561: This Is Why Dating + Relationships Are So Hard Today With Syris King-Klem

There's cause and effect in this reality. We can put energy into something and we receive something. And so in this game, which is this reality, if you're present to it, then you will physically align with, physically see and match with the people that are actually fully meant for you. When we overlay this access and this digital layer to it, there's consequences to that. And it's like, yes, you may meet someone in that augmented reality that then you can ground within base reality. And you may have never met them had it been for this layer and access. But like you said, the. The massive amount of potential doesn't mean that it's always the best thing for you. You can. You can figure it out, you can make it work. But I personally am not someone who likes to figure out my reality or make it work. I like it to be flow. I like it to be alignment, feel, feeling in my body, feeling, know what's happening here and now and be connected to that versus, like, oh, I guess I'll figure this thing out now that I'm here.

Welcome back to the Highest Self podcast. My name is Sahara Rose, and on this podcast I love to take matters of the heart and make it really relatable, especially topics around love, sex, and relationships. So in my own journey, my divorce was the biggest awakening of my entire life. You know, growing up, I always thought marriage is the pinnacle of my life. I grew up Persian, so I was always dreaming about my wedding day, and that day came and found out about a betrayal a few years later and found myself signing divorce papers, which I never would have expected ever, ever, ever. Like, growing up in my family, divorce was like a curse word. It was always like, oh, believe in divorce. We don't believe in divorce as it's like a religion or something. You either believe in it or you don't. And what I've learned is that people who've been divorced didn't necessarily want to be divorced, but they found themselves in situations where they had to be. So that brought me onto this journey of, for the first time in seven years, in my 30s, being single. And I had no idea what it's like out here on these streets. And if you're single right now, I just want to say, I see you. I see you. Are you okay? It's been rough, but I will say the beauty of it is, for the first time, I've got to really sit with, what does relationship mean to me? What does marriage mean to me? Do I even want to be another marriage? And why are relationships at large not Working. We all know the stat. 50% of marriages end in divorce. But did you know in some states, like California, where I live, 75% of them do. So the bulk, majority of people who walk down the aisle and say, till death do us part forevermore, don't end up following through with that promise. And it's sad. But also, we can't look at the past of like, oh, why aren't marriages like this anymore? I want to be like my grandparents, which a lot of us say, but it's. We're in a different day and age. We've got the Internet and online dating and the fact that a single man's income can't largely provide for a family of four anymore, the same way that it did for our parents time. We have porn addiction, sex addiction, vape addictions, weed addictions. We have the feminist movement movement. We have people being more conscious than ever before. So before is like your partner was kind of like your financial partner, business deal, and that's about it. And now we're like, oh, I want you to meet me emotionally, spiritually, financially, mentally, physically, soulfully, in all ways, at all times, as much as I change. And you gotta change at the same pace at me in the same way and support me on my dharmic journey and also question me and also this. And it's like what we're looking for kind of sometimes feels like this impossible order. And the truth is, most people, even in relationship, don't have this relationship that we're all seeking. So in this episode, we're going to talk about the true reason why modern relationships are not working. And as a lover girl, how we can get these relationships to start to work. But it starts with first looking at the muck, looking at the shadows, looking at these unspoken rules and ideas that we have from our own childhood. We might say we want a conscious relationship, but then we find ourselves in it of, well, my dad didn't do this and my mom didn't do that. So it takes us to sit with these topics. Look at how our societies have radically shifted, especially in the past 20 years, but even just since COVID how they've radically shifted. So we can look at this intangible thing like love, which actually we are the first generation to really base our relationship simply on romantic love, which, let's even unpack that. What is romantic love versus infatuation and how we can create these beautiful life partnerships. Because I still do believe in marriage. I still do believe that there's something so beautiful in two people choosing to Come together, but we've got to redefine what that means. So this is going to be a contemplation with one of my best friends on planet Earth named Cyrus. He is, if you love me, he's like a male version of me. Like, we end up talking for, like, nine hours. We did a Libra full moon ritual, lasted nine hours. And we really talk a lot about relationships. And I love speaking with him about is. He's a very conscious man. He was in the Air Force, had a spiritual awakening, went on his journey, and has learned so much from learning about Mayan wisdom and, you know, ancient Greek mythology. And he's just so learned, but really comes from this place of the heart and understanding what it's like, especially from a male perspective. I'll definitely be speaking on behalf of the feminine. Maybe we can come to an understanding on how we can make relationships work today. Wouldn't that be nice? And before we drop into this episode, be sure to hit subscribe wherever you're listening to this podcast. That is the best way to stay up to date on the latest episodes. We've got this in video format, so if you're just hearing my voice, be sure to also watch our fabulous outfits on video as well on Spotify, YouTube or the Apple Store. This is the best way to stay in the flow with future conversations and also allows the podcast to reach more people. So hit subscribe so I can keep vibing with you on all future episodes. Now let's get into this one. So without further ado, let's welcome Cyrus on the Highest Health podcast.

Welcome. Hi. Thank you. Stoked to be here.

I feel like we live in a podcast. Basically, our voice notes are just a podcast. We should just air them.

Except there's not going to be one and a half speed.

Yeah, just I'm insulted. You one and a half speed me.

That's what you said. Bring it on WhatsApp so you can one and a half speed me.

Okay, True, true. Because I go on for, like, 17 minutes, but now we're going to go on for however long we want. So the first question I'm going to ask you is, what makes you your highest self?

