Why Are Good Workers Quitting So Fast?

Ever feel like your office has turned into an episode of Survivor? Except instead of competing for a million bucks, people are just trying to survive the workday. Drama, gossip, negativity— they spread like wildfire. And before you know it, your best people are mentally checked out or handing in their 2 weeks' notice. Meanwhile, customers are feeling the shake-up and your bottom line is taking So, what's really going on here? Why are teams crumbling? And more importantly, what's pushing your top talent out the door? And that's what we're talking about today on Marc Haine Live. Welcome to this episode. This is where small business owners and entrepreneurs develop new skills to help them create the jaw-dropping, show-stopping experience that their customers and their employees deserve. I am your host, Customer and Employee Experience Strategist Marc Haine. And I am so glad that you are here with us today. My guest for this episode is the Team Revivalist, Twyla Onderka. And today, we are going to be pulling back the curtain on the hidden culture killers that are driving your best employees and your customers right out the door. I do have one simple request. If there is somebody in your circle who could benefit from the insights that we're sharing with you today, please do them a favor and pass along a link to this episode. It is so important to share what you know because I believe that you probably have a friend somewhere out there who's a manager of an operation who's bitching and bellyaching about not being able to keep the staff, or the staff seems so disengaged. Share a link to this episode because I know we're going to be covering some really Great content for helping you solve that issue. Look, I know perfectly well that you have built a great team. I mean, you interview people for positions. You hire people and you're picking the very best people for your business. Talented people, strong potential. Everything looks good on paper. But lately, something feels off, doesn't it? Productivity is dipping. Engagement is fading. And the The office feels more like a battleground than a place of collaboration. Meetings are filled with polite nods but zero enthusiasm. Or worse, your people, the ones that you can't afford to lose, they're the ones who seem the most checked out. Not just for you but for your team of dedicated employees as well. And that brings us to our Question of the Day. So, is your workplace culture silently pushing your best people and your best customers out the door? Are you sure? I'd love for you to share your experiences. Why don't you go ahead, share a link to this episode on your favorite social media platform. Hashtag it #ExperienceLeadership and put down your comments. That way, you can be part of this conversation. Leadership isn't about titles and it's definitely not about micromanaging your way to success. That will never work. It's about creating an environment where people thrive, where teams actually want to show up, and where excellence isn't forced. It's inspired. And if there's anyone who knows how to transform a struggling workplace into a powerhouse of engagement, and performance, it's today's guest. With over 20 years of experience in the dental industry, Twyla Onderka has seen the best and the absolute worst of workplace cultures. She's been the employee trying to make an impact, the leader tasked with fixing dysfunction, and the strategist who understands exactly what it takes to create a team that stays, performs, and loves what they do. She's not just a leadership developer. She's the team revivalist. Someone who knows how to turn around toxic cultures, empower employees, and build organizations where trust, collaboration, and success aren't just buzzwords. They're the standard. Twyla, welcome to the show! It's so great to have you.

Hi! Thank you for having me. I'm so excited.

Yeah, it's been awesome. I've been waiting so long for this conversation. I think we talked like a year ago about having you on the show. And I'm so glad we're able to make it happen today.

I'm finally here.

Yay! Hey, before we get too deep into today's topic, could you just tell us a little bit about who your ideal customers are and how you serve them?

So, my ideal customers would be customers who want to make a change, who are not afraid of change, and who are looking to really elevate their customer service for their clients and their patients and their customers.

Yeah, so you've experienced firsthand what happens when leadership shifts from kind of this empowerment mindset to control mindset. What was for you, what was the turning point? What was your experience?

Oh, I've had several experiences where I've come into a position and I'm just so passionate and so excited to do the work that my managers or leaders hired me to do. And it works for a while. It works for a while. They make sure that I'm on board with the process. I'm on board with their goals. But when you get caught up in the grind and the work and the day-to-day hustle of just getting patients through the door and delivering them a service, you forget about what you're really doing there. So, you kind of lose your heart and you continue to work.

