358: Trusting + Connecting To Your Truth with Shannon Algeo

Namaste, it's Sahara Rose. And welcome back to the Highest self podcast, a place where we discuss what makes you your soul's highest evolvement in a noisy world. How do we connect with our truth? It is such an eternal question, one that I have struggled with and I think every human has. Especially when you're on a spiritual growth journey, it can be hard for you to assess what is right for you, what is coming from intuition, what is coming from fear. How do I know the difference? And in this conversation, we really dive into this topic. And this is with a dear friend of mine, Shannon Algeo, who you may have heard quite recently on the podcast because he interviewed me on my book, discover your dharma, a Vedic guide to finding your purpose, which I actually released on the podcast in January. He was also on the podcast, like, two, three years ago. So he may be a familiar voice to you or he may be new, but he is just such a sweetheart who I deeply resonate with. His just very grounded and practical and restful approach, which is completely the vibe that I'm on right now. I feel like, collectively we are so burnt out. This month in Rose Gold Goddesses is all about Hathor, who is the goddess of sacred receiving and what does it mean to receive and, you know, practices like yoga nidra and just like L and letting your energy field receive. I feel like we're all in this combative mode, and I feel like it's. I mean, it's been most of our lives because of the Internet. And I mean, probably the whole industrial revolution has really been like this. But especially in the past year now with COVID and the lockdowns and everything, we really energetically have felt very defensive, have really felt like we need to keep our guard up and we need to be worried about our safety and security. And it can bring up a lot of root chakra stuff, you know, and it can be hard in times like this, in times of insecurity, to trust your truth. But I feel like one of the greatest lessons I've learned and seeing the collective learn this as well, is we're okay. Even in the uncertainty, we're okay. And I saw this funny TikTok, and It was like March 2020. And we're like, on the phone, we're freaking out. We're, like, stocking up, making sure we get enough toilet paper. Like, you know, all of our guards are up. And then we other people maybe even reacting more than we are. So we feel like maybe I'm underprepared, maybe I'm not gonna have enough food. And it totally made. I was like that. We were all like that because it was an uncertainty. We didn't know what was going to happen Next. And now, March 2021, we're just, like, you know, with our face mask on, like, cruising around our kitchen. Like, it's so not a scary thing for us. We're still in uncertainty. We still are, but we have learned to be okay with it. And I think that that is one of the greatest collective lessons that we have learned in the past year. That we never know what tomorrow holds. That was before COVID We never knew. And this pandemic also brought up the opportunity to look at. Every moment is given and nothing is guaranteed. And how are we going to live in this unknown? That every single moment can change your life. And that can feel like a really big respons, but it can also feel like a great gift because that means you can change your life in any moment. That means your future is not set in front of you. That doesn't mean, oh, well, because I grew up in this small town, and everyone does this one thing, that that's what I'm gonna do, too. The whole entire world can shift in one year, one month, one day. Your life can shift in one year, one month, one day. So are you gonna choose to shift it? And that really comes from the practice of trusting, connecting to your truth, tuning into your dharma. Your soul's the big reason why you are here. And I really believe the more we can connect to what our intuitive voice sounds like, because it really sounds different for every single person. You know, I've been sharing this podcast for the past four years now, and I have interviewed so many intuitive people, and every single person, I asked them, what makes you your highest self? And the answer has never been the same. What makes each person their highest self is unique to them. What makes your intuition yours is unique to you. So it's feeling. What does truth feel like for me? What is my home base? What is my north node? What is my dharma? And the more that we can tune into that and feel what it is, the more we can find when we are not in alignment with that and make those shifts and make those changes to come back home. So in this conversation, we talk all about connecting to your truth, your intuition. We also talk about social media boundaries, which which, to me, has been a huge block of my intuition. I don't think I'm the only one. So Shannon actually shares his practice of what he does, which is a pretty radical approach and something that I am not quite doing yet, but really inspired me. So you'll hear what he does. It's really interesting. I've never heard anyone do this before. And it's like I was like, what? And then I was like, the fact that we can't do this just shows how addicted we are. We also talk about creating from a place of rest. If you heard my episode, my solo cast last month, you know that right now I'm really focused on creating from a place of rest, a place of ease. And he also shares his practice of actually writing his book from that place and how he did that. And then we also talk about what our dreams are for the future, for the collective, and what living in community can really look like. So this is an amazing conversation that you'll deeply enjoy. I love Shannon so much and I know you will too. So without further ado, let's welcome Shannon Algeo to the High Self podcast. And before we get started, I have an announcement for you. Do you feel deep in your soul that you have a purpose but are overwhelmed and confused about where to start? Are you a multi passionate person who needs a clear focus and direction so you can truly make progress and impact this year? Do you know deep down that your highest form of joy is your highest form of service, but need clarity on how to make that your reality? Well, you're not alone. Our school system and society has not trained us to follow our intuition and honor our Dharmas. In fact, it can feel like totally foreign territory. But the thing is, discovering your Dharma is the most important work you can do. And without discovering our Dharma, we will never experience true happiness. Because happiness is the byproduct of living your purpose. I was where you might be right now, confused and overwhelmed about my own Dharma, questioning if I even had one, if my dreams were just wishful thinking or if my obstacles had happened to me for a reason. Because it was my opportunity to share them. And through my journey of deconditioning and unraveling and getting true with myself for many, many years, I finally got the courage to write my first book. So second book, third book, my newest book, discover your Dharma and help thousands of others discover their Dharmas too. So I'm so excited to bring you the first ever course, the 21 Day Dharma Discovery Journey. In this course, in just 21 days, in less than 10 minutes a day, I will be your Dharma coach, guiding you step by step on how to discover your Dharma. So if you're interested in learning more, head over to iamsaharrose.com Dharma discovery Again, that's. I am saharrose.com Dharma discovery the link is in the show notes, and I'm so excited to see you live in your Dharma. Welcome, Shannon, back to the Highest Self podcast. It's so great to have you here.

