Q&A + Tangents

All right, guys, welcome to the episode of Coffee is for Closers. It's me and James today, and we are doing a Q and A episode.

Awesome. Looking forward to some pretty good questions we've got in here. We might not get through too many because I imagine the answers will be pretty deep on them. There's some. Some detailed questions that we've got.

Deep and long. That's my nickname in high school.

Have you watched. Have you seen the. The Boys TV show on Amazon? So it's really good. It's like an anti superhero movie. So it's like all comic book superheroes with a reiteration, but what they would actually be like in real life. So they. They're just egotistical assholes. And one of them is. One of them is called the Deep, and he's just like the version of Aquaman, but he's an absolute loser. It's hilarious.

I like it. If you listen to this podcast, you will make your first million within three years. I'm going to repeat, will make a million dollars within three years of the first episode. You listen to. We don't want pikers. We're not here to save the manatees. We're here to make podcasts. You really want this? You listen and review. Put that coffee down. All right, guys, we're back. I hope you enjoyed that lovely intro. Yeah, let's just get into it. Today's a Q and A episode. We're just gonna. This is gonna answer questions of people who are in our closing code. Facebook group link will be in the description.

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And then you can ask questions for us to answer on this podcast, which should be very valuable to yourself.

And we will even say your name. We'll even shout you out.

I shall ask. I shall say the names as I bring up these questions.

Say their names.

So, old mate Samaj, the anagram James.

Backward, the join the Eva Net Niyash joined the Navy.

I hope you like that meme I made of it. Anyway, Samaj asked, could you go into more detail on setting the frame conversationally, that as a salesperson, coach, or entrepreneur, that you have to be congruent and that you get the objections you give. You alluded to this in the. In the YouTube video on Inception selling, but didn't go deep on it for the sake of brevity for the video. I think what that really boils down to is when you, you give your objections in personal life, that is you don't buy things because of financial objections that you get that in your sales call. So I think what he's asking is how do you become more congruent in your day to day life so that you don't get those objections? How do you bring that together?

Yeah, well, I think he asked if I could and the answer is yes right now.

Thank you so much. I hope you're disappointed as I am.

Yes, I can do that now. So there's a couple of things and then the first thing is how do you set that frame conversationally? Right. That was the first part of the question that I heard. So the first thing is like, you want to have some questions? So I sold a guy into a sales coaching program the other day and again, it's all about understanding your product and understanding what it is you're trying to sell and what hooks you're trying to set for the product. So I'll use sales training because that's the thing that I'm selling at the moment. And I basically said like, okay, so what are you here for? What are you doing? Well, what are you struggling with? And he said, I'm struggling with objection handling. I was like, okay, perfect. What kind of objections are you struggling with? And he said, I'm struggling with think about it and money. I said, okay, great man. And do you accept think about it and money objections as a valid, as a valid objection for your prospects to give you? And he goes, no, not at all. I said, why do you feel that way? And I made him go into quite detail as to why he didn't think that those were acceptable objections. And then I simply said to him, okay man, so I just want you to know you've already bought this program, you just don't know it yet. He was like, what? And that's why it was like a nine minute sales call. And I basically just explained to him that that framework that I'd set by having him just conversationally ask him what he's struggling, as soon as he said objections, I was like, oh sweet, that's the hook. Because if I allow him to tell me what objections he's struggling with, I know what objections he is going to, he's going to give me because you generally give the objections that you get. So then I know throughout the sales call, all I have to do is really focus on think about it and money. And then I pretty much got him anyway. And then so I explained this to him. And then I also said, and now, then by getting you to tell me in detail why those are not valid objections, then, now you can't give me those objections, which are the ones you're going to give me in the first place. And now by explaining this to you, you realize that I've put you into a box that you can't get out of and you have to buy so we can continually, so we can go through the next 30 minutes and we can buy at the end, or I can just tell you what you get and you can buy now. Which one do you want to do? And he was like, oh, just buy now. And so I saw something that I could grab onto. Now, I wouldn't normally do that, but I was kind of tired and couldn't be bothered having a long conversation, so I just kind of went for it. And I knew I could probably figure it out because I'm pretty good at objection handling, but understanding what your prospects are going through and what pain points they have and then what things they need to be doing to ensure that they get the outcomes that they want. So if you're selling coaches and consultants, that congruency frame is really effective because you have to live your life in a space of congruence. So if you are not going to take action on your goals, how can you reasonably expect somebody else to do the same? So if you can conversationally go, yeah, man, like, I just really love working with coaches and consultants or salespeople or like personal trainers, because they take action on their goals and that's how they can get people. Because, you know, you have to live your life in a state of congruence with your speech and your action, right? And so that means that, like, you know, by you, you, you know, working on your fitness and your goals, or you working on your business and your goals, then you're going to have that level of certainty that you need to, to show up on that sales call to give the person the confidence to move forward and themselves. Makes sense. They're like, yeah, that's awesome. You're like, gotcha. So that's how, I mean, that's like a more detailed version of setting that particular type of hook and then how you can bring that up conversationally. Because once you do that, like, you just need to write out a few lines that you can put in there in a place where it makes sense. And it's going to make sense in all different parts. And sometimes I do it towards the end, sometimes at the middle, but that allows Me to kind of, it's like a little, like a little thing in my back pocket that I'm like, I know, I know. I've got this. You know, if they, if they, they agree to a few of those things, it's super difficult for them to get out of those loops.