But you lose focus of your passion and what you're really delivering to the client or And so, would it be fair to say that part of that is because we hire people because we have a job description that needs to be fulfilled. But we're also hiring people who in their own right, I believe, have their own kind of superpower. And if we hold them in the box of this job description, we might not even be able— we might not even be tapping into their best performance.

That's entirely true. Also, they have a dream. They're doing the work for a reason.

Yes.

We have to really remember as leaders, what are they doing the work for? And remind them that we're here to support them just as much as they're here to support us.

Yeah, I mean, we start our businesses with a passion wanting to make a change in some form or fashion. I don't know anybody who says, I'm going to start a business and dedicate my 80 hours a week to making some coin. I believe that people go into— I love welding. I love the creative aspect of welding and the problem-solving component of welding. And that's why I'm a welder. And so, to your point, when businesses kind of lose focus and they become more profit-centric about, oh my God, we have to generate more sales. We have to lower expenses, make more sales, lower expenses, and so on. We kind of work ourselves into this grind. where we're not looking at the impact we're making. But we're looking at this quarter's numbers and next quarter's projections.

That's right. And I feel when you do that, you create yourself a ceiling. If you're focusing on the numbers and the productivity only, you have a ceiling to reach. But when you're focusing on the dream and the service and And the reasons why we're doing what we're doing, it's endless. There's no ceiling to that. So therefore, your financials and your productivity, the numbers will follow.

Yeah. Well, and to your point, I think I would love that the biggest problem that businesses have is, oh my God, I have to scale again. It's such a big jump because scaling is costly and it's expensive and it's challenging. But being able to look at it in a light of, hey look, we have an opportunity now to scale. Can we mitigate our environments? Can we mitigate our systems in order to do this effectively? But I still believe that there is absolutely nothing wrong with having people lined out your door because you're just so busy you can't get to everybody. It just means that you just proved to the world you're in demand.

That's right. And you just mentally, you provide just an elevated experience for them because you know that it's something that not everybody has access to. So, you really want to deliver something really great to the people who have access to you.

Yeah. So, what are some early signs that a workplace culture might be going downhill?

Well, when you start questioning what's going on in all sense— numbers, staff motivation, and productivity and performance. When those kind of things start to get you questioning, that's an early sign that you have to really look at your leadership and make sure that you are engaging everyone who's on board with the goals that you've set. And keep them moving forward positively.

Yeah, so what role then does leadership or lack thereof play in driving away top talent? Because a lot of times when I'm talking to entrepreneurs and business managers, they're always blaming the staff. Oh, they're too lazy. Nobody wants to work here. Everybody wants more money. There's not enough people in the workplace, and so on. So, how much of the problem that we're having with engagement and attrition, how much does that have to play on leadership? And how much of it does it have to play on the types of people that we're hiring? It's like, nobody stays in a job for more than 2 years anyway. So, why do I even have to bother training them?

Right. I think what's happening is we're waiting till it's too late. To try and find out what's going on. I've witnessed a lot of times where somebody has left and they told the leader, leadership, or management one reason why they left. But they've told me as a fellow employee all sorts of other reasons why they left. And so then, I asked them, did you tell the manager? Did you tell the leader that? Well, no. It's just I found this place. It's closer. I get more money. So, at that point, it's too late. So, we have to constantly check in with our teams. Make sure that they're still reaching their dreams. Make sure that they're still motivated to help us reach ours. It's easy to forget to do that because you are in the day-to-day getting tasks done. But you really have to make that a task of yours to check in, to revisit, to clarify performance or roles, and clarify visions and goals.

Yeah. So, I mean, in the places that you've been affecting and that you've been consulting with and working in, for the business managers and business owners tuning in. How does a dysfunctional culture affect elements like collaboration, innovation, and problem-solving within the team?

When you have a dysfunctional workplace, you don't have a consistent culture. So, your workplace culture is really important. And if people are losing sight of the workplace culture, they start to create their own workplace culture. Once they start to create their own workplace cultures, they start to talk about their own ideas of the culture, which then don't align with what the organization is ultimately trying to move forward and do. So, that creates a lot of office chatter. When the office chatter starts to happen, you start to find that there's less and less trust for each other. Because one person's saying this, the other person is saying something different or maybe disagrees. And then, all of a sudden, people have opinions. And those opinions are not necessarily focusing on a proactive way to manage whatever concern or roadblock they're facing.

