The Thief of Joy

All right, guys, welcome to another episode of Coffees for Closes. Me and James today, and I just gotta calm down because I just went on a rant about weak people in Clubhouse.

Weak people in clubhouse.

There's a clubhouse. Just go straight into the tangent because people love a good.

How about. Here we go into the intro, then get to the tangent now.

Fuck these people. This is. This is my podcast. They're gonna listen to what I have to say. There was a clubhouse room that said bullying in Clubhouse. And I went in there, just a bunch of people bitching about being bullied on Clubhouse. How fucking ridiculous. How much of a victim do you need to be?

If you listen to this podcast, you will make your first million within three years. I'm going to repeat that. You will make a million dollars within three years of the first episode. You listen to. We don't want pikers. We're not here to save the manatees. We're here podcasts. You really want this? You listen and review. Put that coffee down.

So clubhouse, that's. It's new. It's a bit of a hype. What do you make of it so far?

Don't know, man. It's a zoom call. Without the video?

No, there's no video. I've joined. I've been invited. I haven't actually spent any time in it as. As such because I have so much content already to. To look at and listen to that you really can't justify being pitched to for more people.

I think it's cool. Like, I think it's. It's probably cool for some people. Like, for me, I obviously do a lot of content. I give a lot away. So for us, yeah, another platform just to give free content away. I gotta figure out a way. I know a way where I can actually use that content. So it's not just like going into the Ethereum. But I thought it was helpful. Today a lot of the guys from the NEP Q course who are in there have signed up so they can kind of get more training. So really, if you wanted to do stuff for free, I do a Facebook live in the Facebook group every week. We do the podcast. I do two soon to be two YouTube videos a week. I do one in clubhouse. How much more free shit could I give people? Just give me $25 for the first week of the closing code. You pieces of shit. Just do it. Give it away so much for free anyway. But yeah, Clubhouse, we'll see how it goes. I'll fucking bang it in. Who cares, right?

Yeah. The. The fear I. I have with like another platform and, you know, it's more of a conservative fifth. It's just like so many newbies that don't have big followings on Facebook and that can really jump in and use it as a platform. And what's wrong with that? Well, the thing is, like, there's so many people that don't know what the fuck they're talking about.

Do you want to start vetting social media platforms and if people.

No, no, no. I'm just busy guy. Yeah. My point is, like, careful who you get your advice from, because I've had. I've seen and some terrible things and not just on there, but on Facebook. I've seen some terrible, like me, like anyone that's not good at what they do and they get the first, they get their foot in the door and they can build a following and have no idea what the fuck they're talking about. It's like things like investing things like crypto. Right. A lot of those, like, crypto guys got big followings on YouTube and stuff. Have no idea what the fuck they're doing and, you know, to a point where they can potentially manipulate the market and.

Who are you talking about specifically?

Oh, no one. Just generality. Yeah.

Just trying to throw you under the bus.

Heaps of them. So, you know, no one in specific.

You know, it's funny, there's a great piece of advice, a great line, and I heard it from Dan Lock, of all people, and it's take their advice, live their life.

Yeah, My, my point is I just don't want to see people get sucked in to other idiots that don't know what they're talking about on another platform. What they say is gospel.

Yeah, yeah, yeah. I think, you know, people protrude their own past. But I think, like, I think the cool thing about it, and I don't want to start talking about clubhouse too much, but here we are. The cool thing about it is it's a very interactive way to speak with people that you wouldn't normally get to speak to. So, like, you can hop on if, like, let's say Ryan Sirhant does a clubhouse, you can actually speak to them.

Yeah, yeah, I like that.

So you're gonna get access to people you wouldn't like. Even me, for example, right? Like, dude, I'm fucking everywhere. But it's all pre done. There's not many like, live. There's like one now. There's two live opportunities a week. Not that I'm anyone fucking special in the slightest, but, like, There is a small segment of people who have decided that I'm pretty good at selling. So they listen to the podcast and they watch the videos and for them to be able to like connect and ask me specific questions on Clubhouse. And then also for me, from just an ego point, I had like three or four dudes today say, hey dude, your fucking podcast and your YouTube channel is awesome. So I was like, sweet. So for me it's a chance to like, you know, connect with Douche is the sound. Connect with the fans, James. Gotta connect with the fans.

Signatures.

Yeah, sign signatures.

Sign babies. Kiss babies.