Good answer.

Thank you.

And then for people that aren't congruent with the actual objections that they get other than buying stuff, what's the best way to get on that page?

I mean, I think you just gotta have a look and you know, I was talking to a sales guy the other day and I think the one that he really ate was like, you know, I need to sleep on it objections because like that's how he does it. So I think as like, as a business owner, as a salesperson or as a coach or whatever, like you have to be like the action taker. You have to live your life in a way where you're doing everything that you can to be the guy that you need to be to get where you want to go. Because I just don't understand how you can reasonably expect if you have to speak to your partner to make a decision. I just don't know how you overcome that objection.

Yeah.

Because you're going to go, oh yeah, that's fair enough. Let's schedule a follow up, like every time. I don't care if you have all the strategies in the world, that's what you're going to do. Yeah.

Because it's okay with you and it fits your worldview.

Yeah.

So part of this question from Khalil is incoherence in prospects, thinking or talking. And as an example of that, like I see that as really as a semi, semi objection and failure for you to do the sales call properly to get them to that stage.

What do you mean? Can you. I don't understand.

Yeah. So basically the incoherence in the prospect thinking or talking. So at the start of the call they say now is the right moment and there's no reason to wait. Then at the end of the call, oh, I have to deal, deal this with my kid and then I can begin or I have to wait on something. Right. If that person to me at the start of the sales call, if they're ready to take action and then at the end they're not ready to take action. That, that incoherence, what do you think causes that and how do you handle it? For me, it's like you failed somewhere in that sales process to take them away from taking.

I would say your Pitch sucked.

Okay. Why?

If I had to. If I had to boil it down to, like, I would say it's one of three things. Either you didn't get the real goal, so, like, you asked for the goal too early and then went down a pathway that wasn't necessarily the goal that they're looking for. Like, I want to lose 10 pounds, you know what I mean? I want to get to 10k a month. Like, no, you don't want to get much further than that. So we latch onto the wrong goal, then that just won't. All the emotional anchors that you set just aren't going to play, right? So then, like, you're having a conversation about something that's meaningless. So that's number one. The second thing would be that your consequence questions weren't done properly. So, like, you didn't. You didn't explore failure well enough. So, like, you didn't build urgency. And the third one is, like, you just presented the pitch in a way that didn't, like, land. So you overcooked it, you undercooked it. Like, you just didn't really do the things that were needed to be done in order to ensure that, like, they understood the reasons for moving forward and moving forward now. Because, like, your current circumstances have very little to do with what you need to get done. Like, if you're a single mother with 17 children, you still need to go to the gym, you still need to eat healthy if you want to get fit, right? So you can't run a marathon if you want. If you're, you know, if you. If you run 27 businesses and sleep one hour a week, you still need. If you want to run a marathon, you still have to go out there and run to run the marathon, right? So your current circumstances play no role on the thing that. That need to be done in order to get the outcome. So we have to establish that fact. And then from there, it's about getting them to understand that, like, you can push this back two days, two weeks, two months, two years, it's not going to make a fucking difference. It's any one of those things. And, like, the what if questions are really difficult to answer because, like, it's a process. So it's like, you know, you have a look at a dam. If you have a look at, like, you know, like a, you know, like the Panama Canal, right? There's all these different estuaries where it stops. It's like, if it's overflowing, which one's broken? Yeah, it's hard to tell. You Got to kind of work your way back up the stream and then figure it out.