Oh, my gosh, Sahara, thank you. Thank you for having me back. It's so nice to be back on the Highest Self podcast and always so nice to be talking to you. I'm so excited to be here with you today.

And the first question I'd love to ask you is, what makes you your highest self?

You know, I was reflecting about the concept and the experience of highest self before we started talking today, that there's this opportunity to actually realize my highest self, that there is this kind of, like, higher calling, this kind of ideal or fully manifested, realized, beautiful, conscious version of myself, and that just by tuning towards that possibility moves me more in that direction. So the question is, what makes me my highest self? I think it's my willingness to integrate and. And explore all of the messy, beautiful, complicated, gnarly, sexy, devastating aspects of Shannon. And that by having a willingness to dance with all of these colors of my humanity, I'm able to then, like, rise into my true highest self. Not a highest self. That's like a spiritual. I know you've talked about this before, like, spiritual bypassing or, like, forgetting certain parts of myself or leaving them behind because I judge them as bad, but instead going and getting those parts of myself that I've judged as bad in the past and learning to love those parts of myself and give compassion to those parts of myself. That's where I feel like I get my energy, is by kind of going to the shadow spaces and learning to bring the medicine of my highest self to those spaces too.

I love that so much. And, yeah, really just sitting into all the archetypes of who we are and being able to play around with them. And I feel like so often when we get into spirituality, it's like I got to go from point A to point B, and then you get to point B and you realize, like, all of those things that made you. You in point A need to come with you for this, like, point C, which is, like, the total embodiment of all of the sides of you.

Oh, my gosh. Totally. Yeah. When we first start the spiritual path, there is this kind of dynamic of getting better, like, getting from this place where I am now that might kind of feel like it sucks to this better place where I can be a better version of myself or my life can be better, where my relationships can be better or my work can be more fulfilling. But then you're so right. What happens after you get to point B and you kind of lift yourself up and do the work to kind of get to that better place is you realize that there's point C and it becomes more of a circle than a line. And I think that that's where things get exciting in the spiritual journey.

And I know you and I both so resonate with like bringing that playful aspect of ourselves when we were younger, our inner entertainer archetypes and dancers, dancer archetypes and singer archetypes and these playful parts of ourselves that maybe, you know, I know for myself, when I first got spiritual, I was like, oh, that's. There's no place for that here. Like, that's a separate thing. But it's not in my, you know, all Holy light worker new Persona that I have developed here because I got went to Bali. You know, it's like, no, actually the twerk is fully involved in it.

Yes. The spiritual twerk. Yeah, that's, you know, our friend, I love our friend Sa Desimone, who talks about Zombie Zen. Like, he says Zombie Zen is like this idea that everyone's like so serious and intense and like the spiritual practice is like disciplined and committed and it's kind of rigid and it's. You gotta do it every day. And he's like, I'm not into zombies then, honey. Like, he talks about like incorporating all these aspects of ourselves. And I know for myself, like, play is so important. Especially like, as I grow into my adulthood, there's so much responsibility. There's like bills, there's money, there's like, you know, if you're an entrepreneur, there's paying people and there's. You're not just taking care of yourself, you're taking care of others. There's just the kind of weight of capitalism sometimes can feel so. Like it has so many aspects of toxic, patriarchal, kind of robotic, non human culture built into it. And so play. Like twerking is radical. Is like, fuck yeah. I'm gonna just like click on my camera and like twerk for the Tiktokers or the Instagrammers.

For my highest self.

Yeah. Like, have fun. If it's not fun, I think it's missing something.

I agree. So you just wrote this incredible book, Trust yout Truth. I am obsessed. You know, I got to read it early on and give you a little quote Y quote.

Yeah.

And as I was reading it, I was Just like, you know, we are birds of the same feather. Like, I so resonate with everything that you are saying. And it's a, you know, it's a different vocabulary and different lifetime experiences that you have than I have. But really, like, the essence of it is the same. So can you share a little bit for listeners? What does it even mean to trust your truth?

Yeah, I remember hearing from you right after you read through some of the book and you said, we're definitely connecting to the same source. And I just, like, loved the way you put that. And I, after reading your book, felt very much that I resonated with that. And yeah. Trust yout Truth is about learning to listen, to remember and trust the wisdom that lives within your heart, your mind, your body, your cells, your tissues have wisdom in them. And we are so often taught by society, even our parents, people who love us, teachers, the world, conditions us to seek after something outside of us. And if I can just get that thing, if I can just do that thing, if I can just be with that type of person or make this type of money or have this kind of job or get this person's attention, then I will be enough. Then I will feel enough, then I can rest at night. But the thing about that path is, and I talk about in the book, interviewing Deepak Chopra for the first time when I first started my podcast, and how my ego was so engaged as I was, like, waiting outside Deepak's office in New York City at the Deepak home base, because a part of my ego was like, holy shit, you're so cool. You're interviewing Deepak Chopra. And the other part of my ego, the part that wanted to play small, was like, who do you think you are interviewing Deepak Chopra? You're not worthy of this. Like, what the fuck do you think is happening right now? And so I just watched my ego, like, ping ponging. And the thing is that neither of those were fully true. The truth was, is that Deepak is a human being. And you know him, he's a spiritual being. He's tapped in. Talk about tapped into source. He's definitely tapped into a powerful source, and so am I. And the thing that blew my mind, and I say that from a very humble place, of course, but the thing that blew my mind is after we released that episode on Soul Feed with Deepak, I was hearing from so many people who were like, oh, I've heard of him, but I've never listened to him speak. I always wanted to learn about Deepak. I always wanted to Read one of his books or I didn't know him. So some people were saying. And I was like, oh, by us partnering together, we're actually able to expand and widen the message. That's what the truth was. So for me, getting to partner with Deepak in that way helped me get over myself and helped me get into service, and that's what the truth is. So I think that we learn our truth by getting messy in life, getting in the sandbox, digging in the mud, getting hurt sometimes, even though that's really hard. And learning, learning, oh, that's not my truth. That is not my truth. I do not want to do that again. I do not want to feel that way. That is not for me. But then those experiences guide us towards connection to, oh, this is what I'm supposed to do. This is what I'm called to do. And the more that we can source our truth based on our own internal relationship to who we are and not based on what other people tell us, who we should be and how we should be, the more we build an embodied sense of, like, musculature, confidence, and connection to. This is my truth. I know what is real for me, and I'm going to build my life based on that knowing.

