In-Laws From HELL: Monster MILs & Savage Sisters-in-Law Caught on Camera | KARAMO

Around 4 or 5 years ago, I had a party for my wife. It was her birthday. Her mother had backed me in the corner, drugged me, and sexually assaulted me at the party. I woke up and she was on top of me with another one of her family members that I really couldn't see 'cause I was drugged. So my genitals was out and they was kissing me and hugging me. My wife's mother accuses me of trying to come on to her, but she was the one who assaulted me at the party.

4 years ago. What bar do you give her? 'Cause anything she do, she do it for herself.

Got it.

You ain't got no money to do nothing. Thank you for my 4 grandkids. That's about it. Other than that, he's a freaking bum. He ain't got no money. You can't keep a job over 90 days, okay? He need to leave the drugs alone. How about that? You talking about your marriage. Oh, your marriage is already over. You think you in love. That's not in love. Being abused is not love. Verbal, mental, or physical. That's not love. And that's what he does to her. So if he gonna tell a story, tell it right, 'cause I don't want you broke. Ass.

I hear you.

Okay. I'm not gonna be bothered with you.

Is he at least a good father?

I just said anybody could be a dad. It takes a man to be a father. I'm the man and the father.

You right, you told me, you right, you told me.

I'm sorry, y'all.

You right. I think it's time to meet your daughter's husband, Elvin.

Oh, he just sit his ass over there?

We're going to meet Elmer, and he's going to sit on that side of the couch. So everyone, let's say hello to Elmer. First and foremost, I have nothing to lie about.

I was sexually assaulted.

I was drugged. Can I say something?

No, you cannot. I stopped using drugs. I stopped using drugs a long time ago.

I smoke weed right now a little bit.

Ooh, you're freaking lying. Listen, excuse me.

Excuse me. Excuse me. I smoke weed right now.

Really? What about your Percocets you pop? Every day. What about then? 'Cause I broke my back. Oh really? Oh, you broke your back? If your back's broke, how in the hell you walking around?

It's a Karamo moment. Tara, Tara, Tara, I wanna hear his side. Let me hear his side. I didn't come to make it dead serious. Okay.

I'm on the verge of losing my wife. That bum shit. I'm far from a bum.

Take a seat for me. Let me hear your side. What about, so you're saying in this party that you feel like—

What party that you threw for my daughter?

Listen, at the end of the day, I don't wanna lose my wife or my kids. After my little experience, I told her to ask her mother a million times. Why would I keep saying this? Why would I keep saying it if nothing never happened to me?

I'm not gonna lie about that.

The only person who had keys to my apartment was her mother.

Oh no.

You're saying that at first, 'cause I'm trying to keep consistent with the story, that at first it was a party, but then you're saying she had keys to get in by herself? Listen. Karamo. So was there a party or not? I'm just trying to get this. Listen, my wife had a party. I could have said, I'm gonna throw you a party for your birthday because I know you ain't been feeling a little up to it or whatever. But you can listen, that you can ask about my ex-girlfriend, she come out. See what I'm saying?

I can't do this for her. Because you've lied so much, you can't even keep your story together.

Have y'all ever gotten along in your life?

Hell no.

It been days she came to me and said, son-in-law, and give me a hug that you doing a good job by the kids.

And that's when you had a job. Well, what are you gonna do with your job? I have to have a job to get your respect. No, you gotta keep a job to get my respect and keep a job to take care of my grandkids.

It's been 14 years that you and your wife been together.

Yes.

Why would you think that she'd wanna break you up? I mean, because of what?

'Cause her brothers. They ain't been together for 14 years.

I know her brothers, I know her sisters. The other son, I can call him right now. His number in my phone. He don't fuck with his mother.

Oh yeah? He don't fuck with his mother and he will come out and say, I don't fuck with my mother. Oh yeah? For your son to tell me that the one who you wanna stick on me when we going through something, to tell me that, man, I ain't got nothing involved to do with that.

Do you honestly think that she's the only issue in your relationship? Listen, and listen, I pass up everything I ever been through with her. I keep it so real that she know I keep it real. Have you ever cheated on your wife? No. Never? Listen, ever since I got married, I never cheated. Have I talked to a female on Instagram? Only on Instagram, yes. Yes, that's it. That's it, that's all.

And then when I got caught, I said that I would never do it again or I would never meet no black people.

So you don't believe that talking to a woman on Instagram is cheating? I mean, yeah, so I changed it. You feel what I'm saying? So the question was, did you cheat? And you said no, so you have cheated.

Listen, 'cause— Haha, contradictory as fuck. It's not funny though.

I'm just listening. I'm just trying to, I'm just taking notes. I'm taking notes to get both sides. So in your opinion, why are you so close to divorce? Because at the end of the day, It seem like that it doesn't matter what I do. Somebody in my wife ear, I can see the change in her. Can you explain to me from your opinion what's going on here?

So my mom and Elmer never got along.

Okay.

The reason being my mom thinks I deserve better, which I do. I've been through a lot with him. Cheating.

Oh, so he has cheated more than he said?

I can't just tell you that he had sex with somebody 'cause I don't know. But between the Instagram for the last 14 years, it never stopped.

Okay.

I wanna say he tried to stop 2 months ago, but that's not enough. We've been together for 14 years.

2 months ago, got it. What else has he been through?

Him been in jail. Mm-hmm. I went homeless just for my daughter to be with him. Mm.

And I heard there's drug use.

He take Percocets.

And so what do you think happened between him and your mom that night at the party? Was there a party? Because I found inconsistencies.

There was a party.

There was a party.

For my 25th birthday.

Okay.

And no, I do not believe my mother did nothing to him.

Got it.

So yeah, my mom have a key, but why would she come and molest you? Like—

Got it. So now there's a pattern here. So, and you don't believe that he did anything with your mom?

Hell no. Excuse my language, but what?

No, no, no, no. So do you think your mother is the biggest problem in your relationship?

My mother ain't no problem. She want better for her child. Like, that's what any mother gonna want, better for their child. Like, my mother seen me go, she seen me go through.

So what do you think the other issues are with Elmer?

He's controlling.

Has Elmer ever been a good partner?

Yeah, like we had good times, we had bad times, but the bad is outweighing the good right now.

So why did you marry him?

Because I love him. Like, I do love him and we have 4 kids together. It wasn't always bad, so.

Do you wanna make it work with him? Enough said. Well listen, let's bring Elmer back out to the stage right now so we can talk to him. All right, so I'm gonna disregard the party and the allegations. And the reason I'm doing that and I wanna do that here is because tracking this, We don't have clear evidence to make accusations like somebody sexually abused you. And I just wanna make sure that is, that's not saying that I don't believe you, but I would need more facts to go deep in that. But what I do have facts on is that you two in this marriage is not working. Do you still want this marriage to work? [Speaker] I love my wife. At the end of the day, I changed the whole, and she can really tell you honestly, I changed over a lot to be with my family and to be with my kids. I didn't have a father really growing up. So me and her sat down before anything, and me in particular, I said I will never leave my kids I was raised in a broken home. You feel what I'm saying? I get it. So I made a pact with her, you know what I'm saying? Like we really did that. Nobody, all I'm saying, 14 years.

You could have left me and moved on. Elmer, I have a confession to make. 3 weeks ago when we got into the big fight, you went through the diary, you seen that I had another man in our bed. Sorry to tell you, but it's true. I did have another man in the bed and I slept with him. I wanna tell you I'm sorry, but honestly I'm not because all the things you put me through the last 14 years. And I'm not gonna stop talking to the person 'cause you put me through so much. I just want all this to be over. Like, we could get the divorce and it is what it is.

Okay, here you go. What's going on in your mind? I ain't got nothing to say. She got it.

She got it. Just everything I've been through with him. She got it. It's like he forcing me to do that and I'm sorry that I'm not sorry, but it is what it is.

Yeah. I mean, hearing what you said has been the symptoms of your relationship. Of course, I will never excuse anyone, male, female cheating, but I do understand 14 years of being frustrated and tired. And if I've experienced it in 30 minutes and I'm exhausted, I can only imagine what you feeling in 14 years. So I wanna bring Elmer back out. Elmer, do you wanna come back out? Elmer, your wife's done. I understand. I totally understand.

I can't even get mad.

At the end of the day, I knew who I was coming for. We talked about it, no matter what, I wanted to work with her. You know what I'm saying? No matter what. She told me that day, she said they didn't go that far. You know what I'm saying? And I believed it. You know what I'm saying? I never had sex with another woman when we was in a relationship.

But don't nobody know that but you.

Okay, I'm telling the honest to God truth. That's all I wanna do is tell the truth. Yeah.

Making a video and doing it with another woman is cheating. Like, what are you talking about? Listen, listen.

