What Anyone Can Do: Leo & Randy On Challenge (Season 2020, Episode 5)

Welcome to the What Anyone Can Do podcast with Leo Battari and me, Randy Cantrell. This show picks up where our previous show, Year of the Peer, left off, highlighting the simple truth that who you surround yourself with matters, and that if we enlist the support of others, give back to those who give to us, and pay it forward for the next generation, we can do anything. Author and keynote speaker Leo Battari and I talk with a diverse group of thought leaders who will share stories and insights that will help you succeed in business and in life.

How?

By doing the things anyone can do, but most of us never will.

Welcome back to another episode of What Anyone Can Do, the podcast. We are into season 2020. We are now into February, February the 6th, Thursday.

Is this the 2020th season of What Anyone Can Do? We're amazing.

Yeah, we are.

We are the immortal podcast.

That's exactly right. It's exactly right. He is Leo Bottari. He's in sunny Southern California. I'm in Dallas-Fort Worth, Texas. My name is Randy Cantrell, and we had a major cold front hit through, so you can tell by me. Bruins are on a little bit of a winning streak, 2 games, so he'll don the hat. My Dallas Stars, they've done well, they've done well, they're doing good. Interim coach and all that, so it's all good. But we've got a Super Bowl wrap-up here to kind of begin. Kansas City, congrats.

I think we do. I think for anyone, I can't imagine anyone who is betting any serious money on that game who had Kansas City and was down 20 to 10 with like, what, 7 minutes left to play. Yeah. Like, man, you know, it's not looking good. But, you know, that team all year has been like, there are some teams that are just built to be able to come from behind. And do it quickly and do it in a way that just cuts your heart out and does it.

Well, they clearly are. You know, they did it every game in the playoffs, so why should the Super Bowl be any different? Yeah, it was good. Yeah, it was a good game. It was a good game. You know, heart goes out, I guess, to San Fran fans, but they'll be back in there. It's amazing the criticism that has come down the pike at Garoppolo and, and that their coach, you know, Shannon, I'm like, these are, these are top, these are top-level, these are top-level people at their game.

I mean, we all know that the difference between being, you know, deemed kind of, you know, an idiot and a genius, or like someone making a, making a catch, not making a catch, they're totally fine line, it's like a very fine line. It only— these guys are only being Billiput because whatever they did didn't work at the time. Did work, which it very well could have under any other circumstances, you know, and everyone would be singing a whole different tune. So these guys are no different, you know, and I say that for the winners too. They're no different today than they were before the Super Bowl. I mean, these are, you know, I mean, obviously they have this now as part of their, you know, their history and You know, it's a big deal and there's no, you know, getting around that. But at the end of the day, Andy Reid's no better a coach today than he was last week. And same thing with all these other guys. And, you know, there we go.

You know, the difference, you know, but you think about the difference that's in their head, you know, the confident factor of we did it, now we know we can do it. And it kind of segues into what I know we want to talk about today. And that's just the challenge, and the challenge that we can provide for ourselves, the challenge that other people can provide. And now their challenge is going to be, can they do it again? Which is why it's so crazy hard for people to, to repeat.

There's a ton of moving parts to all that, but, but there's the challenge, right? I mean, it is very much— first of all, I was going to mention that I remember You know, speaking to— you want to know how hard it is to get back? I remember watching the last time they played in the Super Bowl, it was Super Bowl IV against the Minnesota Vikings. You know, we had Len Dawson as quarterback, Joe Kapp was quarterback for the Vikings. You know, you've got, you know, Bud Grant and Hank Stram were the coaches. I mean, this is 50 years ago. So yeah, it's a little hard to get back there.

Yeah.

