What $10K Sales Training Actually Looks Like

I'm in Queensland, Julius. It's glorious. I thought you were in New South Wales. Actually, I live in New South Wales. It's cold there, so we came here.

Oh.

Yeah, for a couple of days.

Where are you?

I'm at Mission Beach. When you're ready, can you accept the approval? Is that a thing?

Yeah.

Where would I get that? I guess I'll just hit allow screen sharing. There's no like notification though. Try that. There we go. Yeah, you see it?

All right.

Yep, sweet. Okay. Alrighty, so what do you sell? I'm a seller for a BA offer.

What's BA?

Buyer's agent in Okay, real estate. Okay, like teaching how to be a buyer's agent or like actual buyer's agent?

Buyer's agent.

Okay, cool. Dials, TT—

what's TT?

Uh, it's total time or talk time.

Uh, talk time.

Yeah, yep. Okay, triages that you've booked. Yeah, that have showed.

Yeah, yeah.

Is that that you've booked on outbound or that have been booked into your diary automatically as well?

They're inbound.

I don't count Outbound.

It's because—

Okay, so you don't do outbound? I do outbound. It's just that way they use this data to track the metrics for marketing because I can control the outbound. Okay, do you have the outbound data as well? No.

Okay.

And what, what, like, what can you learn from this data? I guess it would show us if there's any changes in, you know, lead flow for marketing, if anything needs— like, if, uh, ads are getting tired, things like that. Uh, yeah, the answer is not much.

Okay.

The main reason being is that, like, one, there's just not enough of anything. Like, 29, 24 and a whole month, like, that's the inherent volatility that is involved in, like, small numbers, right? Like, if you sell 3 out of 4, you're a killer. You still only made 3 sales. You know what I mean? Like, it's still only 3. So, like, this is like, is this your data or is this, like, the company's data? Companies that are, that I like manually enter.

Yeah.

Yeah. First of all, tell them to grow up. So triage show rate is like a good one, right? Like that's a helpful triage pass-through rate, I think is a helpful one. Like obviously, but again, you've got small numbers, so you have to understand that there's inherent volatility. Like, you know, you've got 16 to 8, which is a, you know, 50% show rate and 8 to 2. It's 25%, so people are gonna freak out and go, ah, the lead quality's down. It's like, but it's only 8. If you had 3, it would be very different. You know what I mean? So like small amounts of data like that, you know, it creates this like inherent volatility and it creates craziness. For context, we're scaling up ad spend over the next 3 months and like my, my closer slash the CEO or director has like heaps more data that he tracks through GoHighLevel. Yeah, for sure, for sure. It's just like these are like small numbers are difficult to track. So what you want to do is you want to kind of like I would aggregate all those numbers into one and then go like, this is the actual kind of data and it's probably it's going to give you because like it's just small amounts of data, right? Yeah. So I'll go through this real quick. So Like, I think I went through— can you unshare your screen?

Yeah.

Disable screen share. Okay, cool. I'll go through this. Like, everyone should have this. This is like in the— you guys can see that? Yeah.

Yeah.

Right. Okay. So like, first things first, when you're, when you're actually like going to set a goal, This is an annoying layout. All right. So the first thing you want to do is like just go through— if you guys like, you can copy and paste this, right? And then like, don't make too many changes, but you sort of— I was actually going through— there's a company that I consult with. I don't do that much, but they sent me all their projections and stuff like that. And, you know, you sort of want to start thinking and I'm going to go through kind of how I would, I would think this out. Have I trolled everyone and made it so they can't make a copy? Because if I have, that's fucking— that's amazing.

No, you can.

You can.

You can?