Next question, which I couldn't sort of make out the. The specifics of it, but I'm pretty sure I can turn that into. The question is from. From Ings. What do you do when you're on the phone and you get someone that is just doing that due diligence, right? They. They're just on the phone to find out what people do. Not necessarily there with the intention to buy or something. They just got on the phone to speak with an industry specialist. Like how do you handle that to. To probably get them into the buying pocket. Because me personally, I would be doing a better job from a marketing perspective to make sure that we weren't wasting our time on the phone with people like that, which is more of a disqualifying people and then qualifying them when they get onto the phone. But that's why you do two call closes. You actually want to qualify, disqualify people before they get on. Because to me, as a salesperson, you probably shouldn't be on the phone with those people that are doing that just due diligence. Unless you're outreach and you're cold calling people and they're happy to have a conversation and just want to get an idea. I guess like a really good way to form this into a proper question is when you are on the phone with someone that isn't 100% interested or give you their full attention to what it is that you're speaking about on the phone. Or for you it could be in a messenger conversation, right? How do you turn them into someone who could potentially be interested?

No, interest is interest as we know. It's a level of interest as Uncle G would say. Like it's a weird question, right? Because from a sales point of view, like you're probably not going to try and close that person on the first call, right? So you're going to have to have like a nurture. Now if it's enough of a problem to where you need to formulate an answer to this, then you have a marketing issue or a sales process issue. There's three things that'll fuck up your sales. It's the marketing, the sales process and the sales itself. The sales call itself, right? So like if your marketing is saying X and you're delivering Y or if it's like, hey, just hop on a call and we'll help you out. I hate the hop on a coaching call frame. It's terrible, right? It's making it's making a salesperson's life extraordinarily difficult because then you've really got to try and create need and want, which is not really a salesperson's job. A salesperson's job is to understand the need and the want and then kind of connect the dots or make it a bit more urgent. But like definitely having a process that we lay out for those people where like you have a short call and then sort of like put them through maybe a two or even a three step call if it's an, if it's a high end product to be able to manifest that. But like you don't really want to have to have an answer to that question because if you have to have an answer for it, you need to fix the marketing. People shouldn't just be helping. That's the big thing. That's why tripwire sales are so difficult. Like if you're doing like a $39 program that then gives a coaching call where you try and upsell into a thousand dollar program, man, it is difficult. You have to be a master at doing exactly that or have a process that does it for you. Right. So like an example of that is like some of the direct marketing stuff that I haven't done but that say Jeremy's done in the past, whereas they were selling like business opportunities and they would have a five call close over five days. So it was four 15 minute calls and then one 30 minute call and you had a specific outcome for each call and homework to have to do. And over the five days you would build the trust and the need and there was a very specific scripting for each one that at the end of it, the person would buy almost whatever you put in front of them.

Interesting. Sounds like a logistical nightmare.

Yeah, it's really, really effective. If you're selling like $50,000 biz ops though, makes sense. Or if you have like tripwire selling where you're trying to get them into an expensive offer so they buy like a $100 program that goes for seven days and includes five coaching calls. Right. Those coaching calls can be designed in a way where they turn into sales calls, but it's very like follow the bouncing ball and it's very deliberate. But you'd really, you really want to have a dedicated sales team and the program is going to want to be expensive enough and the comms are going to want to be at least 20%.

Yep.

So that's kind of how you do that. Like some of those biz op guys are given 30% comms yeah.

Because of the pure workload that they have to put in to achieve a sales.

And because, you know, those things are here for a good time, not a long time.

Yep.

That's why we don't sell them.

Yeah. You got to sell what you believe in. So next one. This is a. A really good one. Why should I choose you over your competitors from drug.

You know, it's funny, that's kind of a loaded question because, like, he has inquired about using this before.

