472: How To Be In Relationship While On A Spiritual Journey + Overcome Fear Of Sharing Your Story with Yung Pueblo

Living in a way where you're trying to, like, map out your reality in this sort of concrete manner, it really stops the flow of this, like, you know, nature itself. It's like. It's like a river. It's constantly flowing forward, constantly moving and changing. And what we do with our attachments, what we do with this, specifically this attachment to perfection, is that we constrict that flow. We, like, constricted so much that we actually start trying to move against the flow of nature, which will only cause hurt, which will only cause misery. So I think we have to be really mindful of what am I building an attachment around.

Welcome back to the Highest Self podcast. My name is Sahara Rose and this is a place where we discuss what makes you your soul's highest development. I'm so excited to have Young Pueblo, AKA Diego, on the Highest Self podcast. He's a dear friend of mine and was on this podcast actually back in 2018, which feels like a lifetime ago, and since has even blown up more so than he was at that time. If possible, he's written two more books, which are both New York Times bestsellers. And really what he's known for is his approach to making poetry about healing and meditation, mindfulness, overcoming trauma, relationship, friendship. He approaches a wide range of topics that makes it so approachable. And it's funny because we didn't know that. We actually grew up very close to each other in Boston and both come from immigrant backgrounds where it's sometimes hard to write about your story and share about the difficulties that your family has overcome because of the shame. And this idea of like, I don't want my friends to read about this. And we discuss all of the things that it really takes underneath writing your story. So the creative blocks that you might experience feeling like, how am I ever going to write? Like I used to. A feeling of not knowing how to share your story, if your story is even worth sharing. And on top of that, we get into all of the spiritual aspects as well. We kind of just go straight in. In this podcast, I ask him about his past lives and whether he feels like he was a monk in his past lives. We go through various of his poetry pieces and he shares his insight and what was going on behind that. We address relationships and being on a spiritual growth journey and it looking different sometimes than your partners. And this conversation really feels like one between two friends and I know you're going to love it. So without further ado, let's welcome Young Pueblo, AKA Diego to the Highest Self podcast. So there's a lot of talk about morning routines and if I have to be honest, there is one practice that I really stick to every single day. It's my non negotiable and that is breath work. It really just helps me open up the channels in my body and allow me to receive more creativity insight which really supports me in my Dharma. And I have been loving the app open. I actually have the founder Manoj here on the Highest Self Podcast Incredible episode. I'll link it below. And this app is really just a modern approach to breath work. I mean picture doing breathwork to Berlin house music and you basically got the vibe. And I also love that they have meditation movement classes and it's all under 10 minutes. So I love doing their breath work in the morning but also their sleeping breath work at night because it really just helps me calm my mind. So they're actually giving high self podcast listeners 30 days free. So you can head over to withopen.com Sahara again. That's with open.com Sahara to get your 30 days free. And you can find that link in the show notes. And I'm super excited to see you in class. Welcome back, Diego to the Highest Self Podcast. It's so great to have you here.

Thank you for having me, Sahara. I'm overjoyed that we get to do this again. The last time was so long ago, so it feels special to be here again.

Yes, here we are, worlds in a different place, yet still the soul the same. So I want to ask you this question again. What makes you your highest self?

I think it's meditating. Two hours a day. I spend an hour in the morning meditating and an hour in the evening. Not always at the same time, but, you know, sometime after I wake up and sometime after dinner, I'll meditate. And that always brings me back to just like getting rid of all the nonsense that gets clogged up in the head during the day, all the narratives that are unnecessary, all the sort of tension that I'm causing myself. And just coming back to that truth of change helps me come forward as a better version of myself.

Do you feel like you were a monk in a past life?

That's a good question. I definitely wouldn't rule it out. I mean, I really, you know, when I'm in those long meditation courses, like the first few courses, it was very, very hard. But then I kind of. It's a deconditioning process. So once you get rid of a lot of the heavier things and you just start working on deepening your Understanding of impermanence. I just feel very comfortable in that environment of being totally alone. So possibly for sure.

Yeah. I ask this because when I hear there's very few people in the world that meditate two hours a day. Right. It takes so much, just like internal strength, but it's also such a specific pathway. And I wonder how many lifetimes you've probably spent doing this to be able in this lifetime to even sit and meditate for two hours. And that being being your path. So it makes me curious to think maybe in previous lifetimes you've been doing this and you needed to go through the journey of forgetting it. We were actually talking about how we both came from the same place outside of Boston. So our souls are like, let's go somewhere that's like totally not meditation vibes and forget and come back. I'm curious because I know you've really dove into Buddhism. What is your take on past lives and reincarnation and karma?

I think it makes a lot of sense to me. I think having one life seems too short. Like, you know, a lot of people just sort of appear into life with identity. You know, they obviously taken a lot from their parents, from society, but they also like come in with their own flair. I think a lot of that has to do with the nature of arising and passing that is viewable everywhere in the universe. Like everything is constantly changing. Things are constantly arising and passing. And when something passes, it arises again. And not in the same form, but it'll keep coming back. So to me, I think it seems from my direct experience, it seems like it's definitely real. And in terms of karma, in terms of the law of cause and effect, I definitely believe that that's real. I feel like that has been so evident in my life. And you can just sort of take a look at the fact that if you do something, there is an effect. There's always an effect. So it's not just like a one way thing. I think learning and embracing the fact that your actions have not necessarily repercussions, but they have these effects that move forward. You don't know when these seeds will sprout. I think it actually can be. It doesn't need to be something scary. That could actually be something really beautiful and powerful. Because if you put a lot of positivity into the world, it'll come back to you in some way or another.

Yeah. It's so fascinating looking at Karma and Dharma from both the Vedic perspective and the Buddhist perspective. And they're a little bit different, right? Like Connected, but. But different. And it's so fascinating because I do feel like all humans, we do feel this cause and effect, right? That our actions, our decisions, our vibration, our preferences are all going to create our reality. And now it's a matter of how. And I think the hard thing with that is then, like, the blame that sometimes we do on ourselves or someone else, like, oh, something bad happened, like, it must be my karma, like, I must have something bad in a past life or. Or repaying. So for you, when something challenging happens in your life, how do you look at that? Do you see that as like, okay, this is the lesson for me to learn? Or do you see it as like, the universe has random experiences and sometimes things just happen?

