294: The Racism Underneath Our Noses with Marco Hansell

Namaste, it's Sahara Rose. And welcome back to the Highest Self podcast, a place where we discuss what makes you your soul's highest evolvement. We are going through this incredible collective shadow work as a civilization right now. Things are not getting worse in 2020. We might joke around like that, but it's actually getting so much better, because how are we going to be able to create a better future for all if we don't look at what's wrong? Sometimes things have to get more chaotic before they become more clear, and that is what we're going through right now. It might feel like things are getting worse, but they're actually getting better because what we're doing is excavating.

You know, if I want to build.

A new house, the first thing I have to do is excavate. I have to go into the dirt, look at what is underneath the foundation of that house, clear it out. Clear out anything that would not serve this home. If you look at it, if you look at a construction site before the house is built on it, you'd say, oh, my God, it's in shambles. It is horrific.

It is worse than it started.

It used to be this beautiful earth, and now it's in shambles. Well, you don't see what is to come. So we are excavating right now so we can lay a solid foundation in the new paradigm.

The people who before.

I've been doing this work for 10 years, and the people before were like, new paradigm. Like, what are you talking about? And now it's like, okay, it's here. I get it. Because we are collectively growing so quickly that every single day, every single second, feels like a completely new awakening. I was joking that this year is like a global ayahuasca ceremony for everyone. Because people are like, wait, racism exists. Wait, there's oppression. Wait, I've had privilege that I've been unaware of. I thought my life was so hard, I didn't even realize how much harder it could have been because of the color of my skin. You know, there are the things, you know, there are the things that, you know, you don't know. I know I don't know a lot about chemistry, but then the 99% are.

The things you don't know that you.

Don'T know, the things that you are not even aware of you not knowing about. And that is what waking up to this white privilege is. It's realizing that there are things that your black peers have had to think about and worry about that perhaps you will never have to in fact, if you are not black, you won't have to worry about those specific things. Not to say that white people don't have struggles and difficult lives, and many of them have so many other traumatic things happening to them. But right now, we're talking about the specifics of racial divides. And in the past episode, I did the solo cast. Why are people so angry? I go deep into the history of why that is. So if this is a new topic for you, I highly recommend listening to that one first to learn about the history of colonialism and the neocolonialism that's still happening, of oppression, of slavery, of segregation, of all of the things that we are experiencing a result of today. And in this conversation, we talk about what is happening right now. So this entire month on Highest Self Podcast, we are highlighting black and people of color voices. It's so interesting because I've actually never had to be someone who, like, went out and sought people of color or black guests myself because I am a person of color.

So technically, every single podcast has had a person of color because I've been.

On it, but now, specifically, really making an effort to highlight black voices. Because right now, this is what we're focusing on. It is not saying that other voices don't matter. It's not saying all lives don't matter. It is saying that right now, we're focusing on our black brothers and sisters who have suffered because of this oppression that this country has been based off of. So last week, we had a dear friend of mine, a mentor of mine, Tatiana Ray, who is an Apache and Toltec shaman, speaking about it from a shamanic perspective. And this week we have my dear friend Marco Hansel, who I have known for a couple of years, is such just a joy and such an inspiration to the world. And we met each other at this conference, and we were all kind of going to him, and I kept ending up at the same exact talks. Like, we went to a talk on, like, black coolness, on, like, why we almost keep black people apart by being like, oh, you're so cool. And, you know, so I always knew that he was very into all the social justice stuff. And he's also very conscious. He's a transformational workshop facilitator. He's a serial entrepreneur, and he has been very, very vocal about what is happen. So I really wanted you guys to hear it from his perspective as a black man living in the United States who, in this episode, shares, has had to think about things that I have never, never even crossed my mind. And you'll hear in this episode, it really was an aha moment for me, you know, growing up and, like, going to parties and there were white people and black people and noticing that sometimes my black friends would behave differently when they were at white people's houses. And then this episode really clicked in for me to understand why they were afraid. So this is a really great episode to talk about all of the things that people are diving into right now and understand them. He called us in from Colombia, the country of Colombia. So that is why we are on the Internet. And the sound is not the same as when I recorded in person, but it was such an important conversation. I really wanted you guys to hear it and hear his voice and to just listen, learn from him specifically. So, without further ado, let's welcome Marco to the Highest Self podcast.

Welcome Marco to the Highest Self podcast. It's so great to have you here.

Awesome. So glad to be on this podcast, Lisa.

Long overdue. So the first question that I'd love to ask you is, what makes you your highest self?

For me, it's when I sit in this thought that I have, which is being the creator of my reality. And there's something to that that is so powerful. And I understand that every single situation, every single circumstance that I'm hit with, I have the opportunity to decide exactly not only how I'm responding, but I believe that I'm powerful enough to create and shape the environment around me, too. So that puts me in the probably the most highest place that I can ever be.

I love that. And when all of this happened, you're someone who I'm like, what do you feel? Because you're someone who knows so deeply about yourself from a soul level, from an interpersonal mind level. But you're also. I remember. I don't know if you remember this, but at Summit, we went to that workshop together on black coolness.

Oh, yeah. Yeah.

So I'm like, I know. You're like, you know? And it's so fascinating because right now, what is happening, a lot of people are like, wait, where did this come from? And it's like, no, you've been doing this work for a really, really long time. And you're someone who. You're just so, like, calm and loving. You just, like, exude love. No one could ever even be mad at you because that's just who you are. But you're also telling the truth. You know, you're not holding back. So, you know, the first question I'd really love to ask you for A lot of the white people listening right now, they're feeling attacked. They're feeling like people are making them say sorry for something they never did. They're feeling like, well, that was my ancestors and it wasn't me, so why are you mad at me? Can you speak into how we can actually look at this and overcome this white guilt?

Yeah. Yeah. So there's two things. One part of it is a part of the acknowledgement that I think is a big thing that's missing from both our wonderful president and a large majority of the government. Large majority of people around is just acknowledging that racism even exists. So before we even start talking about, wow, you know, who's to blame, and like, did I create this or did I not create that? It's like, yo, the conversation, if it's not about you, which is what is so beautiful, then why are you taking it personal? That's question number one. Right. Question number two is if you actually acknowledge what has happened and what is created not only from a 400 year history of slavery, and then moving into literally less than 50 years, or 53 years actually, is the total amount it's been 53 years since there is a perceived level of equality that's only driven by law. And then knowing that you live in this environment and understanding that as a citizen of this environment, and as a citizen of this environment, particularly being a white citizen, I have benefited from that system that was built for 450 years to benefit and acknowledge me alone, and actually benefited and created to actually put other people down and put black people, people of color down, then I'm still a part of that system. And the one thing that I think is so interesting, and this actually relates a lot to something that I do in my Creator's Journey workshop, is we talk about the different stories that we create and we talk about biases and generalizations. And the invitation that I have for a lot of people is to think about very simple things. Simple things like a chair. And when you see four legs and you see, you know, a tabletop, you're like, that's a chair. And your mind deposits and says, this is a chair. And across the board, whenever you see something with four legs and a, you know, flat surface, you're not reimagining what that thing is every single time. You're just storing it as a chair. A chair, a chair. So now imagine in this mindset of I'm not racist, or I'm not biased, and I say bullshit. I say, you are, you are inherently. And the beauty is Is that what happens when we think about. And a lot of times a lot of people make this assumption. You think about, I don't know if you've seen the. Posted the pyramid of white supremacy, or you think about racism and you're like, I'm not a Klan member. It's like, okay, cool. You do understand that there are several layers to this. And as a part of those layers, one of the things you get to acknowledge is that 90% of you, that subconscious that may not even be aware of the chair generalization that you have made when you see a black person. And that is a reality. So if you tell me you don't see color, I would tell you you're not a human being, because as a human being, you're automatically creating biases around everything, including yourself.

