Sales training 101: 8 figure business owner explains why you need to understand the prospect's "why"

Hey, guys. What's up? Matt here, and welcome to an episode. Today's video is a take Dan. So this is kind of a follow on of a video the other day, but it's a different day. And Dan had a whole bunch of questions for me. He asked me. He's like, matt, can I come in? Can I do a coaching session with you? So Dan's a great sales guy. He made seven sales last week. I think he made like 16 or 17k in commissions last month, selling between two and $6,000 products. He's very, very good at what he does. And he's kind of on that ascension model, right? So he's kind of hit that point where now he's starting to kind of see that really sharp uptick, right? So I think it's a really, really interesting place for him to be. It's a really, really good place for me as a coach to be able to give him some more nuance and push back on him, to give him the confidence to know that he can do a lot of the things that he's asking questions about. He's just not doing them. So if you do like this kind of content, make sure you, like, subscribe, hit notification. But all that kind of good stuff. Comment, comment. Any questions that you have for me, if you were sitting in front of me right now and you were getting some coaching, what would you want from that? So make sure you drop that. Hit the notification bell as well. So you get notified every time there's a video. All right, guys, we'll see you later. Bye.

So a lot of the times when we're in calls, there's a particular process that we have, right, Matt? And a lot of times what I notice is that sometimes it's like, question, answer, question, answer. I want to learn how to challenge more, right? So I don't have to challenge at the end of the call or objection, handle at the end of the call. For example, I want to turn. Like when they say I want to do this and you hear it throughout the whole call. One thing. Everyone wants to make money, right? I want to turn that into, like, I must, I need, I need.

Yeah.

Okay, well, what's the thought process behind, like, the prospect? Wanting versus needing. Hey, guys. The whole reason why Dan's doing this is because like, like, he knows it, right? He's just not doing it because he's. He's new ish to sales. He's been in sales full time for about a year, but he knows this stuff. So that's why I'm Asking him the questions in the way that I'm asking him because I want him to figure out that he actually knows what he's doing.

That's.

Yeah, that's. That's.

I want to understand, like, what your thought process of taking someone through. Like, you know, when they say, like, yeah, I just want to do this. I've always been wanting it, you know, but at the end, they. If they wanted it, they would have done it already. So.

Yeah. Yeah. Okay.

Okay. But what I'm. What I'm asking, though, is, like, what do you think the thought process is of someone wanting something versus needing something? My favorite way of getting someone to figure out what they should be doing and what. And what they're doing right and wrong, is to ask them about the thought process behind it, especially in sales. Right. Cause if you understand the thought process, then. And you can articulate it, then you can start to do it. Because, like, the why is so much more important than the how.

Once is just, like. It's just something that's just blown up in the air. Needing is like, man, I need to make a change, and I need to do this for, like, my family. An emotional drive behind it.

Okay, that makes sense.

Okay.

And so, like, what would. How would you convey that to somebody, though, who's, like, in the state of want.

There must be, like, a purpose behind what they're doing.

Okay.

So not. Not something. So the one's like, a tangible thing.

Right. Okay.

And then the need is the emotional drive behind it. Some people, I can't shift that sometimes, like, from them saying, I just want to do it.

You can't or you won't?

I personally don't.

Okay. But, Mike, do you want to shift it or do you need to.

I need to shift it.

Okay. So what have you done to fulfill that need?

Taking action.

Right. Yeah. Yeah.

So I want, like.

And what helped you make that shift?

Doing it myself and being congruent.

Okay. So like you said, you want to. You want to get. You want to learn how to challenge people.

Mm. Right.

But really what you want to learn how to do is, like, how to show them, like, the logical consequence of their thought pattern.

Right? Yeah.

Yeah. So, like, what you want to be able to do, you already know how to do it. You're just not doing it.

Okay.

If you can articulate it, then you can coach it.

Yeah.

You know what I mean? So it's like, if you're looking for the right time, then it's about learning how to identify the language pattern early. But the Problem is you can't identify it too early because you need to know whether or not it's a pattern or whether or not it's a one off, right? So like, if every time somebody says, I want something and you just went like, do you want it or do you need it, motherfucker? Like, you'd be a dick. You know what I mean? So like, you need to hear that pattern two, maybe three times before it becomes a pattern. So then it's like you either learn how to identify it earlier, right? Or once you do identify it, then you, then you ask the questions around getting the person to move forward.

