Mom Lacks Empathy After Daughter's Prison Stint | Karamo Reacts | KARAMO

Look how she talk.

Because I'm so mad right now. I'm mad. I've been mad for years, okay? I've been mad as hell for a long time and nobody listens to me, bro.

Nobody listens to me. Mad for what?

Nobody.

What you mean mad for what? What do you mean mad for what, Mom? Like, what are you really saying? Like, what are you really saying? Like, you've been acting this way. Like, what are you talking about? You're always mad. You do not listen to me. I done been raped and all type of shit.

Do you know that? No, you don't.

See?

You don't.

I didn't know.

Her mother not reacting quickly when her daughter said that. I want parents to understand that if someone in your life, especially your child, tells you that their body's been violated, that you need to be able to reach out to them immediately and hug them, support them, hear them. Like, you can't just go over it. So what happened that sent your daughter to jail?

She had got to fighting with some girls and I had just bought her a car for graduation and they bust the window out her car. So they were going back and forth on social media and they were like, yeah, we bust your window. And so she was like, where you guys at? I'm finna come shoot all of y'all. Long story short, she went and found the girls and they got to fighting and one of the girls got shot 4 times.

But not by your daughter.

No.

No. The minute I heard about this story, it's beyond devastating to me because to see that this young woman who has had such a bright future got caught up with one social media post, one social media post that then implicated her in something bigger and ruined her life. It's just devastating. I always talk about this with my own children, with people I know, when I worked in social services, is that I don't think we understand how one comment on social media could really ruin everything you've been working for. And so I just encourage everyone out there, like, I know you in your bedroom, you at the office, you making a little comment, you don't realize what a status post or a comment could do. This young woman just said like, you know, I'm gonna get y'all. And then the next day she actually was gotten by somebody else. And look, it seems like you're part of it. Mm-hmm.

But I do try to—

'cause she's about to go off to college, 3 scholarships. How did you feel when she went away?

I was hurt. I was embarrassed. It was her fault. She don't even realize that. And like, you know, people was like, you need to just stop 'cause she's acting like she's away at college. You know, you going to visit her every weekend. She was 4 hours away. I was there every single Saturday. I never missed a Saturday. Making sure she had money on her books. But that's my daughter, so I just still be trying to just protect her and try to shield her.

Of course, that's what you gonna do. Any parent gonna do.

Yeah, but she don't see it. She feel like I'm trying to be in her business and all this, but it's not that 'cause she has a child.

So she feel like you're trying to be in her business?

Mm-hmm. But I do try to be in your business 'cause you're my responsibility.

Yeah.

Something happened to you, I'm be stuck with your child.

Amen.

That's the thing.

How was she as a teenager though?

Kavari was good. She was homeschooled. She got accepted into a performing arts program.

I wonder if she got accepted to a performing arts program. I wonder if she was that sick. Singer, actress, what it was?

I don't know. Is this her? She just took her down just a spiral.

I just feel like she's trying to make me feel like, seem like the bad person.

No, I'm not trying to make you feel like the bad person.

That's not even how everything went down though. That's not even how it went down though.

Okay, so how did it go down then?

Everything that you said was just, that was cap as hell, Mom. That was cap as hell.

Well, that's another thing. She is so disrespectful.

I'm disrespectful, but she don't even listen to nothing that I say though. When I do try to be respectful and talk to her about stuff, we get into an argument.

But look how you talk though. Look how you talk.

You gotta show me respect, give respect, give respect.

I don't talk though. Do I cuss at you and talk crazy? Yes, you do.

Don't sit in front of these people and act like you don't do that.

No, I do not.

This is what you do. I'm not your friend. This is what you do, Mom.

I'm not your friend.

This is what you thought though.

When you dead and gone, I'm still gonna be your mom.

All right, that's cool.

You get mad about stuff I tell you 'cause it's the truth.

What?

What is the truth?

'Cause everything I tell you is the truth.

What you doing is the truth.

It's funny, the mother said that I don't actually disrespect you and talk to you. And it's funny when people say things like that and then you see their temper rise. And the way they're communicating changed.

Like what?

Like what? You talking about a fight?

You just got to fight them. Y'all showed me how to fight. You're a fighter too though.

You know how many fights you've been in too. You don't got any excuse.

These two are mirroring each other in their behavior.

You said that's not how I was raised, but that was how I was raised.

No, abuse.

That was how I was raised. To fight to defend yourself.

It's interesting that Kavari keeps saying, my mother is a fighter. And the thing is, is as I said, they're mirroring each other's behavior. You can see that some of the things that Kavari has done is clearly her own trauma that's causing her to be angry. But there's also a mimic of her mother's behavior. And that was clear when they were just going back and forth. Body movement, intonation, everything was the same. And I think sometimes we forget when we're matching someone else's energy, especially when it's our kids, they're gonna pick up and learn what we've done. Her mother already said that she was a fighter, that she had to protect her. So clearly this is the way that she grow up of like, if something going on, I gotta be a fighter and protect her as well.