I love that so much. And I think what gets tricky for people is how do you know if it's coming from your truth or if it's coming from your fears that are masking as a truth?

That is such a good question. And I think it's like, you don't always know. And that's why you have to be brave and take risks and be willing to make mistakes and screw it all up. Because that's where like, the real learning happens is when you take that sense of, okay, I do feel called to go in this direction. I do feel called to take this job that's technically gonna pay me less, but it feels like my heart is gonna be so much more fulfilled. I do feel called to take a step away from this relationship because I do feel like it's draining my energy, but I don't know what's next for me. I don't know if I'm gonna be able to find someone else who loves me this much. Whatever those conversations are, we have to be willing to be brave and lean in and explore. What is it like to just take one step in the direction of what feels true right now, knowing that your truth isn't a solid, fixed thing? The truth is like, I think of it like breath. It's constantly changing, like the ocean Ebbing and flowing. It requires our presence because you can think that you have your finger on it and you can think, like, I know what my truth is, but sweetheart, like, we wake up in the morning and we got to begin again and check in with ourselves and always be listening to that deeper wisdom within. So it's like a corrective experience where if you take a wrong turn, the GPS has the capacity to reroute you back home to where you want to go. And perfectionism is a byproduct of white supremacist, capitalist, toxic, patriarchal culture. Because perfectionism tells us that we have to be inhuman, that we have to be perfect, that there's no room for error, that it is fear, it's life or death. And when we're in that mode of perfectionism, we don't give ourselves the space to be human and make mistakes. And I think we have to make mistakes in order to learn what our truth really is.

I love that so much. And I think perfectionism is a huge thing that some people identify with. I think a lot of people are even proud of themselves, like, oh, like I'm a perfectionist, and that's a great attribute of myself. I strive for excellence. And, you know, while I do agree it's great to always do your best in this capitalistic society. What does best mean? Who is deciding best? What is the result of best? And I think it just ties us to this never ending. Like, you know that fishing rod that, like the fish is always a couple feet in front of you and you think you're almost there and you think you're almost there, and you think you're almost there. So you're tying your perfectionism to this ideal that you will never get to, and then judging yourself when you will never get there. Do you ever feel that in your own process?

Yeah, I love that reflection because I think that trusting your truth is the essence of practicing, that you actually get to decide what's best for you and really being in relationship with yourself in a way that. Or you're able to excavate. No, this actually, this goal that I have isn't mine. This is like something that's been programmed into me, conditioned into me. I've digested it. It's become a part of me. And the way that we know whether it's true for us is does this thing that we are proud of, maybe we're proud of perfectionism. And I speak from perfectionism because. Or I speak about perfectionism because I struggle with it myself. So it's like okay, well, is this perfectionism actually holding me back from being my highest self, from bringing my truth to fruition to my consciousness and to the consciousness of the world? If something is getting in the way, a lot of people say, like, don't let perfect be the enemy of good, or don't be perfect be the enemy of done. And because I'm in grad school right now and I have to write these papers, so many of the times I go to write a paper, I don't want to start writing the paper, because as soon as I start working on the paper, it's going to have to be the perfect paper. And so it's easier to not do it than to know that I'm going to start to get into a messy process where there's going to be multiple different drafts, and there's going to be, like, errors, and there's going to be things that don't come out right. And. But to weave in play, it's like, well, what is the point of all of this? The reason I'm going to grad school is to get an education, to learn something new, to deepen my knowledge and my wisdom and my experience, to create new paths forward for my career. So this is my education. So why don't I write the paper that I want to write? Why don't I write something that's gonna feel deep and rich and meaningful for me and not be so obsessed about the grade that the teacher's gonna give me at the end? Maybe it would be better to write a paper based on my own interests and miss something on the syllabus that was supposed to be in there than to write this perfectly executed paper that's meeting all of the perfect points to get the perfect grade. And so the question becomes, is, who do we want to be? Like, who do you want to be? And how do you want to play? How do you want to experience your life? And if the perfectionism is keeping you from doing the thing, keeping you from writing the book, starting the podcast, writing the paper, applying to grad school, then the perfectionism is not working. It's like a faulty thing in the. In your database, because supposedly perfectionism is supposed to get you to be your highest self and be the best. So if it's actually creating a lot of, like, suffering and judgment or even sabotage and keeping you from even showing up, then I don't think that's perfectionism. I think that's fear.

Mm. And, like, you know, the topic of perfectionism is so interesting because every single person's Medicine is going to be different with it, right?

Yeah.

Like, I feel like for someone who is a chronic overachiever, you know, the perfectionism gives them a sense of validation. Probably from the time they were kids, they got like, you know, a pat on the head from dad when they brought home good grades or love from the teacher or whatever else it is. And so they're always striving for this thing, for external validation. And then on the other hand, I see this, like, this feeling of, like, okay, well, I'm just going to like, you know, do the bare minimum, put in the least amount of effort, that maybe not striving for perfectionism, but striving for, you know, is this the final result that you would want to give people? You know, in the process of writing a book, for example, I could have been like, screw this, I don't care about my spelling. You know, that level to attention and detail is necessary for something like a book. Right. But when I'm writing social media posts, I have typos in there all the time because it doesn't matter if you can understand what I'm saying. I got the point across. So it's like choosing when it matters and also taking, like, would more energy towards my actions be helping me with who I want to be? Or am I putting so much into it that it's preventing me from being who I want to be?

