Give Me 33 Mins, I’ll Show You How to Explode Your Sales in 2025
Matt Ryder, Kaden, and Dean break down insurance sales tactics for 2025, focusing on lead prioritization and dialing techniques. They mix practical strategies with personal stories and marketing insights for closing more deals.
If you contact someone within five minutes of them opting in, like, then you have a 100 times higher likelihood of making a sale. If you don't contact them in the first day, your chances, like, barely there. If a globe lead comes in and a social media lead comes in and a referral comes in, what's the priority.
For us? There will end up being three to four, because we'll have globe warm market referrals.
Right.
And then we'll have referrals from the leads, and then we'll actually have the lead source that we're generating from as well. With less than 5 of my sales came from leads that I dialed more than seven times.
Hey, guys, Matt and Kaden here, your two favorite podcasters. I think we're the third best podcast in America.
It's pretty dirty.
That's what my mom told me. She's not known for her accuracy. But, you know, it's a. It's a. I can put it on my website.
You could put that on your website. As long as one person has the opinion. And it's amazing that we've been able to build that with our headquartered offices being so far apart.
Yeah, Utah. What's going on? Utah.
Right.
So currently we're headquartered in Utah with an ancillary headquarters. So we have two. Two actual headquarters. Because there's so much quartering of heads required.
Yeah, it's getting pretty serious.
We're in the double Bay office, which, for those of you who don't realize how fancy that is. It's very fancy. It's like saying Manhattan, right?
Yeah.
Or the Jintao province.
Right.
You guys wouldn't know, though.
You guys wouldn't get it. You're probably poor and don't have six.
Packs, so beat it.
I don't want you listening to the fucking podcast.
All right?
Speaking of, I'm back in the gym. You can probably tell.
Yeah, I can tell already for sure.
Back in the gym, I just decided I started to watch. Like, I've just been not motivated for a while to just not really train consistently. I started watching Will Tennyson. You've seen him on YouTube, like a huge fitness influencer guy. But if you watch his videos, you'll see why I like him. He basically has the exact same sense of humor as me, and it's quite. It's quite funny to watch because he says a lot of this. Anyway, he's fun, but he's a huge fitness, like, YouTuber and he does really like entertaining videos. And I was like, you know what? I'll get back into it.
Over the edge.
I'm back into it.
Yeah.
How many days I'm gonna be doing? 4. Fun fact, when I was training for my wedding, I have, like. You ever heard of, like, myostatin, like, inhibitor?
Yeah.
So. Yeah. So I have, like, extremely low genetic myostatin levels. So, like, I haven't trained consistently for two or three years, but I, like, my muscle mass never goes away.
Right.
Like, I never get.
Yeah.
And so I remember when I was training for my wedding, I. Me and my trainer, we had to, like. I kept not fitting into my suit. I had to get my suit altered a bunch of times. And we. We ended up just doing sled, assault bike, and like, high rep crossfit, because otherwise I would put on, like a good kilogram a month. Like two. Two, two. Two to three pounds of muscle every month. And we were, like, trying to. We were trying to figure out ways not to put on muscle, and we were, like, having to war game my food, and we were like. I was like, what's happening? He was. It was pretty funny.
What's funny about that is then what ends up happening is a bunch of people come up to you and they're like, how do I build muscle?
Yeah.
Have an odd genetic makeup. Yeah.
Yeah.
I don't know.
You're the right person to listen to.
Yeah, exactly. It's funny, though, because, like, whenever I, like, lift weights consistently, I get, like, obnoxiously large quite quickly. So we'll see.
Here he comes, Dean.
Here he comes.
Yeah.
Yeah, it should be fun. But anyway, I don't want that to happen, so I'll try and keep it in check. I'm sure now that I'm 41, surely that won't be the case, but we'll see what happens.
But.
All right, so what we're gonna do today is with the guys with insurance, right? We are bringing in dialer, we're bringing in leads that we're gonna generate. So I think we have a meeting later on this week with the new marketing company that we've hired. I actually reached out to some of my Navy SEAL friends the other day to see if we can get some intros for some people to try and get some vet leads, because we're focusing a lot on vets. And, you know, do you want to explain what it is we can do for people?
Yeah.
