I Heard You Cheating Through the Window! | Karamo

So I guess David came here to unlock his girlfriend's phone. But take a look at what happened when she was asked to hand it over.

No, no, I don't. Don't believe me, what am I telling you? This is how I am every time you leave. I'm in the house by myself like this. Look at me, don't go with your thoughts, go with your heart, please, your heart. I didn't do anything to betray you. I never slept with nobody. I never kissed nobody. I never fucked nobody's dick. I never did nothing. I'm not lying to you. Dave, look at me. I'm not lying to you. I swear on everything I love. I swear on God himself. I'm not lying to you. Look at me. Look at me. I don't believe you. Mommy, Dave, your Dana said I wasn't cheating on nobody because there was no one. It's because there was no one. There was no one. All right everyone, please welcome David to the show.

How you doing?

I'm doing great.

David, I saw you watching that and I see that you're getting emotional.

Yeah, yeah.

What's making you emotional about that?

It's just emotional 'cause we've been together for 6 years, you know what I'm saying? So. Uh-huh. We've been through a lot and it was not like we were just together for 6 years. We were together and we were homeless for the first 4 years.

Okay.

You know what I'm saying? So it didn't start out like, oh, let me leave a toothbrush at your house real quick. You know what I'm saying? Like, no, we were straight in abandoned buildings, in the tents. You know what I'm saying? Like together, we were right there. You know what I'm saying?

So.

Okay.

So.

So I appreciate that you two found each other in a hard moment. What caused her to react that way?

She started reacting that way because she was like, it's ironic that my phone broke before we did the show and she thinks that my phone was gonna be looked through. I was more than willing to hand up my phone, you know what I'm saying? If that was need to be, you know what I'm saying? Like, let's put it all on the table then.

You know what I'm saying? Yeah, you can look at it. Yeah. What is she saying?

She's saying that, Oh, Daddy, like, I'm not hiding nothing from you. I'm not lying to you. What do you want me, what else do you want me to do? Like, you know what I'm saying? And I was like, well, obviously you're lying to me because I'm not making this shit up like she apparently says. You know what I'm saying? She tells me I'm making it up in my head and it's all just some fake situation going on.

Okay, so what happened at your apartment last year?

We thought our house had recently been broken into. You know what I'm saying? And so when all my house got broken into, you know what I'm saying, we stayed with a friend upstairs. But me and her kind of got into an argument, you know what I'm saying? So I said, nah, went on for a walk. I came back and the apartment window, the little window in our apartment was open. You know what I'm saying? As you can see right there, like so.

Which one?

This little window. This little window right here.

Oh, okay.

This little one right here was open and that's the one closest to our bed. And I was like, what the hell? It was pitch black in there. Usually we have lights on. I went in through the front door of the building. And as I was coming up the ramp that's inside the building, this ramp right here, and I was about to hit the back stairwell, this one right here. It's the closest to our door. Before I even turned around to get to the back stairwell, she's coming out of the elevator. And the elevator, heavy breathing, you know what I'm saying? So she runs up to me and she was like, oh, I heard sirens. So I came outside to see if you're OK. I came up to her the next morning to address this whole situation and she was like, "Whoa, whoa, whoa. I never ran up to you from the elevator. You definitely made me feel like you're trying to play me like I'm stupid." So that's when the feeling that maybe she could be cheating started?

Yeah. My producers told me that they came up with a recap of a timeline of what happened. Okay, so it looked like 5:30 PM you left the apartment after a fight. Oh, so you all had fought beforehand?

Yeah, we fought.

Yeah, so yeah. Okay then. It was a breakup. And then you came home and saw the window was open. Heard someone blurt out, "Oh, shit." You caught her coming out of the elevator and then returned to the apartment window. It was closed when you went back.

Yeah, yeah, the blinds were down and I was like, "Okay," and I turned around and she has this like half-assed smirk on her face.

Did you ever revenge cheat to get back at her?

