, please welcome Lele to the show. Hello. What do you have to say about after what you just heard?

First thing first, if Takaiya don't want to go nowhere, I'm not finna make her go anywhere. A lot of times Takaiya didn't want to go because she'll tell me what would go on and I say, "Baby, you don't gotta go." Takaiya, how many times have I went broke taking you to Red Lobster and taking you out to eat, bribing you to go with him? A lot of times.

So she wanted you to go with them and you decided that you didn't wanna go? Yeah. Was this both your father and your sister? Mm-hmm. Okay. So LeLe, from your point of view, you tried to get her to go and she didn't wanna go?

Yes, because her past experiences.

So in your opinion then, why don't you think she has a relationship with her father?

I really don't have an opinion on that because just like I know she's here, he know it. Just like I know she need things, he know it too. So it's completely on him.

Takaya, since you came into this world, you've been part of this family. You've been part of my life. Doesn't feel like it.

Never felt like it. How? What do you mean how?

I can only do what I can do. I got 4 other kids and 3— Listen.

Yeah, you always say that. And that's the truth.

But don't none of that means nothing when you can come around. You always been able to do that. So now I gotta take some heat for behind your choice in life when that wasn't even the case. Would you like to be closer with Takaiya? What kind of question? Yes, that's my baby. I'm only asking because those are her concerns. She came out here and she told me that she just wants to be closer with you. And I want whatever she want times 10. Mm-hmm. Shakia, what do you wanna say to your dad?

I just want us to be close, closer than what we are. That's all I ever wanted. Okay.

And that's all I want too. Tell him what does that look like to you?

Me and you hanging out. That's it, me and you. It ain't never just been me and you, never. Yesterday, last night, was the most I ever spent with you, and that's sad, sad as fuck. And like, I understand that you had your issues. My mama had her issues too, but at the end of the day, she never left me.

Is there anything, Terry, that you wanna say to Layla? I really appreciate her taking care of my daughter. That's it. Your request is pretty simple, but it's not even just about you right now, it's about both of you. Both of your daughters are hurting tremendously, and what they're both saying is make me feel special. Make me feel like I'm your daughter that you love. You love, have time for just me. Ask me how I'm doing. Really talk to me about what I went through. Listen to me more. Am I right, ladies? Yes. Right.

'Cause do you remember what you said to me on my 15th birthday? No. I do. I asked you for a cake the week before, and the lady you was with, we got the same birthday. I told you to just spend that day with her, 'cause I already knew you wasn't gonna do nothing. And you know what you said?

You know what you said to me?

What'd I say? You said I was acting like one of your side chicks. What? No. Yes, yes you did. You said that to me. I said what? You told me I was acting like one of your side chicks. That's what you said to me. You— That's what you said to me. No, I didn't.

Yes, you did! You did that to me, Terry. This is a moment where you practice what you show her. Her past and her experiences, you defending it is never gonna help you to build a relationship you want with your daughters now. Defending— I never got an apology, a real apology from you.

That's all I ever wanted.

Show her you wanna show up and make her special now.

Show her. It's you to say, baby, I'm sorry.

You're dealing with it. Listen, listen, listen. I'm sorry, baby. I'm sorry. There you go. That's how you show up. I'm sorry.

Let it out, baby. Let it out. You've been holding it in too long. Let it out. Now you get to dry the tears I've been drying. Love you.

You deserve this as well. No, you do. That's why I brought you in. I brought you in as well because I see what you need as well. And I know you're trying to be big, tough, big sister.

She needs it way more than I do.

I know, but that doesn't take away what would you need. And as a mother, I know you're already in the mindset that I gotta take care of everybody else. You deserve this too.

Listen, he allowed me my time to express. Like I said, he ain't never been the perfect dad. And so when I expressed to him, he listened to me. Good. The thing about this is she never got her chance. Got it. She never got her chance. She's getting her chance now.

Terry, I gotta tell you what you just did right there. Moving closer to your dad too. What you just did right there was a huge big step. Instead of defending anything from your past, you just showed up and held your daughter and let her know she was special. That's what you did. Beautiful. There you go. Beautiful. Takia, how do you feel right now?

