What Does It Take to Be A LONG Lasting Sales Rep?

If you listen to this podcast, you will make your first million within three years. I'm going to repeat that. You will make a million dollars within three years of the first episode you listen to. We don't want pikers. We're not here to save the manatees. We're here to make podcasts. You really want this? You listen and review. Put that coffee down.

So what are we chatting about today? So, Marco, we're not going to do an interview stock thing. That.

That'll be stupid.

And we have a bunch of interviews, so we're just all going to talk, man, about what the week's been like. Interject.

How.

How's it all been going? I'm just going to sit back and relax here. I noticed you decided to wear a turtleneck and a stupid hat, so I'm really thankful. Absolute savage. For those of you who don't know who are, this is going to be the podcast. If you're just watching on Facebook or if it's the podcast. Marco is the Turtleneck Bandit. And we have a special emoji in our Slack channel. When he makes a sale, everybody throws up the turtleneck emoji because only a man of that sales prowess can pull off a turtleneck.

So Marco actually has like a specially made turtleneck sweaters that increase his close rate by 7%. So. So that's why he wears them when he's selling, because it actually helps significantly. The turtleneck warms up your vocal cord, so you're in optimal range for objection handling.

Yeah, that's why I'm half there. I'm wearing a nice knitted jumper today and celebrating Mark. All I gotta do is get my hair down and my fringe down into my below my cap. So I'm good to go. But wanted to have this podcast today, man.

It's been an interesting week.

We've had Peyton Welch, Jeremy Minor, Cole Gordon, and now the ultimate Marco Cortesi. Marco Cortesi. Whenever he calls me Marco. Marco Mancha.

They might need subtitles at some point, but it's all right.

How's your week been this week, dude? How's your weekend this week?

For what I had pretty well, I can't really complain. It's been a good week. It's been a good, good month, I will call it. And yeah, so far I had to change a couple of things on the structure that I had before. That's because of the change of marketing and yeah, it's been pretty good.

What did you do last month? What did you do in. In May?

May $660,000 in contact worth.

Yeah, that was a lot of commissions I had to pay that bill.

And this month. This month, averaging. Yeah. I'm on track to make half of a meal. Yeah.

Yeah. It's been a quiet month marketing wise for some of our clients that you're working on. But it'll sort of pick back up. That's the ebbs and flows of sales.

Right.

It's one of the things we've been working on. It's just kind of like, you know, using the opportunity of having a little bit of a quiet time to kind of nail down some of the basics and making sure that we're doing everything.

Correct and not going over and that's what we've been doing.

Role plays and just all kinds of good stuff, man. So, yeah, I'm pretty stoked by your performance. What do you think? I guess over the last few months, because, you know, when you came on, right, like, you were a fitness sales dude. We both know where from. We both have the same sort of background in fitness sales. It took you fucking forever to agree to come work.

Yeah.

And I have to say, thanks to James. They kind of pushed me and he kind of slapped me around a couple of times and bring me here. Yeah, it took me a little bit. I'm a little difficult to convince, which.

Is hilarious because you're saying something.

But I have to say so I'm really glad. I really got to meet the decision.

Yeah.

It's funny because we had this conversation last week when we're looking back, reflecting, and we're like, oh, man, we. When Marco first come with us, he did like a little trial, and I can't remember what the issue was. It was like an issue with the leads or we had to change some processes or something. And it was a communication or some shit.

He was so angry about it.

Yeah. It was like, I'm not doing it.

It's not worth it.

So I had to convince him, like, bro, like, just relax. Let's give it away, see how you like it. I know there's road bumps, new clients. It's gonna happen. It's part and parcel. Let's just ride it out for a week, see what happens. And the next week is like, okay, I'm gonna quit.

Yeah, definitely.

If we left it there and we didn't convince you to stay on for that, you know, and just test things, see how good it is working with us, we wouldn't be here today and you wouldn't be making just as much money and be twice as happy.

Yeah. Probably I wouldn't be selling, I think itself at all. So you see when you, when you speak with someone during a course, hey, you know, what's the importance of not taking action? Comes from my experience and that, there you go. You got in front of you.

What's your favorite thing to sell?

My favorite things to sell 28 days. I would say a short term membership on the phone for fitness is something that the feeling that I get out of selling that is best that I want to get sell. $50,000, $30,000 contributor. Don't tell me why. I was thinking about it last week and I was like, is there a sense of accomplish that? I like, maybe it reminds me, it reminds me of really kind of the time when I went like, okay, I'm average, okay. And boom, I'm on top of it. So that makes me feel really comfortable. But I actually like to sell pretty much everything. I saw that in my life.

So when did you start selling? I don't actually know this story. Like, when did you start selling?

