The Truth About CRM Automation

Man, except I just freaking was on a sales call and going good, and then my power cuts out, which we have a backup generator, but it's like the 1-second cut, so the Wi-Fi goes out. And then I had this call directly after, so I'm like— and we had like 2 minutes left, so I'm like, oh man, I don't even know what to do. Like, email them, be like, whoops. But other than that, man, I'm doing good. How are you doing?

Yeah, killer, man. Bit tired. I just was like up in the middle of the night thinking sales, thinking rev ops, thinking processes. I just got your blueprint. I'm like, how do I squeeze it into our processes? So I wanted to talk to you about that today. But yeah, man, that's good.

That's my life. That's tough sometimes. But yeah, Yeah, it's awesome. Um, what about you, Mario?

Uh, this is the, uh, first time listening in, uh, on your, like, coaching calls. I just, I just joined the community, like, maybe a week ago, and I've had sessions with, like, the other coaches, and just the first chance I get to hop on yours. I do, um, timeshare, uh, in the Caribbean, so that's That's kind of like what I do. I'm in the closer position and we do a one-call, no tangibles, high-ticket, bad rap sale in 90 minutes.

In 90— in 90 minutes? What do you mean? Say that again.

Yeah. Like when you come to like an all-inclusive in the Caribbean and like you survive the 90-minute presentation, that's where we like basically share you like the vacation club, the timeshare offer.

Gotcha. Okay. Yeah, gotcha, gotcha.

So I'm gonna— I'm gonna close your position. I'm doing that.

Nice, man, that's awesome. Where, uh, where do you sell homes?

Well, um, where are the timeshares?

Yeah, it's a vacation club. It isn't like a property acquisition, but rather like a vacation club. And I do that in Cancún.

Cancún, nice. I was just there.

Oh, that's hilarious.

Yeah, yeah.

Aaron was just here last January, actually, at the, uh, at the Hard Rock in Cancún.

Aaron? Who's Aaron?

Aaron, another, another coach. Aaron, uh, oh, gotcha.

Nice.

Yeah, Cancún's a popping spot, man. Popping spot for sure.

So, so I don't know if it's okay, like, if I can like maybe ask you like what, what you do, like marketing, because I, I looked up your videos online. It's, it seems like it's a lot of like CRM stuff that I'm not Yes. You familiar with, we don't do any CRMs?

Why not?

Um, it, the industry has been— I do.

Uh, but the industry's been like that since forever.

Like there's no follow-up, there's no no-sales, there's no referrals. It's just like you'll have a breakfast meeting with a guy that will get one shot to try and take you for all you're worth. And that's all we do.

Um, well, we'll have to talk about that and see if we can help you make some more sales by, you know, actually following up with our leads. Um, And then BC, what's up, man? Great to meet you as well. Yeah, thank you.

Thank you.

Cool. Well, guys, if you can give me 2 seconds, I don't know if you caught me. I literally— Wi-Fi went out on my sales call and I didn't even get a chance to say goodbye before I hopped on here. I need to send one email. It's going to take me 30 seconds and then I'll dive in with you guys. So sorry about that. Power cut and Wi-Fi went out. Here is the proposal. Um, how awkward. Talk about sales and just being like, you know, just full send. Like, oh, not a preferred situation, but, um, Okay, send. All right, uh, BC, what do you do, man?

Um, I'm in the financial industry, so I, uh, do sales for a— we have a family office model, um, which has been unique to me. Uh, trying to, trying to figure out how to best present this stuff.

But okay, family— and when you say family office, um, like a financial— like a financial services family office?

Yeah, so normally, like, think of, like— so for example, think of like your Fidelities and Schwabs, right? They're just focusing on the investment piece, growing your money. We focus on the investments, the taxes, the estate planning, um, all under one roof so we can help people kind of navigate the, the bigger picture. Not just what are my— are my investments growing or not, but how do they affect my overall, you know, financial plan and wealth management.

Okay. And is it your, your firm, or is it a firm you're working for? A firm I work for.

Cool.

Okay.

Max, you're from Europe, huh?

Indeed I am from Europe. Thank you for noticing. How did you know?

You look like you're from the UK, bro.

Is that an insult or a compliment? You tell me.

What was that?

Is that an insult or a compliment? It's the bags on the— the weather's horrible here.

The weather does suck.

Yeah, it doesn't.

I like the UK. I was there this summer for the first time, actually.

Nice. Where are you from?

California, Arizona.

You know what, I just, I just got off the phone with an American, right, a client, and like, they're so much more energetic, man. It's like a breath of fresh air. It was lovely. It was amazing.

That's funny. Yeah, Australians too, man. Australians got a lot of energy. But yeah, awesome. There he is.

Isaac.

Yeah, Australians, I feel like, are always on doing, doing something crazy.

Indeed.

Yeah.

Max, what kind of offer are you on?

What kind of—

oh, sorry, what kind of offer are you on?

Or what are you doing?

What kind of offer am I on? Well, to be honest with you, I, I came from a sales background, um, and I currently run a small property consultancy in London, um, And I manage a few of my staff. Um, so, you know, it's just I always want to be open-minded. I'm the biggest fish in my own little fish tank. I always want to be open-minded and sort of go into some mentoring and some sessions and, and see what's out there and see what people have to tell me.

That's awesome, man. Um, property consultancy, what does that look like? What does your day-to-day look like?

So what it looks like is I'm on the sales department. I myself am not a consultant. I am essentially bringing all the business for the company. What we do on a day-to-day, because the UK is very bureaucratic, if you have like a— there's terraces of houses here, right? I'm not gonna bore you, I'll be very concise. If you're gonna extend out the back and there's two houses next to you, you have to have planning permission, you have to have all of these things, right? And the part that we deal with is the agreement between yourself as the person proposing the works and your neighbor. Um, and essentially it's— I wouldn't say it's high ticket, it's usually about £1.5K GBP, so I don't know, $1,800 maybe USD, something like that. Um, but yeah, that's what we do. We help people get their projects moving, and if they've got bad neighbors, we solve it for them, basically. Bit niche, right?