Yeah, it's really interesting because you bring up a really good point because you mentioned being onboarded when you were an employee working for somebody. You got the onboarding thing and then you're left alone. But then, you lose the dream because you're so busy kind of just going through the grind of the day. And the challenge I think with the onboarding process is it's such a finite experience for new employees.

Right.

Like I've done lots of speaking now around the country about going from onboarding to forever boarding. Because I truly believe what happens at the onboarding is we bring them on board. We teach them all the policies and give them copious amounts of manuals and policies to review. And then, once we figure that they're good after about 3 months, we cut them loose and we let them be. But then, the poor employees get inundated with all the unwritten rules.

Yeah.

All the rules of all the different stakeholders within your business. And it's like, hey, if you need me, text me in the yard. Or if you need me, if I'm in a meeting with somebody, Just take a message. And so, everybody's got these little micro rules that are all unwritten. But then, they conflict. Like my daughter had that issue when she was working at a trailer rental company. And she had one sales rep says, if I'm in the yard, just text me. Don't call me because I might be with somebody. And so then, she takes out her cell phone. She starts texting. And then, her boss comes in and she goes, you know, our policy is that you're not allowed to have your cell phone at your desk.

Right.

Right? And she's like, but, but, but I'm trying to text John because John's in. You're not supposed to have your cell phone at the desk. Right? And so then, when she lives up to that, John comes running in. Why didn't you text me? Because I'm not allowed to have my cell phone at the desk.

Right? And let's talk about how she feels when somebody says, hey, you know what? You're not allowed to have your cell phone at the desk. I know that you are doing something other than work because I see you on your cell phone. That's distrust. Okay.

It is.

Now, I feel like this person doesn't trust me. Now, and when she's trying everything she possibly can to accommodate the systems that are working for the organization at the moment. So, and you brought up another interesting fact. You said, we're given all this information. We're given given these manuals. So great. For the first 3 months, we remember what those things say. But then, the next 3 months, we're told we don't have time to look back into the manuals and make sure that we're in line and in alignment with what the goals are.

Hmm.

So, it's really important that we take the time to save the time. Allow your employees an hour, maybe once a month to sit down and really reflect on what their role is and how they are really working hard to make sure that they're meeting all the rules and the goals set.

Yeah, well, and to your point, if your employee doesn't have the time to do that, the rest of your employees haven't done it. And so, just like vision and mission, I remember that there was one company that used to go through and they used to— the manager used to spot check all the staff. What's our mission? Right? And you'd have to stop what you were doing and go, our mission. And you'd have to verbatim reflect the vision and the mission. And it's like, but wait a second. Just by doing that, you're going against your vision and your mission because you're creating this Spanish Inquisition every week, right? So, it's interesting. Hey, so I'd like to get into some strategies that owners can consider to start implementing, to start changing the tide to this idea of being in a toxic work environment, especially this idea of trust. And we'll get to that right after this.

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Welcome back. I am speaking with the Fabulous, Twyla Onderka. There you go, Twyla. You've just been called fabulous for the first time today. So Twyla, what's the first step a leader should take to assess the health of their workplace culture?

Well, like I said previously, you need to take time to save time. There's so many organizations that I've walked into and I say, okay, you know what? When was your last meeting? Because I'm really excited to collaborate with you. And they're like, oh, meetings? Gosh, we haven't had a meeting for years. So, it's important to sit down with your team, really collaborate with them, and allow them to have some decision-making power. The decision-making power will help them be part of what you're doing there.

That would be the first thing. Yeah. So, this idea of giving them decision-making power. Again, I talked to lots of managers and entrepreneurs There seems to be a fear behind giving employees any kind of power that if I ask them to do something, or if I ask them to give me ideas, then they're going to want to take the credit, or they're going to want a pay raise, right? And so, there seems to be even maybe a lack of humility on the leadership front Right. That somebody else, an employee could tell me something about my business.

Right.