Yeah, yeah, yeah. So I started 15 years old. That's really, really funny. So some people don't know. I didn't finish school. So my dad told me, you got to get a job. So I've done door to door. That's the first job I've done. I felt Internet connection, fast Internet connection at that time. And after that I saw was that.

Door knocking or what was that doing door knocking? Everyone good has done door knocking.

And I've done it for, I've done it for six months. And it's been, I think, the best things that happened in my life so far. Because I remember the first day of that job and I asked like, which one is the top performer? He has like the guy 50 years old. And I asked him like, all right, what's the strategy of selling these things? He was like, ah, that is not really a strategy. Like more do you not more opportunity you get, the more sales you're gonna do. And I was like, that cannot be.

That can't be it. After 20 years of doing this, you just say knock on more doors.

Was that in Italy?

Yeah, yeah, it was in Italy. It was in Italy. And the first, the first things that I've done is like, oh man, I have to attach something. I remember the first week because first day no sell, second day is no sell, third day and sell that crap. I'm not gonna go on with this. I have to understand what's not wrong. So I actually bought that things myself and I tried on and understood that you know, it was faster than normal kind of Internet. So the action was like, all right, perfect. You know, it's faster. So you're gonna do less time. So it's gonna make you kind of save more time. Save it same more time, save more money. And the. The week after that, I've started selling that way. I made the same amount of sales that I used to make in a month. I made it in a week.

And that was by understanding the product, understanding the experience that the buyer went through, and the actual benefits of doing the product, which is, you know, I guess we know just selling on benefits is not the best way to sell, but it's a, you know, when you're first starting out, it's sort of how you sell. You know what I mean? It's like, hey, I got this. I got this product. It's really effective. It's going to do this, this and this for you, and then you sort of handle some objections and hopefully you get over it. Right? It's definitely better. I think I come up with that fucking Grant Cardone clip every single time. I got fish. You want fish? Every single time. You actually worked for Cardone, didn't you?

Yes, I did. Yes, I did. I had the great luck to work with Grant Cardone and Steve Spray, which I was still in touch with him, and he's an amazing person. He got me for two years, and it's been an amazing, amazing process. I definitely get to all my life for what they gave me. And it's funny because for them, I went to the. So they sold me into a course, and the coaches in their course, when we were doing role play, it gave me a job at some point, halfway to the course, like, man, you have to come and work with us. Like, I can't really come to the US because I. For Visa issue stuff, I was like, all right, I'll let you do remotely. But for the first month, you're just trying to sell books. And then I was like, all right.

Or were you selling books?

Yeah, so it's a different kind of step. Step of selling. So they sell. So you. You sell books on the style, and after, when, like, half of the way through the books, you recall them back and you trying to sell them on a bundle of different kind of books, and then you sell them into the university. So that's why for them, volume is a killer because they have to be able to touch, being in touch with people that they get their content, and that's why it works really, really well. But the artists there Are jobs like that teaches you and the strategy. Because that's what I think is one of the first time where I truly had a strategy in front of me. So that's. That's the way how selling it is and that's the way how it's supposed to be structured. You have to just to learn it and master it. And that's what I've done. And from there it just like went nuts for me. Really, really not.

Why did you leave?

I leave because they want to get. You know how difficult I am with the base in terms of like, they didn't. I couldn't move to the US and they required them to be in the office because they have an environment where they have to push you or do some sort of things. Plus, I was into fitness. And that time I was working from 10pm until like 6am so it was.

Like crazy reverse cycle overnight.

Yeah. And didn't really work. And I was like, you know what? We're still gonna be friends. I'm still gonna be doing the uni, but I have to move to something else. And that where I've started doing fitness. And I started actually with any type.

So. So why Australia? What happened? What happened there?

Why? So that's actually a good. Really good question. I was about to go in the U.S. but the refuse might be. So I was like, which one is the English? Yeah, I was like, which one is the. The country where they speak English and I can kind of be away from home for kind of isolating myself and put myself in an uncomfortable situation. Like, Australia is 38, 30 hours from home. I was like, oh, let's get there. So knowing no one, I had like €400 in my pocket. And I came here like, it was the best decision I made in my life. But I don't know how I made the decision. If I think about, like, it's crazy.