Crazy. Go over there and like break some legs, you like harass the neighbors into like Like, what kind of mafia style? Like, how are you—

how do you know what's not mafia style? It's legal style. It's like we, we, we hound them with paperwork until they comply, basically. There's no, no mafia involvement.

No, that's awesome. Um, yeah, and then, uh, just ask anyone new to these sessions as well as some mindset around that specifically. So, you know, how are we using our CRM? How are we building our CRM? How are we building, you know, AI to enable us to, you know, reduce as much friction as possible as sales reps? You know, and I like to look at it from both on the ground as a setter or sales rep all the way up to the leadership level because a lot of times, you know, operators sit in my seat. And they're building systems, but they've never actually used them themselves. Or, you know, they're trying to enable a team and they've never been in sales. And that's like a crazy concept to me. And I don't love it, you know? And usually those operators are building the coolest, most complex thing because that's what they see as like their bar of like success, right? It's like, oh, it's really cool, complex automation I made. When at the end of the day, all a sales rep wants to do is have more conversations and make more money, right? And usually to achieve that outcome, it's not complex. We don't need a ton of complexity. So I like to bridge the gap between those two things, you know, and we can talk all things AI, Vibe Code, CRM, pre-call psychology. I don't know, maybe even some tinfoil hats. I know Matt Ryder's already got a session for that. So, you know, might be with me. No, no, world's a crazy place.

It's interesting. It's interesting. So what you do is you essentially, because I'm new to all this, you essentially advise business owners on how to automate certain parts of their business and scale through leveraging AI.

Correct. Specifically on the sales side.

Yeah. Nice.

Nice. Okay. What do you think about outbound sales where they are at the moment? Do you think it's at a level that's effective?

Outbound sales?

It's illegal, unfortunately. It's illegal?

Uh-huh.

Yeah. Yeah. So outbound, you can't do at all. Inbound, you can do, but you still have to— there's very, very strict compliance right now on robocalls., it's considered a robocall. So you have to get opt-in language on all your opt-in forms that's specific to robocalls. So not your normal typical opt-in language, you need like extra opt-in language.

Um, I see, I'm seeing that here. I don't even know that. Got that guy.

Yeah, yeah. So if you have the opt-in language on, on opt-in, you can call that person with AI and triage or qualify them. You can't do any outbound. Technically, outbound in general is illegal. Like, even if you're calling and you're just like dialing, like the gray zone, right?

Yeah, yeah, yeah.

It's a very gray zone. I'm not saying don't do it. A lot of my clients do. A lot of people do. But by the time, like a lot of times, by the time you pull the data and it's scrubbed against the do not call registries and all of that, your list goes from, you know, 20,000 to like 500 people. You're like, oh, shit. So Most people outbound dialing probably aren't following the rules, you know, and I'm not going to lie, I'll probably have dialed a few lists myself when I needed to.

Under arrest.

Yeah, I'm in Nicaragua, man. So I don't know. I think we're good.

Fair enough, man.

Fair enough.

Fair enough. It's interesting. It's interesting. I mean, we've tried to— the thing is, I find with the AI consultants, right, we've reached out to a few and a lot of them are these kind of like, I don't want to say kids because I'm young as well, right? But they're kind of like these kids who don't kind of necessarily know what they're talking about. So what kind of systems do you— I'm just really curious, what kind of systems do you build for people? You know, how does it work for you? Because you mentioned outbound's illegal. So yeah.

So it depends. And I mean, yeah, the kids look a lot like you, which is funny, right? There's a lot of young killers, bro, that are crushing it. But unfortunately, there's also a lot of young killers that are selling like, you know, ice to Eskimo. Like, it's just like they're just selling— they're not ice, that's the opposite— they're selling fire to freaking, you know, Eskimos. Like, you know, it's like the hot thing that they need, but it doesn't really work that well. Um, yeah, true, you know. So it is tough with AI. That's the last year I personally have spent playing with every AI tool that I can and seeing what the actual feasibility is for a sales operation, because there's a few different things. One, you have the size of the sales operation that is gonna take into account a huge piece of the viability of any type of technology, right? So for a larger organization, what might work for a 1 and 2 person sales team, probably not gonna work. And the 1 or 2 person sales team could probably get away with a lot more of this, of this new technology than a bigger sales team. So what kind of systems do we build? I mean, a lot of it's obviously around CRMs and automation there. Now, where can you use AI in this process? Admin work is a big one. Creating proposals is a big one. Follow-up is a big one. So software like Charlie AI, you can also, and this is the tough part right now. And I think this is good for everyone here. The tough part right now is like Charlie AI is essentially a great software that'll triage your leads and follow up with your leads via text message. It works very well. Um, but I get the question all the time. Oh man, well, could I build that on my own? It's like, yeah, you could, but it's going to take a while. And like, it's probably not going to be as good as Charlie. So for now, you should use Charlie because yeah, it's a little more expensive, but they've been doing it a long time and there's not a ton of alternative solutions, right? Um, so it's, it, it's like good to use that. Alternatively, there are other solutions that you could use. For example, Lindy is a good example, but even Lindy is in this process of changing very quickly what they offer. So Lindy was like one of the go-tos for voice agents, and there's a bunch of like AI agencies selling voice agents and inbound voice agents and receptionists through Lindy. All they were doing is using Lindy. Yeah, the problem with that is Lindy pretty much overnight switched away from that concept of them as a company to essentially a better version of a Claude bot. So if you go to their website right now and hit their homepage, it is not AI workflows anymore. It's not AI automation. It is now your AI personal assistant. That is what their company is now. And then that changed. They shifted that overnight. Like Claude Bach came out and the next day they shifted their whole company to that.

Yeah. And it's so, I think it's quite common with these AI companies are always shifting. A question I have for you in that case, and if I'm talking too much, let me know. I don't know how these sessions work. Like certain person gets certain time, so on and so forth. It's my first session.

Yeah, round robin. Anyone can, can pipe in. I know Isaac has some questions he wants to go through as well, but yeah, and then you can pop them in the chat. So what were you saying though, Matt?