I think every cause has, like, every effect has a cause, right? So like, like the leaf. Sorry, The Buddha has this saying that, like, even a leaf blowing in the wind, like, there's a cause that created that. So you can't really say that everything is random. But at the same time, that that's true. Like, there, you know, there are simultaneous truths where that's also true. There is karma playing out in my life, but there's also free will. So, like, in this moment, how am I going to receive this situation? I'm not predestined, right? Some situations may be bound to happen, but how I'm responding to these situations is totally how I'm acting out. And I'm creating new karma in helping the future be designed in a whole different way. And it's funny, I wanted to, you know, you're making me think of the way the conversation is going. There's a story where my wife and I, like, we had been together for about six years before we started meditating. And I think that's one of the main reasons why I believe in past lives is because our connection was always so strong. But I wasn't sure why, because the two of us were so different. But it wasn't until we started meditating and meditating in this particular tradition where it, like, clicked. And it was like, whoa, like, we've been doing this before. Like, this is where our connection is. It's so strong because we took to this one particular tradition, to this teachings by Goenka and by Sayaji Ubakin. It felt like you were arriving at home and it was like, oh, like, this is what I'm supposed to do, and we're supposed to do this together. I think that, like, overall is like, why I really believe in those past lives.

That's so beautiful to hear And I feel like so many listeners, they yearn for that with their partner, to have a shared spiritual practice, a shared, even practice in general. And I've written some of your poems, but one of them you wrote was, find a partner who is ready to build with you. It is not about finding perfection in another person. It is about realizing when you come across an undeniable connection that nourishes your being and matches the type of support you are looking for. Getting lost in the idea of perfection is a hindrance. Being with someone who is committed to going through the ups and downs of life together is truly priceless. When two people embrace their imperfections and commit to growing into better versions of themselves, it will naturally enhance the happiness they share in the relationship. Can you talk a little bit about what inspired this?

Definitely. I think, like, to summarize that piece, like, it's all about embracing growth, right? Like, we understand that we're imperfect beings. Like, that's why our healing can never be linear. But when we're able to find someone that we can grow with, like, of course we can grow alone. But a lot of the beauty of life is it comes out through our connections, like, through our friendships, through our relationships, through our relationships with our parents. So that's, you know, this urge to, like, have a lifelong partner. I think a lot of people have that because it's not only a form of safety, but it, like, sort of intrigues our intuition because our intuition is really pushing us to grow. That's something that I've been reflecting on a lot in the past year is like, my intuition is not just trying to point me in the right direction. It's trying to point me in directions where I'll be able to develop different qualities that I'm lacking currently and where I'll take steps forward outside of my comfort zone so that I can continue blossoming. I find that when you're able to find another person, that not only is that connection there, but you can potentially grow together and heal together and overcome trauma and learn more about your own emotional histories together. I think it just speeds up that evolutionary process in a lot of ways. Because there's this thing that happens when human beings are together, when we're in close proximity. It creates recipe. It creates tension, right? It's like, it makes tension happen so easily because in proximity, the egos can rub up against each other, and that causes friction. And obviously we're going to be in proximity with each other because humans need community to really thrive. So it helps us learn how to coexist in more peaceful ways through the challenges.

This is such an important point because it's really easy for us on our spiritual journeys to kind of like ostracize everyone around us. Right. Because we can't control them. We can't control whether they're going to be annoying to us or grow in the same way that we are. And of course, like, there are for sure people who can bring down your energy and have toxic behaviors, et cetera. But ultimately the spiritual path is not about being in isolation. It's not about being in your tiny bubble where you can control every single little thing. And I do think it's an important stage maybe to learn how to be alone and learn how to be with yourself, which you also write about in your book. But I realized like a few months ago, I was like, yeah, all of my problems come from other people. And then like, how funny that reflection was of like, it's because it's the mirror of me, you know?

Yeah.

So it's like relationships are our ultimate pathways and it's not. And we're so quick to like, the moment a relationship, whether it's a friendship, romantic relationship, coworker, the moment's not serving us. We leave, right. And we're like, okay, like, put up my boundary and go on to the next one. And like, there's a huge difference between boundaries and walls, you know? And I think a lot of us, we put up these walls and it's like our form of self protectionism. But we grow in relationship, friendship, work, everything. When we are able to overcome the discomfort that comes with conflict and being able to stay in our integrity in that space.

Yeah. And it's all a balance. Right. I feel like one tendency of human beings is to sway from extreme to extreme. So it's like, oh, I learned this one lesson and I'm going to take it all the way to an extreme and always be alone. Or, you know, anytime I have trouble with someone, they're not the right one because it should be easy. But no, that's not life. Like, life is not meant to be super easy. Like, there are going to be challenges, there are going to be ups and downs. And I think there are probably like a lot of relationships that have ended early because there wasn't enough space to accept the fact that we should grow and learn conflict resolution. Right. Like, we should accept the fact that, like, you know, this love isn't going to be pristine all the time. It's not going to be like a summer of love all the time, you know? There are going to be winters. But if the connection is strong enough and if both people are in a safe enough environment, then sure, let's try to figure out how to keep making this work if we both feel committed to it. But I think with that said, obviously there are definitely going to be situations that you do have to walk away from. But it's all about, you know, you communicating with yourself and your intuition and finding, okay, what is it that feels right for me in this moment and not this short moment, but the long moment. Right. That the long sort of, long term view of what works best for us.

And that's why being on that healing journey together is so important. You have another poem you wrote. They asked her, how do you build harmony in a relationship? She answered, you both have to be serious about your healing and open to growth. When tension arises, you focus on understanding each other's perspective instead of trying to win. As your self awareness expands, it will make it easier to find a middle path that you both feel good about. Harmony blossoms when your primary intention is love, not control.