Yeah. You know, get my emotional jerk off done for the day. Get it nice and early 8am so if you guys are listening, I go live on clubhouse at 4pm Eastern every Wednesday.

Yeah, I love the sound of that. I think that's so awesome that people can connect with those big names that they have to pay 10, $20,000 to get the opportunity to do so. And ask a quick question because, you know, without. With the risk of sounding like you just were. It really is like big for the fans. You know what I mean?

It's big for the fans, buddy. My only fans.

I would know.

Expensive.

I would know. You know, I got plenty.

Me and, Me and Gurn look out for me and Gurn's only fans page.

But yeah, no, like outside of that. Yeah, just be careful. You take advice from. Because man, like there's so many charlatans.

But in saying that, definitely take my advice.

Even on like the role plays that I do. When people ask me stuff that's outside of my scope, it's like I'm not willing to answer that question for you because I'm not gonna do justification to the question. Like I don't have a good answer for that. So there's no point in me trying to bullshit and give you something. I'll just say, hey, look, you know, you're better off asking this question to this person because they'll give you a better answer. I don't have context. No. Anyway, let's move on from Clubhouse. Let's talk about Roadhouse.

Great movie. Tearing throats out. It's the way to go. Apparently you can just tear someone's throat out very easily if you're a 5 foot, 700 pound man. Anyway, I think what today we're going to talk about is. I think it's like, it's a, it's a trap or a pitfall. Talk about traps that I think salespeople fall into, which is going to morph into like what Is like, I think maybe help contextualize for sales reps some things that they don't understand about running a business to make, to make like the longevity and sales, I think, easier. Right? Because I think there are a couple traps and like obviously being both sides of the coin, like, I've been a full time salesperson and I've been the head business owner. Right. So I think there's very different mentalities. And I, I think sometimes as sales closers, we. I think closers want too much sometimes and they, you know, so if you're going to talk about commissions, we can talk about that because I just released a video on YouTube on how to demand more commissions, which I think you can, but it's a very step by step process. You need to kind of realize what you bring to the table. But I don't think people should be paid 30%, 40%, even 20%, really. Depending on the program or the price. If it's a 5K offer, whatever. But you know, I think you got to be careful with wanting commissions that are too high and then getting comparison syndrome. Like, oh, it's a 30k offer. Why am I not getting paid 4 grand a sale? It's like, okay, well, is it any different selling a 15 or a 30? No, it's like, okay, but you're getting compensated more for the 30 than you are for the 15. Because they can do that. But it's not like, it's not like you're getting compensated for difficulties. I think as soon as you start getting into like comparison games, I'm only getting 7%, I'm only getting 5%. It's like, yeah, man, but do you realize that it. If you went into the middle of any country and said, hey, I get paid $1500 to talk to someone on the phone for 45 minutes, like, they would lose their goddamn mind. So I think, like, we have to keep it in comparison. And when people start going like, only 12%, this is bullshit. I'm like, is a thousand dollars not enough for you for an hour? What do you think you're worth? Because like, unless you close at 80% consistently, I don't want to fucking hear it, to be perfectly honest. Because like, and this is, you know, and this. I said the same thing when I was a closer. I was like, why are you worth it? Like, what are you doing so differently than everybody else that you should take 20% of the gross revenue of the business?

Well, I think outside of that, and this will lead into how you understand that better as well, is the discrepancy or the trap that salespeople I found fall into is not having an understanding as to why the business owner has made certain decisions. And because you can't understand why they've set that price, why they've set that commission structure, why they have set certain amounts of leads, you can't really have the transparency to understand that that may be better than what you think it is. And you just don't have the capability to understand where it comes from because you, you don't have business. Not to say you don't, but in that situation people don't have the business understanding to know why people make certain decisions.

Exactly. Like delivery costs are expensive if you run a good program. Do you know what I mean? And the better program you run, the more delivery cost to do. And so like the more people you.

Sell, the more the delivery costs are because of onboarding. Right? And yeah, and further to that, like you can't just go out and expect more leads to make more sales just because you're on a hot streak. Because what are the limitations on onboarding someone in, you know, all of a sudden if you sell too many people, you break the program, people get refunds, then you have no long term business to continue to get sales. You know, there's, there's so many aspects that people don't see or understand.

