Your Sales Team Is Leaking Money… Here’s Where

I farmed my CRM, did my best, put the statuses for the prospects. I wanted to know how to start the conversation with the prospects that I've already talked to, but I couldn't overcome their objection.

Okay.

You know, but to also, if they don't go ahead, how do I keep that connection for the future?

Okay. So it all starts, as I've discussed, at the end of the first call. All right, you need to get conditions of satisfaction. Otherwise, I'm not going to pretend to give you an additive measure that's like ninja, that's going to work 70% at scale with someone that just doesn't respect you and you try to get them back from SMS or email, right? Okay, so what I'll do is I'll share my screen here. Let me know when you guys can see that.

Yep.

Cool. So this document outlines how to essentially de-ghost follow-ups through book a meeting from a meeting and then getting conditions of satisfaction, which we've talked about before, right? It goes through the exact steps, clarify the conditions of satisfaction, which is what exactly needs to happen after this call so that you can come to an effective decision. If you've tried to handle objections and you've seen that you're going to burn them, and you don't want to. You've tried to get a deposit and gone through the entire matrix there. I have the full breakdown of that that I give to like paying clients and stuff like that, but I'm happy to give it to you guys, right? If you don't know how to get deposits like properly based on what they say, if they object before you even suggest the actual amount for the deposit, which is very different from if they object after you suggest the amount— that's two different types. And within those, there's two like logistic fee or logistics value on either side of if you've dropped the deposit price, right? Uh, you essentially want to go down that route. If you can't get that deposit and you move to conditions of satisfaction, which is essentially what do you need to do to come to an effective decision, uh, once you tie down that and create a logistical plan, uh, you'll then do BAMFAM, which is book a meeting from a meeting, right? All part of the conditions of satisfaction is you work out what they need to do between now and, you know, coming to an effective decision, to indeed come to an effective decision, right? What actual artifact, what piece of information, what logistical step, whether it's come to the— go to the bank, speak to your lawyer, read the agreement, whatever it is that you seemingly can't overcome with value, right? Uh, and you've tied down essentially the last step, which is future pacing a commitment, which is, okay, Jess, let's say that you went to your lawyer, they looked through this entire thing, and they said like, absolutely, it's perfect, it fits into what you're looking for, it's all green. Where would we go from that point, right? If they object there, uh, and they say, well, I'd still have to— well, then you have a real objection. If they say, yeah, I would move forward, then you move to BAMFAM, which is book a meeting from a meeting. You go, okay, cool, so neither of us is actually chasing each other down. What we can do in these situations is book that call under the assumption that you'll go to your lawyer and they'll say it's all good. Uh, if not, we can always cancel. The only person that will object to that is someone that has BS or value issues as well, right? Because otherwise the relationship is built on trust. By that point in the call, if they say no, I want to wait and book until my lawyer has said so, you've just massively lost frame up somewhere up in the call. You don't actually have real trust And it's not a matter of fixing the word track there. It's a matter of actually getting the trust upstream in the call to do this properly upstream, as opposed to creating additive measures and trying to objection handle why they won't book a call. They will book the call, right?

Yeah.

And then you send the asset and then you have your multi-channel reminders, SMS, email, right? You do that. And I can tell you now, as I've said before, when you reach out to the prospect, between the end of that call and the next call, one, you've already got it booked in, right? You've shown your calendar's just not randomly available for people that need to go and like kind of sit on their rocking chair. That's as good as lost. You will try to follow up with those people. Yes, but let's address the way that is 50 times better, which is this way. Now between the end of that call and the next call, you will have content Right? You have key specific content to follow up with them on. Feel like, you know, I can give you copy that I've used at scale where you're like, hey, I was just speaking to Founder the other day and your name came up and we were really just discussing how what we've got going over here, this solution can get you to goal they said they wanted quicker and easier than current approach. We have— still have a few spots available for someone like you. Let me know. Or would you like to book a call? Or would you like to have a 10-minute discussion? And you just customize where I said. That's what you can do for dead lead recovery for sure. Like, there is that. But 90% of the time with closers, they just stuffed up the end of the first call, and you need to do what I said first. So have a nice tight frame throughout the call. If you get to the end, objection handle. Right? If you decide that it's gonna be burn or close, make your decision or, uh, burn or close, make your decision whether you want to, uh, like try that route or if you're thinking intelligently, like a lot more offers than people think, you don't have to have that hard charging, uh, close and burn. If you have good objection handling, you know that at scale you have a good, like solid close rate. You've actually solved the problems like one by one from the top of the core to the bottom. And you know, Man, I close like I'm closing at like 40-something percent or whatever's solid for your account, right? And you just know people close with my objection handling if they're solid. So if this person— like, I know I don't need to burn people because I know my process is tight. So if you can't do it, it's like he's either just like not a fit and it's like DQ, or they just need conditions of satisfaction and then I'll close them. It works for me at scale. It's far more lucrative cash-wise for me not to burn people, right? It really depends on your account as well. If you have like bad reviews and stuff, you're better off just trying to close them on the call, unfortunately, because they're just going to go do research offline and then cancel the call. Whereas if you have a good offer, a good sales process, you get to the end of objection handling, you find out they can't do it. It's like if it's corporate or any form of like decently high non-solopreneur B2B, they will have to have like other key decision makers, you know, and maybe your, uh, offer sales process doesn't tie that down upstream. You can try and do that all you want at the top of the call with the partner objection, like pre-handle and say, is a decision maker here? And like, and then, and then just like reschedule 2 minutes in, and then they just don't show up to the next call because they just wasted time. Like, it's not always the case and that's simple. So Or in a very few short instances where you objection handle, you don't want to burn, you can't get a deposit, right? Most of the time you're going to deposit. This step is just, just again, just tightening up the plug. That last 10% of people, 20% of people, you'll get conditions of satisfaction. You'll book a meeting from a meeting. And then now between that call and then it's not about them, like you hopefully swooning them and winning them back over. You'll have content and the follow-up becomes a case of you keeping them accountable as opposed to you trying to win back their business. So you'll be like, hey, Jess, it's Tuesday. You mentioned you were going down to Chase Bank at 9 a.m. today. How did that go for you? Did you manage to go? Or you can even shift to saying, hey, it's— if you've said to them, once you get to them, if you say on the end of the first call, hey, when you, when you do successfully go to the bank and get that loan, would you be open to sending me a message then so that we know that if you didn't, then we can just cancel the call and no problem, no harm done. We can shake hands and part ways as friends. What you can do then, if you're super ninja with that, is then at, say, 9 AM, they went to the bank at like 1 PM. So don't act needy and frickin text them at like 9:01 or something. At like 11 or 12 PM, you message them and say, hey, it's, it's Jess from XYZ Company. I'm assuming because it's like 4 hours since we met, we mentioned you would send me a message that you didn't get approved for the loan. And what, and you say in that way, and then it, it kind of frames ironically when you kind of like DQ it that way and make an assumptive statement, it's far more engaging for the prospect to respond and go, no, I got approved. No, I'm still, I'm still interested. I got approved. And then you'll go, cool, looking forward to our call at XYZ time and see, it's all like, it's all like based on like reasonable content. Like, like people, like teenagers will do this when they have a crush. They'll go, oh, you left like mail at my house, or you'd like, you, you had this thing. It's like they always make an excuse to message, to message the person to not seem like they're just trying to talk to the person. There's always some content behind it. This is just a thing in human behavior that people know how to inherently do, but they forget where their left and right is in sales. You say, hey, uh, or like, my friend mentioned you the other day at work, and like, uh, he was saying how this, that, and the other. It's like there's always some kind of Trojan horse message, like, of content behind it as the means to reach out and not seem like you're just saying, hey, I want your attention, I want your business, which immediately lowers your frame. And that's the, the actual reason why you get ghosted. Yeah, does that make sense? Cool.