That is so good. And that's exactly what people think. They think you're either like a hardcore racist or you're a good liberal citizen. And what. You know, so many people from Martin Luther King to even now are.

It's.

It's actually just those neutral liberals who are often the biggest culprit of this because they're the ones who are being neutral about it. They're the ones who are just. It's not bothering me. It's not in my field, so it's not an issue, so they're not speaking out. So right now I'm seeing a lot of tension. A lot of people who feel like for a long time they haven't been listened to. They feel like, you know, we've been rapping, we've been marching, we've been protesting, we've been hashtagging, and you haven't listened. And now, George Floyd, really being the last straw on the camel's back is like, finally, you're. You're listening.

Yeah.

How do you think we can take this. This anger and rage that is rightfully there and actually construct it towards something that is beneficial to last?

Yeah. Yeah. Well, I mean, I think there's a number of different ways that you approach it, and luckily there's no one way to skin a cat. So there's. It's going to take a diverse set of approaches. Everything from, you know, my. My wonderful world of like, you know, starting off with being is something that's interesting because what I like to preface is when I talk about being, it doesn't mean there's no doing that happens afterwards, but it does mean that if the doing happens without the being being there, then it's just gonna be lip service. Right. It's gonna be, oh, yeah, you know, we locked up these cops. Are you guys happy? Now can we move on? And that being doesn't change. So there is first, starting off again, just repeating back with that acknowledgement of a country and a leadership and Trump in particular. And if he's unwilling to acknowledge this, then I'm just gonna say right now, just straight up, it's like, he should not be able to live out the last five months of this term. It's like, we need a leadership change. If that. Literally, right now, the only thing he's able to acknowledge is acknowledging how he needs to create more martial law on people that are protesting and not even treating the actual disease. Looking at a symptom, which. Let's not even get into how legitimate or illegitimate that symptom is. But, but there's. So there's that first step of acknowledgement as a nation, and everybody, the people that you just even mentioned as a white person wondering like, well, I'm, you know, I'm not a part of this problem, or if I hear another person saying, well, I'm, you know, I'm not racist, is acknowledge the privilege that you have, acknowledge the experience that you have, and acknowledge my experience and acknowledge the difference in that experience. And after we move past that acknowledgement, then a lot of the action starts becoming really fucking clear. It's like, so the easiest way that I start thinking about is, I imagine this race, right? And you started off in a race and you were doing a race around the world, and Somebody else started 400 miles ahead of me. And then they said, okay, cool, now you're free to go. You can go ahead and start the race as well. But they gave you some raggedy shoes. They put a bunch of obstacles in your way. And then they're like, well, I mean, everybody's racing now. It's all equal. It's like, no, I'm 400 miles behind. And in order for you to actually create a balance in that, you have to treat that black body the same way that you treat a sick part of your body, right? Like, you wouldn't just continually treat your entire body the same way. If, as I told you, I have a pain in my stomach, I'm not just going to ignore it. I'm not just going to say, well, you know, all body parts are equal, so I don't need to do anything to it. I'm actually going to pay special attention to it. So that special attention means special economic attention, special educational attention, special legal attention means special attention across every single facet. Of this organization because this entire system has been built in a racist context.

Woo Marco for president. Yes, please run, please. But it's so interesting because, you know, I grew up as like a person of color and my dad is extremely like Malcolm X. And so I grew up always being like, black people need reparations. They built this country. They built the White House, they built everything. They were not paid. They need reparations. They need money going into the school systems. They. They need to. And. And this is what gets me angry is when people are like, well, all lives matter. And they just negate the experience. And then, and then they draw comp of. Well, in Australia, we have the aborigines and we just had a sorry day where we all just said, I'm sorry and they're not mad at us anymore. Those to be the same thing. So it's like, how can we get people to like, understand just the setbacks that, you know, a black person has? And then also I think people then say, well, what about Oprah? What about this one? What about Barack Obama? He made it. And then they make that up and he can do it, then how come all of you guys are doing it?

Yeah, yeah. So there's actually two things that, that brings up for me, and this is something very personal to me because I think that as I started posting about this, I realized I'm like, oh, yeah, you know what? I have a lot of white friends. I have white investors, I have white, like, colleagues. And the, like that look at me and do the same thing as the Oprah thing. Well, you know, look at Marco like, you know this and he did that. And I'm like, oh, wow, y' all have absolutely no idea you what my experience is. And that's, that's the thing that's so amazing. So there's. There's two things that you get to understand. You get to understand. One, the continual experience that I have, right? The experience that I had growing up of kids telling me that they're going to kill me because I'm a nick, right? Of people literally telling me I'm going to grow up as a drug addict, like, labeling me continually. So when you, when you see the success in spite of it doesn't mean that those things are not there. And it doesn't mean that something that I realized just during this process that was so crazy to me, and it came from an interview that I had yesterday when we were talking about normal discrimination, right? And it made me realize I was like, you know, what's so Crazy is I count the number of times that I have had the encounters with the clan level discrimination in my life. And then I absolutely take for granted the amount of time that I spend in my day recognizing and knowing that as a black person. Here are the things that I can and cannot do. Here are the things that somebody is already assuming about me. Here are the places that I can and cannot go. Here's the fear that I feel when a police officer is pulling me over. It's like all of those things that are just a part of my day and that. And it's normalized to the place where I'm like, oh, wow. Like, we accept that as just being a thing of like, well, I'm black, right? And that. That in and of itself is. Is something that people get to recognize is there is very similar to what we were talking about, about the scales of racism, right? There is this extreme up here and then there's this reality part of like, well, you know, what has Oprah's experience then? What has my experience been? What has Obama's experience been? Obama became president and got questions whether or not he was even a US Citizen. We do above and beyond and yet instill the barriers, the judgment, the viewpoint on us is still coming through the same lens.

So accurate. And to me it's so fascinating how someone could even think that way, could even look at someone and think that they are worse than them. And again, there's so many levels to it. But I'd like to talk about that, like, liberal person who thinks they're a good person, the Amy Cooper, you know. Did you see that video of Amy Cooper?

No, I didn't actually.

So it was this woman in Central park on Memorial Day, like last week, and she was in Central Park.

Yeah, yeah.

And basically there is this guy bird watching. Okay. He happens to be black. And she has her dog who's like, you know, a very energetic dog. And he's like, can you put your dog on a leash? It's like a lot. You're in Central Park. And she basically was like, I'm going to call the police and tell them an African American person is threatening me. And was so angry that he told her to put your dog on a leash. That she instantly knew. And she probably voted for Obama. And she probably, you know, is like an Upper west side yoga, whatever, green juice person. And in that moment that she felt not even threatened, but angry that someone put her in her place, she was like, oh, but you're black. So I know that I can use that against you. How often do you see these short little microaggressions happening in our daily society?