Yeah, exactly. And I think like the, the trap is like when you start comparing like what the business owner should make versus what I should make. And comparison is the thief of joy. Like it really is like as a salesperson, I think we're in a unique ability to have a business. Let's say you just like if you look at closing is running your own business with absolutely zero cost, with absolutely zero risk. In terms of like what you had to invest. Yeah, you had to invest what, let's say you invested 50,000 in coaching courses to become good. Do you know what it used to cost us to set up a gym? I used to set up gyms. It was around 250 to $300,000 in equipment cost. Like and then fit out to get that gym off the ground.

Then you got to pay 30 to 100 grand lease.

Yeah, yeah. So like you know, in terms of investment in what you have to do to get a business off the ground, it's absolutely microscopic. It's not even worth worrying about. Then you've got the fact that like one you can hop from offer to offer pretty easily if you're half decent. And like you don't have to worry about the delivery at all. Like you're getting paid, you're getting paid, you're getting paid regardless of that person does three months or ten months a lot of the time. Unless you got back in recurring comms, which isn't that usual. To be honest. Most people just get paid a one off commission. One and done. And I'd rather take a lower one off commission than take back in recurring because I don't want to have to deal with it. And that's where like I don't care about comparison. I don't care, oh, it's a $30,000 program and I'm getting paid $1,500. It's like, yeah, sweet, fucking great. I'm happy with that. Like I am happy with that. If someone's paying me fifteen hundred dollars a sale, I'm super happy with that. Now if I can negotiate more because I bring a lot to the table in other realms, awesome. I'll try and do that. But I have to understand the business and really I don't want to gouge the business and I don't want to take so much off the front end that I limit the ability to liquidate the marketing effectively. Right. And this is a big thing. Like if you're not really good, like if you can't consistently close over 50%, you need to be really careful with how much comms you ask for because you can destroy that business quickly.

Yeah. And you can stem your lead flow because they don't have the cash on the front end then to pay for marketing because you're not liquidating quick enough to get the ROI on their ad spend. Therefore there's no leads for you if there's no budget going back into that marketing.

And the fallacy is that the more expensive the program, the more comms you should get paid.

Yeah.

No, it's just not true because like I've sold plenty of $5,000 programs and gotten a thousand dollars commission. I've also sold $15,000 programs and gotten a thousand dollars commission because like it depends on how it's paid out. If it's a one and done course. Dude, courses have crazy ROIs because there's no delivery cost, it's set and forget it's done. So on a $5,000 course that might just have a group coaching model. So it's crazy good. Right? But if you're looking at like a coaching model with like one on ones or like in depth stuff and model like the delivery costs and they'll blow up because a good a lot of the wet time. The way that coaching organizations work, the coaches are on rev shares, so they take a percentage of the revenue that they coach. Right. And then they get retention bonuses and stuff like that. So like, and then, you know, but the only guy paying the bill for everybody is the guy who, you know, owns the business, who's also paying for all the ads and taking all the risk. Yeah. Like there is. If you want to make the most amount of money in sales, in my opinion, selling the really expensive programs is not the way to do it. It's selling like a $7,000 offer that has high volume. Because on the $7,000 offer, you can usually it's like a course or like, it's something like that where it doesn't involve much people, even like 5,000. So it's a high profit venture and it's a high turnover of, like, leads. And you're going to get your commission up front because it's almost always going to be a one or a two pay. Right. So you get everything really quickly. You can make a lot of sales quickly, and you can do three sales a day at 700 bucks a sale. Making 20 $100 a day, you're making $10,000 a week. No dramas. Now, if you were to translate that into a 30k offer, like a 12k coaching program, you're looking at, you know, potentially that 30k is being paid over 12 months. Unless you're a paid in full bandit, which you're probably not, let's be honest. Right? Then they've got to deliver that person for 12 months. They've also, because it's a 30k offer, it's more expensive to make the sale. They've also got to go through an extended sales process because it's longer. So really, like, you know, the myth is that I want to sell high ticket. I want to sell high ticket. Hey, bro, sell 5K offers and smash them. If you get $500 a sale on a 5K offer and you can sell three or four a day, you're killing it, bro. You have no risk. It's not a difficult sale. Like, you're crushing it. And it's just. It's really more of an ego thing. If you want to start getting into 30, 40, 50, 60K. Now, I'm lucky to be in a position where I've been able to negotiate very, very healthy commissions when I'm doing the sales. But I'm bringing a lot more to the table. I'm bringing sales processes and all that kind of stuff. So some of the sales that I do are 5,000 a sale. Yeah. My close rates astronomical. Like it's over 90.

To get paid more.