Yeah. Think about some of the decisions you made too much. Then you end up going, holy shit. That could have. It's amazing how like some key decisions in your life to shape everything about where you're at now and how you get to this point here. You know, because I grew up in the States. I didn't grow up here, you know, Was born in Australia at the age of three or four, I think maybe four years old. Moved to Canada at the age of like nine, Moved to the States and then moved around the States a bunch of times. And then I remember sitting there in. When during 9 11, watching the towers come down. And I was. I was in English Class. And I'm pretty sure I was in. I was a junior in high school, so I was in year 11. And I was like, I'm joining the Army. And then from there, kind of went through that, and then it kind of, like, ebbed and flowed a bit. And then I ended up, like, wanting to do med school. So I kind of went through that process to become a doctor. And then, like, first year into university, I was like, fuck this. I'm gonna go join the Marines. Went to join the Marine Corps, passed all their tests and got into, like, the direct recruitment scheme for their Special Forces, which is called Marine Force Recon. And then they demanded back then that I had to relinquish my Australian citizenship. So you couldn't be a dual citizen back then. And I didn't know that. That doesn't mean anything. You can, like, you can shout to the gods, I relinquish my citizenship. Australia is always going to recognize me as a citizen.

Right.

I was born here, right?

Like, so I didn't.

I didn't realize that was a load of shit, because I was 19, and a friend of mine was like, he was in the sas, and he was.

Like, oh, they have a direct recruiting.

Scheme for Special Forces over here. Come join the army over here. So I was like, fuck it, 19 years old. I was like, I'll go and join the army in Australia. So I moved back to Perth for, like, three months, joined the Army. They told me it's going to be a year waiting list. Called me four days later, said, you ship out tomorrow.

I think all right.

Fuck.

I guess we're part of the Army.

When I say something, I know, I think I never told you this, but the main reason why I'm in South Nava is because my brother's in the Army.

Yeah, you mentioned.

Yeah, yeah, yeah.

And when I was like. I was talking with him, and he was like, you know, I'm in the middle of changing a job, and I'm having to think about it, and I don't know what to do. And he was like. And I explained. He's like, you know, the guy that we're going to work for is in the Army. He's like, if he's in the army, just go for it. Because he was going to be loyal. If you're loyal with it. I was like, that's why I jumped on board at the end. So. That's a fucking funny story. Yeah, man.

Small world.

All these small decisions. I sucked at sales. Hey. For ages. I fucking hated it. That's why it shits me when people say you have to, like, you're born good at sales. I was like, well, I wasn't shit at it.

It's funny, right? Because most big sales people always, when we interview them, they've always got that horror story of how they sucked at sales but had to get good at it. So they made themselves good at it by doing due diligence to get good at it. Right? No one's ever just like, I fell into the role and killed. It happens for some guys.

But there are some guys that are naturally gifted at communicating.

100%.

Yeah, but I don't think there's anyone naturally gifted at selling. But there are people who are gifted.

In persuasion and communication, and that's just taught to them by their parents.

And my son will probably be good at that, hopefully because of the way that I talk to him. And hopefully I can articulate to, like when he gets in an argument, how you can articulate around that, you know what I mean? And be taught the art of persuasion. Because I think if you're taught that, man, it's, man, like, if I started, if I knew the shit that I knew back when I was fucking 25 years old, you know, I mean, it'd.

Be fucking dangerous, you know what I mean?

Like, I consider myself a fairly good salesperson. Definitely have a lot to learn, but man, if I had the knowledge, I knew now, I was taught that as a kid, you'd be, you know, I mean. But yeah, like, sales is one of those things. Like, the only reason I got good at sales is because I really enjoyed eating. And it seemed like the path of least resistance. I could either, like, try and get someone to do it for me, but like, man, like we tried that and it just never worked. Like, you know, because especially with gyms like fitness selling is a very particular, very particular way of doing things. And it requires a grind. And a lot of the time requires a knowledge of fitness, which you can sell most things with no knowledge of what the fuck are going on. But fitness in particular, you need to have a little bit. You know what I mean? And so we tried these salespeople who were coming in from corporate sales backgrounds and we paid them salaries and all this kind of stuff and they just fucking sucked. So I was like, well, I guess we'll just have to do it. And then got better and better and better. And it wasn't until we started really doing high volume, like, I was okay at it when I had like, just my gym and stuff like that. And then we went into RBT and we started opening the gyms. And, you know, like, you were in Melbourne and then it was like me and James doing Sydney. And then I started helping out with all the things and then kind of getting into it a lot. That's when it really started to click was like. Because I was doing like, you know, like. Like how many sales a month were you pulling in for the three or four gyms that you were. You've done like 50 a week? Month per gym.

Yeah. So for 28 days when we used to do a campaign. 147. 28 days a month? Yeah, a month.

150Amonth. For how many years?

We mean for many years.

So, like, how many years did you sell it for?

I worked with them for two years. Two. Three. Two, three years. But I was doing a side of it. Sixteen weeks as well, which I was putting.

So you have four and a half thousand. 28 day challenges.

Roughly.

Yeah, yeah, roughly between the 147. The 197. 247. And after, since we were doing big volume, jumped up to 297 for the price.