Yeah, I think like the key thing that stands out for me in that piece is like that great switch from winning to understanding. Because it's so hard. Because our ego wants dominance like our ego wants control and it wants that of other people too. But if you're going to create a safe environment, if you're really going to build a home with another person, then you can't just try to dominate, you can't try to manipulate, you can't try to control. You want to create a space of freedom and a space where we can be honest with each other. So I think that's something that my wife and I learned the hard way was, you know, after so many years of the both of us fighting with each other, trying to win, we slowly over time switched into trying to understand each other. Tell me why you're upset. Like, what is going on in your mind that I'm not aware of? Tell me from your perspective how this series of events moved. And then once I take the time to listen selflessly, which is hard, it's hard to listen to one selflessly because you want to immediately interject and say, okay, I see it this way. But it's like, no, if I really respect and love you, let me give you the space for you to tell your story and then I'll tell you my story. And if we can both really understand where we're coming from, then the conflict seems senseless. It's like, okay, I get it. Like, I see you and I see how we can do this better in the future. Nina, I've been spending a lot of, I think, the past, like, two, three years thinking about sympathetic joy, and literally the joy that arises within you when you see another person happy, when you see another person succeed. So sympathetic joy is sort of like the opposite of envy or jealousy. I find that that has been a lot of the answers to the squabbles that the two of us may have, because it's like, I also know that giving myself everything I want all the time, it's not good for me. It's really not. I should also be developing, being able to be more selfless. And in those moments, what I see is when I do act selflessly towards my wife, I do end up getting a lot of joy because I'm like, oh, I love seeing her beam with happiness. I think we have to be really aware of what we're asking our partners of that we're not trying to put them in the line of fire or decrease their energy in any way. And what I'm mindful of is I've been traveling a lot the past four or five months with, doing book tours and just a lot of different things that I've been up to, especially around Leiter. And it's been a grueling sort of traveling itinerary that we've had. And I've been mindful of, do I do more things or. Because I, like, I enjoy the traveling. But I also know, like, my wife, it kind of wears her out, and she doesn't love it. She wants to spend more time at home. So even just recently, I was like, oh, like, you know, we could go to Miami and, like, go, you know, have fun at the end of December. But it was like, you know what? That seems unnecessary because if I asked her to do that, yeah, I would have fun and she would have fun. But then the effect of her, you know, she would just end up being more tired, and I'm, like, asking too much of her. So I realized I was like, I gotta pump the brakes.

So in my own spiritual journey of really honoring the sacred feminine energy within me, I realized that we're not all the same, and we all have different pathways that we can take that I put together in creating five archetypes, which I call the Rose Gold Goddess archetypes. They are the embodiment of Queen, the Womb Whisperer, the Intuitive Oracle, the Expressionista, and the Joy Priestess. And I've put together a free quiz so you can find out what your unique combination Are. So the embodiment queen is the person who's always in her body, dancing, moving, very connected to her nervous system. The womb whisperer always knows where she's at in her menstrual cycle and probably has a yoni steamer in her bathroom. The intuitive oracle has three oracle card decks on them, a pendulum, and knows about their past lives. The Expressionista is creating art through everything, through singing, dancing, writing, poetry. Everything for her is an opportunity to create art. And then we've got the joy priestess, who wants to laugh, dance, and not take herself super seriously. You can find her doing karaoke at an improv class or twerking it on the dance floor. You can guess which one I am. So you can head over to rggquiz.com to learn what your unique rose gold goddess archetype is. Again, that's rggquiz.com and you can find that link in the show notes. And I've created custom graphics that you get in your results so you can share which rose gold goddess archetype you are. I'm super excited to see. Yeah. So how do you cope with now traveling all the time and kind of indefinitely? Is it sort of an agreement that your wife is going to travel with you, or. Or is it just based on places that she only wants to go? How do you even manage the time to even spend time together?

It's interesting because she's not only my wife, she's also my manager. So we work together and we're a great team together. So I think for a lot of the more important things, she will come and she wants to come. But one thing I'm learning, too, is that success is not dependent on grinding. And I've really been kind of thinking about, like, for my future book releases, what can I change about them so that I'm not exhausted at the end of it? Or, like, flying way too much because I've been learning, too. It's like, if I'm on a plane all the time, I just get sick. Like, I just. I don't feel good. Like, I go on the plane and I come down and I feel like I can literally feel inflamed, you know, so all that inflammation is just not good for you. And realizing that, you know, I can keep tweaking things so that I can travel when it's necessary, but not make my work dependent on travel.

Absolutely. I feel like so many of us, and it's that fine balance of, like, you're living your dharma, you're living your truth, and, like, how Beautiful. You have these opportunities to share and then sometimes you have to ask yourself, well, what is my version of success?

Yes, exactly. And developing your own version. Yeah, yeah.

And I'm curious for you, you know, like New York Times best selling author for an author, that's the ultimate version of success. And I think now this is like your second book that is New York Times bestselling. How did that feel? How did that change you? Did it change you?

I think I'm still processing it. I think I've been sort of, you know, just like on the go and I've just started slowing down for December. And what I'm realizing is like, it was just a shock, you know, like, especially because when Lighter debuted and it came out the first week, it debuted as a number one New York Times bestseller. And it was just like totally unexpected because I knew there were other people on the list who had sold like 60,000 books with pre release plus the first week and they got number two. And I've also heard of like that was Ryan Holiday who I just mentioned. And I also knew the story of like Tim Ferriss who sold 100,000 copies and got number four. And so it really is like a, you know, you don't really know what's going to happen. It's not just on raw book sales. So when I realized that, I was like, you know what, whatever happens happens. But when my editor and my agent called me and they were like, it was number one, I was like, what? Like I could not, could not believe it. And it was great. You know, it feels like, I don't know, like they give you like a, like a medal. Like it's not. You don't actually get a medal, but it's just like, dang, like that's a real big achievement for an author and it's probably one of the best things that you can achieve as an author. And I think to me it feels very. Like I'm grateful it happened, but also feels very fleeting, you know, like it's like you're there, you're on the New York Times bestseller for a few weeks and then it's not. And then, you know, your eyes sort of shift to. You keep promoting your book. Cause you love your book, but you start working on another one and yeah, life keeps moving.