I finally feel loved.

Do you finally feel loved? Terry, you took a very big first step here and I believe that if you continue this, because I can see by the way you being in her life that you do want to step up, that you want to start making amends for any past decisions. I can see where you're at in your life and what you're doing today is what's going to keep you of building this bond with your daughters. Show them each they're special. And if anything comes up from that past, don't defend it. Just show them in that moment, I wanna make it up to you now. I'm gonna show you're special now. You did the best work you could ever done here to start mending the relationship with your daughters. You hear me, man? Thank you. Congratulations. Y'all taking the first step to a healthy family. So what I'm gonna do is I'm gonna do this separately. I'm gonna buy you two dinner tonight so y'all can have just dinner together. Thank you. Okay, 'cause I want, she wants time with her dad, all right? And then I'm gonna buy y'all a second dinner so y'all can have dinner, all three of y'all, because y'all need to bond as a family. Because that's all she was asking for. Not anything else, just a little one-on-one time and then a little time for y'all to heal together. How do y'all feel about that? Good? Yeah? All right. I wish y'all the best of luck. Y'all gonna be all right, all right? Thank you. Yeah, you're welcome. So Aaliyah, you contacted the show and I want you to take a look, everyone, what you said. You said, I have a strained relationship with my father, my only Black family left, which is important to me. I am half white and half Black. My parents got a divorce 7 years ago and everything has gone insanely downhill since then. My father has been so hurtful to me "I gave my father an intervention and he called the cops on me. I want Karamo to give it one last chance before I go no contact, Aaliyah." Okay. Yeah. So there's so much in that for me to unpack. There's a lot. Yeah, there is. Okay, so what does your father say that insulted you, where he tries to insult you?

He called me a ghetto Black girl. Which as a Black woman really hurt my identity. And it was all like—

As a Black man, that pisses me off. Yeah. Because, you know, I mean, obviously I'm gonna be fair, I'm gonna hear your father's side of the story, but from hearing that, I can only imagine the pain you hear for someone who's close to you to call you that. Yeah. Here's an excerpt from an email your father sent you that you want me to see. How did you respond to this type of language?

I'm more of a quiet person. Yeah. So I ignored for a bit and it's always been back and forth. It feels like I'm in a toxic high school relationship. So do you and your dad talk right now?

No. And what are you both arguing about the most right now?

I wanna see my siblings. Siblings right now. He lives 15 minutes away from me. They go back and forth from him to my mom who is 2 hours away from me. She'll let me see them, but you know, it takes a bit to go. To go all the way up there. Yeah. And when they're there, why can't I stop by, say hi?

Got it. Well, I appreciate your perspective and I think it's time to meet Aaliyah's father, Allen, so we can hear his side of the story. So everyone please welcome Allen to the show. Hey Allen, how are you doing? I'm well, how are you? I'm good, thanks for being here. Thank you. So what do you think about what Aaliyah described, how she described your relationship? I think some of it was true, but on the other hand, there's a lot of things that weren't explained correctly. Okay, please tell me, I wanna know. Well, first, I mean, calling her ghetto black girl, girl. I just think that she's very spoiled and just always runs to me when there's— Always runs to me when, um, how am I spoiled? You get everything you want. You've gotten everything you want, you know. And I've absolutely been there for her all her whole life. Definitely. You bully, harass, insult.

You spam us with messages. You scream in our faces. You called the cops on two Black kids who were sitting on your couch.

And the reason why I called the cops, 'cause you would not leave and I asked you to leave and you wouldn't leave.

Because I'm talking to you, we're having an intervention. No, we weren't having an intervention.

We're trying to make you understand.

I didn't want to have an intervention. We're trying to make you understand that the way you talk is not respectful to your kids and respect goes both ways.

What did you think of that interview? Intervention? Oh, I thought that was unnecessary. I'm the, I'm the, I'm the parent. Everyone who gets an intervention thinks it's unnecessary.

So we did it because we care.

But the way you care and the way you showed that was disrespectful towards me. So my question is, 'cause you said she was disrespectful, why did you call the cops on them? I know you said just to have them leave. Well, it wasn't just me, it was also my mom, you know, and we're in her house. So my mom didn't want her there and they wouldn't leave. And that was just like, hey, we're just asking you to go.