You knew that they busted my window.

Why didn't you give me insurance information then?

You never gave me no insurance information.

Yes, I did.

I mean, so why wasn't my window fixed? Why was my cup of beans?

Because you decided to go and fight 'cause they posted it on social media where they was at. You decided to go fight.

Told me to. Kavari, why is you? I'm done 'cause she a fucking liar, bro. I'm done with this shit. Deadass, I'm deadass, she a fucking liar, bro. Like, bro, I'm ready to go.

Clearly with Kavari, there's so much underlying anger from her. Oh my gosh, Trey and I laugh at me walking off here because I got such a stank walk. It's so funny. Can you go back really quickly, Damien? Trey, you remember when we were looking at this stank-ass walk? I gotta stop walking stank. I walk so stank. It's so stank. It's like my daddy when he just be over it. Oh my gosh. Hello, let me go back here, right? Oh, stank walk. Sorry, I made y'all go back on the stank walk. Stank walk. Stank. Just stank. Anyway, no stride, just stank walk. But so Kavari clearly has a ton of underlying anger issues that has come from obviously something that went on in her childhood. Also her going to jail clearly added to that. But from her saying that her mother was a fighter, her grandmother was a fighter, I think she's just been in a house where women have had to protect themselves, had to fight. And so I think it's like, it went to an extreme with her, but what's happening now is that she just is, she's just mimicking behavior that she's seen But also compounded with her own trauma, it's just getting worse.

It's what they instilled in me. Everybody in my family fighters. Everybody fighters. Her mama a fighter. So now you getting in front of these folks, you act like it's such a big problem. Nah, all right, whatever, Ma.

So your mother's not on probation. You're on probation. So don't you see that the stakes are different for you?

Yeah, but at the same time, Karamo, I don't be doing nothing though. And that's what makes me mad 'cause I don't be doing nothing.

So how long ago was this last fight she's talking about?

This was, she was a month ago. She's not lying about that. It was a month ago.

So within the time, 'cause how old is your child?

He's 3. He be 3 next month.

3. So within, since your child's been around, I get it, you've been home, but you're saying, so in that 3 years you've only gotten into one fight?

Yeah.

One fight in 3 years?

Yeah.

Okay.

Yeah, since I had him. Yeah, yeah, one fight, yeah.

I didn't know if I believed her in that moment. She said, I'm like, yeah, yeah, yeah. I'ma ask.

She called me and said, somebody called CPS on you. And I asked her, was she the one that did it? And she got mad at me because who else was gonna call on me?

I heard when you were young and you went to jail, she was there every day for you.

She was. I'm not saying she wasn't though, she was.

And does she help take care of your child now?

Yeah, of course.

So if she helps take care of your child, why would you think she's a snake?

But I don't think, because it's like she say certain stuff sometimes that'll rub me the wrong way. Like we was outta town one time, we was on a family trip, she tried to laugh it off. She told me, you might as well just give us custody of him.

Nobody play like that with their child. Don't say to somebody, "Just give me custody." Every time.

And then when me and her get into it, "That's why I'm calling Child Protective Services on you." So clearly she's feeling insecure about where she is in her life.

And when people make jokes, we don't realize how our jokes could trigger us. I appreciate you opening up.

Think about what you're doing. It's not just you. You got your baby to think about.

I got in the car, he told me, "Yeah, yeah, I'm gonna call Child Protective Services on you." And then she said, "No, don't do that.

Don't do that." 'Cause he, first of all, I would never take my grandson from her 'cause I know how he loves Kavon. Kavon loves him. I'm not gonna even put my grandson in the system like that. I would never do that. Your lifestyle and the stuff you do, you need to worry about that.

Can you trust your mother right now? Because I see there's layers of the anger that you have.

She know I ain't talking about my grandson.

Can you believe your mother right now when she says she doesn't?

I've always thought that. But if I did, why would I be ashamed to tell you that?

She just said here, I would not wanna put my grandbaby in the system.

And I'm not going to.

I would never do that.

You can't trust that. Why can't you trust that?

No, because I really feel like they want to take my son from me. I really feel like that. I genuinely feel like that. I genuinely feel like that.

Do you really think it's a fight if I wanted to try to take your baby from you?

Oh, see, those are the comments.

If I wanted to really try to take him from you, do you think that would be hard?

You can't even try because—

See, she doesn't understand. She's trying to prove a point by saying like, you think it would be hard if I want to take your child? That's like not helping. What you need to double down on is not telling her why I could do it, but I'm not. Double down on, I'm not, I'm not gonna do it.

And I speak my mind. If I was a yes man to her, she would feel like I really said everything she said.

Look how she talks.

Because I'm so mad right now. I'm mad. I've been mad for years, okay? I've been mad as hell for a long time and nobody listens to me, bro.

Nobody listens to me.

Nobody.

What you mean mad for what? What do you mean mad for what, Mom? Like, what are you really saying? Like, you been acting this way.