So could you give me example of how you transition? Because like, let's just say you notice that three or four times throughout the call. Or if you're good enough, you pick it up the first time right?

Now like, Dan just kind of keeps asking me how, right? Like, how do you do this? How do you do this? And again, like, the why is so much more important than the how. But if you guys are liking this kind of content, then make sure you hit the subscribe button and hit the notification bell as well so that, you know, I can keep doing them. Subscribe, support the channel. But what did I do to you?

You're like, you, you want it or you need it?

Yeah.

And then, and after they say I need it, like, they'll just like, no, I need it.

And I said, yeah, but what have you done?

Okay, yeah, see what I mean?

That's all you gotta do. Like, I think you're over complicating a very simple issue.

Okay, right?

It's like all you need to do is identify it. Go. Oh, okay. Do you need it or do you want it? Yeah, okay. No, I need it. Okay, well what do you like, do you know what I mean? It's like you answered your own question. You just didn't realize that you answered it.

Yeah, I'm going too deep in the weeds then. Yeah, yeah, because what I was doing was like setting up, setting up like identity frames, like who you need to become so you can actually start doing it and everything like that.

This is when I was talking to Cam earlier.

Yeah.

I was like, it's really simple. People just like to over complicate things.

There you go, there you go.

People want things to be complicated because if it's complicated, there's a reason to not be good at it.

Okay.

Like if I just told you, like, you know, like you, did you play golf or anything like that?

Me personally, I don't know.

Okay, but like if you think of a sport, right. And like, let's say you play basketball.

Yeah. Right.

If you were thinking of the mechanics of a three throw while you were doing it, you would fuck that free throw up every time.

Too technical.

Yeah. But if you just sat there and just like did it, then it would be much easier.

Yeah.

You know, so like, if you're thinking of the mechanics of a sales call while you're in the sales call, chances are you're gonna like petrify yourself into not doing something or overthinking something which slows down all your decision making processes, which means that like, you're two or three minutes behind where you should be.

Yeah.

Because you're thinking.

Yeah. Yeah.

So if you just like be in the moment and just have your process and then just have little like triggers of like, oh, that's interesting. That person's constantly saying want. And then from there they said a couple of times like, well, sorry, do you want it or do you need it? You know, the most appropriate time during there is probably in terms of NEPQ fashion would be solution or consequence. Right. Those two factions. Because it's sort of, it makes sense in the context of the conversation that you're having. Like, it wouldn't make sense to do that in like connection phase. And it's probably too late in objection. Handling.

Yeah.

So that's, that's, that's where it's, that's where I pick it up. Towards the end we're like, look, that sounds good. Like I really want to do it. I just need to take some time to think about it when I should. In my mind, I wanted to understand the thought process of how to actually do that during discovery. So it doesn't.

I'm basically pre handed, super, super common.

Right.

I get young sales reps all the time, like trying to make it more complicated than what it has to be because they're looking for a reason for it to be really, really difficult. Because if something's really difficult, then you have an excuse to not be good at it.

Right.

So like you got to try and simplify things, pull things down into it, simplest possible way and don't get caught up in the minutia. You're much better off making an aggressive mistake than just kind of sitting there waffling back and forth.

Right.

So just go out there, do things. It's okay to make mistakes. Don't get caught up in the minutia in that perfection mindset where you have to do everything perfectly. Otherwise you don't do It. Okay. But again, then you're looking at, like, that's a different question again, because now you're looking at how to identify language patterns faster.

Yeah.

And the unfortunate answer to that is that time takes time.

Yeah.

Like, you're not gonna be able. There's no trick that I could give you to be able to, like, have the memory of 30,000 conversations in your head to where you can go, oh, Like, I remember that. It's like, if you asked Roger Federer, you're like, hey, why did you hit the forearm over there? Like, the forehand in that corner? He might just say, oh, because I did.

You know, I just did it.

Yeah.

Whereas, like, it's a. It's a culmination of, like, 25 years of experience. That makes him think, well, and I've seen this situation 35 times before, and when I hit it over there, I won most of the time. But that's like, an instantaneous decision, you know? So it is the unfortunate reality that time takes time, which is just giving yourself a break and being like, yeah, I've identified a weakness, and now I can think about that when I'm listening back to my own calls. I can go, oh, shit. I can hear that now that I listen to it again. And I can armchair quarterback it. That's what I missed. That's fine. You can't win them all.