Yeah.

Um, again, so what I'll do for you guys, because I'm just, uh, giving away free stuff, I feel generous, the link in Zoom has the Conditions of Satisfaction, BAMFAM, and De-ghosting Follow-ups document. Take it, trust me. Uh, and then deposits, closing deposits, because I mentioned that somewhere between, uh, trying to close, not deciding not to burn, and then, um And then, you know, if that works, great. That's the full matrix in here I'm about to drop. If that doesn't work, then you move to conditions of satisfaction. And that's the second document.

Thank you, Jeff.

Cool, man. Perfect. Does that answer your question?

Yeah, thank you.

Sweet. That's gonna be like ridiculously fire content as well. I'm gonna use that. Okay. Okay, cool. Sweet. Who, what's his name? Pat, go ahead, man. It's nice to meet you as well.

And it's me, but what's the format that you want here?

Try, try. What I like, man, is as tangible a question as you can get, as opposed to being like, how do you deal with fear objections? You know, like you can ask it that way. I will end up asking you a lot more questions than you ask me because the way I teach, dude, is like, you know, the same when I was in the military. If I went and taught someone how to fire a weapon, I would always ask them to shoot first and show me. Uh, so I get context. I'm not talking down to them because they could be decent and I just like need to make a few adjustments. So if you do have a question like how to deal with fear, say I'm currently like losing— I feel like I'm losing deals to this, to that, to this. And just the more context you give me, the better I can help you. So just try to provide that. And if you have data, even better.

But either way, yeah, yeah, I have data. So pretty much we, uh, we own Resident, like a house cleaning company.

Okay, cool.

And I do, I do all the sales. And I mean, as far as like our close, my close ratio right now is I'm only at 33.8.

I know, is that live call or scheduled to close?

Uh, a mixed bag. Uh, pretty much like cooked there.

You need to work out, you need to book to close or live call to close that you need to work out. Otherwise it could be a show rate. So that's just why I said it.

Okay, got it. Uh, all right. And then, yeah, as far as I cash collected, I mean, my ROAS is pretty much at 3x. And I know my, my buddies that, you know, they— we all have like some— we use like literally similar playbooks for like our cleaning companies. Okay. They're generally at minimum at 5, but usually they're like sitting around 7.

At 7, as a general rule, it's like if you're below $500K a month you're dealing with like somewhat warmer markets. It depends on the market cap, market size, of course. But assuming it's just like somewhere in the middle or your average market size, if you're under $500K a month, you're still generally dealing with like, yes, it's not like hot organic, but you're generally dealing with warmer markets. Then it's an order of magnitude colder traffic out past $500K a month to get to $500K to $1 million. So if you're, if you, you don't want to be any lower than 3x ROAS, as you get to $500K a month. Otherwise it's gonna go down to like 1 or 2X. Yeah. And this doesn't factor in like hard costs and stuff like that where I have, I have, uh, old clients that came to me where they were at like 5X ROAS and they were still like nearly unprofitable, uh, at like $600K a month.

Exactly.

Because the hard cost is so high. So go ahead.

That's why I think I need to fix this before I try scaling. Uh, yeah. So I think the biggest thing is for us or for me is like understanding, like I need to get the why, like why they actually want this thing. But I don't know how, like, I know, like, I know I don't, I shouldn't be surface level, but what is like, what's enough? Because yeah.

Okay.

As in getting really emotional sale.

Right.

I get you. Well, I mean, that's actually kind of more, in my opinion, it's easier ironically when it's not an emotional sale because you can be very pointed and logical. You know, like I didn't even need to tell you about like, I just said ROAS 500 for you won't scale. And then you were like, yep. Whereas with like a normie in an emotional sale, you need to like tell them, can you see how you will not have, like you will be broke basically. And they need to like, it needs to be, it's more work. Whereas if I'm selling dialer, I just say like, can you see if we just change your pickup rate by like 4%, you double your business. And they're like, oh fuck, I need this. I don't need to sit there and go, how would life be like if, you know, you were at $800K a month. Like, I don't know. So it's not necessarily any harder, arguably easier with these people. Just to clarify, your avatar is who? Like, explain the avatar.

Like 35+ year old, you know, moms.

Okay.

Working professionals. They're usually just busy or, you know.

And what's the problem you solve just in your own words?

Yeah, I mean, we're just taking, We're just helping them buy their time back so that they can spend it on, you know, spending time with their kids and stuff like that.

Okay. And you, and you, and just to clarify, that's perfect. That's the emotional benefit or problem solve. What's the dimensionalized benefit? Like you clean their property, you clean their property like residential?

Yeah. For house cleaning.

Yeah.

Okay, cool. And you're getting on the call and you're seeing them come through what they, at the end they don't have as much urgency or something. Is that the problem?

Yeah, usually they're just like, oh, it's too expensive, or okay, they don't see the value, price objection, or just, let me talk to some— so I can talk to my, uh, okay, whatever.

Gotcha. Okay, cool. Well, there's a bunch of things, right? The first thing is, uh, what are they seeing pre-call, right, that, uh, gets them bought in on the mechanism or just the results? I'd say, because it's a very simple thing, they don't need to be sold on a unique mechanism that much. Maybe, uh, other than just like whatever it does to portray fast, easy, and cheap, right? But like, uh, because yeah, you know, how hard are you going to go on, oh my God, your house is going to be so clean, right? But that's not why they come to you for some superior mechanism. They come to just get rid of a problem, and that means they probably want it fast and ideally want it cheap. I don't know how superior you need to seem. Uh, so yeah, recall what do they see, like walk me through the sales system, like the process of like Pretty cool. Just like the high-level part.

Honestly, not much. So it just goes straight from Facebook opt-in. Okay. To a call funnel.

Okay.

And then—

Well, I'll show you, I'll show you what I, I'll show you one of my clients and then I'll show you my thank you page post-booking. Do you have a thank you page?

Yeah.

Okay. And what's that like? We can have a look at it even. Do you wanna share your screen? Sure.

Yeah.

Just pulling it up real quick. I just let you share.

By the way, I joined. Is Pat having an issue with show or parade? Because I was literally going to ask the same question.

He's having it. Well, I'm actually not sure because he said he's closed, right? And I said, is it scheduled or live? And he said like kind of in between. So I don't really know. We're going at live quarter close rate, not show rate right now. Okay. Okay. Sick. But we'll touch that for you as well.

Yeah.

Because, you know, I'm new to sales. I don't really know how to Sure, sure.

Most people don't have that thank you crap and it just, it just absolutely prints. Um, it just prints so hard.

Okay, so actually my thank you page is pretty much just the calendar booking.

Okay, that's what they've already booked it. That's, that's okay. So that's fine. Why is it saying we'll be reaching out to you shortly if they're about to go to a booking page?

Well, usually like if they are, because before this is like an opt-in, and then if they don't, I normally just call them right away.

Cool. And then, yeah, and if they— so if they haven't booked yet, then you'll call them up and book them. If they, if they get a chance to book in before you call them, do you call them still?

Uh, yeah, if I pretty much— I call them automatically on my phone. I use GoHighLevel. And then, uh, because sometimes they'll just book in and I'm already on the phone.

Yep.

Cool.