Yes, essentially my question would be is when it comes to automating, automating SMS, SMS messages like you mentioned there, Oh, Max, Max, you muted. Yeah, I'm cutting out. I think I'm cutting out. Can you guys hear me now?

Yeah, we can.

Yeah.

Fantastic. When it comes to automating outreach, right, like, like when you mentioned SMS messages a moment ago, what difference can AI provide you in that sense compared to just having a spreadsheet of numbers and having an automated message that's get sent across? I know maybe personalization of message, but how does that, how does that actually look? I'm curious.

Um, I mean, there's a few things. So there's, there's like personalization of the message on the outbound message, right? But you can do something like you can use Clay, you can use a template. That's not really the difficult part. The, the, the place where AI SMS is cool is the responses. So if you respond, it can respond back and it can customize those responses.

Responses.

You can have a conversation, if you will, with that individual. Um, and because you have things like a vector database, it can store the context of that conversation and have a relatively large context window to the conversation you're actually having, you know. Um, and they're pretty good. So that would be the big thing. Um, now why would you do that? Well, I would say two primary places that I see as the most important for that. One is to reduce overall time suck that you would have. So how much time are you spending going back and forth via text message, you know, or as a sales rep? Or you would get all that time back in theory, you know, so, so very, very, could be very helpful. Um, two is the lack of work that you're doing as a sales rep. So a lot of times I don't want to take away work from the sales rep. Like right now, it's more so like, what are they already not doing and can I do that better? So your follow-up, for example, how many leads did you forget about and they kind of just went to silently die in your CRM? Um, you know, and Mario, you don't even have a CRM, dude. How many leads go to die, you know, like in, you know, and that's kind of where we focus a lot of times, like, oh my gosh, like you guys brought in, you know, 40,000 leads last week. You're like, What percentage of these like want to buy and they're just kind of stuck in limbo, you know, or would have bought and we didn't follow up with them? So Max, that's where, you know, AI can really re-engage these people or keep them engaged, and I don't have to remember to be texting these people all the time, you know. Um, and that's I think the biggest advantage for salespeople, and it's not even for salespeople honestly I would say it's more of an advantage for leadership teams and marketing teams because we can ensure that our leads are being nurtured no matter what Max is doing.

No, of course.

Yeah.

Yeah. And how do you have the operations? No, it's fine. Okay.

Yeah.

So, um, interesting.

Brandon, what's up, man?

Fucking welcome.

Oh, sorry. I was muted. How's it going, man? Good to see you.

Good to see you too. Glad you're on here. Isaac. What was that, Brandon?

No, I'll go next. Isaac was about to jump in.

Cool.

What were you saying, Isaac?

Yeah, cool, man. So I love the blueprint, of course. Like, it was, it's kind of, it's a bit of validation for what I've been doing, but also what my CEO was starting to implement. And you're just, you're just taking it that obviously that next, next level. I've got a couple of questions around it. So you mentioned with the setup, the tier, I think the tier that you're talking about, like the plan tier for Close is the highest one where you've got the groups between like having setters and closers and having all that stuff dialed in.

Yeah. Close kind of screws you on that.

Yeah.

It's kind of screws you up. I think it's like one of the only features that's in enterprise. So you have to get it.

Yeah.

Yeah. And so I'm thinking about, there's actually a follow-up kind of question that goes downstream from this is that We've got something like 38 people in Close at the moment, and that's because we use Close as our whole source of growth for the entire company. And so we've got fulfillment playing in Close. And so to go up to Enterprise would be like another $1,500 a month, I think. So it sounds like it's— is it pretty critical from a sales perspective to have that that setup, or is it— is there a potential workaround? And would you normally see fulfillment playing in Close, or would you normally just use Close for sales only?

Great question. Let's break it down. So there's a couple of pieces there. One, yeah, it sucks Close does that. HubSpot's worse, so I can't really say much. You know, HubSpot's way worse with their, you know, the way they do pricing. But it is a feature of the enterprise level. Um, I would have two questions there. One, usually a sales organization of that size should be using the enterprise level regardless. So my question would be like, the—

where—

why is there like a lack of custom activities, for example? Because normally I think on your plan you can't exceed 5 custom activities, but in reality, with the organization of your size, you, you I've never had a company that's less than 5. So I guess that, so there's like other features, I guess, that like should be being used. And it sounds like maybe they aren't, if you're able to be on that plan. That would be one. Two, is there a way around it? Um, kind of, but it's not very clean. Like you essentially, what you can do is use like Zapier, right? Or Make or Claude or whatever you want to do. And essentially you would just have a list of users, um, and then you would create your own round robin. Now the nice thing is Claude right now allows you to create middleware like it's nothing. So you could have an API call that round robins between the users and assigns the rep. Like, but the problem is again, now you have to do this extra step instead of just selecting it. Um, interesting.

I, I set up a round robin in GHL because most of our lead generation's in there anyway. But the GHL round robin is not a true round robin. It's like a roll of the dice.

Neither is closed.

Oh, okay.

Well, closed is a random assignment, which is also kind of annoying. So it's completely random, which like—

it's the same as GHL's. Yeah, it's working, but I've got like a lot of lopsidedness happening. That I have to manage over the week, which is okay.

Check out, um, potentially for lead assignments specifically, uh, is one we use with one of our companies called— I went in that really confident. Um, I did know what it was 30 seconds ago. Um, not callingly. Um, shit, hold on, let me pull it up.

Yeah.

Oh, we're good.

We do have custom activities, but we've only got, yeah, probably around 5. I didn't know there was a limit.

That's why, that's why you only have 5.

Yeah.

I was looking at you setting it all up and I'm like, oh, there's heaps of custom activities from your world.

We like custom activities transparently. We may change that, which is crazy because we've had the same system for 5, 6 years almost. We may be changing that internally. I'll keep you guys updated because Close is releasing new features that I, they're not public yet. But what I know, I don't even know how much I'm supposed to share, but there's playbooks now and playbooks can kind of be like associated, you know, like they can replace custom activities in some sense, which is really cool. So we're, we're playing around. We have the beta in our account. We're playing around with it. But custom activities up until as of like literally, I think it was yesterday, we just got playbooks into our account, um, were the best way to track just about everything. Um, so, and then, uh, where is this? Hold on, I need this onboarding document. Onboarding National Gold.