Yes, yes I did. Yes, listen, I heard she was, 'cause when we were homeless, she was with her ex-husband, you know what I'm saying? They were hanging out the whole time I was in jail. All of a sudden, she doesn't remember how she ended up in her ex-husband's tent.

Okay, got it, got it. Was there drug use during this time as well?

Yes, we used to be drug users.

Okay, got it, okay. And you're both sober now? Yes. Both sober, okay, great. Yeah, that's great. So do you think she has men over when you're gone?

Yeah.

Has her behavior changed while you were intimate?

Yeah, you know what I'm saying? Her behavior has changed, you know what I'm saying? For all my men out there, you know what I'm saying? I know what home feels like. So it feels different. That's all I can say, you know what I'm saying? It's different.

So why did you want to do this show? Why did you come here for me?

I came here for this show for closure, you know what I'm saying? And the—

Closure, so you're hoping to end the relationship?

Yes, yes indeed. Because even though I stepped out, yes, granted, it was wrong, I shouldn't have did that, you know what I'm saying? But I told you the truth. I came to you. You didn't have to drag me all the way to Connecticut, you know what I'm saying, to come get the truth about you.

Okay then.

You know what I'm saying?

Well, I think it's time to hear from Sarah.

And get her side of the story. So everyone please welcome Sarah to the show. Hi Sarah. Hi. Thank you for being here.

Yeah.

How do you feel about everything that he just said?

I would like to have the window picture back up.

Sure, can we put that picture back up?

This, he said is the little window, right?

This right here? No, no, no, I do not think it's the window.

This is the AC unit, right? That's the AC unit. This right here is a little window. It cannot open.

Oh, it did not. The blinds were open. The blinds were open. Don't play stupid.

He knows the window can't open. There's literally, so if the bed was still there, like right here, this is how much room right here. This is the little window right here. This right here is how much room in between the bed.

That's why you were bent over.

No. Looking through the window. How would he know that?

That's why you were bent over because that's the only logical way of looking through the window. That's the only way you can look through the window is if you were bent over looking—

I'm sorry, you got to talk? I get to talk.

Okay, and we're both talking now.

We're both up here. So the thing is that we live in an apartment building. If you stand out in front of the building, you can hear everything. Anybody's windows open, you hear everything anybody that lives on that side of the building, you can hear everything. It's an apartment building. So what makes you think it was me specifically 'cause all they said— Normally you say you can't hear nothing.

Normally you say you can't hear nothin' at all.

I'm saying when you're outside, there's nobody else around. No, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no! When you come outside— I'm not talking about being inside, that's weird.

Oh, it's different now?

Now it's different. No, don't twist my words. Now it's wordplay.

Now we're playing. Now this is what happens at home all the time. Now all of a sudden I'm wordplaying. Now all of a sudden it's different.

You cheated on me 4 times with one person. With the same person. With a male. You damn right. You damn right. You got to 4 times.

I got my 4 times, you damn right.

Because, because, because you're angry at me.

Yes.

On the video that we watched, you had a very strong emotional response. What caused that?

It's just, I hold it all in. Like right now I wanna do the same thing, but I have to hold it in because I don't wanna sit here and literally break. You know what I mean? Like I had to watch my mother go through this. I watched my mom get cheated. I would never ever have anybody go through this. I would never put anybody go through this. Why can't you understand that? I would never want anybody to go through what my mom had to go through. I watched her break.

Got it.

And like now I know how she feels 'cause I'm breaking. Like literally I'm breaking all the time. All the way through. You have no idea how much I love and like him so much. And that's—

So one of his other claims is that you were with a neighbor. Were you?

No. Okay. No, I wasn't because I would never—

I didn't leave you upstairs. I didn't leave you upstairs with the neighbor.

You did leave me upstairs.

Yes, you left me up there, but I didn't go sleep with anybody. Any fucking way. I didn't do nothing with anybody. I didn't do nothing. I didn't.

Okay.

Because my thing is like, I believe that if you're not gonna do it in front of me, it's cheating. I don't care what it is. That's how I am. If you're not gonna, if you can't do it in front of me, then you're cheating on me.