So you mean price, the actual. Like, regardless of price, whether it was 16 or 28. How many people did you sign up on a monthly basis?

140.

Okay.

So.

Yeah, okay, yeah.

140. Just because we sell. I remember also I had the pleasure to work another guy, which is called Ruben. Fantastic guy. And we sold so much.

Hates me, by the way.

We sold so much that we had to increase the price because we didn't have space in the gym. So, like, we didn't have any more availability in gym. So I was like, we have to change.

You got an armhole over in Italy that has a gym too, right?

Yes, yes, yes, yes, yes, I do. And I do this. I redone the cell structure for them, and then now they do 28 days challenges and 16 week challenges. So they're doing fairly well in the past three years, apart from the COVID time right now. But yeah, they've been pretty really profitable, which is something. Which is really good.

Nice. Because I remember you saying that you were gonna go holidays over there before, you know, Covid hit and you spend more like a month there and you smash it for. You fill out his gym for him and leave.

Yeah, exactly. Like, I can't get away from work. Whatever is listening to this. He has to understand that I'm a little bit work colleagues. So, yeah, when I get there, I do payments up front for them using kind of help them in the cash flow of the business and try to get a little bit bigger. So I sell like chunks of bachelor training.

You know, it's funny, Dean, Dean Chamberlain's watching. He goes, he said he looks like. You look like fucking Mario. So you can say, fuck you, Dean.

What was it like, what was it.

Like transitioning into selling high ticket, dude? Like, I know that, you know, we started off like is when we started right. Like when sales snipers started, we were pretty much only doing fitness sales.

Yeah.

And then we sort of started to transition. Transition. Transition. I know you're super nervous about it.

What do you think it was?

Was it easier than what you thought it'd be?

Yeah, yeah, absolutely. Was super, super scary on the start. And as soon as jump on the third call, I was like, man, this is so easy. Because people like, you have to understand one thing. Like we. I was coming from really cold calling people really hard. And the first time that I had someone not overcome, like not coming with an objection on the call, I was like, that's amazing. This kind of people around the planet and yeah is a way easier process. That's why if you are a person that says, like I want to stack in sales, you should definitely start doing cold calling. Because when you get to an environment where they call it B2D, I don't like calling that way because I. I don't believe in that. But when you get to that sort of sales, it's gonna be like really, really easy for you. Absolutely easy.

How do you think that the. That experience of, you know, the 4528 challenges, you were able to transition that into high ticket, Particularly in the same industry because it's mostly self fitness business coaching. How do you think that transitioned in.

Terms of like, what. What I think or in terms of like, in terms of prospect?

Reframe the question.

Yeah. So like how do you think like that skill set developed from selling fitness products enabled you to then transition into selling fitness coaching?

Yeah. So is being. Being able to understand the patch a little bit better when you're selling for fitness? You as Matt can understand as well because he sold more. Even more than me is you get any kind of person with any kind of issue with any kind of pattern of thinking decision with any kind of objection. So when you get into a states where you get in those goals, which the objection is just one of two, that you move really, really fast, you understand you are able to read that person and be able to advise them in a better way to answer your question.

Yeah, yeah. And is there a difference in the client, like, in terms of the objections that they have, like the issues that you have to overcome on that call as opposed to the challenge? Like, what's the key distinguishing differences for you?

That's actually something. I was thinking about it last month and I don't think there is. Because at the end, when it comes down is all about something called pattern of thinking. So it's the way our person makes a decision. And, you know, in the account that I'm doing right now and in the account that I used to do for small 28 days and 16 weeks, the pattern of thinking there are people that are going for me is actually the same. It wobs around taking an action or not taking an action. So that is what all comes to. Because after, if you really think like you have the money objection, but the money objection still is like a value objection or not taking action. So that is what comes to.

Sweet.

I'm trying get my camera to come on.

You're on now. Yeah, I can see that camera.

I know just my. I keep. Everyone keeps freezing. So I think I'm in one of those workspaces at the moment and I think everyone's pumping zoom and just destroying the. Just, just, just destroying. I'm actually going to switch over to going off my phone, I think, so give me a minute.

Yeah.

I found the transition to high ticket really easy, which is why it baffled me that everyone was so shit at it. If you can do that, I'm gonna.

Make me co host. Right. So that it doesn't accidentally shut down or ruin the Facebook Live.

Yeah.

Sorry, guys, for your technical difficulties. Somewhat. When we say technical to difficulties, it's just us being unorganized more than anything, which is fine. We're not Joe Rogan. We're just a bunch of technical.

I would say not yet. Wow.

Not yet. Well, it was. I don't know, like, since we're talking about sales stuff. That dude's baller now. He just sold that hundred million dollar deal with Spotify. How crazy is that?

Do you know anything about it? What's that?