What about when I asked you to come outside and talk then? I didn't wanna talk to you anymore.

I was done talking with you. It's time to end it. But you wouldn't leave. Well, she says you don't allow her to see her younger siblings. Is that true? Yeah, it was just after that fallout. The fact that being brought in this light and looking like, like no good dad.

Because there's more problems besides you just being there. You just being there doesn't, isn't enough. It's not enough to just be there.

What would it take for you and your daughter to find forgiveness today, in your opinion? For me, I would just need her to change just the way that she, her attitude and and disrespectful. She's disrespectful towards me and ungrateful.

You are ungrateful. But have you ever even given the answer of why I'm disrespectful? You're the one calling me ghetto. Yes, because— I don't call you a ghetto Black guy. But you call me— I don't tell you that you're not shit.

Right, so this is what I'm seeing. I think you're confusing the words respect with empathy. Because everything you're saying is about her to have empathy for your experience. Her to have empathy for what you're going through. And when she doesn't have that empathy because she describes her experience, you then call her disrespectful. That's what I've tracked the pattern. I agree, 100%. Great. I want you to be validated in your feelings because if you're validated in your feelings from another man who could say, I see it and I understand, maybe that will give you an opportunity to validate her feelings. But what she's really asking for is more of the emotional support, the emotional connection. She's asking for that from you. And that is what's missing right now.

She needs you.

You're the man that comes into, that is in her life that she has to turn to. And that's compounded not only by being a young woman, but also by the fact that she is also biracial. And she's saying, I'm also needing that support from you and that validation. Do you hear that? Do you understand that? I absolutely understand it 100%. 100%. I do. And there's a bigger piece on top of that that I gotta say to you. Black man to black man. Yeah. Right. When you called the police on your daughter. Right. When she's been told by her father in an email, I saw your own words, that she's a ghetto black girl. It's your job to make sure that no police are called on her. It's your job to make sure that no one ever calls her a ghetto black girl. Mm-hmm. That's your job. Can you see that? Yeah, I admit that I've made mistakes and that, you know, I haven't been mature in a way and showing my anger towards you and I shouldn't be taking that out on you. And I definitely would like to try to reconcile our relationship by taking baby steps at a time and see what we can do. What we can do in order to heal it. So moving forward, and I appreciate you saying that, she mimics your behavior in the fact of like her, I'm gonna even not call it anger, it's in this strength of like, I need to be heard and seen. Right. So when you talk about like her behavior, she's mimicking yours. Be aware of that. And the fact that she brought you here knowing that this is a place where I try to always cultivate healing and growth, she brought you here not to berate you. She brought you here because she was hoping to get her father back. And if you've never seen this show, I'm gonna be the first to tell you, people come on this show because they're hoping to reconnect. They're hoping to get better. And so she brought you here because she wanted to be heard and she thought this would be the only place to be heard. But she hoped that after she was heard, you could reconnect. Am I telling the truth? Yeah. What are you thinking about right now?

Don't touch me, please. Oh God. See, that's what.

Here you go, love. What made you emotional right there?

'Cause it doesn't matter.

What does it matter?

Like how I said.

What do you love about your daughter? What do you like about your daughter? Oh, I love so much about her. Just her talent. She's extremely talented and she can do anything that she puts her mind to. I just love the fact that how she interacts with her siblings and How she's not almost like a motherly figure to them and—

That's why I should be able to see them.

Hold on, but what he just did there is he validated that you were a good big sister. You have to help her to build herself, to see herself as a strong, powerful, amazing Black woman that she is. All right, I agree with you and I'll look forward to taking those steps to have her see herself siblings. Can you believe that? I hope so. Good. Listen, this is the first step and I'm glad I could be here. Listen, I wish y'all the best of luck, all right? Thank you. So I wanna know from your perspective, why do you think Rene hasn't seen his daughters in 7 years? 'Cause he's a piece of shit. Okay, so well I guess that leads me to what happened in y'all relationship. Exactly. Mm-hmm. So what happened in y'all relationship? How was it?