I don't care what it is. So let me ask you point blank, have you ever cheated on him?

No.

Never once? Never. Okay. So after everything he said, because he also clearly just said that he does not wanna be with you, he wants this just for closure. Do you still wanna be with him?

Of course I do. And that's funny because this whole time up until right now, he's been saying, I wanna be with you, I still love you, I still like you, I'm still in love with you, I'm still in like with you.

But have you been telling her that?

Yes.

Yeah. Okay.

But for the last 2 weeks, he didn't just leave. He left with a girl.

Okay.

He left with a girl.

So are you in a new relationship? No.

Yes.

You're establishing the connection?

Yes, he is, because that ring that's on his pinky is from one of the, it's from a girl.

Okay.

This pinky ring is not from a girl that you think it is, is that right?

Oh, it's from the other one. Yeah.

Were you two intimate last night?

We were intimate this morning. And he called her right after.

Mm-hmm. So why did you agree to unlock your phone?

Because I have nothing to hide.

Okay, so let's back this up. You said he called her this morning?

Yeah.

Yeah.

He sure did. And the reason why he would give up his phone willingly, 'cause the phone he has now is her phone.

No, I said—

It's her phone.

Before I bought that, I broke mine.

He literally broke his phone the night before we got on a plane.

So why did you call the woman that you're talking to right after you two had sex? Was it to inform her that you just had sex with—

No, it's just to rub it in my face.

To know, to go ahead and talk to her about our cat Tina that is at the house, checking on Tina, and if it was rubbing, really?

It was rubbing in my face. I don't give a fuck. And? Then why are you saying, that's not love and that's not like at all.

Okay, yeah, you're right. That's hate.

You're right.

That's evil.

No, no, no, I'm just saying. So David, how many other women are you currently seeing?

Just one.

Just one other woman? Just one. Okay, got it. And so you're hoping that by unlocking your phone that you're gonna prove to him that you haven't been doing anything in hopes that he will realize that he should stay with you.

I know that's not gonna do anything 'cause he wants, he wanted me to take a lie detector test and he told me that's what was gonna happen here, but I didn't know it was at the phone. That's the thing.

Yeah, we unlock phones here because you get some truth in that phone.

Yeah, then that's fine. If I would've known that you unlock phones, I would've brought every single phone that we've had since we've been together. I have all of our phones.

Got it, got it, got it.

All of our phones. I would've brought every single one of them.

I think it's time to unlock the phone.

Sarah, we unlocked your phone.

All right, David, you wanna know if Sarah is talking with your former neighbor. She says she is not. My unlock the phone investigator searched her phone. This is things that are active right now and also things she deleted and found that Sarah is telling the truth. David, you wanna know if Sarah is texting with other men. She says she is not. My unlock the phone investigator searched her texts, both those in her phone and those that have been deleted and found that Sarah is telling the truth. David, you wanna know if Sarah is DMing any other men. Sarah says she is not. My Lock the Phone investigator searched her DMs and found that Sarah is telling the truth.

Okay, I love you. I love you and I like you.

Okay, then what happened that day at the little window?

Nothing. At the end of the day. And the thing is, the thing is. At the end of the day. I believe her.

At the end of the day, I appreciate you for apparently being able to hide it well, but that little window.

See, he refuses.

No, yeah, I refuse. He refuses.

He's not the only one that's refusing. You're also refusing. Refusing what? You're refusing to listen to the man that's telling you he does not want you.

No, that's fine.

No, that's not fine.

You're me, you're me. The accusation really is against me. Are you telling me I'm a liar and I'm not?

You're me, hear me. When a man has told you that he doesn't want you, that he doesn't believe you, It is not your job to convince him or to show him or to prove to him anything. It is your job to look at yourself in the mirror and say, do I believe me? Do I love me? And do I deserve to have someone speaking to me or treating me this way? See, the issue in this relationship originally was codependency that was predicated by drug abuse and also homelessness. And so now with that codependency, there also was some paranoia. And so that paranoia did leak into the foundation of your relationship. But the unfortunate part is that once you got clean, you start to figure out how to maintain a life together. The foundation was already broken. And so of course he doesn't know if you're being honest, just like you don't know if he's being honest as well.