With the. Like, what we're doing for the veterans is really helping educate them on their VA benefits, because for those of you that are veterans, then you know how good the VA is at Explaining all of the benefits that you get after the service, which is incredibly clear and every veteran understands it. So we're providing a lot of education there, helping them just plan for end of life services. You know, if that includes selling insurance, then selling insurance, which usually they get.
A free will, right? Just for, just for hanging out. That's not a will. Hingson. We would give them away for free, but there's only one and he's already a vet, so gave it to himself. The selfish cuckoo.
Right.
What a bastard.
But yeah, so what we're going to be doing so is we're going to be installing dialer into the, into the company. And so all the sniper insurance guys, all the guys who want it are going to be going forth and getting dialer and then we're going to be providing leads and all that kind of stuff. And I know that like, you know a bit about dialer, but what I wanted to do is actually go through because we can pretty much sort of decide how the leads are called because it's like automated manual dialing. So one of the problems that I see with insurance is that they, they use a lot of like power dialers. Now the issue with power dialers is that like, they're like, from a regulatory and compliance standpoint, they can be a little bit hit or miss depending on how the leads are generated. And you don't always have a lot of control over how leads are actually on the generation side when you're an insurance rep because you're buying leads and so the chances that you're auditing it, you know, it's probably just not there. And so but you're the one making the call. So if, if, if they don't do their, you know, their TCP opt in box correctly, then then you can end up kind of like in a bit of a bad way.
Right.
So we're going to be doing it for the guys.
Right.
And there are a couple of cool things that we can do. And so what we're going to be doing is going through and I'm going to ask you, like, how do we think we should be calling these guys? For how long?
Right.
You've done a lot of insurance calls, you know, the kind of leads that we're going to be getting. And so like, how long should we be calling them for? So the first thing I would say is from a, like, how many, let's go through like lead sources. So we have a look at how many lead sources are there going to be for us?
There will end up Being three to four lead sources. Because we'll have globe referrals, warm market referrals.
Right.
And, and then we'll have referrals from the leads and then we'll actually have the lead source that we're generating from as well.
Okay, let's go through the social. So the, the leads that are coming direct from say globe, for example, like what's the priority that we want to be calling them? Because the way that we can do it is we can like waterfall the leads in.
Right.
And then we can have them prioritized by rep. We can have them prioritized by lead source and then we can. But we need, because it is true automations like we want to have a priority. So if a globe lead comes in and a social media lead comes in and a referral comes in, what's the priority?
Social media.
Social media.
All right.
Yeah, because the globe lead, when we get those, we don't know when they were generated. There's not necessarily a huge importance for speed delete.
Okay, right, yep.
So referrals number two.
Yeah, probably the referral number two.
Yeah.
And then globe leads.
Yeah, Okey dokey.
And with these social media leads, the priority is then going to be speed to lead.
Speed lead asap, pretty much with any lead generation, isn't it?
Yeah, well you know, we got some guys that do, you know, like they might do like webinars and they want like a minute delay.
Right, okay.
You know, you know, and so like speed to lead is like our system. We'll set it up so that we'll API it directly in and then within like so API is 0.1 second from one place to the other. So you're looking at like directly done. Then it has to API into its own system inside social media.
Right.
Like, you know, and then it's straight out. So you're looking at like 0.2 to 0.3 seconds by the time it's inside of the dialer and then it will be the next call in the queue. So like the whole point is that they are still sort of on the phone, you know.
Yeah.
Like when that, like when that happens and then what that means is that they're, they're available. I think a lot of people, there are a couple truths. There was a study just released by MIT and they worked with HubSpot and they went through 16,000 leads. They sort of followed a full journey over a number of different companies and then they figured out that if you contact someone within five minutes of them opting in like so true. Five minute, then you have a 100 times higher likelihood of making a sale.
That's crazy. 100 times, isn't it?
And every single minute was like a huge drop off.
Yep.
But basically, if you don't contact them in the first day, your chance of selling them is, is like barely there, you know, so like, speed, speed, speed to lead is, I think from what I can see and from what I can see across all the accounts that are on dialer and then also some of the consulting clients that I still have and stuff like that. If you can nail your speed to lead, like, you're pretty much good to go, that, that, that will do a significant jump. I got a text today, I got a text yesterday, like, lovely dudes. And they, they sent me a message. It was like, here it is. It was, thanks. Thanks a ton, guys. Dollars been working amazing. Pickup rates increase. Booking rates increased over the first two days. The team were loving it, still adjusting. I know we were a special team.