I just— I can't. Yeah, you're not connected to the cloud. Oh, it's weird. Anyway, I can share this tab instead. It's bizarro. Okay, cool. So this is like my copy, I think. Yeah, this is my copy. All right, so first of all, there's like a limit here on how to use this. Okay, but you know, first things first, you want to kind of sit in like, say it's like $500K or whatever, right? Whatever it is you want to make, you make $5,000 per sale. Okay, your inbound close rate is 30. You can leave that blank. Your inbound show rate is 50. Your calls are 90 minutes long, right? Like, from there it starts to kind of like spit all these things out, right, as to like, as to like what you'll need. Now, one of the, one of the big things you want to have a look at here is you take this, right? You can do a little special paste, values only. Okay, and then you can go like, this is the goal, and then this is now. Okay, and then what you can do is you can be like, I make $200K, right? My average sale is $4,000, my commission, whatever. There's certain things that you can't change, okay? But that's gonna be 20%, that means I'm making $800. Then I've got, I'm making, say, 25 sales per month, whatever, right? My close rate's 15%. Yeah, yeah, all the way down. And let's say my calls are 100, and let's say my calls are 120, right? Because I'm a fucking retard. Okay, so then what you do is you go, all right, you put in all these numbers and you go like, all right, this is a real problem, so I'm gonna mark that red. This is like, that's a problem, but it's not like a crazy problem, right? Because Although $4,000, $5,000 looks, looks very different when you're, say, commission value, it's like $1,000 to $800, like, isn't as much of a difference, right? So you're like, ah, that's not a difference. This is like an enormous problem. You know what I mean? And then you might be like, you know, I'm green here, whatever, right? So you're like, all right, cool. So after you fill out all these numbers, you're like, okay, like, these are my 2 big ones. Close rate and time are like my 2 big levers. So you're like, all right, cool, because like if you can get that down to 60, for example, right? So right now I've gotta, I've gotta work 97 hours a week, okay, in order to achieve my goal. If I get that down to 45, it's now 48 hours a week. Okay, so that's like, I can now, like if I can get my calls under 30 minutes because I'm a beast, I can make I can make that money in 32 hours a week with no more calls, no more anything, no more nothing. I'm just significantly more effective on a call in terms of speed, right? So you're like, okay, well, that is like a monster difference, right? So let's put that up to 45. That makes 48. Okay, down here, 48. My goal is 45, and right now I'm at like fucking 90. Okay, which means I have to work 97. So you're like, okay, the like this is a huge problem. This means that like categorically you can never achieve this goal, right? Do you guys see that? Like if like this if this doesn't get fixed, you can never achieve this, right? Given given your unless you like fucking quintuple will go up to 60% close rate, which just. Like, ain't gonna happen, you know what I mean? Unless you had some sort of like unicorn offer. So just by doing this is like a step one. You're like, all right, cool. Like, this seems to me like the biggest problem, you know what I mean? So then what I would do is I would start to go, okay, like, why are my calls long?

Okay.

Then I would like start assessing my calls with specifically this focus in mind. So then I would start to put together like I like I suck at interrupting. Okay, you're like my pitch is boring and like twenty minutes long. Okay, I go down rabbit holes at the problem phase. Right? Because you're looking at calls from a specific lens now. You're looking at why do they go so long all the time, right? I'm at 90 minutes. My goal is to get down to 45, which is for sure possible. Like when I started training with Jeremy, he told me if you can't sell something in 25 minutes, you can't sell it, right? And I said, I just sort of thought that's bullshit. That was like my initial visceral reaction. And then like years later I was like, oh yeah, that That that that fucking tracks. Do you know what I mean? It's just sort of like ego made me think otherwise. Okay, so then what we can do is we can go. All right, cool. Now this is my goal for the year. So I've got like you know Jan Feb. Right? Hopefully this thing is smart enough. Yes, it is. Okay, so then I'm gonna set like a time goal. So I'm at 90 minutes here. Let's be at 80 here. Let's be at 70 here. Let's be at 60 here. Let's be at fucking, uh, 50 here. And by fucking June, right, when World War III and the US has nuked everyone, we're at 45 minutes. You guys see that fucking True Social post today? You guys didn't see that shit? That was fucking crazy. Fucking crazy, bro. What does it say?