Think about Dan Marino when he lost his first Super Bowl. He nor anyone on the planet would have ever predicted he would never get back to another Super Bowl. It is extremely difficult. And I think these folks, for all the confidence it might give you, it also gives you a reality check for how hard it is. And there's no shortchanging whatever you had to do to get there the first time. You've got to do that and then some to get there the second time. There are no shortcuts. There's no things you can do because there are too many people who want this for next year and the year after and the year after that. So, but yeah, to your point, you know, we were talking a little earlier today about, you know, the fact that when I was working with that company up in Canada last week, and then of course, you know, I just worked with a few groups. I was just in Florida yesterday, as a matter of fact. And, you know, it was interesting to me to see, you know, with all these workshops and we talk about the importance of psychological safety and that safe and confidential environment, you know, of course Google is part of its Aristotle Project, you know, has really come to a place where psychological safety first, dependability on one another second, as being keys to what great teams are all about. Um, of course, the Aristotle Project, for anyone knows who may or may not know why it was called the Aristotle Project, that has to do with the quote of that the whole is greater than the sum of the parts. Um, and it was fascinating yesterday to have some people, um, give me some examples, some CEOs give me some examples from some great teams they played on. And one of them mentioned a basketball team that they played on where They by far did not have the best players, and yet they won the championship. And it was that classic example of what people can do when they work together really well, as opposed to having a lot of individual stars on the other side just on their own program. They'll lose all the time, and it's just really, um, something. But I think what was most interesting, um, is when we talk about psychological safety in a group situation, you know, in particular, of course, exists with the team as well. It's that it isn't just about them being willing to be open and vulnerable and fearless about asking questions or taking risks and all that. And then in a group situation, realizing that that is supported by the fact that what happens in the room stays in the room. I think that is one high level of safety, no question about it, because even that is something we don't enjoy in our lives, really, you know, because we're always having to put our best face forward. Most of the time we're not admitting our stuff. And you know, when people ask us how everything's going, it's great, everything's great, fine, everything's fine. But, but I think the real next level, uh, is when you get a group that feels so, uh, purposeful about why they're there and so committed to why they're there that they're actually willing to challenge one another in a way that comes from a really good place. It comes from that place of, you know, if I were challenging you on something, it would likely be about something that you've already expressed that you want for yourself, and there's something keeping you from doing that, and you keep running up against it. And either me or someone else as part of a group experience might say, Randy, You know, and we might either ask a hard question or offer thoughts on something or observations about something that you may not love hearing. But it is difficult to say. It's difficult to hear. But yet it's such a necessary part of how we grow. It is that moment where we truly are uncomfortable. And you get out of that comfort zone. You get to a place where you're about to have a hard but necessary conversation. And, um, you know, cause I'll see a lot of groups who they're, they're really good about being open with each other. They're really good about, um, you know, their familiarity with one another. They know each other well, they know their kids, they know, you know, all this stuff. The problem is that that can get to a point where it can go so far in that direction, and then they don't want to challenge each other anymore. So it's that sweet spot of thinking about how do we develop a level of familiarity so that we gain that trust, but then how do we also make sure that we are constantly recognized, particularly in a group, formal group situation or team, why we're there. So in the group, it's to make everyone better. For a team, it's because We're looking to achieve a level of excellence collectively toward creating a singular product or outcome or service that we just want to be better and better. And the only reason we're challenging each other isn't about personal, it's about how do we make that better.

But that's, well, that's often the elephant in the room though. I mean, for people to, to keep that at the forefront instead, what I often see in groups and in teams, is the challenge isn't for the benefit of the other person, it's for my benefit. It's for me to show that I don't agree or I don't like him. And there's so many other things that they really, and at least in my mind, they're not challenges. They're not productive challenges. They're more objections or statements of disagreement. And that's not what we're talking about. It's not that kind of challenge.

I don't think rock throwing, you know. Yeah, yeah.