Great. The first word that comes to me is flow. So whenever I'm in the flow between being challenged and also in surrender, so the space between doing the work but also surrendering the work, so the first thing that comes to me is like, surfing. Because surfing is, like the best analogy or metaphor for this. It's like you have to choose the wave you want. To ride, you have to look and see where you're going. But you can't focus too much on where you're going. So you surrender to the motion that's happening around you. But you also have to have the stability and the strength. So it's that dynamic moment between surrender and action. And that's, for me, not just surfing, but, of course, finding those moments in life and bringing that to the moment that I'm in.

And it's such a great analogy of relationship, because in relationship, we can do our own inner work, which a lot of us are doing. We know about attachment styles, we know about codependency and all these things. But there's an element of surrender of you actually don't really control who you fall in love with and who shows up in your field and how it's gonna go. So as much as we can write down the lists of everything we're calling in, God just places someone on our pathway for whatever reason. And then it's that. I like how you said choosing which waves you're gonna surf, that sometimes people show up in your field. And is this the wave I wanna surf? Is this the dance? And also some waves, they come like, really big and then they kind of dissipate totally, you know, and then some waves, you don't see them coming and they're big ones. You didn't see that relationship happening. And here you are. I feel like a trim surfer. I mean, I'm a mermaid. So the ocean.

You're the og.

Exactly. We go under the water too. But I just think that's such a beautiful metaphor. You've probably just subconsciously of, like, what we're talking about today. So as we dive into this massive question of why relationships aren't working. I remember we once had a conversation about the history of America and how our grandparents and our parents and our experience of relationship is so different. So can you share with us some of this history?

Totally, yeah. And if we look at our grandparents and we can go further back. But let's start with our grandparents. For me, my grandparents were in World War II, so end of World War I, World War II. So in many ways they had everything taken away from them. And similar to, like, where we were at Covid, it was this entire new world. So the world was at war, there was the Great Depression. So there was a massive amount of scarcity and lack. That was real to a lot of people. And then that shifted and then through the Industrial Revolution and then into. Well, really what it is is, like, marketing and the commercialization of goods is what gave our parents a tremendous amount of access and false luxury. So some luxury, but just the quantity, right? So then from grandparents who basically are born into or endure extreme lack, parents who go through in a seeming abundance of opportunity, but it's also very shallow. It's like the beginning of ads in magazines and TV and that whole machine. So then we're born into this world. So like one generation before us, and then us with this, we're kind of in a whole new world between having to go through the work of resolving our grandparents lack doing the work to resolve this need for more, constant need for more and access to more like our parents had. And we're left unfulfilled, we're left disconnected, and we're. It's a really hard place to be, especially for people who aren't even aware of that. So I think that's the overarching. The arc that American culture has been on. And so it kind of leaves us, you and I, in this generation with a lot of work to do in terms of ancestral healing. But also it gives us a massive opportunity because we can create that next phase so we can get rid of the excess. We can get rid of all the fluff. We can get rid of all the. I'm just thinking of like, KitchenAid ads that our mom would have of all the kitchen equipment and then our dads, right? All the campers and the cars and all the options that they had. And that came because we. All of the businesses and corporations came online, right? And so then thinking back to, like, my grandfather, who would save strings from feed bags to make mops, and he would give these mops to people to clean their house from strings of feed bags. Like, that's the level of, like, frugality. And there's a beauty to that and there's a simplicity to that, but there's also this deep core of something's going to come and take away what we have. We have to fight tooth and nail to survive. So that's kind of where I feel like I've recognized that, seen that, to shift out of that and to see, okay, what that's where we come from culturally, where do we want to go and who do we want to experience that with and who you experience life with. They come with their ancestral work or patterns, all of that. Right?

Yeah. It sounds like our grandparents time chose, who can I survive with? Our parents chose, who's going to provide for me the lifestyle or the family life that I want. And now we don't really know what the question is. And what I believe the question to ask ourselves is, who can support me in my dharma, in my soul's purpose? And that is the decision to make. What I find happening right now is we are growing and changing so quickly because we every day on social media, if you're conscious, you're seeing all, like, these different videos and you're, you know, listening to podcasts and you're doing all this work that obviously the rate of growth is going to be different. And if this is a generalization, but tends to be women go first before men. We've had a lot of these conversations, but then even the pathways are different. You know, someone can go on the meditation pathway, someone else on the plant medicine pathway, and they're like different places. So what I find hard is, you know, the beauty of that is we're learning and growing. And the shadow side of that is to find someone growing in the same direction at the same level you at the same time. It's impossible.

It's really tough. Yeah. But that only really happens now that we're able to even ask that question. We're able to connect with someone from their dharma. And previously someone's dharma was to have kids, to be a mother. And that's so many people's dharma. And that's an amazing dharma. I mean, it is what our biology is literally for. But now we have this opportunity to build upon that. So it's not to negate that or diminish that in any way. It's like, how do we build upon that and connect with someone? And that's where, of course, you writing books, likewise books, films, music, all of these things. And what I feel is the question is more about who can you create with? Because. And I feel right now the theme of this is where we're going to come back to is creation is the action, but also the surrender. It's that moment of how do we of who we are, how do we express ourselves, how do we show up in the world? And how do we create that next phase? Yes, we can create children, and we can also create these messages, platforms that reach more people than anyone our parents, grandparents, ever had not even access to, but could even fathom.

And what I find happening is a lot of people still aren't in that, like, creativity as a form of healing and growth pathway. So what happens is, let's say you meet someone, you have great chemistry with them, but the way that they chill at the end of a workday is they just, like, sit down and they watch tv.

Exactly.

You know, so this person's life is, I work, I watch Netflix and on the weekends I go to the bar and you know, sometimes go to a concert and that's life for me. And sometimes they're in a relationship with someone who's like, I'm sitting with my limiting beliefs and I'm questioning my consciousness and all of these things. Do you think it's even possible for these two people to be in relationship?