What did it say?

A whole civilization will die tonight, never to be brought back again. I don't know what— I don't know. I don't want that to happen, but it probably will. However, it's the fucking craziest shit. Yeah. Either he's playing for— either he's playing 4D wizard's chess or fucking How do you back down? I don't think he is though. Anyway, I don't know. You have to nuke everyone. It is what it is. Um, okie dokie. Anyway, let's try and let's just try and be good at sales until everyone gets nuked. Um, might as well be rich enough to build a bunker. That's the goal, people. Why do you think I'm in a far north Queensland? All right. Um, all right, so like, this is your goal. So you go, okay, cool. Now we go, how? Okay, so like, the first thing I'm gonna do is like, you can't focus on all these things at once, right? So you kind of have to like prioritize them as to like, what's the easiest? Like, this is probably the easiest, right? Like, changing your pitch is probably the easiest thing. Right. So you might go like pitch, pitch, right? Just give yourself some notes. Then you're gonna go like interrupting is like a— it's not, not that difficult of a skill set to get. So interrupt, interrupt, and then you might go like anti-rabbit hole. Okay. Anti-rabbit whore. That too. Right. So this becomes like the focus of your development for those periods of time, right? And like maybe you, you know what I mean? If we're really focusing, because this is, you're halving your sales goal. So like I think taking 6 months to halve your sales goal is pretty reasonable because what you're looking to do is halve it but without removing any efficacy, right? So like, and during that time, You can start to take significantly more calls, right? So you can make more money, and then you can start to change these metrics. Like, maybe you can actually get there, you know what I mean? I made a— like, obviously this is, this is going to be tough regardless, making that much money with a $5,000 sale, right? But just because the amount of units you have to sell. But you can start like making more money because now you can start holding more calls. Right. You also might have an increase in show rate because now you're able to bring your calls closer to you, right? So they don't have to be booked so far in advance. There's a whole bunch of benefits that come from short pitching. Also, you're probably going to remove a bunch of think-about-it objections because like the amount of time that it takes like can play that role, right? But this is how you would do that. And then, you know, so you're going to go like, this is my number one thing. And maybe you get there by here and you're like, fucking perfect. Right. Maybe you try and shorten that development a little bit. Like, hey, I reckon if I take 4 months, you know what I mean? So like the pitch is only going to take a month and then I'm going to go like work on interruptions and I'm going to go like this. The rabbit hole is probably the hardest, the hardest one to like prevent, right? So you're like, all right, cool. I want to be at 45 minutes by here.

Right.

So you're like, okay, cool. That means that I should be at like 70 by here and probably 60 by here. You're like, all right, cool, that seems pretty reasonable. So my focus is this, right? So like all the trainings that I do, whenever I show up to something, like my focus is like, I want to talk about this specific thing. I want to get as much— I want to like dive in. And all of my core views that I do are based around this one thing, right? And what that does is it gives you such a good focus, right? And then like by the time you hit it, you're like, okay, cool. Now what I want to do is like, I want to, even though this isn't much of a problem, I'm going to work on getting this up. Right. So around here, I'm going to work on increase AOV. Right. And so then for the next like 3 months, I'm going to work on increasing AOV. So you'd be like, this is the goal.

Matt, what's AOV?

Average order value. Right, so your average sale. Right, 'cause you've gotta get that up. It's just easy, right? You just set the new floor and fucking nut up. That's it, right? Like, but like, if you have a huge mountain to climb, like if you're at 300 and you need to get to 1,000, then you're gonna have to set that floor at 500, set the new floor at 700, set the new floor at 1,000. Right. Does that make sense? Like, you know what I mean? Like, if you have to do something, you're not gonna like just go like, I'll say, oh, tripping my sale. Like, don't be a retard. Right. You know what I mean? Like, you want to kind of incrementally budget up, right? And so you're like, all right, cool. Because like, if you do it incrementally, you'll rarely see that much of a difference in terms of close rate. But if you do a huge jump, then you probably will.