And then once they book that in, can you do a test booking or something or take me to the next page? What's the thank you page? What happens after this? Okay, cool. You don't have a thank you page at all. Perfect. This is how you immediately double your close rate. And I usually do not make like marketing hypey claims. I'm telling you now, it's the biggest fucking shift for any business. On it with a sell, with an online sales team, right? It astounds me people still aren't doing this. This is one of my clients, Omar, right? This is his thank you page. It's very simple. I'll send you a document because I've got this shit squared for my paying clients is you simply need to follow these main 3 steps. One is to have somewhat, it depends on your avatar. For mine, I'm literally talking to people that have a sales team, so they kind of know to not like fuck around. It's pretty simple. I need to show superiority of the mechanism. Yeah, whereas you, you don't need to as much. I also didn't need to pull their finger out of their ass, uh, like to like confirm the call. I need to show superiority through the mechanism that I am the best sales manager in the world, right? So I'm showing my, uh, I'm showing all my case studies, right? Okay. And I have a very simple step-by-step process with people that literally have sales call funnels. So it's very simple. But for example, with this person dealing with unsophisticated prospects, uh, this first 1 to 3 minute video— and don't worry, I'll give you the documents, you can just enjoy this— The first 1 to 3 minutes is a logistical video saying thank you for booking, please check your calendar, please don't show up late, and please do your due diligence and go check out, like, don't listen to me, go check out our reviews, right? That's just a 1 to 3 minute, very logistical video. It doesn't sell them on the idea at all. This video is a second step. It says step 1, but it's really a second step, right? This video is a short explainer of 6 to 8 minutes outlaying why funded trading is the best way to make money online, specifically better than remote closing, better than fucking paid trading, better than e-commerce. It sells them on the superiority of the mechanism, right? What you can do is probably do away with most of this video, and you'll simply just do a logistical video when they book and say, hey, thanks for booking in. Please, first step, just a couple of clean things before I call to set you up for success. What I get you to do is check your calendar and just say, wait, if it says I know the sender, click that. That way you actually get the notifications and stuff and it doesn't go to spam.

Cool.

Outside of that, go check our reviews down on this page, right? And you can skip this video and then just have testimonials. What I would recommend with your market is just have before-after timeframe. That's what I would do. I would literally do— I'm going to do the most bastardized version right now, but I just know it would convert me. I would be a— absolutely perfect client for you because I'm like, I do nothing that will not make me money. I don't cook, I don't clean, I don't do any of that shit. So I would just pay you and not think about it as long as I know that I can see this, right? Which is before. I would have before and then I would have like some, something like this, some arrow after, right? After. And then I would have literally like some kind of like thing like this and go in like 2 hours or whatever it is. If it's industrial cleaning, maybe it takes a day, but I'll just have it like that and I'll just have a series of these going down the page. You could have them literally structured like one of these per row and this is going to do all the selling because it's all they really care about, right? You just have, you just have bunch of those pre-call, this is going to absolutely cook them before the call and you'll show up and you won't need to be a ninja, right? If you can link to Trustpilot or Google Reviews, whatever you have, have that below the copy. Again, I'll give you the copy templates. We just have testimonial, test, like case study, case study, case study. They don't necessarily care about like the person because these models, the reason that these testimonials are here is because the customer has an objection still in their mind, whether they know it or not, it's latent. They come on the call. They have, they have different types of objections. One is outer value objections, which is I don't trust you. And the other is inner value objections, which is I don't trust if I can do it. Obviously with your market, they're very unlikely to have inner value objections like, well, I don't know if my— maybe they do to a degree, but they're not going to have that many objections in my mind of like, oh, I don't know if my house can be cleaned, right? They're going to be like, is this legit, right? Our outer value objections. So these are for people to go, oh, he's just like me. Oh, I have two kids. 'cause you're just like me.' And it solves the objection of the inner value. With you, you don't have that as much. So with those, uh, with those like before-after screenshots with the time frame, it just answers the question I have in my mind: what would it look like after and how long does it take? All right, that's all you have, and then it's cooked. And then if you need— we don't need to go that far for now, all you need to do is that. But eventually, and depending on how much intel you have from all your sales calls, what we did here was basically work out the 5 to 8 most common objections that the prospect gives on the sales call after the presentation. And they ask a bunch of object— a bunch of questions. You probably— you guys all probably know after the presentation you get all these questions, or they should already have been solved. So what we do is do shit like this. I'll play them for you. I'll play one or two. Is this actually a loan? Like, how does funded trading work? Do I owe money to the company if I lose money? So first and foremost, the answer is absolutely not. This is not a loan. Funded trading, you're not borrowing anything. So here's how it works. First and foremost, you— and now he just sells them on the mechanism again. He's like, this is how it works. So what you could simply do, in my recommendation, to just knock this out, is do one video either there or just don't do that part and do it in the mechanism explainer, the one below the 1 to 3 minute. A 5-minute walkthrough talk-through of like how we come into the property and how we assess and what we do and all this stuff. And it'll just show like how sure they are of the process. Um, I know people in similar markets that do in-person service, online sales, in-person service is they literally do a video of them going— this was for an appraisal, a business that does like appraisals of like property or businesses. And they literally have like someone following with like a phone camera and they like go in and they like show, okay, this is what we do. It's just like a walkthrough talk-through. Of them and then maybe even like a sped up version of them cleaning the property. This will cook them completely because market sophistication is higher now. You didn't have to do this 3 years ago. You do that and you probably don't even need to do anything with your sales process. It will cook them already. And then, I mean, I could be here for a while explaining to you this in terms of sales process of what you need to do. I would recommend because I want to give time to other people, otherwise I would literally go to the end of the earth with you. Go to my, go to my YouTube and go to that new video I just put out. Which is like, um, the pain video. And I literally talk about the exact thing you're asking, which is you need to create a narrative and a logical stream of acceptances to get the prospect to believe that they need your thing to get that, get what they want. And then how to probe and clarify, which I would imagine is probably what you're lacking as well, congruently on their questions. If you just said like, are you— don't get pain urgency, they say I can't afford it and I, I need to speak to my partner, Pain. Go do it. Or unfulfilled desire. If they're, if they're, if, if they're in pain because their house is a shithole, then that's pain. If their house is okay but it's not high stat, like me, I'm not in pain. Like, my place is pretty clean, but I would pay you to get my property to a very high level if I knew people were coming over and I wanted to convey high status and I wanted it squeaky clean. That's unfulfilled desire. Like, I could get away with it. It's not pain, but it's definitely unfulfilled desire, which is like, I won't get this status that would be extra good if my house was clean. That's all, that all gets fulfilled through tight probing and clarifying questions of what they said. Like, they say things, you need to ask congruent non-scripted questions that get out pain, uh, because you're the mark— you're the subject matter expert, so you should know what questions you can ask to get them to say stuff like, have you checked, uh, behind— when was the last time you checked behind your walls in your property? And they go, well, we haven't checked. You're like, right, we are aware. Are you aware that— and then they immediately— you don't even need to say anything. Even you don't even need to say, are you aware that there's mold? Like, 60% of the time you can literally just ask, and when was the last time you checked your behind your walls? Okay, when was the last time you actually did XYZ thing they definitely don't have? And then they'll be like, oh yeah, I don't do that, I don't do that, I don't do that. And then it'll build a shit ton of, um, it'll build a shit ton. I think Luke is smiling because he started doing it. He closed some for like $6K the other week. He's in car detailing. Tell him what you asked or some shit.

What did you say? Yeah, yeah. So I literally had the same problem. I've closed 3 deals since hopping on this call with Jack. 3 different deals. I had an upsell as well. And it's crazy because like that unfulfilled desire, I never really thought about it that way. You can like sell them on that very easily. And like if you're the expert, you can ask very technical questions. Which if they're not doing will inherently just bring pain. It's like it will just bring pain because they're like, yes, shit, not doing that, I'm losing X, Y, and Z money. So yeah, so yeah, thanks, bro.

