107: How to Establish a Connection with Anyone with Alex Banayan

Namaste. It's Sahara Rose. And welcome back to the Highest Self podcast, a place where you discuss what makes you your soul's highest involvement. Alex Banayan is back for a much requested Part two. I had him on the podcast. The episode was called how to Meet the Most Influential People in the World and everyone loved it. He is the author of an incredible book called the Third Door which is now a best selling nationwide book. So recommended. I read the whole thing in one plane ride because that's how riveting it is and I had to have him back on the podcast to ask him more questions. So in this episode we dive deep into networking and lots of you guys had questions. I posted on my Instagram story if any of you guys had questions. By the way, if you're not following me on Instagram, make sure you're following me at I am Sahara Rose. I'm constantly pulling you guys to know what you want me to ask these people on the podcast. So this podcast is completely based off of questions that I got for Alex and questions that I had for him as well. So before we dive deep, I have two sponsors that really supported this podcast. This episode is brought to you by uva. UVA is a modernized ayurvedic supplement company that takes certain issues that we have such as mood, joints, immunity, digestion and creates these custom little packets exactly for us, infusing ancient Ayurvedic herbs with modern vitamins and minerals. I take the mood formula daily. It is great if you work a stressful job, had adrenal fatigue, ever suffer from anxiety or even depression, and it really heals you from a fundamental and holistic level. So if you want to try it out, head over to uvada. Y O U V E Use the code Sahara and you'll receive 35 off your first order. And they now ship to almost every country globally. So check it out. If you live internationally, they may be shipping to your country too. And they just added India. Guys, this episode is also brought to you by four Sigmatic. Four Sigmatic is an incredible mushroom elixir company. I proudly drink their elixirs every single day. My favorite is their chai mix. It is insanely delicious. I quit chocolate cold turkey and what helped me was drinking this chai mix every day. And best of all, they use stevia to sweeten it. And there's no sugars like the chai lattes you'll find at Starbucks or wherever else. And the mushrooms are really good for balancing your hormones, helping heal adrenal fatigue, healing your body on an adaptogenic level. So adaptogens really kind of relate to what your body needs. So if you are high stress will bring you down. If you need more energy, it will bring you up. And that's what's so amazing about adaptogens. They adapt to your body. And mushrooms, medicinal mushrooms, have a lot of adaptogenic properties. So you can head over to their website 4sigmatic.com F O-U-R S I G M A T-I C.com Sahara I have a little shop up there with my favorite four Sigmatic products so you can try it out and you can also get 15% off any four sigmatic product using the code Sahara. I also want to share with you that my new book Eat Feel Fresh is now available for pre order and any place books are sold, Amazon, Barnes & Noble's, Target or Walmart. So you can pre order it and I will send you as a free gift assigned book plate, 10 bonus recipes and more. So head over to my website after you've pre ordered the book, you'll be able to submit your receipt and that way I am able to send you your free gifts. I'm so excited to share this book with you. It is my modernized plant based approach to Ayurveda that incorporates recipes from around the world. So from Chilean, Italian, Vietnamese, how can we eat all sorts of foods and all sorts of ingredients with an Ayurvedic perspective. And I speak a lot about when you can eat tridoshically, when you have to cater for your doshas and it's specialized so the breakfasts are for your dosha, the lunches incorporate the six tastes of Ayurveda and the dinners are tridosic. And I really explain my modernized and plant based approach to Ayurveda and I'm so excited to share it with you. And again, Deepak Chopra was kind enough to write the forward of this book and I am so honored and privileged to have his support as well. So head over to Amazon, Barnes and Nobles wherever you buy the books. Check it out. Eat Feel Fresh. After you get it, send me the receipt over on my website eat feel fresh.com and I will be able to send you the free bonuses without further ado. Alex Benayan, author of the Third Door we speak all about networking, do's and don'ts, social media verse in person networking, how to overcome, playing small, how to take action while still being anxious and nervous and what would Alex have done differently or the same? So we dive into all of that and so much More in this episode. Without further ado, let's welcome Alex Bonaian. Welcome back, Alex, to the Highest Self podcast. It's so good to have you here.

Thank you for having me again.

Oh, well, you were so heavily requested after. After the first episode. People loved it so much. So thank you for taking the time to be here again.

I am very, very excited.

So I'm going to ask you this question again. Maybe you have a new answer. What makes you your highest self?

I do have a new answer, because things have changed. So yesterday I was actually at my grandmother's memorial service. And of course, you know, it was really sad and hard, but the feeling of, so I have two sisters and my mom is still around of being with my sisters and my mom. You know, in times of, like, a memorial service or a funeral, sometimes the pain of the loss can get so deep that we want to function on our. And act on our very, like, you know, core instincts. Sometimes it's like to close off or to, you know, not be especially warm. And yesterday I had a really cool opportunity of pretty much deciding if I wanted to do what felt, you know, right for me or honest or in my integrity versus what was kind. And I know it sounds like an obvious thing, but it was a decision to, like, go and do the kind thing and doing that and standing next to my mom and my sisters, like, in, like, you know, in Persian funerals and memorial services, the family sits in the back row and shakes hands as people come in and out. And, yeah, yesterday, just standing with my mom, my sisters, after making that decision felt like my highest self. And what I've realized is that what makes you you, I'll get caught up sometimes, right? And. And I don't know if you go through this of, like, what's my talent? What's my gift? Like, am I in my purpose?

I've never experienced that before, actually.

You know, like, we think about, like, you know, what's my passion? Like, that's not what makes you you. That's what you're doing, which is amazing and important, but that's not what makes you you. What makes you you is the decisions you make in the, you know, not so convenient moments.

Yes.

And I was really proud of myself for doing the uncomfortable thing. That was the kinder thing. And I know it's sort of vague because it's like a. A family situation, but, yeah, I was just really proud. And I felt it was literally the definition of what I felt like was my highest self and doing it with my mom and my Sisters was a hundred times more fulfilling.

That's so beautiful. And I think that one, it's like the closing of chapters and the opening, like, your sister is getting married, and you have this new book, and there's all this, like, new energy coming forth, but also the closing of chapters of, like, others. And, like, I think sometimes we get so caught up in the moment of, like, oh, my God, all this stuff's going on. Like, we forget about, like, there are other stages of life that you and I will all eventually face. And I think it's really important to always have a grasp on that, because then you realize that every moment is really fleeting. And sometimes we just get so caught up into the next goal, the next door. But to just. To like, really be here in the.

Now and what matters other than that.

Exactly. And I know we were just speaking about that you're a meditation practitioner, and how has that helped with this whole journey? And when did that begin?

It began about four or five years ago. This is about two years into writing the book. And along the way of working on it, I would run into a bunch of people, and for some reason, I would meet certain people and really gravitate towards them. And some people just have an easy smile, Some people have a strong forest smell, and some people have an easy smile. And I just sort of like being around people with that easy smile. And at every single conversation, about 30 minutes in, I would find out that person meditates. And you have to understand, like, I, like, you come from an immigrant background where meditation is like saying black magic to my parents and grandparents. You know, the only thing worse is saying therapy to them. So meditation was a thing that I had to hear hundreds of times from different people I admired to finally try it out. And as soon as I started practicing, I realized that there's a different way to live. You don't have to be a monk meditating on the top of a mountain in silence your whole life to live in peace and to cultivate peace within yourself. It can be a practice that you can do 20 minutes a day while you're in an Uber to the airport or in your car outside of work. And it's been. You know the saying, like, you know, fill your glass. It's been the most, like, fill my glass type activities that I've added to my life, you know, next to reading and exercise.