Right.

Um, okie dokie. All right, so, and this is how you want to kind of like— so the first things first, like you got to go through all this kind of stuff, set your goals, and then start to figure out what your development's going to be. Once you've figured that out, then you're like, okay, how am I going to plan this out? And then you've got to like sort of figure out like, all right, this is what, what I'm going to do and when and why. And then you'll find like you'll develop 5 to 10 times faster doing it this way. The reason being is it's actual, like it's actual, it's planned progress, right? And instead of it just being kind of like random shenanigans. That fancy sheet, Nick Prisco, is like right in the beginning of the course. So that's embarrassing for you. Right, Nick? It's very embarrassing, but if I believe it's in the— is it in Start Here? Uh, oh yes, it is. Here it is. Yeah, it's in a couple different places, I think, but yeah, it's in the starting ones. We've got the tracking sheet or the goal setting calculator, right? I think we're having it here as well, so no. Just me repurposing content like a beast. All right, here it is. Oh, look at this, Nick, right here. Hey, there's 1, 2, 3, 4. So maybe you stopped at 3, buddy. It's okay. Ironic thing is Nick's doing very well, right? All righty. Um, all right guys, any kind of questions, uh, on that? Whoa, that's obnoxious. Pin. There we go. All right, any questions on that? Any questions on like your goals, what you would need to do, sticking points? Anyone doing this considering it's the 4th video with monthly— sorry, with, um, Sales value, like AOV, would you go over like a month's value for that or would you do a week to week or? No, you probably want to go over a month, right? Like again, it really depends. Like if you're banging out 50 sales a month, a week, then you can go over the week, right? So it's really just a volume thing, you know? Like if making a small change, like if going from selling, like if selling one person Makes an enormous difference in the dataset. Okay, yeah, that's true. Then, you know what I mean? Then it's like probably not a good dataset. Even you could use the median if you really wanted to fucking go crazy with it. If you had like a smaller dataset, the median would probably be a better number, you know, taking out the top and the bottom, right? But you know, what you wanna do is like setting a new floor is the best way to increase the average order value. It's one of the best ways that sales reps can just make more money. Because like they can just start collecting more cash, right? So like if you have the ability to alter even the payment plans, like when you're selling on a payment plan, you have to realize right now you're not selling a payment plan. If you're selling anything high-ticket related, you're selling a monthly subscription with the hope that they keep going, but you're not actually selling installment plans. Like you don't have the ability to sell installment plans. Like they won't allow you to. Like, you know, it's a $10,000 payment, right? Split up over 5 payments of $2,000 is an installment plan. But no high-ticket business, literally not a single one of them on the planet, has the ability to do that. They just sell like 5 payments of $2,000, which is a very different thing, right? So the fulfillment rate on most payment plans is not amazing. It's not even necessarily a reflection of the product, right? But it's just the way it is. So what you want to do is like you should analyze the amount of cash that you get from the different payment plans, right? And actual commissions that you earn. And then you should figure out the ones that fulfill at the highest rate, right? And it's not going to be the lowest, I guarantee you. The higher— like what we found is like at 7th Level, I did a huge analysis The 2-pay was garbage and the 6-pay. The 2-pays almost never fulfilled the second payment for some reason, but the 3-pays almost always did. This doesn't mean this will be for you, so don't take this as like, oh, I need to go do this. No, this is very specific to this one business. I'm just using it as an example, okay? So don't ever, don't do that. The 1-pay is obviously fantastic, right? 1-pay, very hard to not fulfill on the 1-pay. 2 pays was a very low fulfillment rate on the second payment. 3 pays were very good. 6 pays were horrendous. Right? So, like, you know what I mean? Like, that's kind of weird. But so what we did is like we just started changing around. We just offered a 1, a 3, and a 4. And then we tried that out. That worked a lot better. But for you guys, like, you should be tracking every payment. That's, that's made, right? So you should have all of your next payments. Like if you're selling people on a freebie, I don't care what you sell. If your people are taking multiple payments and you make commission off those other payments, you should know when every single payment is going to be made, right? And you should have a little tracking sheet for that. And then it's like what I had is one where I just used to like, I used to just like press, press the number, right? I just set a little checkbox. 'Cause that's my money. It's way easier to ensure that someone you've already sold gives you the money as opposed to having to sell somebody brand new. It's a much easier thing to do. So don't sleep on your other plans. You should know these things. That's your commissions. So not knowing it's kind of insane. And then, so you should be able to see after a little while which ones are not worth selling and which ones are. Like which ones you actually make the most amount of money on yourself. And then from there, if you can change the plans, like if you can, you know what I mean? Then don't do like a 2-pay is 50/50, start it at 60/40, right? Then push it to 65/35, then do the 3-pay with 50% down and then 25/25. Like start to see if you can make small adjustments to the plans to get more cash upfront. Because you'll make significantly more money that way because like really the first payment is all that you can rely on. All right, and this is where like understanding your data will make it a hell of a lot, a hell of a lot easier for you, right? When it comes to actually kind of like making money.