You know, one story that comes to mind immediately was when I was doing a SWOT analysis at a hotel. And the owner found out I was doing the SWOT analysis interviewing. I interviewed the supervisors and all the front-end managers. But then, I started interviewing the staff. And he says, I understand you're doing this thing. And he says, why are you interviewing the dishwasher? And I said, well, because the dishwasher has some insights into your business. And he says, oh, the only thing a dishwasher could tell me is when his smoke break is and when his payday. And it's like I said, you don't think that a dishwasher has insight into his bottlenecks and what slows him down and what makes him inefficient? You don't think that he could share that with us? And he was adamant that a dishwasher was a dishwasher. There's nothing a dishwasher could tell me about my business.

Well, a dishwasher is an important part of the team. And the dishwasher is working towards a goal. So, it's important to remember that the dishwasher became a dishwasher because there was something about it that intrigued him. He didn't become a manager. He's not looking for a managerial position. He's looking to do the best that he can in the environment that he's Hmm. So again, just as the leader has to trust the employee, the employee has to trust the leader. And if there's a mutual trust there, then they're going to be able to collaborate with each other.

Yeah.

Me as a dental assistant, I'm an expert at being a dental assistant. My manager who is not a dental assistant and who doesn't sit in the chair every day maybe loses sight of some really innovative things that we could be doing in order to elevate our services. So, the fear of somebody taking away your job should be put on the back burner because the positives that you can get from actually giving the decision-making power to your team That's going to show how strong you are as a leader and a manager. That's going to elevate your organization. Therefore, you can take credit for that.

Yeah, it's interesting because again, I've dealt with all sorts of people. A perfect one would be telecom people. You know, when you try to— you know that it's up for renewal. And so, you call them and say, can you give me the best deal? And they give you a quote and all this. And then, when you talk to a new company, they give you a better deal. So, you call up your existing company and you say, this company's giving me a better deal. Can you match it? And they're like, oh, I'm terribly sorry. We can't. And so then, you go with the new company. And then like 2 weeks later, you get on a call with somebody and they say, oh, we can match that price now. We can do that. It's like, why didn't you do that before? Oh well, we can't give decision-making capabilities to the people on the front lines because they'll just make an abuse out of it. And it's like, ah, to your point, there's the trust thing, isn't it?

Correct. And another thing that often happens is the leader, or the manager, or the owner of the organization, they sometimes fear failure. So, but I question what's the difference? Either you make a decision as a leader and fail, or your team makes a decision as a team or as an employee and they fail. I mean, the failure is going to happen. We're all human. We all make mistakes.

And it's how we learn.

And it's how we learn. That's right. But trust in that because I guarantee you, once you give the decision power over to the experts in their field, you're going to be more successful and face less Failure.

Yep. And on top of it all, you just kind of qualify the reason for their existence. When you tap into the brilliance that they bring to the forefront, then you tap into their knowledge. And it's knowledge that you can't possibly have because you're not doing the work. Even if you grew up through the industry, right? You grew up through the industry and now you're the general manager of whatever, the regional manager of whatever. And you look at a dishwasher or you look at another position, you go, you know, I know what it's like because I've been there. And it's like, but you know some of it. But you don't know what the reality is today. And being able to be open to that I think is the key, isn't it?

That's absolutely the key. If you're not open to innovative ideas from other people, you're going to stay stuck. You're not going to be able to grow because change Means growth. But if you're fearing change, then you're not going to grow.

Well, and then you're looking down the street at your competitors and you're going, why are they doing so well? It seems like they're doing really well. They have lineups all the time. They have good reviews on social media. People are talking about them. Why are they doing so well and we're not?

They're never looking for staff. Why are their staff there for 20 years?

Yep, yep. So, how do you think leaders can shift from being kind of this reactive, putting out fires mindset to being proactive and really fostering that thriving team?

