She Was An Addict, I Don't Believe This Is My Mother! | KARAMO

My little girl was taken from me at 11 months old, and I have never, ever stopped searching for her. I got pregnant with Crystal when I was 18 years old. At the time, I was on my own. I was out there using drugs, and I don't even know who Crystal's father is. After Crystal was born, 11 months later, I got arrested, and CPS took Crystal away from me. I tried to get Crystal back, but things was just too hard. I was very young, uneducated. They tell me, go get a job, get an apartment. A job? An apartment? How do I make enough money to pay for an apartment? There was no help, no guidance, no care from no one. I lost all contact and visitation rights with Crystal when she was about a year and a half. At the age of 3, she was adopted, and of course, it's a sealed adoption. They just handed me a death sentence, and there was nobody to help me. And so I pushed myself further out into the darkness because I didn't want to live. But the pain was so hard. It was heavy. But I kept seeing the baby's face. I just wanted my baby. I did not care that the adoption was sealed. I still did everything that I could to find my baby. 12 days ago, the most amazing thing happened in my life. The child that was taken away from me when she was 11 months old, I found her off of Facebook. That absolutely changed my life. For the first time in 40 years, I was able to talk to my baby. I am 1,000% sure that Crystal is my daughter. I just need her to know that I am her mother.

All right, we'll talk to Lisa shortly, but first, please help me welcome her potential daughter Crystal to the show. So Crystal, I gotta tell you, I read body language and I noticed why you were watching that video, you were tapping your feet and also playing with your fingers. Is that translating into some type of anxiety or frustration? What are you feeling?

I'm frustrated and I'm like really mad.

Okay, well tell me why.

Just, it's been 12 days and it's just been hell ever since I met her. And I feel like she's just been lying to me and telling me a lot of stuff.

Okay.

So I just really wanna know the truth.

So do you believe that Lisa is your mother?

Not really.

You do not believe that. Okay then. And tell me how you first came in contact with Lisa, 'cause I know it was 12 days ago like you said.

It was on Facebook. It was through a reunion. Reunification group and it was a lady that reached out to me and told me that she found my mom.

Oh wow. Okay then. And when you got that news, what was your initial feeling?

I was excited, but then when I talked to her, it didn't seem like that was even my mom.

So what part of the conversation that made you have doubts if you were excited at first?

Well, I've read my adoption records and the adoption records basically say that She was 14 when she had me. She told me that she was 18. She also told me that she didn't give me up for adoption, that I was taken. And my papers say that she left me at a shelter. Just completely abandoned me, so. Got it.

What have your conversations with Lisa been like? Because you just said 12 days and it's been hell. That's very specific language.

It's been very traumatic. It's been hell. I feel like she doesn't even focus on how I feel. She just going into how she feels and it's been trauma after trauma after trauma.

And how has all this affected you?

It's affected me a lot. I have had my kids taken away from me and I've had a CPS case. I been clean for 13 years. Congratulations. I got my kids back. So when I say that I don't understand, I literally don't understand 'cause I went those steps that she's went and I fought hard. I didn't have nothing when I came to the location where I stay at now. I started from scratch with the clothes on my back. I didn't have furniture, I didn't have anything, but I walked, I looked for a job, I completed school, and I'm here today.

Congratulations. Congratulations. Thank you for sharing that, 'cause I think that also speaks I think it speaks to also your hesitation in this moment and the wall that is going up and that I'm seeing through your body language because it's like, okay, you are not giving me consistency in stories. You are not being concerned about me, but also I was a young mother who had some similarities, but I fought. So where was your fight is what you're asking. That makes sense. So. So let me be clear, how long had you been searching for your biological mom?

It was only a month. Only a month. It's only been a month.

Only a month. So within a month of you putting in this Facebook post, something came up and now 2 weeks later. Yes. It's all compounded. So I gotta ask you directly, at this point, do you want Lisa to be your mom?

To be truthful, no, because of everything that she's got going on, I kind of want the peace that I had at first. But I'm willing to work with her if she can be truthful and she can agree to my boundaries.

Got it. Okay then. That's good. Well, as you shared earlier, Lisa was unable to be here with us today, but she joined via remote. So everyone please welcome Lisa to the show. Hey Lisa, how are you doing?

I'm doing great, how are you?

I'm good, thank you. So listen, I was sharing with the audience earlier and also sharing with Crystal, like I've heard her side of the story, but I'm also very open to hearing your point of view on all of this. So first let's start off from your perspective, why weren't you able to be here today?

I'm on parole and my parole fees are not paid up.

So because of that you're not able to, okay. So why have you been contacting Crystal so much since you only found her 12 days ago?

Because she my daughter. She's my daughter and the state took her from me and she needs to know the truth of everything that happened. So obviously the people lied to her.

I really don't think so.

And it's very important to me that she understand what happened. Of course I'm concerned with her feelings. Absolutely. And that's all that matters right now.

But are you really concerned with my feelings?

Yes, I am. Because I am in your shoes. I'm gonna have the same situation to deal with. So your feelings are very valid. That's why I'm here today. I want you to speak your truth. Tell me how you feel. But I also need to let you know what happened.

So Lisa, I can understand, I respect your desire to make sure that she is aware of the facts because for you, I'm sure at that young age, there was so much going on that you wanna make sure she knows your intentions of your heart. I can see that. Absolutely. I can see that from your perspective. But she's saying to you that in these first 2 years in the last 2 weeks, most of the interactions have not been about concern for her. How do you justify that even in the letters you wrote or in that text, it's been more about like meeting versus saying, are you okay? I do see that you saying I love you.

We can get to that part as soon as she understand what happened. Okay.