Here it is.

So it is called Distribuly by New Breeze.

Distribuly.

Mm-hmm.

I'm gonna drop it.

Oh yeah, sweet. Oh yeah, there we go. Cool.

Alright.

So we've, we've used this on a couple brands. It's kind of archaic. It's like a pretty It's not— if I were you, I, I might even do it. I might even get a little bug in the middle of the night to go do this, but I would vibe code my own lead round robin system. You could bust one out in 2 hours. It would be better than anything, you know. You'd have it fully custom.

And that's where I'm thinking, because I, I was— I don't know if I told you, I was vibe coding my own commission tracker last week, and I've saved myself like 60 grand. Is wild, man. Like $120 and about 3 days of work, and I've got this committer tracker, and it's beautiful. Now, Replit. Replit. I, I was looking at doing Antigravity, but I, I didn't like that it was on my local, my local, computer, whereas Replit's in the cloud. It was a bit safer.

Yep.

I was like, ah, I'm just gonna play with that. And I've already got all, all the stuff set up, the developer stuff set up with Replit.

Try Antigravity when you get a chance. The, the nice part about the local is like, well, it's, it's, you're only developing your own local stuff. So it's not like dangerous, right? Like it's your own stuff. But what's nice about it is you can iterate and test on the local server. So you don't have to host like to Netlify every single time. I'll show you real quick. We've been building— dude, I got so many softwares. Like it's insane. So this is one I built. On Monday night, I think. So this one's like an AI deal rooms and proposal software. That's like absolutely killer. Really, really good. Completely, yeah, vibe-coded start to finish. We got, we got—

Is this Antigravity?

No, this is Netlify. So this is like where we serve all our servers. So this one's really, really cool. This one will be released to the public here shortly. So this is a RevPilot sales enablement tool. Adopt.revplilot.com. Um, essentially it allows you to embed training directly into your CRM. So like if you look at the video here, um, you can see— oh, I don't want to see myself, that's weird.

There we go.

So you can actually embed— you see it's like a little emoji right here and how these are glowing right there. You see that, Isaac?

Yeah, yeah.

Yeah, so any training you have, like if I want to teach people what custom activities are, that's directly embedded directly into the CRM and it works on any domain. So it doesn't matter if it's Google or HubSpot or Close CRM, any keyword, you just create the domain and then any keyword associated will be highlighted and then it'll have this little thing next to it and you associate training videos with it. So if I click on this, it opens up that training video.

Dude, that's wild.

But, yeah, it's all 100% vibe coded. This whole landing page is vibe coded.

Yeah, nice. That— yeah, I, I love it. I love Replit. I, I would definitely— it was getting into the Netlify and all of those extra pieces that I was, wasn't really— didn't have the bandwidth for last week. I wanted to play around with it, but I think we're gonna move that way. One more thing before I— I know Brendan's got some thing, you know, he wants to talk about too. But, It sounds like I need to move some things around. Oh, actually, yeah, just before I come back to the sales team versus fulfillment in Close, there was one other one around lifecycle and lead status. Do you track lifecycle? Like, for example, I've got this playbook that I've— yeah, like I was going to do custom fields for lifecycle states and then keep the lead statuses in the lead status for Close. And then have a separate one for GHL so that they're matched up and they're both kind of like in tandem. And then I think between the two, it really kind of covers the customer journey on those, on this, like a little bit tighter than just lead status. So I was curious about your thought or how you've set that up before or how that kind of typically works in your world.

Yeah, so lifecycle stage is kind of a weird one. Like, I feel like it's like something HubSpot kind of made up, right?

Yeah, yeah.

Uh, it's almost like an additional metric that usually just confuses people. Um, but it can be useful. So I look at it as three— to explain it as three different levels. So you have the lifecycle stage at the absolute highest level, then you have a lead, lead statuses, and then you have opportunity statuses, right?

Yeah.

Yeah.

That's how I think of it too. But it really doesn't— I think the only time that it makes sense to have lifecycle stages inside of your sales process is if you're like a heavy outbound SaaS organization. Uh, and that's why kind of HubSpot has it. And the reason being is you may have a lot of people that are, um, what you would consider leads in the general sense of like B2B SaaS, which is they're, they're not an— they're not really like an opt-in. Like they didn't book a call. They're not from ads, right? Like maybe they opted in for a newsletter at some point in the last 60 days. Okay, well, now they're like a lead, but the question is what, what life cycle stage are they at as a lead? Um, because if I'm doing outreach, they're going to be at that very, very like, you know, and if you just look up like HubSpot, I think here, like default, um, there's like the, uh, this article right here.

Oh yeah.

So when you come here, right here, so like this is, this is what I'm talking about. So like when it's B2B SaaS, you might have like a subscriber, which means they sign up for your newsletter, you know. Now if you're doing outbound, you might want to call all those people. Now when they become a lead, that would be they opted in for multiple things or, you know, whatever it is. Then you have MQLs. And so really for me, most— like, what are you selling again, Isaac?

Um, we, we are predominantly a financial company, but like, so we do financial planning as well. Um, just like, I think it was BC— no, yeah. Uh, but we also do, um, business coaching, we do, uh, marketing agency, property advisory, and like investment advisory, and, um Tax and accounting. So mostly financial stuff.

Okay. That's what all service.

Yeah.

And how are you generating your leads again?

Are they mostly through Meta, Meta ads? But I'm also in charge of like developing a referral program, which will be probably my next week's conversation.

Yep.

So you can do this, but that was kind of, that's kind of what I was getting at. So like all of your leads are coming in at like MQL or, or higher. Right?

Yes.

So these two are essentially useless. And then, and then like the difference between MQ and LSQL is like about to call. So it's, it's not really like, so in short, for like a company like yours, I probably would just ignore it. I wouldn't even think about lifecycle stage. I'll just make sure your lead statuses make sense. Um, if you are a heavy SaaS slash outbound organization, this makes a little more sense, you know.