I love that, and it's so true. And, I mean, I know that you're super busy, and a lot of these people who meditate are. But a lot of Our blocks around meditation are like, I can't sit for 20 minutes twice a day. So how has that fit in with your busy schedule and has that affected your schedule in any way?

I like to think of it this way. If someone were to tell me that if you just took this, you know, this one pill and it would make your work better, it would make you happier, it will help you achieve your goals, it'll make your friendships better, it'll make your romantic life better, it'll help your health and your blood pressure, like all of these things and there's like no side effects and it's free and you just have to like take the pill and it takes 20 minutes to kick in. Wouldn't you take the pill? And like everyone would say yes, but as soon as you start calling it meditation, it becomes this, you know, very like I can't do 20 minutes. Let me try to, I'll try five. I'll try. When you focus on the benefits as opposed to what you're giving up for it, it's just a no brainer. And what you end up finding out is that I would take, I don't know, let's say you're awake for, you know, 15 hours a day, 20 hours a day, whatever it is, I would take one less hour a day and make the other 90 of my day 10 times better over the alternative at any point.

So good. And I think it's amazing that I'm seeing meditation like hit more of like the corporate and like the business world and the mainstream and it's not just like in the yoga studio because people really are noticing it's making them so much more productive which then you can start with doing it because you're going to make more money and be productive, but then you're like, oh wait, and actually I don't exist. And all of these things, they like naturally start spiraling. Next. And it's interesting, I think I was listening to an interview with like Tim Ferriss and don't remember who it was. Oh, who's the woman who writes about shame? What's her name?

Brene Brown.

Brene Brown, yeah. And he was saying how he started meditating but he like got to this place where he realized like his success actually isn't that important. And he's like, what a great realization, right? But then he was like, should I guess his converse? His question to her was like, well what about for us people who want to keep being successful? If we meditate too much then are we going to let go of that and she was basically like, no, you're just more aware that it doesn't matter, and you're just doing it for the sake of the journey.

That's so true.

So do you ever see that because of your spiritual practice, you feel, like, less attached to meeting these people and writing these books or.

Yes, and thank God for it.

Right?

It would be so sad if I became more attached to these things that don't matter.

Yeah, totally. And I think that's such a breath of fresh air to hear as someone who, you know, your life is doing this, and you're also like, yeah, it doesn't matter. Like, that's not who my true self is. It's who I am. Like, in between these moments.

Absolutely. And, you know, I say it doesn't matter as a joke, but in reality, you know, nothing matters except what you decide matters.

Right.

And meditation just helps you make more thoughtful decisions about what matters to you.

And I'd like to talk about fear. So I went on Instagram Story and I told them that you're coming back on the podcast and what questions people had. So I have a list of questions, but one that kept coming up is, how do you move through the fear? Like, there's this big person, it's Tony Robbins, it's Oprah, whoever, and you want to talk to them, but you're so scared, you're scared that you're wasting their time. Whatever. Does that fear go away? Or how do you move through that?

Okay, so I'll give a mindset answer and a practical answer. Both are equally important. The mindset answer. One of the biggest realizations from the seven years of working on this book was that I realized that all these people who I just assumed were fearless, you know, whether it's Bill Gates or Elon Musk, I just assumed they had to be fearless to achieve their goals. I realized they're all tremendously scared during the process, even, you know, to this day. So I realized that fearlessness is never the goal. It's this mirage that for some reason, society has made us chase. Fearlessness shouldn't be the goal. Instead, all of these people have been courageous. The difference is tremendously important. Fearlessness is jumping off of the cliff and not thinking about it, which, to me is idiotic. Courage, on the other hand, is looking at the cliff and acknowledging how terrified you are, analyzing the consequences, and then deciding that you care so much about it that you're still going to take one step forward anyway. So it's courage that is the Holy Grail when it comes to Facing your fears. Because it's not about overcoming your fears. It's about acknowledging them and befriending them and using them as your ally on the way forward. You know, there's this unbelievable book that changed my life called. Called When Things Fall Apart by Pemachodron. And in it, you know, there's a small little portion where she talks about meeting this Zen master and asking him, you know, what's your relationship with fear? And the Zen master says, the best answer on Earth. He goes, I agree with it. I agree with my fear. And that blew my fucking mind. Because my entire life pretty much has been a story of me fighting my fears, fighting my insecurities. You know, World War Three in my mind, of me versus my fears. And the second I read that, I realized if I agree with my fear, there's no more battle and I can do whatever I want now. So that's a giant mindset shift that has changed my life. And anyone who's trying to, you know, go up to talk to someone who they really admire and is feeling that overwhelming sense of fear, agree with it. Then you don't have to battle the fear. Now, that's the mindset. The most practical thing I can give someone that they can just use is the cure to nervousness, is immediate action. If you go into. Let's say you're going into an event where you want to meet an author at a book signing. I've been in that situation, you know, dozens of times. A handful of it has worked, and a handful has not. The ones that worked is when before I entered the room, I told myself, the second I see him, I need to just say hello. I can't think about it. I have to take immediate action. And if you can commit to doing that, it becomes exponentially easier. So those are really one thing that changes your mindset and another thing that you can actually hold onto and make immediate action.

When you go in, I'm, like, writing things down that I want to ask you as you talk. So I just want to, like, go into. Let's say, you're in that moment that there's a book signing. You want to talk to the author, and you feel like you really don't have anything of value to offer them. Like, when you introduce yourself, what do you say?

It's a book signing. They're there to talk. You know, I'll make it even more practical. This is, like, a little silly, but, you know, when I was starting out, I had to do these kinds of little tactics. One of the most Useful ones. And now we're almost moving past the whole fear question, and we're just getting to the how to part of it. If you're trying to have a meaningful conversation with someone who you admire at, like, let's say they're doing a book signing, the best thing to do is either to be the very, very, very first person they speak to at that event, which is very hard to do, but if you're lucky enough, that's great. The thing you can control, though, is being the very, very, very, very last person they talk to. It's a little bit risky, but it's worth the risk in my opinion. So, you know, everyone's in the long line for the book signing, whatever. Let those people do it. There has to be. There's an exit to the room. It's usually the way they walked in. Right. If you just sort of hang by the exit and as the person's walking out and you go, you know, I've really admired your work. You know, I'm an aspiring writer. Can I walk with you to your car and ask you a quick question all of a sudden? Because what happens if you try to ask a question while your book is getting signed? You might get an answer, but the person knows there's, you know, 200 people waiting to talk to them, so they sort of want to move it along. When they're walking to their car, it is as much time as they want to give you. And I've had, you know, numerous examples in my life of that working out better than I ever could have imagined.

That is so true, because I'm just thinking about my own book signings. I do always end up speaking to the people who hang out till the end.

Because I'm like, very last one.

Yeah. Because I'm like, wow, that's so nice of them. They even, like, waited this long. And then, you know, when you're. When the whole long line's there, you're just like, okay, like, sign, like, next. Like, you're in this. Like, let me make sure I can get through this. And like, so the place can shut down, essentially, but when it's at the end, you can just linger. So that's really, really good advice. So I'd love to know. And some people asked, is then when you're asking the questions, how do you, like, establish that, like, ongoing connection? Like, you ask the question, but you want to, like, continue relationship with that person. Do you just give your business card? Do you ask for theirs? Do you ask for their email? Like, what does that look like.

All right, so we're getting into the tactical parts.

Yes.

Never, ever, ever, ever, ever, ever give your business card.

Right.