Right.
Wasn't the smoothest road getting us up and running, but the learning curve is pretty steep. But we're very happy with how everything's going so far. They just couldn't figure out their integrations. Their tech guy just didn't know how to use Zapier, which is actually one of the reasons why we want to do it for the guys. Because then we know that it'll be there because just like not many, you know, sales dudes or insurance guys are going to sit in there and work out all their zap situations and, you.
Know, it ends up just being the wild, wild west.
Right? Yeah.
When you're, when you're paying for your own leads, they're all going into your own CRM. You have a lot less control over speed to lead.
Right.
Because if you generate one, one comes in. But you're on the phone with somebody, obviously you have to be on the phone with that person. And then every minute that goes by, that goes down and it just.
Yeah.
You know, when you're able to operate as a team.
Yeah.
Everything's easier. It helps. All right, so how many times should we dial? Day one.
How many?
Day one?
Yep.
All right, three. And then how. What's the redial time in between? So do you find, like, try and get those dials out like really quickly? Like say 10, 15 minutes in between? Or do you think like maybe leaving.
An hour in between from 1 to 2? Generally you're going to be 15 to 30 minutes.
Yep.
And then the third dial, you want to be 45 minutes to an hour and a half after the second one.
Okay.
And then day two.
I personally would hit them twice.
Yep.
And then.
Yep.
So we'll do a readout time of like 90 minutes. That's a minimum redoubt time. So it can be more, you know, I mean, and then I would say day three to like, seven. Really what you want is like, you know, sort of seven to eight times in a week is sort of, you know, a good marker. You can. There's no, like, hard rule on that. I just think it's like a good. It's a good practice. Also, from what I can see, once you hit 10 dials, it's like a giant waste of time.
Yeah.
The chances of you selling them are significantly. Everybody's data that I've seen, my own Personal Data After 7 to 10, everybody's a little bit different. 7 to 10. But between 7 to 10 dials, it's like nobody buys after that.
Yeah, Well, I think what. What it is from. From what I can see is that it's. It's, you know, if you have a bucket of 100 people, right. And let's say 60 of them will. 40 of them will never pick up a phone number.
That.
Which they don't know.
Right.
Like, there's probably 30 of them. That one ever picked that up. They don't know. And there's 10 of them that are just never pick up their phone.
Yep. Yeah.
I mean, just ever, under any circumstance. And then. So now you've got. So you've got 60 people left over. So if you get in touch with 20 of the hundred the first day now. Now you've got. Now you've got 40 out of. Out of a hundred.
Yeah.
You know, and so like, the percentage. The percentages are drastically skewed. Hello. Every single time.
Right.
And so you're just dealing with a bucket with it. With. You're still. You're fishing in the same bucket all the time, and the efficacy just gets lower and lower and lower and lower because there's just a bunch of fish in it that don't bite, you know, and it's. But that's what text and email and stuff like that is supposed to do.
At the same time, like, if you're, like, if you're an independent insurance agent, you're buying all your own leads and you can't. You're not having enough success that you can buy enough to be able to dial and keep that under 10 dials, then it is what it is. You got to call them more.
Right.
Like, you You've got to keep searching for. Even though it's rare, it happens, and you've got to keep searching for it if that's the situation that you're in. But ideally, I know, you know, from. From my own personal data, it was like, what's the number? Less than 5% for sure. I don't remember the exact. We'll just stick with. Less than 5% of my sales came from leads that I dialed more than seven times.
Oh, yeah, dude, it's just like in, like, it. Listen, one of my. One of my favorite things to hear is, like, there's gold in the list. There's really not, mate. It's really not how much you're saying there is. Unless you've been doing nothing.
Right.
Like, unless you've just been doing absolutely nothing, then like sometimes. But you're better off sending an email to a really old list. Like, you're better off just sending an email that you'll get. You'll get like the amount of. Yeah, filter that way. Yeah, exactly. And then the people who raise their hand, give them a call. You can actually set up triggers to where if they, like, reply to an.
Email, you can send them in and.
Give them a call. All right, so we're gonna do day one, three, three times with 30 minutes in between. Day two, $2, 90 minutes in. Day three to seven, $1 each day. And then because they won't be working weekends anyway, so, like, you know what I mean? And then day eight to 21, I put like one dial every two to three days.