Yeah, that's, that's interesting.

You can always pull up the document. It's one of my HubSpot internal documents.

So yeah, I'll definitely check that out. Yeah, the mine, mine definitely, they definitely start at MQL and then go to SQL and then current customer expansion, or as I said, I think evangelist. And then I've got former customer, lost, and do not contact. In the, in the lifecycle state. But, and then I've got the lead status stuff all separately, which is more focused on the deal, but not, but it's separate to the opportunities as well. It sort of probably tracks the opportunities more than anything else, the lead statuses that I've got.

Gotcha. So how I, one last thing on this, how I look at it is lifecycle stage is the overarching customer journey at the highest possible level, right?

Yes. Yeah.

Lead status is the individual lead's journey. So the, the smaller steps that they took. Then you have pipeline or opportunity, which is post-SQL. So once they became an SQL, what is it? Yeah. What is the status of the opportunity specifically unrelated to the rest of the client journey?

Yeah, 100%. Yeah, that's, that's how I've got it. Yeah, that's validating. That's good. That's cool. And just one, one more back around to the use of Close with fulfillment and sales. Like, would you just get fulfillment out of Close or depends on the type of fulfillment?

You know, it totally depends on what they're doing. Usually fulfillment, 99% of the time is going to be much more efficient and effective in something like ClickUp.

Yeah. Yeah. We've got Asana for that. So that's, that was where my thoughts are as well. So cool. Thanks, man. Appreciate it.

Yeah, of course. Yeah. ClickUp, Asana, like that's, it's just, it's just way more focused on that. You can manage like HubSpot, for example, like you can do fulfillment and like the pipelines and stuff, but it, ClickUp's probably best or Asana.

Yeah. I love, I love ClickUp, but we're already in Asana, so cool.

Alyssa, Alyssa, Alyssa, Alyssa, Alyssa, welcome. Jordan, great freaking name, bro. Great name. Even better hat.

Welcome. I'm gonna say the same for you, brother. Thank you.

Yeah, thank you.

Brendan, what's up?

Hey, what's up, man? I, yeah, so I, I just kind of jumped on here. I've just bought, I bought your whole Front-end system the other day, and I think I scheduled a call with you later in the week so we can dive in.

I recognize your name. That's so funny. I swear I was like, I think I have a call with this guy today. And then you popped in here.

So great to meet you.

Yeah.

I don't want to waste your time on that. I actually, I was looking for it today and I didn't see it on my calendar. So I just scheduled another one for tomorrow.

I was like, oh, which one do you want? Tomorrow, tomorrow works as well.

I'm good with today, man.

If we're good with it.

Uh, I just didn't see it. So I was like, maybe I didn't schedule it.

Um, so it's at, at 2 Central Standard Time.

2 CST. Okay, yeah, that's great.

I have— well, I won't publicly drop your email, um, but yeah, it's like 2 CST.

Maybe these guys will Venmo me or something or whatever. Yeah, no, so I, uh, I'm just started on offer, it's basically a high-end mold inspection testing company, primarily working with very sick individuals. So their system is two calls. Their show rate's phenomenal. Their show rate's like 86%.

Yep.

So they do a first call on the phone and the goal of that is to then sell the home inspection for $1,495. They do the home inspection, then they loop back for a second call where they go over the pictures, the moisture readings, all that. And they basically sell all running all the samples at the lab. The whole, the whole total deal value ends up being around like they would target around $7K. The issue is not getting people to show up. The issue is more people more people not being convinced that this is enough of their health issues to invest the kind of money.

Okay.

And so, you know, I wanted to install, I just started like a week ago, so I'm still getting acclimated. They use Pipedrive, they have like no reporting, there's very little data on this stuff.

Yep.

But I wanted to install some things that would be more, give people more proof, more certainty of the problem. Coming in. Okay. Do you, that's, do you, what are your thoughts on that?

Yeah, great question. Well, first question, are you a rep on there? Are you managing the offer?

I'm managing.

Managing.

Okay, great.

How many reps?

3.

3 reps.

Perfect.

So I, I mean, there's only two ways to break it up. We either can consider it a marketing issue or a sales issue, right? Um, part of me would pass off— I'd split the issue into two. So I would say, hey, yeah, marketing's got to do a much better job of getting these people either— they're— that, that gap, the urgency, the pain, like, they need to be showing up understanding this stuff already. If, if your entire call is trying to educate them on the, the negatives of mold, like, in my opinion, you're toast. Like, that's going to be so difficult at that stage.

Okay, so they're mostly problem aware of like, this is a problem and it might be contributing. They had tried in the past doing upfront packages for just $6,000 to $12,000 up front, and it kind of tanked because people just were not— yeah, they were not aware and convinced enough to put out that kind of money without validation.

Yeah, I mean, I think the mold, like, verification is like, shit, like, you know, if you can get them to say yes to that, like, I'd almost— you could almost potentially test an offer of like doing that part for free, you know, like, like, go, go get that, you know, because like if you can prove there's mold in the house, like you know, people will probably pay anything. But, um, so I, I think the, the urgency, you know, needs to be there. So it's good they're problem aware, but can you, can you obviously push them over the edge? Can you educate them more on the front end, you know? Um, on the, on the back end, I guess my question would be, what are they more like? Are they Is the objections around more like urgency? Like, yeah, I know it's a problem, but it's like, it's a lot of money and I don't know if I should deal with it right now.

The way I've kind of thought about it in my mind, just getting my feet wet there, is like, it's almost like our sales process creates more problems for them. Yeah, it solves some problems, but it creates more. Because now they're like, call one, we sell a home inspection for $1,495. Their fear is, what if you find all this stuff? We have to do these samples. So now the $1,495 is actually going to be $7,000. And then the $7,000, they'd almost rather not know. I have to go remediate it for $30,000 type of thing. Like, because we don't do the remediation, that's a conflict of interest, that's separate. But it's like, it's almost like that $1,495, they're now thinking this is about to turn into a $50,000 commitment to go the distance. Is part of the problem. Now we do have a couple vetted remediators where we've struck up an arrangement of like, they get 15% of the remediation job, our testing goes to credit up to $6,500. So that's kind of like, you know, part of the, part of the thing.