Why? I'll give you a reason. Results. Have you seen this? Yeah.

Like, I don't think it's a question worth answering. Like, today we were on a pitch call, sort of a pitch call. Like, they thought it was a pitch call. But I was like, no, dude, you pitch me. Why should I bother? Was really the answer. I make more money than you. I have more successful business than you. We have the solution. You have the problem.

Yeah. Why do.

They started grilling me? And I was like. And they asked me that. They're like, so why can you do this and why can you do that? And how do you ensure that you will represent our brand enough? And Marco started to talk, and I just went. And I was like, the answer is because it's our fucking job. And I said, and we're really, really good at it. I was like, the real question is, why should we consider working with you? Because we're the proven side of the table. You guys have a 15% close rate. I don't know if it's your sales or your marketing. Chances are it's both. So I have to prove an entity. You guys are the X factor. So what are we doing? I don't think it's a question that's worth answering in nearly any sales environment. And I wouldn't use necessarily a deflection tactic, but I would sort of say, well, I mean, of course I like, I can give you 25 reasons as to why I think I'm better. I've seen the back end. But, like, I'm not like. And I'm sure that if I was on their side of the table, I'd think that we're better. I think that, you know what I mean? I go like, it's just a perspective thing. I think we're the best. That's why I work here. And I take what I do quite seriously. And I want to help as many people as I can get into a program that I think is good for them. That's why I do that. But why are we better than somebody else? I Can't really answer that question ethically. So why are you on this call? What drove you to us? That's probably going to answer the question. But if you want me to talk about people that I don't know and approach program that I haven't done, I think I'd just be blowing fucking wind up your ass if.

Yeah, yeah. And why would you of us talk about the things that you guys don't do well, as would any of your competitors?

Yeah, it's like when people say, like, oh, can you send me testimonials? Can I speak to a client? I go, you want me to send you to my best client?

Of course.

I was like, yeah, I can just send you to the guy who's the most successful person in our. In our, in our entire. In our entire coaching organization. Would you like to speak to?

Yeah.

Which is you want to speak to the person who paid for 12 weeks up front, never even showed up to a single call. Do you want to talk to that guy? Which one? Like, because they're both same program, very, very different outcomes. So, like, you know, are you looking for a reason to sign up or a reason not to sign up? Because the only people that I'm going to send you are people who have had pretty phenomenal experiences. So, like, I don't. I don't know, like, like, what is it that you want to achieve out of having that conversation? And usually that pretty much stops that in the butt pretty quick.

And it's funny. Reminds me of that really funny line on from the Wolf of Wall Street. Don't judge me on my winners. Judge me on my losers because.

Don't judge me on my winners, John. Ask my clients to judge me on my win. Losers. Because I have so few. Actually, YouTube video that's coming out is me doing a review of all those famous sales.

Nice, nice. That'll be fun.

It's already been flagged for copyright. It's all good.

Of course. Yeah, we'll have to edit.

It's just been uploaded. It's not good. That's not a copyright strike. It's just like, it's this fair use.

Yeah, cool, Cool. It is funny. Like, that point just brings me to something else. Just to go on a little bit of a side note, we had.

We don't do tangents on this podcast.

No, not at all. Speaking of tangents. So we had this guy who didn't. Didn't sign up to the program. He wanted to speak to a client, et cetera, et cetera. And the reason he wanted to speak to a client. It was for a. What was the offer? It's like a small time business coaching offer for semi rookies to help them find their nation. Develop an offer. Yeah, and he, he, the, he wanted to speak to clients and the, the client of ours really wanted to get this sale and the guy, you know, said he's been burnt because he's done heaps of other courses. Like he did traffic and funnels, he did Sam Ovens, he did this, he did that, everything right. And he's like, oh, you guys need to show me why you can, why you can sell and can I call.

Traffic and funnels in Sam Ovens and can you give me a testimonial as to why I should put you in the program?

Yeah, but I was just like, mate, if you had no success in all of those programs, you're the reason and that's the cause. The, the closer wanted feedback on that call and I'm like, you shouldn't have closed him. Like he's not someone that you want to put into that program. And our client was disappointed that we couldn't get that sale. I'm like, you fucking kidding me? You want this person in your program that won't do anything and don't blame you.