Or give your contact, because they'll be very kind and say thank you and they'll never reach out to you again. It depends. You have to be thoughtful about how busy the person is. You know, if it's Hillary Clinton, unless you have this magical out of world experience with her, probably not the best to ask for her contact info. What is best is if you do talk to her, if you get a chance to talk to her, asking her, is there someone on your team that I can connect with? And then she'll just like point to someone in the room and you go to that person and be like, hi, the secretary told me to talk to you. And that person just standing at the event waiting for it to be over anyways. So you can probably create a really wonderful connection with that person who's much likelier to connect with you on a much deeper level. The best things to do, if it's someone who's a little less busy and can give you their email address, you know, little things that I do is email them immediately. Like that night with the subject line like, Sahara Dash, great meeting you at your LA book signing.

Yeah.

That way it just. When the person sees that they've, they.

They'Ve met you before, they know they've.

Met you before and they feel a little guilty that they gave you their email address and to not respond now in that email that you sent, if it is longer than five sentences, it's done, it's over. Yep, five sentences maximum. And the best thing is actually not even ask a question in that. And if you do ask a question, it has to be something they can answer in one sentence. Any question that requires more than one sentence won't be answered.

I love that. And it's so true. I think we spoke about this on the last episode. But like the life stories and when you write like, this is everything that's happening to me, like, do you have any advice? It's like, like, I don't even know where to start with that one. So they end up just never responding. But if it's just like, hey, I have this question about this, it's like, okay, I can just respond to this on my phone. I'll just reply.

Right?

So that's really good advice. You guys should write that down. So I'd love to talk more about networking because a lot of your success, and especially now that your book came out, got on the USA list, You were on this, opened up the New York Stock Exchange, and you do so many things, and it's not because you hired this fancy publicist. It's because of you, and it's because of the networking you've really done. So can you give us some networking kind of do's and don'ts?

The biggest thing I could say is that there is a giant difference between someone being, you know, a connection you make networking and a friend. Now, it all starts with someone being a loose connection you just met at an event or through a mutual friend. So it all starts that way. But to me, what I've learned in my life, and it wasn't, you know, 100% strategic and thoughtful on my part, it just sort of happened naturally. Which is, the people in my life who have changed my life the most, whether on a personal level or who helped the book launch be what it was, are people who went from, you know, a guy I met at an event to someone who's on my speed dial. And as much as, you know, the guy you met at the event might help, maybe he'll. She or he'll post on Facebook or something. The people who will go to bat for you, especially when you're trying to launch a dream, you need people to go to bat for you, and those are your homies. And those take years to develop. Where the relationship isn't about them helping you, it's about you guys being friends. And you can't force a friendship. You can cultivate a friendship. You can work on a friendship. Friendship takes energy and thoughtfulness, but you can't force it. And there's a great line from Will Smith that says something along the lines of, if you're doing the work you're supposed to be doing, the right people will come into your life. Now, it doesn't happen on accident. Again, you have to cultivate and put in the energy. But the right people end up saying yes.

And it's so true, because when I go back and I think about anyone that's ever done anything for me, any publicity, whatever, it's always been through friendships. Because it's like your friends are just people. You're like. Like you have them top of mind. Like your. Your roommate is the one that knew Steven and connected you with me. And it was like, through friends versus. If it was your publicist, I'd be like, I don't know who this person is, you know? So I think cultivating friendships is such good advice. And I feel like in this day and age, like we've Almost become very introverted and we're like, oh, what's the point of like hanging out with this person or keep building? So do you like, do you have. I know there's that book, like Never Eat Lunch Alone or something. Do you have like. Yeah. Do you have a practice like that? Like every week you like, make sure you meet a new person?

I don't. I used to. And I think there's tremendous values in books like that. And, you know, there's a great book called the Go Giver by Bob Berg where, you know, the core of all of these books are about, you know, outreach and generosity. You know, that's the basis. I'll tell you what's worked phenomenally well for me that I couldn't have learned in any of those other books. It happened during one of the interviews and it was actually with Tim Ferriss, the author of the Four Hour Workweek. So I'm interviewing Tim Ferriss and here, this actually goes back to what we were talking about earlier. So the way I met Tim Ferriss was he was one of the people I wanted to interview for the book and I knew he was speaking at a conference in San Francisco. So I fly out to San Francisco. I used my Price is Right money for anyone who didn't catch the first episode. I ended up funding the whole journey of the book by hacking the Price is Right, winning a sailboat, selling the sailboat, and that's how I funded the book.

And you guys need to listen to him explain it because it's a hilarious story. And you guys need to read this specific chapter in the book because it's so good too.

Thank you. So I took my Price is Right money and I saw Tim Ferriss speaking at this conference in San Francisco. So I'm 19 years old, I use the money, I buy this plane ticket. It's like my first time on a plane alone. And I go to San Francisco for this event ready to talk to Tim Ferriss. And the second I get there, I see hundreds of people with the four hour work week clutched under their arms. And I realize, shit, everyone's here to talk to Tim Ferriss. So I'm like, all right, I'm going to sit right in the first row in front of the stage, next to the staircase on the right hand side. So when he's done, I'm the first one he talks to. The lights dim and Tim Ferriss walks on from the far left side of the stage. So I'm on the opposite side of the auditorium. I'm freaking out. Because I had spent like all this money to get there and I'm like, there's no way I'm gonna let this opportunity pass me by. So I see that there's a bathroom next to the far left side of the stage. So I run into the bathroom and I end up having to crouch in that bathroom, in a stall by a toilet for 30 minutes with my ear pressed against a tile wall listening to Tim Ferriss speech, waiting for the applause. So as soon as I heard the applause, I can jump out. And as soon as I did, there is Tim Ferriss. I get the interview. And during the conversation I knew that Tim had really launched his career by cold emailing. Which is, you know, the digital way of networking these days. Whether it's, you know, cold email, which is more professional or sort of cold dming someone on Instagram, at the end of the day it's the same tool. He got his first job out of college by, you know, sending 32 emails to the CEO of a startup he wanted to work for. And then when he wanted to become an author, he cold emailed dozens of best selling authors asking for advice. So I asked him, what's your cold emailing secrets? And he gave me a template which changed my life. And this is it. Ready? It starts off very simple, you know, hi, so and so. I'm sure you get a lot of emails and you're very busy. So this will only take 60 seconds to read. Boom. Next paragraph. This is where you put one or two sentences max of who you are and what your credibility is in context to that person. Next paragraph, again, one to two sentences max of your very hyper specific question for that person, something they can answer back in one line. And then the closing paragraph is the most important. I totally understand if you're too busy to respond, even a one or two line reply will completely make my day. All the best, Tim. And what is remarkable about this email template is if you break it down, you know, the opening saying I know you're totally busy and you get a lot of emails, this only takes 60 seconds to read is telling the person, look, I'm cognizant of how much you have on your plate and I want to be respectful of your time. That is the opposite of 95% of cold emails. Right. And then the closing is really important too because it sort of puts the person off the hook and they'll actually be a lot more grateful to you. And you're only asking for one sentence. What's cool about the cold email template is that's how I've reached out to mentors in my life. That's how I got interviews for the book. And the thing that makes me happiest is, you know, the book's been out for a month now and if you go on to the Amazon reviews of the book, there's like a few that with all caps, people go, the gold email template works. That makes my day. Because the best part is they always, the next thing they write is, I really didn't think it would. I really swear to God did not think it would work, but it worked. And that makes me so happy to.

Hear, oh, my God, that's so good. But soon everyone's going to do it. We're going to know, like, oh God, he's doing the third door template. No, but it, but it works.

It works. That's the best part.

Because of the time, because of the taking off the hook and because it's, it's simple.

Yeah.

So now that you're trying to secure interviews and things like that, how do you make the template work for that?

The amazing thing about the template is it works in all aspects. So it doesn't matter if I thought it wouldn't.