So the back end of your offer— so you have the front end, you test— what, what is that middle? Like, what is the offer itself? Like the, the 7 or the middle of that offer?

Yeah, I'm reworking it with them right now because we're, we are by far— like, I have personally— it's near and dear to my heart because I've personally been through this with my family. I've spent $100 grand on my wife's health with mold, and I've spent $150,000 on my house, so I know this stuff very personally. Um, part of the, part of the offer, they need to reposition themselves as a niche because they kind of position themselves as just, we're a mold inspection company, and then they get apples to apples with their local inspector who's $2,000, and that's part of the issue. So we're gonna reposition more as like a home health engineering firm and do exposure mapping rather than just mold testing or inspections. Like just relanguage in a lot of ways. Yep. But the offer is basically, you know, we're gonna do an onsite ins— the $1,495, we're gonna do an onsite inspection. We're not gonna spend 30 minutes like your normal guy does. We're gonna be there 4 to 8 hours. We open the HVAC, we go in the attic, we go in the crawl, we take pictures, thermal moisture reading, everything. And then we're going to get on a Zoom call with you within 3 days and we're going to show you every area that's suspect in a problem and make a recommendation for a full panel of testing to be run. Got it.

Okay.

Then that's the second call is really when most of the sales made because that second call they're going to close for $5,000 to $8,000. If they go.

And what's that, what's that offer?

The 5-day— selling individual testing. So source, every source sample is $150, and then there's special testing that's $500, $700 for mycotoxin and different things.

Okay.

It's very nickel and dimey. So I would like to go in the direction of a 3-tiered offer that's more all-inclusive at that point.

Mm-hmm.

Then you know, it gets very nickel and dimey of like, we're gonna shave off this test, shave off this test sort of thing.

Yeah, well, I mean, yeah, I mean, it sounds like you're just explaining that. It sounds like you need to do exactly what you're talking about, restructuring that offer to be much more around the outcome that they're trying to achieve than, than like, oh, you get this test and this test and this test, and it's like, you know, just as this long list because it instantly becomes confusing too of like, you know, oh, do I need that test? What about this test? It's like the more stuff you have in there, the more confusion is going to create. And it's kind of like our own offer at RevPilot. Like, you know, there was times where I was like, oh yeah, you know, I went into like all the details of what we do. We do lead statuses and pipeline and blah, blah, blah, blah, blah, blah, blah. And then like every time they would always be like, oh, that sounds awesome, man. Well, like, can you send me something with all this information on it?

Yeah.

Which is like the worst. And it's like, well, yeah, but can I? And it was because I was just giving them way too much information. At the end of the day, they did not care. The outcome is all they cared about, which was I'm going to have clean CRM data, right? My sales reps are actually going to do their fucking job for the first time. And, you know, I mean, my processes are going to work, like I'm going to make more money. That's it. Yeah, stop. Hard stop. Like, that's it. So for you, it's the kind of the same thing, I would imagine, of like, yeah, we're gonna get all the testing done, but like, here's why, here's what that testing is going to result in, you know. Um, so, but that is—

it is—

I'm interested to see how you end up stacking that offer because it is very much a commoditized thing that you guys are trying to decommoditize of some sort, you know.

Yeah.

Um, and that's going to take definitely some crafty verbiage, you know, and, and some careful creation around kind of that offer, you know. So, um, and then the website too, because I did look at it Yes, when was that?

Yesterday.

Um, give me one second, let me pull that up again because when I looked at the website, um, what was, uh, what's the company name again?

Uh, yesweinspect.com. There you are.

Okay.

Yeah, so like if you go to the website, I think this— it's weinspect.com.

Yep.

Yeah.

Yes, we inspect. Yes.

Oh, yes, we inspect. Okay, this one is different.

Inspect one is totally different. Yes, like some local thing.

Okay, so mold inspection is a heel. So, okay, it's, it's better than the other one because I was looking at the other one. The other one, yes, it's not helping you. Yeah, like a general, like, inspection company. Um, so I guess I'm gonna share my screen real quick. So this is where I kind of get lost, which is like step 1, understand your history. Step 2, inspection review. And then it was— yeah, and then like personalized next steps. But it's like even here I'm kind of left wondering like, okay, well Yeah, all you're going to do is tell me what the next steps are. Kind of like, oh man, like I'm spending money to know what my next step is.

Um, where we're going, where we're going with that second call offer is basically get all the testing done, right? Get all the testing done. And there's whole nuance to the way they do it versus your average guy, because most mold inspections are such garbage, they miss everything. It's false False negatives, right? But, you know, it's basically get all the testing done. We're going to map your exposure through the house of like by person. Where does Johnny spend time? Where does the mom spend time? Who's sick? And then we're going to give you a prioritized remediation report based on your outcomes. So like we, you know, we say a lot, they say a lot like, look, most of our clients don't remediate everything we find and that's by design. We're gonna show you like what's, what's bad, what's important, and then correlate it with your health.

Yeah.

So we can actually prioritize this the right way. And that's their way of trying to minimize the fear around remediating.

Yeah. Everything in a way. Yeah. I, I like that. I mean, I also like the fact of like, oh, I can understand if like, you know, my daughter Amy is like getting cooked by this mold, you know, and like versus like, you know, my bedroom's fine. It's like, You know, so yeah, well, keep me updated, man. And then obviously we'll talk later, but I'm excited to see how you craft that offer. And I'm excited to talk about the systems piece as well around it and how we get you optimized there.

So yeah, it's some of the worst I've ever seen.

So yeah, Pipedrive's tough, man. We have a lot of people come to us like Zoho and Pipedrive, like both of those.

Yeah.

And they're just in Monday. You know, it's, it's like Zoho is probably the worst in my opinion, but yeah. Alyssa, what's up? Running a marathon over there?

Where are we going?

Yeah, I'm walking. Sorry, I didn't know. Honestly, I didn't know like the topic of this call or if it's just a random Q&A. Um, so I just hopped in to see what's going on. Is there like anything specific? Can I just like ask anything sales related?