I believe him. I think he's being honest all the time 'cause I came home.

No, hold on. Hear me out now. I took notes, so I tracked it. You do believe him now, but there was a period when you even said, "I don't know what he's doing." I'll know what he's saying as well. So now you have gotten to a place where you believe him, but he is not there. But the bigger issue is not the codependency or the paranoia that happened when there was drugs. It's the lack of respect and the lack of self-esteem that you have for yourself.

I gave him my, I gave him my whole heart. Like I didn't, when he told me that he cheated on me.

Let's stop focusing on that. Let me ask you a question. Let me ask you a question. How often do you give yourself your own heart? 'Cause everything about you that you're expressing is always outward. If you're gonna be on this show, we're gonna have a real conversation because if you're really trying to grow, instead of focusing on the relationship with him, you gotta focus on the relationship with yourself.

Yes. I don't understand why, like it's been going on for months, the accusations, accusations, accusations.

So what you're, I want you to listen to the narrative that you're telling. I just don't know why he didn't listen. I want you to listen You're talking about him and accusations. I'm asking you to focus on you. Why is that?

I just want him to just do it and grow up.

So hold on, hold on.

I'm gonna keep calling it out. I'm gonna keep calling it out till you hear me. You just did it again. I want him. I'm asking you, when are you gonna be able to focus on you? Why is it hard for you to focus on you in this moment?

Because I don't wanna.

It's okay.

I don't wanna leave him. My heart's breaking.

I want you to focus on you right now.

He's everything to me. I know that. I know I have to leave.

I want you to focus on you.

I just don't want to go. I just know I have to.

I have to go. What are you afraid of if you have to be with yourself?

I'm not afraid to be by myself.

Oh sister, you are. So we gotta be honest about it. What are you afraid of?

I've been by myself so many times. Like I know what it's like to be by myself. When we got together, I gave my whole entire heart and soul to him. I thought I broke down all the walls that I had and told him I was the last time.

So can I ask you a question? When was the last time you gave your wholehearted soul to yourself? I'm gonna keep asking these questions.

When I was in prison.

When you were in prison, what was the work you did?

I just got to know who I am.

Thank you for being vulnerable and sharing that time when you were in prison.

Because, and I know like, The last couple weeks that he's been gone.

So what I want you to do from now on, for the next 2 minutes while we're on the stage together, you can't say nothing about him. If you can't speak for yourself and about your own feelings, about your own self-worth, I want you just to be in your head. And this is not a punishment, this is an encouragement for you to see yourself as someone who needs to be talking about and focusing on themselves. Listen, I understand. Listen, I understand that you two found each other again in a vulnerable time, but this young man has clearly said he is moving on. Yes? Yeah. I know. He's ready. He's moving on. There's a 10-year age difference. You are 10 years older. He's a young man.

I know that.

He's a young man.

And I understand.

I understand. Your statement's only better be about you. I told you.

I understand. Because I was listening to a podcast and it was telling me I need to let go of the one thing that I hold on the most.

Good.

I have to let it go. And I just, it hurts. Good. It hurts so much.

Let me tell you something. I cannot tell you how proud I am that you just modeled that behavior.

It hurts. I gave you a task.

Those are the first steps for you to start healing and for you to start growing and for you to start focusing on what you need. This young man is gonna survive. You are going to be great. You are gonna find someone else to love you. But I would encourage you that when you get into another relationship, that you do find new and healthier ways to communicate your fears. You got some work to do yourself.

Yes, sir.

You got some real work.

Yes, sir. Okay?

Yeah. The best separately. And I'm hoping that you can hear the words that I said to you and the words that I said to you, and that you walk off this stage separate and not try to get back together.