So, um, so if it's, if it's not, if you feel like they're not in much pain and you're like, I can't get anything, and you, you can't fabricate it, you can't be like, oh man, you know, it's worse than you— what you do is you ask questions. And what the questions do is raise people's awareness because they trust their own questioning. They'll go, no, I don't have, I haven't checked for termites or I haven't. And you just ask questions that one, you know, there's probably a no and two, your product solves. So if I'm selling car, if I'm selling like car insurance, I'm like, I could technically say like, okay, and I guess like 'Where do you live?' And they're like, 'I live in Detroit.' And you go, 'Okay, and I guess are you like, uh, you know, obviously there's the metropolis, there's like the city center, and then there's sort of the outskirts, the sticks.' They're like, 'I live in the city center.' I'm like, 'And how long have you had insurance for?' And they're like, 'Uh, like I've never had it.' You go, 'Right, can I, um, can I offer a suggestion to you?' You don't want to just shove it down their throat. 'Can I have a suggestion to you?' 'Yeah, go ahead.' 'Are you— I guess I should ask first, are you aware that Detroit, in specific the city center, has like a 300% higher likelihood of a car accident than like any other city in the West or Mid-Canada Central. You know, you're just a subject matter expert. You said it and they're like, no, I've always avoided it. I'm like, right. Well, can I ask you a question? Yeah, go ahead. Is it more risky to like, you know, just kind of say that, like hope and pray as opposed to like, do this? We're going over here where at least you pay a hard cost of like $1,000 a year as opposed to like, you know, ride the rocket, pay nothing. And but if you do have an accident, even if it isn't your fault, you pay anywhere from $6K. Like, if you did the math, it's like, it's really like, it's— you're literally like, you have 5 years of risk management just by paying $1,000 a year. Have you ever thought about it that way? And they're like, no, fuck. But I couldn't do that unless I asked them a series of questions to get them to like line out that they're like kind of they're just not addressing something and there's going to be consequence from it. A great salesperson in a non-manipulative way can ask a series of subject matter expert questions to get the prospect to feel a degree of tension over pain that hasn't even happened yet.

Okay.

Right. So do that. Check out the pain video on YouTube. Go build the thank you page. Let me just get you the doc and then we'll answer, uh, Jaden's question. Uh, pretty cool assets. It also— what do you know roughly, like, just off the top of your head, maybe even just good, bad, what your show rate's like?

Show rate is pretty crap. Let me see. I got the number.

That's the thank you page as well. They've got no reason to show up. The objective of the VSL, if you have a VSL, if you don't, that's probably another reason unless you have some mad copy and stuff. The objective of, like, pretty much everything pre-call is obviously it sounds very stupid, but I always answer from first principles. Is to get the prospect to show up to the call, right?

Yeah.

So what the thank you page does is obviously it cooks them on like how good your product is. Of course, that gets them to show up. But the, those before afters I said with the time frame, what that does impregnates in their brain. They cannot get out of their head is they're like, what will it look like for me? That's the exact thing that you're trying to do on every VSL is that's why you, you, they never give you all the information. They give you enough and then you're like, oh, I can see how it would work. They even laid out 3 main pillars, but how do I actually do that? Well, you need to show up to the call. So by you showing before-afters for other clients, they'll go, what will my property look like? And then it'll, it'll make them want to show up to the call. And that'll also, it'll also increase the— because you can't show photos on a sales call. And if your market is very leaning towards just show me proof Right? You can't say, oh, it'll be real clean, let me show you a slide deck, or show, like, have the slide deck on the thank you page. They see the house, I've already seen it, man, I'm pretty happy, let's do it. Okay, like when I bought, when I went with my YouTube guy, Matt Ryder's, uh, guy and Jeremy Haynes guy, and we, I got him as well, I was already cooked. I've already seen Matt's videos. I was just, thank you, babe. Yeah, yeah, I see my videos, I'm like, yep, done. I'm like, yeah, I don't want to buy it. So I recommend you do that and then go, if you need reminding of all that stuff, go and take this document, which is the pre-call sales system document I give to my clients. It literally has everything, even has a bit of accountability in there. Right. Cool. Jayden, go ahead.

Yeah, I was just wondering if I could get a call review on objection handling.

Yep.

How long we got? 35 minutes. We'll do it. I want to do it. I'm going to try and tie down Luca's show up rate thing. I just want to assess which one's going to take longer because I want to get both of you. I'll stay over time if need be. So you both get taken care of. But I think maybe—

I'll be hard fast. Yeah.

Yeah, go ahead.

I'll be hard fast, Jaden.

Don't worry, bro.

So what we're doing right now with the offer is our shop rate's 22%. And it hasn't been like that before. I joined the offer and then it's kind of dropped. I wouldn't blame, like, I had a look at it. The thing is, bro, literally it's like Instagram ads running to DM, like DM ads. They DM the thing, they get a free post, they look over it, and then the setter DM sets them into the thing. After the Calendly, there's no thank you page. There's no thank you page, nothing. And then it's straight to a booked call with me. As soon as they book, I have to triage within like a minute or two. So I call them up, I triage. But the thing is, bro, they're still, they don't show up. They're like, they, you know, get on the phone with them. I'm like, all right, this, this, and then boom, that's it. That's the process.

So you outbound triage after they book, you said?

Yeah.

It's not an inbound triage, you outbound triage. And then even though you do that outbound triage, they don't show up to the sales call.

So yeah, I mean, it's inbound.

Yeah.

Outbound triage. Yeah. But the thing is like, bro, I get them to accept the calendar invite. I get them, by the way, we don't have nurture content.

So it's like, yeah, let me just clarify because these are little nitty gritty things. So DM setter, no thank you page, but they've booked in or they've booked in for the sales call already. You, you intercept and outbound triage. I literally had a paying client, a $500 diagnostic. Have you ever seen that thing? I literally had someone literally book, have this problem last week for a B&B offer. It's the same thing. I got them. I look, if you don't have the ability to do this, we have to do this ghetto under the radar. What I got with the actual founder to do is change from an outbound triage to an inbound triage. The DM setter, actually, the big problem as well is I've seen this before, is the DM setters are just trying to book.

As—

and they're very low status. A lot of DM setters are just very low status. They're not good at sales, and they're DMing— and their DMing is super needy. So if you can address that and just have a look at the copy— if you don't have management, uh, capital, what you do as a closer with that step— I'll even show you, share screen, so we can just like— you don't have to remember everything I'm saying. Cool. DM setter, if you— what you can do if you're under the radar, if you're not managing, yeah, maybe you don't have the chops yet because you've only been there for a short period, but if you've been closing deals, you'll build some respect if you're not managing, all you do is find— do you have access to see the DMs? I do, yeah.

I can show right now.

Okay, I don't need to see them, it's fine. I mean, I'm sure I can probably actually address it, but just for this step, if you're not managing, all you do is find screenshots of the DM status being needy, right? And either— and try to do it in a non, like, shit, like, snitchy way. Just go to the sales manager and be like, hey man, I just noticed some of these things Like obviously no limiting beliefs on my part. I'm going to close regardless and do what I can. That said, like just wondering, like, do you feel like this is kind of like a little bit needy and just at least objectively it doesn't— it's like pushing them to book the call before even creating any frame or anything like that, right? You send that to the manager or the founder and trust me, they're probably already aware of it. So if you're not managing, all you do is find Cedric and send it in. Send it. Up to someone, or if you're in good comms with the DMs, that'll be like, hey dude, I got some pointers, it's going to help us both make more money, right?

Yeah, yeah, definitely. I can, I can definitely say to the setters because they're like pretty chill with me. Yeah. Um, so I can just tell them to do it.

Yeah, cool. Okay, thank you, Paige. I'm gonna get to my next point. Thank you, Paige. If you can, if you can push this up, uh, if you don't have the, the clout to do that yet, that's fine. Outbound triage, what I got this other client to do is I— if you look, there's two routes. If you can change the system, make it inbound triage, right? So the, the DM setter doesn't book a sales call, he books a triage call, which is a 15 to 20 minute inbound booked Zoom call with either a triage setup or in the beginning a closer, i.e.

you.

