Sell more sell better

Okay, fantastic. Well, welcome everyone. Good afternoon, and I hope it's sunny where you are. Thank you so much for joining us today. Most of you know me, my name is Rebecca Smith, and I run the mentoring programme for Growing Kent and Medway. And this webinar came about actually from another webinar that we did, and Laura, the founder of Dockyard Jams, we went, we did this webinar together about imposter syndrome, and she was so inspired by the webinar that she hung up the call and she picked up the phone and she called the farm shop that she'd been trying to get her jam jams into for ages, and they'd been ghosting her on emails. And she was like, do you want my jams or not? And they were like, yes, we do. And then she called and in fact she was like, I've got to sell it to them, what do I do? So I went out into the internet and fate led me to the amazing Karen Green, and I'm just so thrilled that she's here with us today because there's really no one better qualified to talk about how we sell and how people buy, that whole science of buying. She's a consultant. She's an author of 2 amazing books, Recipes for Success, and in my background you might be able to see Buyerology. She's worked extensively in buying and is a foodie. She's one of us. She's a foodie judge for the Great Taste Awards and other things. So the woman who literally needs no introduction. I'm going to hand over to you now, Karen. Thank you so much for being with us today.

A pleasure. Thank you. Thank you for that lovely introduction. So yes, we're going to digging into selling more and selling better. And yes, it's— let's just, let's start you in easily with a bit of a question. Harvard Business Review, who I do love actually, did a little piece of research and they actually had a look at corporate buyers. So people who are buying business to business, the types of people that you're probably buying from. And they did some research as to what percentage of corporate buyers are basing their decisions on emotions rather than the facts and figures. And we have 2— sorry, 3 answers here: 95%, 60%, 10%. So if you'd like to pop your answer into the chat, that would be greatly appreciated. What do you reckon? Is it A? Yeah, so we've got one. How many have we got? 2 A's so far, 2 B's. Anybody else? That's only 4 answers.

Another A.

Yeah.

Lots and lots of A's.

Yeah. A, A, A.

Have you all read my book? Is that where you're getting all these answers from? So yes, absolutely. You are. The majority is correct. It is actually 95%. And as Rebecca was saying, I've been doing this a long time. have been a buyer, I have been a seller, and I'm also extremely logical, and I've always based a lot of my selling on facts and figures and logic. And, um, when I first started thinking about this all those years ago, and then, and actually doing the research for the book, I went, ah, okay, it's, uh, we need to have a little bit of a different think about how we're going to do this. So I started my life— we're not going to go through the very long, uh, career I have, but I started my life as a buyer. First of all for Tesco and then for Boots. And I was the buyer for vitamins for 5 years, and that was one of the 2 biggest buying roles within Boots. It was very prestigious. I was very proud to have it. And I like to think I was extremely logical and I did make some very, very good business decisions and the business grew very well. So you're probably thinking, well, Jaffa Cakes are not vitamins. Um, or supplements. Um, and the reason I put this on here, because I remember, and I did try and find him actually, yes, um, last week when I was trying to write this, um, there was a guy who used to sell ginseng to us and he would come in at 11 o'clock in the morning, which is just lovely coffee time. Um, and he would always bring me Jaffa Cakes. And I am— am I ashamed? I know I'm not ashamed, but I, I will note that he did get a better deal and I was more open to what he brought in and just generally much easier with him than some other people who I didn't particularly like, such as the sales guy who used to go over my head and talk to my boss. And if I could possibly jeopardize their business, even though they were a brand leader at the time, I would have done. Now, you know, that's me as a young buyer, but in a very significant position. And I think it's worth knowing that. That's how I started my life. What I do now, I then, when I left Boots, I went across the table and I went and sold own label, a variety of own label foods and drinks actually back to retailers. And I then left what I call the corporate world, the proper jobs, and became a consultant 9 years ago, moved to the south of France, and this is pretty much what I do now. So I work with United Nations International Trade Center and as their UK sales advisor and work with a number of different companies from chocolate. So this was, this was a specialty last year. Um, to, um, what we just started. Cashew nut juice is our— isn't— is my cashew apple— cashew nut apple juice is my newest product, um, which is extremely exciting from Senegal. I speak a lot. Um, I think some of you have already, um, seen my books, but, um, I've, I've written Virology, which, which is what we're going to talk about today. And then prior to that, Recipe for Success, which is a little bit dated now, but the principles are still the same, which was born out of thinking about how can you, how you have a profitable food business rather than getting shafted by people like me as a buyer. So I wanna ask you another question because the subtext for my book is to sell more and sell better. And that's what we were gonna be talking about today. But I suppose the first question, I'm assuming you're all selling, otherwise you wouldn't be here in some capacity or other. And even if you're not selling necessarily in the traditional sense of selling your products or your services, you may well be selling ideas. And also, we also sell ourselves. So if we go for an interview, we are selling. So in the chat, it'd be really useful to just see what does selling better mean to you, just to get an idea of, of what you're thinking. So I Selling at the right price and in the right volume.