What are we talking about?

You're gonna have to turn mute off on the computer because all you're getting is background noise. Yeah, cool. Say something now. Yeah. Hello. Yeah, Cool. There you go, listeners. Fixed. Yeah, we're just talking about Joe Rogan, you know, on the topic of stuff.

Oh, my close personal friend Joe Rogan.

Yeah, yeah, he'll be a guest next week. Yeah, it's cool. Like, what do you think? Between like what we do, like in terms of coaching sales, how you have to close a deal of that magnitude, like what do you. Like we've never had to do that before, but probably going to have to do in the future. Well, not to that extent, but similar style deals. What do you think separates close and deal like that as opposed to something like selling a 12 month business?

Well, selling corporate deals is really different. The sales process is different. Like you need to create. It sort of depends, right? Like we had a client, Alex, who's a mate of mine who we brought on, never really done any sales and now he just signed like a million dollar deal with Westfield. Right. Because what I did is I taught him how to create like an advocate and that was about him like I guess learning the strategies of how to make someone like work for you within an organization. And it's just, it's a different environment but the principles are still the same, but the way that you go about it is different. So corporate sales, they're far less emotional on the upfront, they're far more logical because people aren't dealing with their money. And that's essentially the difference. So people are less emotionally tied to like the monetary figure, so the price isn't as important, but they're more concerned about being the person who looks the best from making the deal happen. So you really want to identify the person who's the decision maker. The easiest way to do that is to identify the person who never uses singular pronouns like I, me and I. You know what I mean? If they're using we and our, that's the person who doesn't want to be known as, as like as the decision maker. So you identify them and then you sort of try, you need to try and figure out what their pain point is and how you can hit that and then structure your pitch around the pain point of the person who's making the decision, which is usually going to be status driven, which means that they want to come off looking the best. It wants to be their idea. So you need to like have them figure out what problems they have and then them kind of like solidify in their own hands. So it's a different type of selling. There's a great book on it called Flip the Script, which is written by Oren Claff, which is all about how you can create confidence in buyers. Because if you're at a pitch meeting, it's a really different experience if you've got three or four investors sitting there in front of you and you're creating a Case, more like what a lawyer would do. So essentially you're trying to create trust without a back and forth. It's very difficult and it's a very different skill set. And it's more like real estate selling, I guess than what it is like, you know, selling a coaching program which is a highly emotional, very, very personal process.

Yeah.

Which is why, like I'd love.

To, actually it's something that I'd love to start doing, doing more of Those high end B2B type stuff and looking for opportunities to be able to learn how to do that. But it is definitely a, it's a, it's a different skill set. But I think the principles of persuasion and communication still last. I think like they still, they're still valid. I think the techniques are different.

If anyone listening happens to know some absolute killers in the B2B world, hit us up, connect us. We'd love a mentor.

Yeah, I'll pay someone some money to teach me how to do that. I'm sure it's going to come in Handy Someday.

Oh, 100%. Take those lessons into what we do now and apply it into a lot of our business stuff. Bringing on clients, bringing on other things, closing deals with some of the software stuff that we do is to get that out, you know, to a larger audience by, you know, some affiliate stuff. Like it's all going to come in handy to where we're taking the business.

Yeah, Jimmy said he wants me to shout him out, so. Shout out Jimmy, Great guy. I told him everything he knows about sales, which isn't saying much. But no, he's a great marketer. He has an awesome group too. It's like 50 bucks a week, similar to our 50 bucks a week, but it's like, it's the best fitness, fitness coaching program there is for someone who wants to learn the basics of how to run a successful gym. Yeah, it's 50 bucks a week. It's pretty good. What else is he saying? He's fucking spamming my feed. Shout. Yeah, yeah, mate. See ya. Fucking calm down. Dan Henderson's there, Austin's there, Caleb's there. Everyone's watching my shit.

Jimmy wants to know, Marco, question for you. Where'd you get your hat? Just. Jimmy, if you're still listening, you should be asking where he got his turtleneck sweater from, because that's the key to success, brother.

Yeah, we're actually selling those turtleneck sweaters.

They're 69.95.

We should get some made up with a logo on it.

Yeah, I was thinking about it to do it.

The Marco turtleneck, it comes with every. With every subscription to Sales Sniper you get a turtleneck.

Every sauce I do becomes with a satisfactor neck.

Speaking of some of the stuff I'll just show the cool little trophy that Marco's one that we got made up for him. So just for something for business and you know, gamify things, reward the guys for doing great things. We're now doing a sales rep of even just staff member of the month. Really not necessarily sales rep of you know, who's contributing the most. Combination of who's making the most bank, who's making the closing the highest rates, getting the best show ups, who's developing the rest of our team better and just doing outstanding things. So massive shout out to Marco for May. Absolutely killing it. See how you go this month. But I reckon you might be neck and neck with someone else and you might lose the mental this month we'll see how we go.