Ryan Holiday actually in one of his books wrote about the moment that one of his books hit New York Times. And it was like this ecstatic moment. And then he gets the phone call from the editor, so what's your next book? And then that pressure of like, oh, shit, I have to do this again. And that for him, it's like he had to just become numb to both the praise and the criticism.

Oh, totally, Totally. Yeah.

You know, if you have one, you gotta take the other, right? And it's like when your book, when your work sees a lot of eyes, and I feel like that's the thing that holds most people back, is the judgment that might come with it, the bad reviews that you might get, the negative comments that you might get. I think just the thought of that paralyzes so many people that they don't even try. I'm curious, in your own process, like, how have you navigated that? Do you even read reviews? Or do you just kind of put your blinders on and focus on creating?

I put my blinders on and focus on creating. That's totally me. I've learned over time that if I'm, like, reading all the reviews, reading all the comments, trying to respond to all the comments, respond to the DMs, I'm just badly affecting my mental health. And I feel like with all creators, like, if you're a writer, a painter, if you make movies, there are going to be some people who love what you did, and it changed their life, and they're going to be other people who don't like it. And that's just what it is. And that's totally fine. That's just life. People have different preferences. And I think accepting that and then also realizing, like, I don't. I really don't need to read the reviews. So I just keep focusing on creating and do my best. And it's funny from what you just said, too, it's so true, because after Leiter was out for two weeks, my editor was already reaching out to my agent about the next book. And it was funny because I didn't think we were gonna start talking about it until a few months after, but they immediately started talking about it, and it was like the book had barely come out, and I was already putting together an outline for a book that comes out two years from now.

And the beauty in that is you keep the momentum going, you keep creating, and you don't stay in one thing for too long. But then it's also like, where's the room for celebration and acknowledg acknowledgement? You know? And I think it's like, it seems like you have a healthy balance of doing so, but for a lot of people, it might just be like, oh, like, I know. In Big Magic by Elizabeth Gilbert, she writes about that like, pressure she felt of, like, okay, I'm realistically never going to write another Eat, Pray, Love again. So then feeling like, then is my creative career over? Because I have to match that. And, like, in writing these multiple books, do you ever have that pressure of, like, oh, is it going to top my previous one?

I'm really inspired. There's this one line that Jay Z said. He said, treat your first like your last, and your last like your first. So every time I make something, I treat it as if, like, it's the first thing I've ever made. And I want to be clearer. Like, you know, reach people, make something that. So to me, my measurement of success is, like, did I create something that people actually find useful? And because if. And if they find it useful, not only will it touch them, but they'll want to share it with their. Their family members, their friends and whatnot, and the book will spread. So to me, that's my primary aim. And trying to reach people is hopefully making something useful for them. And I try to keep that mentality for each book. But at the same time, I know that different books are going to reach different people. They're not all going to be the same equivalent level of success. And even with the Eat, Pray, Love thing for an author, if they have an Eat, Pray Love at all in their roster of, you know, that's incredible. Like, that's massive. Like, even thinking about Paulo Coelho, like, Paulo Coelho, his really big book, the Alchemist. So The Alchemist sold 150 million copies worldwide, and all of his other books together have sold, like, another sort of like 100 million or so. So none of them have reached that level of the Alchemist that was so expansive, changed so many people's lives, but they still affected tons of people. So I think trying to, like, constantly outdo yourself isn't the best. And just realizing, okay, like, I'm just gonna create and I'm gonna keep trying to make things that are useful. I think that's, like, as much as I can really do for myself personally.

Yeah, like, Eminem still releases music. Most people don't know that, but, like, he's still going out there putting music out, and it's just. That shows. It's like, it doesn't need to be like, another, like, eight Mile, you know, but he's doing it.

He just loves it. He just. Yeah. You know, too. It's something I learned the other day was that Eminem still is, like, constantly writing, is constantly, like, has a notepad and has so many rhymes. That will never make it out, but he keeps going and keeps writing just to keep that part of his mind open.

So that's one question I really want to ask you. What does your creative process look like in writing? And when you're writing a book, are you kind of writing it all in, like, one go? Like, you spending a few months, months just in this book? Or are you just sort of, like, writing for a certain amount of time per day and it's over a long period of time?

That's a good question. I think it's choppy. Like, it's really choppy. I know when the ultimate deadlines are, but on the way there. Especially for Leiter. Leiter was so different from my first two books, from Inward and Clarity and Connection, because Inward and Clarity Connection were poetry and prose books, and Leiter was a nonfiction book that just goes deep into all these topics regarding personal development, relationships, and self love. You know, I really go into all of it, but not only does it do that, but I tell my own story in that book. So one difficulty of that was, like, as I was writing Lighter, I had a few chapters, and then I kind of had this big moment of writer's block where I didn't write anything for like a month or two. And my editor was like, hey, what's going on? We're running out of time. And I realized that I was just. I was afraid of telling more of my story in such depth because I've been sort of unconsciously enjoying the fact that I've been writing under this pen name, Young Pueblo, and I sort of just sit quietly behind that pen name. Like, I really enjoy putting a lot of writing out there, but my goal is not to make my face famous. You know, I'm not, like, interested in, like, people knowing what I look like and all of that. Like, I like living a quiet life. So when I started putting together a lighter and I realized that these themes that I write about, they. To be able to fully express them, I need to share the arc of my own story to make it clear where this is all coming from. And I really just had to basically step up my vulnerability and share my own story, which slowed the process down. But normally I write in chunks. Like, I'll have these moments where I'll feel the creativity and I'll respond to it by acting on it. Because I've noticed that if the creativity goes away, that feeling of creativity goes away. Then it's hard to capture the same essence of what the original idea was. And I don't write Every single day, I, more so will just write in waves. And when I feel the creativity, it could be for a whole week or two weeks or a month. And I'll just write a ton of stuff in that time period. And then when I feel it sort of subsiding and relaxing, you know, I can go a few weeks or a month or so without writing anything new.