I love that. Yeah, I love that you're naming that. Different medicines are going to be required for different people based on where they're kind of what their relationship with perfectionism is and how it's showing up in their behavior. Like, for me, I constantly have to be like, Shannon, it's good enough. It's good enough. It's good enough because otherwise I can be like, like hone in on every little letter of every sentence, every word. And so for me, it's medicinal to be like, baby, step away. Let the mistakes sit there. Let someone else see them. Like, you don't have to find them all. And so I love Anne Lamott. The writer says to write your shitty first draft. Write your shitty first draft. And there's something about the permission to like, yeah, like, you can go back and edit it. You can go back and reread it. You can, like, don't. This is one of the biggest things I learned while writing this book is don't edit while you're creating. Don't edit your writing while you're writing. Turn on the flow, turn on the faucet and just write, write like. And as I would write, I would first do my yoga nidra practice lying down, and then I would come out of it, and my computer would be right there. And I would have hiked before, meditated, done all my morning routine, and I would just start flowing through the chapter and just letting the chapter pour out of me. And not let my inner critic not let the judge say, like, shannon, don't tell that story, or this is stupid, or this doesn't make sense. What are you talking about? I would literally be like, no, no, no. You can show up later. We'll talk with you later. But right now the faucet is on. And when the faucet is on, the water comes out. And that, for me, made actually the writing process of this book incredibly easy. I know that's not everyone's experience, but that was the experience for me. The editing process, as you can imagine, based on what I've shared, that was harder. That's where my perfectionist came in. The final manuscript, the last chance to make final edits. That's where I was like, ah. But giving myself the space to just create from a space of, like, freedom and play and trusting that, like, I do have this connection to a higher source, and it can just come right through me. I'm so grateful that I let myself do that because I know that this book, while it may not be the perfect book, it's a book from my heart, my soul, my depth, and my highest self.

So beautifully expressed. And I actually found out that on your computer, I think it's on Microsoft Word, there's an Ernest Hemingway mode where you can't press the delete button. So it's because so many people, as they're writing, they start deleting and, like, editing what they're going to say. So it's this mode, which is what Hemingway used to do as well, of just letting yourself write and not go back and delete anything, which is like, I'm sure if you Google it, you'd figure out how to do it. But that's, like, a really good thing if you are someone who's, like, always editing what they're going to say. But for myself, too, it's always stream of consciousness download. I'm just, like, typing so fast, like, the words aren't even making sense. They're not even real sentences. But I'm just like, that faucet, that connection is turned on. So I ride that wave. And then I can kind of feel when it's, like, starting to shut off and starts trickling. And it's a Little bit less. And then trusting that, honoring that, like, okay, thank you. Received, get myself, you know, rested. And then for me as well, it's like, when I'm in that stream of consciousness mode, then it just allows me to just get whatever source is seeking to express through me in that purest channel without my ego trying to now dictate it or, you know, see where it's going. Because it's a different part of your brain, you know, like, it's a helpful one. There's a time and space for that, too. But you're not going to be, like, channeling from source and like, hey, that trauma was not in the right place at the same time.

Totally. Yeah. And that's where that just. It's so freeing to let yourself have the experience of flow and of creativity and of nonjudgment and of riding that wave. Like you said, like, there's something exhilarating about that. And I really hope that everyone, whether it's writing or some other, like, way of creating, I hope everyone has that experience where you. Where you let yourself. It does feel like a choice to be like, I'm putting my joy and my creativity and my flow first, and we'll clean it up later.

For my husband, it's when he's making his music. So he, like, now he's doing his, like, morning pages practice and, like, getting himself into that flow, like, state. But his biggest, like, kryptonite was exactly that. As he was making the music, he would be like, this sucks. Or, like, you know, the top line is wrong, or whatever the music terminology is that it's like. Like, in that modality, it still shows up. Like, that same inner critic perfectionist will show up. And maybe you're doing pottery or you're, like, even coaching with someone, and you're like, did I say the right thing? Oh, shit, I shouldn't have said that thing. And here you are no longer being present with your client because you're, like, overanalyzing. And here's the thing about perfectionism. I feel like, in a way, it's like an obsession with self, because it's this obsession of, I care so much about what you think about me, you know? And at the end of the day, no one's sitting around and thinking about, like, you for the most part. Like, I'm not, like, sitting around like, oh, my God, I can't believe, like, Shannon did not use the apostrophe the right way for pluralization. Like, didn't he know it was not there? Was not supposed to be an apostrophe for that as like, no one's sitting around and thinking about that. But in a way, like, perfectionism is like our own sense of self importance. Like, the whole world cares about me. That like, oftentimes as a teenager we're like, you know, as a teenager, you walk down the hallway, you think everyone is just like staring at you and only thinking and talking shit about you. And it's like, the truth is most people are just in their own story and they're not even thinking about it.

Oh my God, I love that. And it's like figuring out where you're at on the spectrum. Because sometimes it's helpful to think my words matter and what I'm going to say is going to have an impact. And I want to be mindful and conscious and awake and aware and connected to how important it is that I show up and share. But if you go too far into that or you stay there for too long, then you might need the other quality, which is what you were just talking about. Like, sweetheart, nobody cares. Everyone's in their own world. Like, let it go. Get over yourself and just vomit it out. Go play, make a mess. And so, yeah, it's like, I don't think it's a one size fits all. And it's not even a one size fits me. Like, I need those different relationships with my myself. And I think, like, that is what I'm hoping that people are exploring when they explore trusting their truth. Whether it's reading the book Trust yout Truth or whether it's just exploring this is that what I need right now is going to be different than what I needed yesterday, perhaps, or what I needed last year. And that we aren't robots. Like, we are beings. And so we need to be in relationship with ourselves as we grow and evolve and continue to take care of where we're at on an embodied level, on a spiritual level, not just on a mind level of like, well, I worked out. And last week when I worked out, I felt great. Why do I feel like shit right now? Like, because maybe I needed to go on a walk that day. Like, maybe I needed to go a little bit slower and I kind of forced myself to work out, you know, so there's different things that are required in different moments of our lives.