Like, let's say you're pitching yourself to be interviewed by someone.

So, you know, the most important thing is the only thing better than a cold email is a warm email. Right. So that's always my number one priority. I'll spend, for example, if I'm trying to, let's say, you know, be interviewed in a certain publication instead of. But what I used to do when I was starting out and I didn't know anybody, I would spend hours perfecting that cold email, making sure it's well researched and thoughtful. And I'll read everything that person's published on social media the past 30 days to make sure I'm not emailing them at a time where a family member died or something. I can be super thoughtful about it now. I'll still spend that same amount of research time, but I'll instead spend that research time finding someone who I'm mutually friends with them. And of course I don't have mutual friends with everybody, but if I try hard enough.

So did you research me and find Andre? No, I'm kidding. Because that's how we. Yeah, we got connected. Yeah.

Yeah. Andre's one of my best friends. Yeah, it goes literally a hundred x better if a person they trust, they don't even have to do a kind intro of hey, meet my friend Alex. They can literally just forward the email and, and the reason it makes a difference is, okay, think, if you're a very busy person and you open your inbox, what are you naturally going to click on the name of a person you know? And even if all that person did, who they know, forwarded your email to them with no contact, just forward. If they just said, like, see below from my friend Alex, you're just. The open rate is higher for sure.

So let's say you're trying to interview. Let's use Oprah as the example. Like, let's say you don't have a mutual friend with Oprah. Like, how congratulations, you're like everybody else. How would you, like, you're like, hey, Gayle, like, how would you go about something like that?

You know, I did, I did try. And the biggest thing, you know, look, you can't. There's a great quote from the founder of TED where he said, I live my life by two mantras. One, if you don't ask, you don't get. And two, most things don't work out. So, you know, the same is true of interviewing over. If you don't ask, you don't get, and most things don't work out. The way I went about it, and I didn't actually end up interviewing Oprah, but I, I've gotten.

You were featured on the oprah, oprah show, oprah.com I saw the video.

They were very kind. So oprah.com and the super Soul Digital team did a bunch of videos.

Amazing.

And I think one of the reasons it resonated with them was that, you know, I reached out to them in the beginning when I was trying to make the book happen. But now that the book was finished and they found out.

Maya Angelou.

Yeah, exact. Of course, everyone knows Oprah's incredibly close relationship with Maya Angelou, who passed away. I had one of the final interviews that Maya Angela did before she died. And when I shared that with Oprah's team, you know, they had me into their office here in la and, you know, I'm sitting in the this conference room and there's people like, you know, webcasting in from Chicago. And they were just so supportive. And, and we did wonderful videos on Jessica Alba, my interview with Jessica Alba and with Maya Angelou. And we're in talks of doing some other stuff. The same. Whether you're trying to interview Oprah or trying to do something with own. It's the same mentality of find someone in the organization who believes in you, who's willing to bring you in, and vouch for you. And I don't know how much time we have, but there's a great story from Steven Spielberg we have all the time.

Yeah, great.

Okay, so one of my favorite stories is how Steven Spielberg launched his career. He was 19 years old and rejected from film school. So unlike most people, you know, if they're rejected from film school, they might think, you know, maybe it's not for me. Spielberg decided to take his education into his own hands. So one day he was on the Universal Studios lot and you know the way it works, the tour ride. You get on a little tram and it takes you around the lot of Universal Studios. So Spielberg gets on the tram ride, it goes around the lot, he jumps off, hides in a bathroom, tram rides away, and he starts walking around the lot. And he's walking around and he ends up bumping into this older man who says, hey, who are you? What are you doing here? Because he's this like teenager and he tells the truth, you know, he says, my name is Steven Spielberg, you know, my dream is to be a director. And he ends up talking to this guy, his name is Chuck Silvers. And he ends up talking to Chuck Silvers for an hour. And Chuck Silvers goes, do you want to come back onto the lot? Spielberg goes, that would be a dream. So Chuck Silvers writes him a three day pass. And Spielberg comes the first day and the second day and the third day. And on the fourth day he comes back, this time in a suit, carrying his dad's briefcase. And he walks right up to the security entrance, puts the arm in the air and waves and goes, hey, Scotty. And the security guard just waves back and Spielberg walks right through.

So he had used those three days to establish a relationship with, with a.

Security guard who guards the gate. And you know, he does this for months. He is sneaking onto sound stages, sitting in editing rooms, really absorbing as much information and knowledge as he can. You know, in essence creating his own film school. He's asking producers out to lunch and actors and actresses. And after a few months, Chuck Silvers became his mentor and gave him a great piece of advice. He said, look, don't come back to the lot until you have a short film of quality to show people. Because there's a certain point, you know the saying, you know, it's not what you know, it's who you know. That only takes you so far. You really need to know something, have something to show. So Spielberg takes that advice to heart and spends months grueling, you know, directing and editing this movie. Called Amblin short, you know, 20 minute film. And he goes back to Chuck Silvers and shows it to him. And it was so good that a single tear came down Chuck Silvers face at the end of the movie. And he reached for the phone and called up the vice president of Universal, Sid Sheinberg, and said, Sid, I got this thing you have to see. And Sid goes, look, there's a lot of things I have to see. Is it that goddamn important? And Chuck Silver goes, yes, this. It's that goddamn important. If you don't watch this tonight, somebody else will. And sure enough, the next morning, Sid Sheinberg calls Spielberg, tells him to come to his office immediately. And waiting for him is a contract to become the youngest director in Hollywood history. Now if you look at this story, on the one hand you can think, you know, Spielberg really networked. He went around the lot and met a bunch of people and sort of networked his way. I don't buy that explanation. To me, you know, of course Spielberg had tremendous talent. That's the base, that's your entry fee to play the game. But so do other aspiring directors. Why did this work when so many others don't? To me it's Chuck Silvers. If it wasn't for Chuck Silvers writing Spielberg that three day pass, giving him the important and hard advice to leave the lot and not come back until he had a good short film. And then most importantly, calling the vice president and putting his reputation on the line for this kid who had nothing to give him in return, none of this would have worked. And the phrase that comes to me is, you know, Chuck Silvers is sort of that inside man. Somebody inside of the organization who's willing to put his or her reputation on the line for you, for you to get your foot in the door. So it doesn't matter if it's you trying to interview Oprah or it's you trying to get a book deal. Whatever it is, it always comes down to you finding that inside man who's willing to put his or her reputation on the line for you to get in love.

That and I know what people are thinking. They're like, well, how do I find an inside man?

So for me there's been two things. Number one has been the Tim Ferriss cold email template. It sounds simple but it has worked magic.

So like what I'm thinking, okay, let's say you ask a question and then they respond in their one sentence. And then you're like, so do you want to meet up for coffee right.

So there's multiple things. Yeah. And during my interview with Bill Gates, he actually gave a great piece of advice. He said, you almost want to create this, this, almost this feedback cycle. So let's say I email you and I'm asking you for writing advice because I'm an aspiring authority and you know, I use the email template. I say, what's the best, what's the best book you recommend to aspiring writers? And you recommend the book. And I say, thank you so much. Go read the book. Not in a month. Read it in like three days and actually read it. Read it actually, even better, read it two times. What would give me your honest answer? What would you do if a young, you know, random person who is an aspiring writer emails you for a book recommendation and emails you back in four days saying, I just wanted to let you know I'm so grateful for your advice. I read the book not once but twice, have it all underlined, and it's changed my life. I couldn't be more grateful. And I know you're doing this live event in Venice next month. Would it be okay with you if I came and said hello at the end of the book signing? How would you respond to that?

I would love it. I'm like, you are my disciple, right? You're like, you're a superstar.