So like, give me two leads, I'll sell two of them. Give me 10 leads, I'll sell nine. Like, and I even like, the first, the first two weeks that we went with Jeremy, they gave me no leads. I made 35 sales at 15k a pop, right? No leads, zero leads. They just gave me a Facebook group with 800 people in it. I was like, I can do this. Crack the knuckles, boom. Couple hundred thousand dollars in revenue, I'm out, right? Like, and so like, unless you can do that, like, why do you deserve it and you can do that. You just got to get there. This isn't to toot my own horn, but it's just like, I don't know. I see a lot of people in the closing industry, like just they, they. I think they want more than they're worth in terms of like and been on both sides of the coin, having run a couple of businesses now and been a commission guy. Like, I never bitched about the commissions because I understood the delivery. All I wanted was like the delivery to be good. And if the delivery is good, the refund rate's low, so there's no callbacks. And like, you know, if you're going to sell a shit program, you're going to get really high comms. Like, if you're on an E comm offer with a 50% into ten $15,000 coaching program and they're giving you 35% comms, it's a scam, I'll tell you that right now. Either the guy's a genius and he's automated everything and he's super generous, or.

It'S a scam I'd particularly need come I'd lean towards the fucking thing more often than not.

I'll give you the round tip. Yeah, yeah. Because if you look at like anything.

That sells a way for you to get rich really quick and they do it for you, you're fucking in dreamland.

Because if you ever look at certain offer which I will not name, but it's a something automation offer, right? Some sort of, I don't know, automation where you sell products on a very large website and they're done for you is 160k and the com for that.

Sounds like you might get a copyright infringement on how dare you podcast.

Possibly so. But like the commissions on that are like two and a half grand. It's $160,000 sale. And like it's like, oh, it's bad. It's like, yeah, but like, I mean, if you. Assuming that's being done properly, tremendous amount of cost, it's probably 50 grand in cost to get that up and running, you know, so you're not really selling, you know, 150. And I've said this before, but if you're selling a $30,000 yearline coaching program, and unless you're paying it in full, you're not selling a $30,000 coaching program. You're selling a month to month. You're selling a month to month. Because I don't care what contract you sign, there's absolutely no contract that is worth anything in service. Yeah, because the moment you say, I did not get the service that I required to get the outcome that you said I would get, and if anyone has ever said an outcome, then you're tied to that. And if they don't achieve the outcome in Australia, for example, they are entitled to a 100% refund.

I think all you're selling in those programs is the cash that you collected. In reality, that's all the money that you're taking. And from there as a gamble as to whether the rest gets paid off because it's out of your control. So you take more cash on the upfront and get more commission from that.

Exactly. You are selling the amount of cash that you collected.

You want to make high commissions, take more cash than you can and then.

And then negotiate a cash collection bonus, which I lay out how to do it in my video or go to my base.

Your commissions rather than a flat rate based off a percentage of the cash that you collect, which will one, incentivize you and drive you to take more cash, the business owner will be happier and more open to negotiating. And then your commission check is in far more in your control than a flat rate for a dollar for a program.

So I think like, if you're a sales rep out there, like, don't get in the comparison game. Don't start thinking, oh, it's 50 grand, I should get this much. There is no industry standard. People say our industry standard is this. No, it's not. There is no industry standard because the commissions that you get are purely, you know, going to be dependent on the delivery costs and how much the person can, can pay. Like you've got taxes. Like in Australia, every single dollar that we make in profit is 27.5 cents is sent to the government. So, like, you know, if you. So. And then I've got. So if I make a Hundred bucks. Ten percent of that goes to sales tax, which is state tax, right? That's 90, right? Let's say I'm running at a 30% profit margin. So I got 30 cents, right? So 10 cents of that is going to the government, you know, like, so I'm making 20 cents and you want to get how much? 20 cents commission, you know, from my, from my dollar. So you know, it's, it doesn't make a lot of sense. So I think a lot of people are shooting themselves in the foot by saying they can demand these massive comps. And if you are really good, like you'd be dealing with volume, you know what I mean? If you're really good, like if you can close people really, really well and you're a master of your craft, you know, you're doing four or five sales calls a day, you should be closing two to three, right? And you should be making heaps of bank even if it's 400, 500 bucks a sale. The first high ticket closing thing that I did was a $7,500 marketing offer. I made $400 commission and I was stuck. I was pumped. I'm so happy about that because I used to sell 400 packages and make $22 commission, of which I was still pumped. I was on a base but like, I was stoked about that, you know, I mean, because I was like, I have no risk here. I'll have to delivery. I'm happy. I just think we need to realize like the incredible position that we're in as closers where like, man, it's such a good gig. If you're good at it, it's, it's easy cash if you're good at it. Now getting good at it is not easy, you know, but like, you know, I think you need to be more realistic with like, don't get comparison, don't, don't start. Just, you know, because it's just not the case. Because a $30,000 program might have the same profit as the $7,000 program, you know, so they can't afford to pay that much anyway. That's sort of one of the traps that I think that salespeople are falling into. Think another trap is like thinking that like, oh, this guy, I'm making this guy all this money, I might as well try and do it myself. Yeah, it's like good luck.