Maybe, you know, there may be someone that perfectly that's what they desire and how they can support each other and that's worked for them. I don't know how sustainable that is or like what, why there's such a stark difference in decisions or actions and how that manifests. So I would be hesitant to say that that may be the most long term. It's not what I want. But if someone's there and it works, that's great. But what you just spoke to is recreation. We were just talking about this previously. We talked about this often, which is the problem. And I can speak for men and for myself. Probably the most significant problem that men face is. Well, it's the problem they don't face, which is they use recreation and leisure to escape. So sports, entertainment, like you said it earlier, vaping, weed, all the addictions, porn addiction, sexual addiction, sexual hunting addiction, which is just the dating apps. And being in that energy of pursuant, using that to find leisure and pleasure and using that to try to recreate oneself is very unsustainable. It's very taxing. You're, you're spending a lot of energy. So it leaves people depleted, depressed, isolated and disconnected. So I think that's what most men know now as normal. And that to me is really tragic because that means that that man, how they show up in relationship is from a depleted place, how they show up at work, everything. Because if they're using leisure and recreation to deplete themselves and not recreate themselves, what do they have to give? So then, and this gets into hormones. So if, if recreation is based on dopamine, then, then you're only spending, you're, you're doing this external activity or taking something externally to create the dopamine rush. That's an unsustainable hormone to build a life upon. Serotonin, oxytocin and endorphins, Creativity, going on walks, being in nature, eating healthfully, lifestyle. If you build your life on those hormones. That's why when you experience something that raises your dopamine, that's great, but you don't seek it out. You don't depend on that. So I think that's the biggest problem men face, especially through porn, sports, entertainment. And I mean, those are the big ones really, like, yeah, smoking and drinking, yes. But really the visual addictions are, I think, are so taxing for men.

Have you recently gone through a heartbreak that rocked your world? And honestly, you're still maybe picking up the pieces. You've learned so much from this experience, but you also know there's so much more awaiting you and probably you have an intuitive sense that this was meant to happen for you to become your highest self. Well, I've been there. At the end of 2022, I found out that my then husband had been cheating on me and it was the most horrible news I've ever gotten. But now looking back on it, I can say it was my life's greatest blessing because without that, I would have never left the marriage where honestly, we were quite incompatible in many different ways. But it took me getting to that level for me to actually see. See what was not working in the relationship and for me to set off and create this new life where I traveled the world for a year, started producing music, singing, rapping, dropped an album called My Body is an Altar that has hundreds of thousands of streams around Spotify, creating music videos, moving to la, dressing in these really cute outfits, becoming my fullest expression, and most importantly, not having anything in my consciousness that I'm afraid of anymore. I have become truly liberated. And that is the gift of a heartbreak. So all my friends would come to me when they would go through their heartbreaks. I know a lot of people are in it right now and this is why I've decided to create my ultimate heartbreak healing course. So it guides you step by step with the exact tools and realizations that I used on myself during my heartbreak that have allowed me to not just heal from it, but but become this version of me that I am frankly obsessed with. So for 33 days, every single day, I will be guiding you through a practice journal prompt will be writing poetry, healing and transmuting so much. But most importantly, taking this as the opportunity for you to become the version of you that you've always felt it was too soon to be. So I'm so excited for you to get started. As soon as you join the course, you can get started on day one. I have seen insane transformations and I can't wait to see what awaits you on the other side. So head over to iam saharrose.com heartbreak and use coupon code podcast for $50 off. Again, that's I am Sahara S A H a r a rose.com heartbreak and use coupon code podcast for $50 off. You can find that link in the show notes. And I'm super excited for you to meet the version of you that's on the other side. Guys, I'm gonna put you on some game right now, okay? Let's be real. Meal planning, grocery shopping, cooking, getting the right ingredients and not having a bunch of leftovers. It is a huge hassle. And take it from someone who literally wrote a cookbook, I don't have time to do all of that. I really don't. Because I'm here dropping bars on this podcast for y'. All. So when I tried Hungry Root and I've heard of these food delivery services before, but this one blew me out of the water. And let me tell you why. Okay, first of all, I took the most amazing quiz. Like, they really tried to get to know me. It was like this or that. Like, do you like short, easy, four ingredient recipes or do you like ones that have a little bit more time, like, are you into meat and seafood? Or do you prefer more of a grain bowl? Like, I was like, this is like a personality quiz and food in one. It was amazing. And all the ingredients are super, super clean. But not only did they bring me the ingredients and the recipes to cook all of the meals, but all these delicious snacks and drinks and breakfast that I would literally see at a grocery store. And some that I've never even heard of. Like, I got these really good keto sugar free donuts with 1 gram of sugar that were so delicious. And I would have had to like buy that at the grocery store. And they delivered it right to me in my box. So I was super blown away. I even just did like an extra Instagram reel for them because I'm like, y' all people need to know. So right now I'm so excited they're working with me because I'm like, I'm obsessed. Hungry Root is offering us high self podcast listeners 40% off your first delivery and free veggies for life. So just go to hungryroot.com highest self to get your first delivery and your free veggies for life. That's hungryroot.com highest self. And don't forget to use the link so they know where we sent you. You can find that over in the show notes. So trust your intuition. Trust you in the wisdom, Trust you in the gu. Yeah, here's what I See happening now as having been single for years, having experience of dating. This is like the overarching, like, theme. The men are not living their dharmas. They aren't getting their, like, hunter energy out there. They are in these jobs where they have to be complacent, where they have to follow their boss and this and that. So they're not in their, like, primal male energy. Right. So this gets suppressed. And often they are resentful. They are angry that women have risen and they haven't. And they long for those times where men were in control and looked up to, and it's no longer. And they are blaming the feminist movement for that. And then they go online and they hear people like Andrew Tate and this red pill movement, which I hate that it's called red pill movement because the red pill in the matrix is actually the truth.