Yeah. So that's.

So I think I'm. I'm trying to, like, catch up to who I really want to be. Like, as a sales rep, I just don't have the experience in between.

Yeah.

Like, someone put on the Facebook group the other day, like, rate yourself on where you are in any pq. And I was like, oh, I'm probably just getting started. Like, someone was like, ah. And I was like, no. Well, if Jeremy's 25 years in and I'm 18 months in.

Yeah.

Like, there's probably a fair bit of a skill gap.

Yeah.

You know, like, that I can't fill.

Yeah.

With just, like, working really hard. I have, like, a natural, like, affinity towards it, but, like, he has so much more, like, experience using it than what I do that I fight. I couldn't kid myself and be like, I'm a fucking master at it. Like, obviously, I'm not. One of the most frustrating things that I was told by mentors and stuff, besides subscribe to the channel, obviously, was time takes time. I remember when I was in the army, I was a sniper in special operations, in case you didn't know. I do try and keep it a Secret. I was actually my best friend at the time who unfortunately died in a helicopter in Afghanistan in 2010, was doing the sniper course, and he was really frustrated. He was kind of like. He was just very, very much of an overachieving person. But sniping is a very difficult skill set that takes a lot of time and repetition to become good at, which is why I think it's really aided me in my sales journey. And so, you know, I sat him down and we were kind of going over one night because I was his instructor and we were living in the same house, and I said, listen, man, like, this is a skill set that takes a long time to develop, and time takes time. You're not going to be the best. You're not going to be that. Well, you might be the best one day. You're not going to be the best in the next six, 12 or 18 or 24 months. Like, this is a long game. So, like, stop being angry at yourself and just realize that, like, everyone's at a different stage of development and you're starting now. I'm two years ahead of you, right? So comparing yourself with me when it comes to shooting and field craft is ridiculous right now. If we started at the same time, then that would be fine, but don't compare yourself with me or with anybody else, because you're new, right? And I think, like, in just, like in anything, like, when you're developing, it's a very important thing to understand that time just takes time. And some things just take. Take reps. And so that's something that Dan in particular struggles with because he's surrounded by the 97 bulls, right? As fucking arrogant as that may seem. And I'm sure you can disturb me in the comments, but he's surrounded by dudes that are extraordinarily good at selling. He just hasn't been doing it for as long. And so it doesn't mean that he can't get there. It doesn't mean that he will or won't get there, but it just means that, like, it's the frustration of seeing what's possible but not having the skill set or the time and the experience to be able to do it. So, anyway, pretty interesting. Let's get back to.

Yeah, okay, so the next question that I had was, like, it kind of. It kind of bridges off that question as well, Matt. It's more of the. Like, when you identify something that someone says and you don't know how to formulate that into a question. Because if sales is all about change, Right. You can't just tell someone, I think what you're thinking is wrong. Like, unless you can.

So, like the difference between getting detail on a good idea versus getting detailed about it.

Yeah, yeah, yeah.

I think clarifying something is always a good thing.

Yeah.

So the example that I can give is like, if you take someone who's like a racist or something.

Right.

Like, you've got two options. You can ask them a lot of. A lot of questions about their viewpoint, or you can just tell them to be quiet. You know what I mean? But no, like, but generally speaking, like, if you wanted to unpack a really bad idea, the more questions you asked about it, the less it would make sense, you know, so. But it's a dangerous game, right? Like, because if you're not good at it, it's not going to go your way.

That's how I feel right now.

Just ignore.

Just ignore it.

Yeah.

Because I can go down a bad rabbit hole, right?

Yeah, yeah.

So, like, if you get, like when someone has a good idea, always ask for clarification and like solidify the idea.

Yeah. You know what I mean?

Oh, but what did you mean by that? I really need to get better at objection handling.

Oh, really?

What do you mean by that? Right. Like that's a good idea for you. An example of a bad idea. You're someone selling sales training. A bad idea would be asking about somebody's marketing.

Okay. Yeah. Right.

It has to be related to the problem that you solve.

Well, no, you're just going to cause more problems if you ask about the marketing.

Okay.

Like, if someone's like, yeah, I just really want my lead quality to be better and you're like, ding, ding, ding, I hear a problem.

Yeah.

What do you mean? Lead quality?

Right.

That's a really bad route for you to go down.

Yeah.

Because there's very little benefit to you there.

Yeah.