Because see, she's gonna have a wall there. But don't you believe that it should be the opposite? It should be an emotional connection. No, I do not.

She needs to understand what happened because obviously she's been lied to. So she needs to know that I didn't give her up.

I really don't think she's telling me the truth though.

Okay, she feels like you're not telling her the truth. She feels like there was inconsistency in the story. She told me earlier that you had told her that she was taken. She said that on her documents that it was said that she was left behind. She also said that there was an age discrepancy that you said that you were 18 or you were 14 and then it was 18 years old. So there's a discrepancy there. How do you justify those two things?

I was not pregnant at 14 years old. Her birth certificate is that shit. I got pregnant with her when I was 18. I can't see any of that.

I've went to search for my birth certificate and the records are sealed. So I can't even tell if she's telling the truth or not. Got it, okay.

So from your perspective, Lisa, why did they take Crystal away from you?

The system being the system, See, it's different this day and time. Back then, they really didn't care. I was just a young, impoverished Black woman, addict, young, with a baby. So we were staying in a shelter, you know? When I got arrested that night, it wasn't like I had committed some horrible crime. So I wanna say this.

This is the part where I get confused because she said we were staying in a shelter. My paperwork says that she left me at a shelter. So I'm not seeing the, you know, she could be telling the truth, I don't know. But I just— We can prove that.

We can prove that. I got arrested, the shit in city jail. They should have records on that. Have them pull those records. That night CPS had to come and get you from the jail.

Did you leave her at the shelter? What am I saying?

I said the story can be verified.

So you were arrested that night.

You can pull those records.

Okay then, so you're saying you did not.

You can prove all of that.

Mm-hmm, okay, so you were saying—

You just have to have the power to do that.

So you were saying that you were arrested that night and that's the reason that the CPS stepped in?

Yeah, I was arrested.

I will say this to you, and everyone knows that my history and my background, I did work for Child Protective Services for over a decade. And for me, I will say that though there have been many strides in the way that families are treated, especially Black families are treated, I do know that the reality of what you're saying, especially during that time, would've been true. I agree with that point in your story, but I'm saying also from Crystal's point of view, she's saying, well then after you got clean, why didn't you come after me? Why didn't you find me? Because that's from her what her issue is.

Okay, I got a question for you. You say you know about the system. How was I gonna find her on a sealed adoption? She couldn't find me, I couldn't find, how was I supposed to find her? You tell me. Anybody in that audience, Tim is, maybe. Okay, okay.

How am I supposed to do that? I'm gonna ask you this. Is there any way that, and this is just because what I'm trying to help you all find is a common ground. If you are possibly mother and daughter, I wanna make sure that we're finding some clarity so that you can move forward. So understand my intention always. So is there any possibility that in some of the details that your memory could be cloudy? So that way there could—

My memory's not cloudy about my child.

Okay.

We need to get to the DNA truth. Are you ready? Crystal, in this envelope is the DNA truth. A month ago, you were optimistic that you might find your mother, a connection. And since you have found this person, it has not been what you imagined it to be. You have done the work in your own life. And you wanted answers. This is your truth to open, not mine.

I just want everybody to understand that like this has been 40 years that I have been going through this. I literally tried to kill myself because I didn't know if I even had somebody that was my mom that cared about me. Okay, baby.

Bring her the support she loves. Bring her the support she loves.

She is my mom.

Okay, I would like for you to tell, because I do hope that this can be the beginning the beginning of a connection. What are your boundaries so that you all can move forward in some type of relationship?

I just need to cut down some of the messages 'cause it's a lot. The messages is a lot.

Okay. Okay.

I need you to be completely honest and truthful.

Hold on, let's do this. I wanna be clear because the thing is that boundaries are a very funny thing. You can give a broad boundary and then you could still feel unheard. So when you say, I need the messages cut down, that's a broad boundary. Being specific about like, hey, let's only have conversation once a week or once a day or once every hour. That's where you set a clearer boundary where you don't feel yourself feeling overwhelmed again. So can you be more specific with that boundary?

I would like to at least talk like maybe twice a week.

Twice a week, great.

Start there and then move up.

And do you wanna initiate the calls or do you want her to initiate it?

I can initiate the call.

So see, that's a more specific boundary. So what were the second boundary you said?

To be truthful and I just don't want any slips because my kids haven't seen me slip. So I don't want them to see her slip because they want their grandma too.

Mm-hmm.

I would like patience. I feel like sometimes things can take, me overboard. My blood pressure gets really high sometimes. So if I ask you for some space, just—

Or truth. Respect me. And this one, if I ask you for truth. Truth. Be patient with me processing it. Lisa, can you honor those two boundaries that she's already given to you? For her to call you twice a week where she's gonna reach out. And then also that when she needs to figure out her own truth, that you are patient with her in hearing you. Can you give her those two boundaries?

My baby can take all the time she need 'cause I ain't going nowhere. Hands down. Can't nobody take me away from her. Take all the time she need.

Okay. Do you feel heard now?

Yeah, a little bit.

You do a little bit? Listen, I want y'all to know y'all both got me in y'all corner. All right?

Well, you can find the rest of our family.

Okay, well, if you need my support, listen, listen, Lisa, if y'all need my support. 'Cause now you're about to say she's adopted, so we're going on a journey. Listen, if you—

I don't know my mother, father, no sister, brothers. Now it's just me and Crystal. Listen. We don't know anybody else.

Any support you need, I am here because my only goal with this talk show has always been to make sure that we have a resource to know that somebody's going to hear us and give us the tools to be better. Yes. So if y'all need it, I'm here for you. I'm here for you 100%, all right? Absolutely. I'm so glad you got your answers, Lisa. I'm so glad you got your answers and everyone at home. Stay with us. We'll be right back with more.