You think you're better than Sam Ovens?

Stop scraping the bottom of the barrel. Like, come on dude. Like you're not going to get this personal result. Cause they're not going to do anything. Like if you go through, it's the same like if you did the closing code, you didn't Danlock's course you did grant card earns, you did the straight line selling, you did napq and you still can't sell. You suck at selling is you, you are the problem.

You suck at selling.

You know, so it's the same thing with business. Like if, if you go through all these problems program, it's like you didn't put the work in. And these are the guys that are the same people that are on coffee fillers, like videos are saying, oh, this program didn't work for me. It's like, yeah, I'm sure that maybe that program wasn't the best in the world, but you can still take valuable lessons and get a lot out of it if you actually put the work into it.

Absolutely. You know, even some programs I've gotten some good value out of.

Yeah. And the first step to getting good and in any of those examples is even in bad situations, taking out the, the good things from it and applying that to get better so anyway, the tangent over.

Tangent rant over.

Next question. This is. This would be a big one, right? And you kind of slightly touched on it before.

Are you talking about my penis?

No, not at all. I said a big one and you touched on it before. Whether it's marketing or sales. And the question from, from Claire, and it's funny that she asked this because long story short, but at what point can you intelligent, intelligently decide the lead quality is the problem versus sales skills? Depending on where you're at in the business, you should have numbers, you should have structures. Right. And the best way to figure out where the problem is is by having. Is probably putting a constant in place. And what about. I mean by a constant, like air quote constant is a proven entity that is successful. All right. And the way that you would do this in deciding whether it's a lead quality problem for sales skills is by having a very good salesperson in there that closes at a very high percentage on very many other things. And if we put a. So for instance, like class, if we were to go ahead and put a proven sales guy that absolutely crushes it on every other account, particularly in that niche, into. Into that business and that constant can't close those leads or that close rate significantly drops. That's an issue with lead quality, right?

Yes, it is.

If.

Preach it.

If we put in a very good sales guy and they sell the shit out of your program, it's an issue with the rest of the team's ability to sell.

And we've had both.

Absolutely. Yeah.

I think you have to have objective, objective, unemotional data. Like I said, I think before, there's three things that are going to really affect your close rate. The first is the words that come out, the noises that come out of the salesperson's face. Right. Just the first thing. But that's like a very downstream thing. Next is the process that they go through. So do you need a one or two or three cold close, whatever. And then is the marketing does the market message and match all line up to where like your, your content is. Is doing stuff? Like, I mean like it all lines up like you're not doing. You're not like advertising, we're going to get you leads and then you have a coaching program like that shit doesn't work. People don't like it. So they're showing up for extra giving y. Like that's a real problem. Even if they are good leads, they don't want what you have, you know, so like that's an issue. So You've got to be able to unemotionally look at all those things and then from that go, this is the problem. You know, and then go, okay, cool, let's fix that. Let's fix that problem. Let's work on the lowest hanging fruit. You know, the hardest thing to do is make salespeople better. That is the slowest process out of all those things. If you can identify that they're bad by listening to calls, it's like, okay, we know that they're not great, but that's gonna take a while to fix. It's gonna take a while to find somebody good. So let's make sure the marketing. Because, like, I think 10 to 15% of people should just buy by picking up the phone.

Yeah.

Like at least 10%. Right. Should be like, hello, do you wanna do it? Yep. Sweet. Okay, thank you. Bye. That should be 10% of people. If the marketing is good and 10% are never gonna buy and there's 80% in the middle. That it's our job. So if you have like a 10% close rate, you should be able to sell that from a webinar.

Yeah. That 10% close rate you'd be getting if the sales was bad.

It's essentially zero. Right. If you had a call center in India taking your calls, you'd get that 10%. So like, that's a massive red flag. Like, I don't think your sales guys can be that bad. And so when we've taken on a few accounts recently that have really, really low close rates, like 5, 6, 7%. And I just told, like, you know, had one of them last night, had a meeting and I, I was like, okay, like. Cause we're only just starting with them is Brendan. I was like, okay, like, we need to figure out if it's the marketing though. Cause I have a feeling it's a bit of both. The sales team sucks, but. But the actual leads might suck too. So let's get somebody into fix the leads. We'll come in and fix the sales, and then it won't work out over the next couple months, you know, but like, if you're trying to fix a lead issue with sales and trying to fix the sales issue with leads, if you have like a rock star sales team, you can make bad marketing look okay.