I really admitted that I had problems in the past, but she really said and told you, Like she can tell you I've changed a lot of shit. I changed a lot of shit. All I wanna do is my wife. All I want is my wife and my kids, man. But you do understand how for her 14 years of frustration. But she say it haven't been like that for a whole 14 years. It have not.

Come on, let's be serious. It really has not. Let's talk. I didn't just go out cheating. Everything I've been through with you, you got problems with your hands and everything. I didn't just go out cheating. Come on, we not about to do that. Latarra, you done it too though, boo. Yeah, I hit you. Yeah, okay. I did.

Okay.

But what'd you do 3 weeks ago?

Then we got into an argument. I snatched her phone or whatever like that. So she started yelling. I grabbed her by her thing and I put my hand over her mouth just so the building and the people in the building wouldn't hear her scream.

What am I screaming for if nothing going on?

I'm done with this, man.

I'm 37 years old and my mother and my fiancé are both trying to control me. My mother and fiancé cannot get along and it's ruining my relationship. My mother says my fiancé is a deadbeat loser and thinks I deserve better. Sometimes I agree with my mom. I think she's right. I go to work every weekend 2 hours away because that's what works with my schedule and visit my mom. And I want my mom to be able to see my kids. And he accuses me of cheating. I go there to work and visit my mom. That's it. And I'm not cheating on him. I'm a sweet person. And he always acts like I have this attitude, and I don't. I'm not my mother. If he could only hear the things that she has said about him. My mom says my fiancé is controlling, a deadbeat, and not marriage material. They make me feel like if I choose either one of them, they're not gonna like it. And I don't wanna be in the middle anymore.

Well, we'll meet Tara shortly, but let's start with her mom, Colita, and hear her side of the story. Colita, thank you for being here.

Thank you.

I saw that was making you a little emotional.

What's going on? Oh yeah. I hate that she thinks that I'm trying to control, but they call me in the family, Suge Knight. Because anybody intimidates anybody in my family will get intimidated by me. Yeah.

Come on, sugar.

Yeah. And so, I— Gluel is not marriage material. He is 9 years older than my daughter, and they're in different lifestyles. He's already been where she's at now, and I don't like it. And I'm not gonna tolerate him mistreating my daughter because he tends to be very controlling master. He's a master manipulator. And he master manipulates her and she's very easily led. And he tells her I'm the meddling mom, but he's not gonna mistreat my daughter.

Got it, I hear that. Well, let's meet your daughter's fiancé, Lowell, hear his side of the story. So everyone, please welcome Noel to the show.

How you gonna come out here lying like that? First of all, you know damn well I take care of my kids and I'm always working. You talking about I don't take care and I'm manipulating? I take care of Tara, I work, and I was actually talking to Tara about moving to where we all live at so I could be closer to her, all right? And then I moved down and I gotta start dealing with you. You're the manipulator one, you're the controlling one, you're the one telling Tara what she needs to do, how she needs to live her life. Listen to yourself out here talking about I'm controlling just because I'm old? I'm not here to please you, I'm here to please Tara. Well, you're not pleasing Tara. Well, whatever, you had your time to talk, all right? I work hard, all right? I work hard for Tara. You're the one who want everything, it's you, you're the controlling one. No, my daughter needs to work and be independent. Okay, well, if she wants to work, if she wants to work, she don't need to drive 2 hours a day for a week and to make $12 an hour just to make you happy. She could make more money up in where we live at. And I'm willing to work. You asked earlier, we can split the time. If she wants to go work, I can stay home with the boys. And then when I'm working, she— Don't tell me what's— You don't even listen. You don't even listen.

Loel, I gotta ask you this. Take a seat for me. Thank you for being here. I gotta ask you this because you just made a point. You said that she could actually stay right in your own town and make the same amount of money that she's making now. Why is she not doing that in your opinion?

Because it's what her mom wants. And that's been the problem this whole time. What Colita wants. Don't nobody care. I don't care what you want. All right? I care about what Ty want. I don't care what you want. I care about what Ty want. You don't care about what Ty want. You don't care about what nobody want but yourself. She's not angry with you, Luel. Don't nobody care. You're too damn old. Whatever. How do you— how much you own? How much, you don't know none? Tara and I came with a decision that we were gonna be together, we were gonna find a life together, but she cannot get away from you. You got to put them talons in her like a dog.

So the age difference between you and Tara is only 9 years, correct?

Yes.

Okay then. So in your opinion, why do you think the relationship with her mother, Colita, is so bad?

Because I'm not what she wants me to be. In fact, we stopped talking. From what I hear, Tara said Khalida's the one that told her to call me 2 years later and we rekindled our relationship and got together, so it was her, and now she's not happy with what she said, she told Tara to do. I didn't know Luel, I had never met him. She had said she had met some— You damn lie, you met me before. No, when she started met you, I had never met you. She told me she had met a nice guy that had a job, that was working. So, okay, I didn't have a problem with that.

So you were like, just go back, go talk to her if you feel like it's gonna be something.

Money in her eyes, gold diggin', gold in his stash, right? That's all you cared about is money. You want somebody to take care of you, your family, and everything else. When I found out you had 3 baby mamas, that's toxic. Oh, is it toxic? I take care of all my damn kids though, all right? I'm a good father to all my kids, I'm a good father to my 2 boys. I never said nothing about you and your kids. You did, you out here lying earlier talking about I ain't no good father, I don't take care of my kids, but I'm there for them I gotta show respect, man. I never said that. You do.

What she expressed to me earlier, in all fairness, is she said that there was not enough support that you gave Tara when it came to these two children.

Yes, Tara. I've always given Tara support, but she's running up and down the road after you, and that's the problem.

So can I ask you this, Loyal? Why do you think that Tara is cheating?

Because in the beginning, when we first met, right, she didn't move up with me, right? But then when I would come visit, there was times I witnessed she's had pictures of a dude in her phone naked. Then there was a time I went to visit, we was staying in a hotel, and the guy texted, told me, hey, I enjoyed that kiss the other day. So I have proof that she— I never knew about that.

So there was a lot of trust for me in the relationship.

I never knew about that. Yeah, see, and you know about half of the stuff that you talking about.

Well, let's see what Tara has to say. So everyone, let's welcome Tara to the show.

What are you talking about? At least I'm here for my wife, Mike. At least I'm here for my wife. You're talking about your dad. I'm here, yeah, I'm here for my wife.

My woman though.

We're not here for that. This is what I'm talking about. Y'all put me in the middle all the time from day one. Tara, you know he doesn't talk to you respectful. Why would you put yourself through that? Because you keep being with him. The only respect I disrespect is you. I told you, you stay out the way. I told you, I just want to make your own decision. So it's wrong for me to tell my woman to make her own decision? She trying to be her own self? To stop listening to her damn narcissistic mother? I don't know what's right or wrong.

Hold on, can you both give me a chance? I gotta hear from Tara. I gotta hear from Tara. Tara, what do you want to happen today?

I want them both to stop trying to control me. Both of them.

'Cause you feel like they both say things to try to manipulate you and get you to do what they want.

Yes, they're both spiteful.

So you both hear that. She's saying it's not one or the other. She's saying it's both of your behavior. How does that both make you feel? Let's start with you. Go ahead.

I'm not trying to be spiteful, Karamo. I just—

I understand that you're not trying to, but your wife is telling you that she feels that way.

Well, if she's telling me that, then we need to talk some more when I get home so I can realize what I'm doing. But at the same time, I don't want to do that. I just want her to be happy. I want her to make her own decisions. I want her to stop listening to her mom. And what her mom thinks because her mom, she's got this twisted sense of reality. And Tara knows, Tara knows what I've done. Why don't you be kind to your mother?

Tara, can I ask you this? How's your relationship with your mother right now?

It's always been good, our relationship. She just has always guided me and told me what to do a lot of times. If I'm with a guy that she don't like, then she has to tell me has did her best to end it. Mm. Okay then.

So why did you agree to unlock your phone today?

Just to prove to him that I've been going just to work.

Got it. And do nothing else.

Yes.

Do you still wanna be with your fiancé?

I do.

But there's changes. Changes need to be made.

Yes.

Okay. Do you still love him?

I do.

Okay. Before I get into unlocking phones about their relationship, I'm gonna ask you to leave. And the reason being is because what I wanna model right now is that you gotta take a hands off. Whatever they're doing, it's her choice. She gotta be outside of your bubble. She has to be able to make her own choices and live her life. And if she decides later on, you know what, mom, I made the wrong choice, you can come back and you can say, I love you and support you. But if she says, you know what, mom, this is my choice and I'm happy about the choice, You gotta let it go and accept it.

Yeah.

So what I'm gonna do right now is I'm gonna say thank you so much for giving your perspective.