But yeah, but in so many people's minds, that's, you know, that, that's what they do. And they— I, I don't know, I, I had, I had it happen recently, you know, somebody just blurts out, I don't agree. Well, my curiosity and wanting to understand, there are so many things that I wanted to say in the The particular context of this meeting is not really important except for the fact this just wasn't the right setting. This wasn't the right group of people for me to do much pushing back, and so I didn't. I just fell on the sword. But in a different environment— and this was a one-off— but in a different environment, I would have wanted to have at least challenged, "Why do you feel that way?" Because my curiosity to understand And I find that in a lot of group interactions, the challenge— well, there's the trepidation, as you said. We're too familiar. I don't want to hurt their feelings. I don't want to make them uncomfortable. I'm wondering, what advice do you have? How can we shove to the forefront, I need to do this, and I need to do this for them? I need to do this for them. I need to do this for the group. I need to do this for the team. It's not about me. It's not a— it is largely about them. And it's always about us, you know, putting that focus seems to me to be a big hurdle for a lot of people.

So you bring up one extreme, which is the person who doesn't want to hurt someone's feelings and all that. Right. Then there's the other person who might say, what do you mean you don't agree? What are you, learning impaired? You know? So then that's like the opposite, right? Where we're immediately about trying to put the other person down and have a basically, or whatever other ad hominem attack we want to put down there, which is basically what we see in our politics today, right? It isn't about, let's not actually have a conversation about what's going on. Let's have a conversation about who's saying it, where it's coming from, and how do we discredit that so that we actually don't even have to have a conversation about what's really happening. Right? So, so there's, there's a bit of that. But to your point, I think, again, you have to recognize, you know, why you're there. You know, you recognize that, all right, I'm supposed to be there as a group member. Typically, most groups, they don't do it right away. They do it over time. And even whether they do it right away or they do it over time, the really good groups tend to revisit kind of what are the values and behaviors they believe make for good group membership and delivering value. And it's largely being there, understanding that if I'm part of the group, I'm first and foremost here to help other people. And if I do that, if I give myself to that mission, I will— and I have other people committed to the exact same thing flowing in my direction, right? Everybody's going to win, and everybody's going to win big. So I think as long as we remain committed to the idea, you know, of that— you know, when we've talked before about when I worked at Mullen, it's MullenLowe today, I basically said that they don't— if you, if you walked into that building and heard some of the conversations or attended meetings and you really didn't know what the culture was like or what was going on, you'd be like, man, you got a lot of people here and there's a lot of passionate conversation, let's put it that way, going on about a lot of stuff. But what you realize is that these people aren't fighting against each other. They're fighting for the best idea. In fact, they realized that the more we challenge each other, the more we recognize that everybody in this room is really, really smart and they really come, and they come at it from all these different ways, that if we keep challenging each other and keep digging in, we have a chance to create the best advertising in the world. And that's what they fight for. And so that, I think, is a great example of a team. That knows why they're there. They kind of put that personal ego stuff aside. They're not about showing each other up because there's such incredible mutual respect around the table, basically, for everyone in there. It's laser-focused on making the work better. It's all it's about. That doesn't mean people don't get mad or don't— or if their idea doesn't advance or something like that. But usually, you know, in the end, you get over it and realize that the better concept kind of won out, you know, at the end of the day. And that's why you're all there. And even if you didn't contribute the specific idea, you participated in a conversation that likely steered people in a direction where that idea became possible. So this is why everyone can celebrate together so easily. You know, it's not about, oh, that was his piece or hers or whatever. It very much becomes, you know, everyone's. So I think the big antidote to, you know, not being so self-focused is recognizing, you know, why we're there and knowing that if everyone else is there and that we all keep each other in check about what that's about, what those behaviors look like, then we're all going to be huge winners for it. If it's not in a group where we're all going to individually benefit or a team where the Um, you know, collective outcome that we're looking to achieve is always going to be better. And we always recognize that.