Yeah, yeah, you. And then I can give you the triage script for that. If not, if you can't change the system, we refine the outbound triage script. That you have, right?

Yeah.

And also, do you roughly know your pickup rate on the outbound triage?

It'd be high, it'd be above 60%.

Okay, cool. It's not something to go for. All right, perfect. That's nice. That's solid. Solid. Perfect. Perfect. That's nice. Okay, cool. Even then, if that's the case, if your outbound triage is like super high, like 60%, it may be just work. Don't even change it. Don't go for the inbound triage. we just need to look at why they're not showing up to that call, that sales call. The TL;DR, we'll go through the script right now, but the TL;DR is that what I do is if you look at my triage script and you look at my sales script that I give to clients, they're actually basically the same, right? Yeah. The triage script is like literally the first 10 minutes of the sales call. You do what we have just learned, which is create a frame. You just go like North Star goal, whatever your thing is, whatever you call it. Situation, what are you doing now to get that thing, problem, unfulfilled desire, hit a rationale, and then all you do is, uh, go, okay, what have you been doing to solve the problem, right? And then as soon as you smell, within 15 to 20 minutes, as soon as you smell they say some degree of supplication to the frame, which is like, yeah, I haven't really been trying, like something where they convey like, I'm kind of a little bit caught with my you know what in my hand, I don't really know, like, as soon as they admit a degree of like need, or they don't even say I need you, but they show that they can't solve the problem on their own to a degree, uh, then you pivot to, okay man, I've got to jump in another meeting, but what we can do is book a call. And then you send targeted proof, i.e., the thank you page or some kind of sales assets for them, not for just anyone. You don't send them 20 videos. You say like, okay, what I'm going to do between now and then is also send you this. You remind me of this person, or Hey, your business situation, boom, it's like this. You send that, you have a strong lasting impression, and then you book the sales call. And then from there, between then and the sales call, you just check if they went through the pre-call stuff, right? And then they'll watch that, it cooks them for the sales call. And then what you'll end up getting is you have a nice, uh, pickup rate on the outbound triage. This will push your show up rate past like 70%. For their sales. Yeah, because it's crazy, bro.

Like, literally, it's the biggest bottleneck right now. It's crazy.

Yeah, it's like the biggest thing you could do to make more money. So, um, what I'll do is I'll show you. You tell me, we can adapt. But, um, cool. Okay, I just have a look. Don't worry about like the sales process, like what Ninja questions are you asking. Just look at the, like, this is just pre-call stuff, right? Just look at these questions. Can you see me? Look, people booked a call about getting help around solution. Yeah. Cool. It's a, it's, if you've seen my sales calls before, the sales call outline, like this one, let's see, it's the same thing, right? It hits problem. You just don't obviously be a scripted puppet. Right, exactly. What you do, if you— especially if you did the call, if you did the call, obviously. If someone else did the call, when you jump on the sales call, you go, um, like, whatever your setter's name is, right? If someone else does your triages at some point, let's say his name is, uh, James, you go, oh, now James mentioned— and you say like the question in that way. You go like, okay, James mentioned you were in, um, you're currently in XYZ situation. Is that right? Okay. Yeah, that makes sense. And I guess, and then you can basically get a free, because you're not asking, like there's a cost to asking a question, right? You lose capital if it's a dumb question, but by you basically reminding them of their situation, it's not really a costly question. You're just saying, now James mentioned you are currently in business for 3 years, XYZ. Is that right? Yeah, that's right. Okay, cool. And I guess, uh, and you can ask for more detail as a probing question. Right? So what you do is when you do the triage call, you basically go through this process. You can adapt for yourself, right? You go through just essentially connecting, situation, problem awareness, get here, book the next call. Based on what we're doing at work, I have a few more things. We have another appointment now because Sandy does homework, whatever it is, send you pre-call stuff. And then when you jump on the sales call, say, now it's been a few days since our last meeting. You mentioned if you're doing the triage and the sales call, you go, and it's been a few days, you mentioned, uh, in terms of success metrics, you mentioned you want to take the business from $500,000 to $2.5 million a month in the next 12 months. Is that right? Okay, cool. And I guess like, uh, just, just remind me, like, what's the, the revenue now? Right? So you just work to basically work in, and these questions are so quick that you end up picking back where you left off. And, um, you'll find like basically because this call ends at basically problem awareness. Yeah. Success metrics. When you pick up the sales call, you just go over it lightly. If you feel like it doesn't even need doing, you don't. And then you'll see that, um, you'll just pick up basically an objection finding or solution awareness or whatever is the step in your process. And this will, uh, make the triage to sales call congruent. You don't sound like a scripted puppet reading the same script, but you do get the benefit of pulling the information you got from the triage call to the sales call. And, uh, the call, just sales call, is so much fucking weight. Uh, I don't know if I can— I don't know if I sent it to you guys already. You would have heard it maybe, uh, Jess, when I sent you— if you watch that Najib call, uh, that's in the folder I gave you, my call recordings. Okay, that one, that I start in the call, like pretty much starts at like objection finding. People always ask me, how the fuck did you start that client? Because I did a triage. Because I did a triage and I basically went, this, that, that's right. It just like, does that, okay. Hey Najeeb, man, it just been like a couple of days since our last meeting. So you mentioned right now you're in tech, you make $7K a month, right? Cool. And you ultimately want to get to $25K a month in the next 6 months. So you can eventually like feel the security to be able to leave your job. And you also said like right now things are a little bit tough with your partner. It's been like, that's all we kind of said there. What did you mean by that? It's been tough with your partner? And the person's like, oh yeah, my partner's really expecting me to step up. Okay, cool. I'm just like re— like it's like re-striking the— it's like re-cooking, like turning the flame back on. It's kind of the embers have gone dead a little bit since the triage to the sales call. So I just ask the questions again and I remind me, you mentioned this. What did you mean by that? Yeah. And then they'll say, they'll say it again. And then it just like, then you just, okay, cool. The triage has been brought up again. The pain has been brought up again. And then you flow into the new questions that you didn't ask them on the triage call in the sales call. And it just completely fucking cooks them. Yeah.

I was going to say, Jack, that I noticed with that call that he wasn't answering the what cost of inaction question. Yes. But you just kept like, you didn't care. You just kept going, going, going, going.

Yes, so yes, so with that, that's the example. Another example I want to— I'll just stay on it lightly because it's not Luca's question, but, uh, every, every call has a center of gravity. It's usually a similar phase on every call for one offer, but in this case, which I don't really see too much, the, the center of gravity or 80/20 phase for that offer, not special to that offer, it's just a B2C biz op trading which is like one of the most perceived commoditized, every coach does type thing. So what you need to do as the 80/20 on that call is you need to show that they, they, they need to get to a point where they believe that they don't have a good strategy and you have a better strategy. That is achieved through objection finding, and that's why objection finding is the most important phase on that sales call at scale. But for that guy, the center of gravity was objection. He laid down like he didn't have a clue about trading. But he was the first prospect, and to this day the only prospect that has just had a completely ass-backwards understanding of consequence of inaction. I kept asking him about like, what's the burning building? And he was like, yeah, my burning building is to get to $30K a month. I'm like, I'm not trying to— I'm like, dude, like, I had to explain to him like 6 times. I'll give it to you, Pat. And I said, I had to give it to him 6 times. So I had to say, okay, let me tell you a story. Let me give you like 2 analogies. Then I had to do something else. I know I did 4 different versions. I didn't like, like sledgehammer loop on the same thing. I just literally had to teach it. I tried 4 different ways to show him what consequence. And eventually, if you heard at the end of that call, he sounded fucking defeated. He was like, yeah, I'll never achieve it. I'm like, cool. And that was when he was cooked because that was the center of gravity. So that was something very different. But, um, you know, I kind of, I kind of had a little bit of an inkling that I would have had to do that because I already got to know him a little bit on that triage call, which is another benefit of having a good triage because you get to know him. And yeah, he was kind of completely distracted, seemed like his, his life was crap. He was like, his wife was dragging him off the call, his baby was crying, he was, he was super tired, just got home from work. And, uh, but he didn't seem like too bothered about it. He's just kind of like deadpan about like, yeah, whatever. I'm like, this guy's just like gotten completely used to this level of dissatisfaction. So it was no surprise he had no consequence. Yeah, right. So that's kind of like, you just gotta— you'll, you'll notice over time with your trading calls, if you're still trading, that if that you just constantly get the same objection, if you kind of work one step back where that kind of happened or where it wasn't solved, typically in like trading or e-com, uh, It's just like they just don't trust that your strategy is better than what's out there available because they think it's a buyer's market type of thing because there's a lot of people selling it. But they're actually the most— the thing is they're not a bad offer to sell. They're great offers to sell because trading will never go out of style as a business model, right? It might be hot to sell affiliate marketing in 2022, right? but it's— trading is still going. Affiliate marketing is pretty much like the offers, maybe a couple offers doing well, but in terms of selling high-ticket info to affiliate marketing courses, it's not anywhere near as big, whereas trading is still just going strong. So once you can get good at trading, if you can crack that offer, you can make— you don't ever have to leave that offer, really. Yeah, I'll say that. Thank you. Cool. Um, now, uh, any questions on, uh— I'll give you the stuff, Luca, on WhatsApp if you need, but is there any like clarification you need about what you'll do to test these show rate levers?