Yeah, it's so interesting to hear different people's creative processes. Do you have any, like, rituals? Is it always after your meditation? Is it always in the morning? Or is it just sort of whenever the muse hits?

I feel like it's more like if like I'm like a playing baseball or something and trying to catch the ball with a mitt. It's just like when it comes, it comes. And like, sometimes I feel like a lot of that energy. Like when I knew that it was time to write the book, like I wanted to do it and I felt all of the energy kind of aligning. And I would just like sit all day and write and keep writing until my wife was like, yo, we gotta go to bed. Like, you're done. Other times I could be like at midnight, could be at 10 in the morning. And it's interesting because then when I meditate, like, I don't meditate to be more creative. Like, that's sort of a byproduct of meditating where it's like, you know, when you decondition the mind, the mind just gets lighter and it's able to have more energy and able to make connections that weren't there before. And that's where that creativity emerges. But I really, I meditate to liberate myself.

So beautiful. It's. Yeah, for me as well. I feel like there are time periods in my life where it's almost like I have this like, soul contract with the book. And it's time and, you know, it's like the baby's coming through. You have like no choice but to surrender to it. And then other times where I'm just like, it's like you're writing and then it's like, done. Like the river has gone dry. Like, done. And then other times you're just like, so in it that you can't sleep. And it's like 16 hour days. And it's so, so fascinating because you really are in relationship with these books, right? And then like once you open up that, that channel, it's almost like you're just being of service to it. And it can almost be hard to like, live other areas of your life. Because you don't know when it's going to come through and you, like, always need to be available for it.

Yeah, I'm really grateful to the. Especially to my family and my wife. Like, sometimes I'll just, like, get something and it's like I just disappear into, like, either pen and paper or my laptop or my phone. Because I put a lot of things in my notes, especially a lot of the short poems. You know, I'll take like 30, 40 minutes to put it together and then it is what it is. But I'm grateful that they gave me the time and space to do it whenever it happens.

This show is sponsored by Better Help. We all need the someone to lean on or at least someone to talk to because life is crazy and a lot goes on that's out of our control. And sometimes we just need someone to hear us out, to give us the support that we need so we can come back into alignment. And this is why therapy is so important. It's nothing to be ashamed about, like former generations have felt. But it's actually, to me, I'm like, shout your therapist out. Because a girl is always looking for a good one. And I find a bit little lot of really great ones with better help. That's where I'm currently matched with one. I love them because you don't need to actually drive anywhere and be stuck in traffic and be like, stressed out about going to your therapist. But it makes it really easy. They're all online, they're affordable, and they'll match you with a new one according to your survey. So you can fill out information about yourself and get matched with your perfect therapist and actually try out different ones until you find your right fit. So to get 10% off your first month, head over to better health help.com Sahara again, that's better help h e l p.com Sahara and you can find that link in the show notes. When you have a creative block, do you take that as, okay, I'm done writing for now, or do you kind of just like keep writing and muster through and then the inspiration hits you.

Again as soon as the block comes or it just like the river dries up. What I do is I start reading or I start watching movies. Like I do something to strike inspiration and it could take weeks, you know, But I go back to like Interstellar or like that 1997 Romeo and Juliet or just like a bunch of different movies that meant a lot to me growing up. Or like Great Expectations. I think it was also 1998. There are these movies that I watched as a child, like, you know, I was 10, 11, 12 years old watching these movies, and they just, like, something about them just, like, fills me with so much inspiration, and it kind of brings it back.

That's so funny. I would have never guessed that watching movies would have been the thing that inspires you, but it's so interesting. Everyone has their unique thing.

Yeah, it could be movies or like the Siddhartha by Hermann Hess or Narcissus and Goldman by Hermann Hess. Those books are like.

For a second, I thought you were gonna say Narcos. I'm like, wow, I'll watch Narcos and write a book about poetry.

Oh, that's funn.

Yes. I think that it's so fascinating too. I have some friends that when it's time for them to write every single day, they'll wake up an hour before and write for that hour, no matter what. That's their routine. And then for myself, I feel like I go through this period of time, a few months that I'm so focused on the book, and I kind of write the book in that period of time. And I have other friends who in one week will just channel that whole book through. And I think every single book also. When it's your story, that's the hardest part, right? Because it's like, there are so many ways that you can tell this story. There are so many other people involved. So how do you navigate telling your story when other people are involved? Like your family or people that knew you before might read it, they might not want you sharing it, they might have different understanding of things or even be telling you you're lying about that. That never really happened. How do you navigate this?

That's a great question. I think I give people a heads up what I'm writing about, if I'm writing, because most of the stories are about me and what's happening inside of me, and sometimes that's in relation to other people. But I'm not, like, dogging anybody out or anything like that, like, in my books. So it's not like that type of, like, memoir. It's more like, I think the hardest one was talking to my parents and checking in with them and just, like, telling a lot of their story to sort of show where I was coming from. And I know, like, you know, so I was born in Ecuador, and we have a culture of, like, you know, a lot of people in Ecuador struggle with poverty, but a lot of people sort of keep it to themselves. And I was talking to my mom and dad. And I was like, hey. I was like, you know, for me to be able to do this really well, like, I have to tell our story, which is your story. And I have to talk about how, you know, like, my mom, when she came to the United States, like, she had a job cleaning houses, and my dad, he worked at a supermarket. And we, like, struggled with poverty immensely while my brother and I were growing up. And it was, you know, we were stuck in this, like, American poverty trap. And my parents, they were so courageous to allow me to tell that part of our story, because I know if they had a preference, they would just keep that to themselves. They're not trying to, like, air that out. So it was more so like just asking my family if we can all just open up a little bit in the hopes of serving other people for sure.