Right.
And that way that'll be like a super low priority. And if there's no leads coming through, like, at that particular moment, it'll give them a try. But, like, they're not going to be like, you know, they're not going to be getting hammered by any stretch of the imagination and they're not going to take away from speed to lead. Now, what are the states that are going to be calling? We're going to be focusing mainly on what? Arizona, Texas, Florida.
Arizona, Texas, Florida, Tennessee, easy. That will change. But for now, those four.
Okay.
And then we'll do. You want to do, like, we'll do local presence for those. Not for those particular states.
Yep, yep.
We won't do local presence down to the county because I think that's stupid, but I think the state is fine. Also, like, it gets expensive because you actually have to provision the numbers. So then you have to have like a number for each county and then do the mapping.
That sounds redundant.
Yeah. Also like, you know, you have living in a small town and all of a sudden some unknown number, you know, from that town is pulling you, like, going here. That's definitely Italian marketer.
Right?
Okay, cool. And then in terms of like, how do we want the guys to have them, like, pooled? So do we, do we. Do we want. Do you want people to be able to like, like, kind of pick and choose? Do we want to have the states made as individual campaigns and have them pulled in together like. Or is everyone going to be pretty much well versed on those. On those four? Or we just have they come in and then you can schedule a call with another person if they're not.
Yeah, that'll be exactly it. We want them all pooled together. And then if somebody happens to get one that they can't help that person with, which will come up, like, you know, if there's a health product and they don't have their health license or. Yeah, their license hasn't come through for one of those states yet, then they can schedule it with somebody in those states.
Okay, all right, cool. So all these go into one pool. We need to have the state identifier in there so that agent can schedule with another. Okay.
Okay. All right.
That's pretty much it. And like, what, like what. What information do you want? Do the reps need for it to come in with the lead?
Ideally, we need. Obviously we're going to have email, right. So. So email is already a given. We need one other identifier, whether that's their address. I. I think that's kind of overkill. Or date of birth.
Right.
That could be a really good one. Even age can. Can suffice. We just want.
We.
We need a couple of identifiers so that when we're doing the outbound. Yeah, we can confirm that information.
Okay. Okay, perfect. So, yeah, I got your name. Okay, so when we do the. So we'll do that on the opt in.
Right.
And then. Yeah, so we'll get like name, email, phone number, state, and then I think we redirect them to like a form they fill out that all gets combined into one and then sent in. And they've got as much information as what they need in order to kind of get the ball rolling on the free will.
Right?
Yep. Maybe like, branch as well.
That'd be a good one. Branch would be good. The more personal the information, the better. Not necessarily, like, you know, not, not, not too personal.
Okay, cool. All right, and then do we want to have a, like, we want to have a Separate script uploaded for each lead source.
It'll be two different scripts because there will be one referral one, and then we'll have one for veteran leads. And within the, within the script for vet leads, we'll have a new lead and a lead that's, you know, over a few hours old.
Okie dokie. A few hours old. And explain.
Well, just the way the, the Facebook works, right. When they fill out the marketing, as soon as they, they fill out the ad, Facebook automatically takes them to an another ad that's similar and is marketing for somewhat similar things. And so it's better to adjust your intro as if they're being called a lot because if they're not being called a lot and you've, but you've used an intro like they were being called a lot, you're safe, it's not going to hurt you.
Right.
But if it's two hours later and they've already gotten 17 calls because they filled out five ads.
Yeah, it's true.
And I'm treating them like a brand new lead. I'm, I'm getting steamrolled.
Okay, so like run me through like what's your, what's your opener for that?
Yeah.
Hey Matt, this is just Kaden. I apologize. You probably have already gotten some calls about this. I don't know why nobody updated. Looks like you had put in some info about potentially abc. Did you end up figuring that out or like what, what ended up happening?
Okay, cool. So you even do that even after a few hours you're fine? I guess it makes sense.
I used to do that after 20 minutes when I worked final expense. Literally if I did not have Speed Delete Within 20 minutes, I'm using that because what? Even if they haven't received any calls, they're like, oh no, I actually haven't gotten any calls about that.
But yeah, I was looking like, okay, well I'm glad I called. I can help you out.
I'm here.