Okay, Matthew, I have a question for you. Yeah, yeah, the granularity of the— so 2 things. The granularity of the planning, you go super far, right? You do for the year and then you bring it back to the month and then the week and then you analyze. So for example, when you have like all the fucking holidays and stuff like that in a specific week, you know that, you know if you have election in the US, you know all that stuff. That means the granularity that I'm bringing into my plan is like on a daily basis. Like I look like The next month, I look at all the days and like okay that day it's like a Labor Day or whatever it is. I know I'm gonna get wrecked in the show up rate, whatever. So you have to adapt for that. That's how far you go, right?

Yeah. Yeah. Like yeah.

My second question is when you because immediately because it was garbage at planning immediately when you finish a plan for the year, right? I was like in my mind I was like go to someone like you like. Matt. So actually, I'm gonna go to you and debrief with him because you might have a blind spot, you might have a bias that you don't see because you never planned super successfully before if it's really the first time you do it. And then have him just look at your thinking process.

That's the most important— the most important thing is like, you want to— one, you want to list out all your assumptions. Okay, right. So when you're doing any planning, you need to list your assumptions. So like, if your assumption is like, You know, like November's gonna be bad because of the election. It will be. Like everyone just has to deal with it. So it's like, okay, cool. January— December's gonna be like less than usual because of this, or December's gonna be great because of this. You kinda wanna, you just wanna list out your assumptions. Like my close rate will go up to this because of these reasons over this period of time, right? My show rate will be, you know what I mean?

Yeah.

List out your assumptions, and you have to have those because like that's what you use to like change your shit moving forward, right? So, so it's, it's like that's just, um, and then from there you just want to play devil's advocate with yourself. Yeah. So it's like, yeah, yeah, yeah, you have a look and you're just like, okay, like, is this reasonable? Should I? Can I? Uh, will I? Uh, what happens if? What happens if? What happens if? Right? And so that's when you start going like, okay, Like, and then by looking at the number and then justifying why you can do it, right? And then thinking about any things that would stop you from doing it. Those are the things that, that's playing devil's advocate. You're just going like, oh, okay, maybe what if, what if, what if? And if you start like ruminating out, just start talking out loud to yourself and then do a, do a Loom video explaining your thought process.

Okay.

Right? Like, um, it's like, like I have a, like a 19-year-old that sent me his business projections and he thought through the whole 12 months. Every single month was planned and it was like this because of this, this because of this. These are the things that I'm concerned about. These are the things we're ramping up. We're gonna have a big month over here and we're gonna start that ramp up here like 3 months earlier. Like, it's just well considered. I was like, yep, that's all pretty good. think about this, this, and this. This is probably too aggressive. You know, this will cause problems here. Like small things, but like overall very good thought process.