You've read it twice in four days, right?

Totally.

I, I 100 agree. And there's something about people can smell hunger when you're hungry. And you know, actually I want to specify that people can smell genuine hunger that's combined with action.

Right. Because the hunger is different than the desperation.

Right. That's why I wanted to clarify that Ye. If you're like sitting in your room just like desperate to make it and you're not getting off the couch, people can smell that too.

Right?

But someone who's no one can help you as much as you're willing to help yourself. So, you know, the best person on a sports team is when the coach says, go run a mile and that person runs three. Even if that person isn't the most talented on the team, the coach is going to be like, I have my eye on her or him, you know.

So I'd love to know how quickly or do you always is get it to become an in person meeting? Because like, for example, in this example that you use, it's like, hey, you're doing an event, let me meet you in person. Like, do you just try to like, you know, it's like a bumble, like you try to meet him in person as soon as possible or are there some relationships that you have that have been an inside man for you and you've never met in person?

Ooh, great question. There have been, it's been rare, but they have been. And that is a testament to how kind those people are. You know, for the most part, human nature is most people won't pull a Chuck Silvers for you until they can look in your eyes and be like, okay, she's the real deal. A great thing that I learned in the interview with Larry King was he said one of my favorite things. He said young people have it all wrong. They look at the Internet and think the world has changed. Sure, technology has changed, but human nature hasn't.

So true.

And I think that was one of the most brilliant insights. He said, at the end of the day, people need to look in your eyes and know you're you and know you're genuine. And no amount of cold emails and no amount of, you know, tweets to a person will change that. And you know, as much as I talk about this cold email template, Larry's right. It's when someone looks you in the eyes that you fully can make that human connection.

So would you recommend for someone, let's say they live in like a state where there isn't that much networking stuff going on, they live in Wisconsin, I don't know, but they don't have a job in the city. Would you recommend they move to a city like LA or New York just for the purpose of soul networking? Or would you wait until you have some sort of opportunity to move?

It's great. First of all, depends what your goal is. If your goal is to have a lifestyle where you spend a lot of time with your family and your childhood best friends and have a job that makes you happy, you can do that wherever your hometown is. You know, if you're a school teacher and you're changing kids lives, that's a successful life. So I don't think, you know, making it big in the city is, you know, the only way to succeed. However, if your goal is very specific, like you want to be an actress and if you really, really, really want to be a film actress and you don't live in Hollywood, it's still possible. You're just stacking the chips against yourself because it's hard enough. If you live here, if you want to make it in tech and you know, people will get upset at this because, you know, there are a lot of great tech cities everywhere. You know, New York and LA and Austin and you know, even smaller, you know, Omaha, there's these amazing tech hubs. At the end of the day, it is easier in San Francisco. There's just no way around it. So yes, if you have a burning desire where you're willing to go all chips in on this dream, why not give yourself every advantage you can?

I so agree with that. I just like, for example, I moved to LA without having a job here, but because the wellness community is oriented here and if it wasn't for the in person connections that I've made, not necessarily that I even work with these people, but the fact that they just know I exist and I'm an actual human, it's helped me tremendously. Versus when I was living in Bali. Like, yes, I could be blogging all the time online, but I wasn't actually seeing anyone in the flesh. So I definitely think if you can move to the city that has whatever you want going on.

Absolutely.

Okay, awesome. So a question that people had is how do you overcome the playing small? So, you know, you naturally had the, this massive goal for yourself, but a lot of people, they don't. And it comes from fear or maybe just like really not knowing what you want or, you know, what do you think playing small even really comes from?

So there's two things that are important with this question. The first thing you have to ask yourself is do you have a unconscious story from your childhood that you know you're not deserving or you're not worthy of a certain dream? Therapy has changed my life. I've been going every week for years now, and that's a great place to start. And if that's out of your resources, even journaling on the topic is tremendously helpful. That's the first thing. Now, in my opinion, the more important answer comes not even about the question of whether you're playing small or not. It's really about defining success because that's, you know, playing small, playing big, whatever. At the end of the day, we're really about defining what success means to us. And I learned about the definition of success in probably one of the most surprising ways, which I couldn't have expected. And it was with Steve Wozniak, the co founder of Apple Computers. I went to Cupertino for the interview and I'm flying there. And I get there and I get early to my interviews and I'm there, you know, 15 minutes early. I'm waiting outside of this restaurant two blocks from Apple headquarters, and my phone rings and it's one of my best friends Ryan. And I tell Ryan what I'm about to do. I'm like, dude, I'm gonna go interview the Was. And he's like, the Woz? Seriously? And I'm like, yeah, like, what are you talking about? He's like, look, man, I know you've, you know, had trouble getting interviews recently, but, you know, Woz peaked like 20 years ago. You know, he. Look at the Forbes list. He's not even on it. Steve Jobs was at the top. Like. Like, dude, you know what? Maybe, maybe it's good you're interviewing him. Maybe you can find out why he was never as successful as Steve Jobs. And before I could answer, I looked up and I saw Wozniak walking right towards me. So I said bye to my friend and hung up. And, you know, Woz gives me a big hug and we go into this restaurant and it's this sea of white tables, and we sit down and I pick up the menu and Wozniak motions for me to put it down. He calls over the waiter and orders for the both of us as if he's like, like, you know, a 10 year old kid, first time in his Chinese restaurant. And the table's just, you know, overflowing with this amazing food and egg rolls and, you know, this and that. And the second I sit down with him, he is undeniably one of the happiest people I've ever, ever come in contact with. Whether he's talking about his kids or not his kids, his dogs or his cars or his road trips or his wife, like, he just glows with this joy. And it made me really curious. So, you know, we're going and talking, and I realized that Wozniak is actually one of the biggest pranksters. So he's spending half an hour telling me all these praying stories, and I'm crying of laughter. And this woman joins the table, and I find out this is his wife. So she sits down and Wozniak starts telling her about my book. And he's like, you know, explaining to her the premise. And he's like, you know, Alex is interviewing, you know, some of the world's most successful people. And then he turns to me and lowers his voice and he goes, you know, I don't know why you're interviewing me. I'm not a big mogul like Steve Jobs or anything like that. And a part of me felt like he was, like, baiting me for an answer, but I did the only thing I could think of. I just stuffed an egg roll in my mouth.

Oh, Shoot that y. That's so funny.

So, you know, Wozniak kept talking, and the question my friend Ryan asked me before the interview started kept coming into my mind. So I started asking Steve Wozniak about what it was like starting Apple with Steve Jobs in the early days so I could sort of try to figure out the difference between the two of them. And I ended up finding out the difference. And the stories, you know, shine a lot of light. The first one he shared. He shared three. The first one actually took place before Apple started. Steve Jobs was working at Atari, the video game company, and Steve Jobs was assigned to make this video game, but he knew Wozniak was a way better coder. So he tells Woz, look, if you make the video game, I'll give you half of the money that I get paid. And Woz goes, that is a great deal. So Wozniak makes the game. It's a home run. Steve Jobs told him that he got paid 750, so Wozniak got half of that. And Woziak could not have been more grateful. Decades later, it came out in a random news story that Steve Jobs was never paid $750 for that video game. He was paid thousands of dollars for the video game. So that's the first story. The second one takes place in the early days of Apple. You know, the company was taking off, and it was clear that Steve Jobs would be the CEO, but it wasn't clear what Wozniak would do, where on the executive team he would be. So Steve Jobs asked him what executive position he wanted, and Wozniak thought about it, and he goes, when I was a kid, I decided that my definition of success was building something with my bare hands, using engineering that changes the world and having fun while doing it. And nothing about being on the executive team accomplishes either of those things. So I want to just have my position capped as a regular engineer, which, you know, is the opposite of everything in Silicon Valley today. Right. And the third story takes place during Apple's ipo. A few of the earliest Apple employees went up to Wozniak and told them that Steve Jobs has denied them shares in the company's ipo. You know, Jobs didn't give them stock options. And Wozniak's like, that's impossible. You guys started the company with us, essentially your family. Let me go talk to Steve. So he goes and talks to Steve Jobs, and Jobs saying, you know, 0% chance slams the door, not having it. So Wozniak does the only thing he can think of, he gifts some of his own personal shares to those early employees. And on the day of the ipo, those early employees all became millionaires. So I'm sitting at this Chinese restaurant at the end of the interview, and I'm looking at Wozniak. You know, he's leaning back in his chair, he's laughing, he's smiling, he's cracking open a fortune cookie. And again, my friend Ryan's question comes to my mind, and the only thing I can think of is, who's to say Steve Jobs is more successful?