And I think that this is such an important conversation, especially in spirituality, because we can take these universal truths and apply them to every single thing in our lives without the relative truth that every single situation at every single moment of time is going to be different. So we could have done this whole podcast on, don't be a perfectionist. Just get your stuff out there. But then it couldn't have been the message of the person who is just kind of half assing their whole life. So it's just, just again, trusting your truth, knowing what works for you and having that sovereignty of like, life is like a buffet and advice is like a buffet and you don't have to take it all. Or like maybe you put the jello on the side of your plate and then maybe when it's time for the jello, you have the jello, but you don't need to force yourself to have it now because it's on your plate. You know?

J E L L O It's live.

Yes. Throwback. We'll take a quick break so I can give a shout out to our sponsors. If you know me, you know I love two things, Ayurveda and natural skincare. So I'm always so excited when I can find an amazing Ayurvedic skincare company that smells really good because my husband always complains when I smell like herbs. So I was super excited to find Pavani Ayurveda. They're all organic, certified, vegan and cruelty free, handmade by their small, small team of Ayurvedic herbalists in their Shakti powered apothecary. One of my favorite products that they have is their Kanza Wand. So if you're familiar with facial massage, this is actually the most ancient facial massage tool that predates the Gua Sha or Jade roller. So I love just massaging the serums into my skin using the Kansa Wand. It really gives you that glow, that definition. It helps relieve muscle tension and just, just makes your skin look so amazing. So if you're interested in trying it out, head over to Pavani Ayurveda.com and use discount code Sahara for 15 off. You can find that link and discount code in the show notes. And I'm super excited to massage your face with this beauty. If you're like me, you just want to be comfortable and wear clothes that are super soft and stretchy but also not damaging for the environment. Well, I'm super excited to introduce you to Woven, a sustainable yoga apparel line that was actually founded by my dear friend Kieran, who's also a woman of color. I live in Woven's joggers. You actually can see me in them in my yoga journal cover shoot spread as well as in a lot of my dance tik toks and reels and the best part is they're actually made out of recycled BPA free bottles. There are about 27 recycled bottles in each pair of pants. The fabric is is super soft, breathable and odor resistant, meaning you can wear them more and wash them less. Climate scientists agree that reducing carbon emissions is our single most important objective. To reduce catastrophic climate change and protect the environment for our future generations. In addition to being climate neutral and good for our planet. Woven created the innovative four way top, a top in which you can reverse four ways from from print to basic. Their sacred geometry prints are designed in house and the basics are inspired by the colors of Mother Earth, including their turmeric, which is one of my favorite colors. Each piece is designed to hug and accentuate your natural curves, all while providing support and versatility. You can get 25% off your woven order@woven threads.com with coupon code Sahara and you can find that link in the show Notes. Notes. So in your book, you talk about trusting your gut, tuning into your gut's intuition. How can we practice that in real life?

Yeah. So go with your gut or trust your gut is something that, like, I had heard so many times and it could put it on a bumper sticker, put it on an Instagram post, like, and whenever I would see it, I'd be like, yes, yes, Queen. Trust your gut. Go with your gut. Of course, duh. But I didn't really learn this lesson in an embodied, oh, my gut kind of way. Really, truly. My body has a felt sense of sensory communications that it's communicating to me. And if I listen to my gut, I can actually be aware of when I'm giving power away versus when I'm holding my power or my sovereignty, like, you know, being a force field of that power and containing it. And for me, this, like, what happened is I was in a relationship for it was almost three years. And the last year of the relationship, I had this feeling in my gut what didn't make sense in my mind at all. But my body told me, this guy doesn't want monogamy. He might be cheating on you. I think he's into this other guy who we're kind of friends with. My body felt it. And then, you know, all the things I just said were kind of the stories that my mind tried to grab onto based on my body's feeling. And what happened to is. Or what happened to me is I would go to him and I would say to him, I feel like this is happening. Like, you know, and I told myself I was like, Trusting my truth. I told myself I was like, you know, I feel this thing. Can we talk about it? I feel this thing. Can you let me know whether it's true or not? The problem was, is because of his own experiences and his life and his trauma and his fears and his stuff, he lied to me and he deflected. He often got angry. And every time I would bring it up, it would get worse. We'd have bigger fights. And I believed him. Or I wanted to, my mind wanted to. And so what happened was, is that I started to think I was crazy. What's wrong with me? Why can't I trust people? Must have been my parents relationship. Wow, that really fucked me up. Why do I have these trust issues? I started to really internalize his anger and deflection. And what I realized in the end, as things came to light and as he got honest with me, was that my gut, my body was right. Every single time. Over the course of a year, on many different occasions, every one of those feelings was correlated to an actual event that happened. And when he told me that that was true, that all of that was true, I felt my body becoming supercharged with energy. I felt like a superhero. I felt alive. I felt the clouds part. Like I could actually see my life again, like the delusion was starting to fade. And I felt both devastated because this truth coming to light meant a whole array of messiness for my actual physical life. We had just moved from New York to la and there were cars involved and apartment leases and furniture and dishes and like families. And it was complicated. So that part of me was very devastated, but another part of me, my body was like, thank God this is what I knew. And I'll just never be able to forget that lesson. And at this point, I'm so grateful to him for that lesson. As painful as it was and as fucked up as it was, I have so much love and gratitude because Shannon needed that lesson. Shannon needed to know that your body knows. And no matter what truth you go seeking on the outside of yourself to make yourself feel better, to keep your life in this kind of structure that I had made it into with this relationship. The body keeps the score as vessel. Bandar Kolk says he has the book, the body keeps the score. And so if you're wondering about how to build this relationship with your gut intuition, I really invite you to look at times where you just knew, but you didn't want to know because the truth can be incredibly inconvenient to our egos and the structures of life. That we've built. And yet paradoxically, the truth sets us free, it sets our spirits free. And so I think by investigating and maybe you haven't had an intense experience yet, or maybe you're like, oh my God, I knew that too. I had that feeling too. But I would invite people practically to look at what don't I want to see or know what am I like, opposed to being true, that my body is telling me like, you need to pay attention to something here.