And that's where go try. And that's where you become a coach with no business sense. Because you, if you have that comparative mindset, you don't have the business acumen to do it yourself. Like, you just don't. Because you're making poor decisions. Yeah. Because, like, you probably don't have the skill set. You know, are you a bringing coach or are you a sales guy? Do what you're good at. You know, that's the reason you're in sales, is so you don't have to deliver. But if you get trapped into that mindset, it's like, sure, go ahead and do it. And it'll be a really good teaching tool for you to realize how much goes on in the back end of an actual business that you never realized before, and then you can come back to it a better person and work better.

And I think that, yeah, like, from the other side of that as well, like, I'm not under. Undermining the importance and like, the. The difficulty of being a really good closer, but it's just an entirely different skill set. I've only, like, I've been selling for a very long time, but I've also been running businesses for a long time now. Like, my first business started it in 2011, 2010, something like that. So I've been running businesses for 10 years.

Yeah, I run my first business 10 years ago as well.

Yeah. And so I've gone through a lot of iterations of that and I've learned a lot and I've made a lot of mistakes and I was selling the whole way through. And now it's just the fact that, like, been lucky, the stars have aligned and now I'm good at selling plus pretty good at running a business. I'm probably better at selling than running a business, but learning that skill. But it's like having seen both sides of it, it's like. Like there's not many people who are in a situation or like, lucky enough to. To really sort of be good at both. Because if you're a really good salesperson, the way that you think is different, and if you're a really good business operator, the way that you think is slightly different again. So it's like, it's just like, you know, if you figure out what you want to do and you figure out where you want to go, and if you want to start a business, by all means, go and start a business. But don't think just because you're good at sales is going to mean, like, there's so much more that goes into running a good business than just sales. Yeah, but sales is an integral part of having a successful business. You know what I mean? But you can have awesome Sales, like, and we know because we've done programs, we've sold programs for guys who are just garbage at business. Garbage doesn't mean they're not good at what they do or what they teach. They might be good coaches, but they're garbage at business. And we sit back and we go, what the fuck are you doing? Like, why are you making these decisions? This doesn't make any sense. You know, I mean, and it's really frustrating, and it's like, I can't work with this guy because, like, the decisions that are being made on a business level are ridiculous, and they're going to tank it, and I don't want to be a part of it. But then you work with someone like Vince Del Monte, phenomenal business operator. Phenomenal. Like, the dudes really, really switched on. And at another level above us, like, considerably in terms of business acumen. He's been at it for a lot longer, but it's an absolute treat to see, like, how somebody like that maneuvers a business of that size with relative ease and how he's able to kind of massage all the individual places and put the people where people need to be put. So, you know, it's just a really interesting dynamic. And as salespeople, we're in a really privileged position to be able to make more money than the business owner. And, you know, in a lot of cases, until the. Until everything really starts to take off. You know what I mean? But you should be really happy. Yeah, you should be really happy. If the business owner goes out and buys a Ferrari. You should be like, sweet. I am responsible for him for partly for him being able to do that. I. I bought the left wheel.

Unless he's very bad with financial decisions.

Yeah.

And that just bankrupted you and stopped your lead flip for the next six months. And you needed it.

They buy a Ferrari, and then there's no lead coming in. You know why? Yeah, but, yeah, so it's kind of like one of those things. Like, we all have our roles, and, like, if you're going to be a commission sales rep and you're good at it, you'll be very, very financially comfortable, and you will be in the top 1%. However, the people who have taken the risk and the guys who are like, if we just take our business, for example, right. At the end of the day, if everything goes to shit and all the bills need to be paid, it's my savings that'll be pillaged.

That's.

That's. That's the end of the day, that's where the buck stops. Right. And me and you're fairly equal at this, but end of the day, like, hey, pay the bills. Okay.