For the benefit of our audience and people in our audience, because I'm sure we've got people that are listening to thinking that's all, that all sounds great. And that all sounds wonderful. And that's kind of a utopia thing, but I've never experienced it. Um, what comments or advice can you give for, for people who may be part of a group or even part of a team inside a company? Or they would at least like to be a spark plug. They would at least like to be the catalyst for where those kinds of challenges can happen, but they're just not there yet. It's just, they are not a high-performing group or team. And let's admit it, high-performing groups and teams don't just grow on trees. I mean, these are, these come about with great intent and great purpose and a lot of hard work. And not everybody can achieve it. But if I, as a member of a group or a team, I want to contribute to that, I realize that everybody in the room— I may not like them all, but everybody's competent, capable of doing their job. And maybe I've got enough of a professional level of trust. No, I don't trust them with my personal vulnerabilities, but I don't have to. I can trust them in this context here at work, But we just, but we just can't get there to the, this area of really productive challenge. What are some things that I could do as an individual that might could benefit that?

It's a great question. I think that, um, most of these cultures that I talk about, whether it's from great teams and in sports or business or whatever, these are not cultures that grew up overnight. Um, and in many respects, whether it's a company or whether it's a sports team in particular, they don't have the same players or the same employees or team members than they had 5 years ago. So what they learn is who are the people that are the strongest contributors and why? How do we get more of them? How do we recognize? And again, you want all the diversity of thought and opinion and experiences and all that. But at the core, you have to have people who share values and behaviors that you, they believe are congruent with what the organization is trying to do. And so when we talk about, in any group or team, having the right people and understanding what the right people looks like in your specific organization or team or business, sports, whatever it happens to be, it's crucial. You know, it's that teammate thing we talked about with UConn Women. You know, it's like, Gina Ariama says that it's harder than ever to find high school basketball players who are committed to be good teammates. And it's the difference between— and it can be very difficult to teach certain things to people. We tend to look at someone's resume and we look at what they can do. It usually doesn't offer much insight into who they are. And it's who they are that's usually going to make the difference between whether someone survives in a culture or thrives in a culture. Culture, and then recognizing, um, you know, what that looks like in someone and doing the best over time. You know, I had someone the other day who was saying, okay, um, I'm a new CEO. I've been there 6 months and I'm, and I'm not exactly— I didn't believe I inherited a team that has a giant commitment to excellence here. Right. So I want to change that. Well, you know, she realized I can't just fire everybody and start over. So how do you go about making that transition? And so one of the things that we did talk about and we had a group conversation about was this is where, especially where I think there's a new opportunity, is the more clear you are about your expectations, the easier it's going to be to determine the people who can pivot and play in where you're trying to go. And those who can't. And one of the great examples of that for me that I saw up close and personal— God, this was over 20 years ago now— but I worked with Paul Tipton, who unfortunately passed a number of years ago, but a wonderful guy, very big personality, very controversial personality as president of Jacksonville University for a while. And not universally loved because, you know, but at the same time, I did love him. I thought he was an amazing man in many respects, not only for his intellect, but he had incredible clarity about what he wanted to create there. And it was very simply, the university at the time when he took it over was very kind of an ivory tower mentality where the administration was the top of everything. And the students were just— they happened to be there paying tuition, right? So he was very much wanting to flip that on its head. And his whole thing was about anything that came to him, any initiative, anything that university ever was going to do had to be based on a students first kind of mantra, if you will. So if you brought something to him and it had that student first perspective, he'd be really willing to hear it and it's in play to be able to get approved. If it wasn't, don't even, don't even come here, you know. And it was fascinating with not only was he incredibly clear about that, I'd say about half the people got it and the other half of the people heard it but they didn't get it. And then over time, the people who were never going to get there, they just were, it's not who they were, found, you know, other places to teach or work or whatever happened to be. And it was a slow process, and I'm not sure, you know, he had enough time, you know, there to have completely executed that culture change at the time. But I thought the clarity with which he came at it and Got everybody around it and then supported it, and you have to live every aspect of it. You know, I may mention to you when I started my firm, um, and it was based on Hal Rosenbluth's book, The Customer Comes Second, and when— and, and that's very much like employees are first. Well, okay, employees, you know, employee-first thing sounds really, really good. But when it gets tested is when it's going to cost you money, right? At least from the employee's perspective. So we had a client who has abused one of our employees or whatever, and it was a horrible kind of deal. And, uh, the client wanted the employee fired, and instead I fired the client, and that was that. So, so then now people are like, whoa, okay, we're really serious about this. This is, this is really who we are. This is what this is all about, that There are no circumstances. It's not like we're employee first except when, or yeah, but. It is no, this is what we live by. And the more— and the irony, of course, is the more true you are to it and you don't have exceptions in there, the greater that it actually— greater opportunity it has to actually have an impact and really work. And in the case of, you know, it happened actually on a couple of occasions. You know, you might say, well, whoa, that, you know, they must have been small clients or whatever. Actually, one of them wasn't. One of them was a pretty good-sized client. And, um, but did it cost many money? Really? No. In fact, it made us money. And we've got a whole team now that had run through a brick wall to do whatever we needed to do. I mean, that was that level of commitment, um, because they knew that, um, not just in terms of me having their back, but we all had each other's back. And I think when you get that kind of trust in a singular approach that defines culture, you know, that can be huge. So that's a long answer, but I also think it's a rather complex question when you start thinking about— there's no magic button to push. There's no thing there. It's just But it works, but you've got to be all in. You can't be, you know, again, yeah, we're this, you know, it's almost like the Enron, you know, when it was— there was an article, I think, I think Jay Conger, I think it was either Jay Conger or Patrick Lencioni, actually I think Patrick Lencioni wrote the article. And he paints this picture and it was all the values etched into the granite, you know, at Enron. And it's like, well, they were etched in granite, but they— Nowhere else. They were nowhere else.