Mm-hmm.

That's a, that's a good one. I'll let people type, type away. Anyone else got any thoughts about what does selling better mean? Getting across the value I can provide. Yeah, absolutely. Repeat customers. Yes, I'm doing a piece of work at the moment for a company, quite a big corporate, looking at new business development. And in, even in part of the start of this, we've actually discovered that 60% of their business is repeat customers, which is not unusual. So yes, repeat business is, is sometimes what we neglect, but it's just as important. Knowledge, USP to increase sales volume and profit.

Yes.

So there's a lot of talking here about value, sales, profitability. So in the book, I talk actually about what success— what does success mean to you? But I think what selling better is a summary of what you've already put there. So I've said more profit. Profit is— when I first wrote Recipe for Success and I was like, oh, we're gonna have a profitable sales business, sorry, a profitable food business. And then I discovered that the majority of young fledgling businesses actually don't make a profit because they're busy reinvesting all of their profits back into the business. And I think that's fine. But I think what we should always be looking for obviously is a significant gross margin, whether you then decide to spend that on your business, that's another matter. But I think to make more profit, and that kind of incorporates the rest of that in terms of sales volume and also of the longer relationship. So where Jen was saying repeat business, longer relationships certainly reduce the cost of acquisition. And this is mostly about business to business. I don't really work on a B2C basis. So I'm not necessarily, I mean, B2C is important and the longer the lifetime value of a customer is really critical whichever way you go, but longer relationships do make your life a lot better. And then the one that maybe none of you have picked up and was maybe none of you feel stress in selling, but certainly for the 10 or so years I was selling to the light. And most of my sales were to Tesco, to be honest. I was selling a number of different products from ready meals to sushi to salads, sandwiches, and Christmas puddings, bizarrely. And it was very stressful. It was incredibly stressful. And more latterly, where I've been supporting clients, again, coincidentally with Tesco, it's been stressful because it's very difficult to control what they want and it's very difficult to build that relationship. So These are the things that we wanna be working on to actually sell better. So if, if we're kind of all on the same page that that's what we're gonna do, we're gonna be selling better, how are we gonna go about it? I'm gonna talk to you about 3 different things today. First one is how do people buy? I'm not gonna get into the psychology of buying. If you are interested, and I'm— this is not a plug for the book, and if you want a book, I'm very happy to send you a a free copy. It's not a problem if you haven't read it. But in the book, I do talk about the psychology of buying and how we buy as human beings. And it is very— I find it really very interesting. But I want to talk to you more about how are people going to buy your products and services. Then I'm going to talk to you about, well, who are you selling to? Because we've all had, and maybe more so now with the advent of AI, the random message that's like, oh, I've got this lovely thing and it's just so suited for you and you're reading it going, well, that's nothing to do with me. So we're going to talk about who are you selling to, and then once you understand your buyer, which, you know, the whole point of buyerology is the study of the buyer and the study of buying, then how do you tailor your message? How do you actually use that information to sell better, sell more and sell better? So How do people buy? There's a very simple model which I find useful, and you can use it as a structure for all of your customers. So basically, and this is broader than just retail or food, this does apply for anything really. So When you're buying, and this would apply to you as well, if you're buying a washing machine or a new car, you identify a problem. Or you might, because of the advent of lovely TikTok, TikTok might suddenly say, well, did you realize you actually needed, I don't know, highlighter or whatever the thing is you would. But anyway, there is a problem, okay? So, or an opportunity or something, or a treat. It doesn't have to be a negative. It can be a positive as well. And so most people and buyers will go out and do some research, and they shortlist a number of different customers— sorry, of suppliers— and then they'll get you in, have a discussion, negotiate the deal, and then they will buy. And then the virtuous circle is that they repeat working with you, and if you are I specialize in working with companies to get them into retail. What we're interested in is to get repeat business, but also for you to develop new products and new ranges. And so it goes on and it grows and you get this perfect circle. And then if it's probably— I always present this and then I go, well, I don't think Tesco are going to refer you to Sainsbury's or Aldi. But if you are working in a slightly different industry, there is that opportunity of referral. So for me Personally, if I'm working with a client, the greatest thing, and I've, I get a lot of my business through referrals, is people refer, and then you start back on the, on the cycle again. So you need to think about who your target audience is and how they're going to buy from you. And, you know, There is also, and as I say, I'm working on this presentation for this client at the moment, and we're thinking about, well, how do we actually proactively go and tell them there's a problem and how we can solve it and how we can actually make the whole thing interesting? So, and then if you put the overlay around that, and I've used the acronym BIO because we just love an acronym, then you start to say, well, actually, what do you need to do to pull the buyer around this, this egg or eye or whatever you want to call it to actually get them to buy. So the most important thing on the left, and this is probably something I do more with clients than anything else, I don't like cold calling. Nobody likes cold calling. Nobody likes to have a cold call and nobody wants to have it. So you want to warm people up before you even start. So the first thing you need to be doing, if you think to yourself, well, actually, I want to launch my product into this place, how is that person gathering the information? So for example, can you build awareness? And, you know, there's lots more information in the book about how you build awareness, but you really need to be out there. And I think there's lots of different stats on this, but touch somebody 11 times from 4 different locations with consistent messaging. So you want to be there if