Well, I have a few steps that I believe are really important in fostering your thriving team. And the first step is to assess where you are. Really assess, okay, where am I? Where am I going? And who's with me? Once you do that, you understand that you need to get a commitment from the people who are with you. If you express where you want to go to them in a clear way, they're going to be able to say, you know what? I am on board with you. Then, you assess the roadblocks that you're hitting. Towards your vision. Once you assess the roadblocks, you can then collaborate with your team and come up with ways that you're going to overcome those roadblocks. After you've done that, then you have— and through that process, you develop the trust. You develop the reliance and the loyalty to the goals and the vision of the organization.

That's brilliant. Hey, for anybody tuning in right now because you just said some really amazing things, how can they get hold of you if they want to get in contact with you?

So, my website's currently in the works. However, I am on social media. I've got Facebook and Instagram. And I'm part of the Devon Chamber of Commerce. So, they can look up the Chamber of Commerce and they've got a A little slot of information for me there.

Great! And so, they can also find you on LinkedIn as well. And we'll put all the links in the show notes anyway.

Right. LinkedIn, I forgot.

So, we talked about trust and leadership. For environments where trust is quite low, how do you think leaders can start building or rebuilding trust within their team?

I think the first thing that they have to do is just ask their team where they're at. If they ask them and the team is like, hey, yeah, no problem. I am so comfortable in my position. Then, that's positive. But most times, they're going to say, you know what? I thank you for asking me. I've never been asked that before. And I would love to share with you where my frustrations are or what I'm having a difficult time doing in this environment. Just being asked, I think, is not happening. And that right there just fosters a little bit of care and a little bit of trust.

I'm a big fan of Stephen Covey's trust bank account metaphor where the whole premise of the metaphor is that trust is like a bank account where every time we have an interaction with somebody, we're making deposits or withdrawals within the bank account. And so, a lot of the positive stuff we do is creating the deposits. And if we make a mistake every once in a while, it's a-okay because we haven't become overdrawn. But so many teams really have had kind of these negative interactions with their leaders And the leaders themselves have forced kind of this overdraft of trust.

Wow!

For them to go up to their team now and say, hey, Twyla, you've been with us for a while now. So, I'd like to know how you're doing. And it's like you're going back to, when was I manipulated? When was I given heck because I had to leave 5 minutes early? When was a time off refused because I had to take my daughter or my son to the doctor and they told me I absolutely couldn't do it and I had to Find and scramble and crisis and all this. And so, you go back to like the history of all the things that prove a level of distrust. And now, the manager's coming to you and going, hey, things are about to change. How you doing, Twyla?

For sure, I understand that. And you know what? If that's where the organization is at, which is a pretty— it's an important time to reassess what you're doing. Another thing that they can do is start listening. Just start listening. And they're going to hear where they can make some improvements. Once they take a little piece from here and there, they can start putting the puzzle back together and start showing instead of just talking it through. They can start showing that they are there for the team.

Yeah. But again, it takes the leader has to shift from this boss mindset though. first, right? They have to shift from this, I'm the boss, everything I say goes, and nobody else matters mindset into, I have a group of people who are really pretty brilliant if I give them the chance to be. And so, why don't I just tap into that?

Yeah, again, they have to be willing to change. That's the number one thing.

Would it be fair to say that if people are struggling with this, like they recognize that they've burnt some bridges, They recognize that their team is detached and even disengaged. And of course, the attrition is like going through a rotating door of people. Would it be fair to say that maybe one of the steps people should be looking at is maybe bringing in an outsider to help them create that clarity and to help them rebuild that trust?

Well, thank you. That is correct. A fresh set of eyes can be very helpful. A non-biased opinion or a non-biased guide is something that can really help. If I come into your organization and I say, hey, you know what? I am here to help the organization. But I'm also here to help you really love what you do. You spend 10 hours a day, 6 days a week here. It's really important that I'm able to help you find the things that you love about this job.

And bringing in an outsider with a fresh pair of eyes might be able to— they become the trusted advisors. So, the staff might be a little bit more open about what is going on rather than trying to go up to the middle manager or the CEO at a town hall and, okay everybody, just tell me what's wrong. And it's like, I shouldn't say anything because that would be a career-limiting Right.