They weren't living.

You know, in any real way, obviously.

So yeah, we talk about challenge in the context of helping people pretty much do what they themselves say they want to do. So I know that a lot of your work with CEO groups, this is not about— these are groups, these are not teams, meaning every individual at the table has got something they personally want to accomplish, and then they've got their collective work together that they do to help get those goals accomplished for one another. And for themselves. And so a CEO can say he wants to do something, but then the group can sense he ain't doing anything. He ain't doing anything to head there. So let's, as we kind of round the final quarter poll here for today's episode, I mean, share with us a little bit of insight about that, that challenging people, not for what we think they ought to do, but for what they themselves have committed or said they want to do.

Yeah. You know, what you said too reminded me of one other thing before I get to that, which is, you know, if you think about what the workshop I do with groups is, I actually get the group to work together as a team to help make them a better group, if you know what I mean by that, right? So—

Yeah, well, tell us more. Explain.

Because they're a group which is designed to, you know, help each other all get better. Right?

Right.

Right. For them to do that, what I need them to do is come together in a 3-hour workshop and literally be a team because now the singular outcome is how do we be a better group? What does that look like? So they collect how to make that happen and then they play a team in that regard. And then in many respects, they go back to being a group based on the things that they just all agreed upon. In their team exercise, right? So it becomes—

makes perfect sense.

I get it. You know, interesting in that way. Um, but, um, regarding your, um, question, it is really interesting. Um, you know, I think that, um, for the most part, um, when an issue keeps resurfacing right? When somebody says they want to do something for themselves and all of a sudden issue keeps coming up month after month, or it goes away for a while, then it comes back, or whatever. In most cases, I think this is where you can start asking the wrong question, okay? Or, or they're, they're actually dealing with the wrong question. So in other words, let's say that there's a person in their company that is a real cancer in their company and they need to let them go. A month goes by, 3 months goes by, 6 months goes by, still there. You know, all these other things, you know, you're losing other people because of it. God knows what's going on, right? The question isn't about, you know, whether— you've already determined that the person should go. What you probably didn't have the conversation about is what is it about doing that that bothers you so much that it actually keeps you from pulling the trigger? What does that look like for you? And really start digging deep and getting into the heart of what is the cause of the reluctance. And that can be powerful. And that's where groups— that's also the difference between a group in terms of challenging one another and willing to go different places sometimes versus just with the question at hand. Because it defies logic, to your point, sometimes where if someone says, here's what I want to do, we've all talked about it, we've all agreed that this is the right course of action, I own this, I accept it, I see where this is going. 6 months later, we're still dealing with the same thing. OK, you know, well, now we got to— we have to have a different conversation now, as opposed to getting frustrated over the same conversation over and over again about what have you— you know.