Yeah. And right. If you're the sales guy that thinks that you can do what the business owner does and you want to be like, I'll just do that for myself. Have to ask yourself, if you've got employees and you're doing that, are you willing to take that financial risk that if things fall over, it comes directly out of your saving and your bank account to make it right if you're not happy to put that on the line and keep doing sales and stop drinking.

Yeah, yeah. And so like, I think like, you know, you have to be aware, like it's such a phenomenal way to make such good money. But it's never going to be crazy money, it's never going to be boat money. You're never going to buy a yacht, 100 foot yacht from being commission sales rep right now it can be a great stepping stone into other things.

Maybe if you sell yachts.

Yeah. You can put yourself in positions. You know, actually I stand correct on that because you can, if you sell fine art and you're on 20 commissions, you can make hundreds and hundreds and tens. You can make tens of millions of dollars a year. Right. So. But in sort of like the coaching and consulting industry, which is where a lot of what we're doing, like you can make $150,000 a month would be like a phenomenal, you know, about the top tier of what you can do in terms of time and money and stuff like that. And that's a fucking lot of money, you know what I mean? But it's not fuck you money.

Yeah.

You know what I mean? And the only person who's going to make the fuck you money is the one that takes the largest amount of risk. And I think a lot of this stuff is coming up because of like the transition that's going on and like I'm having to go through that transition and so are you and so, so of our sales reps and you know, so I don't want this to come off as like anything, but I think it's like I've, I've been at all different stages in business and I just think it's always important to remember, like I need to make sure I get what I'm worth. I need to make sure I can maximize my income opportunities, but I also need to like, just for myself to make sure that I'm in the best headspace possible is to make sure that like, I understand the privileged position that I'm in as someone who can take a good percentage of gross revenue from a company with assuming no risk. And that's why I like, I love sales. It's such a good place to be, is because all you're doing is risking your time. That's it, you're risking your time. You're not really having to put much into it. So I think like, it's such an amazing role to be in, especially these days, which is like, probably, you know, it's the infancy of that type of sale. And I don't know if it's gonna last a long time. I don't know what's gonna happen to it. But I think it's gonna be around for a while and I think it's a phenomenal place to be in. And I think like, it's a great opportunity for people to make silly money because I think if you can make 100 grand a month from your fucking, you know, basement with an Internet connection on the phone, convincing people to give somebody else money, boom. Like, what a life. And that's what the dream of the inbound closer is. You know what I mean? Now what you have to do to get there is, you know, I don't know many guys who have really cracked that. Like, if I'm to look around honestly and have a look at like every single inbound closer in the coaching and.

Consulting space, I'd say the average wage was three to five thousand dollars a month.

Yeah.

From what I've seen, I collectively looked at it.

Yeah. And like I was making that a day.

I think like a really good, good thing for like salespeople to do is, is get some business understanding so that you are in a position to understand how you can negotiate because you understand what is able to be negotiated on. Right. Read some books, like Good to Great. I think that's Jim Collins Principles, Ray Dalio, Lean Startup. Eric Riles maybe writes that book. Like have a read of a couple of these things so you can get like a baseline understanding of what goes on behind the scenes. Because if you can understand like delivery costs, risks and that from that, that salesperson, you're in a better, a much better position to negotiate because you know what is realistically able to be negotiated on and you'll get the better price for yourself.

Commission. Yeah. I've actually helped a few of my one on one coaching clients negotiate better comms and I stopped them from making some enormous mistakes because they just wanted to go in there like to be Honest. I'll walk you guys through. If you want more comms, the first step is to get more comms on self generated leads. That's your first step, right? It's the easiest one to get. All you got to do is find out what the average ad spend is to make a sale and then half it and ask for that. If it's usually $500, go. I want an extra 250 every time I make a sale. It's a no brainer. Then you can get all the referrals. One of our clients just took off the ability to first. It's so stupid. They said we're not allowed to ask for referrals because we get so many referrals that they just want the in house team doing it because they don't want to pay the commissions on us getting referrals.

Okay, have one.

But two. It's adorable. They think it's that easy to get referrals. What do I think? We're just asking for them. They don't think that we don't put them through a sales process to get the referral. Teach them how to ask for the referral and then nurture that sequence to where it becomes a sales call and we sell it.

So fucking prime example of having a good business but sucking at business. Making bad decisions. But, but back to that. Yeah, you. And for self generated leads, there's no associated marketing cost.