You know, I once worked with a dream team. And that dream team just— we were able to grow so much. And we were able to increase the productivity of the office. And it was all due to a manager who really came in, really was the middleman between the organization and the team. And we achieved so much. Once the organization saw the growth and saw the productivity, there was a decision made to, okay, that manager is going to go and we're going to bring in somebody else who's focused on the numbers because we're really seeing a lot of profit now. Let's keep this moving. Once the focus became the numbers, That dream team was no longer invested in. And I don't mean financially invested in. I don't mean trips places and gifts all the time, but truly cared for and truly represented. Once that went away, the dream team did fall apart.

Amazing.

Yeah, there was such a change. And I just I solely believe that it's so important to just invest and care. And that doesn't cost anything. Yeah.

Well, and part of it as well is when you bring new leaders into an organization, the habit is, hey, you're experienced. Why don't you just go in, find your way? And there's no kind of real onboarding for leaders. And I mean, I think there was a stat somewhere that I saw that 15% of people who come in as a leader, CEO, or whatever upper management who doesn't get onboarded, 15% of them suffer and they leave because they're not effective. Because they haven't been able to understand what the culture is all about and they haven't been able to adapt. So, I could see that happen.

And the simple key there is assessing where you are. And assessing where you want to go as an organization and as a culture.

Love that. Hey, when we come back, I'd like to talk about some cautionaries and pitfalls. I'm always afraid that people tune into this and they'll see a new idea and they'll go, right, for the next 30 days, this is what we're going to do. And so, I want to talk about some cautionaries and pitfalls so that we really look and focus towards more permanent solutions rather than just the band-aiding. And we'll get to that right after this.

After this.

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Welcome back! We are having a great discussion. I hope you're getting tons of value from it. As evident from our discussion today, you can tell that Twyla and I are deeply dedicated to supporting business leaders just like you. So, if you're in the midst of planning a leadership retreat or an industry conference and you're looking for some amazing content, to bring to your group, or you're just needing some expert guidance, we're just a message away. Feel free to reach out to us for conversations about your unique challenges, or maybe even to discuss how we can collaborate to achieve your goals. Our link is in the show notes. Don't be afraid to reach out. We're here to serve. Twyla, what are some of the biggest mistakes leaders try to make when they're trying to improve the workplace? Because we've talked about kind of what got us to this position. But now, it's like we want to shake up the tree. We want to shake the tree, come up with something new. But we're making mistakes along the way. What are some of those mistakes?

Oh, one of the biggest mistakes is just not listening, not receiving from your team. I think team members, when they're truly passionate about what they're doing and when they're truly invested in what they're doing, they're going to say, hey, you know what? I did this the other day. I think this is going to be a little bit better if we can make the decision to improve a certain something. The manager says, or the leader says, we don't have time for that. Let's revisit that another time. That's really putting up a roadblock and not allowing your team member to be innovative, or creative, or part of the vision. So, the biggest thing that leaders do is they just don't take the time to try something different that's suggested by their team members.

And the minute we shut down people, the minute we shut people down, they will stop contributing. The minute somebody comes to you and says, hey boss, I think I have a really great idea. And you slap back with, oh, you don't know how much that would cost. Oh my God! That's— as opposed to actually listening. And listening means, that's really interesting. In my book, I talk about the yes and, the improv philosophy of yes and. And so, looking at it and saying, yes and what would that look like? And what would it take to make something happen?

Wow!

And what is the objective we're trying to What's the objective we're trying to achieve? And does this adhere to kind of our mission and what we're trying to do, right? It's to listen means to ask really good questions.

And we have to remember that when somebody comes to us with a real good idea, or if somebody comes to us with a little bit of a frustration, takes a lot of courage. It takes a lot of courage for somebody to come to somebody who's their leader and say, hey, I have this idea, or hey, I have this frustration. If we shut it down and we don't really receive that, it crushes them, especially if they're really passionate about what they're doing.

Well, and I like that you use the word courage and then the word frustration because I think it does take courage to do it. But sometimes, it's just out of sheer frustration And the worst time to shut somebody down is when they're really frustrated about a consistent issue and you're not willing to do anything about it.

Yeah. And that frustration, it is mitigated when you open the door before that frustration becomes a real problem.

Sure.