I mean, I'll test it myself, but all I'm thinking too is I'm probably just going to get my offer on it to book a, like, pay for the $500 thing with you as well. Because like the current sales is doing fuck all, if I'm being honest. So like, bro, I'll just get them to come to you. And what I think I would change, like, with the whole thing is like, I would definitely run it. I just think the thank you page is the place where we're fucking up because like, bro, people have these like questions that are very answerable. Like, yes. Okay.

Send him the, there's a, there's a, I've got Fathom in this room. Maybe you do as well. Just send him the Fathom, unless he just wants to book in. He's fucking, he's got a, yeah, yeah, yeah.

Sweet. Money on everything. He'll be fine. Okay, cool.

Yeah. Well, I'll go hard in the pain because I want the testimonial. I want the case study.

So if you can sign him up, like, bro, if you can sign him up and just manage the offer or some shit, I'll be happy as fuck.

Yeah. Yeah. That'd be sick. But you know, if, even if he does the, the $500 diagnostic and then I, we fix it, we lift the show like 20%, 30%. In like a couple weeks, that equates to like $500. That equates to like 4,750 million percent ROI, like in like 2 weeks. It's a joke. So we'll try and get that done. All right, perfect. Um, all right, Pat, my YouTube— no worries. Um, my YouTube, I've got another video posting, uh, this, uh, at 12 PM Eastern. I don't know what time that is because I'm in Dubai. Yes, just sent it to him. Oh, you sent it to my YouTube?

Yeah.

All right, legends. Thanks, guys. Yeah, I'm going to— if you like boring-ass sales data, you like getting rich the boring way, I'm posting a video on sales data at 12 PM. I walk through it. It's a screen share document. It's not like a high production fucking brain rot video. So if you can sit through it for like— I explain every sales metric and how to solve it in 10 minutes flat. Or 12 minutes flat, something like that. Um, so that might be worth watching. But cool. Uh, Jaden, do you want to go, man? The time is yours now. We'll review the core. Do you need to be on a call in like 7 minutes? No. Okay, cool. Well, you guys can stay along if you want. Otherwise, I'm just gonna— I want to give Jaden at least like 25-30 minutes of a core review. Cool. So send it in the chat. Uh, I also want to ask if I could get permission to pass Documents, Jack. Pat's document. Offer doesn't have a welcome page. Yeah, I mean, it's in the chat.

It's all open to share. It's locked.

Because it wouldn't let me in. Which one is?

The one you said. Okay, I'll do it now. That's access. Anyone with the access can view. That's anyone with the link can view. Oh, the one I gave to— maybe the one I gave to— oh yeah, that one, the last one, the pre-call one. Sorry. Yeah. Yep. You click it, refresh it.

Works. Yep. Thank you. Cool.

Perfect. We're good. So, okay, let's, you dropped your call recording yet?

Yeah, send it right here. So basically a little context on it. Like I thought he was super bought in. I thought he definitely saw the value. Um, he gave me a partner objection. Um, I do feel like I didn't handle it to the best of my ability. And then the thing is, he still gave me the objection after I said like, okay, whose responsibility is it? Yeah. And then I wanted to, I was gonna go down to like a partner perspective reframe of like, do you feel like she can give you the right perspective? So do you think it's fair to bring that on her? But he did really like seem, it was his mom, so I didn't really wanna like offend him. So I just didn't even go that route. And I went down fear because I already went down partner and he still wasn't buying in. And I don't think I bridged properly into fear. And, um, I was just confused because then he ended up leaving the call.

Okay. He ended up just bouncing.

Yeah. But he was super bought in. Like I thought we were on the same side of the table. Everything was cool. I was helping him work.

So, and, uh, let's have a look because partner is a tricky one. It can often be money fear. And it's a cope. What they do is externalize responsibility to an outside factor that you can't objection handle on the call. And they just, they're just afraid of spending money. And sometimes because they trust you, uh, they like you, they don't want to offend you. Sometimes there's a degree of that. They just kind of feel embarrassed to admit they don't have the money, especially if it's like a guy around your age, stuff like that. It really depends.

I did ask about money after value. Like, I, I asked, like, okay, like, if we were to break it up, would that be easier for you? I didn't mess up there and I didn't go more in depth, but he, when I brought that up, he didn't seem like it was that big of a problem. And I know early in the call he said he makes like $4,000 a month. He lives at home. So I kind of just assumed like, okay, money's not really a problem. He's like, I know he's made a lot of money.

He's got low expenses and shit.

Yeah. And he makes $4,000 a month. And when I brought up money, like if you can split it up, he's like, hey, that'd be helpful. But it didn't seem like a make or break it. So that's why I just kind of skipped over that and went into partner objection.

And, um, okay, well, I'm interested now. I want to get to it, but what was the kind of— what was the, the rationale behind him? Obviously, you obviously went at it and said, are you the decision maker of like running an e-com store? I'm assuming his mom's not going to run her e-com store.

So what was the rationale behind it? But clothing brand, what do you mean by rationale?

Yeah, e-com is, is a clothing brand, uh, sold in person or online?

It's online. It's specific. It is e-commerce, but it is specific, like clothing brand.

Like, that's the niche they sell to. Okay, okay, cool. Yeah, yeah, I get you. Ecom, but clothing brand specifically. Yeah. Okay, sorry, I skipped over it. What was his rationale? How did he rationalize? When I say rationale, which is the reason why, the logical reason why, oftentimes they try to. Yeah. So the rationale behind why I haven't done X is because of Y situation. So what was his rationale for having a real partner objection? Like, I need to speak to her. Like, why? If she isn't going to run the business.

Well, he says like he never brought this up once, but then when he went to that, he was like, oh, like regardless of what she says, I'm still gonna do it because he said it's his brand. And I was like, okay, that's cool. But he didn't seem fully bought in. He was like, I kind of still need to bring it up to her. So then I went down the responsibility. He's like, it is my responsibility and I understand that, but, um, she's kind of like my only business partner, so I do want to just run the rough it, run it by her. And I even asked him before that, is it like an FYI or is it kind of like a, hey, like I want your permission? Let's have a little bit of both. Let's have a look. Yeah.