That's free free money.

There's if it costs them 500 a ROI for a sale, that's 500 they just saved. So if you're able to, if you're willing to go out and make that work for them, it is what makes incredible sense for them to pay extra for that sale because they've not only saved 500, they're only now paying 250 for that lead. Your extra commission as opposed to 500, it is an absolute.

So it's a net savings for the company which is huge.

And it incentivizes you to get more sales.

It makes you, it makes you like indispensable, right? So it means that you're the guy going out there and hustling. So then you start to be like the dude, right? Plus you're making more sales, you're out there, you're doing it, you're making more money. They're liquid at the marketing foster. Then you hit him with a cash collection bonus. Hey brother, I and then calculate, I usually collect 50 grand a month in cash. I would like a bonus every time I hit 70. Right? Make it a hard goal. Be like, yeah, 70 grand. If I had 70 grand in cash, I want 4%, make it a random number. I want 4.68% of the cash collected, everything over. As soon as I hit 70 grand, right? They're like, okay. And then chances are you've just been lazy, just been doing payment plans because there's no incentive to you to get paid in fulls now. There's incentive to get paid in fulls. You start asking for them, you start going for it, you start getting after it. You're making them more money, you're collecting more cash, you're liquidating ad spend, you're getting referrals, you're getting paid more. Bingo, bango, bongo, you're making more money. You know why? Because you're fucking hustling and you're getting after it and not being a goddamn pussy, sitting back like a baby bird, making more leads, more leads, more leads. I want more money, more money. Shut the fuck up and do something about it.

Yeah, yeah. To get more money, you have to be worth it. Like if you're a business and you had an employee come to you and say, look, you know, I'm a really good coach, I want to get PA paid heaps more to do exactly what I'm doing now without bringing anything to the table. You get told to fuck off. Like it's stupid. So why as a salesperson do we think that we can do that with commissions? It's no different.

So those are all things that I did make my money like you can.

Do to make more money?

Yeah, like there's like, you know, there's, you know, it's like getting better at sales. Right. The slowest way to make more money in sales is to get better sales. It's the least efficient way in the long term, it's the best move. In the short term. It takes forever. Takes like, you know, let's say you one on one coach with me, I will probably triple your money. I'll probably triple your sales in three months. Right? Still three months. You know, Dave Melman went from averaging in the hundreds, averaging in the three hundreds. Angelo Savage went from like 10k a month in comms, like 27k a month in incomes. Like, you know, they're doubling and tripling the revenue pretty quickly. But like the first thing I do with everybody is not teach them how to do a new script. The first thing we do is. When was the last time you asked for a referral? Never. Why not?

She loves hanging fruit.

Go out and ask for referrals dickhead. Like, what are you doing? Every single person. And then we do an assessment. How good is the delivery of the client that you're going for? It's about a 7 out of 10. Okay, cool. When do you think they'll be at their happiest? Day 21. All right, perfect. Day 21. Everybody gets asked for referral from now on. Okay? So if you get good at it, maybe one in five gives you a referral. You sign 50% of those. That means that one in every 10 sales that you make is an extra sale. Right? So that means that if you're making 10 sales a month, congratulations, you're now making 11. Okay, sweet. There we go. Now it's like, okay, what about follow ups? What are you doing to farm your follow ups? Where's your list? Okay, sweet. Let's put some place into that. Okay, next is like, what do you do when somebody no shows? I jerk off and watch Netflix. All right, well, that's not very productive. Why don't we cold call a list of people who know shutter for the last six months? If you have an auto dialer, you can do four dials a minute. So if you have an hour, what can you do? $240 an hour. Right. When was the last time you did $240 to try and generate your own leads? Right, exactly. So there's that. The next thing that you can do, right, is you can call everybody either other douchebags. He's not doing their own follow ups. Right. Call their no sales. Call the no sales of the worst rep that you know. I told a guy this the other day. I was like, who's the worst rep in your team? He's like, this guy. I was like, call all of his no sales because you're good. That guy's garbage. Right?

There's a lot of buyers on that list.

There's gonna be a lot of buyers in this. Right? So, like, it's, you know, standard. Okay, so do that. Like, these are all things that we can do. And if we create those into habits, like, that's how you become a really successful, consistent sales rep. Right. Because you're providing yourself with the most amount of opportunity, then over time, that opportunity converts at higher and higher percentages.