So it's, it's more, uh, sales systems related, um, and a mindset, uh, but I've got a pretty, like, pretty— yeah, I've done everything in sales from fractional leadership to, you know, so we can talk about anything, but technically the call is more about AI and, and sales systems.

So yeah, so systems as in— that's fine because I was literally just doing this, um, systems as in like Like, like backend systems or like process of getting like prospects into calls and whatnot?

Yeah, like, uh, back kind of backend system. So CRM, um, pre-call system, post-call system, you know, follow-up systems, smart views. That's all my questions on. So, well, look at that.

Can I ask about, uh, follow-up systems?

Yeah, what's up?

Um, well, for me it's just more so of it's taking me too much time. I'm doing it all manual. I mean, we have our automations, but obviously post-call, I don't close objections. I'm like manually getting a summary, all that good stuff. And I don't want to be wasting time doing that. So I guess what's kind of your recommendation there? Something I could—

Yeah. What, what kind of offer are you on?

Public speaking anxiety.

Public speaking anxiety. Wow.

Okay.

That's cool. So there's levels to it. What CRM are you guys on?

Go— we literally just switched to GoHighLevel.

From what would you switch to GoHighLevel?

Yeah, we were using Monday. I have a lot of experience with GoHighLevel, but they were using like Monday, Vocas.

Got it, got it, got it, got it, got it. Okay, um, so do you use Fathom? Do you take your calls on Zoom? Sorry, there's like so much context I got to get here to like be able to make a recommendation. Do you, do you use Zoom or how do you take your calls?

Yeah, Zoom and Fathom.

Fathom.

Okay, so Fathom has an API and this is where it's really tough for sales reps because like I would just go whip you up something real quick if it was like me as the operator on your offer. It's a little harder for you guys on your own offer. What the recommendation would be like if you have an ops guy there, it would be to grab the transcript from the Fathom API. And then once you grab the transcript from the Fathom API, you can essentially do whatever you want with it. Typically what I'd like to do with it is use N8N. We'll just throw it into N8N. We will run it through an AI agent and then pull out any and everything we want. So we can create proposals from that. We can create follow-up messages that are customized based on the conversation. We can create marketing feedback. Which is one of my favorite things, will update, you know, the actual CRM with all kinds of, you know, data from the call, like the buying signals and their level of, you know, financial readiness and awareness of like the actual product, you know, fit and problem awareness, etc. So, you know, now it's like, okay, if your ops guy can't do that, what would I do if I was a sales rep and I had limited knowledge on building this out myself? Um, I would set up a GPT. It's like as simple as you could do it as a sales rep without doing anything else. I would go into ChatGPT. I would set up my own little GPT. And the reason for this is because I don't want to have to re-prompt it every single time. Um, which is kind of the annoying part. Now, if you do a GPT, you can just copy paste the transcript and you get the whole things spit out to you. Um, but the problem with that, you're only going to get information back and then you're stuck in this copy-paste. And it's almost, it's almost like easier not to do that. So, yeah, you know, that's where it's tough, um, without like an actual operator. The good news is here very soon everyone is going to have a Claude bot. Or a Lindy agent or a Manus agent that is going to do all this admin work for you. I promise it is 90 days out. Every sales rep is going to have one. Um, so you won't have to do admin work here very soon, and CRMs will update themselves in the next probably less than 6 months. I've already been building them. To like completely update themselves or sales reps just hang up the phone, like the CRM just updates itself. Um, but that will become like the new norm in, in, I would say less than 6 months, which is cool.

Okay.

So it is cool. Um, yeah.

Yeah.

I wish I had a better answer for you. It's just without like going to build something, it is pretty tough, you know?

Yeah. That's hard. I used to own my own business, so I could have done whatever I wanted, but now I don't. So now it's like I can't just get in there and build stuff myself, you know?

Yeah, it's, it's tough. I know it's, yeah. And depending on how busy your operator is or if you even have one, you know, sometimes there's a founder in there just like trying to build stuff himself or herself. Um, but yeah, you can totally call us and we'll go build it for him on your behalf. That's an option. I'll try.

I can, I can try to tell. I think he's got someone who's working on it right now, but nice. Yeah, let's see. Well, I appreciate it though. Thank you for, for your insight.

Yeah, anytime. Um, Jordan, what's up, man?

Yeah, I know we're right at the hour mark, so, um, I'll keep it pretty brief. I'm hopping into the Hold on. Can you actually hear me?

I can.

Is my audio working? Cool. I'm hopping into the roofing industry, uh, coming from selling a lot of, uh, virtual high-ticket B2C and then even some B2B AI right now. It's going to be a bit of a new, um, playground just in the sense where I'm trying to create some systems in place, not only with the— I'm going to get 3 scheduled appointments a day from the owner. But I want to be able to get to 5 appointments a day. I've kind of reverse engineered all the numbers in order to hit my income goal. I need to be chatting with at least 5 people a day. So what I'm thinking is obviously referrals when I get a rooftop, but I'm trying to come up with a system in place where even if I'm doing an inspection and I find anything, whether deal or not, I can go hit the other 10, 15 homes. And if they don't answer the door because they're not at home for work, What can I do to still get maybe like a callback, get people to reach out to me to want to do an inspection? I'm just trying to be able to stack my calendar.

Mm.

I mean, the obvious basic one that probably won't work is leave a freaking card, right? Leave a flyer, leave something at the house.

Door thing. But people throw that away. I need something like—

Yeah, exactly.

So it's like You could take a piece of paper and like take some blue tape and just make it look like there's a— it's a notice or something on their door. But yeah, trying to figure out.

Yeah, so I mean, that's the obvious thing. Um, that's—

we—

people have been doing that since the dawn of time. Um, if you wanted to get more creative than that.

Yeah, I just wanted to stand out.

Yeah. I'd have to think about that.

I could probably go ChatGPT some more ideas and then bring it to the next call.

Yeah. Yeah.

I mean, it's, it is, it's a good question. It's a really good question. And it really depends on, I guess, how much money you want to spend, how creative you really want to be. Um, I do think, yeah, Claude could probably come up with some pretty— if you told it to just like be extremely creative and just come up with some ridiculous ideas, I'm sure it would create some, some good ones.