Oh, man. I mean, it's happening all the time. Like, you think about, if I were to just absorb and imagine somebody sitting in a position of power, right? It's like, you don't wake up one day in your position of power and say, you know what? This is unfair. I should give up some of my power, right? So imagine that gift. Imagine the ability of being able to throw around your whiteness as a card that you can use to get yourself out of bad situations, to exert superiority over somebody else. And that ability becomes something that you are using whether you're conscious of it or not. It's like. I mean, quite honestly, it's a very similar thing to any personality trait that I could have, right? Like, I know I'm like, oh, you know, I'm relatively, like, gregarious and charming person. So when I think about an average situation and I'm competing against somebody else, I'm like, well, you know, my charm is a skill that I can use to support me in this situation. So I don't have the ability to say my whiteness is a skill that I can use. I'm like, actually, my blackness is always starting me back. It's like I walk in knowing, like, you know, I'm already five steps back. And something that's actually brought me. Brought up for me when you mention that is you're familiar with Emmett Till.

Emmett Till, yes.

Yes. So it reminded me of this scenario. And just for people that are listening, Emmett Till was a young boy. I think he was, golly, like 12 years old or something. They get accused of basically this white girl who was in elevator with him. Like, she yells or whatever. And apparently they say that he raped her. Obviously, none of this was true. They end up, you know, killing him. A whole clan of white people come, and it becomes this just massive thing, obviously, just false, false accusation. And this was something that culturally was done a lot of, like, this big, scary black man who's coming to rape our white women was literally a part of the birth of a nation, a part of so much in media. So there was a time where just to get into the mentality of this, I was actually in Thailand at the time, and we had this. You know, we had a table, me and a bunch of my friends. And there's this white girl who. Her and her boyfriend, like, came and they were coming hanging out with us, and they got way too drunk, right? He ended up leaving her and now she's insanely drunk and we're ready to leave the club. And I'm having this moment of she's here by herself in this foreign country, right? And she doesn't have anybody looking out for her. I don't want anything bad to happen to her, but through my mind is running. What is it going to look like if I try to help her, if I try to support her right now? And what if I try to help her and then something bad happens and then she claims that I did something to her. So in that moment I made the decision that I'm like, yo, like, my intention is good. I can't consciously sit here and allow that fear to keep me from acting and my own good intention. But just taking a moment and just thinking about that from a mentality standpoint, I know I have no bad intention. I know that I'm here to support. I know that I'm here to help. And I'm questioning whether or not my help is going to put my life in danger.

Oh, what a story.

That's something that you as a, as a white male wouldn't have to think about. Wouldn't even be thinking a second. I'm going to help, I'm going to support. It's like, and these are the thoughts that run because I know not only what happens from a legal standpoint, but what happens from a media standpoint. So that you got to think about this is that media wide, right? I travel to a lot of places where people have never even met a black person. And then the only perception they have of a black person is something that is definitely not a good image. Oftentimes it's, oftentimes it is the criminal, it is the rapist, it is the that, that energy. So regardless of how I am showing up, that's how I end up being interpreted. And I end up having to unwork that mentality on a daily basis.

What do you think of kind of this, like, modern movement? To be like, I love black people. Like, I love their music and I love their movies and I love their sports. And to show you're not a racist, similar to the black coolness, to almost like use it like tokenism. To be like, look, I have this black friend, look at me. Like, for example, there was this girl, girl on Instagram and she didn't post anything about blm, like the entire week. And people are like, why aren't you posting this? And then she posts a picture of her and her black friend. She's like, look, I'm not A racist. As if, like, that's enough. So what do you think about this tokenism fetishizing black culture?

I mean, this has been done since the beginning of time, right? Like, so, you know, wonderful. Trump has his, his, my African American that he does and he finds black people, he's like, hey, you know, I get to black person here because like Candace Owens. Yeah, yeah. It's like, we're we. Which is the interesting theme and something that I was just talking with my family about is this concept that like, we're all just this one monolithic voice. You're friends with one of us, you're friends with everybody. Like, how many people have asked me, like, Marco, like, what would you do about this racial issue? Like, my white friends are like, well, you know, speaking on behalf of all black America, here's what I think, or.

I'm on calls and they're like, what do they want? It's like a translation. It is crazy. But it's just because they typically only have one token black friend, they don't know that. It's. It's just like we think of Asians are all Chinese. It's the same thing.

Yeah, yeah, yeah. Thinking. Thinking that one person speaks for an entire race and then also thinking that somebody's like an individual changes what your role is in racism. Right. And I think this is, again, I'll just go back to the same thing I said before, is that if you understand that pyramid of racism, everything from indifference to marginalization to discrimination to all of those layers, I would argue that I would find it hard to find an individual that can actually claim that they're not racist. Right. And one of the things that I would offer because I do this in my creator's journey, it's like, that's not then meant to be. Like, all right, now you're a bad person. It's as much as it is to be like, acknowledge and understand that. Gain awareness around your own bias. Gain awareness around the way that you treat somebody differently based on the color of their skin and then understand, well, what are those assumptions and what are the different stories that I'm making about that person and are those assumptions and stories that are actually lined up with my values and if they're not, then you got to throw them shits away. And if you are not even willing to investigate your own biases, then this is like the thing that, you know, we do and both like, your highest self, like, is like, all of this stuff is like, these are all self work issues at the end of the Day just so happens to be centered around racism. But I spend all day talking to people about the stories they generate and the things that they're not aware of that they're walking around living in. Because 90 of them is living from their subconscious. And they got this little 10% that their surface area, they're like, I'm aware of this. And they're not even aware half the time of what is truly going on in their actions, in their mind and their thoughts, in their ways of being.

Here's what it is. People only want to do work that they think will benefit them directly. And them dismantling their racism doesn't benefit them directly if they're not. So they don't want to look at that. You know, if you say white privilege, they're like, I'm not a racist. I'm good in that area instead of actually looking into it. Whereas if you tell them, how do I manifest more money? Sure, they'll do every work.

Yeah, every workshop. You know, it's funny you bring that up, because I think this is something that a lot of people get to understand from an historical standpoint and a very human standpoint around this. And I think this highlights a lot of what's happening on both the black and the white side of this. And then as an overall society, imagine for 400 years, right, you have been one way. Let's just take the picture of the super racist, you know, clan member, right? I'm the ultra racist clan member. And then I go down that scale of I'm the ultra racist clan member, I'm the person who supports an ultra racist clan member. I'm the person who discriminates, I'm the person who's indifferent, whatever that is. When a civil rights act passed, the law did not suddenly infiltrate your stories, didn't suddenly infiltrate your beliefs. So that that act passed. And based on a variety of different responses you might have made, one might have been the tortured genius response, which is like, if these people would just listen to me, they should have never passed that law. So you just doubled down on your racism. And then what do you think you taught your children, who are my peers, Our parents were the generation that was going through this very thing, and we are one generation removed. And then we wonder, well, what do you mean, racism? Still? I'm like, what the fuck do you think? And then flip that on the other side of for 400 years, you have been told that your life, literally, legally, did not matter. What stories are you teaching? You're teaching stories of fear. You're teaching stories of, you're not going to be the same person as this other person. You're not going to have the same values. Matter of fact, you need to watch yourself because you might get killed if you speak in the wrong way. And then all of a sudden a law passes and you think you sprung up with all the most confidence in the world. You and I both know how much time we spend trying to support people in changing habits they want to change, let alone the ones that don't want to, let alone, like, if you are a racist, if you are a discriminator, if you are anything. And you didn't go to, you know, Sahara's course or one of my courses to work on that. You didn't just suddenly shift. You continue to tell those same stories. And you were in a multitude of positions of power at that time. You didn't uproot yourself from power. The law didn't say, well, now you're not allowed to be in power now. You're not allowed to have your wealth. You continue to have wealth. You continue to have political influence. You continue to have every single thing that you benefited from in that system. And now just the law changing might have changed your language for a moment 100%.