you're looking for 4 different locations. The ones that I usually go for are things like LinkedIn, your social media of choice. So if you are on Insta or you're on TikTok, if you are maybe entering awards. So we talked about the Great Taste Awards at the beginning. I am a massive fan of awards because it gives you something to talk about. And then some other interesting news, PR, for example, PR can be really important, especially in the vitamin supplement world, which I come from. So you need to be doing the B, so building that awareness. And then the next thing, and I'm going to come back to this again on how you work through this unique value proposition, but I'm sure you've all, you've been on accelerators, you've been mentored, someone at some point will have said, You need to create a unique value proposition, and that's so important that to make sure you get on on that shortlist. But also, it really the the clue is in that word tailored. If you take nothing away from this, think about how do I tailor the solution? Now, you know, you might be I don't know making honey, selling wine, and say, well, I am going to tailor my wine. My wine is my wine, and that's. That's fine. But what we do tailor is how we sell it and how we position it to each of the different customers. And then going around onto the right, which we're not gonna talk about today, but how do you negotiate the best deal? And a lot of that will be from the first 2. So if you've established That the, the, and I'm gonna carry on with wine cuz I've got wine in my head now. If you've established that your wine is really, really an amazing product and it's gonna give them something that they don't have and it's very exciting, they are gonna be more inclined to pay a decent price for it than they would be if you haven't done this work already. So that this is the shape it is and it is a cycle for a reason. Because you're building up all the time the desire. Because if we go back to that initial statistic that 95% of people buy on emotional reasons, those emotional reasons is I want that product and I don't care how much I pay for it. There will be budgets and there will be numbers and there will be margins. But if somebody, if you've shown somebody and said, I've got this lovely thing and you can have it exclusively and none of your competitors are gonna have it, they're gonna pay a good price for it. So just bear that in mind. And then the other 2 pieces which are often neglected, execute well. So we've just done a deal for a client with Lakeland and we're launching into stores on the 1st of July. It's My Spike and we are now working very hard on that launch. Both in terms of the products, but also how we promote it, how we get it off the shelf. Really, really critical. And then the R of buyer is about reviewing and repeating so that you keep that ongoing, because what we were saying about selling better and having the loyalty, you need to keep building that relationship with the buyer. you don't want to neglect them. And that's something I think we can be guilty of sometimes because we're so busy on trying to get that trajectory going and thinking, right, I need new business and you need new business, that we neglect our customers that we already have. And then they start on this cycle again with someone else who's maybe seen the presentation or thinking, right, I'm the challenger now, I'm gonna come along and challenge their position. So you have to keep ahead of the game. So how do you know what they want? Okay, so how are you gonna profile what they're looking for? So the buyerology matrix is, as I say, a distillation of years of my thought processes of saying, well, actually, how do people buy and what are the key parts of it? And I believe that They are 3 elements. A lot of selling that you will— selling training you'll go on focuses on the corporation. So things like, yes, so if we carry on with the Tesco example, we're going to send to Tesco. So we know a lot about Tesco. We know what their mission statements are, we know what they're doing, etc. But it's more than that. And the second part is actually about the buyer and the corporate interface. So going back to buyer as a human, I'm going to keep repeating it because you need to remember it, even though they might not seem it, they are. What's going on for the buyer? You know, are they looking for a promotion? Are they looking to stay in their role? Are they new to the company? What's their worries? What's their concerns? What's the risks around the role that they have and what you're going to do for them or to them. And then we've got the buyer as a human, and we're gonna talk about that. That's probably where we're gonna focus most today. And then I've put the fixed and the flexible on the other axis because I do actually think some things are fixed and some things we can influence. So if we start to look at what's, what we've got in here. So as I mentioned, corporation mission and values. If you're selling to somebody, you really need to understand what they're trying to achieve. What do they want to do? What's, what's their, what's their key thing? Is it sustainability? Is it environmental? Is it, you know, Planet Organic are now definitely saying we want to go back to our organic roots. So is it organic, etc., etc.? What's the business goals? What are they focusing in on? What are they, you know, Whole Foods are fantastic because every year they list out the key drivers in their business. So do Waitrose, actually. So you kind of go, right, actually, that's really important. Or Tesco will come out and say, well, we want to match Aldi on price, and they'll say, we're going to do this. Or who's just said they're investing? In fact, it's Aldi have just said they've done a deal with an apple company for 6 years, which is quite exceptional, actually. So get to know the corporation and understand what their business goals are and what they're going to be doing. Um, and then resources. I've put resources in there because a lot of my clients are too small to really impact on some of the bigger corporations. But, um, if you are— I was just trying to think of an example. Um, Vita Coco is a coconut water. I'm doing, as I say, doing some work for a juice company, and Vita Coco actually have managed to do a deal where they don't just display Vita Coco at the point of sale where you would buy it in food to go and at the back of the store. They've actually managed to get a space within produce so that you can buy Vita Coco when you're making a smoothie, which I thought was really interesting from a merchandising point of view. But your corporation is going to have to have the resources for that. But if they're flexible and interested in it, it could be something that's quite useful. So that's what the resources is about. And then It is Kent, is it? Thank you, Rebecca. I know, I know, I skim an awful lot of data because I find this industry so interesting and I couldn't remember who it was.