The baton might be true. We also got those medals being made up. So we got a 1 million, a 5 million and a $10 million medal. So that's going to go out to the reps and to the account holders that we have. So the like the influencers or the business owners are the guys that we do. So as soon as we sell a million they get a medal. It's a very cool custom made coin. And then from there we have a 5 million dollar one which I think you would think you'll be entitled to pretty as soon as it's minted Marco. And then we have the 10 million dollar one which is exclusive right now for people like me. So. But you guys will get there. It's okay.

One day we're gonna get there. One day we're gonna get there.

We've got a few clients that would be hitting the 15 to 20 mil mark quite soon.

Yeah, we got. I mean our spreadsheets are. You know, we gotta, we gotta update them. That's actually interesting, an interesting one. The tracking. The tracking's gone next level. Yeah, tell me about it. Tell me about our amazing tracking system that'll be available purchase soon for between 15 and $25,000. So if anybody wants it.

Big investment. So I guess what we built was. And I'll probably talk you here a little bit Monto. Not just you but your colleagues as.

Well as I think me too. I think it's fair to say me as well.

Me too. You know, before I decided okay I have to be the person that is the opposite to everyone else. To fix the issues that as we all inherently say, as people have, and that's poor administration tracking, not keeping our shit up to date because we're focused on sales. And you know, we come together and be like, well, most organizations, they need their salespeople doing these things. It's like. But they hate it. They're not good at it, and they're not consistent. They won't do it. So let's build a system that stops them from doing it. And we can still track things meticulously to know where we're at. So we've built things out just because in salespeople inherently have the same positives, negatives, 90% of the time. Right. And that's, as I said, the poor tracking and stuff. So our guys, across all of our cases, they need to do three things right in their CRM. They simply change the outcome of the call. And this is just clicking a button, you know, did the person no show choose the no show? We write the lead and we put down any of the objections. Now there's three things the sales guy has to do and that tracks every metric for us based off a series of automations that we've hired computer scientists to figure out for us. Because, you know, that's not our area. We're salespeople, we're ideas guys. We need people to make that stuff happen. Once we have the ideas now it's really important to, you know, those three things might not seem like a lot, but when you have a bunch of data points, you can create statistics and see patterns. And those patterns allow us to make decisions in what we do because we have real, realness. You know, we're not just thinking, oh, it seemed like the leads weren't as good because most of the time it's probably your headspace you might not have closed well. So you blame the leads. And we subconsciously do that. It just happens. Right? But if we have leads, right, we can assess things. So for instance, I think, I think.

One thing he said. Sorry to interrupt. I think one thing he said there was like. Was like lead quality, right? And lead quality is a really weird one to track. And like, there are only certain times where you can track it where, like it actually, I guess it is always subjective. Yeah. But it has to be before the sales call, right? So if you, if you, if you're tracking lead quality after a sales call, you're essentially just tracking a salesperson's ego. Which is why I don't like the method of tracking offers made like a lot of people Track offers made. I don't like it. I think it's too subjective. I think the only way that I think what you should do is you should decide before the sales call, like, if that person is a really qualified lead. If they're not, and leads are down. Like, me and Marco had this call conversation. If leads are down, let's just put every old Tom, Dick, and Harry through a sales call. Because, like, what else are we doing?

Do you know what I mean?

Like, what are we gonna do? Just sit back and go to the gym extra time? I mean, let's just put them through. Let's have a system in place where we're marking those people within our CRM as, like, unlikely to buy. Because then we can, like, separate that data out and we can just go, hey, listen, we put 10 people through this week who are super unlikely to buy, and we put six who are likely to buy, right? And if we sign five of the six, that's awesome. Of the likely to buy, and if we sign two of the 10 who are unlikely to buy, fucking awesome. Because if. Because you know that, yeah, it's only 20% close rate, but who gives a shit? Because we're making sales, right? And as long as we can delay that data, then we don't have to then, like, take the overall close rate, because it goes down from 80% to, like, 40%, and then start to freak out and make decisions based off, like, essentially inaccurate subsets of data. And so it also protects the salesperson's headspace from one from being reprimanded about their close rate going down when it's an intentional thing, and so is irrelevant.

When you're hitting targets.