So, and that's insanely common. Sure. Top-level leaders. I mean, it really is.

I mean, they logically, intellectually, they know what they need to do, but, and there's, there's a thousand different reasons for it in terms of why, uh, they weren't, they won't pull the trigger in situations like that. And then, you know, some of it, you know, again, when you ask the question, sometimes you find out, oh, it's your brother-in-law. Right.

Minor detail.

Right. Yeah. What we're talking about here, or, um, you know, you've always been that person who kind of believes it is your personal failure when someone else doesn't make it in the organization, that somehow you weren't able to really bring them along and coach them and get them to a place where they could be successful. And because, and you're not willing to fail in that regard, you're not even talking about them anymore. You're really talking about you. Um, so again, that's like two examples of it. I mean, we could go on and on about all the things that go on in people's heads about why they won't, um, you know, again, set somebody free, you know, where, and we all know also, cause any of us, and I think all of us have had who have finally, and it's not always been in my case either, did it so quickly. You, when you do let them go and you actually get a person in that job who's really good at it, you're like, whoa, like, What was I thinking? What was going on in my head that I was willing to kind of, you know, allow this to go on, not only to my detriment, but to the detriment of everyone around them. Um, and we all know too that when that happens, it's never a situation where people looking at you like, oh man, I feel so badly for that person being gone. What they tell you is, what took you so long? What was that about? Yeah.

And it's a great question. I think for our audience, if you're sitting there wrestling even with your own, with your own stuff, your own things that you want to get accomplished, yes, it's great to have other people that can do this for you. But I think it's a, yeah, I think you just mentioned it's a great question to ask ourselves is what's, what's really stopping me from doing this? Why am I not taking this action to get this done? Cause I know I want to do it. I say I want to do it, but I'm not doing it.

It's why these peer groups are so powerful, because you will get other people, you know, to ask you the questions that you have stopped asking yourself. You are able to process that in your own mind and come to your own conclusion. This is not about— and this is nothing against consultants, because obviously they have— can have a really critical and great role. But oftentimes when you get something that doesn't come from you that gives you advice and recommendations about what you need to do and you don't own it as part part of who you are, it can become very difficult to implement that successfully. Uh, when the solution comes from you based on questions and your own having to wrangle with it, and you come to a place finally where it's, yes, this is how I have to move forward, or this is how I have to see my business, or these are the opportunities ahead of me that I never imagined possible, but now I know that they are within reach. Um, you, This is where a group can help you get there in ways that a consulting firm is probably going to fall short, at least on that front. They may have all the right answers. The question about whether you can own them and implement them, you know, is another matter entirely. And the more I think people are in an environment, again, where they are comfortable challenging one another, realizing why it is they're there and what this is all about, you know, the greater success they'll have and the happier they're going to be actually as, as being part of a good, healthy, you know, group or team.

Let's end the show with an update on the book and let's kind of pre-tease the book that you're working on. You've been traveling a lot. Does that— share with us, what is— what are you able to write on a plane or do you— how do you— what's your process for writing real briefly?

It's really a question. It's a, it's a, I write when I feel like it. Yeah. It's terrible. I'm the most, I'm the least disciplined.

I like that though.

It's not like I sit, I have in my head, because there are some people and I applaud this and it's how they work and how they can do it, where they will say, all right, for X number of hours a day between these hours, I'm going to sit and I'm going to crank out whatever. Not, not going to happen. I, I will go days where I won't touch it. And then, then I get on a run and I'll be looking at the clock and 7 hours passed because I'm just rolling. Right. And then, then I'm, I get exhausted with that. And then maybe a few more days will go by. And then some days, um, was it that way with the first book?