So that's—

I presume it's fantastic news. It looked like it was good news, but you never know the background. So then when you're thinking about the biology, the buyer-corporate interface, I've got 3 things in there. What's their personal goals? That's the hardest one to find out. You know, it's very difficult for you to find out what they're up to, but you can, you can, you can get some ideas potentially. What's the market challenges that they're facing? So what are the things that they're likely to be in trouble for? So has there been issues around not paying the right price for produce, for example? Are they under a lot of pressure from the media? Is it something that that buyer is specifically struggling with? And then worries about your business. And I have that as flexible because the biggest problem a buyer has with taking on a new supplier is the risk. So there's lots of risks around all of us, you know. Are you gonna go bust? Are you gonna supply something that they're gonna have to do a recall on? Is it gonna sell, which is there? Is it sustainable? Is there— there's a whole load of worries. So those are things that you can really address. And as we say, these are all fairly logical, but the emotion of the buying overlays on top of that. So I like to think about when you're selling, and I have a 6-slide sales proposal, which again, I can send to you and share with you. So you can see how to do this. But basically, the factual side of selling is getting the basics right. So, you know, what's the range of products that you're selling or services? What's your growth? What's the growth strategy? So most, we talked about what's the mission and goals for the corporation. Most corporations want to grow. So how do you fit in with that growth strategy? How is, by taking your products or services in, are you actually going to take their business to the next stage? So thinking about how do you fit into that then, and this is something that I teach, but I really struggle to convince people on. Your company credentials need to come towards the second part of any presentation because actually what we want to be doing is to say, right, the umbrella, the marketplace is this, the opportunities are these. So these are the opportunities under the umbrella and this is the growth strategy that we have and the range that we have which will fulfill it. And then and only then do you underpin by saying, well, actually, The reason you want to work with us is because, and that's your credentials and whatever those may be. And there's lots of different opportunities to put things in there. And then obviously, if you've talked about the growth opportunity, but you need to put a commercial proposal together. And I've, and I always, and I'm just seeing if, think if there's an exception to this rule, but there isn't. I never put a price into a first presentation. So in terms of commercial proposal, And I'm quite happy to discuss that with you separately. But the commercial proposition really is around, well, what can you do to transform their business? And it's not just about price. It could be, I think a couple of you mentioned volume. So volume might be really critical, especially in produce. We can supply this much volume. We can give you exclusivity. We can promote. We can do PR, etc., etc. We can work together. Those 4 things with some embellishment are probably the ones that you would normally do. But we have the other bit, which by now you probably realize is the human element to it, because even Tesco is populated by human buyers. And they make decisions in a more human way. Now, the reason I'm sort of hesitating here is you may well be seeing into the press, and I know Tesco— I'm not deliberately focusing on Tesco, but they keep coming into my mind. Tesco came out a few weeks ago to say they're going to be using AI to make decisions as to what goes into express stores. And I think we will see more and more of that. Walmart use AI to make decisions about buying for non-consumables, well, non— sorry, not for resale. So things like, I don't know, typewriters, computers, or paper, or things that are being used in the stores. So there is going to be AI, and I think it will come forth more. I did presentation or a discussion at IFE on AI with Ocado, and they have been very explicit that they don't use AI for buying decisions because they feel the buyer has more insights. And I didn't want to go on about the fact that they'll just make emotional decisions, but I do think that's probably the case. But that's good for us because we can sell in a much better way. It's easier. So we have to remember the buyer is human, and this is your fairy dust. This is the thing that is going to transform the way you present to customers. And the 3rd column is about this human element. So again, fixed and flexible elements. So personality— personality technically isn't actually fixed, but for the This purpose it is. So your buyer has a certain personality, and I'm going to come on and talk about that in the second part of this so you can understand. Then we've got how are they feeling? And there's not a lot you can do about that. Maybe, I don't know. There's some things I'm going to talk about. And then do they like you? And that's so fundamental. And it goes back to the Jaffa Cakes. Do I like this guy? Yes, because he brings me in Jaffa Cakes. And do I remember him after 20 years?