And the 60s are not that long ago. We're still listening to the Beatles. What was happening during that time? That was the first time a black person could drink out of the same fucking water fountain.

Yep.

Sit in the same area of the bus. That was the same. Let's talk about Marilyn Monroe. There was legal segregation at that same time. That was not that long ago. Our grandparents were alive for that. So it's like, we just think it's like this far removed, thousands of years, and then we do comparison. So this is what I say. Well, I'm Jewish, so my ancestors suffered from the Holocaust, or they did this. So I know what discrimination is like. So I. So I don't have any prejudice or racism. And I think people have a really hard time to understand that, yes, the Holocaust happened. Yes, racism to Hispanic and Mexican people, to Middle Eastern people and all these things. But I don't know why people have such a hard time to just focus on black lives right now.

So you want to know why? Because we're actually living in a system where the context is that black lives don't matter. So what's happening subconsciously is that topic in and of itself is not allowed to be talked about. It becomes taboo immediately. We weren't allowed to talk about our own oppression. Right. This shit Right here is so much of a mirror to 19 freaking 68. Six days before the Civil Rights act was passed and we were literally getting beaten and killed in the streets out here protesting MLK's assassination. And we are now having the same exact thing happen. Same exact thing happen as your voice is being silenced. And it is not okay for you to talk about it because it's not a big deal. Just like it wasn't a big deal when we were literally being lynched. And it was for fun. It was a celebration. Allow that to settle in for a moment of not only a people that are being oppressed, but it wasn't just your black life didn't matter. We celebrated your death. And what happens is that mentality continues to get passed on. And you tell me that I as if I'm speaking from a business person. I had a business that I ran for 400 years with a set of mission statements and a set of core values. And one day I changed them. But I didn't change any of the employees, I didn't change any of the business. I didn't change much of anything other than just we'll just change some of the words and then I expect that there's going to be this immediate change. Matter of fact, I probably am going to think I probably just need to start a new business because this business is so cancerous right now and so many people already believe that thing that I was telling them for 400 years that it's probably easier for me to just fucking start over. Just allow that. Like I love using very simple metaphors of things that people do on a continual basis to understand. Like this is not some far fetched thing that is so unique to racism. Like just think about how you try to change values in your own company. And now imagine trying to change values of a country and how quick that's going to be. Be fucking patient. Be patient on all sides.

I know this episode is good, but.

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And that's why I love that I reshared the systemic racism video that you put up. And I was shocked by how many people were like, wait, do they teach this in schools? I had no idea.

Yep, yep. Because the system is built to support the silencing of that. And that's, that's the problem and the reason why there's such a beautiful opportunity for these types of conversations and my invitation for everybody when they're dating in because just to, just to be clear, like, I have the side of me, right, that gets very fucking angry about all of this. And just imagining for a moment I'm like, I'm coming from a place of having superseded and achieved things that I'm not supposed to achieve, of being in rooms where I am constantly the only person in this room because I'm sitting in a top 1% of whatever it is that I'm doing in the nation. And yet, and still the experiences that I have had caused me to feel rage where I'm just like, yo, like, fuck this. Like, this is. This is fucked up. So imagine if I wasn't in an empowered position, how pissed off I would feel because I was actually born into a context that was a little bit different, right? So my context came with the context of parents and grandparents letting me know how things are going to be for me and how different things are going to be for me. But also a context of a grandfather who was a black general in the military at a time when he couldn't even eat the same places that his officers could eat in. But he managed to supersede things. So what he passed down to me and my lineage and my family was a story of empowerment. And not everybody got that story of empowerment. They only got the side of, you're not going to be as valuable and you're going to be discriminated against and you're going to be put down. And, you know, you gotta, you gotta watch yourself because white man is out there to continually get you. And if you don't marry that with the empowerment of. Yes. And you can do things despite that. Then you wonder what happens. And we. We know this so well from talking about the stories that people created. Imagine now what gets passed on generationally, on both sides. A empowerment and superiority mindset and a not good enough mindset. And what does that continue to create?

And I think that is so important for people to see. You, who your career, everything you do is doing personal development, and you still feel that rage. Imagine someone who's been completely in the system, who's still in the system, who's never actually met, you know, someone who loves them. You know, I was watching the Malcolm X documentary, and when Malcolm X was in jail, the person who was his mentor was like, he said, all white people are the devil. Which we would be like, oh, that is so not true. But it made sense why he would think that, because his only experiences with white people at that time of segregation were them being extremely cruel to them. So look at the stories that we can create around someone that we don't know.

Yeah. And that's. And it's so beautiful because I think when you. When you start looking at those things, from implicit bias to the way that the mind creates generalization to the stories that we tell and pass on, a lot of this stuff doesn't become such a big surprise. It's not like, oh, my. Oh, my. Oh, my word. I can't imagine how this is happening. You're like, I can't imagine how it wouldn't be happening with what position we have placed and with how much. Not only have we ignored this problem because we. You know, I talk about this a lot about parts of yourself, and I love thinking about all of us as parts of this human body. Right. And just imagining again, you know, that one part of yourself that has been screaming for attention. Right. Continually, and has been yelling out what, you know, Al Sharpton did this yesterday, yelling out, get your knee off my neck. Right? And keeps yelling and keeps yelling and keeps yelling. How frustrated does that individual become? And that whole concept of what you resist persists, like, plays out on a larger level in a physical manifestation of you are literally resisting this as ever, even really being an issue. You've addressed it just by saying, we changed the law. Why isn't that good enough for y'? All? Why aren't y', all, you know, happy and just being quiet about the fact that actually what we did is shifted a few laws to allow ourselves to have four times the amount of enslaved black males than we had during slavery. We just changed the Fucking form of it. We changed the face of it so we could still continue to do the same thing, but maybe appease you by saying, well, you know, it's because they're criminals, but it's also because they're criminals because of the system that we set up to make sure that they weren't criminals. The system we set up to ensure that they couldn't even get out of jail. The system we set up to make sure that they wouldn't even have a fair shake. But now we just put a new.

Face on it, 100%. A new face on. You know, the slave owners, in a way, are behaving like some of the police right now, you know, using the same exact tactics that they would have used to make a black man, you know, succumb to them. Is what they're doing in the police force just this. This eight. The eight things that they're trying to pass right now. Did you see this law that they're trying to do, like, eight things that officers have to have to obey.

Oh, yeah, yeah.

And one of them is like, don't put people into chokeholds. Like, dude, like, tell people before you shoot them. Wasn't a thing before that.