Um, yeah.

The hard part is there's not a lot of like technological thing. That's what, that's kind of where my brain's trying to go is like, you know, what, what, what electronically could we do?

That's what I'm used to as well. So yeah, you know, outside the box.

It would be tough electronically to do much of anything. Now, something that is nice is QR codes. QR codes are pretty badass, um, you know, and, and it's— it just makes it so easy. It's like, if you— and you, you could try something funny like that where it's like literally just a QR code, nothing else, and you just like put it, you know, tape it on their door, and it's like— it's like, they're like, what is this thing? And it's like, you'd almost be— I don't know if I I would scan it. I would 100%— if I came home and there was a QR code on my door, I would scan it. Um, and then you can just redirect that QR code to, to anywhere, you know. And the nice part is, um, is they have QR code management softwares, so you, you can use that one QR code and you can tell it to go different places. So you, you could test it one way, maybe you handed out 1,000 of them, you're like, damn, that didn't work, I want to change the actual website it goes to, you just one click and it'll change like where it goes. Um, and then let's say you did something like that, you, you could send them to a form, you could send them to, um, you can send them all over, you know, you, whatever you want. It could be a form, it could be a video. Hey, this is Jordan, I missed you, you know what I mean? I was just at your neighbor's house right over there. Literally, it could just be like a video, you know, talking to the camera. On a landing page, um, with a, with a schedule call calendar button. You know, hey, I was just doing the roof, you know, in your neighborhood. I was walking by, I knocked, I didn't see you, I left this here. Now you get to see me, you know, like, I don't know, you can make a funny video. But that could be a cool way because QR code is like super low leverage. You don't have to call phone number, you know.

What do you, do you feel like it would be too much if I left a note, like a handwritten note, and I can find a way to like I'm just ordering like a portable printer, you know, just to have some kind of what looks like, like typed out letter or something for them. Or I could just handwrite it.

I don't think it's too much if it's going to lead to a sale, right? Like, I don't, I don't— yeah, dude, like, I— it depends on how lazy someone is. Um, you know, like, I— you, you hear about stories. I was talking, I forget who it was that we're talking, it was one of a big, big company in the tech space, but They spent their entire marketing budget on sending expensive bottles of champagne to like 20 very specific affiliates, right? And that was like their marketing campaign. So instead of spending $20 grand on ads, they spent $20 grand on, um, I think it was like $20,000 bottles of champagne. They wrote handwritten notes and they mailed them out, right? Um, and, and it was, it was wildly successful, you know? So it's like Does it? Yeah, yeah, 100%. It could and would work for some people. Depends on how much time you got and how, how scalable it is.

Um, I'll have to think about that some more. Even thinking of just leaving balloons with QR codes.

Yeah, dude, like a balloon with a QR code, hilarious, you know?

A little heart balloon that just has a QR code on it. Just floating by the water.

Do it, Jordan, and bring it, bring the results next week. That's the killer one, the balloon and the QR code.

I'm gonna have to try that.

Yeah.

But I do like the QR code idea because like out here I've been traveling a lot and like a lot of these places, we don't have it in the US. I have no idea why, but it's, they have QR Wi-Fi. So you, you just scan the QR code and it gives you the password to the Wi-Fi. And I'm like, why do we not have this everywhere else? It's so nice. Yeah, because they just come over and they show you your phone, you just take a picture of it, and then you connect to the Wi-Fi. It's like, so QR codes are dope. Um, a lot of billboards now, um, if you see those, like, it'll just be one giant QR code and it won't say anything else, just a QR code, because there's like that curiosity of like, what is this thing?

Should I scan it?

I just, I just need to create something that gets them to go, I want, like, I Like, I need to scan this. Like, this is out of the box. I haven't seen this before. And then that's where I'm like, it's almost like I'm trying to, trying to create a process that kind of pattern interrupts. Yeah. Pattern interrupts it, so to speak, and doesn't scream like, just trying to expand my business.

For sure. Like, yeah, like I kidnapped your kids. Scan here to get them back.

Balloons.

Here's the—

no, don't do that.

QR code for ransom.

Yeah.

Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, exactly.

Oh boy. Yeah, I'll give it a go. I'll put something together and I'll maybe bring some more ideas to the next one and we'll kind of build it out because I've never, I've never used QR codes. I have no idea where to even start, but super easy.

Just if you just Google it, um, it's extremely easy to just go online, um, and grab a QR code.

Cool.

So thanks, Jordan.

Yeah, of course. Yeah, um, great to see everyone. BC, thanks for joining, man. I know we didn't get to chat much, um, but thanks for being here. Mario, Great to connect. Isaac, always good to see you, man. I hope to see you next week. If you need anything in the meantime, let me know. And then Philip, welcome back. I know you were on the last call, I believe, as well. So what else? Yeah, thank you so much, Jordan. Throwing up the shotgun. I'm about to go surf, bro. We got some waves finally back here.

Look at you, you can see one coming in right there.

Yeah. Hey, Jordan, real quick, with your blueprint, is there a whiteboard model or something I can import into like Canva? For like to play around with it and edit it?

The CRM blueprint? Uh, I believe you should be able to download that file, but I— it's not like a Mermaid file. I guess I could share the Miro with you. Like, you're talking about like the actual diagram thing?

Yeah, just so I can edit it for us.

Yeah, let me find out. I just don't know what, uh, Miro account that's in.

Yeah.

So, cause I'm looking at my Miro right now and I, I don't even know what account that's in. So let me find out if you message, um, kim@revpilot.com and then CC me.

K-I-M?

K-I-M. Yeah. @revpilot.com. CC me, jordan@repilot.com, and just say, hey, I'm wondering if I can get like an editable version of the blueprint. And we'll, yeah, we'll make sure you got that.

So that's perfect, man. Awesome. Enjoy the, enjoy the surf.

Of course, man.

Yeah.

Thank you. Thank you, Mario. Nice to see everyone.

Pleasure.

See you on the next call, okay? Yeah. Cheers, y'all.