I so resonate with that story. And I feel like when we, when we don't listen to that, it gets louder and louder and louder and then it becomes this like smack in your face of there are cars and leases and all of these things involved. Whereas a year before that, you know, when it was a whisper, it could have been a lot less complicated, but it just took getting to that point for you to make the change.

Yeah, and that kind of goes back to that was a big, beautiful, sacred, holy mistake. Thank God for the three year car lease. Thank God for the cell phone plan, that ugly sectional navy blue sofa. Thank God for the dishes that are still in my kitchen. And thank God that it got me to la. And so I don't want to, you know, you don't need to rush. It's like Sean Korn says, you can't get to the bless you until you've gotten through the fuck you. And I believe she quotes her mentor Mona Miller when she says that. And so like, don't try and rush to the gratitude. Like I had to go through months of like crying and anger and rage and like all this stuff. But that makes the gratitude even richer because now I see it's like Steve Jobs says in his famous Stanford commencement speech that you can't connect the dots looking ahead, but you'll always be able to connect the dots as you look back on your life. And so yeah, just like letting yourself go through the process can be so hard. Like so much easier said than done. But. But that's where the highest self comes in, is that like there is this self correcting force that is supporting you and getting you to where you need to go. If we can stay open to that path, I believe it will be revealed to us.

I love that so much. And then you can just feel when things are off, when it's just like this little slight nudge. So for you, what are maybe the practices that you've developed now to be able to feel when something is off or could become a bigger issue before it has?

Yeah, this experience deepened My relationship with my spiritual practice, which for me, my spiritual practice is a practice of humbling myself, humbling my ego, so that I can connect to my higher self, so that I can connect to that voice of truth that just knows the truth. To look at all of the resistances I have to seeing the truth, what in yoga we call satya truthfulness. What are the conditionings, the limiting beliefs, the attachments that I have to not dealing with what's true? Because that's the thing you mentioned, the whisper. The whisper's there. And sometimes the whisper says, like, write the paper today. Sometimes the whisper says, record the podcast today. Sometimes the whisper says, go on a hike. Sometimes the whisper says, shannon, stop working. And like, I listen to that stuff now. I'm not as regimented with my life as I used to be. I used to, you know, I grew up in Catholic school and Syracuse University and musical theater and academia and like, just like really kind of like, gotta meet the deadline, gotta do it perfectly, gotta get it done. And I let myself have a more like, what you might call like, feminine, spacious, creative, non linear experience. And I don't beat myself up when I don't get as much done as I think that I should have gotten done. So like, practically I'd be like, what's your relationship to listening to the truth? Are you willing, are you willing to really look at what's happening in your life and see it, see it for what it is? Are you willing to be in these practices, these spiritual practices of like, humbling yourself? For me, I lie on the ground and do yoga Nidra. Or like, right before this conversation, I just laid in my hammock and I looked up at the blue sky and I just like felt some of the intensity that I was feeling earlier today, doing some life things, some important life things that just needed to get done. And I just was like, I just want to rest and prepare to talk to Sahara and not be busying myself on my phone. Get off your phone.

Mic drop. Get off your phone.

When I was working on the proposal for Trust yout Truth, I would turn off my phone for 36 hours from Saturday night to Monday morning. I would turn off my phone and I would put it in a drawer and I would tell everyone, I'm gone. And I was in Hudson, New York, alone, didn't know anyone in the city. And there was something so holy about what was happening. As I was noticing the colors of the windows and the paint on houses in Hudson and making eye contact and seeing someone's eyes, I never would have seen any of this stuff because I'd just be on my phone. So so much of connecting to your truth and listening to your gut is a removal of the noise that keeps us from hearing.

Mm. You know, the phone, I think, is, like, the greatest, you know, thing that's preventing us from trusting our truth. Like, and it's. It's something so simple and something so innocent. And I'm not against social media by any means. I think there's a lot of beauty. I mean, podcast is sort of like a form of social media, so you guys are even listening to a form of it right now. But, you know, I noticed in myself, too, the whole time I was writing the book, every time I was, like, on the brink of, like, something amazing that was really pushing me, I would just grab for my phone. It was like my energy body couldn't handle it and just needed an escape. Or if I'm doing something that's just, like, hard and difficult, I just keep stopping, like, between scrolls, and I'm looking at my phone, and then I just catch myself. I'm like, why am I doing this right now? And it's just this little, like, drug. It's like a lottery machine that we have. And when you share about having your phone off, like. Like, you know, in my earlier 20s, I was, like, in Bali for four months without a phone, and just like, yeah, it's okay. Like, I'll just go on the Internet cafe and reach out to people. But now I'm like, oh, my God, like, 36 hours are at your phone. Like, I feel like right now, because I'm on my phone so much, I'm like, that might make me anxious. So how. How would you, like, suggest for someone who feels like, if I just turned off my phone, like, what. What if my mom is trying to reach me? Or, like, what if I get hurt? Or, like, what if, I don't know, I get into a car accident? I don't have my phone on me? Like, what about feelings like that? I feel like we're so dependent on our phone for our safety.

Oh, my goodness, yes. And I went through this because I used to do it almost every weekend for a period of time. And the first step was to observe all of the thoughts that come in that say, you can't do that. And what I would do is I would write down, because there's some very practical concerns, like, you just named, like, what if your mom needs you? What if someone needs you? And if you are a parent or you take care of others, like, it becomes even more complicated. But it doesn't become more impossible. You can still do it. I'd say the first step is to write out all of the practical reasons why you believe that you can't, and then remember that it was only about 30 years ago. Less like 20 years ago, and less, when you think about, like, social media, that we've had these things.