Wasn't a thing. Yeah, yeah, yeah. They can do whatever they want. And it is sickening. And I think the thing that the invitation I would have for people that are sitting in the position of either I'm confused or, you know, I don't understand, or, you know, why is this such a big deal? It would be very similar to something that I talk about with my analogy I use about the sky is green, right? When, you know, somebody says the sky is green, and then you just say the sky is blue. And you guys just endlessly go back and forth, and no matter how many times you tell them the sky is blue, they're not suddenly just going to see the sky is being green for them. Their experience is the sky is green. So until you acknowledge the fact that to you the sky is green. Tell me more about that. You can't even fucking begin a conversation. So when you're walking around saying, well, you know, I'm not experiencing this, or I don't understand, it doesn't invalidate my experience. It doesn't invalidate the people that are marching's experiences. You're having that experience. And what's so interesting is even. Let's just take it even one step further. If you just thought we were fucking crazy and you were like, yeah, you know, they're just. Racism is all in their Head. I'd be like, well, what do you do to your grandma that gets Alzheimer's? Like, do you dismiss her and just say, she doesn't have a disease, she doesn't have a problem. It doesn't exist? No, you still pay attention to it. So in every single version of this, from the, like, extreme disbelief to the ability to decide to understand, the only option you have other than understanding and supporting is to literally be against it. When you sit in there, you start realizing, go, wait a second. So me sitting in my silence, me sitting in my disbelief is literally as powerful as the person who is saying, blatantly, I do not like your black skin. Because they are denying the ability for me to have my experience, my experience to even be valid, for it to even exist, and denying the ability for me to be cared for as a human being in this race where you would say, well, wow, Marco's having that experience. What can we do to help? That's the only question you should be asking.

Yeah, the racial gaslighting, you know, it's. It's so real. Like, the people who are like, well, to play devil's advocate, what if. Or like, oh, well, I don't think it's that bad. Or maybe it's just a joke or doing something to make you feel like your experience is not valid.

Valid, yeah.

And I see that happening so much, probably subconscious, and they don't realize how fucking bad it hurts.

Oh, oh, oh. I think you said this perfectly. It's like, I go through the process of coaching people to absorb their emotionality and everything, and I've still had conversations where I've been, like, on my verge of like, yo, if you ask me one more fucking question about this, I don't know if we're allowed to curse.

But they're like, marco, black friend, please tell us why all lives don't matter. I don't get it. Do I not matter?

Yeah. Yeah. I'm like, yo, this is so crazy. And it's like, I. I make it akin to, like, you walking into. I posted this earlier. I was like, it's like you walking into, like, a history class and, like, yelling at the history teacher, being like, why aren't you teaching math? He's like, because this is a history class. I'm like, yeah, I'm confused. Like, what is. What does one have to do with the other? There was no. There's no statement we're paying attention to. This part of our human body invalidates all the other problems. So you just saying, like, well, what about aids? Or what about poverty? Or what about this? It's like, yeah, those are problems as well. Thank you for reminding us of that. Okay, moving back to what our subject was, I don't see how the two are correlated at all. So in the thing that gets to happen for people is also, and this is the part that I think is so important is like, other than this idea of us, you, me, everyone walking around trying to teach and train people, there is this internal awareness and internal responsibility that you get to have of like, yo, before you speak for a moment, like, think about the intention of what you're saying. What is your intention? Because if I'm sitting here saying I have this problem and then you're like, well, but is it really a problem? What intention is that? Yeah, what is the intention of that? It's not an intention of support, is an intention of literally invalidation.

Yep.

That is the most human basic thing that doesn't have shit to do with race or not is you walking to somebody and expecting to create a forward meaning meaningful and connective conversation from them that starts off with invalidating their experience.

I see this so much. I see this so much. It's like, Well, I, I'm 1 16th Native American and da da, da, da. And it's like, what are you here to prove? And then, and then it's like all of this energy that we're also spending on just fighting with each other instead of remembering the cause. It's just like everything is just getting so lost into the semantics and, and the call out culture. And I get it and I know that a lot of people's intentions, even maybe in doing so could be good. But it's just all this energy that we're wasting. And if we waste the energy, then we're not going to push this movement forward. We're all going to get tired, we're going to get fatigued, we're going to get worn out and it's not going to move forward. And one thing that I think is so important is just to human, the cause and how we can humanize it is when you have a friend that, that is black. And what I'm realizing is that most people, their friend groups are only people that look like them. And it's interesting because for me, like, remember our crew at Summit, it was like, me, you like an Indian girl, Puerto Rican girl. It was like the United Nations. Yes. And I'm like, I feel like maybe because I'm a person of color, maybe because I've just been around, like that's Just always been my reality. But then I see other groups of friends that every single person is white. Like, the Italian girl is, like, the person of color for. For them. So why do you think there still is so much discrimination in friend groups and on both ways? Because I know what they say is, well, they don't want to be friends with us.

Wow. Yeah. Again, it's just back to what we were talking about, right? And you've created an entire system that's been built around that separation, been built around that inequality. And what's. What's interesting to me that you just mentioned is I sometimes forget, like, what the world looks like and what our nation looks like, because I'm in, you know, spending my time in the most liberal state in the world in California. And it's like, yeah, you know, people love each other, and we're. We're all sort of this one melting pot. And then I did something like a few days ago, I pulled up the MAGA hashtag, and it was literally this whole world of people creating memes, Right? And I was like, oh, wow. Yeah, they do memes just like we do. It's like, oh, but they're creating memes about shooting looters. Like, there's this. There was this one meme with this guy being like, I set up my looter trap. I put my electronics out my front door, and I'm waiting for the looters to come. Like, literally perpetuating, not only encouraging violence, but trying to create it. Like, I'm going to create a trap so that I can have an excuse to use my ar. Why? Because I believe that I need to rid the world of these people. Look at the messaging behind it. So now when we start talking about the subcultures that exist and continue to exist, and not only the overt racism, but the racism and the continual stereotypes, they get perpetuated through our media. They get perpetuated through our education system. Right. And you don't have to look too much further than I posted the Dahl test earlier today. And I know you've seen that it's like those implicit biases that we create that then shape our actions because our beliefs shape our responses. So even. Even that concept of, like, you know, I can separate myself from this black culture and from this black society, and I can decide that, well, I believe that, you know, they don't want to be friends with me or whatever. It's like, well, yeah, you. You create that, and whatever you believe, that's what's going to be. So that's what you're creating. That's what you're continually creating, because you're continually creating separation. And we are running around creating that separation instead of creating the conversation. And that's why I love right now, because the conversation is so fucking loud that the people that don't even want to talk about it are hearing it.

And the people who don't want to talk about it are, in a way, being called out for not wanting to talk about it. Which is beautiful, because we're saying, you don't get to sit this one.

No, no. And, you know, that's actually something I do want to bring up, is that this whole scenario also taught me something, and it taught me that in my own pursuit of. Which is something that I created. Like, there's a story that I created, which is that I don't walk around thinking, you know, I'm Marco, the black entrepreneur, right? Because if I do that, then I'm going to associate it to all the things that I can't do and all the things that, you know, people are going to judge me for and all this other stuff. So my own level of protection for me was like, I don't walk around thinking that, because if I think that, it's only going to continue to draw what I believe is the opposite of what my results are that I'm desiring, right? But in the process of doing that, what I also done is I've allowed myself to disconnect from that experience and disconnect and essentially. Essentially numb myself to that experience. Because as it's happening, I'm like, yeah, you know, that's just. That's just what happens. It's like, but moving on, but moving on, but moving on. And then I realized that the people around me, I'm like, oh, y'. All. Y' all don't even know about this experience because I don't talk about it normally, right? And I'm like. And I have all these experiences that I could tell you about my life and about growing up and about my daily interactions that are. It's. It's not meant to be. Like, I put it on blast so that. That everyone can say, oh, what was me, Marco? It's like. But you're not even made aware of it because all you see is my success. And then all of a sudden, I have friends that think, like, you know, Marco must not experience racism. I'm like, oh, no, I'm sorry you thought that way. My bad for misleading you.