Yeah.

Um, so that's probably the most flexible thing, and I'll show you how to build rapport, but that's what you need to be doing. You need to be understanding the personality so you can adapt and tailor what you're presenting, understand how they're feeling. You know, if you go in and the buyer's having a bad day, maybe you have to abandon it and come back when they're having a good day. And then do they like you? How do people buy from people they like? And I have seen certainly bigger corporations Say, well, that we need to change the salesperson because they're just not getting on with the buyer. And then obviously you have the flip side of that, which I'm sure some of you will have had, where you've built a brilliant relationship and then the buyer leaves. And that's been a problem for me and all of us in the past. But if you underpin with the rest of it, it shouldn't be too disastrous. So we've thought about how we're going to sell. Who are you selling to? So you're going to be sitting there now going, so how on earth am I going to find out what the personality is of the buyer? And there's lots of different things you can be thinking about. So this is the first time in, well, probably in history actually, that there's actually 5 generations of people in the workforce. There's 4 different personality types, which I'm gonna talk to you about, 3 different learning styles, and a whole lot of other permutations about culture. So who you sell to and how you profile the person you're selling to is critical. And I'm just gonna say this here, we're not particularly gonna talk about if you're selling to a group of people, and I'm sure some of you do with the, with the roles that you're in. And we can talk about that separately, but the principles are still the same. You just have to broaden it. how you present out so that you're covering all bases. So this is a lovely summary of 5 generations, and you're going to be kind of like, well, so what? Who cares? And the reason we care is because people from different generations buy in different ways and think in different ways and have had different life experiences. And I'm finding that myself. I just come into Generation X, so I, I kind of am relatively open-minded. But what I do find is that with Generation Z, which is my daughter's age, I struggle with some of their, their experiences, some of their mindsets, some of their ideas, things that I have to have to say. It's quite a challenge. We will give these slides out at the end, so, or that you're obviously welcome to take a screenshot of it because I'm not going to have time to go through it in awesome detail. But finding out what generation your buyer is from actually will change the way they buy from you because they will have different experiences and different points of reference. And how do you find that out? You can ask their age if you want, or you can go the way I usually do it, and it's not entirely accurate, and it's not, you know, it's not the end of the world, but I'm a massive fan of LinkedIn, and if I— I'm amazed I've actually managed to get halfway through this presentation without mentioning LinkedIn. But if you go on to LinkedIn, and this is my LinkedIn, if they went to uni, you can you should be lucky enough to find out what year they graduated, and you can get a rough idea of how old they are, or go on to Facebook or what have you. But prepare to stalk these people. I'm assuming obviously you don't have super loads of people to analyze. So that's the first thing, work out what generation they are. And then the second, and probably the most critical thing that I use on a regular basis is is called DISC profiling, which is an acronym for the 4 different types, personality types: dominance, influence, compliance, and steadiness. Again, I'm not going to go into it in super loads of detail. If you want a copy of the book, I'll send you one, and there's quite a lot of information in there. But the— and the percentages under there is the percentage of people in in the world that have this. So I'm quite high dominant and you'll find a lot of buyers tend to be quite dominant. So on the left side of the circle, it's more task orientated, on the right side it's more people orientated and a lot of sales, successful salespeople have a combination of dominance and influence. So I do have some influence in there as well. So influencing people want to make want to be friends, they want to make relationships, they want to build up. Steady people are people orientated, but they're going to be less dynamic. And then compliant people are the, are the detail people. They're the people in your companies that are going to be doing technical. They were going to want loads and loads of information. So if you are using, if you know the DiSC profile of somebody, you can work out how to present to them. So if, if you were presenting to me and you sent me a 5-page email, I wouldn't read it because it's too much information. I'd probably go to the end and see if there was a relevant point that I could get something out of it. Whereas if you were sending a sales presentation to a high C, you probably would want to send the 5 pages. So how do you find out? What a person is. There are several, um, several ways you can do it. They are based on LinkedIn. Um, I use Humantic because it's cheaper, um, and there's a QR code there that you can use. It is, it is an affiliate code, but don't worry, I, I don't think I've made a penny out of my affiliate code. I just actually really like the way these guys work. And basically How it works is it analyzes the LinkedIn profile. You do not need to, to be linked in with the person. You can just go on, click on it, and it will give you their personality. And the great thing about it is, so this is me a while ago, and in fact, it'll tell you, there we are, 28th of January. I'm a pioneer according to that. So I'm high influence. It's giving you an idea of my age. So you can do again, you can work out what generation I'm from. It's got the confidence level. So, you know, whether how confident they are, because sometimes it will come back and say that the LinkedIn profile is a bit thin, in which case we don't know so much. And then it will tell you. So it will say, get to know Karen. And this is me. And this is relatively accurate. And I would say about 80 to 90% of the time it works. Occasionally I read it or I'll say to a client, oh, you know, you're this, and they'll go, nah, not. But most of the time it does work. And then the great thing about it, and this is getting more and more developed as we're going through with the AI, it will tell you how to sell to them. So it will go through how to send a cold email. Well, we don't like cold emails, but an email, how to negotiate, how to present, how are they gonna make decisions? Absolutely fantastic. So I can't stress enough how useful you will find that going forward. And then another one which we don't talk about that much, but I'm just gonna throw it in there in terms of learning styles. You're all sitting today hearing, listening to me. If I would prefer this to be a little bit more interactive, but we've got super loads of things to get through, and we will have some questions at the end, and we can run over at the end. But I wanted to get this into an hour. The majority of us are visual, which