So, it's really important to make sure that your door is always open. to feedback and ideas.

Yeah, I've been a big fan. Sorry, sorry, Twyla. I've been a big fan over the last year about this idea that managers in themselves have too many tasks to do. And they're not being given the ropes to be really effective leaders. And by that, I mean being able to sit down one-on-one with their charges, sit down one-on-one on a regular basis to be able to create that relationship, to be able to create a safe space where people can vet their fears, their frustrations, and so on. But then also give a safe space to be able to share ideas to make the workplace a better place to work.

Yeah, and that comes back to empowering your staff and allowing them to make some decisions. Because once they're making some decisions, They have confidence. And that confidence will allow them to be courageous and bring other ideas or frustrations to your door before it becomes a real problem and they want to quit. Love that.

That's absolutely true. Any other cautionaries?

I think just avoid the hustle culture. Take the time to save the time. I think that's so important. Another thing is if you're not helping, you're hindering. So, make sure that you have an idea of a helping hand for your team so that they can perform the roles to the best of their ability so that they can be part of what's going on.

So, that helping hand is not necessarily jumping into the foray to be the superstar to save the day. That helping hand could be, tell me what you need and let's see what resources we have to help you.

That's right. I recognize that there's a frustration here. Or I recognize that you're not able to perform as well as you'd like to. How can I help? How can I provide some resources or support for you so that you can feel confident and comfortable in what you're doing?

Love it. Twyla, this has been such a great conversation. Do you have any last thoughts about what we've been talking about today? Anything that we missed?

Well, not really. I think the only thing is that I really wanted to touch on the experience sometimes is much more valuable than the book smarts. So, Remember that when you have somebody coming into your organization that maybe doesn't really look awesome on paper, or maybe they do, but they come in and they're not really impressing you, it's important to really connect with their experiences, connect with their emotions. Their experiences and emotions will provide a much better result than just what they know.

Yeah, you can train skills. But you have to hire for, I think, values more than even attitude because I think values precede attitude. So, you're absolutely right that whole idea. And I think this is one area where I think AI is really hurting us when we're looking for the best people to fit to fit our industry or fit our businesses because we have all these screening tools now to be able to very quickly go through resumes and submissions and that sort of thing. And I find that they filter out people very, very quickly based on really kind of routine developments. So for instance, if you say that somebody's got to have an MBA. Well, does an MBA for a person out of university for 1 or 2 years beat out somebody who's got 15 years' experience.

Right.

Right?

And remember that when you hire somebody to be part of your team, they want to be there. They've accepted the interview. They've come in. They've talked to you. They're already trusting your organization enough to be there 5, 6 days a week. So, don't give up on them. I think you hired them for a reason. They started working for your organization for a reason. Don't give up on them. They are human and they are there because they want to do good things for your organization.

Yeah, I haven't met a single person yet who wakes up every morning and thinks, today, I'm just going to shag the dog. Today, I'm just going to slack off as much as I possibly can. Today, I'm just going to be no bloody good. Never met it. This has been great. Hey Twyla, could you remind everybody one more time how they can get a hold of you?

Yes. So, my name is Twyla Andjerica. I am part of Revive Team Solutions. You can find me on Facebook, Instagram, and LinkedIn.

Lovely! Twyla, I want to thank you so much for sharing your passion and your expertise with us today. It's been brilliant. Thank you for this conversation.

Thank you, Marc.

And why don't you let me know if this was of value to you? As always, my offer stands. If you'd like 30 minutes of my time to brainstorm your business with you and your team, feel free to book some time on my online calendar. The link is in the show notes. It's the one that's marked meetwith.marchaine.com. It would be my honor to be of service to you. And while you're at it, why don't you leave a comment or review about this episode? I'd love to get your feedback. Did you get any nuggets? Was this of value to you? And of course, if you haven't done so yet, please make sure that you're subscribed to this podcast. That way, you get notification each and every week when I bring you fresh new experts like Twyla to the forefront talking about business issues that affect you directly. My name is Marc Haine. I hope you stay safe, stay healthy, and I hope you dare to be the exception. Thank you, Marc.