So, like, we grew up prank calling people on landlines, y'. All. Hey, is so and so home.

Oh, my God. And like, I just called someone last.

The mom. It's his mom. It's his mom. Hi, is Mikey there? Do you like Shannon? I won't tell her. Tell me, tell me.

Hearing the laughter. Oh, my God. We could. I used to speak, spend hours on the phone. This is probably why people love Clubhouse is like. It's like spending hours on the phone, which is like, I used to do that with my friends. But write out all these practical reasons because you're gonna have to deal with each of them in order for you to feel safe, to let go. That's my experience, is you're gonna have to kind of reckon with each reason. And so one of my reasons was, what if my family tries to get in touch with me? What if I feel lonely? I feel like I'm going to feel lonely. And my phone fills up so much of my. My loneliness. And so the thing with my family, it was actually quite easy. I just enrolled them in what I was doing. I was like, I'm gonna take 36 hours off my phone. I, like, talked to them on Saturday. I FaceTimed with them. I made it kind of into a thing like, okay, I'm going out. I'm like, I'm out. And so knowing. And I did a post on social media. I'm away for 36 hours. I kind of took care of all of the things that I felt like would be wondering, like, where the fuck is Shannon? Like, if I just disappeared. And then that gave me a sense of preparation. It also gave me a sense of people are psychically holding this space with me, like my mom, my sister, my dad, my brother, my friends, my social media followers. Everyone knows what I'm up to. So the space feels even more held. And then I find for my nervous system, because I'm super addicted, too. But for me, I find that when I turn the phone off, I slide the off button and I put it in the drawer face down. There really is like, almost like, what do you. Oh, like a cold turkey kind of thing. I'm just like, I'm Done. I'm done. And there's a bit of relief that happens. There's a deeper level of relief that I don't think you can actually know until you experience it. And you can't even imagine it when you're getting all of the drug benefits from the phone. The part of us that get the drug hit from the phone cannot conceive of how good it feels to be away from it. And then for me, what I love about the experience of being off of it for so many hours is that I get to be with my loneliness. And instead of reaching for this thing that just kind of makes it. It go away, but doesn't really make it go away, it just kind of, like, makes it seem like it's gone away. I might write, like, a poem or I might, like. I don't know, like, masturbate, like, do something like that I wouldn't otherwise do, that I would not otherwise do. And then I start to get really curious because I'm like, what am I not doing with my life? Because I keep kind of going back to the phone as a kind of connection point towards my truth, as something to guide me. And then the last thing I'll say about this is, I feel in my body several hours in or when I, like, I close it off Saturday night, I feel like a freedom on Sunday. And then when I go to bed Sunday night, I'm like, holy shit. I feel so connected to myself. I'm in relationship with myself. I'm like, in my actual physical life and not tuning out. And there's something so empowering about that. And the nervous system feels like it's really unwinded, unwound. And so, yeah, I think it's. I think it's huge, this digital detox thing. And you don't have to do it for 36 hours, you could do it for four. And starting with less is actually a great way to kind of build towards more.

It's so amazing how not having our cell phones for 36 hours, which is basically a full day, is like this revolutionary act that we need to prepare ourselves for so much. And then within the first night, where our nervous system is totally unwound, it's like, if we know this, like, why do we keep going back? And it's like a lot of us, like, including ourselves, our businesses do rely on social media. And. And that's the thing. It's like so many people are like, I want to be an influencer. I'm like, do you? I can't get off this app. You know, and I think too what's so challenging about social media and these phones is the amount of incoming messages coming in is first of all, it's never ending. Second of all, it's not natural, you know, like in life I can only really be having a conversation with one person at a time. Maybe I'm in a group of five people, but I'm really only listening to one person speaking at a time. Whereas on social media you have all of these people, you know, who are in your DMs and then a whole other group of people in your comments and then people in your emails and people in your text and people on your WhatsApp and the people who sent you voice notes. Like even just today I got to listen to your voice note that you sent me a couple of days ago. I feel like sometimes like my walks to reground myself are just spent like listening to the voice notes and responding to the text. It's like keeping in communication with people has become a part time job. And the thing is like, what's the alternative of like not doing it? It's like I do want to remain in conversation with people and I just don't think that long term the way that conversations work is like a 30 seconds here when I have the time and a 30 seconds respond when you have the time, without the like dialogue that we're having right now that there's so much more. And even though we're on zoom, there's like body language and nuance and like listening and holding space and I feel like we're just, I mean even like us millennials. I get like weirded out when people call me. I'm like, why are you calling me? Send me a text or an email. Like why is she calling? You know, and it's just.

Who does she think she is?

Exactly. So it's just this, I think it's one of our, I think we're going to realize this in the next like 10 years of. It's like one of our greatest withholders from being able to trust our truth.

Yeah, this technology in the social media age has shadow and light and I mean I notice for myself like when I get off my phone and I start to like be in my world, how quickly I forget things. Like I'm like, oh, because it's like my brain is like pinging around as if I'm on my phone. I'm like, oh, I should do the dishes. Oh, you should put your socks away. Oh, you should do this. And then I'm. And Then I'll get back. And I'm like, wait, why didn't I do that? I was so committed to doing that. Like, why didn't I put my socks away? It's such a little thing. But like, in the moment I was like, I'm gonna put my socks away. And then there was just like, like I'm like, wait, why aren't they away?

And then I end up in the closet and I'm doing something else and I'm like, I went to the closet to put this thing from the kitchen and now I'm doing a closet project. But it is rewiring our brains to act like the phone.