Such a beautiful answer, because, yeah, one could say he was playing small, but was he at all? No. He was just being his true, authentic self. And I think that this is a really important conversation to be had, because a lot of us, we all want to be the person who wins the prize, who's on the stage, who's starting the company. But the. That isn't what would make all of us happy. In fact, it's impossible. It's not all of our dharmas to do that, because the world wouldn't create everyone to live out the same exact life. We just see that person, we hear their name. So we think that that is what success looks like. But I think someone who's eaten all this Chinese food on a Monday and his wife's stopping by, like, that's a pretty good life. So I think that's a really good question. And then what about for the people who feel like that they do have something to share, that they want to speak, share their story, but they have this imposter syndrome. Who am I?

There is a realization that I had during the journey where I was actually at a friend's house, and he had this quote on his living room wall, which I. The second I saw it, I just stopped and I took a picture of it, because it really captures the essence of that question. And the quote is by Mike Dooley, and it says the one thing all famous authors and giant musicians and billionaire businessmen and people who have changed the world have in common is that they all started when they were none of these things. And that is one of my favorite quotes, because it busts this myth that I had where I would look at all these people who I, you know, really admired, feeling like they were anointed somehow magically, and I wasn't. And, you know, what's the point of even trying if, you know, I'm not even in that caliber of person? And what that quote reminds you in such a logical way is that Every single person was none of those things in the beginning. Bill Gates got hung up on, Steven Spielberg got kicked out by security. You know, Lady Gaga got kicked out of offices at her music label. You know, all of these people have just gone through tremendous, tremendous levels of rejection. You just don't see it when you're reading a cover story in Forbes magazine, because it's a lot cooler to talk about, you know, their successes. But in reality, all of these people started out, and that, to me, is the cure to the imposter syndrome. Imposter syndrome. If you peel the layers back, it's essentially saying, they're different than me. But as soon as you realize that, at the end of the day, you know, there's this great quote by Maya Angelou that says, I'm a human being. No one can be more human than me. No one can be less. Imposter syndrome doesn't exist in that world if you can fully accept that. No one can be more human than me and no one can be less. It doesn't exist.

So. So beautiful and so well said. And, yeah, everyone started somewhere, and, you know, and we're all still getting somewhere, and no one's like, okay, like, I'm no longer the imposter. I'm, like, ready for everything. It's like there will always be things that feel out of reach, and that's how you continue to grow.

Yeah.

So I'd love to know, like, before the book came out, were you giving talks and did you ever feel like, who am I to give the talk at this Google? Or something like that?

Yeah, it wasn't who am I? It was like, I can't believe they made the mistake of hiring me, but let me not tell them that's in the beginning is how I felt. I was like, don't say anything. Just nod your head, Sign the deal, nod your head, don't say anything, because they'll change their mind. Right. So I guess that's sort of imposter. I. I had that version of him. I had that flavor of imposter syndrome, where it wasn't like, who am I? It was like, they made a mistake. Just don't tell them.

Right. Yeah.

But what ends up happening is, you know, you have that feeling, congratulations, you're a human being, and then you do the thing, whether it's giving that speech, writing that book, starting that podcast, whatever your thing is, and what ends up happening is, you know, it might turn out. Well, it might not. But either way, you know, maybe a few people, maybe hundreds of people who knows come up to you and say, hey, that really touched me. Or I really like this part of it. And it happens slowly. And you start realizing, huh? And for me, it took a while. At first, I thought they were just being nice or that you start realizing, you know, I'm contributing. And the imposter syndrome gets fueled by comparison. And my friend Inkyu has this great line that he says, comparison is the thief of joy. Now, I do it naturally all the time, and I just have to keep tapping onto that quote. Comparison is a thief of joy. I just remind myself that whenever it comes up. But that's why it's a journey. You don't just have these epiphanies and start seeing everything in this bright, beautiful way. You have the imposter syndrome. And you just go back to reminding yourself that you're a human being and you're on your journey and you're not meant to be any other way. And the first time you tell yourself that it helps a little, and the next time it helps a little more. And the imposter syndrome doesn't disappear. It just comes back in a lighter form until it slowly just dissolves. But it will not happen overnight. And if you're looking for it to disappear overnight, you're chasing a mirage.

So I'd love to know about how you started your speaking career and, like, the transition between you being the interviewer and you being the interviewee.

So the speaking career started way before the book came out, but it was, of course, centered around the book.

And, like, did you ever feel like. Because I know before my book came out, I'm like, oh, I can't talk until I have a book out, you know? And I see a lot of my friends are like, I need to have a book. That's the only way people take me seriously. Did you ever feel that?

I felt that, but I didn't let it stop me. And something that I've learned is that, sure. Another great lesson from Pema Chodron's When Things Fall Apart is she has this great passage about giving up on ridding yourself of insecurity. She's like, it makes life a lot better if you just give up on trying to rid yourself of insecurities. Just accept you have them and don't let them control your life. I think that's true of whether it's imposter syndrome or anything like that. Where, sure, if you have those thoughts, just sort of say, okay, that's a thought. I'm still going to do it. But that's a thought. It goes back to what we talked about, agreeing with your fear, which comes back to meditation.

And that's probably how you cultivated that.

Exactly. So the speaking. I remember the first talk I gave was at a event at Nike. And again, it goes back to having an inside man. You know, it's all, all of these lessons. My favorite thing of this conversation so far is pretty much every answer has been in. This is like this big quilt because all these lessons tie together. And that's how my speaking career started.

So you just met someone that works at Nike corporate and you're like, hey, I'd love to come talk at your office.

We, we became friends first. We became friends first. And he just became a friend who supported me on the book. And anyone who hasn't listened to the first episode, the basic premise is that I spent this, you know, seven year journey tracking down some of the world's most successful people, figuring out when they were just starting out, how they broke through to launch their careers. So how Bill Gates sold his first piece of software or how Lady Gaga got her first record deal and Nike was looking to inject some new perspectives and corporations call it innovation. But for me, it's really about finding these very gritty ways to break through. And the whole premise of the book is this whole third door mentality where, you know, life, business and success is just like a nightclub. There's always three ways in. There's the first door where everybody waits in line hoping to get in and the line goes around the block. There's the second door, the VIP entrance where the billionaires and celebrities go through. And what no one tells you is that there's always, always the third door where you jump out of line, run down the alley, bang on the door a hundred times, crack open the window, go through the kitchen, there's always a way in. And that's not only the title of the book and the thesis of it. That's really the energy I try to inject into readers. And my friend who worked at Nike way before the book came out was just a friend of mine who was part of the process, bouncing ideas off of me, off of each other. And when he was looking for someone to inject his team with that gritty hustle energy, he just invited me, even though I didn't have a book out. He just knew what my thesis was and what my lessons were. And that's how that started. And from Nike, then it went to IBM, to Apple. And it's been this, you know, wonderful, wonderful experience that to me is one of the most fulfilling parts of my job.