Yeah, right.
But most of the time they're like, oh my God, I've been getting so many calls.
Yeah, right.
And, and you're ahead of it.
I guess that's the nature of insurance.
Right.
Because it like they're selling the lead. How many times?
Yeah, you know, they're selling the lead a bunch of times. And people go out. Like when people shop for insurance, they generally fill out a bunch of different places to price. Compare like with car insurance.
Yeah.
Like it's baked in society that with insurance all you think about is price.
Yeah.
Compare the meerkat.
Yeah.
There's a, there's an ad in Australia where they have like a meerkat. And when you say meerkat, when you say market with a Russian accent sounds like meerkat. So it's like a Russian compared to the Meerkat.com. right. And it's like a whole comparison website where you can just see all the prices and then like they obviously like get the click affiliate type thing. Compare the market dot com.
Yeah.
It's very clever marketing. It sticks in your head. Compare them to. Yeah, a little Russian meerkat.
A little Russian in your head all day. Never heard anybody.
Exactly, exactly. I suppose it's no different than a little Geico Gecko. Is he still getting around over there? Geico Gecko.
Geico Geckos. I think getting around.
I don't know. Yeah.
Changed the world.
What's that?
Streaming has changed the world because you don't like tv, I guess streaming, you're still forced to watch ads. Like, you know, if you're a brokey and you don't upgrade your YouTube, but.
Thank God they don't. I get, I get better ad revenue.
Yeah, that's true.
I'm always shocked though when I see someone like watching ads on YouTube, like, what are you doing?
You can Skip.
Right.
Like 10 bucks. What's happening over there? Are you okay? Do you need some money? Yeah, sort of. Like when people have an Android, is everything, is everything all right with your, with your business? Is your life filled with consternation?
You know that there are blue texts that exist. They're not all green.
I know, exactly.
Right.
It's funny because, you know, it's really, it's, it's, it's odd because like I see the, I see the, the appeal of having an Android because, like the phones are better. You know, there's like way more options. You can do a lot more with it. But the, the ecosystem that I'm in, not even terms of the Apple ecosystem. Just like the being in Australia and not being able to iMessage would like half my income.
Oh, that would make a big deal for you because you can't.
Yeah.
Because you use iMessage a lot.
Yeah, that's all I use. And I use FaceTime audio to call people. Yeah. And then like I can use it on my computer so I'll like, I'll text leads and you know, it's like, like, I don't know. There's most. 90 of entrepreneurs are on, are on Apple.
Yeah, that's the hard part is like, if you like, you said the, the PCs, Android, they have a lot of features. I get it. It's cheaper for, you know, similar chips and things like that, but if everybody's on it, it's a thousand times easier to communicate that way.
Yeah, it is. And you can do group messages. The fact that you can't do group messages is like so petty, you know, I guess what, what's interesting though is Twilio is going to be. Is bringing out RSS messaging. So RSS messaging is a lot more like, the reporting is way better and you can do a lot more with it. And that'll be super interesting because they're going to bring that in, which means that you'll be able to actually have true deliverability reports in the same as what you can with email through like Twilio messaging. I mean, all of the networks will be bringing it out, but it's going to be, I mean, that text will get, I think, a lot more powerful, but with that it'll also get a lot more easy to stop.
Yeah, it'll get, it'll do the same thing as email where, yeah, everybody used to check their email and live on their email and now email is just a bunch of spam.
Yeah, it's a lot of spam.
If it's important to text.
Yeah, I always tell people, like, if it's really important, you can text me and if you don't have my number, it's just probably not that important.
Yep.
Like, you know, have you just get my number, you know, although my, my, my, my WhatsApp phone number is out there and want me to read it off right now? I mean, it's, you can find it. It's not very difficult to find, but it's just linked to WhatsApp. But yeah, it's, it's. I get like messages every day.
Hey, Matt.
Fuck you.
My WhatsApp does all sorts of weird things, so I just don't look at it.
I have, I have WhatsApp business. It's the business WhatsApp. It's no different. It's just more annoying. And, but you can do ads. Like, but who the. Clicking it out on WhatsApp. Like, I don't kind of putting ads everywhere, you know. I tell you what's gonna be wild, when the AR glasses get really good. You start getting ads in your AR glasses that you can't even tell are ads. Yeah, I mean, like, just be like a little whisper in the back. You want to buy this?