Like, so, so, so let's just say you do have a call and then someone says the lead quality about the.

Marketing, I would completely ignore it.

Just completely ignore it.

Or I would say, let's focus on what we can focus. Let's get you good enough at sales to where, you know, doesn't matter what leads come through, you can still make it work.

Because.

Because what I say is like, yeah, the lead quality goes up and down all the time. You'll pass. Is that.

Yeah, it's a good deflection.

Okay.

All right.

That's what I learned off Jeremy.

It's like if I was selling marketing and someone started going about. I seem to get better at like closing people and up my sales skills, I was like, you know, like, sales skills is one thing. Unless you want to be a long term sales guy, maybe it's not the best use of your time. But let's focus on getting you leads that are so good that you know your sales skill, that a monkey could cause them.

Okay.

You know, so you gotta, you don't wanna go down past and going back to like the other like the original point, which is more like I don't really. I ignore a lot of what people say, right. Because it's not like if you have like a little internal cost benefit like analyzer, you know. You know, I've talked about this before. I only do anything that's a net positive.

Okay, Right.

If there's like, and I'll take risks at the end, like an objection handling or take risks. But in the beginning I've got like a risk analysis where it's like, if I ask that question, what are like the say three possible outcomes right now? Unless three of those are positive, I'm not doing it. Cost benefit analysis in sales, right. Like what is my brain thinking when I'm doing stuff? Because I don't want to take risks in a sales environment until I have to. And that's usually going to be towards the very end. But when I'm kind of running out of things to do and I'm throwing up Hail Marys. Right. So like one of the most beneficial things that you can do and that I've told Dan to do and many other people to do is that when you're listening back to your sales goals, what I want you to do is like when you ask a question is pause it and go, okay, what are the potential outcomes? And that's kind of where like sales and chess are very, very similar.

Right.

If I move here, what are all the potential outcomes that can happen? And if they're not, it's not a net positive for me. I'm not gonna do it if there is like where. If it's at the end and I take a risk, then it's a calculated risk. And I know that I might lose the game, but it's fine. But in the beginning, you really need to make a series of moves that are strategic and always going to net you a positive result. So if I think of five possible answers and three of them are positive and two of them are negative, I'm not going to do it if it's a 4 and 1, I probably do it if it's a 5 and up if it's a 5 and. Oh, I'll definitely do it.

Right.

So always think back. It's a really good strategy. Like, what's the cost benefit of the question that I just asked? And what are the potential outcomes that it can induce? And is it really worth doing? Because if it's not, like, if it's not a net positive, like a very, very high net positive, just leave it out of your process.

That's how you think. Yeah, because I think maybe because my lack of experience just allows me to just like, probe or clarify on something without even knowing. Like, like you said, the risk. The risk versus reward of it.

Yeah.

And does that just come with time?

No, I think now that one you can really speed up. Because, like, what. If you've ever done a core review, the most common question that I ask is, why did you ask that question?

The thought process.

And it doesn't mean that I didn't think it was a good question. Just I'm wondering why you asked the question. Because, like, that's where I think the most valuable development you can do outside of actually having a coach.

Right.

Is listening to your own calls.

Yeah.

Because, like, the thing that is, there's a couple of things that are really beneficial with sales coaching is one, listening to someone's call is only beneficial if they're there.

If they're there. Yeah. Right.

Like, if you want to listen to one of my calls and you have the ability to ask me what I was thinking at the time, that really benefits you. Because then you can understand the process behind why. What was said.

Right.

So you can, like, the court makes sense to you. Other than that, you just kind of like listening to someone do cool shit.

Yeah.

Because I think, speaking for myself, I fall into the trap of. It's a trap, like, understanding, like, what they said. Like what? Let's just say, for example, I hear you. Objection. Handle. Or I hear you say, like, this. Reframe. And I just, like, pay attention to the words. I don't pay attention to why.

Yeah. That's completely the opposite of what you should be doing.

Yeah.

That was a rookie error, which I only just realized, like, two weeks ago.

Yeah. Because, like, it doesn't matter what I say say. Because there's like a thousand different ways to say everything.

Yeah. You know what I mean?

You can. You, like, you can get the point across, like, in a long, verbose fucking way of doing things, or you can just like, mirror somebody and go, like, more cash, you know, like, there are really easy ways to do things. And there are more elaborate ways of doing things, but it's like, it's the thought process behind what you're doing that matters.