Exactly. And you can always work on it and get it better. But close rates and ego thing. And I'm a fan of having a big close rate, and we do have a very good close rate because we do a metric fuck kind of development, right? And it's very targeted and very specific development. And if someone. But once someone's up to a good standard, like someone with Marco, I don't even monitor. I don't give a fuck. Yeah, right. Like, I know it's really good. I'm more concerned about the people that come into the top end of the funnel and how many people come out of sales, because I know the process is solid and I know it's not broken. So if. But if anything out of the normal happens, we can just check something and we can make sure that, you know, Marco's headspace is okay. Or maybe there's Been a huge lead quality issue. And it's just a conversational thing. Then when people are new and they're coming in and we're developing. Yeah. Monitor closed weight quite closely. Right. Because that's what allows us to develop the person. We then even monitor every single objection. So I can then do very, very specific coaching based off like, you know, because if the injection is downstream, the problem's upstream.

Right.

So let's fix the upstream problem. And then from there, like once we do that for a little while over say three to four months, we can get the person up to a standard where they really should be self managing. And the development that we do as a team and some of the one on one stuff that we do should be enough to keep them in a good headspace. If an anomaly comes up, it's usually going to be an emotional situation. Right. That's not as much of an issue with some people. People like you, Marco, like, you know, you're like me. You can separate yourself out from that. So generally speaking, like your day to day doesn't affect a huge amount how you close. But some other people, you know, they, it affects them, which isn't a bad thing. It just means they're more empathetic than we are. That's all it is.

And also, don't be afraid to track your numbers. That's what I can advise to someone that is watching because that is where your improvement is. If you're lying to yourself, like if you don't book people because they don't tell you I'm ready to do that or I'm not ready to do that, that is me that you, you're not willing to be the top.

Exactly. People don't track their numbers or fudge their numbers because they're afraid of what the reality is. And the numbers don't lie. But people do. And when you have those numbers, you have the data to be like, okay, I am not as good as what I think I am. Here's where I'm being let down in my process. How do I fix it? And without knowing that because your ego is in the way, you can't make the changes to get better.

Everyone's got a 90% close rate. Yeah, everyone, everyone has a big deal. I had a conversation with quite a big company in Germany the other day and I was like, what's your rate on this? What's your rate for this? What's your rate for this? They're like, oh, it's about this, it's about this. I go, okay, hang On a second, when you say about, do you mean it's 69% and you're rounding up to 70 but you have the exact number or are you going off field? They go, oh no, I'm going off feel. I go, then okay, everything you're saying is completely relevant and I have no interest. I was like, so let's just back it up. And what data sets do you have and how can I actually have a look at what the hell is going on so I can see if like what improvements need to be made. But like this is a coaching organization that's doing hundreds of thousands of dollars a month, you know what I mean? And they're a good organization, they know what they're doing. But from a sales front end perspective, like nothing is tracked effectively. They're like, oh, I think organic marketing gets way more qualified leads. I go, what makes you think that? They go, oh, I think that way. I go, do you track it? They go, no. And I go, I do.

I'll tell you which one.

What are you crazy? Like I was like, where are you going to sink your effort? Do you sink your effort into ads or you sink it into content? Like you know, or do you do both? Because it's 50, 50, like what's a more scalable model? How do you run a business that way? And the reason why we came to do it was because I was sick and tired of people coming to me going like, why aren't we getting more sales? Why aren't we getting more sales? And as a salesperson, I can't just go back to them and say, because your leads are shit, I have to have some data. Sometimes it's because it's a salesperson's fault, sometimes it's the leads, sometimes the process needs fixing because there are just parts along the way that just people fall out of the funnel. And without data and figuring out exactly what the hell is going on, like I just don't know how people make decisions. It's terrifying.

Sometimes they. You create new funnels and you forget to put a transfer trust page in. So all of a sudden you haven't pre handled the price. Now we track all of our objections. We now know that. Hold on a second now. Money objection just went up 70%. It's not. We've assessed this calls from the salesperson, anything that that saying, why is everyone getting price shock? Then we go back through the funnel and be like, oh, they're not getting the pre qualification stuff that they were before, therefore pumped up, let's go fix that now we're closing better because we're having to handle less objections and people have got more trust before getting on the call. Those little things make big differences to the income that we can bring in for someone just for tracking.

Yeah, for sure. As a guy, as a guy in the trenches every day. Marco, what would you say are the things that you like to see in like a pre sale process that makes you confident that you're going to get a good, a good lead? I suppose.

Okay. I would say that there is a couple of things. Like especially when we do the triage is the, rather than the answer to the questions, the tonality they use on answering questions. That would be the main. Having the right tonality and not being a person saying, Yes, I want 100% in, but that turns out to be a non bio language. Yeah, for sure. Is going to turn you like, you know, yes, I'm a person does it 100%. So I feel like 70% right now and I don't want to do it. That's I think I had there. And then like more often than people saying, no, I'm not interested and yes, I'm interested. Like I trust more in someone that say I'm not interested in this. Then someone, they say, yes, I want to do it.