Yeah.

Right?

Because actually thinking about it and going like, oh yeah, like it's very simple. It's just think about it.

Yeah.

And then like justify your position.

Yeah.

Right? If you can't justify the position, if you can't hold up to scrutiny of like, why are you doubling your skill set over a 3-month period?

Yeah, okay.

Ah, well, mindset. Like, it's fucking retarded. Like, it's like, what do you mean you're gonna double your close rate in 3 months? Like, no, you're fucking— no, you're not. Like, that's stupid. Why are you planning for these, like, things that will never happen? Like, it doesn't make any sense. But like, if you just have a look at your plan and then you can go like, okay, like, this makes a lot more sense. Then from there, your plan will probably be significantly better thought out.

Yeah.

Then because you have all your assumptions, then when things go right or wrong, then you'll know like which assumptions were correct and which ones were incorrect. Because like, it's not that big of a deal if you're— if you guessed wrong, right? The thing is, if you guessed wrong but you don't know why you guessed wrong, that's when it becomes an issue. And so what you do is you just like make all those kind of assessments You know, yada yada yada over time, and then you just constantly change your assumptions. And then from there, like by your fifth time of doing it, say you know if you read it every six months, like after a couple years of doing it, I know it sounds like a delayed gratification, but like you'd be very good at doing it.

Okay. Yeah. Because sometimes you don't have that experience, right? So you're like you just have an assumption; it's fucking retarded, but you don't have someone next to you telling you, yo, like what are you smoking? Like, this isn't— this is— there's no way that stuff is possible. Um, okay, very good.

Uh, Chris, what's your question?

Hey, what's up, Matt? Sorry guys, I was at the gym trying to listen in.

Um, you're right.

So we, we have a setting team on Dialer. We have 7 setters and we have inbound and outbound.

What's the business?

Um, Bunky Life. We actually reviewed it together like a few weeks ago on a call. Cold connectors. Uh, so high-ticket physical product. Um, right now all of the setters are taking inbound and doing outbound. So all 7 of them. And I'm getting to the point where like the efficiencies are not good.

That's not a great idea.

Yeah. So, um, what, what would be in, in your experience would be the best approach to divide and conquer that?

I mean, generally speaking, I don't think it's that good of an idea to mix inbound and outbound or have dedicated hours, right, for each one. But the moment you mix inbound and outbound, it makes it very difficult. Just because, like, who the fuck knows what's— like, your ability to use those people is drastically hindered.

Yeah.

Because like your speed to lead gets wrecked. Do you know what I mean? And then they always prioritize the inbound, like always, because they don't wanna do dials because for some reason they think it's hard, right? So really, like, you need to divide the teams. And then because like right now, for example, like Which time zone are you in?

We're in Eastern time.

Let me just, uh, reband as well.

So, and we don't have like in— like people that are calling in, they're calling into a different dialer software, JustCall. So that's like another level of complexity.

I mean, you can just have them dial into Dialer, but yeah.

Does it make sense to route them into Dialer?

Yeah, you can do that. Yeah, it's easy. Um, you know Sam? Are you in touch with Sam?

Yeah, yeah, we're in touch. I'm in touch with Sam.

Yeah.

Yeah, Sam can help you fix that out. Um, because like, you've gotta— you do have kind of like weird, like massive dips. Like, why does nobody dial at midday? I'm not saying that they should, but why does everyone stop dialing at midday? Is there a reason for that? Do you guys have like a team meeting at midday?

Yeah, we have a team meeting at hilarious.

I can see, I can see that you guys just stop at midday. Yeah, I'll show you. Just stop at midday.

Yep.

But yeah, like you're. That's a fucking hell of a time. Sorry, I'm just looking.

What time is that? I'm on my phone so I can't see.

That's 12, 1, 2, 3, 4. This is like aggregated over the course.