What I'd love to know is when people at these like corporate jobs are listening to your talk, don't they ever sometimes feel like they want to like quit their jobs and leave?

Oh, I love when they say that.

So like, you know, as they hire you, isn't IBM like a little bit like, oh my God, what if they all like, like bounce after the stock?

Yeah, you know, my. That's definitely like a thing we always joke about. But what's interesting is that it's actually the opposite happens. Even though I always think what you just said happens, what happens is the opposite. Where, look, if a company is bringing me in, they're essentially endorsing my message. And when an employee or someone on a team hears this message in a corporate off site setting, what it does for them is it gives them freedom to take the third door within their organization. Whether that's, let's say, they're unfulfilled with their job. Instead of just leaving their job like they were planning to, maybe they go to their boss and say, look, I want to, you know, fine, I want to create an entire new title. Because I think our company really needs someone to do outreach into the Latin community. You know, my background is this. My family came from here. You know, I'm fluent in Spanish. Like, can we create this new job? First of all, that is taking the third door. The third door isn't always about just being an entrepreneur and going out solo. It's about finding what you want and getting it, no matter what it takes. And the cool thing about the third door mentality is that it works in an organization, it works outside of an organization. And the companies that actually invited in are able to cultivate it and harness it as opposed to their employees, you know, just going rogue and leaving.

So good. And I think that any company that's like afraid of you saying that because everyone would leave obviously needs to revisit the way that they treat people.

Problems outside of me.

Yeah, but yeah, and it's so true. And I think it's important because in this day and age, like everyone wants to be an entrepreneur and it's so glamorized and not everyone needs to and not everyone was designed to be one. So I think it's like you can show initiation while working in a corporate job or any other sort of setting. Being a housewife, like you could take a third door in the way that you raise your kids. Like it's not just in starting your own company. Love that. So if you were to have gone back to beginning this journey and now overlooking everything you've done, what would you have done differently?

So I've made dozens and dozens and dozens of mistakes. I've learned, though, that my mistakes are my greatest gift. So it wouldn't be to change the mistakes. What I would do, though, if I were to go back and, you know, people get this question of, you know, do you have any regrets? And, you know, so many people are like, I have no regrets. I call bullshit, all of that. Now you can decide to not change anything because you're grateful for your present moment. And you know that your mistakes led to your present moment. That I can buy. But if you don't have regrets, then you're not being honest with yourself. There were moments where you could have been kinder to someone. There are moments where you could have been more honest with someone. There were moments, you know, I've had so many moments. You know, when you're achieving your dream, you can get caught up in so much desperation that you blur the truth or you, you know, a white lie keeps going. And, you know, there are dozens and dozens of moments where, you know, somebody reached out to me asking for help. And I just. Sometimes when I get scared and scarcity focused, I forget that helping someone doesn't mean I'm losing something. There's small things like that. What I think is, when we get older, when you're reflecting back on your life, at the end of your life, you're not going to regret the mistakes you made. I think you'll regret the things that you didn't do. Because the mistakes, as painful as they might be at the time, are what add flavor into the stew of life. But my biggest fear is looking back and wondering, what if? So that's sort of my take on mistakes and on regrets, which is that I would rather go forward and make a mistake and just be grateful that I tried. And the things that I do wish I could change were opportunities where I, you know, could have been nicer. And I was, I. I can be a dick sometimes. Like, I can be scared. I can, like, look at my bank account and think, like, I have no money and like, ignore people's calls because I'm so desperate to try to. And when I look back, I would have been fine if I just took a day to breathe and relax. So that's sort of my take on it.

And I love what you said about how, like, helping other people does not take away from your own success, because I think a lot of people, they're looking for that inside man, but they're not willing to be that inside man.

Ooh, yeah.

Yeah. So can you talk more about, like, the importance of, like, times that you've helped people?

Oh, I love that. One of my greatest mentors is a man named Cal Fussman. And I met Cal because I chased Larry King through a grocery store. Yeah.

Which is a great story in the book.

And at Larry's breakfast table, when Larry found out about my book, he's like, look, I'll. He's like. He talks like this. He's like, yeah, I'll do the interview, but you got to talk to this guy instead. And he points to his friend. And his friend is this guy named Cal Fussman, who's a writer at large at Esquire magazine, who's very famous for Esquire's what I've Learned column. So he's interviewed Muhammad Ali and Mikhail Gorbachev and all these people who have shaped history the past 50 years. And I met California a few years into the book journey, but I hadn't started the writing process yet, so I really needed help on how to write a narrative, you know, a page turning adventure. And Cal just very slowly started mentoring me on the writing process.

Yeah. Also, do you ask people like, hey, will you be my mentor?

Or no. That's like seeing a girl who you like and saying, hey, would you be my wife? And she's like, what's your name?

Right. Because people. People ask me that all the time, and it sounds like a massive responsibility. I'm like, oh, I don't really know if I have time for it. Just sounds like a lot.

Right. But if we go back to that example where they ask for, you know, a book recommendation, and then they come to your event and then they offer to help you with something.

Exactly.

It's sort of.

And there's so many people, like, who I help like that. But it's never been this formal. Like, I'm the mentor and you're the mentee, and it's just an organic process.

And then if that person writes you a birthday letter a year later saying, you know, you've been such an incredible inspiration for me and I'm so grateful for mentorship over the past year. You wouldn't be like, I'm not your mentor. You're just like, that's so sweet.

Thank you. Right, Exactly. So just through the organic asking Cal, like, so, like, what advice do you have for someone writing a narrative? How do you get the pages to keep turning?

It started out very Simply if Cal saying, you know, go. You know, I told him the whole Price is Right story. And he was just like, put that down on paper and let me see how you'd handle that. And it was as simple as that.

And were you, like, a good writer growing up? No.

No, not at all. If any of my English teachers who I grew up with found out I'm an author, they would, like, roll on the floor.

Right? Because you were, like, pre med, so I'm guessing you're more of like a math and science person.

Naturally, not that either.

Okay. Like, I skew in between.

So Cal's super helpful. But, you know, your question of, you know, being an inside man for someone else.

Yeah.

What happened naturally, almost by accident, was I met Cal at a time where the magazine industry was shrinking rapidly. I remember meeting Cal and asking him about, like, what he's working on, what his future. He was talking as if it was a doomsday and he would never, you know, see the light of day again. And I was like, what are you talking about? You're one of, like, the greatest writers ever. You know, like, you know, the Internet was made for people like you. And he. I will never forget this first day we met. He goes, twitter is my kryptonite. And I was like, okay, I got a lot of work to do. So I helped him really see himself as an entrepreneur and as a speaker and really create this new career for himself, where he started speaking at Summit Series, and my best friend Kevin started becoming his manager. And if you go to Cal on Twitter now, you know, his tweets get, like, you know, 15, 20 retweets per. You know, he's just, like, so popular on Twitter now. And his podcast Big Questions is unbelievable. And I wasn't consciously, like, I'm going to be Cal's inside man. He was just the most generous, kind person who was saving my ass on a daily basis. That what was natural for me, which was, you know, one of my best friends, Elliot, had the Summit Series conference. It was natural for me to loop Cal into that. Or I enjoy, because I'm weird of making websites on squarespace. Like, it was easy for me to make Cal's website, and. And, you know, I can make a Twitter account in 10 seconds like pretty much anybody else can. It's easy for me to make a Twitter account, right?