Everything but the right thing. He's a serial cheater. And I actually divorced him. Okay. He kept cheating, just kept cheating and making up excuses. We did therapy, I prayed, I took him to church and his woman was in church. Oh wow. He was messing with a woman in church. Like he's a piece of work. So I can't respect what he has from here on out.

So you said you feel like you picked the wrong man to be the father of your child.

I definitely did. Why do you feel that? I feel because he's He just, he wasn't giving what he said. This does a lot of talking, but I don't see the actions. And I feel like he's just, he's a whore.

How involved are you in his relationship with his kids?

How involved am I? Yeah. I helped him try to be a dad. Meaning even after we separated, I went to go pick him up, like take him from work. I would go get the kids so they would have time together and drop him off at his other female's house. Like I was that parent. While they played in the park, I was sitting in the car on my phone, reading, doing whatever I needed to do while they built time. Like that's the mom I am. I'm gonna help you be the dad I need you to be because you obviously can't do it yourself.

So how did you feel as their mother watching their relationship with their father deteriorate?

That's why we here. Because when my kids hurt, I hurt. I'm mama bear. I'm coming for you behind my kids. And when they got on Facebook and da da da da da da, and she's, The wife is saying stuff to her, and baby, stay out of it. This was before you. Learn your place.

You told my producers that you think that his wife, like you just said, his new wife, has— She don't know half of it. But do you think that she's causing some of this problem?

I'm not gonna say she's causing the problem, but when you insert yourself to say stuff like you feel like I'm the problem, baby, you don't know the half of what you got. You don't. Like, he's a serial— He don't like to work. He works for like 6 months and quits. Or something on my back, on my neck. Oh, it's always something. I got 3 jobs, I get 2 jobs. I'm constantly going. I don't stop. So why you don't stop? You not taking care of none of your kids.

Well, Renee's wife, Ashawna, is also here in the audience and I wanna talk to her a little bit later in the show about what she feels. But I just have to ask this because I heard you talk a lot about what he did to you and how he treated you. Is there any resentment or jealousy a policy towards Renee and his new wife and his new family?

New family, that's the issue right there. How can you not even take care of the one you had? He lies and I don't know what he tells her, but baby, it ain't the truth. 'Cause I got the messages where he even said he wish he had his family back.

Do you get along with his new wife?

I don't know nothing about her. I really don't. Like, she has nothing to say to my kid. Like, she's constantly inserting herself with my kids and think it's her. It's not you. I'm not jealous of you. I don't care about you. If I wanted Renee, I could have had Renee and kept Renee and kept the cheating going. That's the fact about it.

Do you talk about Renee in front of your daughters the way you talked about him to me? So this is the thing.

No, baby, my kids made their own choice. They see Renee. They see him for what he is now, and that's what he can't stand, 'cause he's a narcissist. He's a liar. He was supposed to see he was supposed to send a Christmas gift while he was in Boston. Baby, we still waiting on that. UPS, where is it at? We still waiting on these boxes of clothes.

Do you feel like he abandoned your family?

He did. You got these women laughing at me 'cause you over here chilling with them. Like, he had a woman in my bed. And all the kids was in the house. All the kids was in the house. My nieces, my nephews, his daughter. Like, everybody was in the house and you had a whole woman in my bed. We were high and we fell asleep. Get the hell out of here with that. And then I stopped smoking weed. So that separated us too. Because when I stopped smoking, we didn't have that bonding. And then, you know, he would go elsewhere to smoke because I wasn't giving him what he needed. Oh, but now he got a smoking buddy. That's why he love his new wife. They smoke it up.

Okay, understand. So why haven't you seen your daughters in person since 2016? Financially, I pay child support. That's directly taken outta my check. I live in a state where the cost of living is way higher than the state that put the case on. I have no savings to afford to make it. Well, can you explain your child support payments? Massachusetts would give me $600 a week on unemployment. I would see $125 of that money to survive, to consider my rent and all other bills. $125 was nothing.

Why are you on child support?