You always mad.

You do not listen to me. I done been raped and all type of shit.

Do you know that? No, you don't.

See?

You don't.

I didn't know.

You don't. Ooh, her mother not reacting quickly when her daughter said that. I want parents to understand that if someone in your life, especially your child, tells you that their body's been violated, that you need to be able to reach out to them immediately and hug them, support them, hear them, Like you can't just go over it. I see the breakdown in this communication here. One note that I wrote down, and I wanna show you this, this is literally earlier before your daughter came out here. I said, "Doesn't seem like she likes to communicate with her mom." And then I did not know any of this and it just said out of her mouth, "I don't feel like she listens to me." And when she said that and when she described a moment where her body was violated, you passed right over that. She's just screaming out. That's all she's doing.

I know that.

I would like you just to be an empathetic listener.

Okay.

Don't say anything. And Kavari, I want you to be able to say anything that you want to say and not be interrupted. Tell your mom what you want from her.

I just, I mean, I just want my friend back. Like, you never listen to nothing I say. Like, I've been through so much that I have never told you about.

Like, because I know you're very judgmental, Mom. Like, you're judgmental as hell and I don't like that. It's like, and who else did I trust besides you, Mom? I love you, Mom. Like, you know I love you, Mom, and I appreciate everything you do for me. But like, damn, bro, I am tired of being so mad all the time, Mom. I'm mad every day.

She said, I'm so tired of being mad.

Just listen to me. Like, that's it, Mom.

Like, that's it.

I just want to be a mom to my son and be your daughter. That's it, Mom. I'm not doing nothing else. I'm not trying to hurt you.

You don't even know what she's saying. You see the pain?

What you think that is? Because I'm not, Mom. I'm not that person no more. I'm not. Like, I'm not. I just want to be a good mom to my child and show you that I can be You just sat there and listened.

You did a good job. Because sometimes that's all our kids need. What a beautiful breakthrough. Sometimes we realize we get into a pattern where defending, where telling somebody else what they're doing, or— and we don't just stay quiet and listen. Empathetic listening is one of the skills that I think we should teach more, because the more you can be an empathetic listener where you're not coming with solution, you're not trying to solve, you can just hear somebody, the more people can feel validated and then you're able to have conversations that are constructive. But there's also something you said early on that I also wrote down is you said, when this happened, I was embarrassed and I shut people out because I was embarrassed. And as much as we want to pretend, those feelings stick with us. And so when she's acting out, those feelings are triggered whether you know it or not. And she's saying, I need to get this out so I can heal. So you gotta work on not feeling embarrassed by your daughter. Can you say, "I'm not embarrassed by you anymore"?

I'm not embarrassed by you anymore.

What's going on in your mind? What are you thinking?

'Cause I don't want her to feel like that. I want her to be able to talk to me and tell. I want her to be able to, I don't want her to think that I'm not there to protect her 'cause I know that I'm all that she has. And I don't want you to think that I would take your baby. I would never do that to hurt you 'cause I know that's somebody that loves you.

Now she's doubling down on what she needs to say.

I would never do that to you.

Now she's trusting her mom.

I just don't like the people that you be around. I don't like the choices that you make and I don't want you to expose your baby to that. I don't want him to have to go through that.

She's trying to grow and it's hard. I'm sure there's a lot that plays into like, I'm trying to grow, I'm trying to be better, I'm trying. Like you just said in 3 years since you had the baby, you've only been in one fight.

Yeah.

That's growth.

Yeah.

I see that growth. I see your growth. Do you see her growth? But at the same rate, as much as I can acknowledge that, can you acknowledge that there is some, a little bit more growth you gotta do?

Yeah, like I'm not like doubting that.

I'm just happy that this mother and daughter have finally had a chance to hear each other and communicate about where they are and where they hope the other can be.

Don't keep throwing the old stuff I did in my face, like, because that's just pulling me back even further.

They're gonna be okay. They're gonna be able to grow together. At the end of the day, y'all both want to be there for each other. You've been there. She's saying she loves you, she needs you, but there's anger. There's anger and there's embarrassment. And those two things have to be healed. And as soon as those things can be healed, y'all are gonna be on a path together. Get back to that friendship. You gotta believe her for who she is now. But you also gotta commit to showing her day by day that you're not gonna do stuff. I believe you're a good mom. But those little things, like it's better that you check in with your mom instead of having to check in with a parole officer. Ooh, that's a word. Ooh. I said check in with your mom and not check in with a parole officer, girl. Now that you will stop fighting. Yeah, I can do that. Tell her.

Yeah, I will stop fighting, Mom. I'm not gonna be fighting or nothing again.

And can you commit to your daughter to say— come on, y'all better make them commitments.

Yes, I can commit to not being embarrassed by your emotions.

It's gonna take some time. This is a step. And through this step, y'all gonna keep running together.

Mm.

Aw, hi, Mommy. Hi, daughter.

So sweet.

I like this show. You like this show too?