Yeah.

And so what you want to do, like when you listen to someone like Marco for, for example, like know what he's doing, like, oh yeah, I know what he's doing. Like, I can open a call with Marco and I know exactly what he's thinking. I don't know what he's thinking outside of sales. But like, if we hop on a call together and he asks a question, I know exactly what he's about to do. Now, we have two very different styles of selling.

Yes, right.

But I understand the thought process. And one of the things that I'll do is like when we're bringing on people or whatever, I'll listen to phone calls. Like, I don't care how they say things or how eloquent they are. I just care that I understand the thought process behind what they're doing. Because if I don't understand how they're. What, why they're doing things, then I can't help them in saying that. I think that a good vocabulary, a stupendous vocabulary, is very beneficial, advantageous. All other different words and such is if you're losing, you use language to persuade people. So understand the language. I think it's very important now in saying that Marco, you know, or anyone else has English as a second language can still sell in English. But the better your vocabulary, the easier it is.

Yeah.

You know, so it's like they either have a totally different method that I don't understand, which is fair enough, or they just don't understand fuck they're doing and they're flying by this. I listened to a call the other day. A company came to us and they were like, oh, we got a recruitment placement company to put this guy in. And they took seven calls a day and they sold for four weeks and they sold two.

Right.

So they had like a 6% close rate or a 2% close rate. And he was like, but our marketing is amazing. And they said, those guys suck. I go, well, hold on a second. My 5 year old can close it for 5, 10%. So I was like, probably it's a little bit of both. But send me semi what you would consider the best call that you heard so close. Right? And I'll go over it. And this poor was just like a. He got the sale. But the way I described it to Marco was it was like watching a blind squirrel who ran head first into a nut.

Right?

The poor had no structure.

Yeah.

That guy's like. Like in that little repertoire. Like, I'm not cheating on anybody.

Right.

But that's kind of an example. Like, if you haven't been taught a structure of how to do something, it's really, really difficult to do. Like, you look at pole vault or something like that for an example. There's a specific sequence in which you need to do in order to be successful. Now, it can be done, and there's a few different ways that you can do it, but you can't just, like. And then, like, hope for the best and jump over. Like, it's not going to happen.

Right.

So, like, if a pole vaulter is watching, they can go, I can see what they did wrong. And if there's some sort of, like, craziness going on, then chances are it's not going to be a revolutionary way forward. Chances are it's just the wrong way of doing things. And so this guy that I was listening to is cool. Like, I could just tell no one had ever taught him how to do this. Or someone was teaching. They didn't teach him very well. Or he wasn't listening because, like, I had no idea where he was going, what he was doing, what he was trying to achieve at any stage. And to me, I couldn't come up with, like, a semblance of order. Right. So it was just chaos. And the fact that the guy sold was, in my opinion, pure luck.

Right.

The poor fuck had no structure.

Yeah.

And I didn't, like, I did not know where he was, what he was doing.

Yeah.

Or like, I couldn't put together his thought process. So I was like, either he's brand new at sales. All right. Which is definitely a possibility.

Yeah. Right.

Or his process is just like. It's like, you ever heard the quote, even if a lion could speak English, you could never have a conversation with them.

I haven't heard of that one.

Yeah.

It just means that your frames of reference are so far removed that even if you were speaking the same language, the conversations wouldn't make any sense.

Right.

So that's why I like, that thought process is so important.

So how would you coach? Unless it's just sales iq, but how would you coach, for example, up and coming, rest, including myself, on having a good thought process to go through the call?

Well, it's. It's understanding what you want to get out of each part of your sale. So, like, if we go back to NEPQ terminology, right, Then it's connection. What do you want under the connection phase.

So I want to just understand why they're even here.

Sweet.

Yeah.

And situation phase, what do you want to get of that?

The problem that they're trying to solve or what they're currently doing to solve it.

Okay. And then problem awareness.

How the what. What the problem is, if any, and how it's impacting him and what caused it in the first place.

Yeah.

And then solution.

If they've been looking for a solution out there to solve the problem.

Yeah.

And then once they find the solution, what's the tangible outcome after the tangible outcome? The emotional drive behind it.

Yep.

And then what they really want if it's not the real goal.

Yeah.

And then after that, like painting the picture in the head and asking you consequence questions on why they want to resolve it.

Yeah.

And then after consequence, what do we do?

We get a commitment.

Yeah.