Okay, yeah.

One of the things we have that you'll like, I'll go, I gotta go into a separate one real quick. Is this what this is? Yeah, this is like this is I'm sorry school is in my way. This is um. Breaking down like, like all the successful calls. And then we have like, this is coming out next week. So basically you set up your scripts.

The script?

And then, and then you put that in there. It like, you take the script and it makes all the checkpoints of like which ones they should be doing. You can, you can adjust them and stuff and then like flag topics. So if you want to have like guarantee or promise, You know what I mean? So like you can add that as a flagged topic. And then from there, you can like, uh, go in, run the report. You can see like an analysis of it, like script adherence was 20%, didn't do all these things. Do you know what I mean? Yada, yada, yada. And then we are compiling— That's not live data, right? Uh, it is for me. Um, but not for you yet.

Okay.

Uh, it'll be live in like probably next week. I would say either end of this week or next week. It gets done. It works really well. But what we're doing, the one thing that we're doing is we're putting all of the successful ones and then it's making a map of success, right? So like it'll show you like this is every successful call that That's been like aggregated, the sentiment curve, the time, the script, the milestones in what order, right? And then it will go like, it can give you a comparison of all of your successful calls to the calls that are not successful. And so you can see like what lead source, what campaign, what setter, how long they should be, what areas of your script are commonly skipped in successful calls so you can cut it out. Do you know what I mean? Just shit like that. So that comes out. That's pretty much it. I mean, it's done. We're just like testing it with an account just to make sure it doesn't tell people to do weird shit.

Nice. Looking forward to it.

But that'll be out like next week and same time as the SMS and the Click to Doff. All right, cool.

Waiting for all 3 things. Excited for that.

So once you— once we have the— we have a Chrome extension. That's coming out where you can, they all get their own number and they can text and call from it. So then you can just have your inbounds come through the, like their number that's assigned to them in there. And then it all logs the same way. You can get rid of JustCall. You can just do the inbounds through there. Then they have to disposition it and then it all works the same way. That makes sense?

Yeah, yeah, we'll try that.

Yeah, but I would definitely start to like separate out your inbound and your outbound. And you can have like, you know, best performers, worst performers, however you wanna do it. But, you know, maybe you change the pay structure so it incentivizes outbound. Outbound's obviously very good for the business.

Mm-hmm.

But you definitely need to like delineate those roles. Otherwise what I see is like, or you just get way more reps, but I've never seen it implemented well. I've never seen like people doing inbound and outbound really well as a team. It's like just these people doing this, these people doing this. You know what I mean?

Yeah. That's what's happening now is like a few, few people are just camping down and they're not doing their dials. Exactly what you said.

Yeah. And like, it's like, yeah, of course.

Yeah. You know, it's easy.

Of course.

Yeah.

Especially if you make the same commission, like it's the same pay structure right now as we have, as they have it, it's like the same pay structure. So I'm like, I have to kind of recalculate that. Yeah.

And like, yeah, I think the more delegated you are, the better.

Cool.

Yeah.

All right. I'll connect with Sam on that. Thanks. Nice chatting.

Perfect. All right, guys, I got time for one more question, then I gotta bounce out. I had a quick one just on like, can you run like Close CRM and Dialout at the same time? Or how would you approach that? Or are they 2 different things? No, it's, I mean, Close is a CRM. I would say Close is the most difficult to integrate with. They make it quite obnoxious. We're having an integration built at the moment. But yeah, I mean, you can run both. Like, they're 2 different things. Dialer is an outbound dialing system. Like, it's high-volume outbound dialing, right? You can do a lot of other stuff with it, but like, that's the main use case for it. Whereas like, Close is the CRM that has a dialer. It's not a very good dialogue. Okay, okay. That's actually perfect. Yeah, yeah. Any more? Any more? Any more for any more? If not, no. All right, good stuff, guys. Speak to you in a couple days.