Yeah. And secondarily to one, you've increased your amount of sales from opportunity there. But if you listen to our advice, negotiating commissions, you're also getting paid more commission on those sales because you generated them.

Exactly. So, like, you know, yeah, man, double dip. Sideways went sideways.

So Kim Paris, the Thief of Joy.

Thief of Joy.

That'll be the title for this episode, I think.

Yeah. Yeah. It's just like, you know, go out there and get after. Like, you don't need more. Like, if you think you need a higher commission to make more money, you are like, you are. You are thinking wrong.

Yeah.

You have wrong think going on, because you just need to make more sales, brother.

And here's another massive mistake. And we'll try not to spend too long on it because we're getting quite into this podcast related to comparison that sales people. Yeah. So sales people, they inherently look up to someone that is another salesperson. Whether that's, you know, Matt, whether that's Jeremy, whether that's Eli, whether it's Brian Stewman, whether that's Grant, whether that's Dan. They look up to all these people and they compare themselves to that person and the way that they sell and try and emulate the way that they sell. And the reason why it's so successful is because they figured that specific way out for themselves and can deliver on it because it's themselves. You can't be Dan Locke. You can't be Jeremy Minor. You can't be Eli Wilde, but you can be yourself and take what they do and molded into your way of selling, so that comes across genuine. And when you're comparing yourself to these guys and try and emulate and replicate it, it doesn't come across the right way because it's not you.

Yeah. What's one of the first things I tell everybody when they join npq? I go, do not try and be Jeremy. You will fail miserably. That guy's got 22 years of NDPQ. If you try and emulate exactly what he does, you're gonna. You're gonna dive.

Yeah.

So you just.

You don't even.

Principles. I don't do it. I don't sell anything like Jeremy, but I use his structure. But, like, my sales calls would be totally. I slap. I slap people around like they're a bass guitar. It's just my personality. I only get a bass with Prospector.

We should do that.

Yeah, man.

We're buying some dumb for this office, aren't we?

Slapping the prospect.

I just ordered a bowl in the shape of a human skull. Goddamn right.

I did get pinged.

I put it on my personal card because it was linked to PayPal. It's a. It's a cool skull that we can fill with snacks or whatever. When we're doing the. When we're doing the podcast and literally eat out of the skull of our enemies. Just to put fear. If you try.

And if you try it, if you.

Try and come at it, it's not.

Enough rough to succeed. Others must fail.

Yeah. There'll also be a trolley there so that if you do try, you'll be pushing them at Woolworths. You know, there's a whole bunch of.

Funny, dumb shopping cart for those Americans. Yeah. Whenever we have competition, we say by the end of the year, they're going to be pushing shopping carts at Safeway. I don't know why. I don't know where it came from. It's just a joke. Just fine.

I think it's something Marco came up with.

Yeah. He said pushing trolleys at Coles, which is the Aussie version.

Kels is like, yeah, walnut, I guess, but.

All right, guys, well, it's just gonna wrap it up. Hope you guys enjoyed the podcast today. This one will be called, like, Angry Rants and Pitfalls. We'll see or something. I don't know. People like angry rants, so I think I'm gonna put that in the title. I gotta move Fired up, you know, it's okay. You deal with it. If you don't like it, don't listen. I don't give a. I'm gonna keep.

You wouldn't still be listening if you didn't.

Yeah. If you are. If you are still listening, shame on you. What did Marco say today? I don't want to bring shame to your face. Fucks you talking about?

Fuck this guy. He's coming from the basement.

Good news. I got my car back the other day. That's good. So now I'm driving back around in my Mercedes, which is always fun. You got to get your Mustang. Gonna do that?

Yeah. I'm in the middle of organizing it now.

Okay. Yeah, guys, so don't forget to, like, subscribe. Slap the base and join the closing code. Give me some money. My V8 is terrible on petrol, so I could really use the cash. So nothing else, you know, do that. But, yeah, make sure you join the closing tour group. Make sure you look at me on Clubhouse. If you're on there at Matt Ryder, make sure you go on to Facebook. At Matt Ryder, make sure you go on to YouTube. Matt Ryder. Check it out. Subscribe. A bunch of you fucks still unsubscribed. I gotta say, it's pretty disappointing if I'm honest. So, you know it's not. Nothing's gonna happen. What's gonna happen if you don't? It's gonna happen if you do. Anyway, guys, have a good day. Enjoy. Goodbye. Thank you.

Goodbye.

Put that coffee down.

Coffee's for close.