And then we go to transition. And then commitment again.

Sweet. There you go.

Okay.

Well, it's just a complicated shit of it.

Yeah.

Yeah.

So, like, if you understand where you are in the sales script.

Right.

Or where you are in the sales process, and then from there, like, you know how to transition between them and you know what information you've got and what information you need, then it's a pretty straightforward process, by the way. Like, if you can't do what Dan just did, which is clearly and clearly and easily articulate your sales process, like, then you don't understand your sales process. And if you don't understand your sales process, it's really difficult to take people through that process, which means there's going to be inconsistencies in your process. So if you're having those inconsistencies, what I want you to do is I want you to go into the description down below, and I want you to check out the closing code, Facebook group, and also subscribe to the YouTube channel. Okay. Those are going to be things that you can use as a resource to be able to actually understand your sales process. Okay. So you need to be able to do what Dan just did.

Okay.

Because I think what I was doing now that I now have been talking about it with you, is that I get so far in the weeds of the language and I'll be using.

But look at Marco. I mean, the motherfucking barely speak English.

Yeah. Yeah.

That puts me to shame, doesn't it?

I mean, I love you, Marco, but Jesus.

Yeah.

Indirectly.

Yes.

Like, I just don't like Angelo as well.

Yeah.

Angela's a fucking savage.

Yeah, right.

Savage.

Yeah.

You know, again, English is a second Language. To be fair, he speaks English very well, but I just don't. Like. Again, I think we're over complicating a somewhat simple process. Now, simple doesn't mean it's easy. Like, you know, complexity fails, simplicity, scales. Right, yeah, that whole business analogy. But it's true, I think in most processes, if a process is complicated, and I think people overcomplicate sales because again, they want to find a reason why it's really difficult to apply. But most people haven't really tried.

Mmm.

You know, and you've tried and you're doing really well. You got seven deals last week.

Yeah.

Like fucking yolo, you know, so you're doing really well and. But like, it, like. But you spent the first six months of your development doing a bunch of busy work, stupid shit.

Yeah, that's true.

Yeah.

You know, and then you came here where you had a good place to develop. You were around people who were doing it every day, and I called you a pussy for not closing deals. And the next day. Yeah, I think the same day.

Yeah.

Literally 30 minutes after.

Yeah.

You closed it in a circle for the first time.

Yeah.

So it's like again, you over complicated the process.

Yeah. Right.

Because like, that makes people feel good, you know?

Yeah.

Sometimes it just takes a person to be like, what the fuck are you doing? Yeah. And then just believe in you and then you just go for it.

Yeah.

And like, listen, everyone does the same for something, you know? Like for me, it's like my health. I overcomplicate it, make it harder than it has to be. So I have a coach, James. He comes in, fucking slaps me around, calls me a piece of shit, and I'm like, yep, thank you.

Thank you.

You know, so everyone's got like, everyone. Whatever you're not good at, you're gonna make it seem harder than what it actually is, you know?

I like that.

So that's why we need mentors. That's why we need people who are invested enough to tell us the truth.

Well, that kind of like all those questions that I had pretty much were like, based off the thought process and like just how. How you basically think on a sales call.

Right.

Yeah.

But you. Everything that we went through basically summed it all up. So all those questions are now redundant.

Yeah.

I'm glad. So I think. I think the key take homes is like, you know, it's simple, but it's not easy. You know, some things just take a lot of time to develop the muscle, you know, it doesn't mean that you can't actively do things to get better at them. But it means like, you've got to have a look at your, like the curve, you know, and like do your cost analysis. Like for you, at the point you're at right now, is it worth you spending two hours a day doing development over that? Two hours a day be better spend calling leads.

Calling leads for sure now.

For sure.

Yeah. Right.

When you first start out that that cost benefit was different, you know, so now you're at a stage where you're good to go.

Yeah.

And the thing that would develop you most is just more success.

Yeah.

You know, and there will come a time where you will go through some sort of slump.

I went through it last week.

Yeah.

Yeah.

And then, I mean, not really. You made seven sales.

Yeah.

I mean, should have had like double, to be honest.

Should have had double.

Should have.

Yeah.

On what? On whose. On whose calculator.

My personal one.

Yeah.

How many calls did you have?

I had about. So four of them were follow up calls.

Okay, Right.

And then I basically had six out of. Six out of like 14 calls.

Yeah. Okay. Yeah.