Yes.

But if you have a shit sales team, it's. It's hard to make good marketing look bad. Like, even like an average sales team, they'll get 20% of the leads are really good.

Yeah.

Famous, like, which we've Seen like is when we came in and took over Tribe of Buyers, they had a pretty decent clo. They had a pretty decent sales numbers, but when we came in, it quadrupled.

I think there's a very famous quote by a guy. I think his name was Zabuna 04. And he, he said that and there was a really famous quote from a guy. I think his name was Zabuna or something like that. Maybe it wasn't that famous. But great marketing makes for a weak sales team and weak marketing makes for a great sales team, and that's what we're finding here. But, but going back to like you, you mentioned like listening to their calls and see how they are. If you don't know whether it's a sales problem and you've listened to the sales calls and can't actually tell what they're doing, then you need someone to come in and consult on that and consult a professional to tell you whether that sales call is good or not. Also like a really good analogy for those questions in problem solving things like that. Is it this or is it this? That's the problem. As I said, like, with that constant. Like a great analogy is like, I've got a mouse here. If this mouse stops working, there's probably one of two problems, right? The problem A, the marketing is that something is, is broken with this mouse, right? Problem B, the sales, the batteries are the problem. Okay? Now if I have a perfectly working keyboard, right? And I know that that works, I can take the batteries out of that and put it into the mouse, okay? If the mouse no longer works and just note in this case the batteries are the constant. If the mouse doesn't work with those new batteries, the mouse or the marketing is broken. If it works with the new batteries, then it was the batteries or the cells that was the issue. The point is you need to match something that you know is consistent and will work every single time to figure out what the issue is. That's just basic.

I concur.

Common sense, you know, I concur.

It's just like you got to have an unemotional way of looking at it. So if you're really struggling, put in a triage call and then tell the people to only put people who are really qualified to buy through. If you have a super, super low rate of qualification, then you'll know that's it. Otherwise you're asking salespeople to retrospectively tell you why they couldn't sell someone who was sellable, which just isn't going to happen very Accurately on a regular basis. I've had this argument many a time. I am always I am correct.

Yeah. Yeah. Because you have.

I will tell you, if it's your.

Leads, you have a very strong rationale way of figuring out these problems from an unemotional point of view.

I also just want to make money, so I really don't care. Yeah, sales problem will fix it. If it's a marketing problem, you fix it.

Here's a question from Peter and I'm just going through and searching for questions now on call. Sometimes I don't know what to ask next. How do you handle this when you get stuck? Have a script for one?

Yeah. I mean, it's a difficult one for me to answer because it never happens.

Okay, but if it did happen, how would you answer?

Like, it just doesn't. Because I've done that much selling. I can't remember the last time I got stuck. Like, I literally can't remember. It sounds super arrogant and stupid, but, like, I've done that many sales. I do that much sales coaching. You just have to know what the fuck to say. Like, you got to be able to stay in the saddle. I can talk underwater with a mouthful of marbles to four different people at once. I have no lack of things to.

Say at any particular time, as evident by these podcasts.

Yeah. And I think if you download the objection handling matrix, it will give you enough loops, analogies, and things to say that you probably wouldn't ever run out. Yeah.

Yeah.

And if you are struggling with that, like, get a coach. To be perfectly honest, if that's something that you're struggling with, then you need to get someone to really write things out for you and make sure that, like, if you're one of those people that, like, I'd see it all the time in role plays. People are like, this is where I get stuck. I was like, what? At the part where you have to make the sale, that's where you get stuck. Fuck, that must suck. Right? Like, just keep talking, even if it, like, just keep saying things.

Yeah. Conversational flexibility. You need to.

Exactly. And if you struggle with it, then practice it.

Yeah. Get on the. The role plays in the group, Peter, because we go over that very lovely code. Peter, join the closing code so we can get you over that.