Yes.

Saying is not the truth. But what they do is they speak into this frustration that men are experiencing right now of, you don't feel respected, you don't feel revered, you don't feel like. Like an alpha man. And that's true. That's true how they feel. And it's true that men need to be primal and, and wild and. And have that. But then the solution is the conquest is Ferraris and many women and money and these capitalistic things which are never going to actually give you fulfillment, always had were rites of passage, vision quests, medicine ceremonies, men's circles, initiations, men to look up to. So because they're lacking that, they know they need to conquest something. So it's like conquest woman, conquest money, conquest this and that. The other thing is because society has gotten so expensive with inflation and everything. Like, we were talking about how in our dad's time, like, it was normal. Dad could provide for everyone in the family.

It's like 12 raspberries by like a.

Literally, he's like, yeah, I bought a.

House for $80,000, you know, and that was like $330,000.

Exactly. And if you live in somewhere like LA, even a million dollars won't even get you a house. You know, and it's. And people's income is not rising to the level of what it takes to provide for a family and a household and all of these things. So then men are like, well, I don't have the means to be in a relationship, let alone even just dating. You know, you go out on dates. It's like, you go out on dates, buy dinner, get drinks. That's a couple hundred dollars right there. To be actively doing that every Week. Multiple times a week. Most men just can't afford that. And we also have to have compassion for them, too. So then how the men feel is, well, let me not pursue. Let me. Not exactly. Let me make sure this doesn't become a relationship. So how am I gonna do that? I'm gonna take a really long time to text her, and I'm gonna have a lot of space in between. And if she starts talking about love and stuff, I'm gonna kind of stop it right there. And I'm gonna tell her that I'm still healing from my ex and that, you know, not that I'm sticking from experience, but, you know, I'm go. I'm going to say these things to make sure it doesn't turn into a relationship. Yeah, Consciously they're thinking, because I don't have time for relationship and I'm not in a place in my career, but it's subconsciously, it's because I don't feel as a man, I can provide. So then oftentimes they're saying, well, then screw it. These women are demanding. They're gold diggers. They're requiring so much from me emotionally. I don't understand them. But I have the sexual desire, so I'm just going to watch porn, which is easy to find. You can find any kind of it that you want. And it's triggering our. Our brain, that it's making us have this massive amount more for men. Doesn't really do this for women, but this massive amount of dopamine that makes you extremely addicted. And then the way that these porn algorithms are is like, you start watching, like, I don't know, two girls on a beach. Exactly. Two girls on a beach. You're. I'm gonna go risque with two girls here. And then the next thing, it's like, oh, do you want to see this orgy? They're like, oh, wow, okay, let me watch this orgy. It's like, do you want to see this gang bang? They're like, oh, wow, okay. And it's like, do you want to see this? Like, it's like crazy things, and I'm not even getting into it.

Yeah, and then, like, straight spiral.

Exactly. And then. Because what they do is they stimulate you so much, but then they put in these darker agendas happening here, which I actually decided to, because I'm very interested in these topics. I was like, I'm curious on this pornhub, which is the greatest web. The biggest website. Not the greatest. The biggest. The greatest website of pornography. And I've never. Never. As I'm not interested in porn at all. But I'm just like. So for me, I'm like, anthropological of, like, what's really happening here. And the biggest category was stepmom. Stepfather Incest.

Yeah.

Yeah. And I was like, wow, this is insane, because you might just be looking for regular sex. And then you're like, oh, whatever the character plays here is this stepfather with the stepdaughter. I'm just gonna ignore that. But then you're in this place of climax, which, as we know, orgasmic energy is manifest manifestation energy. It's your most powerful energy. It's focused, you're there, but it's this disgusting agenda, and that's in your subconscious now. So these men are getting hooked on this porn that then if they even become in front of a naked woman, it's not enough mass amounts of erectile dysfunction, you know, And a lot of people, too, needing to watch porn while they have sex because the act of sex is not enough because they're so numb to it. So then there's more shame of I can't date because of the erectile dysfunction. So it's created this web. And then with the porn now it's turned into VR that they're creating VR experiences that you can have sex with a porn star. You know, they're sex dolls now. There's AI girlfriends. So you can even have. You can even code a girlfriend to say what you want. So it's like, between my AI, my VR and my sex doll, I don't have to buy her dinner. I'm just gonna stay in that. But the thing is, as a human, that will never be enough because you're not being touched, you're not being loved. And it's a fallacy to think that, oh, men just want heartless sex. They don't.

No.