Because they're worried about what will their friends think. And especially when you come from another country, you want to show, like, I'm successful. I'm here. And I think part of it, too, is, like, you see yourself as one of the lucky ones. Like, we're one of the ones who made it to the US we're the ones who made it. Like, I'm not a pity story. I don't want people to feel bad for me, so. And this the same thing with my family, too. And that's why I couldn't even write their full story in my book, because it's just, like, too much for them and that they don't want out there. But it's hard because it is your story as well. It's your lineage's story, and you have to honor the people who are living and how much they want shared as well.

Yeah, true. And it's like, yeah, it's a balance of, like, how vulnerable can we get? But also, I want to respect, like, you as an entity, as a being, and. And not, like, cross any lines, especially with, like, my mom and dad, my brother, my sister, like, they're my life, you know? So I want to treat them well.

Yeah. I have some students recently, we were talking about writing your story, and for them, it's that fear of their family members saying that you're lying. You're making this up because of the guilt that they have for playing a part. And I think that that's tough because it is ultimately your story, and it can open up a can of worms from your past to go back to those wounds and to retell it. And sometimes, you know, even parts of my story were about that, of just the things that my dad said to me. And even though our relationship is a lot better now, that deeply affected me. So do you have any advice for someone who telling their story might trigger someone into saying, like, you know, putting up a wall and being in denial?

I think it's just. It's a common response, right? Because we have the way that we see things and we develop our own sort of narrative of what happened. But other people can experience the same exact moment and just see it a whole different way. And we often don't realize how in those moments, right. Like, the person who may have hurt us or whatnot or said something to us that we didn't like, like, what their motivations were, what was affecting them in their own sort of emotional history that created these words that had so much heaviness that really affected us. So there's a lot of factors that go into creating a moment and, like, not just within us, but in the other people around us. And on top of that, memory is really fickle. That's one thing that I've been realizing is, like, even in putting the story together without trying to leave things out, I'm leaving things out. Like, if I sit down and I'm like, okay, what happens? Like, in my kitchen table when I was 10 years old, watching my parents fight because they didn't know how to pay rent. But then there's just, like. There's so much about, like, okay, I'm actually writing it down. But by writing it down, I'm leaving things out because moments are very complex and they're expansive. So that's one thing that I've been thinking about, too. When I put together a story, I'm doing my best to capture the moment, but the moment it passed, it's going to be really hard to fully bring it together in its full brightness. So I think when people do want to write their stories and feel a need to. And want to do it in service of others, like, obviously I encourage it because you don't. You have no idea how many people you would help or how many lives you would save. So it's really important, like, to. If you feel that creative flow coming, to do it, act, act on it and share. Because you can be helping so many people, but also know that one side of the story is not final.

Yeah. I would sometimes write my story and, like, write it with, like, the anger that I had and, like, you know, all the. As if I'm writing in my journal. And I would write it that way, and then I would come back to it and Write it really with, like, my dad's perspective and, like, his fear and his uncertainty. And, of course, he was acting this way and, like, write it like that. And I just kind of kept rewriting the story until I was able to find as much as possible a balance of honoring how I felt in the experience and also acknowledging his background and why he would behave the way that he did. But like you said, you know, I could have written the entire book just on, you know, that story. And you also have just a limited amount of words and pages. And I think that's also the hard thing about writing a book is, like, you think, oh, it's a huge book. I'm gonna be able to, like, dive into this. I'm gonna have so long. But it's like, every word is, like, real estate on the page, and you have to be so specific with it, and you're never gonna get to the bottom of it. So, yeah, after writing my story, especially the fighting with my dad and him disowning me, I was. I knew if I asked for permission for that story, he would say no. So it was like that, well, it's gonna be printed, and he's gonna read it eventually. It was the most distressing thing that I have ever dealt. You know, eventually it came out, and he actually handles it way better than I thought. Like, he's just like, okay, well, it's like he was sort of just removed from. It was my mom who had just the embarrassment, you know, of, like, people are. That we know are going to read this. And. And it's like, I can have so much compassion for that because, like, especially when you come from tribal backgrounds, it was so much about, like, what the tribe and the village thought about you. And that's, you know, ingrained in so many, you know, different cultures around the world. And, like, in this lifetime, we are safe. Even if the people in the village talk bad about us or whatever else, like, we are still safe.

Yeah. All the power to you. Because I think those really formative experiences that we have that other people are a part of, I think it's. There's a lot of positives to sharing them because it just normalizes the fact that, like, we're, like, incredibly imperfect and we hurt each other through our imperfections. Something that I'm constantly trying to write about often now is, like, this attachment to perfection that we all have that is just, like, it's a sickness, and it is causing us so much mental strife. And if we're able to let it go and not allow this attachment to perfection dominate our lives. I think we'll all be better for it. But by showing our stories, we show, like, you know, we're incredibly imperfect, and we can move forward from that and we can build new relationships, even with the people who we once had conflict with.

Can you talk a little bit about this perfectionism that you are seeing? Because I think a lot of people, they hear that and they're like. Like, oh, I'm not a perfectionist. I don't like, perfect. Like, but it's still showing up in their lives. So it doesn't always look like you are perfect and pristine and proper, but it's more this, like, subtlety. So can you dive into it?

Yeah, it's subtle. Exactly. That's the key word. And I think it's. It's the nature of attachment, right? It's wanting things to exist in a particular way. And that is a craving for perfection. Because you have this. This idea of how you want things to exist or how you want people to talk to you or how you want people to treat you. And if it doesn't happen in that way that you have already dreamed up, then your mind hurts. You literally feel tension in your mind. And living in a way where you're trying to, like, map out your reality in this sort of concrete manner, it really stops the flow of this, like, you know, nature itself, it's like. It's like a river. It's constantly flowing forward, constantly moving and changing. And what we do with our attachments, what we do with this specifically, this attachment to perfection, is that we constrict that flow. We, like, constricted so much that we actually start trying to move against the flow of nature, which will only cause hurt, which will only cause misery. So I think we have to be really mindful of what am I building an attachment around? What am I trying to make happen here that isn't already here? And this is very different from having goals or having desires, right? An attachment is something that is built with tension. And having a goal is something that is a lot more. It's intentional, it feels light. It will direct you into a better version of yourself. But even if you don't immediately get it, you don't get super upset that you don't have it or that you don't. You know, when you don't get your goal, you go back to the drawing board and you figure out, okay, what did I do wrong? What can I do better? How can I keep moving forward to try to achieve this? And you keep working at It. But if it was something, was an attachment, then you know that when you don't get it, your mind is just so upset and it's rolling with tension. So they're very, very different things.