Okay.

It was really important for me to hear.

Okay.

But now I'm gonna talk to this couple.

Oh, okay.

Thank you so much. I appreciate you. Y'all come scoot down for me. I respect your mother. And again, I'm a third party, so I'm not in what y'all going through, but I understand and I see where this on the conflict. Y'all in a relationship, and what goes on between y'all is about y'all.

I got a phone call last month on my birthday from my sister that changed my marriage. She said that he was talking to women at work and being grimy, and I am not okay with that. I felt heartbroken. We have 3 children together. We've been together for 6 years. The man that I thought he was is not who he is. It's embarrassing. It's heartbreaking. That he could do this to our family. It still hurts. I feel like I married a stranger.

So how did you hear about Aaron flirting with the coworkers?

My husband, he actually works with Aaron in the same area, and there were multiple people coming up to him and telling him that Aaron is talking about being with other women and basically criticizing these other women and saying he's going to tap them and what he would do to them and sleep with them. Like, who even says they would tap them? Like, what is this, the 1980s? Like, grow up and treat a woman with respect, especially your wife.

You better preach, you better preach.

Like, it's crazy.

If your husband works with him, why would he even be so bold to say that at work?

I feel like Aaron thinks that he's all this and all that. And honestly, he's nothing but a lowlife who can't keep a job, can't support his family, and doesn't deserve my sister. She's amazing, she's beautiful, she's kind, and he does nothing but beat her down.

How did your sister react when you called her?

When I called my sister, she— I could see the look on her face. I video chatted her, and as soon as I told her, she her face just dropped and she was so upset and I could just tell how she felt, like she was outraged but she was so sad to know that he would do this to her. And honestly, it doesn't even surprise me because I've known Aaron like my whole life and I tried to warn her from the get-go that he's this way and that he would treat her like this, but I guess she didn't believe me.

So from your opinion, outside of him saying, "I wanna tap it," do you believe that he has Been cheating?

I do. It breaks my heart that he has beaten my sister down so much and broke her heart that I can't stand him.

Got it. Do you think your sister should be with him?

No, I absolutely think that they should be done. They should end it. I feel like Aaron would just go his separate ways and he honestly wouldn't even care if she did leave him.

Okay. Well, you know, we unlocked Aaron's phone. Do you think we're gonna find anything?

I do. I think there's definitely gonna be some stuff in there and I honestly can't wait to find out what is in that phone because my sister deserves the truth.

All right then. Well, listen everyone, I think it's time to meet your brother-in-law Aaron and get his side of this story. Aaron, come on out.

You see though, I haven't done shit.

You haven't done anything? No. Okay.

I honestly can't wait till you freaking show everything on my phone.

Do you feel like she's trying to break up your marriage? Yes. You do? Why?

Because she has been jealous of me and Kaylin from day one.

Got it. She gets mad because Kaylin's able to get pregnant. This one, she thinks that she gets pregnant even though she doesn't.

She's pregnant for not even a day and then the next day the test is positive, which I find funny.

So, so, okay. I'm not gonna go too deep in that because talking about her fertility issues, if there might be some, is a little bit too much. Yeah, I'm sorry, love. Here you go, here you go. No, no, no. Here you go. Here, take this napkin. Take this napkin. Here you go. Sorry about that. That was a pretty low blow for your sister-in-law. I can't stand her. Yeah. I've hated her since day freaking one.

Yeah.

She did make claims that you said you were having sexual conversation with your coworkers. Is that true? No, I did not. 'Cause she said that came from her husband who was a friend of yours and a coworker.

But see though, me and her husband don't work in the same vicinity.

Okay. What's the tattoo on your arm?

And has worked at Walmart for multiple times. Kailyn's initial.

You have her initial on your heart? Yes. Okay then.

What a joke, should be a broken heart. You're a joke.

So why do you think they're accusing you if you're saying that never happened? I honestly don't have the slightest freaking clue.

Why would all of these people come to us saying, like specifics. Well, why are there so many? There are specifics. Why are there so many different stories then? What stories? The specifics were that you were talking about sleeping with other women, what you would do to these women. No, have you? And about tapping these women. That's a weird word.

To use.

Like nobody uses that word anymore. Nobody. Like we're not old. We're 22, 23, and 24 years old.

Have you ever cheated on your wife?

No.

How have these accusations affected you?

It's pissing me off 'cause this is the first time that has ever happened in any of my past jobs.

Okay. And any of your past relationships, have you ever heard someone accuse you?

No.

No one. Now your wife is the one who called us and asked us to unlock your phone. Mm-hmm. Are we gonna find anything?

No.

Okay. Well, I think it's time to meet your wife, Caitlyn, and get her side of the story as well. So everyone, please welcome Caitlyn to the show.

How dare you do this to our family? And don't ever say that about my sister again. I don't care. I can't stand it. I don't care. I don't care. You're not gonna do it. I didn't do anything for or to Caitlyn. You have broken my trust. You have hurt our children. You've hurt me. I'm done. I'm done with it. You better not be lying to me anymore. I'm not. You better not. You better not.

Thank you for being here. Okay, so what happened when you contacted his female coworker?

She— I had asked her if she even like just knew him, and she told me at first that, you know, she had spoken to him. Yeah, like just coworker stuff, not a big deal. But it is a big deal because I had asked him, he said that he had never talked or was around them. So when she told me that, I confronted him and this one, she, I guess he'd never even spoken to her. But she told me word for word their conversation.

Got it. We have some of those messages that my producer wanted me to take a look at. Hi, could you tell me what my husband has been saying to you? How are you always smiling? I said, I'm not. It's just not been a terrible day yet, but this place can do that to you. Good luck. I don't know who that's from. Is that a message? He said, "There's two older women he tapped, excuse my language. I'm his wife. We have three young kids. He definitely said it was flirtatious talk with hints of sexual innuendos on his part. She's married with kids and would never cheat with anyone." So this woman is confirming that he made sexual innuendos or something, but the woman never did anything back.

Not that I know of.

Okay, what is your—

See though, in further messages it also says that I never even spoke to this bitch.

Okay.

No, no, no, no, no. That's what you told me. That's what you told me. That's also in your messages too that we didn't even speak. No, it is not.

How's this affected your family, Caitlin, and your children?

When I found everything out, I was devastated. I was hurt and it happened on my birthday actually. So I got the call from her and she had told me Yes. She had told me and obviously we started fighting and yelling and my kids hate that. They were crying, they were screaming. I took them away. I didn't want them to be in that because they don't deserve that. They deserve the best in life and not this. This is not what they deserve.

Have you ever suspected Aaron of cheating in the past?

Not like physically cheating, but he has done like internet things in the past, like on dating sites and looking at half naked women.

Yeah.

Which? Skinny women. Yeah, well, that doesn't matter to me.

Yeah. It does to me. Okay, is he a good husband, a good father?

He can be. He's not always been. He's working on it though. He has made some improvement, but not always, no.

Aaron, I gotta just talk to you because I'm watching your body language. I'm watching the way you're standing and I read everything and I'm watching just the intention behind your eyes as well. There's something going on with you you of where this aggression is coming from because this, it seems misplaced. I understand that you're upset about being accused and like you've heard me say before, like I have to listen to all sides and take your side, but there's something going on where you seem angry or there's something I'm missing here and I'm not getting it through this story. This is just me just staying calm. Okay, okay. I'm just sorry. My feeling and my intuition's always just, something else is going on there and I really hope to help you all because at the end of the day, there's a family here and we just saw your 3 beautiful kids. And so there has to be some resolution here. Do you feel like your sister is trying to break you two up?

No, I don't. I think she's just trying to be there for me.

She's trying to protect you. Yes. Good. Okay, so then why haven't you two talked? 'Cause she said y'all haven't talked in a long time.

I mean, we do. I'd like to hang out with her more. I'd like to be with her more, but— Like the other night. Yeah, that was amazing. We went to the hotel bar and we had— We had fun. I had to help her in the elevator.

Yeah.

We'll just say that.

Okay.

Yeah, I would like to associate with her.

Well, is Aaron the reason you don't see your sister too often?

Partially, yes.

Why?

He just doesn't like her and I don't like conflict, so I'm not gonna cause that conflict because I gotta hear about it at home.

So you're like, just to keep the peace, I'd rather not see my sister and just keep the peace at home.

Exactly.

Okay, well you called the show because you want to unlock his phone, correct?

Yes, I do.

Yeah, and you want to know if Aaron's been on any dating apps with other women, if Aaron's been calling any other women, and if Aaron's been texting other women.

Yes.

What will you do if we find something in his phone?