Okay. Okay. Gotcha. Uh, let's do this. Um, let me just set up the screen. Uh, starts at 48. Yeah. Cool. Just, uh, just setting this up. Two secs. All right, you should see like 2 of me, but it's just, it's fine. Cool. If I write notes here, guys, I've got a client meeting, just 2 seconds. Let me just message this paying client and then just tell him, just tell him, what do you call it?

I mean, if you have a pink clan, I don't, I don't mind.

Just, just, uh, give me 10 minutes.

All right, just pay him, Jaden, then you'll be a pink.

There you go. Um, all right, uh, 40, let's see. I'll probably identify it pretty quick anyway. It won't even take 10 minutes.

Does that all make sense? Yeah. Perfect. So how we're going to deliver this to you, first things first, most important thing is you're going to hop on a call with L.

What's his language like? Let's see.

$5,000 a month, someone who might be doing $30,000 a month.

But, you know, like, but this is online payment processor that we use. Okay, that's fine. Um, I know this is about to sound odd, obviously, of course, because I am still an adult, but can I talk it over with my mom when I go pick her up? Not for the simple fact that I don't want to do it, I just want to, you know, I always incorporate my mom to let her know because she helps me with my brand as well. So is that okay as well? I, I want to do it for sure, but I still like to, you know, let her know because she helps me on the back end. Yeah, no worries.

Well, first things first, again, like, first thing first, I want to really solidify though is like, again, like, if this is something that you want to do, I'm willing to help you make it work. Yeah, first thing first is, do you actually want this help and feel like it can help you with your brand?

Yeah, I most definitely feel like it will help me. It would save me countless times of having to do a lot of stuff on my own, especially because, yeah, I'm by myself, so I don't— and my mom, I mean, yeah, she's older, so it's not like—

you want to kind of just like verbally keep the frame and keep him on track. So when he's talking here, see, you've got already got your answer. Does that make sense? You've already got your answer. The objective here, all you're trying to do and all you're thinking about as a salesperson is to get a double tie-down, which is you say what you said perfect and then kind of go, okay, okay. And you'll— and that okay, okay will actually get him to stop talking and saying like kind of pointless stuff, because the end— the question was, would you do it? Right? Yeah. Is yes. He'll stop and you go, okay, cool. So just so I'm aware, like you're 100% bought into the process.

You say it like again. So here he started reasoning. Typically the answer after this is why would you do it? How would this help you? He started kind of answering that. So that's why I felt like I could let him ramble a bit. Yes. How do you feel about that?

It's fine. You don't, you don't need, you only need so much. You don't. I can already hear it. He's saying like she could do this. She can do that. It's fine, bro. It doesn't do anything emotionally. It doesn't do anything more. It doesn't close anymore. You got enough. You can do it. You sure? Like, let him speak. But I can just hear, bro. I like literally, um, I can just hear as if I'm closing when I hear a prospect. I'm just like, yeah, this is getting pointless. He's— what he's doing is telling stories. Do you know the difference between stories and concrete?

Um, it's just, I guess, like, he's telling a story.

But like, dude, these guys, these prospects in B2C, they literally like say like, yeah, I would do it. And the reason why is because, you know, I've really wanted to go here for like 6 years. Yeah. It's like, dude, no, that's cheap. You've given an objection. If it was true, you wouldn't, you would have said yes. So it doesn't matter. So just like when they say, yeah, I would, I would 100% do it. Yeah. Okay, cool. So just, I'm sure like you're 100% bought in on the process. So you say something slightly different. So it's not a repeat of the same question, but it's basically the same. So you feel like 100% this is like going to help you get to where you want to go with your clothing brand? Yes. Okay, cool. So like you're 100% bought in on the process. It's just a matter of speaking to your partner. Yeah. And then you go, okay, cool. So I guess like, go speak to your, uh, your, what do you call it, your parents or your mom, right? That's what you're up to now. Just getting the double tie down and then redirecting. It's because objection handling is as much about keeping control as it is about the content of everything you're saying.

Like, that doesn't really help. Yeah. And then she knows nothing about, you know, clothes for younger generations.

She's just like, 'Cause you'll still get this information that you're looking for that you think is gonna solve the partner objection. You'll still get this information, but you'll get it when you asked it. You'll get it when you asked it. So you'll go, hey, so cool, man. So like, not a problem. As long as I know you're 100% bought in on what we do to get you where you wanna go with your clothing brand. Yes, of course. So you're 100% bought in on the process. Yes. All right. So what is it you feel, you like, what is it making you feel like you need to speak to your parents if like you're 100% bought in on the process? Just so I'm clear. Mm-hmm. And then she'll like, you can cut all that crap out and you'll, if he needs to say it, he'll say it. And only the 80/20 will rise to the top. The cream, they will rise to the top. When you have frame, you get less stories and it's easier for you as a salesperson to know what words and content they're saying that you need to go off because they won't say any extra crap. It's just less processing power. And the problem with objection handling, which is what's gonna potentially happen here, I don't hear a lot of sales coaches talk about is objection handling has a half-life, right? Have you heard of that statement before? A half-life?

Like the longer you go into it, the worse it is?

Yeah, exactly right. Exactly. Or like, yeah, stuff like that. You want to keep it lean without, you know, being too terse and not getting the information.

You'd get it by more quick questions to get them through. Knowing that I have someone either closer to my age or in the same business as far as a mentor versus like me just bouncing ideas off my mom. She's like, I like that color, I don't like that color.

So absolutely. Okay, perfect. And just knowing that that works, first things first is like, does the $4,000 actually work within your budget constraints? Or if I were to be able to set up with that—

Don't offer to close it. Yeah, in the future, just ask logistically speaking, the $4,000 is fitting to your budget logistically, and say logistically after you say it. Go. That the, the $4,000, the investment for the thing, the $4,000, does that fit into your budget? Like logistically, you say logistically again like the second time, just so they don't give a fear objection there. And don't option close and say, well, do we need to split it up? Just say that. Cool. Again, this will, uh, so just make sure people don't try to flop down because someone that's got fear, they will probably take that fucking second at scale a lot of the time. Depends what data you have, but a lot of time they will sit, they will take 'Oh yeah, it's a little bit too much for me right now.' And then you've got to kind of either go, 'Well, if you have it or not.' You're just dealing with more shit when all you're actually asking is logistically, do you have it? I'm happy with you saying no. I don't— it's not going to lose me the sale, me saying— you saying no, I don't have the money. I just need to know if you have it or not before we talk about splits. One thing at a time. So logistically speaking, the $4,000 for the coaching, does that fit into your budget, like logistically?

But for you, would you have brought up logistically first before going to partner, or would you have just gone into partner?

Uh, yeah, I would have, because I do my 3 types of objections thing, but I'm just rolling with your process. Okay. As soon as I come in, they go, oh, I need to speak to my partner. Not a problem. Logistically speaking, the $4,000 for the program, does it fit in your budget? Logistically? Yes. Well, I need to— not a problem. And just logistically, does it like actually fit in your budget? Uh, yeah, it does. I just need to speak to my partner. Okay, cool. And do you have any questions around the process itself? Like the actual process, like on your side, like I understand your partner's not tied in. Yeah. Do you have any question on the process itself? No, I don't. Okay, cool. Just before we go into like that, happy to have that discussion. Like, just so I understand, are you like 100% bought in on us being able to help you go to where you want to go? Yes. Okay, cool. So you're like 100% bought in on the process. It's just— now we'll deal with your objection. It's just the partner. And then it's very pointy. There's no chance of surprise. They can't escape on anything because you have like 3 real hard pillars, which is like you believe it, you don't have any like unknown unknowns, right, that have come up, and you can afford it. And now when you go into partner and you go for the partner objection process, uh, it's going to be so much easier when you go down that route. That's how I would do it in that order, but I can still close with the way you're going. With the way you're doing it. It's just when you have enough control and you segment the information and you just get it clear like that, you won't have, uh, you won't have as many problems.