You tell me because I was locked up in prison when you put me on child support for these two kids. You lied. You told my producers that you feel like Mo's the reason that you have a hard time spending time with your daughters. What do you mean by that? I've contacted several years. The summer's coming up. Can I get my kids from the summer? Spring break. Oh, I'll see. I mean, when me and my wife first got together, the conversation from her was, oh, "I don't trust my kids around no female that I don't know." Not a problem, I'll put y'all on the phone. They had conversation, everything was okay and said yes until I got on the phone and apologized to her.

I let my kids go stay there with him and they came back smelling like smoke.

Before me and my current wife got together, I was having an issue living in the same state seeing my children. Renee hasn't seen his two daughters since he and Mo divorced 7 years ago, and I wanna talk to them now and get their point of view on this. So everyone, please welcome Alon and Sinai to the show. Hi. Mm-mm, don't do that, baby.

It's okay. It's all right, Stink.

Thank you for being here. What's bringing you to tears? This is your first time seeing your dad? This is your first time seeing your father. Do you wanna say hi to him?

Missed you. I have one parent and that's it. There's nothing else, no one else I can like turn to. And I have like no father figure, so it's just empty. And that's what hurts. What I'm saying about this whole thing is that he doesn't get is that he's trying to say I try to keep him— I, I'm—

that part I truly understand how my kids feel, and I understand all of that. When I was a kid, when I was a kid, kids got to see both parents whether they live together or not. And that is my only thing. We have our issues, we don't live together. Why can't I still see my kids regardless of where I lay my head? That should not matter when I want to be a part of their life.

We are not together, Renee.

What does it have to do with them?

Understand why, because you made a promise you wanted to be in these kids' lives.

We are not together because I cheated, you cheated. So what? The relationship now is about them.

So what I'm saying is that— They should be allowed to be a part of that. But you wanted to be a parent, right? So when I gave you the opportunity—

You moved on with a relationship, so the kids are allowed to be a part of that. I moved on with a wife, my wife is a part of my life, so being a part of me—

It's being a part of my life. That's not what it's about. The whole point is you could be there for them.

You said you was in Colombia.

You said you had not been in Atlanta.

And at one point in time, in all this child support money you got, have you said, hey, you can't financially afford it, I'll meet you halfway? Too much for you, right? They're still out there, arguing. Did you make me— You told my wife I didn't even talk to her. Oh, yes, you did.

Where is she at? Where is she at?

Please stand up and explain to the world.

First of all, you went through the whole spill of what he did to you. You told me I wasn't gonna be the last person he was with, and this was in 2015. It's 2023, we've been married for 2 years. He ain't stepped out on me not once. Nobody clap for that. Okay, I don't need nobody. I don't need nothing.

I made mistakes with you. I'm sorry. But I'm still trying to be a part of my kids' life every day.

It's not just gonna get resolved with them arguing.

What do you want?

I want to sit down with him and let him know why, why, what's going on with me. Like, I want to speak my heart. Like, with them yelling, I cannot, like, it's just— Yeah. It's too much.

Is it often like that how they communicate with each other? And even though y'all might not directly be in between it, y'all are always in between it. Between them, right? Yes. Yeah, 'cause your parents talked about a hard moment for you with an ex, and it sounded like even in that hardest moment, instead of focusing on you, they were still arguing with each other. Is that what happened? Yes. What's it been like for y'all?

Hard. In what ways? Because like my sister was saying, we don't have a dad. We don't have no father figure. That's why I feel like I went through the domestic violence relationship because I'm looking for love in the wrong places. Yeah, yeah. And I don't want that to keep happening or I don't want that to happen to my sister because of the actions that he did.

Can I tell you something? You have a right to blame him. When a parent doesn't step up to do what they need to do, you have a right to say this was your job and you didn't do the job. But I will also tell you that I see a strength in the two of you as women that I'm very proud of. That choice to get up and walk off that stage was a choice where you put yourself first. You hear me? Yes. And I still hear them arguing back there.

No, you're not gonna make up no lies on him. I specifically said— Girl, I'm not making up no lies. Specifically, don't run up on him, bitch. Don't run up on him. We came here to talk and I feel like it's just arguing.

You allowed her to stay where a man was physically abusing her. You wouldn't send her to her father just for a break.

That lets me know you don't need to have a dad. That lets us know that you ain't speaking behind my back. That's why I asked you to step in and help me.