If I find something, we are done. I told him if he lied to me at all about anything, he could be going, he could tell me he's going here and he goes there, I'm done. I'm done. You did give him the chance. I did. She did. On the way here, she gave him the chance. She said, here's your last chance to tell me anything that we might find out fine, Aaron, because if we find something, it's done. And I really hope she sticks to that. Oh, I am, I'm serious.

Got it, got it, got it.

The reason why it's my business, because it's my son. Okay. Okay? This is why your son not gonna have a relationship, is because of you. This is exactly why. He's not, well, that'll be the best thing that ever happened to him. Yes!

Yes! Are you telling me that this interaction between Marianne is doing is affecting your relationship with Chris?

Yes, it is.

In what ways?

Because me and Chris could be sitting there in the crib, we'll be, first of all, I cook all the time, 'cause Chris does not know how to cook. That's something his mother should've taught her. But yeah, so anyways, we could be in there. Well, your mama should've taught you how to be a lady in the streets. Oh, I don't be in the streets, that's for one. For two, we could be in there laying down, chilling or whatever, watching a movie, whatever the case may be. Here come the mother calling, let me tell you about this son. Let me tell you this, and Chris be sitting on the phone for hours. They talk about nothing. They talk about coffee. What type of ground of coffee she like to drink. What is that? So we gotta stop. How would you know? You always on your cell phone texting other men. Actually not texting other men. Okay. After your son done cheated first. Okay, didn't my son video you talking to your baby daddy? I think that baby daddy is the father of Christine. That's not a problem. That's not a problem that I can't talk to my other child's father.

Hold on, so you're saying You're saying that his, Chris cheated first?

Yes, Chris did. Oh my gosh.

Did you know that?

That's why I started texting somebody. I ain't heard nothing like that. Yeah, I started texting somebody, but I never met up with this person. I never had sex with this person. It was just conversation. That's all.

Well, there's somebody else that is involved in this. Like you said, your child's father, and I think I'm ready to meet Chris.

If I'm the grandmother.

Hear what Chris has to say about all of this. Karamo, please welcome Chris to the show. Chris, nice to meet you, man. How you doing, man? I'm good. So do you feel like your mother has overstepped her boundaries in this?

Yeah, yeah, you know.

Diamond said that you intentionally trapped her with this baby. Did you?

You didn't? Yeah, I intentionally trapped you? You didn't? When did you feel trapped? Before or after I was buying the kids clothes? Or before or after he paid you to screw you? He didn't pay me.

Do you have evidence of Diamond cheating?

Yeah, yeah, yeah. Physically cheating? That I met up and I just had sex, I'm this big-ass hoe.

What is the evidence you have that is her being unfaithful?

Well, first of all, her son said, "We spent the night at Daddy house two days." That don't mean I had sex with him. After his birthday. That don't mean I had sex with him. The day on his birthday. But if you felt like I had sex with somebody that same exact day, what you did, Chris, when I came home? What you do?

I wanna go ahead and take a look at— But I got text messages though. I wanna take a look at what you found in Diamond's phone. These are the DMs that you found in her phone?

Sure is.

"I bet you won't send me no pics of that pretty thing when I come up. I'll see you later." I'm a blank. Give you some of this the whole she is. You always been playing Hope you really coming you talking about. Okay, hold on. So basically. Hold on. So you. But you sent this to another man saying that?

Yeah, it was just conversation. He lives all but not the conversation.

Talking about you gonna send me a.

We gonna have sex and I never sent no pictures. Show me a picture.

Okay.

Oh, okay.

When was this? How long?

That was in April.

And so you found these texts in her phone, Chris, right?

Yeah.

Oh, yeah. Okay.

Asking how far she had a phone. She told me she cheated. She told me she cheated on him before and that she was sorry. No, no, no, no, no, no lies. You said you broke up with me. Chris broke up with me and I came and I told Chris myself that I slept with my baby father that time, didn't I, Chris? Don't lie.

Oh, so hold on.

Oh, okay.

I gotta back up because earlier when we talked about behavior, you said, yes, I go to my baby father's house because we're just friends.

No, but this is way, this is before when I was staying with my sister.

But you said that there was just friends, but prior to that you had a relationship while y'all had kids.

Oh yeah, that's my son's father.

But you slept with him?

Yeah.

Okay, okay. But do you understand how that can cause trust issues?

Yeah, that can.

Okay then. Chris, you sent a picture of you and her best friend?

Chris sent that to me of him in a hotel with my best friend after he got done screwing her and they took a picture and sent it to me.

Okay, so let me back up. So Diamond, you're telling me that you brought proof here of Chris sleeping with your best friend?

Yeah, he took that picture and he sent it to me. He said 'cause I was a disrespectful hoe, that's what he went and did.

What?

But I never did anything after this. That's when I started talking to the boy.

Chris, so you said you slept with her best friend?

It wasn't even like that. It wasn't like that.

This say 4:55 AM.

I mean, it happened, but it didn't happen like that, you know?

So did you sleep with her best friend?

Yes or no? Yes. Yeah, yeah.

And then you sent your child's mother a photo saying you disrespectful.

And that's what he did.

I mean, technically that's my ex-girlfriend. Okay, are you still communicating? Are you still communicating?

I don't communicate with her. I don't. Me and her, it's just, it's like a hi and bye.

So how many times in this relationship have you cheated and how many times have you cheated?

Oh, Chris was cheating since we got together 'cause his baby mother still stayed downstairs from me. He was downstairs with her almost every day, wasn't you?

So you're both, 'cause I see on here y'all are both 27 years old.

No, Chris is like 38. I'm 27.

Okay. She's 27. Chris, how you acting? You 38, almost 40, and you got you doing this?

She knew I was a polygamist when she got with me.

Okay, okay, listen, it's one thing about that, but at almost 40, as 40-year-old to almost 40-year-old, how you sending photos like that? Like that's the stuff we did when we in our 20s and 30s.

Thank you.

Listen, we have the DNA truth right here in this envelope. Maryann, you are questioning if this is your grandchild, so this is your truth to open. So let's find out.

Yes, let her open it.

Is there anything you wanna say?

Yup, she gonna apologize to me and my child soon as that proves that Chris, you are the father. Listen, honey. Go on ahead. I already know I'm the father. Go on ahead. What's gonna happen is you gonna walk off this stage On this stage screaming and crying. Go ahead, open it up. Go ahead, really. You brought this on yourself. Open it up. What's taking so long? The things that you've done to my son. You are the laziest woman I ever seen. You run the streets all the time.

Marianne, let's find out because that's gonna be the thing that's going to give you the clarity.

Yeah.

Because this is really what you wanna know because if this is not your grandchild, you don't have to deal with her ever again.

Exactly.

But if this is your grandchild, then we have some work to do.

You're gonna see me forever. If it is.

You ready for this? This is your truth to open. Are you ready?

Not really. I'm waiting to hear. She don't look like my— Could you just open it up?

I know. What does it say, Marianne?

I don't have— What it say, Ma? What it say? What it say? Open it up, Chris. Oh, my fault. In the case of Christina, Maryann, you are the grandmother. Oh, hallelujah! Hallelujah! Like I said, nope, nope, nope, nope, nope. I'm sorry. I'm sorry. I'm so sorry, baby. I'm so sorry. Well, now that we got that out the way— We're going to work on this. We're going to work on this. Oh my God, I'm so embarrassed.

I am so embarrassed. Okay, yeah, okay. So you got your results? Yeah. Okay, I just heard what you said. So you said we gotta work on this?

Yeah, yeah. Work on it?

Ain't no working on it.

You put us through too much. Exactly. This drama with this DNA. So now you got the results. Like you said, you gonna take your baby shopping. I want you to take your grandbaby shopping.

Well, Marianne, hold on. The question is Marianne was already being a grandmother. That wasn't the question here.

She better come see my baby.

But she, okay.

When the last time she had her? When I watch her, what she do? Scream.

That's not her home. We're gonna take her. Because now that you have your results, now you understand this is your grandchild. You do understand how— 'Cause I'm not doing this anymore. How the way that you've treated your grandchild and treated your grandchild's mother has been affecting. Is there anything that you wanna say about that? Because I get it, you got a mouth on you, you feisty. I understand this isn't your personality, but what I can also tell is that there's a loving woman in there. There's a woman in there that understands the value of being in a child's life, that understands, 'cause you raised a son, that you've been there. You understand the importance of family. And now your family is torn apart because a lot of your behavior.

Yes, it is.

So is there anything you wanna say to Diamond?

Diamond, I'm sorry. I really am, truly from my heart. I really, I do love you. I don't like you, but I love you. I don't like you either. I don't like you either, but— I do love you. I've always loved you, but I've never liked you, okay? And there's a big difference. You can love a person, but you don't necessarily have to like that person.