Men are extremely emotional. You know, some studies say that men actually feel love, even to a greater capacity than women, but because they feel it so much, they're scared of it, you know, so that. And so then on the other end, as women, we're like, where are the men pursuing us? They're not asking me out. They just want situationships. They don't even come up to me anymore. Like I was telling you at the gym, I was like, I don't have guys come up to me. Also because of AirPods. Yeah, that. It's like, I'm on an AirPod. They're on an AirPod. So it's like, as a guy, I can imagine that's extremely nerve Wracking. Some girl might be listening to a podcast, she might be listening to this right now. He's not gonna be like, hey, pretty lady, yeah, take off those AirPods, I'm ask you out on a dinner that I can't even afford. Like, you know, so that's happening. On top of that, then the women are like, where are the men? Where are the conscious, empowered men? I'm just going to keep improving myself. It must be because I'm not a high value woman enough. So I'm just going to keep reading about myself, improving myself, glowing up, uploving, making more money, being more successful all the time, these things. Now the bar is higher. Where there are very few men who can let alone meet you, let alone surpass you, there is this core biological need for women and it's maybe something we need to relook at and visit, that we want a man to make more money than us. So then if, let's say the average female income is 60,000, average man is. And I don't know exactly what it is, I know it's a little bit less, let's say it's 55 or whatever it is, and I think it's separating even more. Well, there's just gonna be less and less men on top of that, men who are doing inner work and this and that. So then women are told this dream of, well, if you just become good enough, this magical man will appear. And he is embodied and he is conscious and he is an alpha man. And he gives you princess treatment, but he listens to you and he can read your thoughts and you know, but has his own big mission and you know, like all these things and it's like you're just thinking, just improve yourself enough. And here he'll come like fucking Santa Claus. And so then when men do approach them, they're like, ew, you're not Jason Momoa. Exactly, back off. And then men feel rejected, so they don't reject. And then we have this massive divide that you see ourselves in right now. So where do we get started here?

There's so many things. The common thread that you just said though is that men feel resentment and anger. And then the woman who says, I'm just going to glow up and work on myself, she rises and rises in her energy and capacity. Then she's resentful. So then there's this disconnection between what they want and who they are and an inability to communicate and this searching for the one instead of searching for someone or not even searching for, but Recognizing who shows up in the field and choosing someone rather than looking for the one. And that's the thing. Any relationship is a continual choosing. And as soon as that choice stops being made and it goes on autopilot, that's where the relationship is. Basically it goes off the rails.

Here's what I find as a woman, that many men are just choosing to not be in relationship.

They're not. Yeah, because like you said, there's all this access to the quick release, the quick fix and then devaluing of not only themselves, but of women. And so then women feel, I mean I can say from what I know I felt before is that there's this massive gap, there's a chasm and so might as well, same thing. I'm just going to focus and do what I want to do. And that's not something that our previous generations face or dealt with. So how we deal with this is essential because how we deal with this, resolve this and then potentially have children and bird the next generation and raise the next generation is massively consequential. So our massive increase in awareness of all of these things increases our responsibility to do something with them. So I think that's why we're having this conversation right now is what do we do with this massive increase in awareness and this shifting of power. So like you were talking about how men have felt the shifting of power and they want things to go back to the way they were. There is some value to the masculine leadership and the feminine receptivity and openness. And then the shadow of that is if a woman's fully in her receptivity and openness, then she's not self sufficient. So she's completely dependent on the man. So if the man says, does, believes, goes, so where's her value? Where's her sovereignty, where's her choice? Where's her unique experience? It gets funneled into. And so, and then that's where then the resentment happens in relationship, not just out of relationship. So I think that's the thread that.

And then we often pendulum shift that you experience, you know, a relationship where the woman is extremely receptive but she's completely dependent on you financially. And then you're like, I don't want that because it's extremely burdensome for me. It's hard enough for me to be able to pay my own bills and survive and, and then plus my wants and travel and all the things, let alone someone else's and their lifestyle. So then maybe they'll go for the super independent woman who has Everything done and d. And then they're like, well, now I don't have that same partnership anymore. Or she doesn't, you know, have as much time for me. And I, I find. And as women too, we keep oscillating between extremes. And even societally, I feel like our parents generation was very like, you get married till deaths are you part. You don't question it. And now our, the youth today are like, I don't know, I don't like how you like wore your tied your shoes. I got the ick. Yeah. And it's like crazy, you know, it's like we are now looking for any excuse to not be in relationship. And so I think it's the question to ask ourselves, and it's one I continue to ask myself is what do I even want a relationship for?

I think this is the conversation you and I have had the most outside of this one. Yeah, well, there's so many different ways into it, but, but we are living in a hyper individualized society, especially now, because previously, if it's like I was talking with grandparents, with World War II, there was a sense of community and there was a cultural sense of bonding together, but that's where the family unit became so strong. And then same thing in the 50s, the family unit was so strong, but that's where the rise of the feminist movement started to separate and pull the woman away from the nuclear family unit. And then the education system started to pull the children away from the family unit to indoctrinate and re educate the children based on very, very shallow education principles that create robotic cogs in the machine. So that is where that family unit started to get broken apart. So we're now experiencing the end result of the breaking apart of the nuclear family, which in some ways is tragic, but it also gives us an opportunity to recreate that in a new way. Yet we, you and I, our generation, have to go through this hyper individualism, especially in America. Like when I lived in Germany, it was kind of there, but they looked at America and again they were like, wow, the hero. What a, what an amazing, glamorous place to live. So, so many cultures think this is the place, but to actually be here and live here, it's massively isolating, it's massively disorienting. And so then we're left hyper independent with this great opportunity, but massively unfulfilled. Which I think going back to the resentment, but deeper than that, resentment and anger, when you're talking about like the Andrew Tate red pill movement, the anger that they're speaking to. What that does is it's keeping men and confirming that that level of consciousness is true, that that's authentic, that that's real. And yes, it is, and it needs to be acknowledged. However, what transitions us out of lower emotions and into higher emotions is courage. So it takes the courage to say, I'm going to do it differently. I'm going to leave this relationship. I'm going to leave operating with my family in a way that keeps me safe in their eyes, that keeps me good in their eyes, that keeps me loved. Because we don't want to do something that's going to then potentially mean. Love is withheld. So we stay in these lower emotions of fear, grief, apathy, which is doing nothing. And hatred is actually the same, same emotion. So we get stuck there. But courage. And I think most people listening to this podcast have made that shift into courage, but we still feel these lower emotions circling and swirling all around us culturally and in our relationships. And that's why we're doing the work. But courage is that emotion that shifts us into higher emotions. That's where then we can access surrender, acceptance, joy, peace, love, unconditional love, and then enlightenment. And enlightenment is, for me, it's not something that I'm striving to. To live all the time, but it's being able to feel that fully when it does come, feeling the joy fully when it does come, knowing that I'm going to strive for unconditional love. But I have massive amounts of conditions with myself, how I treat myself, that limit how unconditionally I can love someone else. So that, to me, is where the, like, the propaganda and the attention some people gain and the influence some people gain by speaking to these lower emotions of anger and fear and hatred. Politics, obviously, right? That's hatred and fear, separation. It creates a ginormous amount of energy and attention. However, once that shift is made into courage, that's where we start living. And my goal is being in resonance with a relationship, a friendship with my family that I don't compare where they are to where I am. However, there's this. It's being able to see the unconditional love when it's there, being able to see the joy and feel it fully and experience it fully when it's there, but not hold people to this standard or expectation of where they should be. And that's kind of where we're getting to the kind of the paradox and the nuance of what you're willing to. The boundaries of what you're Willing to tolerate in a relationship and also being open to them, being that an independent, unique person on their own journey. But yeah, there's so many threads there in terms of the resentment, the anger, the lower emotions and why men, especially men go to think extreme visual outlets or external inputs to essentially not even allow themselves to shift into those higher emotions. So just a lack of courage.