But for older person, it's like, how do I do it?

It's so daunting for him, right? So it was very natural. And my relationship with Cal for years, I felt was this, you know, very one sided relationship where I was only getting. And it wasn't until years later that I realized that it was this beautiful symbiosis.

I think that's so good. And just to like show up and serve and it's just, just natural. As human beings, when someone gives to us, you're like, okay, how can I give back to you?

Oh my God. Because you're so indebted.

Exactly. And, and that's, and it's a beautiful thing. That's like an ebb and flow of like you scratch. It's not even. You scratch your back. I certainly. Because that seems like I'm just doing it to get something out of you, but it's just like a genuine friendship that you've built.

100% what I've learned. And you know, you can call this quote unquote networking, but that's so undermining the value of what a real relationship is, which is. You're a great example. You have so selflessly helped me the past few months with this book launch. You know, before we started recording, I was like, I need to sit down with you and try to give you as much help because your book is coming out soon. And I'm like, you in no way ever asked for anything in return. I was, look, this is human nature. When someone is so generous to you, you feel like so guilty. How can I thank you? And those are the best relationships. And look, if you're giving to someone with that expectation, it's sort of in the air and you can feel it. And if you just help people because you like them and you want to see them win, you know, the score takes care of itself. If you're keeping track, it doesn't, doesn't work because people can sense your energy and it just doesn't play out. If you're playing the long game of just trying to have friendships with people you admire, being as kind to them as possible, it sort of just starts working out. But if you're looking at it from a three month timeline, you're like, okay, I need to help her so she can help me do this. It all falls apart always.

And I, and I feel like the people who are so strategic, like, I've met people who are like, oh, well, I post about this girl's book on my Instagram and she didn't post about hers, so she owes me one. And they're like coming to me and complaining about it. I'm like, like, I so don't even want to get into some sort of situation with someone who is keeping score like that, it's better to just be like, you don't need to do anything for me. But then the people who are just, like, here to be like, how can I support you? I'll support you back. And then also just the people that you don't get anything in return with, I think there's such immense, like, joy of just, like, helping someone who's just like, I just want to learn from you and I admire you and. And that's it. Like, we were talking about, like, Gary Vee, like, meeting up with you at 1:00am like, the guy does not need anything from you, but doing it anyways just because of that's who he is. And he's really walking his talk.

Yeah, it's really remarkable.

So this is a question that I had on the podcast, so sorry if this catches you off guard, but people want to know if you were single.

I am.

Okay.

I am. I am single. And it's funny because for the past year, between, you know, my dad passing away and with the book coming out, it's. Although I've been open to dating, it just wasn't. I didn't even have the bandwidth to think about it. And with the book coming out, it felt like an entire weight was lifted off my shoulders. So, yeah, I am single and I'm very open and actively looking.

And I'd love to know, like, what is it like for you as someone who's doing a lot of personal development work in the dating world? Because not everyone is. So how do you, like, handle that? And maybe you've been in relationships that someone's not interested in doing personal development? So what does it look like as, like, a conscious man? Hmm.

You know, I think I don't care about how they do what they're doing. Like, I don't care about the how. If your form of therapy is therapy, that's mine. I love going to my therapist once a week. She's incredible. That's my thing. If your form of therapy is going to yoga every day or journaling every night or taking walks or listen to pot, whatever your thing is. I don't care about the how, but I do care about if I'm dating someone is, are they taking responsibility for their own happiness? I'm a big believer that the best relationships don't come with the whole, you know, you complete me. It's, you know, I am complete and you are completing. We're coming together to do this together. Because, you know, I've learned that if your job in the relationship is to make the other person happy. That's not a relationship. You know, that's codependence. If that person is responsible for their happiness and you're responsible for your happiness and you come together to experience your happiness together and it multiplies. That's love. That's, you know, magic. And so, again, it doesn't matter to me if the person is, you know, consciously in personal development or if they're not. However, she gets to the point where she is in, you know, complete control and ownership over her happiness and her, you know, self work and, you know, because we all come with our own baggage and insecurities and histories, and however she deals with that, I'm totally cool with as long as, you know, she's doing it because I'm trying my best too.

I love that. And one of the things that my dad said when Steven said he was going to propose to me, he was like, the best relationships are when one plus one equals three.

Oh, I love that.

Yes. And it's like two whole beings become something. So much.

I love that so much.

Yeah. So all the ladies out there, if you're looking for someone, message Alex on Instagram at Alex Benayan. I will have him tagged. He lives in la. He's going to be coming to some of my book events. You'll meet him in person. I'd love to know, like, the third door. Do your templates work for, like, dating?

I've never.

60 seconds. I. I'm really into you. Just one quick question.

I've never tried. I think with dating, it's probably a lot easier. You can probably just send an emoji and I'll get the message.

Just a heart. I'll understand. That's amazing. Oh, my gosh. Well, thank you so much for sharing your wisdom.

That was the funniest way to end this conversation.

People need to know. And it's like, you know, especially, like, a lot of people listening to this podcast are women. And it's. It's really hard because not always, but it tends to be more often that women go into, like, let me deal with my emotions and this and that. And more often the men are just. Just very goal oriented and they're just kind of focused on, like, okay, making money, this, that, that. There's just no time and no real, like, desire to work on these things. So the fact that you are and you've, like, really, like, dived into the pool of yourself and gotten to know yourself really makes you, like, a gem in this world. So whoever you end up with is a very lucky person. And I'm sure you guys will like co write a book together and it's going to be amazing. Can't wait to double date with you guys.

That is amazing.

Okay, well, thank you again so much for being here on this podcast again. I know we'll have you a third time. And where can people connect with you and find your book?

So the book is available everywhere books are sold. So it's the third door on Amazon and Ibooks and Kindle and Audible and local bookstores, Barnes and Noble. And if you hear about the book through this podcast, let me know on whether it's Instagram or Twitter or Facebook, it's just Lexbenayan. So A, L, E, X, B, A N, a Y, N and A. Say hi so I can wave back.

Okay, well, thank you again and be sure you tell him you came on this podcast and if you're single or not. And we will definitely have you again soon.

You are incredible. Thank you.

Oh, I just love Alex so much. I feel like he's my little brother, especially because my brother's name is Alex. So I love learning from him and he's such an amazing soul, so kind and honest. And I'm so honored to share his book with you guys. So if you love it, check it out. The Third Door. And also, while you're ordering it, don't forget to pre order my book, Eat Feel, a plant based contemporary Ayurvedic cookbook, which is actually way more than a cookbook, but it shares how the mind is connected to the body and how the foods we eat really impact the way that we feel. And I break down Ayurveda. What makes sense, what doesn't make sense, what do we need to look at differently? For example, mushrooms are not allowed in Ayurveda. Why is that? Does that make any sense? I discuss why that is. Fermented foods. Well, what about all the benefits from them? So it's not just an Ayurveda cookbook. It is based off of the Ayurvedic guidelines, but it's looking at them from today's lens and a lot of science to show a lot of parts of Ayurveda work and these are the parts that don't. And this is how we change them and this is how we make it work. In today's busy day and time, we're all networking and doing all these things that Alex talked about and we don't have time to cook everything from scratch. So the recipes are easy. They're things you can make ahead. There are things that that you only have to cook two days a week. I really made this book so you don't have to worry about food anymore. That is my goal. My goal is to give you this book so food can be the thing that you have on lock and you can go out there and change the world. So check it out. Eat Feel Fresh Available for pre order. Send your receipt over to me on eat feelfresh.com and I will send you signed book plate some cute little cards I created for you guys as well as email you 10 bonus recipes. These I hope you have a beautiful day. Namaste.