is why YouTube works, which is why we watch TV, etc., etc. 30% of us are auditory, so 30% of us listen. Um, which is why when I'm walking the dog, I have Audible and I listen to it to, um, books. And then kinesthetics are people who actually like to feel something and hold something. So if you are selling to somebody, it's worth just knowing what type of person they are. And it's a really easy one to learn because they will tend to say— visual people tend to say, I see what you think. Auditory people say, I hear what you say, um, and kinesthetic people talk about feelings. So it's just— that's probably just a little bit of gloss on the gingerbread. It's, it's not sort of— I think if, if you master one thing from this, I would, I would master the DiSC analysis because you can do so many good things with it, which is what we're going to show you in a minute. So putting it all together, You've basically built this beautiful present— sorry, profile of your buyer. You know what generation they are, you know what type of personality. If you've dug around a bit more, you might know their interests and hobbies, which will be useful in a bit, their work history. You know if they're new to the company, if they're leaving the company, and you've got a real understanding of who they are. So, so what? So what is the third thing I wanted to talk to you about, which is how to tailor your message. So you can take all of these elements and tailor the message, and I've talked a little bit about the purple one and the red ones, and we're going to do a little quick demonstration on the blue ones now, on the buyer, because the buyer is human, as we said. So in terms of personality, this is again from me. So this is, this is what Humantics is recommending you do with me. How to build a winning connection. Keep your pitch focused on impact. Build a relationship. Use these phrases. Don't do this. How fantastic. It's a coach. It's coaching you on what to say and do. And so when you are putting your pitch together and when you're putting a presentation together, you can be thinking about all of these different elements. And yeah, it's amazing. Awesome. You can also use this in different meetings. So this is, this is another interesting comment about how meetings can be planned. So, you know, Ds like fast meetings. They don't want small talk. They don't want to say, how are you? Is are into people. So they're going to be like, oh, let's talk about what you did at the weekend. And the Ds are like, seriously, no. And so on. So it goes from there. And as I say, we'll share the slides and you can have this for a later date. But it's well worth having this, I think, up on your wall when you're talking to somebody, especially if you're doing something virtual and go, right, okay, I know what I need to be doing today. And then the third part is how are they feel— sorry, the second part is how are they feeling. So we've done personality, how are they feeling? And 95% of the decisions are made by emotion. And I've put kittens in there because there is some research that shows if you build an emotional reaction. So, I mean, the supermarkets have been doing it for years, but when they pump out the smell of bread, they don't really do it anymore. But baking, when you go into the store, that's starting to trigger an emotion. You go, oh God, that smells lovely, and I'd like to buy some bread. And now I'm thinking about all these other food things. So if you can put something emotional, and I've chosen kittens because I like animals, you can actually change the way they're feeling. So If you build on what you know about them, you can trigger emotions. And when we trigger emotions, people make decisions and they make them more likely in your favor. And then the last one, as I say, is do they like you? And people buy from people. Well, people buy from people and people buy from people they like. And so there's lots of things. And, you know, there was a lot around body language in the '80s and '90s. And and neurolinguistic programming and all sorts of stuff. But there is an art of rapport, and I quite like this triangle because it does take you through. We've all met people who overshare. So you go and meet somebody, and they go, "Oh yeah, you know my husband's done this," and da da da da da. And you're like, "Oh, I don't really want to know that. I've only just met you." So, and it does vary actually with different cultures as well. I do quite a lot of work. With Northern Europe, and we have all sorts of different cultural changes, and we talk about it. But British, we probably stay in the polite conversation and cliché for quite a while. So, you know, that's, that's the level 1. So you can start with that, then you can share information and facts, and you can overlay on top of this, if you're getting good at it, the personality as well. So C's, for example, will love it if you share lots of information. And if you, in my opinion, go on and on and on and on and with a lot of detail, you know, those people, it will probably bore me to tears. So again, you're adapting how you build that rapport. Then you can go in with ideas and opinions, but it's always dangerous. You know what they say, don't talk about politics and religion. You can with people that you know. Then you can talk about feelings and emotions. So then you can start to do a little bit of sharing, and then you get into the authenticity and congruence and rapport. The really good people with charisma are the ones that take you up that very quickly and build that trust and rapport very quickly. But there's lots of ways you can do that. But I think it's worth having a, having a think about that when you go into that meeting. And then there are other things like making sure that you're wearing the right the same clothes. And, you know, so there is some synergy, but also keeping your own integrity as well, I think, is really important because people really know if you're not being yourself. So in summary, we have been through how to sell more and sell better. So I think you should now understand the buying process and how you can think about your company in relation to that buying process and how you relate into how your buyer is going to be working. You have a good idea of how to profile your buyer, whether that's from a corporate point of view, the way they are interacting with the corporation, and also who they are as humans. And we've also talked a little bit, not, you know, there's there's lots and lots of detail and lots of things that we can get into about how you tailor your message. So whether that's tailoring your unique value proposition so that it fits in with the buyer that you're selling to, to actually tailoring the way you speak to somebody and the way you design a pitch or your email so you're actually appealing to their personality. If you would like more information, please do connect with me on LinkedIn. I think there is a link somewhere in the chat. That QR code that you have in front of you now, you can go onto that and that should go through to Calendly and you can book in a half-hour session with me if you want to have a chat. And then again, drop me an email, send me a WhatsApp. I'm here, very happy to help. And I think that gives us about 10 minutes for questions. Oh, and there's my LinkedIn page gone into the chat.