And I think it's courage to say the hard thing when you're in the relationship that may make the relationship dissolve. Yeah, I think most of us when we're in relationship, we're like, oh my God, I'm in this relationship. I'm scared of what my life will be without this companionship. Because our societies are so isolating that your relationship is like your entire island. You know, Whereas before you had friends, you had family, you had people in your, in your tribe, you had, you know, different recreational outlets. But for most people, most people have three friends. That's the actual average, you know, including their partners often. And also 50 of people they found don't even feel comfortable telling their partners their dreams.

Wow. Like physically when they wake up, like.

They'Re like, no, like their, their big dream.

Probably both actually.

Yeah. And probably that too. So. So when you do find partnership, it's like, okay, if I lose you, I lose everything. The person I talk to, the person I sleep with, the person I make decisions with, the person that helps me when I need to open up packages or if I have to go to my parents house and deal with something. You're everything. So I can't. So the courage to say that uncomfortable thing which may dissolve the relationship or it may make the relationship up level, you know, like I remember when I was in my marriage, you know, I'm in the spiritual community, everyone talk about ayahuasca and I have this fear of. I'm scared if I sit with ayahuasca, it will tell me to not be in this relationship. And I can't have that. So there was a part of me subconsciously that knew that if I really, really listened to the voice of truth, it would tell me to not be in this relationship. And I can't because, you know, I need to be in this relationship. I don't know who I am.

The religion of we don't divorce.

Exactly. So, you know, and I do think that's what's so beautiful about spiritual practices, whether it's ceremony or just like sitting in honesty. And like there is a tantric practice of saying the uncomfortable truth. And just like saying that thing that's like, it's like an ouch, but it's also a turn on. When you're able to just be so transparent with someone and be received. And if it's not meant to be in your highest truth, it's not meant to be. So there's the courage to say that thing in relationship. There's the courage to be single. You know, the courage of waiting and not like, jumping ship, which I think a lot of single people reach a point that they're just like, oh, my God, it's never gonna happen. Let me just settle for this thing. And what I have found in my journey is like, once you've reached a certain point of consciousness, you can't.

You can't.

You can try to convince yourself to.

And you can try. Yeah, no, you can try and you can. And. Yeah. But yeah, it's.

You've seen me, I've tried, and it's just like, it can't work.

But you learn so much because you also have. Have a massive amount of personal integrity.

Yes.

Where you know that there's not anything someone else has that you need. Yeah, that's the. That's the. I think the shift is there's other things that people have that you want to experience, you want to feel, you want to enjoy with them, and that's friendship, partnership, and that's that physical, mental. Right. However, you, me, knowing you as a friend now, you don't have that sense that someone has something that you need.

Yes.

That's the key.

Yes. And I think that that's why I'm so proud of myself for not going straight into another relationship, because that's what most of us do. You know, you leave a relationship, you're in that place of a void where you're so used to being in partnership. You're so used to, like, waking up next to someone, having someone for all these things, that it literally feels like your right arm was chopped off. And then you're like, shit, I can't even focus on anything else until I find a replacement arm. So could it be you, you, you, or you often just recreate that same person, another dynamic, instead of sitting in our solitude, sitting in our single dom, noticing all of these thoughts and limiting beliefs that are coming up and healing those, and then the quality of relationship will just be so much higher. And I've just noticed in myself of, like, throughout this year and a half, of, like, anyone I'm attracted to is such a reflection of me and my consciousness. And I always learn something, you know, and I'm like, Oh, I see why. And then at end, the. The quality person keeps getting better and closer, and then you're realizing you're like, okay, maybe this person met me. Really, Like, I don't know, we shared a love for music and dance and things like that. But there wasn't this, like, dharmic connection or this. And you keep getting closer. The paradox of that is you could also be waiting forever for someone to check all the boxes, and that doesn't happen as well, you know, And I think that our generation in general, the people who are single have these impossible standards, and then the people who are in relationship almost have no standards.