Making some sales, 50 bucks a week. Get access to seven role play sessions a week.

Yeah.

That's the stupidest offer on the planet.

Here's another question I found for me. Would you use that tactical vulnerability on most calls or only if the person is not really opening up that much.

Only if the person's not opening up. I don't use anything I don't need to to extend the call. There's no point.

Yeah, that's exactly what I would have said. And to. To add onto that point, Ian, is you don't want to use every tool in the toolbox just because you have them there. Sometimes if you've got a nail, all you need to do is use a hammer.

Yeah. I started overusing a few of the analogies a little bit. I realized the other day I can pull that back because I was threading them together.

Yes.

Like three at a time.

I was like, just merging it.

I can probably. Yeah. Because I know that it works. Right. So I was just like. But I probably don't need to do all of them.

It'll just end up in a clusterfuck of confusion. And then you've got no tool to go back to if you've used them all.

The good thing is I can. I can sort of make up. I can make up as many new analogies as I want. I can get pitched a lot of bullshit stuff on Facebook.

I have one guy that he come over, just added me randomly as a friend. I think we had like one or two mutual. And sent through one of those. Those cold traffic messages. Like, I have no idea what this guy even does. And it was like the most enthusiastic message ever. It's like, hey, man, what have you been up to the last couple weeks? You've been working on anything? Crushing it. I'm like, dude, just skip to the pitch.

Skip to the pitch.

Don't waste my time.

Skip to the pitch.

I don't know you. I don't know what you do.

This is a Disney bad. I'm going to try and find it. Hey, man, it's been a while since we connected. How are you? I just got introduced to something I am excited about. I wanted to and I really feel compelled to share with you. I thought of you because you're an open and you have a great personality. When can we chat briefly? I said, no, thanks. I can tell by the text that this is either MLM crypto or forex. Not my type of thing, but keep hustling.

I have the opportunity to get you in on the ground floor level of this new organization that I'm working with.

I might copy and paste what he said. That'd be great. Just copy and paste, make up the title and then pitch them like playing chess against the grandmaster. And you just copy every move they do.

It'd be funny, you know?

It's funny. One of those guys who pitched me cold hard, pitched me terribly, and I kind of had a bit of a go at him, and I was like, fuck sake, dude. Your pitch sucks. He joined the closing code. Yeah. I was like, hey, can I give you some feedback? That's terrible. And then, like, he sent me a. Like, when I didn't respond, he sent me, like, three question marks. And I was like, fuck you. He's like, what? I was like, fuck you. It's Sunday afternoon with my kids and you're sending me three question marks? Who the fuck?

This was on Sunday as well?

I was like, who the fuck are you to tell me I should respond to you? I don't know you. I don't give a shit about you. He's like, oh, I'm sorry. I'm sorry. I was like, your pitch sucks. This is what's wrong. Rewrite it. Here you go. I gave him a better pitch and he's like, oh, that's pretty good. He was like, do you do any coaching? I was like, not that you can.

Afford based off your pitch. I'm just like.

He's been. He's closing code. He's been in closing. Come in for, like, two months now.

I always get curious. Like, I always do, like, when I write that, I actually wrote back an outlier. I'm curious, what's your ROI on me? Because I can't be good.

Yeah, I mean, like, I'm never, like, mean to them unless they're a dick. Because, like, I just understand, like, they're just in a situation where they're trying to hustle and make cash, and they kind of hold that against them. It's like, why door knockers come to my house. I'm super nice to them. Door knocking is fucking hard. Cold calling is hard, you know? So, like, just be polite to them. But, like, if someone's rude to you, then fuck them. Yeah. It's a tough gig, man, trying to cold DM people on Facebook.

Don't message people that you haven't done your research on. Because I went back through his profile later and it was like, stuff that we're clearly better than him at. You know what I mean? It's like, come on, man. Like, you have done zero research. You could have clicked.