Yeah, Someone who's super, someone who's skeptical is someone who's actually generally looking to buy. Someone who's like, oh my God, this solves all my problems. It's so amazing. Thank you so much. I just really. Can you send me an email and just let me get back to you?

Exactly.

So if you hear that, if you hear that, like super keenness, like I tell everybody, like all the time, if you can identify non buyer language, then you can slow the coal down and start to get that cost of an action piece. Start to really tear apart the things that the person really wants. And then from there you can kind of like get that out of them. But that's just a real like defense mechanism. We had Jeremy Minor on the podcast like just the other day and he was saying the same thing. Like when you're, like when you're cold calling people, like, there's two types of people. There's people who tell you to fuck off and there's people who are like, oh my God, this sounds so good. Like could you please send me some information because now isn't the right time. But like if you can follow me up and like three, three, six or 12 months, that'd be amazing. Thank you so much. And then like They're. They're never going to answer the phone because they're just people who are, like, don't want confrontation. And that's the vast majority of people, which is why people get ghosted. Right.

And polite people, essentially.

Yeah. Because you're not capable to be influential with them. That's why. So if you turn someone or not being interested to being interested that you're influential, therefore you can get them to pay, but, you know, you're not influential on someone that he thinks he already wants to do it. So whatever you're saying is not going to listen if you don't really bring them to a point where you ask them, why.

Why now?

Why do you want to do it? Why do you want to be 100% like, those kind of things? And then you just do.

Yeah. Understanding someone's why is like, actually talked about this, and I think in a training, I was like, understanding their why is It's a good thing for a lot of salespeople to get. I think when you move into, like, the upper tier of a salesperson, like, you don't need to really ask for, like, that what is your why you need to ask why they want to do it and why they want to do it now. But that whole, like, getting into, like, the deep emotional drivers, like, and actually asking as, like, a standalone question format, like, I think it's. It's like a pedestrian is definitely the most douchebaggy way that I can put it. But it's. It's just like, it's a very simple way to get an outcome that you can do in far more elegant ways. Right. And I only. I've only learned that recently. Like, I used to use it hardcore as part of my whole selling technique, but, like, now, after being mentored by Jeremy and stuff like that, like, he doesn't do any of it, but he does it. But he does it in a highly nuanced way where he doesn't even know he's doing. You know what I mean?

Like, it's.

It's one of those things. So.

Yeah, but it's. Never speak in a certain way for a certain reason over certain period of time. It just becomes natural.

When you listen to the podcast itself, it's very funny. Like, it. That's how he talks when he's selling. So he talks every day. You know, it's just. It's just how he is and who he is as a person. He's become this Persona, which is a good thing because it's incredibly, for sure, persuasive of someone who talks in a way that is persuasive and engaging. And it's very similar to Eli. Right. And I hope that one day I can be anywhere near that engaging, because, like, you know, being. Being able to have someone hang off every word that you say is an incredibly powerful, incredibly powerful tool.

And we. We've even discussed that in our personal meetings. It's like, we want to get to that level for our team so that you hang up every single word we say so that we can deliver our words with such clarity that it can match those guys. You know what I mean?

Exactly.

So, yeah, I gotta get Tony Robinson.

Mentoring, but I'm just short the million you gotta pay up front to do it. So I'm close. Close, but not there yet.

Well, this month you might be, maybe. Yeah, this is a good month.

Been a good month, not gonna lie. All right, we should go, because this is. This is. I got meetings coming up next. This is fun. This is fun. We'll do this again.

There's still somewhat of a podcast. Marco, why don't you run us through? Because that's what we always ask our guests. What's the best objection you've ever had? The funniest, most crazy objection that's ever come across your desk that you could probably stay on Facebook and not get a shutdown?

Yeah, the weirdest one is I don't think it's an objection. It's more like someone. I think a guy once told me that his dog chew his credit card, chew his wallet.

Yeah.

And he didn't have. He didn't have his credit card with him. But he paid. But he paid the day after, though. I have to say that he didn't.

Ghost me though that product.

I beat him. It was actually for the. For the gym in Sydney.

Oh, yeah.

Rocktail. Okay.

If you can make sales in Rocktail.

You can make sales in here. That was a rough gig. That's trial by fire, man. Trial by fire. Selling people. Selling people who culturally have no interest in exercise. I'm just muting you, dude, because you have that stupid thing. All right. All right, guys. Thanks, everyone, for coming. We're gonna go ahead and exit stage left, but also I'll speak to you guys soon, everyone on Facebook. Thanks for joining us. And, yeah, we'll do it again. If you guys like to drop a comment. And we'll do this again. And if you got any questions you shouldn't want to cover them, we'll do that too. So, yeah, put that coffee down.

Coffee's for closers only.