Have you, have you seen that video of the two guys? They asked Chachi pt. If you were going to take over the world, how would you do it?
Is it like create Tick tock?
Oh, no, bro, it's wild. It's basically what is happening with chat, GPT and AI now, as it said, I wouldn't have to forcibly. You know, I'm going to summarize it. I wouldn't have to forcibly take over the world because what I would do is I would become so convenient that first everybody would want to use me. And then at that point, I'd become so convenient that I would make it so that everybody would depend on me. And then once everybody was dependent on me, I would continue. I would continue to infiltrate all of the top companies. All and all, basically, I would be your source for information. And then at that point, every thought you thought, everything you think, everything you do, you will think that you are doing, but really it will be planted from me.
Yeah. Let's tell you what's happening. It's been happening for a long time.
Yeah. Yeah.
Just like. Yeah, it just is what it is. It's just I rely on the fact that I have. I don't watch, I don't.
I'm.
Yeah, I don't think I give a.
Well, you have to be. You have to be in the system. Like, obviously we're all in the system, but you have to be in taking their content for it to happen. Grand scheme, but I'm sure it's still small scale, so it happens.
Oh, yeah. It still gets. You still get you. Like, I mean, who the fuck knows, you know? I mean, although, like, that song is a banger.
They're playing bangers now.
That one. Yeah, that, you know, I'm talking about that new one. That new one we can't talk about. It's a banger of a song.
Yeah.
Not saying I agree with the message, but it's a hard one not to hum.
It's stuck in your head.
Yeah, it's a good song.
Yeah.
You know, actually I watched a full breakdown of that song by a guy called Michael Knowles, who's like a full Christian conservative, right. And doesn't seem like a big Kanye fan, but man, it was fascinating breakdown because, like, he actually, like, he's like, oh, let's look at it like a piece of art. He's like, oh, this dude is just like, yeah, I'll be the villain. Like, so I'm gonna say this is the worst thing I could say now.
What?
You know, I mean, like, that's what he's kind of saying. He's like, oh, Like I'm losing everything. Oh, sweet. I'll be the villain. I'll say the worst thing I can say now. What are you gonna do?
You can't make everybody hate me. If I make everybody hate me myself.
It's exactly right. And he's just like, here you go. I'll be the villain. It's pretty fascinating. Like when you actually listen to the words, they're quite. It's quite interesting, like what he's, what he's saying and like how much pain that dude's probably in right now.
Yeah, yeah.
Because he's not allowed to see his kids. That's what it's about.
Okay.
He's not like these kids and all kinds of stuff like that.
Yeah.
It's interesting because I feel like that's the route he's been going for the last few years is really. He obviously does a lot of crazy things, but in my head, when I see it and look at it from that perspective, it's like he's just being crazy to really prove a point of you cannot control me.
Oh, for sure. Yeah. And also I think he, I think he's, you know, he's one of those people. He's like shockingly ahead of his time.
Yeah.
Like always with everything. And so he's just. His, his thinking is so non conformative that it's very confusing to people. But I fucking. His music's so good.
So good.
So good, man. He's the reason I don't have Twitter.
But say you're a fan of him, you're a fan of yourself. Old him.
Exactly.
And anyone who's in that music video, they're never getting work ever again.
No, they're done.
No, I'm hopefully, hopefully, hopefully, hopefully. Mr. Yee paid them an awful lot. Just a big, Just a bunch of big black dudes with wolves on their heads saying, hi, Hitler is fucking. It's a wild look. It's a wild look. I'll say that. You know, good for them though.
Definitely not controllable.
I'll say that. Yeah, they're definitely fighting the system.
Right. But. Yeah.
Alrighty. Well, you know, that's enough for today. But I think we have a good base and this is how you should be dialing leads if you are a young person. Insurance. And if you want to just have us do it for you. And if you want to come and be mentored by the sales daddies and just, you know, be in a better place in life, no longer filled with consternation and have a guiding light force telling you that you're retarded and don't work hard enough and come on down to Sniper Insurance.
Be ready to laugh. Exactly in the same sentence.
Exactly. We will. You can reach out to me or Kaden any way that you can. And also we'll have some links in the description where you can go and apply to speak with us. So, yeah. All right, guys, good luck and we will see you soon.