Thank you so much, Karen. That was absolutely fascinating. Yeah, I almost don't know what to say. I'm speechless. That never happens. Anyone who knows me, this is a very rare moment. We did have one question popped into the chat, but if anyone has anything that they'd like to— I don't know, Just comment on something that we've heard just now, or a specific question on something that Karen's just shared. The DISC thing is really frighteningly true. Really, it's like witchcraft. How can you be so accurate just based on kind of what people are posting? It's frightening.

And it's only going to get better because as the AI learns more, it will get better. And I honestly, I I use it for whenever I talk to a new client. I just, I have a look at it and, and it's, I just find it fascinating. And to be honest, there's, there's certain personality types, mostly in the blue compliance arena where I just go, we're not gonna get on. And I've had it a couple of times and, and they've come on and I've gone, nah, it's not gonna work. And unfortunately, when we're selling products to Tesco's and we meet the buyer and we go, no, we're not gonna get on. we don't really have a choice. Then you need to dig deep and really understand. And I have, I have had a C Tesco buyer actually, and it was before I'd learned all about this. And it was only subsequently when I did actually go back and profile him and I went, oh, that explains a lot.

That's why. Anca, you had a question earlier.

Yeah. So I can say, hi. So great presentation, Karen. Really, you are unique in a way, you know, what I've met, you know, so far in terms of the information you shared. So I'm familiar with the DISC report, but I didn't know about the sequence that you can put actually the LinkedIn profile into that app. And relating to the app, which I think it's extremely useful, so I start using it. You've mentioned there is a— for now, their profile looks like that. How often actually do you have to review the profile to see if anything changed, you know, based on their LinkedIn It's a really interesting question, actually.

I, I do, um, a lot of coaching with a, with a big corporate company, which is not, funnily enough, a food company. And they use DiSC all the time, um, and they don't use Humanics. They, they use Thomas National, which actually does the full kind of analysis. And they do talk about changes, and they kind of say, well, you know, as I've got more through. So for example, I'm a lot less hotheaded D than I was 10 years ago. I would say my influencing skills have gone up. So I guess, yes, you can, but the AI is only as good as the information that it has. So yes, if somebody updates their profile, happy days. Is it going to make a super difference? I don't know that it will. I think It's, it's one element of a number of different elements. But in theory, as I said to you, personality shouldn't change. But I think over time we do. I think we do change, actually.

All right. And thank you very much. And I had put actually the question in the chat as well. Is there any recipe, I would say, you know, and I'm putting the brackets in the word recipe. For bringing a product into big retailers like Tesco, or in my case, you know, I have a product which I'd like to put it in a pet shop. Is there any way we can do it? Obviously, we can have like you know of discussion to understand more how you can help my company. But it's just to understand: Are there any specific steps? Who is actually the person should I approach? You know. the buyers within the big companies, like your previous experience, or who is actually the best person to approach in order to sell and to, you know, customize the message towards?