Oh yeah. Oh, okay.

Oh yeah. Yeah. Yeah. I'm, I'm not improving in that regard. That level of discipline around it, but it works.

It works for you.

So it works at least from a standpoint of the book is not the only thing that I have to do. So when I'm, when I'm not writing on the book, I'm kind of working on other, other things. What I've got to make sure is that it's easy to say, oh, I'm not going to attack that today because I've got all this other stuff to do. When in fact I've got to ask myself, am I doing these other 5 things because they have to get done today? Or am I just going to avoid doing that and make myself feel better? So, yeah.

So share with us, share with us, this book is going to be about those people that may not have listened before.

Yeah. Like I said, I think that the working title will be the Peer Innovation Pentagon. And the idea was not to just make it in terms of a list, but to give it shape because I think that There's something about that in the way a shape comes together that plays with this, besides the typical alliteration to it and the fact that I'll have to have a great subtitle which really kind of explains, you know, why I should care to read it, okay? You know, that the Pentagon Principles, you know, the— excuse me, the Pentagon isn't something like, you know, like a book about the armed services or something, you know, or about our military defense. It's, it's, it's the number 5 and it's, um, yeah. And, and aimed, you know, so someone immediately knows, ah, okay, this is why this would be relevant to me. This is why I might care to read it. This is, or this is the business problem we're solving for. More accurately, and as Ryan Folman likes to remind me constantly, which he's right always too. So, but, so yeah, so there we, so there we go. And I'm just cranking at it as best I can all the time. I'm actually, I got in last night from Boca Raton, Florida. And, you know, as you know, I did fly through Dallas-Fort Worth. I was there for a little while, you know, and I, And it was really funny because of course your text to me was, yeah, welcome to balmy, you know, Dallas-Fort Worth. And of course, you know, and then I'm, as I'm walking down the jetway, seeing my breath, you know, as I'm going in the gate area, I'm like, wow. But actually we didn't get delayed much. We did have to get de-iced last night, interestingly enough, which delayed us a little bit, but in this case—

Yeah, we tend to get ice here. We don't get snow, we get ice. But this is, that was really the first one that we've had this winter.

So, And I get— and so I'm just really home today trying to catch up on a bunch of things. And then I'm taking the overnight flight to Newark. And I'm meeting my partner in crime, Dr. Cecilia Hauser, who the two of us teach a graduate course at Rutgers. And we're meeting, going to grab some breakfast. I'm going to spend some time. I'm actually doing a 2-hour lecture for another group. While I'm at Rutgers and then teaching Friday night from 6 to 9 and then from 9 to 3 on Saturday.

So bomb and balmy Newark. And yeah, well, you were in Florida, so you live in Southern Cal, so we're not feeling too sorry for you.

And I'm back by 11 PM Pacific time Saturday night.

So it's a rest for the weary. No rest for the weary. But the website is Leo Bottari. It's LeoBottari.com. Pearinnovation.co will take you to the same place. You can keep up with Leo's progress on the book, which the Lord willing will be out summertime, give or take. So we're looking forward to that. If you find yourself, um, not properly challenged, then hopefully we provided a little bit of insight and some questions that you can ask yourself and some ways that you can kind of lead the parade to be part of a high-performing group or team. That really is what we do here. It is what anyone can do, but most people don't. So we hope that you're one of the ones that will get out there and do it.

There we go. All right, everyone have a great weekend.

You too.

Bye.

To learn more about our show and what we do, to submit questions to us, and to subscribe to What Anyone Can Do Podcast, please visit our website, whatanyonecandodo.com. What Anyone Can Do Podcast is hosted by Leo Battari and me, Randy Cantrell. Music provided by Kevin MacLeod is Vibe 8. Licensed under Creative Commons by Attribution 3.0 license. Thanks for watching or listening. We hope you'll share the podcast.