There's no racism. Marco made it.

Yeah. I was like, because, you know, it's actually interesting because in my, in my course, there's actually a session that I do that it moves from this whole concept of you being the creator of your reality. And then it starts talking about energetic momentum. And when I speak into energetic momentum, I start talking about your environment, I start talking about the people around you, I start talking about the city and the energy that's happening in that city that actually creates this gap between just claiming and manifesting. Right. I'm like, well, you know, if you could just claim and manifest, why can't you just, like, sprout wings right now? I'm like, well, because there's a lot of energetic momentum that is things like gravity and like all these other things that are keeping you from just sprouting wings. Like in the same. There's a reason why when you wanted to go to California in 2000 and pass a gay marriage law and you want to go to Texas and in 2000 pass a gay marriage law, there's more energetic momentum towards California being open to that than Texas. Right. So no matter how much you willed it to be, it was going to be harder for you to create that result in Texas. Right. So what I am saying and bringing that up, it's not that it's ever impossible for me to create the circumstances and create the types of results that I've created, but it's been a hell of a lot harder because there's a hell of a lot of energetic momentum that is actually put against me and against what I'm creating and what I'm standing for.

And even the energetic momentum of this time right now of, like, us protesting, us going out, this is. We can use this energetic momentum to pass the laws, to get Trump impeached, to defund the police, which doesn't mean no police ever, but it means retrain the police and reset up the police system. And what I see, and this is from a lot of spiritual people, is, well, I don't want to play into victimhood. And they label this, you know, the spiritual bypass of they're playing into the victimhood. They keep telling themselves something that happened in the past past and negating the fact that we have to go into what happened in the past to create the energetic momentum for a better future. So what do you say as like, someone who's like a deep coach and a black man of when people are like, well, I don't want to play into the victimhood.

Yeah. I say, then you're not really standing for what you are saying. You stand for. If you're standing for the love, you're standing for the harmony of this nation and of this body, then we get to follow the being with doing, with actual action, right? Like, if all we're doing is running around saying, like, well, I'm, you know, I'm sending you good vibes. I'm like, well, right now there's literally somebody holding a gun to my head. I would appreciate it if you could call the police instead of sending me good vibes. I appreciate it if you could help me out instead of just sending me good vibes. I'm like, so that is something very similar to what I oftentimes call. It's very similar to like, faith without works, right? It's like this idea that we, through our sheer willpower, are going to change things in the world without creating action. And I must say, like, you know, no offense to anybody. Actually, no, I'm not. I'm not even gonna say that. Actual, actual offense to anybody that is thinking in this way where you're sitting in your high and mighty, like, I am so spiritual or I am so religious or I'm so whatever that like, I don't need to create any action in this scenario. Like, that's. That's bullshit. And that, that is what we do in our entire lives is like, we, we follow this thing. And I call it like responsibility plus belief plus willingness, right? It's. It's the responsibility for us to take ownership for the environment that's happening around us. The belief that we actually can change that environment, and then the willingness to do and be the types of people we need to be and the types of things we need to do in order to affect the. I am, right? But all of this shit, even, even that thought process of like, well, I meditate, I meditate, I'm doing in order to calm myself down peacefully. So I'm still creating that call for action and alerting or, or noticing and being aware of a victimization is not you feeding into it. That's the same, same exact thing of what we talk about, about accepting all parts of ourselves, right? Like, accepting my anger doesn't suddenly make me more angry. It makes me become friends with my anger, right? And I understand that anger, but if I avoid it, then it becomes just like a phobia. It's something that I am literally so. It's so toxic and like, oh, get that bad energy away from me that I effectively and ineffective at ever shifting that energy. I'm just running around in this bubble of protection that I believe I've created. And I'm not actually dealing with real life.

And here's where I think a lot of the law of attraction, you know, books or whatever are harmful because it tells you, well, if you don't want to think about it, then if you don't think about it, it won't happen. And I had Marianne Williamson on the podcast who's like a spiritual politician, and she was like, so if your neighbor was beating up their kid and you knew about it, but you said, well, I'm going to put that in my frequencies, does that make him stop beating up his child? And. And it's so important for us to realize, like, yes, we are spiritual beings. We're so. We're all one. All of our souls are connected and we're in physical bodies here on this earthly plane here too. If you weren't meant to be in a physical body, you would not be in blood.

You wouldn't be in it. Yo. You know, it's so funny. I actually was joking about this with Anna because I was like, anna, just. Just think about this for a moment because, you know, we live very much in this space of understanding our infinite power and then also understanding our human experience. And I always call it, like, the way I think about it. Let's say I play the game of life hard, as if my life depends on it, all the while knowing that it doesn't, right? So there is this duality of infinite connection to all. But then there's also this very real identity that a Marco only exists in my limitation. It only exists in my physical form. The moment that I am connected to all things, and I am all things, and I'm just this. I'm one. Like, I literally imagine you just collapsing like a black hole. Like, if you ever achieve that, you would just cease to exist. Because our sheer human existence is built around those limitations. It's built around this wonderful contrast between our infinite power and this physical form that I am here to exude and exert. That infinite power through that is a conduit for that power. So if I sit in only here and I'm thinking, well, I'm just going to will things into existence, I'd be like, well, you're missing the point. Like, we literally were given a physical form so we could physically exert things and physically exist.

And I think it's our lack of understanding and having experience in sitting into our more shadowy emotions, our anger, our sadness, that we feel like if I give into it, I will lose myself to it. If I feel the anger I'll never be able to come out of. If I feel the sadness, I'll become just depressed. So I rather just pretend it doesn't exist because it does create a better reality to me in the immediate, you know, but it's not real. It's fantasy, you know, it's mental masturbation. You can think about it that way. It's. It's not true. So what tools do you have for people to explore their anger but also be a channel for it so they don't get stuck in it forever either?

Yeah, yeah. I mean, one thing that we actually do, we call this polarity collapsing. And it's a really far out way to think about it. So I might suggest that if anyone's in that position to start off first with just letting it be, letting your anger exist. And the interesting thing about presence, right, is that oftentimes what we think when we imagine presence is, we imagine this stoic monk who's like, he's unaffected by anything. And I remember practicing in my vipassana in Thailand with a bunch of monks, and we actually had an opportunity prior to vipassana, starting to talk about some of this stuff. And they spoke about the fact that they're like, yeah, I feel all the emotions that anybody else feels. It's like, it's just that I'm in control of how I act with those emotions. So when we accept the fact that there is no good, bad, right, wrong emotion, we just allow ourselves to be. We allow ourselves to be like a baby, right? And like, like a baby. And I love that thought process of, you know, baby smashes their, you know, head onto a wall and, and they move on, they release it, right? When we, when we deny ourselves the opportunity to be in our emotional state because we've labeled a certain emotion as being bad, then we're going to continually label ourselves as being bad for even feeling that emotion. And then we'll continue to create more energy and bubble that thing up. So I say let that shit out. And after you let that shit out, then start loving it, like, and literally being like, you know what? I love this. I love this feeling. I love the feeling of anger. I love my. I love that I even have the ability to feel that, right? And in that, what happens is this beautiful thing where the energy that is repelling you from this, that is making you ashamed that you feel anger, that is making you want to repel or quiet, that anger suddenly starts moving because the brain doesn't fucking understand the difference between you saying you love Anger or you love happiness, starts saying, okay, cool. So anger's okay, right? And then all of a sudden when you feel the anger, it's like, I see you. Anger. I see you. I love you, I love you. And I can become somebody that can embody that anger and still embody that love.