Yes. And I do feel that connection and it incentivizes me. And there's something about the pandemic that has slowed us down where I really do value this conversation with you, Sahara, like so much more than like some of the more frivolous aspects of social media. You know, like, this is so much more deep and meaningful than a voice note. And a voice note might be, you know, more meaningful than, you know, a, like on a post or, you know, or like a comment. And so it's like the meaning, like we're here to be alive and to have like a rich quality, deep, meaningful, connected experiences with one another. Like that is how humanity has worked for thousands and thousands and thousands and thousands of years. And this phone is not natural. And I think it does a lot for us. I don't want to make it wrong or bad. I think it does some amazing things about connecting us to some of the patterns, like global patterns and connections with people around the world and like minded and like hearted people all over the world. But it does also do a disservice to like our local communities and our grounded, especially now with the pandemic, that we can't technically really be with our local communities the way we were before.

I think we should all move off grid. Move off grid, live in community, grow our own food, play board games, you know, like. Cause it's like what really matters, you know, why are we ping ponging in communication this and that. Because we're valuing our output more than our connections.

Yeah. Yeah. And I don't know if it's like just because I'm 34 now and I feel my values shifting, you know, like writing the book was big for me because it was a three year process. Now I'm in grad school, which is going to be another three year process. So just thinking about, like, what's the long game here? What's the sustainable impact, what really matters to me, because at the end of the day, it's like, yeah, you can get all the followers everywhere, but, like, if you want the hug, if you want, like, the birthday celebration with your close friends, if you want the, like the meaning and the shared. You know, I got to go over and hang out with Sa and his sister Moon in Venice a couple months ago, and we just like, sat around for hours, like, eating, and they were making food and it was just like, like, oh, my God, like this, like this is what we're supposed to be doing. And of course, the pandemic has made that more complicated, but we were already wrapped up in social media before this all happened. And so, yeah, like, what does it look like for us to reimagine? Because there is going to be another side of this pandemic and there's going to be a renaissance of human connection. And, and I just, I hope for all of us that we reimagine how much more important that connection is than these kind of fleeting moments and posts. Not to minimize the impact of a social media post, because of course it can have a huge impact, but I don't think it can replace human connection.

Well, I think we're onto something. My wheels are spinning with this community living idea. Buy some land to just eat some avocados, mangoes. You know, I was. And I was just in Costa Rica and a number of people who are there have. Are doing that. Like, they each have their own acre of land, but it's like in this shared community and they grow their own food in this, like, you know, regenerative farm and it's happening, you know, And I think the other end of this pandemic will be that. I mean, I think there will be both realities. The people who further and further detach themselves and basically will like, live in the Matrix and have no human contact and like the flip opposite end, which is deeper connection to Earth. So I'm actually excited to see where it takes us because we're all. We're all feeling it and just, you know, how much we do truly need each other.

Yeah, we do. I'll come live on the farm with you.

Okay, let's do it. So many goodies. I always just love conversation with you. It just feels so natural. We were definitely brother and sister in a past life. And I'm so grateful for you.

Oh, my God. So grateful.

And where can listeners get your new book, Trust yout Truth and Connect with youh Further?

Yeah. Thank you. Thank you. First of all, Sahara, just thank you for you. Thank you for the space you hold, the questions you ask, like how fun and playful and dynamic it is to be in conversation with you and just explore what comes together through our consciousnesses merging. Consciousnesses merging. And yeah, I would love everyone you know, if you're listening and you feel called to go on this journey with me and explain, explore more of what it means to trust your truth. The book is available worldwide. Everywhere books are sold. You can go to trustyourtruthbook.com it's trustyourtruthbook.com and there's a bunch of bonuses. There's a meditation album, there's a meditation for each chapter and the chapters are in alignment with the chakras, so there's that. There's also two yoga nidra practices for deep relaxation. One that goes with the beginning of the book and one that goes towards the end. And then there's also a movement medicine practice which is going to involve some high intensity blood pumping with some yoga and twerking, which I'm excited about.

I can't wait to experience that.

Yeah. So, yeah, come get the bonuses. And thank you for grabbing your copy of the book. If you listen to this podcast and you get a copy of Trust yout Truth, make sure you also have your copy of Discover your Dharma. Take a picture of one or both books and tag me in Sahara and I will be really excited to share it on social media.

Yes, tag us. We'll do a giveaway with the book. So tag us. If you listen to this episode, share your top three takeaways from listening to this. Give us a taggy tag and you may win our books. Woo. Yay. Well, thank you so much for sharing your truth with all of us. We're so grateful.

Thank you so much, Sahara. Thank you.

Are you feeling inspired? I always am after I have a really great conversation. It just allows me to see the world in a new way and I feel like we really need that. We really need conversations that cause us to question and really anchor into a deeper meaning of life that we often don't search for when we're just in our routine. So I love that this conversation provided me the opportunity and I hope it provided you with the opportunity to dive deeper as well. I'm going to assume has if you're here till the end. So thank you for tuning in and be sure to check out his new book, Trust yout Truth. So if you'd like to journey with me for 21 days in discovering youg Dharma, your Soul's purpose. Come join me in the Dharma Discovery Journey. You can find that link in the show notes and you can also find on my website iamsaharose.com dharmadiscovery and if you loved this episode I would love to send you a free gift which is the first half of my unreleased book Eat Right for your mind body type. This is a different book than Eat Feel Fresh, my first book ever which is not released anywhere and I am gifting it exclusively to those who leave a review of my podcast in the itunes store. So all you gotta do is head over to itunes where you may be listening to this podcast and leave a review, take a screenshot that you've left it and email it over to me@saharaetfeelfresh.com again that's Sahara S A H A R A at@eatfeelfresh.com and I will send you back the first half of my unreleased book Eat Right for your mind body type which goes all into Ayurveda, doshas, plant based nutrition, body types, all of the things in a really fun and engaging way. So this is my gift to you for free for supporting the podcast. Every single review I personally read. It really helps the podcast be listened to by more people so we can raise the vibration of the planet together and I am so grateful to have you on this journey. Thank you so much for listening and I'll see you on the next episode. Namaste.

Sam.