We ain't gotta wait. We ain't gotta do none of that. She right. Who do you want to talk to?

My dad. And what do you want him to know?

I want him to know that he has hurt me He hurt me like— Yeah, and he needs to acknowledge that and make amends for that moment because you deserve to have your father make you the priority. You deserve to have your father make you the priority. You both deserve apology from both of them, okay? So I want y'all to wait in the green room and I'm gonna go out there and I'm gonna try to figure this out, okay? Two things. First, I can see the breakdown in communication when it comes to you you and your daughter. And it's up to you to be better in that communication. She has her pain, she has her experiences, and as a little girl, she needs your help to heal that. But you can't match her. And secondly, it's unfortunate right now, but brother, I gotta tell you, you're wrong for your train of thought. And it's just the truth. I get it, you're in circumstances where you need support. But the thing is, is that the support You gotta figure that out. You are stuck in a narrative of like, I needed somebody else. You need to figure it out. There's other choices you can make. And I'm just telling you, there is. I hear you saying it, I'm listening. Let me tell you something. I've been on a Greyhound bus before. I have been in Ubers before. I have done everything else. So you don't just, listen, a Greyhound ticket is $100-something. You could have found that. You could have found that. I know your ex-wife would've, I mean your new wife would've given it to you. She know I would've did it for myself. Oh, believe me, it may look like I ain't did nothing in the last 8 years. I've been homeless in a shelter, homeless to make sure their child support was paid or the things that they've called and said, "Hey dad, I need these shoes, that." And I've done it despite of whether I could even put a spoon or something to eat in my mouth. That was your choice to have more children, not theirs. You right. It was. I'm not saying it was their fault. Yes. But part of that statement is looking for empathy. I'm not looking for empathy on them about anything. What I don't understand in that situation is their mother knew my situation to then turn around and do the exact same thing to me, hold my kids against me. But she didn't hold your kids against you. And she wouldn't let 'em come see me. She did. But it's not her. And I'm telling you this because your daughters are saying this. She said they needed you to show up. So you keep thinking it's her that's not here. Now they need me to show up, but when they were still considered minors and kids— She just said when they were younger too, they needed it. All right, you're right. Who doesn't need their dad? You're right. I appreciate the strength that you two women had to come out here. I appreciate the vulnerability that you two had. And I'm sorry that you're in pain. I'm sorry. And as I told you backstage, stage, and I want you to hear this too, Renee, because I said this to your daughters. I said, when they said it's just dad's fault, I said, no, it's not just dad, it's mom too. Because I understood that this take both of y'all. So young ladies, I'm sorry again, and I'm gonna figure a way to get you some more healing. If I offer you two young women therapy, just to have somebody to talk to about what's going on, would you be willing to take that? I've already did it.

I've already done that when he left. I'm not finna keep sitting there, you know. It's either he wants to be in our life or he don't. I'm sitting here acting like this man is dead. He's obviously alive.

Like, I don't want no, I don't want that.

I don't, I don't, I get it. Like, it's just I want him to get where we're coming from. These are your blood, your child, and you have not seen us in how long? You don't even know nothing about us, Dad. You know, you, every time you ask to get us something, What's y'all's size? You should know this.

Alon, I am sorry. I have loved you since the day you were born. What are you talking about? I'm sorry for leaving you in that situation. I'm sorry for that. When I moved away, I didn't pack you up, fight your mother, and put you in the car and take you with me. I die and hurt every day because I don't get to talk to you. Both of y'all. Okay, so we got an apology. That's what you wanted. You got your apology and that is a start. I know there's a lot of, a lot of hurt right now and that there's a lot of healing that needs to happen, but at least you got the apology and now you can start that journey. All right, listen, I want to offer you therapy because I want you to have a little bit of therapy so that you can feel better about what's going on. Are you willing to accept that? Okay. Are you willing to accept the therapy? Good. I will get you support, okay? I know you're not ready right now, but at least you can get it. And at least you got a little bit of something that you can use and take with you from here. All right? I'm so sorry for what y'all are going through, but I love you. And at least you heard your father say, "I'm sorry." Mm-hmm.