Absolutely. I feel like that perfection is linked with the judgment. We feel like if I don't get it that way. And like you said, perfection is more about your preferences. And I also think there's something beautiful about striving for excellence and for wanting things to be authentic and for putting in the extra care and the touch. And like, that is coming from a really pure place. The way that it gets out of control is when we're like not even paying attention to everything that's working in our lives and we're so fixated on the thing that's not. And we feel like we're going to lose everything if that thing isn't working, you know, like, like, especially as an entrepreneur, it's like the link on the website didn't work and it like trickles into this, you know, this fear that you have of like, everything is going to be taken from me now, you know, And I think that it does come from this like, nervous system, hyperaroused state that our urgency culture often leaves us in of like, you gotta be producing all the time and it's always gotta be best quality. And if not, like you're shit and you're over and you're canceled.

Yeah, it feels like too that it's also part of our like survival mechanism that's built into us where it's like, you know, the ego, the purpose of the ego, it's like it's here for you to not just interact with reality, but to help you get from today to tomorrow. And that becomes really difficult when you live in civilization and it's not, not that hard to get from today to tomorrow and you have these higher goals that become more available to you where you want to develop happiness, you want to develop peace. But if you keep living from an ego state that is just focusing on survival, focusing on dominance, focusing on control, which is like what, you know, different forms of attachment, then it's going to be very hard to be. To develop any sort of peace or to develop wisdom. So as opposed to living from a place of ego, I have found that, that it's been much more productive to try to live from a place of compassion, A place from compassion to myself and to other people.

And I think it's the fruits of these practices, meditation, contemplation, personal growth, when you can notice the shift in yourself when the emergencies happen, when the link isn't working, when the client is not satisfied, whatever thing is. And to notice how much more peaceful you are even in your response, you know, it doesn't mean that you, like, don't care. It doesn't mean that you don't do anything, but it doesn't trigger you the same way that you once used to be. Like, I've noticed in myself, like when starting my business, it's like one little thing. It would just. It was all I could think about, you know, and now I'm like, you know what? I'm still, I'm still gonna try my best and respond, but like, it's okay at the end of the day. And it's moments like that that you're like, oh, this is why we do the work. You know, it's not about like being in the meditative state only in your meditation, but it's about cultivating that state in your day to day actions. And that's the merit.

I couldn't have said it better. I think that's like literally the reason why we practice is like, when the thing that you love breaks, you're like, okay, it broke, I'm all right, you know, like, I'll figure out how to fix it or I'll get another one, or that was it, it's over. This thing that I once enjoyed is no longer available and I'm totally fine. And I think being able to respond to life like that as opposed to reacting it with the ways that we've reacted in the past with like a lot of anger or a lot of, you know, a lot of tension, that's how we know we're making real progress, is when the intensity of our reaction is decreasing, then we know we're winning.

So a question that I have for you, and this is kind of even a big question, but you know, the Buddhist perspective is very much about this feeling of like, like equanimity and neutrality, or at least this is how I see it. So I'm curious what your take is it, but more about like the neutrality and to not be affected and to be in that, like bodhisattva, peaceful nature. And then you see a lot of also the trauma healing space. And it's about like, feel your feelings. Like if you're angry, let yourself be angry. Have an anger practice. You know, if you're sad, let yourself cry on the floor. I see you dabble in both spaces. So what is your take on this?

I was going to say there's a middle space There in the tradition that I'm a part of, because, you know, all these different Buddhist traditions, like, they're so expansive and so different, and it's great. It's great that they're different. I think in the tradition that I'm a part of, it's really important for us to allow ourselves to feel. But when we try to feel whatever's arising, we're trying to create a situation where we let that fire burn, that fire of sadness, that fire of anger, whatever it is, but we simultaneously don't try to feed that fire or fuel that fire. Right. So if you're feeling sadness, you feel it, but you're not going to let it overcome you or govern your actions or make you say things that you'll later regret. You try your best to just create space for it and feel it. So for a lot of people, you know, sometimes that may bring on tears. For other people, they just feel that, that dense energy of, you know, whatever it is that's coming up, anxiety or whatnot, but they're sitting with it it as opposed to becoming it. And I think that's that middle ground that I've found in this practice of vipassana that I find so attractive to me. Like, so, like, because it's giving me space to really be with the tough emotions that come up, but at the same time it's helping them burn away as opposed to getting accumulated. So just creating space for them to come up has been like. It's really just been, you know, godsend. Like, I'm so grateful that to be able to have such a practice.

Yeah, I love the differentiations of the different kind of Buddhist paths because I think we all think of it in this, like, more, I don't know, like, stereotypical way that it's like, all about being peaceful and Zen. I don't know if it's the Zen Buddhist tradition or the Tibetan Buddhist tradition. I'm not sure which one we're all thinking of, but it's this feeling of like, just be calm. And I think what, you know, a lot of, of science is showing us is the importance of. Of going into the feelings. Otherwise they get, you know, stored on somatically and how important it is. However, I really like this concept of titration. I don't know if you've heard, heard of this before.

Tell me more.

But to titrate is to allow an emotion to kind of bubble inside of you without exploding. So let's say you're angry instead of being like, okay, now I need to go Punch pillows and break things and scream at the top of my lungs and letting that just like, you're just.

In my view, you're just multiplying the anger.