I had a guy reach out to me in the day, and he was like, hey, do you want to join my sales group? I was like, oh, yeah. I was like, not really. But, you know, he sort of was like, okay. I was like, you know, I didn't. Sort of ignored. Then he came back and he's like, oh, yeah. I was like, oh, yeah, sweet. I'll join the group. And then he's like, hey, man, I have noticed your profile and seemed like you're pretty good at sales. I'd like to offer you a potential position within our Inner Circle program. It's like, selective only. I was like, hang on a second, champ. I was like, first of all, don't. Don't pitch me. I was like, I know what you're doing. But I was like, well, okay, can I. Can I be perfectly frank with you? He's like, yeah. And I was like, does anyone there. Has anyone ever made a hundred thousand dollars in a month of pure comms? I was like, because if there's no one there that's done that, I don't want to be the best guy in the group. That seems useless to me. And he was like, no. And I was like, all right, cool. Then, like, good luck with it. And then he sort of asked if he could have. If he could book in a chat with me. I just like, you know me, I'm a development guy. I'm more than happy to pay whatever people want if I think they're better than me. If he was like, yeah, we have one guy that makes $250,000 a month in pure comms. I'd be like, how much money does he want? What's he doing?

I would be like, hey, can you introduce me to him instead?

Yeah, that's awesome. Let's go ahead and do that. But I don't. Like, I had one guy that. This is getting a bit tangential. You guys can leave if you want. No. Has to be here for the rest of this podcast. But I had one guy that was like, hey, I did some snooping around on your profile and was really impressed with this. I was like, oh, yeah, you did some snooping, dj? He's like, yeah, caught me. I go, how many kids have I got? And I was like, and you need to answer in the next minute. Otherwise you're just looking at my profile. And it just didn't reply. I was like, gotcha. You gotta just go through my photos. You see, I got two kids just for the guys still listening.

This is no longer a podcast. This is just a standard conversation that.

We have on a day to day times a day. Marco tried to fucking sell me on something today. He's trying to sell me on something to do this and this. He's like, we can do this. I was like, marco, Marco, don't use my lines on me. He's like, that's totally. He goes, I totally understand. That makes total sense. But I just kind of wanted to understand the rationale behind why you might do that. I go, hey, fucking timeout, bro. I taught you that. Fuck you.

It was. It was really funny, like, because I opted in to test a few of the. The things to give them feedback. Dan messaged me. I just wrote back. I'm like, is it Dan or Marco? He's like, yeah, I understand your concerns. I'm like, hey, if this is a Marco, put me in touch with the boss. I'm not speaking to her too wisely. That seems funny. He had no idea how to handle it. I'm like, malcolm, the funniest thing is that Marco needs to train you better.

I was messaging Andrew Crozy. Andrew reached out to Jeremy, and it was Marco reaching out to Jeremy, but I was replying as Jeremy. And so I was trying to sell Crozy into Jeremy's program. Jeremy was trying to sell him into Crozy's program. But it was me and Margot talking to each other. But we both knew it.

That was. That was basically. It sounds like a dick measure.

That makes sense, but how is it impacting you? Yeah, yeah, it's fun.

That's funny.

It's funny. All right, I think that's enough.

I was gonna say. I got nothing else to talk about.

I don't wanna see your face anymore. All right, guys, I hope you enjoyed that episode of Coffee Is for closes. I'm sure half of it's been edited out. At least I hope to God half of it's been. But yeah, make sure you, like, subscribe. Make sure you join the email list. So there'll be. We mentioned the objection handling matrix in this one. So there'll be a link to the objection handling matrix and also the inception selling YouTube video. Make sure you subscribe on YouTube. Make sure you join the mailing list. Make sure you join the closing code Facebook group. Like, I think we have, like, just check then we have like 400 members there now, 392. Who wants to be the magical 400th, right? So get in there. We do role plays that you can watch for free every single day. And if you want to join the role plays and get coached six times a week for $50 a week, all you got to do is give us that 50 Dara, and we'll be more than happy to take it. But yeah, guys, and make sure you subscribe to the goddamn podcast for. You fucks aren't subscribed, so let's. Let's get amongst it.

Subscribe or die.

All right, guys.

I heard that on another podcast. I thought it was cool.

Subscribe or die. If you don't subscribe, like, you're all dying very slowly, but if you subscribe, you'll die a little bit slower. On that very positive note, that mortality is coming, and the only thing that we can't stop is death and taxes. I think that we should end it there.

See you later, guys.

Bye. Put that coffee down. Coffee's for closers only.