See, but see, but so this is what I wanted y'all to both understand. In the moment where there could be growth and start healing, anytime you put a caveat of like, I love you, but I don't like you, all you're doing is putting yourself backwards. We understand that there has been tension here. We understand that there have been words said on both parties. We understand there's been disrespect. Of course, there's gonna take time for you all to like each other, but that's not a necessary thing.

Unnecessary thing to say here. No. Listen. Sometimes we as parents, and when we become grandparents, we do everything we can to protect our children. I have 3 children in the cemetery. Okay? I buried 3 kids, you understand? This is my beloved son, all right? He's been here for me. We all we got. Okay, okay, okay, pause. All right, so.

We're gonna pause, but before you say that, the reason she's having these type of dialogues about, first of all, thank you for sharing that about your other kids because it makes me understand more of why there's protective behaviors here because you've lost children and so therefore now, and I can't imagine what that's like, now you're always gonna hold on. But what happened, what you did, and this is unfortunate. Yes, you have a close relationship with your mother, but one thing as grown men we gotta understand is you have to understand the boundaries of what you share and what you don't share. Because the minute you let your mother into your relationship, of course she's gonna have this reaction. That is your direct fault. You started telling your mother the issues y'all were having, you're arguing. I'm sure you got a friend, a colleague, somebody your own age that you could talk to because you have to understand just because you move on and then you still wanna lay up, that doesn't mean she gonna move on.

Answer, that's correct. I have a mother-in-law. I just recently got married in July and so I'm pregnant also, but— Congratulations! Thank you. Thank you. But we were, we're having relationship issues now.

Okay.

And I'm not sure how to like go about it. Like I'm a family-oriented person. My husband is very close with my parents. Like, they love him, he loves them. Like, my dad and him work together, so like, they very close. But me and his mom mainly, you know, with me having a girl and her— my due date is very close to her birthday, I want to try to get things back to how it used to be. Like, we used to go out, we used to go have drinks, like, we used to have fun. And like, I think Once I think her son got serious with me and was like, yeah, this is serious. Like I wanna marry her, I wanna have kids with her. Our relationship changed completely. So I don't know, I don't know how to go, I don't know if I should talk to, and I've tried talking to her, I've tried calling, texting, being the bigger person, but I don't know. Like I wanna support my husband 'cause I know he wants his mom. With our child and everything.

Well, I'll tell you this. First of all, congratulations on the child.

Thank you.

Secondly, the willingness to want a relationship is the most important thing. 'Cause that was gonna be my question to you. So I'm glad you answered that. Because if you were just saying, I feel like I need to have a relationship 'cause she's my mother-in-law, then that's a different story. Right. That way I would've encouraged you and told you, you don't need to have a relationship, you just need to set clearer boundaries.

Right.

But since you want a relationship, which is what I'm hearing, is really important and the relationship was once good, I have to tell you, it's actually not your job to be texting her anymore. It is now your husband's job, not your boyfriend, your husband's job to say, Mom, my wife would like a relationship with you and I need to know from you what is the issue so that I can broker this relationship. See, what you've been doing right here, which is what I try to teach people all the day, you've been filling in the blanks. You started filling in the blanks saying, well, maybe she don't like me because I got serious. Things have changed because of this. When we fill in the blanks, we keep ourselves in a cycle of confusion and not understanding what's going on. So you need to get clear answers, but you've already tried, so it's not your job anymore. You gotta release it. The person whose job it is is the person who made a vow to support you in happiness and health. It is his job to say, Mom, I need these relationships to be good. I need you to step up and talk to my wife. I need you to tell me what the issue is so that we can work together as a family. To make this work better. So I would tell you right now, is your husband in the audience with you?

Yeah, he's here.

Where he at?

Hold on, don't be shy.

No, bring, bring, come over here. No, come on cousin, bring, come over here. No, no. Okay, what's your name? Dion. Dion, Dion, grab the mic. Okay Dion, did you realize that your wife wanted to have a relationship with your mom? Yeah. Okay then. And so how old are you? You're young. 21. See, you're young, I know. So let me tell you something. At 21, it can be uncomfortable to say, let me get in the middle of something. Let me speak up. But you're at a point now where you're a husband now, you're about to be a father. And so what you have to model is the strength to say, if communication is ever lacking in my home, I gotta step up and be the one to fix it. And so right now communication is lacking. And the best thing you can do as a man, as the father of your house, is to make sure that everyone is communicating in harmony. So when you get home, you need to say, "Hey mom," don't do this over the phone, do a face-to-face. Is she near y'all? You can close by? No.

About an hour.

Okay, then we can do FaceTime. Usually I like you to say face-to-face so she can see the seriousness in your face. And I need you to say to her, "Mom, I need this relationship to be better. I need y'all to communicate." And then ask her directly, "What is your issue?" Now I'm gonna give you this one pro tip. Whatever she say to you, don't come back to your wife with. Okay. Okay. Yeah. Yeah. Because again, your job is to make sure there's healthy communication, not to be a gossip. Okay? Okay. So because your mother might have feelings that she's still processing and you go tell her, now she pissed and now they, uh-uh. Give people an opportunity to process their feelings. This is a tip to you as a man. Okay. By saying, what is it? Once she tells you, say, okay. If it's something that's, you know, is like farfetched, say, process that, I'll help you. But get over that so we can connect, all right? Okay. This is your job now. Yes, sir. And I believe you can do it. You think you can do it? Yes, sir. All right, there we go.

There you go. You picked a good one.

Good, good. All right, good luck. I need y'all to, I need you to email me and let me know how it goes, all right?

I definitely will.

All right, good, cousin. Thank you. All right, perfect. Thank you so much. You're welcome.

Tiffany is the love of my life and I cannot wait to marry her. The biggest problem in my relationship right now would be Tiffany Mama Felicia. Felicia and I have been going at it for 2 years straight. I don't know, I don't think she never liked me. She's always talking about my kids, she's talking about me. She tell Tiffany X all of our business. When I heard Tiffany Mama wouldn't come to the show, I just felt like she wasn't woman enough to come to me and talk to me about the situation we have going on.

We will talk to Tiff and Nisha shortly, but let's start with Felicia to hear her side of the story. So welcome to the show, Felicia. Thank you. So what do you think about what you just heard? I know that laugh.

Well, I'm Tiffany's mom.

Mm-hmm.

What's her name? Tanisha.

Oh, mm.

'Cause I really don't know her. I know nothing about her for 2 years. Excuse me. So I'm getting a little emotional 'cause I seen that. I didn't even know they was engaged, but let's roll this video.

Oh, you didn't? You just found that out?

Yes.

Wow, okay.

Yes.

So how do you feel about Nisha? You feel like you don't know her?

I don't like her.

You don't like her?

No, I do not.

Why not? 'Cause she thinks you don't like her about her kids or something about her. What about her?

I don't like Nisha because she's very disrespectful. Disrespectful. When she first met me, we were at my house. She did not even speak to me. So from then, no, I did not like her. She tossed it.

What was her reason not to speak? Because I mean, we grew up in a house, you walk in, you speak to everybody, you say hello. That's just manners.

Yes.

Yeah. And you're her fiancé's mother as well. So what was her reasoning behind that?

'Cause I like her, Tiffany's ex.

Oh, got it. Okay. So do you approve of their relationship?

No.

No. And why don't you approve of it?

It's toxic. Very toxic. Very toxic. They argue too much. Uh-huh. They don't know how to talk and communicate with each other.

Uh-huh.

Tiffany's not ready to really get married yet. Tiffany have a lot of growing up to do. Tanisha have a lot of growing up to do. She don't, the reason why she don't speak to me because I let her know how I feel about Tiffany. I love Tiffany. Me and Tiffany have a close relationship. Well, we had a close relationship. And me and Tiffany don't even talk like we used to. And the reason why I don't talk or text Tiffany because Tanisha will have her phone and text me back. Like I'm thinking I'm talking to my daughter, I'm talking to Tanisha.

[Speaker:KARAMO] So what did Tanisha text you?

One text when I said, "So how you doing? You know my birthday coming up." And I did say, "Don't bring her." And she said back, "Oh well, Mommy, if I don't bring her, then I can't come." I know that wasn't my daughter.

Did she call you drunk in a text once?

Yeah, she said, "You's a drunk and Tiffany gets that from you. You don't know how to parent it, but I'm gonna help Tiffany get off drinking." I said, "Girl, you don't know me." I don't drink like that, and if I did, that's my business.

Yeah.

'Cause you ain't, you gonna talk to me, I'm not, we're not here.

Yes, of course.

I'm here.

Yes.

I'm Tiffany, Mom.

You're Mom. This sounds like it's really, really deeply affecting your relationship with your daughter.

It is.

Wow, okay.

It is. Sorry.