Yeah, you said something which is when you get out of relationship, most people get straight into another relationship. And so when you're, let's say you're two, three, four years into a relationship, the universe is witnessing you in a certain energy. So whenever you remove that energy, there's a massive amount of energy in what. How you manifest and how you see the world where the universe is going to give you that. Either that exact person or the exact opposite or some form of karmic reflection immediately. And that's the ultimate test is can you see it for what it is, or do you. Which is a test for you to get back into the same loop or a similar loop, or it seems like a completely different loop, but you wind up at the exact same place when you started the relationship. So that's the key. That's why the space in between relationships allows your nervous system to reset, allows your reticular activating system, and which is how you look and perceive the world. And what do you notice? So for someone that's just getting out of a relationship, they're naturally going to notice the things in the world that confirms their previous reality. But if you give yourself a pause and you change how you see the world, you'll see things that were always there, but now you can see them because you change your RAs, your particular activating system.

Oh, you go about the world in a different way in relationship versus not completely. Like, everything about you actually shifts. Because when you're in relationship, it's almost like you have this home. And so it's like you're doing life and you're meeting people, but like, you got your house, you know, you're a little bit less curious of new experiences because you also have a responsibility to be there. And there's attending to that relationship when you're single, the challenge and the opportunities to find that home within yourself.

Exactly.

You know, to realize that I'M home anywhere that I go. And what I find happens is you start to open up a lot of these walls that you had when you were in a relationship that you know, because humans require intimacy and intimacy doesn't mean physical or sexual. But just like I noticed with myself, it's like I just talk to the Uber driver more. I talk to the person at the front desk more. Like, because I don't have like this home to go back to, you know, I'm just be myself all the time that I'm just like, hey, like tell me about this. And even my friends notice I just became so much closer to people, so much more vulnerable to people because you don't have that one person that you go to for everything. So it makes you open up to friendships a lot more totally.

Well, the openness right there, the second to last word you said openness is everything because in relationship you can get comfortable and that comfort creates closures because you have needs that are seemingly fulfilled. However, when you go into a new relationship, you're more open to your reality, you're open to your life. You're more open to the Uber driver or the cashier. And I think some people, when they get out of relationship, they're in closure, they close down more. They say, I was so hurt in that relationship, I'm going to close down so I don't have to be hurt again. So it's a choice. You're living completely by choice to open now that you're single. So how you're opening is, is a reflection of what you're going to be able to see, who you're going to be able to attract. And that's why the people that you do attract, you're able to see them for who they are, how they're in alignment with you, how they're out of alignment with you. And there's a massive, massive level of awareness and connection to that versus this kind of like I don't really know what's happening. And kind of the lost maiden versus the, the aware, attuned in integrity, aligned being soul who is aware of what's happening in her reality.

Yeah.

And you see how you're, you're allowing someone in more and then you see what they have and that's a reflection of you. And, and then you learn about yourself that way. But that happens through the openness. So of course you need the boundaries and of course you need those not closures, but you need those clear guidelines. However, coming out of a relationship, I think the most important thing is to radically open yourself to not necessarily any and all people in any and all experiences, but a fundamental shift of openness. So you can fundamentally shift. I think that's essential.

Yeah. I decided after to be really in the surrender experiment of just saying yes to so many things I wouldn't have done before, which led to me literally traveling the world for a year.

Portugal, Afro nation.

Exactly. And they all led me to different phases of myself.

Yeah.

The shadow side I had going on was I had in the backstory of, and maybe I'll meet my person here and maybe I'll meet him there and maybe. And it's this thing, I'm curious. Do men do this? This is something women do. You walk into a room, you look around, you're like, is he here? Because we all have our like type. And then when he's not, then you're kind of like, ugh, like a little bummed out. Do men like do this? Do you ever walk into a room like, is she here or not really?

Kind of. I don't think it does much. I think there is a little. Well, yeah, there's a fundamental difference there.

But do you think men. Okay. I would say most women that I talk to are actively looking for a relationship, you know, but they feel that they have had their hearts broken so many times that they're like, I don't even want to try, you know, so I'm just going to kind of wait and do me until the relationship happens. It feels like most men are actively trying to not get into relationship. They keep meeting amazing women, but because they are not where they want to be in lives, healing from their. Healing from your ex is such a fucking excuse.

It's such an excuse because that's closure and it's being stuck in the past of some idea that something happened there that's too heavy, dark, intense to actually feel fully. So you keep carrying it with you in the moment. So then you project that onto future people to keep yourself safe. But it's not safe.

So do you as a man, for the most part, we can't speak on. On all. Do you feel most men are kind of like trying to avoid relationships because they feel like it's going to deter them from their career path.

Yeah, career path, but also single men, there's this feeling of getting on with your life and you don't want someone to get in the way or mess with you or. Yeah. Kind of knock you off your routine. And those routines can be very self employed and destructive and not great routines. But you get comfortable in it. And so you don't want someone coming in and then you having to actually do the work to change and be better. Or if someone's on it, right, like on point, they don't want a distraction because they see their life then as a machine and an algorithm that they're tinkering with, which is like the uber masculine energy of like this optimization, biohacking thing, which is just another way to like disconnect and isolate, which is everything in its own time and experience and balance is essential and beneficial. But the words coming to me as passive aggression because there's this passivity of like, oh, I'm just going to wait for them to come. And then amidst that there's all this aggression that's being built up. Like we were talking earlier about the resentment. So that that passive aggressive in, out, one foot in, one foot out, not fully being where you are is such a like bug of our time. Like it's such a. Yeah. If and since reality is an algorithm and it is in many ways a machine full of infinite options, these shadows and these places in which we get stuck, they create these bugs, right? And like originally, like a bug the term bug came from because actual bug was in a computer and fried circuits. And so like that's like where the term comes from. But that's what happens. We get these things that come into our circuits, porn, entertainment, addictions, and they fry our circuits and so they, they mess up our operating system. And then some people will have those circuits get fried and they'll get comfortable with them and they don't want someone coming in, challenging them. That has to make them reactivate certain parts of themselves. So they just get on with their life, keep doing what they're doing.