So like 40.

Yeah, 40.

And like what do you close month on month?

Usually it's 60 to 65.

Okay. Yeah.

So. But you just said you had a stump because you didn't close at 80.

Yeah, well, I personally felt because it's first lump struggled.

Yeah, yeah, yeah. But like again, it's a macro cycle.

Yeah.

Versus a micro cycle. Right. So what Dan is doing now is pretty classic, you know what I mean? There's a great quote and I can't remember where it is or who said it. And I don't even know this is exactly what it is, so please take it with a grain of salt. But basically, lazy people spend all day long telling themselves how hard they work. And people who are really driven spend all day long worry about the fact that they're being lazy. Okay. And so Dan is a really hard worker who is good at what he does. And he's like a pleasure to work with, to be perfectly honest. But he's like in the trap of constantly worrying about the fact that he's not doing enough right now. This will change with time. Dan's young. I think he's just turned 30 or he's like late 20s, you know, and like the older you get and the more mature you get, I guess, the more context you get. So yeah, this is a classic, classic example. I don't think it's a bad thing or a good thing. I think it's just a Thing. But I think that people need to give themselves a fucking break. Especially if they're getting offered to the level at which Dan is, I think.

When you hit it.

But like, what if this week you close at 100? Are you the greatest salesperson of all time?

I personally feel like I would be.

Yeah. Yeah.

So if you don't close much one week you're the worst of, if you close the next week, you're the best.

Yeah, that, that's just my stupid ego playing on me.

Yeah.

It's a long period, man. Like, you know, like there are times where I close. I think like my best week was like my best week of closing ever was I think 15 deals.

Right? Yeah.

That was the best week I had in terms of like when I was commissioning my sales repping and it was like from 18 calls.

Yeah. That's crazy.

But like, like the week before I'm pretty sure I went like over four. Like the week before I'm pretty sure I went like over four.

Yeah.

You know, and then I have, I've had weeks where like I closed at 600% because like I just had all bunch of follow up sales close, you know, and then I would go like 0%, 200%, 50%, 80. But it always leveled out to like 70.

Yeah.

So I guess gotta ride the highs.

And ride the lows.

Yeah. Yeah.

Now I close very, very high. But again, like, you know, it's an unfair metric now because nobody gets on the phone with me unless they've already bought.

Too scared.

I'm scared. It's just if they're reaching out to me directly, they want something very specific.

Okay.

You know, and I tell them the price over DM and I guess this much. If you want to hop on a phone, we can like, because I just, I don't need to. I don't. It's just, it's the, it's the. As her mosey would say, it's the, it's the chicken. The red dress from the Matrix.

Right.

It's just a distraction at this point. But so I think like everything you're doing as well. So I think for you, in order to develop first of all in a slump, it's probably going to be longer. It'd probably not be closing at 40%.

Yeah.

That would not be a slump. When you do hit a slump, which you eventually will, which probably lasts for a month. Right. The determining factor of how good you are is how little you change. I just want to say that again, if you're an experienced salesperson, you can always tell how good or seasoned a veteran is by how little they change during a slump. If your process works, then you keep doing it.

Right.

Just because you have a bad week or a bad month doesn't mean you throw everything out the fucking window and just start again. Because like I could not sell 10 people in a row. I wouldn't change a thing.

Yeah.

Because I could then sell the next 20 people and I'm a 2 out of 3 guy, which is pretty fucking good.

That was a quote from Pain and Welch, wasn't it? Like your ability as a closer to takes on like the consistent actions you take, not the actions you change when you go and draw a slump.

It could be.

Yeah.

Salesman 97 bucks.

There you go.

Now sales sniper.

Yeah, yeah.

Cool. Any last questions?

No, that's pretty much it. That gives up everything.

Very.

Okay, cool. Alright guys, so hope you enjoyed that video. Dan again, great guy. You know, if you do like this kind of content, make sure you like subscribe, hit notification but make sure you comment any questions that you have down below. Okay. If you like this style of content, you want me to do more things where I'm actively coaching people through things, then comment coaching down below and I'll make sure that I know to do more more of this style of content. So. All right guys, thank you so much. Make sure you, you check out the Facebook group. Okay. The closing code. Facebook group. If you guys have any want any more from us, you can also go to sales sniper.net we have a whole bunch of free resources, calls, SOPs, everything and yeah, we'll speak to you soon guys. Thank you.

It.