No, no, you're fine. Here you go, love. Here you go.

Thank you. You're welcome.

Well, I think it's time that we hear Nisha's side of the story. So everyone please welcome Nisha to the show. Hey Nisha, how are you doing?

Hey Karamo, how you doing?

I'm good. Thank you for being here.

Thank you for having me.

So do you feel like Felicia is the biggest problem in your relationship?

I do.

Why?

Felicia, like she say I disrespect her, but she disrespect my relationship. And you did know me and Tiffany was engaged. I never know you. Tiffany told you, and you told her, don't bring that girl around me. You and Tiffany said y'all was married. No, Tiffany proposed to me. Tiffany proposed to me in front of my mama, and she wanted— in front of your mama? Yeah, she wanted to tell her mom too. This is why I don't like her. When she came along, me and her— me and Tiffany relationship is like— you never gave me the time of the day. You never— she— this woman has judged me even before this woman? Miss Felicia has judged me since day one, even before I even— when we went to, um, Tiffany's sister house to pack Tiffany clothes so we can move back to— I did, I spoke to you and your husband because who not gonna speak? This is your mom. I did speak to you. I did speak to you.

So from your recollection, you think she didn't speak? She did not speak. From yours, you're like, I did speak. I might have been in a mood.

To her and her husband and her sister, like, before Before I even met Tiffany, Mom, she has been judging me. When Tiffany first came down to just visit me. Tiffany was with her ex, cheated with you, and you know Tiffany was with her ex. I didn't know Tiffany was, no, I did not know Tiffany was with her ex.

So Tiffany cheated and that's how y'all got together?

On a dating app. No, no, I met Tiffany off this app. How am I supposed to know Tiffany was in a relationship or anything? Me and Tiffany literally stayed on the phone, y'all. For 30 days straight. We started over together. At the end of the day, I love Tiffany, you love Tiffany, of course that's your daughter. I won't, who wouldn't want to have a bond with their, 'fence to be mother-in-law? But then I can't. You're disrespectful. I tried, I text Felicia. You ain't text me nothing. I text Felicia so many times. If she would apologize, maybe we wouldn't be here. I did, I did apologize.

And what do you wanna apologize for, for that first meeting She's the first meeting being disrespectful, telling me that I wasn't gonna be a good parent.

Can we talk? 'Cause I heard you when I was back there.

Well, to make things more complicated, there are trust issues between Tiffanysha. So we're unlocking phones, right? Today as well. So why do you have concerns Tiffany may be cheating?

I don't think Tiffany is cheating, but I know Miss Felicia uses her ex to, you know, and of course Tiffany never hide anything from me. She never hide nothing from me. So if you saying that, oh, she was talking to the girlfriend, the ex-girlfriend at the time, or she still be talking to her, then— I didn't say still talking to her. You mixing my words up. And don't go telling Tiffany I said that. What I said was Tiffany was talking to her girlfriend then, at that time. What's all going on now, I haven't talked to Tiffany in 2 years. Almost 2 years. I wanna know, when men say that, Tiffany got together, was she still with her ex?

Because this is something that I didn't know that, because you're confused by this, right? Her mother's saying that.

So is it your mama or is it you? Who is the problem?

Well, I think it's time to meet Tiff, right? Yeah. So everyone, please welcome Tiff to the show so we can hear her side of the story. Hey Tiff, how you doing?

I'm well, how you doing?

I'm good, thank you for Thank you for being here. So how do you feel about the situation?

Hello. Hey, Mom.

You two look alike. That's your twin right there. So do you get involved when your mom and Nisha are arguing?

When they did argue, I did try to get involved. I tried to intervene. But as you know, this is my mother, this is my fiancé. Are you scared of me? What? Are you scared of me? Scared? No. Okay, that's all I wanted to know.

No.

Don't we have a relationship that's all? A very good relationship. A strong relationship as well.

So what do you wanna say about the situation?

I think that they should figure this out because it is messing with our family dynamic.

So were you discussing moving in with your ex after your engagement?

No.

Okay, just wanna make sure.

Moving in with her? Were y'all together when me and you got together? No. We were not in a relationship.

My mother had said that.

I was talking to several, I'm gonna be honest, I was single. So I was talking to several different women during that time. That's when I met Nisha while I was still talking to other women.

So why does your mom not like your fiancé in your opinion?

Because of the one night where they had the disagreement. I think that stems and nobody ever tried to communicate it. I mean, I tried to intervene, but it just wasn't working 'cause neither—

And this is that first night when she said she didn't like him?

That first thing.

Keep it real, Tiff.

Right. When you came to Pennsylvania, Nisha did not speak when she came in the house. For whatever reason— I didn't speak? No. Ma, you're right. Listen, when you walked in, we were already in. She was about to get in the shower and stuff. She did say hello to you, your husband, and my sister. And your husband, Tiffany. Okay. I'm gonna be honest. I want you to be honest. I am. She did speak, Ma. We did have a long— We drove 14 hours straight. We didn't stop at a hotel, nothing.

No, that's not—

She got in the shower, she did all of that there, and we had an argument prior to getting there. But that ain't got nothing to do with me. It doesn't, and she should have changed it. Your relationship and your argument don't have nothing to do with me.

So can I ask you this? Why didn't you tell your mom you were engaged?

Why didn't I? Yeah, I did tell my mother I was engaged through a text message. So I was wrong? I said it through a text. I said, Mom, you said you married— I'm thinking about marrying Anisha. I have a round body shirt in the car. You and Nisha have like this and said, you said, I am married. I was actually looking to propose. I didn't say engage. I said I was looking to propose to Nisha, and he was like, don't bring her around me. I didn't want to pause and get being engaged to Nisha because I knew my mom wasn't going to be on board. I want my mom on board 100%, but I still have to live for me. I can't still— but I want to be on board with you.

Have you cheated on her? No. So how do you feel about what you just heard? Well, I feel that it's crazy because I feel I'm in between it. Uh-huh. So what happened the night your wife was arrested?

Well, the night she was arrested, she told me to, when her mother come, to give up her mother the keys and go to my mother house, and that's what I did.

Glenda, why did you move over right now?

No, because I don't want him to sit next to me. I don't want that next to me.

Why do you want him not to sit next to you?

Yeah. What, she's accusing me.

So has Virginia ever said, I gotta ask you directly, has Virginia ever said or made inappropriate gestures to you?

No, she did not.

Never?

Never.

Not once?

Not once.

So what happened to your phone last year?

After my phone last year, I mean, with this situation going on, she broke the phone and the only time we communicate is through a payphone.

Okay, why did you break it?

Because I don't trust him.

Got it, okay.

Text him? I never text him. I don't trust him.

How do you communicate with people when you out there? Through a free phone. Okay. So why you feel like you caught in the middle? Because of the situation with her and her mother, what they going through, so she— So why don't you just say clearly, since this is your woman, say it did not happen, dead it. Stop saying this, it did not happen. Why you gotta say that, bro?

I let my wife know that I never I never looked at her mother in no type of way, no form, no fashion.

Does he say that to you?

I mean, he doesn't. It makes it seem like he don't really say much.

He doesn't say much.

He doesn't seem like it's real.

Got it. You're naturally a soft-spoken, sort of more timid male. The reason I'm saying that is because that's part of the issue here, because you're not asserting your dominance to assure your wife that nothing's happening. And so in a sense you are caught in the middle because you could dead this. You could let your wife know immediately and forcefully, not in any way physically violent or anything in that way, but say, listen, I love you. If I was your man and I said this to you right now, listen, I love you. I am not messing with your mother. I'm not doing nothing with her. It's me and you. Stop this BS. Would that resonate with you?

I don't know.

Yes, it would. I know for a fact it would.

If it would've been from the get-go.

From the get-go, I get that, I understand. But now it's lingered for so long.

Yeah.

I get it. So I wanna know from you, when did you start having these trust issues?

From that day.

From that day? I think it started before then. But you know what we gotta solve right now is I do wanna unlock the phone because we need to find out if there is something here to start this getting back concrete.

Thank you.

All right, it's time to unlock the phone. Virginia, we unlocked your phone.

Yes. Lovely. I have nothing to hide 'cause I don't do nothing wrong.

Well, Glenda, you wanna know if your mother has been sending inappropriate text messages to your husband. Your mother says she is not. My locked phone investigator searched her texts and found that she's telling the truth. Glenda, you wanna know if your mother has ever secretly met up with your husband when they visit NYC. Your mother says she has not. My Unlock the Phone investigator searched her GPS and found that she's telling the truth. You want to know if your mother has been receiving calls from your husband via Link NYC. Your mother says she has not. My Unlock the Phone investigator searched her phone and found she's telling the truth. So from what we can see and see She's searching her phone, there is no communication.