But let's see. We'll make it more easier because of the fact of like, you know, life happens.

No one knows. That's a story. That's a perfect example of a story. Yeah. Life knows, who knows what these Hemingway poets on the sales call. That's a cope. That's why, especially with these guys, cause they're young and shit, you can like, ethically speaking, you can smack them around a little bit and say, well, man, we're on the call with you today. You know, the main, the main thing is about the, the focus of the call is you today, man. So I guess like for you, you know, like I would even interject there and say, well, you know, at the end of the day, um, this is one thing, but the end of the day for you, like this is, this call is about you today. You know, I'd say that anytime they say a story, their friend, uh, HighLevel, or if, if they do say a story and it's kind of hard because it's plausibly them talking about themselves, then let them finish and ask a follow-up question, which is like, okay, but I guess for you, like, how is that, I guess, played out for you specifically? And then point it back in there. It's not so much about getting the answer, it's about training them to stop talking externally. Yeah, but doing it in a non-combative way.

Yeah, like our house or my car or something could happen.

So you're cool, man, you're being helpful and stuff. Like, I like your vibe. There's a few little things Yeah, you're like, no one just wanted to interject there. I think over time as well, you're going to get, I can see it happening. Like if you do that already, you're probably over time going to stop as you get more experience, going to stop taking people's shit a bit earlier and probably just go, okay, okay. And then like not really finish talking yet. Okay. Okay. That makes sense. And I guess, and just redirecting them slowly showing, you're just showing without telling. You never want to have to tell them, don't ramble. You just interject when they're rambling and and then they'll know that you don't take it.

You know, that was like the last thing we want is you being in an uncomfortable situation with your money, with your funds. And if anything like that were to happen, like, rest assured that you'd be taken care of. You don't have to worry. We work on something else. We work something out for you. Make sure your situation— like, that's the last thing you want. I guess, like, knowing that money works and money figures can help you, is it something you still want to bring to your mom's attention?

Yeah, that there, like, why did you do that? You asked him again even though you feel the value. Is it— do you still want to have the partner objection? Like, what? Like, let me know.

Why? Because from the way that I've learned objection handling is like first things first, when you get the objections, you first get the buy-in, make sure the value's there, make sure that logistically works for them money-wise. Once you have that buy-in, you re-ask for the close of like, okay, so knowing that you think this can actually help you, cause you've got them back in a buying state. The knowledge I've learned is like once they get the price, they're just going to give you an objection because it's such a big price. So you want to get the value buy-in, you want to get the price buy-in. Now that it logistically makes sense. And you physically can make do it and emotionally makes sense. Yes. What do you want to do from here?

You're not doing that though. You're not asking that question. You're asking, do you still want to have the objection?

Because I literally, I was going through it and I was just so much was going in my head that I overthought the process. And then that's when I went back into it. Yeah.

It's all good. Your process is fuck, it's near perfect. You just, you just offer someone that's like kind of, you just tighten them up and said, hey, do you want to fall back over? Yeah. You're giving, you're showing in the door. What I would say is just like, once again, instead of— that's a telling, like, do you still want to have the objection? Or like, you didn't even go, uh, what do you want to do from this point? Which is a neutral version. You could have done that. What I would do is I personally just don't like being told no, so I don't say like, what do you want to do from this point? I can just tell he's probably going to still have the partner objection at this point. You haven't really done much to actually scrape out the fat of the objection. You've done well to tie down the 3 pillars of like value, or the two pillars, value logistics. That was good. Then you go in and re-ask, do you want to buy it now? Even though you— I haven't really pulled apart your excuse. Uh, what I say is, okay, with that in mind, if you can afford it and you don't have any questions, what would you need to discuss with your, with your like, uh, parents specifically? Now I would have interjected before he told a story earlier. He wouldn't have got a chance to say to me I'd like to still keep her tied in. If he did and I couldn't interject there, I still would have gone whatever logistics value, like you said, then gone, uh, cool, man. So with that in mind, if you can afford it and you don't have any questions, what do you feel, uh, is like the center of gravity? And I guess the main reason you actually need to speak to your, uh, your, your mom, whatever it is. Yeah, if you can— but see, the question is now, if you can afford it logistically speaking, if you can afford it and you feel like it's 100% the answer for you to get to where you want to go, what do you feel like with that in mind you'd need to specifically speak to your mom on? And then like, and then I'm going at the— I'm not trying to re-ask for the deal. If you want to re-ask for the deal, do it. Just say, where would you— where should we go from this point? He will say, I still need to speak to my partner, right? And then, but see, not— you don't want to just adjust your sales process for every prospect. The process I gave you will allow people that without re-inviting the objection, if you just say, where do you want to go from this point? Some people go yes. As you know, you just said you got a bit in your head. So by you going logistics, value, uh, with that in mind, where do you want to go from this point? Some people will break off into one group and buy, and some people will give the objection anyway, right? Whereas with what you did is you said you just kind of shut the— you didn't really provide a big open door for people to just say yes. You didn't kind of just like push them through. You can just push people through by saying— it's not really pushing, you're just saying, what do you want to do from this point? Some people go, yeah, you know what, I should do it. Or they sit there quietly, and then you can go into a reframe and say like, what's behind that, man? You know what I mean? Just giving a bit more of a door for the buy. And I know that sounds like it's what you was intending to do anyway, you just got like whatever, flustered, uh, as opposed to going, so do you want to still speak to your partner? It's very easy to say yes. And they'll just say yes. And then you've got to go, okay, what would you want to talk about? Which is what I'm saying you should say anyway, is going— instead of saying, what were you going to do from this point? You go, okay, cool, logistically you can afford it and you can, uh, you, you see the value, etc., truncated. Uh, what do you feel like you need to go and speak to your partner about to help you come to a decision? And I always say that, to help you come to this decision, right? So that they don't give me crap like, I always speak to my partner. They're less likely to say that because you're pointing a question very much towards this deal. You're saying, if logistically speaking you can afford it and you don't have any questions on the process, what is it specifically that you'd want to speak to your partner to help you come to a decision? Yeah. And it's like they have to say, like, it's a bit more pointy. They'll feel inside of them as a prospect, not knowing how sales works, they'll just go, oh, like, I can't really like give any— like, it's harder to give high-level shit And if they give high-level shit, like, I just always speak to her, okay, and what about this here? What we've got going on here where you feel like you're 100% bought in and, uh, you can afford it? What do you feel like she needs to know about this specifically, uh, that's holding you back from, like, I guess, making a commitment to yourself today? Yeah. And just keep trying to point it in. And then he would probably give nothing. You go— and if he gives nothing and he's kind of like, uh, uh, and trying to come up with it, I try— before he can come up with it, I try to interject and go, can I make a suggestion to you? And he, if he says yes, he's cooked because I'm going down fear. I go, I can understand this is a big move for you. He agrees, and then we go through the whole mental reframe and, uh, and close with fear. If he kind of pushes back on frames, then you got to see if it's logistical, and then, uh, and then go for the logistics, try to get the deposit for the deposit matrix kind of thing I've given you. Yeah. Uh, and then get— if he doesn't want to give deposit, use at each stage to work out of its fear and then get conditions of satisfaction, bam, bam. I know that sounds like a lot, but it is a lot. It's to get a very high close rate, have the objective. There's a lot of variations when you get down the stream, but that's— you can go back and watch this, Fathom it, and just like—

yeah, that makes sense.

Does it? Yeah, you're pretty switched on. Yeah, yeah. Okay, cool. I wish I could give you more and go into that and roleplay. I would fucking do it because I just want to see it work, but I've got to go.

No, all good. I appreciate your time. Thank you for staying. No worries, brother.

Thanks. Nice to meet you guys. I'll see you next week. Bye.