So good. And I love how you brought up. You know, when we think about spirituality, we think about that monk and he must not have any emotions. He must be like totally happy all the time. And that even being a symbol of spirituality in our modern world of like completely non attached to anything. And so if you're reacting to things happening, if you have a response, yeah, you must not be spiritual. And then also there's the warrior path. You know, I know you were training in Thailand and like martial arts and stuff. And like that is also a spiritual practice. So let's look about the other side of spirituality, the shaking, you know, the trans dance, like this side that is just much more yang and explosive and uncontrollable. And our society is so afraid of it because we want to control things. And someone who's sitting and quiet, it. I can control that. I don't know what they're, I don't know what they're doing. I mean, it wasn't that long ago that even meditation was deemed as satanic. And probably a lot of people still think it is, but we still haven't been able to go to the other side of spirituality, which is me yelling and being free. And that is actually the more indigenous side, the African side. Like that side of it. We're, we're only taking this one Asian side. And even these Asian sides have those other practices, but we've cut them all out. So it's like, like we're deepening our understanding of what it means to be a spiritual person. When we are realizing that, oh, me protesting and marching and screaming at the top of my lungs to protect my children and my future generations is the most spiritual thing that I.

Spiritual thing, need to do right now. Powerfully spiritual. And that's, that's the part when we match up our responsibility with our intentional action, right? It's like I am aware of what's happening. I am aware of the power that I have. I am taking responsibility and ownership for my ability to choose how I'm going to respond right now. And my intentional action is to create change and is to create change in a very tangible way. And I think the thing that we get to understand is every single part of this process is going to play A role, right? It's like, there's. There's going to be the part of this that is spiritual healing. There's going to be the part of this that is actual legal, like, legislation being passed. It's going to be a part of this that is people and people coming together. There's going to be. Part of this is going to be economic healing. But every single one of them is necessary. And that's. And that's the one thing, too, that I would invite people to do and to understand because I oftentimes another thing that I'll see and divide is people, like, telling you, like, how you're supposed to protest or something. Yeah, like what the.

Or that the way that you're doing it is incorrect because they're passionate about doing it another way. It's like, hello, let's all focus on the oppressor here or someone beating us up. Let's focus on that.

I'm like, yo, we're really diverting energy from somebody. And like, somebody pops up and you're like, well, I didn't see you say anything about black lives last week. Why are we putting energy into that? Why? Like, why? Because, you know, you know, so crazy is I was telling out of this was like, you know, the beautiful part, you see all these corporations popping up, right? And they're all like, you know, I'm building in $100 million because Black lives matter. Here's the one interesting thing. I actually don't even give a fuck if they believe it or not, because what's happening is you have a energetic momentum that now has made potentially, for a moment, caring about black lives popular, which then allows us to continue to create a narrative that just might allow the black narrative to benefit for a fucking moment of the same benefit that the white narrative has had for an entire freaking several generations, is that if my media dollars now benefit me to stay in the white narrative, I continue to do that. But if my media dollars benefit me to play up the black mirror, then I might actually change the way I produce media. I don't care how it happens. If it happens that way, then the beautiful thing about the wealth of the wicked being stored up for the righteous is this concept of like, people can literally, through negative intention, still actually create the type of momentum we need to start developing change.

Well, because we can, you know, take Google's money and then someone else that might have the ideas but not the money can link up and then someone that's with the kids. So it's like, that's the Beautiful thing that there's so many aspects of activism, and we get to give in the ways that we can. So maybe you have a lot of money and not a lot of time, and that's how you can give. And there's people who are the opposite. So, I mean, in an ideal world, and eventually, I think we will all do all of the different types of healing work within ourselves. But in the meanwhile, let's keep this momentum going. And instead of, well, why aren't you doing this? And this, let's just. Just keep. Keep it going. People keep showing up and giving the ways that they can give. And. Okay, so one big thing that I see people are criticizing the movement is, well, there's no one leader. And I think it's really hard for people to get around a movement that there's. Who's the MLK of this? Who. Who do we listen to? And what I'm hearing from the black community is this is not about one person. So can you. Can you give us some knowledge on that?

Well, you know what's interesting is I love the fact that there's no one leader, because there's no one person to assassinate.

Yeah.

Let's just be real for a moment. Like, that's actually the beauty of utilization in this particular scenario. And the separate thing that you just said is, like, I think that, you know, we're at this point where the beauty of technology, the beauty of media is we're able to create this, like, collective oneness, this collective leadership where the pulse is beating, and you not only can't find a single person that you can say, that's the person that's doing it, but you also have this crowdsourcing of ideas, of energy, of thought processes, of approaches that no one individual could have done, that a Martin Luther King in that time could not have actually executed. The number of different narratives, the number of different initiatives, the number of different. Different ways that we could approach this thing by literally having this entire freaking massive unit. So, like, I. I welcome it. And I think that, you know, it's. It would be false to say that those movements and those initiatives aren't without leaders within their own separate rights. It's like every single individual becomes a leader. If I'm the leader of this Blocks protest, I'm the leader, right? If I'm the, you know, the leader of this city, I'm the leader. I'm the leader of this initiative and this Minnesota Fund, then I am a leader, right? And that. That ownership and that ability to allow people to fill that level of empowerment and also to fill that level of responsibility that it's not resting on one person that's going to save us. It's resting on us individually that is so much more powerful. So much more powerful. Because if we. If we make that change, it's very similar to something that we know in the coaching world of, like, you know, if you come to somebody and you coach them, you tell them what to do, it's like you're damned on two different sides. If it works out, then they're like, man, I got to go to Sahara every time I need that fix. If it doesn't work out, then you're to blame. Right?

Exactly.

You are the one that empowers yourself to actually take that action. You own it, and it's rooted in you. And there's. There's nobody that can be killed that will stop a movement like that. There's nobody that can be removed that will stop a movement like that because it'll actually bleed in all of us. And I know that this energy, momentic lies or energetic moments of whatever just created a whole nother word, but momentously go with that. Momentously. I know that this time is so valuable because I feel the feeling of me. And I've had all these scenarios happen. Philandro Akashi, Sandra Bland, all these. And I felt the anger and I felt the. That's bullshit, whatever. But it hasn't charged me up enough to start a fund for black empowerment now to say, okay, what are we going to do on June 19th? To say, well, I need to create content. And if I'm feeling that, then there's tons of me. There's you, there's tons of people that were like, yo, I'm about to use my platform to shift shit. And that's powerful as hell because there is a certain thing that I have, there's a certain thing that you have, there's a certain thing that somebody that is listening to this has that nobody else in the world has access to, that nobody else in the world can do. Like they can do. And if they spring into that level of ownership and they say, my gift is now going to be put towards this promise, there's no stopping this. It is going to happen.

So beautifully said. So what can we do to just keep this momentum going so it's not like another like, like one week thing, back to business as usual. Like, how are you asking us to really show up and serve and keep this cause going?