I told you, that hurts me, you know? You're saying sorry now, but if you continue, you're on your own, 'cause I want your love as a daughter, and I'm a mother, not a mother whatever, okay? I love you dearly, and you gotta give me more respect and stop degrading me in this space and talking all that shit. Same for you, and the same for you, and the same for me, and the same for you. So don't say that you don't respect me. No, no, no, no, I do it to you because you disrespect me. You talking to me in front of everybody and staying quiet. You learn how to respect me, I respect you.

When you were a kid, you said y'all didn't have a good relationship.

It was, I mean, maybe till like the age of 13.

13.

'Cause she wanted to do what she wanted to do.

What happened at 13 from your perspective?

Okay, let's talk. I was on my own basically. No.

Why were you on your own?

'Cause she wanted to go.

What?

I really don't wanna go there.

You don't wanna go there? Yeah. Okay, so I'm gonna tell you. No, no, no. This is why I said we don't have to go there. But no, 'cause this is what I know. At the end of the day, yes, I see disrespect and you do deserve respect as her mother now. But what I do know to be true is that at 13, something happened where she felt disconnected from her relationship with her mother. And I don't know this story, so I'm not gonna come down on you, but what I do know is that I'm looking at two children who never got something from their mother that they needed at some point in their life. And I said you as well, because to hear your mother say things about you, I feel sorry for you as well. Your job is to do this as a parent. I'll leave the door open whenever you want. Whenever you want, I'm here. Whenever you want. You've been vindicated today that you're not sleeping with her husband.

I never.

I got that. So now that that is cleared, you will someday have to trust that your mother is willing to hear you. And I know that's hard for you because that's why all of this trust and things have come up because you don't feel like she would hear you and it's broken the trust at some point. I know it, I don't know what it is. And I'm not, you can make the faces. No, no, no, no, no, no, no, I'm just— Because I'm not coming down on you. Not on you, not on you, it's just that it's true. It's frustrating, I get it. But I'm just trying to tell y'all, since I can't go there, at some point the healing has to happen. At some point. And you have to believe that she's gonna be open and she's gonna be there to listen. And when that day happens, you can't say, "Ah, ah." You just gotta be patient and just be there. That's it. But I wish y'all the best of luck. I really do. Because I see a lot of pain and I wish that y'all had an opportunity to heal this. But your mother's right. The only thing that's gonna start this healing journey is you opening up. So when you're ready, she's willing. All right? Do you believe this relationship can be fixed between you two?

I don't know. Personally, the last thing, and it was like the last straw for me, she had questioned me, and this was the last time we went out to eat. Together, she started asking me if I'm legal, if my parents are legal. And, you know, I'm a first-generation American, so for me that was super sensitive topic. And I wasn't like trying to make a big deal out of it, but I went home and my dad has like a noticeable accent. So I asked him— he's been in the USA for over 50 years— so I asked him, has anybody asked you if you're legal? If you're a citizen of the USA. And he said, Carla, that's a really weird question. Nobody should ever ask that. And then that got me thinking. I was like, she's asking these questions not to get to know me because she's never said, hey, Carla, what do you do for fun? Hey, Carla, let's meet up and go out to eat since you're in town. And she's never made that effort. And when I try to be a grown adult and tell her, Hey, you know, like this is what bothered me, let's fix it. She started getting defensive and telling me that I wasn't Christian, I wasn't this, I wasn't that. And I even gave her my phone number and I said, you know what? Just call me so we can fix this. And she never did.

Let's meet Carla's sister-in-law and hear what she has to say. Shaylee, come on out. How you doing? Nice to meet you. Nice to meet you. You look beautiful.

Thank you.

Both of y'all just, hey.

I match you.

Yes, you do. All right, so Shaylee, we heard what Karla has to say. She said that basically there's issues because in a sense you're bullying her about her body. In a sense, you're also bullying her about where her family comes from. What is your perspective on that?

I wish this was a conversation that we could have had on our own together. But I had reached out multiple times to you. And I remember one specific time when you came into town, I said, hey, can we meet up for coffee? It's really important for me to have a good relationship with my brother. And it would mean so much to me if you could tell me what I've done to you. 'Cause you were telling my whole family I did something that you couldn't forgive me for. And I didn't know what that was. I never said that. I never once said I couldn't forgive you because your mom told my husband that I didn't forgive you. Like saying that I hate you. I said, where are these words coming from? I never once said that. And you never have. I never have this text message saying that you wanna go out with me. To begin with, I think I have the right upper hand to say like, I tried to have this adult conversation with you and you got very defensive and I didn't know what else to do. I said, why am I gonna have this conversation again? Is it because I'm married to your brother?

Do you have a problem with Carla being married to your brother?

I do not have a problem with Carla being married to my brother because I want my brother to be happy. I am, however, very sad because since the beginning of them being together, my relationship with my brother has dissipated. And I wish that I could state my side to everything that was claimed here, but I have a whole completely different side. I have a different story.

So then what are your issues with Carla? You tell me.

From the beginning, I've tried to be friends with you. I've tried to have some kind of connection with you. I remember the very first time where you had complimented my brother and said how great of a husband he was and how awesome of a person he was. And again, we're married and you— Right. And I said, and I said, I agree, Jeremy's awesome. And then I found out later that you were offended by that because I didn't say anything about you, but I didn't know you. No. No, that wasn't that. Okay, well that was the first— That wasn't ever anything about that. Okay. No. That was the first issue, and then I feel like things got brought up to me later on. The whole conversation that we had where I asked if you were legal, that has been stretched to a different proportion. You were talking about your family in Peru. No, no, no, no, no. Let me talk to you. No, no, no, you don't ever, ever, ever ask somebody if they're legal. Hey, Tess, you, me, don't do that. You can't do that. That is insane. I don't know who taught you you can do that, but that is not okay. Context is important in this conversation, and let me say why. Because you were talking about your family in Peru, and you were saying how they wanted to come to this country, and they wanted to become legal citizens. No, I never said that. I never said that. This was a conversation we had at Starbucks that day. My family is, they do have a citizenship where they can come. So you're, I think you're remembering things wrong.

So I wanna hear about this slow chat.

Well, we clearly have two different sides.

Because I wanna know, so what she did say as well is that you were shaming her about her body.

Yeah, and I do not even remember that conversation. I would literally, my entire message, I'm a body positive plus-size fashion YouTuber. My entire message, my entire message is about loving our bodies as they are. I would never purposely, ever purposely hurt somebody in that way.

Ever.

And I'm sorry. Like, I really am sorry that you felt that way. I wish that you would've like said it in that moment. Like, hey, when you say that, that means that. But I had no idea this entire time. Yeah, because the thing was we were married at the time and you started asking him questions. Does Carla work out? What does she eat? I don't remember asking these questions. Okay, but do you realize when you ask these questions, it makes me question my own body. How are you gonna make someone feel that way? And then have the nerve to be a body positive influencer. It makes no sense. It really doesn't. And I agree with you.

Shaylee, my producers told me that you said that sometimes you've been discriminated against.

Yes.

Have you ever been shamed by Karla?

Secondhandedly, I guess, yeah. I mean, there was a public figure that had made a video basically bashing plus-size people and the body-positive community. And I had conviction in my heart to make a video about it. So I posted a video and all I'm doing in this video, as you can see, is like rubbing my stomach and embracing my body for what it is. Because I'm proud of myself. Like, it's taken me a very, very long time to get to a place where I am happy with myself. And I have too. I took a long time and you made me realize live a trauma that I wasn't meant to relive. I'm so sorry, I really never meant for you to feel that.

I wanna know what happened though when you said you posted this video in response to this person who made a video and you said, I'm loving myself and then what happened?

And then this person who has millions of followers actually made a response to me. Was not expecting it at all, but it happened and I was scrolling my phone and all of a sudden I was hit with thousands and thousands and thousands of comments, messages, all of these.

You don't have to worry about getting kidnapped, we don't want you. Oh my God.

Fat shaming comments, like tons and tons and tons of fat shaming comments.

So what did Carla do in that moment?

She had liked that person's post. Mm-hmm. Yeah. And my response to that was, I have tried so hard, and my side, I feel like I have tried so hard to make amends with you.

You can't swipe by that 'cause you nonchalantly just said yes, you liked a post.

Yeah, I did.

But if you felt pain and hurt, she's getting attacked online, we all know what that can feel like. Why would you then like it?

'Cause I was hurt. Hurt people hurt people.

I get that. But that still doesn't make it right.

No, it was wrong and I'll own up to it.