Right, Right. So instead letting yourself, like, have that. I think of it like a little parrot on your shoulder. And it's there and it's like it's bubbling and you're using it as a. As a tool. You know, maybe it's to assert your boundary and stand up for yourself or create art from it. And you're not saying, oh, I need to be calm, I need to be peaceful all the time. But you're also not practicing it. Right. Because the things that we practice might show up more in our lives.

Yeah. And that's why I really like that sentence where it's, you know, it's really about feeling it as opposed to becoming it. And it's sort of, kind of, kind of aligns with what you're saying, where you can just make space for what's coming up without letting it become this, like, blazing fire where you just, you know, act in ways that you'll regret later on. So I think there's a middle path for it for sure, because. Because ultimately you have to let yourself feel it for the unbinding to occur, for the letting go to occur. Because if it's going to stay deep down in your subconscious, then you're just going to carry that heaviness wherever you go. But if you allow whatever is there in the subconscious to arise to the surface and you feel it literally in your body, you can create just enough space for it to dissipate as opposed to go back inside.

Yeah. My wonder is if for someone who hasn't felt their anger in so long, maybe they do need to go into this very cathartic practice and, like, feel it and let themselves, like, be in that experience because it's built up for so long. And that can, like, remove the lid off of the. The tea kettle and it can diffuse.

Yeah, I think it's. It's very situational. Right. Like, this is something I'm always trying to, like, hammer away at people is like the. What works for you may not work for me, and what works for me may not work for you. And we have to understand that, like, we are so unique. Like, I love what Jirukrishnamurti says, you know, where he says, like, we think that we're different, but we're very similar. You know, like, you feel sadness, I feel sadness. You feel anger, I feel anger. But at the same time, that. That is true. Right. So the structures of our minds may be the same, but the conditioning of the mind, what the mind carries, what these emotional histories, what they've shaped out to be, you know, what they've become over time, they're very different. Right. Like, I may have this complex of anxiety and sadness. You may have a complex of, like, anger or whatnot. We're so different. So that means that the tools, the practices that are going to help us navigate our own internal forests, they may need to be very different. Especially if someone's experienced, like, really severe trauma. They may need, like, you know, lighter tools that are not going to take you super, super deep at first because it just may be too much and you won't want to do the work. That's why I really think, like, I'm so grateful that we live in this time where there's just a vast amount of practices available to us. And I think it's historically unprecedented. Like, there are all these Western modalities that have been different, Western therapies that have been available, different Eastern forms of meditation and practices that have been around for thousands of years that have now become global indigenous practices. There's just so much out there. So it really is about finding something that meets you, specifically you, where you're at. And the thing that you feel like is the best thing ever that has helped you so much. It may not work well for your friend. It may not work well for your brother and sister. They may need their own thing totally.

And I wonder if it is that karma or past lives of, like, why are certain emotions more prevalent with certain people? You know, like some people in this lifetime, it's about, like, really knowing sadness or anxiety or whatever else. And, you know, I think it's a combination of maybe past lives and childhood and, you know, DNA and all of the things together. So I'd love to end the conversation with, how do you cultivate more joy in your life? Because I feel like right now we're in such a kind of joy void time. And I feel sometimes we even feel guilty about feeling joy because there is so much suffering in the world. So how do you bring more joy in?

I bring more joy in, like, simple and mundane ways, like really enjoying the ice cream that I'm having. Like, really enjoying the sort of, like, mundane reality TV that my wife and I are watching. Or, like, just these. These moments where there's, there are, like, no pressure situations where, you know, there's no work to be done, where we're just, like, relaxing. Like, those are the moments that by far bring you the most joy, where it's just like. Like there are no objectives to get done for the next, like, two or three days, no emails to be sent or anything like that. That feels like to me, it's like, so joyful because I've had such busy days lately. So not working just like, bubbles up joy for me.

So interesting how, like, it's the simple. It's like who you were as a kid, you know, like being able to have the ice cream and watch the.

Tv, like a little taste of summer, you know, is joy.

Yeah, I love it. And we make it so complex, you know, and we think, I need to have, like, everything in my life figured out and then I can be joyful.

Oh, no, it has to be now. Like, there's no other moment besides now. It's literally the, like, eternal now. Like, you know, that moment passed, but now we're back in now again. So I have to be able to experience, like, the most beautiful parts of life. They all happen in the now. Like, wisdom occurs in the present moment. Joy occurs in the present moment. Compassion, love, all these things happen in the present moment. Otherwise they're just memories or desires for the future.

And that's what I love your book subtitle. Let go of the past. Connect with the present, Expand the future. And it's so true, because when we connect with the present, we really do expand all of the possibilities for the future.

Yeah, totally. And yeah, I hope if people pick it up out there, I hope it really serves them well. And it's, you know, it's quite different from the first two books, but it's still a book where if there's a particular chapter calling to, you can just open up and read it.

Beautiful. Well, thank you so much for being here and sharing your wisdom with us today. I'll have the link for your books and your social media below. And so grateful always to reconnect with you, brother.

Yeah. Thank you so much, Sahara. This has been such a joy. I'm always so inspired by the way you move in the world. So thank you.

That episode felt like a nourishing cup of tea with a friend. Thank you for being our third in this conversation and I hope you loved it. And if this episode sparked any revelations within you and you feel inspired to share it, I would absolutely, deeply appreciate that. It helps get this message out to more people. You know, what I love about his work is that people who aren't really into spirituality per se tend to still resonate with it. So I would love for you to share this episode on your story. I will reshare it as well. And as a free gift for writing a review on the iTunes store, which is the ultimate way to support the podcast, I will gift you my free Womb Meditation. So this is a meditation to connect your sacred feminine energy stored in your womb space, and in just eight minutes you can tune in and receive the wisdom to that she has for you. So all you got to do is leave a review for the podcast on the iTunes store, take a screenshot before hitting submit and email it over to me@saharaamsahararose.com and you can find that link over in the show notes. So thank you so much for tuning in and I'll see you in the next one. Namaste.

Dad.