I think the first step is don't be silent. All right? It's like, I think as much as we talk about any movement, right? Or you talk about age relief, you talk about poverty, whatever it is, is like, don't allow this to become a fad and recognize that. Which is why I even had. And I don't know what the new suggestion would be, but no justice, no peace is not enough, Right? Like, it's not about just getting these officers arrested. Like, that is. That is a great symbolism of black lives actually mattering as much as a white life by being like, wow, the justice system treated them the same. Great. Cool. You get brownie points for that. Now the real work begins. Now the real work begins. And the real work begins when we don't allow it to. To become silent. When we hold our government and we hold our officials and we hold our cities and we hold our states accountable for what are they doing now, now. And we demand that there are changes. We demand that there are shifts. We demand that it continues, and it needs to continue until I start feeling the warm and fuzzies about it, until I start seeing the actual results of what's happened and what's been enacted. And I'm like, you know what? This. This feels amazing, right? And then it still continues. It still continues. It's not a fight that just suddenly ends, because if it ever ended, it would be as if we were saying that the condition of caring about black lives was a temporary thing. Right? It's like, yes. Just as much as we bring into the whole matter of all lives mattering. It's like, yes. So then this is never an issue that is ever a fad and ever has a time, start and end date of this is when we're going to do, you know, care about black people, and then we move on. So it's a matter of how do we integrate into this thought process of, hey, here is this issue that has happened, that's been happening for hundreds of years, and that we get to deal with and we get to address. We get to address it with feverish resolve and not accepting tokens. Right? Like, I would hate for a court case to go down, for these officers to be convicted, and for everyone to say, good job. Yeah. Because that is not the point. It's not the point.

And just like making one leader the face of a movement puts that leader at the face of, well, in their personal life, they're like this and that, like what people do with MLK or anyone else, and it discredits the whole movement. What I'm seeing opposing people is, well, George Floyd was on Drugs or George Floyd, this and making it just about him as this one person. And like, what's such a big deal about this one guy? And it's not. And people are so missing the point. So that's why I feel like it is really important for us to like, remember that this is a greater movement that one person is right now currently the face on. But it's actually all of the billions of unnamed people that have suffered because they of the system for the past over 400 years.

The simple question is, is violence against your brother okay? Like, does it become okay? Because, oh, well, you know, he wasn't that good of a person. So, yeah, I'm like. I'm like, so if you. If you even form your mind to start asking questions like that, yo, I'm like, seriously, are you literally getting back to that moment of like, what is the intention, like, is your intention to discredit the violence that was done against this man? What does that mean? And where does that come from if not a example of, again, black lives not mattering? Because, well, he did something, so, you know, it doesn't matter. Not a big deal, right?

Exactly. And I think it's just us trying to protect ourselves because changing is uncomfortable. And it's much easier to blame someone else and say, well, they this, they that. Instead of looking in the mirror and being like, there's a lot of shit I don't know. And I'm going to continue to make mistakes and I'm going to continue to figure this out. And even though I might even be receiving mixed messages, because some people are saying, use your voice. Some people are saying, mute your voice. And I think there's a lot of that happening too. But don't let that keep you from trying. You know, don't let. Don't let a mistake, don't let an error. Don't let someone calling you out on something keep you from continuing to go. Because as you started, there is no one black voice. And also, every single moment, new layers are being added to this whole movement. So let's continue it, keep it moving and keep supporting. So can you let us know any accounts will, of course, your own, anywhere else that we should follow? We should subscribe. Like, where should we Director Energy to really remain updated on all of this?

Yeah, I mean, honestly, the Black Lives Matter hashtag has been serving me really well. You know, I have been religiously posting content, reposting content from there because it is so decentralized. Obviously, Black Lives Matter account is a valuable one, but there's A myriad of accounts like mine that are continually putting out information, continually sharing not only content that's relevant to this exact issue, but also action steps and things that we can do. So I just would invite you to dig into that. Like, dig into the Black Lives Matter. Won't take you very long to start finding a whole host of information and resources that will be available for you on how you can act in a number of different ways.

And I will have your Instagram in the show notes. And where can listeners connect with you, get coached by you, join your group, everything that you have?

Yeah, definitely. You can check me out on Instagram at Enhanceful. You can also check out Creator's Journey Me. That's where my workshops are held. And they're all centered around you understanding, gaining awareness, gaining acceptance, and then moving into the creator of your reality, understanding how you are responsible for the things that you creating. It's a very powerful journey, very powerful workshop. So, yeah, really invite people for it. And it's interesting because during this time, there's so many amazing parallels to that journey of self discovery and this journey of racism. Right? Because it's. It's all about the things that are sitting in your subconscious that are you then acting out of. From a lack of awareness. And that journey to bringing that stuff that's under the iceberg to the surface is something that everybody gets to do. And if you think that you don't need to do it, then you probably should die or implode into yourself because apparently you figured out the world and you're not growing and learning. But as long as you're a growing and learning individual, I can assure you there's 90% of shit that you don't know. And you don't know what you don't know.

100. Well, thank you so much for sharing your wisdom with us, for always bringing your expertise. We should do another podcast on just like all of the other wisdom that you have. Like, guys, we literally hop on the phone and we pretend that it's like a year from now. And we're like, oh, my God, I'm so glad that Oprah just had us on the show. Tony Robbins there too. It's like, oh, you know, so I love how you are just like a visionary. You are a big picture thinker. You are so just like, you don't let any limitations stop you. And it is so inspiring in this conversation, but in every single conversation. So thank you for being you and for shining your light.

Thank you, Sara. Thank you for having me. You are a Constant inspiration and the light that you shine with is the thing that allows people like me to continue to be inspired and continue to know that we're going in the right direction.

So I love it. Thank you.

All right. Wow.

How potent was that conversation with Marco? He is someone who can really deliver the message of truth and not detract from his experience and really tell it as it is without trying to make anyone else feel comfortable. He does not diminish himself or make his experiences invalid because they are and because they're real and because his anger, which he's not even expressing but it would be justified. And I think it is so important for us to really hear it from the mouths of the people who have been oppressed by our system, by the black men, specifically by our prisoners and police system. And it is important for us to hear the voices, to humanize the cause, to remember who is on the other side side of that line. And when we hear it straight from the people who've experienced it themselves, we create more compassion. And with that compassion, we can take action, change laws, vote in the right people, and create a better and more just world. So check out Marco Hansel. His Instagram is in my show notes. He is such an incredible person to learn from. I deeply admire his work. And if you loved this episode, I would love to send you a free gift which is the first half of my unreleased book Eat right for your mind body type. This is a different book than Eat Feel fresh, my first book ever which is not released anywhere and I am gifting it exclusively to those who leave a review of my podcast in the itunes store.

So all you gotta do is head.

Over to itunes where you you may be listening to this podcast and leave a review, take a screenshot that you've left it and email it over to me@saharaetfeelfresh.com again that's Sahara S A H A R A@eattfeelfresh.com and I will send you back the first half of my unreleased book Eat Right for your mind body type, which goes all into ayurveda, doshas, plant based nutrition, body types, all of the things in a really fun and engaging way. So this is my gift to you for free for supporting the podcast. Every single review I personally read, it really helps the podcast be listened to by more people so we can raise the vibration of the planet together. And I am so grateful to have you on this journey. Thank you so much for listening and I'll see you on the next episode. Namaste.

Sam.