Because the thing is she's trying to own up to her behavior and saying like, I'm sorry. And from my perspective, 'cause I'm on the outside and you asked for my help, it seems like you don't want to hear her. And so what I really do want to start, and I think a great baby step is to at least apologize to each other for shaming each other on their body. You made comments about how she was eating that made her feel uncomfortable. And you liked to post when she was being bullied about her body online. So can you both apologize to each other for that and allow that to be the first step?

I'm sorry. I didn't realize. I appreciate that. I didn't realize I hurt you like that.

Yeah.

I would never do that on purpose. Thank you. That means a lot. That means a lot. I appreciate that. I'm really sorry that I know that what I did hurt you and I didn't mean it to hurt you. I'm so sorry. I really wish I didn't do that. Thank you.

It's gonna be baby steps for you all. Yeah. Because there's pain that you were experiencing from before and you just have to now acknowledge it and not minimize it. And I think if y'all can start doing that, you can start taking the steps to move forward. Move forward and be healthier as sisters.

Yeah.

Because I do believe she wants to be in your life. I know it's gonna be hard for you to believe, and so I'm not forcing you to believe now, but I do believe it. Can you give your sister a hug? 'Cause I believe it's sincere.

Yeah, of course.

This is a big step. Y'all saw each other for the first time today, I think. A little bit, right?

Yeah.

Yeah.

Yeah.

So you told my producers that you feel like you can't win in this situation. What do you mean?

If it's something dealing with her, then it's also something dealing with my mom.

Like, I'm in the middle of the whole situation. So either way it go, I lose on both ends. 'Cause for one, that's my wife. Two, that's my mom. She is the one. My mom is the one that raised me.

Right.

I didn't have no dad.

But I raised you after that. And that's great.

No, just let me finish. Let me finish.

I raised you after that. Let me finish. Okay. I didn't have no dad.

I put everything on the back burner, I dropped everything, I moved her back to her family. After, like, I say 2 months after we got together. I moved her back to her family 'cause she missed her family and everything. I was up there for 7 years and I worked, I did everything that I needed to. He did his part. I shouldn't be in the middle of a situation that I feel like I really don't have no say about nothing.

You married me, not your mom though. Yeah, I know I married you and not my mom. So it shouldn't be a situation where you feel like you have to choose.

Why you think your mother dislikes her? My mom thinks she lazy.

Because I'm a bad— Okay, because I'm on top of my stuff.

Hush. Because my mom thinks she lazy because she don't never do nothing.

Hush, get up. When it come down to it, when we stayed with my mom, when it came down to it, my mom was at the house, I came back to the house. I don't never do anything, but I brought your son back to you in one piece. I brought your son back to you in one piece and better than, doing better than he's ever done.

Okay, then that's another thing we've got a problem with.

She don't never let me talk.

She always gotta come back and talk over me.

I don't never let you talk. No, you don't never let me talk. You hear me talking, you ain't saying nothing. I am saying, I'm saying a lot. You're not listening and you're not understanding.

And you're not trying to understand what I'm trying to say.

That's your problem. Oh, it's my problem? Every time it turn around, you always right. You always right. You not always right. I would never lead you down the wrong path. And I would never tell you anything wrong. My intentions are for you to be great.

I want you to realize and understand that I'm gonna be great.

With that shit?

I'm sorry. You all right? It's real emotions. This your real life. Sometimes I just want for you to let me do stuff my way. I don't need you to sit back and sit there, act like you trying to protect me. Every time. I don't want you to feel like you have to protect me. I don't. The only reason I'm bringing that up, 'cause we gonna get back to your mother and what's going on, and I wanna also address the drinking, but I was watching y'all's communication as just a couple, and I was watching you say hush, which is completely disrespectful to your wife. I understand the frustration you have of saying I need to be heard. And so what I realized, and that's why I brought up the thing of you saying, You don't need to protect me. Because earlier, your exact words when he said, my mother raised me, you said, I raised you after. That's very strong language for a wife to say.

I know.

And so when a man starts to feel as if you're turning in not from his wife but into his mother, that's when the communication's gonna start breaking down. And you're not helping it then by turning around and then being disrespectful.

Exactly.

So I wanna point out that both of your ways of communicating communicating with each other are wrong. Okay?

I understand.

I'm just helping y'all to see the communication breakdown, 'cause I saw the communication breakdown right there. Y'all saw it too? Yes. Now, when it comes back to your mother, I heard earlier that she was drinking a lot and that's what caused the fight. And that your wife has said that you started drinking a lot more too. Do you think the drinking with the family is becoming a problem? I just have a cup of beers, I'd say probably like, Until he can't remember how many he's had. Well, okay, yeah. But still. So you can acknowledge this is a problem now. It is a problem. What is the stressor that happened when you moved back that's causing you to have this, wanna drink more? 'Cause she said you weren't drinking before. Okay, so the pressure is that I got a deep issue with my mom. Okay. I didn't really wanna come back I didn't. I was happy where I was at. So you didn't wanna move back? No, because since I been back, I had problems with my family. I fought with them every time I see them.

That's so funny. Yeah. That's so funny.

I fight with them every time. I get drunk and I think about everything that happened to me when I was coming up. And that's one thing I don't think she realized that she always wanna talk about she trying to help me or she, I miss them? No, I didn't. I never did. I can talk. No, I see the pain. I see the pain. I wanted to stay up there where I was happy at.

But babe, you wasn't that happy.

I was happy. I did not show it, smile every day, but on the inside I was happy. As long as I had you and my 6 beautiful kids, I was happy.

That's what you never understood.

You don't understand, and it's like you don't wanna get through your head. This is what I wanted to be.

I had no, I didn't know.

I got the cops called on me 3 times for fighting with my family.

That's why I feel like I have to protect my husband. I get it, I get it.

So why would she think I would wanna come back? I drank till I can't remember stuff because now I don't wanna remember stuff. You ever talk to your mom? About the issues that you have with her? I tried to a couple times, but she'd never come out and she never—

I don't think they really talked about her sober though.

Yeah. What is your fear about talking to your mom about this? 'Cause I still won't get the truth. Got it. None of the stuff that I went through when I was coming up, I never, she ain't gonna give it to me. Does your wife know what you're talking about? And you don't have to tell me here in detail. Yes, she know. She know just what I'm talking about. 'Cause I tell her every time. When I got drunk and I told her the things that hurt me, the way I had to live, what she said to me.

And I understand that.

This makes a lot more sense to me of the issues that you're having with your mother-in-law. In some cases, it is a, you need to set a boundary. In this specific case, there is trauma associated. When there's trauma, it's going to be a lot harder for the child who's experienced that trauma to confront the parent, to be able to protect you the way he could. He's trying his best, but I want you to imagine a kid trying to say, "Mom, stop doing something." And he's not a kid, he's a grown man. But what's happening, and this is why I said earlier, your language about I'm raising you after, is because once he got there, you saw the kid, you saw the trauma.

I did.

And that's why you use languages like, "I'm trying to protect you. I was raising you," because you see a kid that's trying to protect himself from the trauma. Yeah. Antwan, your mom, she sent a ping over. I wanna hear what she had to say about your relationship.

Hi, my name is Velma. I'm Antwan's mother, and I'm not the problem. It's Jaquilla. I'm doing everything that I can do to take and help them out. I'm staying home. To take care of the kids. I just want the best for my son. I want my son to be happy. I want him to figure out what's, what's really going on with him and Jaquilla so they can live their life together and take care of all 6 of my grandbabies. That's all I want. No.

So let me just mention this. We did ask Antoine's mom to be here, but refused to be here today. And the interesting part about this is that even hearing that message, it's funny that she says, well, this person's causing you unhappiness, and you're here saying it's my mom causing me the unhappiness. Is that direct answer? Yes, it is.

Karamo, I'm still trying to understand what did I do wrong to your son? I've had all this man's kids. I have been there for him.

Let me tell you guys, this is what you gotta realize. You didn't do anything wrong. You didn't do anything wrong. The only thing that happened wrong in your marriage is you and your husband having a breakdown of communication and y'all moving to a place was gonna make him not happy. That's the only thing that you, and you didn't even do that wrong. That was a choice y'all made. But you gotta release that. You did nothing wrong. So you don't even need to ask yourself that question anymore. And the reason I know that you didn't do anything wrong, because your husband just validated that his issues are with his mom.

I don't know what to do.

Y'all need to figure out first of all how to get y'allself outta that space. The trauma you've experienced, if you don't want your kids to experience it and you don't want them to have those issues, if you don't wanna lose your wife, if you don't want things to break down, y'all gotta make a decision today to move somewhere else.

That's why I'm telling him we need to go see Karamo because he's gonna help us figure this out. This thing out, okay?

But I appreciate that. I appreciate that. Y'all are gonna be all right. I believe in y'all.

Thank you. I do too.

Yeah, give your wife a kiss and a hug.

Oh my God.