So this is, I mean, sometimes I do get asked this a lot in terms of, you know, what's going to push something over the edge. So I suppose the first thing is to say, make sure that you're clear on, on the unique selling point. And I work a lot with clients, um, on what that is. And people will go, well, we're a female-run business. I'm thinking one specifically. And, and we, we make this product and it's unique because it's this. And I went, no, it's not. These companies will do that. So I think it's thinking about what is the unique thing that you're bringing to the party and also making sure that it's a decent size of business. So for example, I always sort of say, well, if you have, I don't know, organic free-range, I'm thinking of a company actually that I Judge at Farm Shop and Deli. They make ready meals from venison and other wild animals. So venison, and I think it's rabbit as well. But they were making recipes which I thought were quite niche as well. The products are amazing, but it's kind of niche, niche, niche, niche, niche, niche, niche. Fabulous. And they're like, well, no one else does it, but it's not a big enough niche to be profitable for a company. So yes, have a unique selling point, but it needs to have gravitas as well. And then I think the other thing is that yes, you do need to approach the buyers. But what I was trying to say about what are their feelings about you, it's about the risk. So what's the risk that they would have by taking you? And the corollary of that is what are you bringing to the party that will transform their life? So I always used to joke actually about the role of an account manager because I used to manage account managers in these bigger companies is to get the buyer promoted. So how does the buyer get— how do we get that buyer promoted? And in the case of the guy with the detail, oh, Happened sooner than, uh, as quickly, which was good. Um, so how do you get that buyer promoted? Because you, you, they look good and they've found something unique and it's made them money and it's sold and you haven't had a product recall and you do fit with all their compliances. I, I, um, did a sales presentation and again, rookie mistake. To be fair, I didn't know they were coming. It product guru with them. Um, and we had Whole Foods and I was selling toothpaste, funnily enough. I don't just do food. And, um, they went, it's got— and I'm like, and it's got gold and silver. And they went, we don't have gold and silver. It's on our banned list. And I went, okay. And then another one I remember actually a company that's, that's done very well since, and I won't remember their name, uh, mention their name. They went on stage and did a public pitch to Planet Organic. who don't take anything but I think it's either free-range or organic eggs. Anyway, they just had standard eggs in their recipe. And literally the guy picked it up, turned it over, Al Ollison went, no, other than— and just say, um, that's a kind of long rambling answer, Anca, to your question of how do you make it successful? But is that what you were asking? I'm actually wondering whether that's what you're asking.

Yeah, in a way, yes, it is. Yeah, it's about just, you know, there are other questions I have to answer myself, you know, about the risk, you know, they will be able to take against my company and how I can mitigate those risks as well. So, you know, but, you know, it's a risk, you know, because I'm a small company and trying to approach, you know, big retailers. This is my major risk at the moment. Not too many people will know about me. So how I can mitigate that risk, you know, and So you mitigate the risk by taking the small steps. All right, thank you.

Sometimes you can go to bigger companies. So I worked with somebody and we— her first customer was Tesco, and it really made life hard for us because we weren't ready. We were nowhere near ready for Tesco. She's still there after— I was speaking to her yesterday, actually. She's still there. But it's not been easy.

Yeah, I had a last-minute question pop into the chat, and you have less than 60 seconds, Karen. And it's, do big retailers actively recruit buyers of all personality types, or are all buyers all quite similar personality-wise?

Okay, so I've got 2 answers to that. Tesco, I think, employ all reds, or they used to. And then I was coaching actually one of the senior buying directors at Ocado recently, and she recruits all different personalities because she says actually, although she is a red, she said it's amazing to have all the different perspectives. So you'll be surprised. And then the other thing to say is depending who you're selling to, retail buyers tend to be more red, procurement managers And food service— well, sorry, procurement managers tend to be more blue, so they're more detail, and food service tend to be green.

Yeah, you can see that actually, how those different qualities would be necessary in different types of buying roles. That's really interesting. Well, we've reached the magic hour. Just a huge thank you on behalf of everyone on the call for sharing your experience. and your expertise. My mind is blown. I'm looking at the world in a different way now. Thank you so much, everyone, for joining us. And please do take up Karen's very kind offer of a half an hour call, because I know you'll be able to dive into your own situations and get so much value from that. But have a fantastic afternoon, everyone. The sun has just come out from behind a cloud here in Canterbury. It's going to be a great afternoon. And I will see you at our next event, which is innovation funding and how to get it on the 11th of June and on the 18th of June, cash forecasting finance. Who doesn't need help with that? Please go to the website, sign up, and look forward to seeing you at the next webinar. And thanks so much for your time today. And once again, huge thank you, Karen, for joining us today. Thank you so much. Thank you.