And there's this fallacy that most men, I think subconsciously have of a woman is going to deter me from my purpose, deter me from my abundance, my career, when not always, but often she enhances that because she is your reflecting, you know, partner. To talk about these things with which most men lack gives you a sense of providing for something that's beyond you. You know, just a partner to go through life with. But I think maybe men have been in codependent relationships with women who have given all of their emotional well being to the power of these men. So then they think all women are like that. So they're like, women are going to hold me back. And then so I see even a lot of like really powerful and even conscious men still choosing to be with like disempowered women. Who they feel is not going to require as much from them so they can focus on their purpose rather than being someone who's an energetic equal to them, who's actually going to propel you. But that propelling is not going to come from coddling. And oh, you're so amazing at everything you do at all times. Well, it's also going to. Cause I think that's what the awakened feminine does is like she sees your shadows. Like it's impossible to be with an awakened woman or an awakened man without your shadows coming to surface.

That's what relationships are for.

Exactly.

And it's who do you want to experience that with? And can you find and discover and move through those in a way that leads you or leaves you feeling better than when it started?

Yes.

Like can you go through that and be held and feel held? Because it's going to happen. But how that happens and the feeling that remains and the growth that can happen there is what makes all the difference.

And that's always my prayer of may this leave us better than we found each other. And I think that that's what a successful relationship is. It's not till death do us part. It's not like stand up. If you got 20 years in your marriage. Good job, Bob and Sue, 30 years.

Anyway, I gotta tell you something here. My grandfather's memorial, one of my siblings stood up and basically applauded. My grandparents marriage married 65 years. And I must say, my grandparents, amazing marriage. They were intimate, they were loving, they were cute, they were physically affectionate. Amazing role model for me. And then he basically, my sibling at the memorial is basically like, oh, it's up to us to carry on that lineage. And every one of his children, the marriages are like, like still together. All of the, all of his kids, they're still married. And then all of his, his grandchildren were all still married after that. An one of an uncle, they separated, multiple cousins separated. There's like boom, boom, boom. So it was this moment of like, let's, let's put so much power in this idea. And it was almost like that being said, I don't know how, but in some way it seemed like that that almost opened the door for reality to come in because that was one reality. And for that to be a part of how my grandfather's memorial is was beautiful because it was true for my grandfather. But then projecting that onto his children, which is my dad and the children, which are my cousins, we're in a new world. We're different people, we have different relationships. And so I'm so grateful to have that, that reflection and that being shown that kind of love. And I know it's possible. I've experienced that kind of love and the grace to understand it's a whole new world. We live an entire different reality. And how we move through that, I think is so important that grace and treating each other with grace. If the single in relationship, getting out of relationship, you know, bad breakups can serve their place if it's part of the karma. But all breakups can happen with that vision of are we leaving each other better off than we found each other? And if not, then ending it is a good thing. So actually you still are leaving each other better because you're ending it. So if it's not working and it needs to end and you do the thing that you need to do and end it, you're still in a good place. You're still in alignment with what's true. And it may be a painful truth, but at least it's true because then you can build upon that. So you can build upon I just got out of a relationship that wasn't good. And that truth, you can find the next truth. And that can propel you on your path.

Because you're listening to this podcast, I'm gonna make a quick assumption about you. Your friends come to you for advice whenever you're at a party, someone corners you you at the side of the snack table and starts telling you all of their childhood dramas. And you actually love diving deep into spiritual topics. And you have a really good way of communicating with people. So the best way to actually create a career doing this is through coaching. But I know a lot of people, they're like, I don't even know where to start. I don't even know what type of coach I would be. So I've created a quick, easy quiz to discover your unique coaching style. So there are three categories, the intuitive, transformational or innovation empathetic coach. So the intuitive one really works with your intuition. You're able to receive downloads, you just have insights about people. The transformational one has more of that fire energy. You love to keep it real and help people go through the deepest phoenix, rising from the ashes moments in their lives. And the empathetic coach really loves to listen, hold space. They're very grounded, nurturing. So if you're curious which type you are, you can try my flower free quiz@quiz.highestselfinstitute.com Again, that's quiz.highselfinstitute.com which is my School that certifies spiritual life coaches. And you can find that link in the show notes. I'm super excited to see what type of coach you are because I'm a hire you one day. So trust your intuition, trust your inner wisdom, trust you in the guidance. Yeah. I believe if you can look at the relationship and say, we've left each other better for the most part than we found each other, we brought each other closer to our dharmas, whether that is in your career or birthing children or whatever the thing was then, that was a successful relationship. And again, yeah, my grandparents beautiful marriage. But it's like, realistically, how much did they change in their lives? Like, not that much. So. So we're kind of comparing ourselves to this model that's like a different breed of humans and a different breed of society. I think the other big piece that we struggle with today are our cell phones. So we have these individualized, like, for before I get into apps and all that. We just have these individualized things in our hands all the time that are always distracting us because it's our own curated TV that all of our friends live in.

Yeah.

You know, sometimes I think I'm like, I see you. I see my friends in person. I'm like, wow, you're a real human. Because I just see your little profile picture on here and I just hear your voice, you know?

Yeah.

So it's like, of course we're addicted to this thing. We work out of there. Our leisure time is in there. Our relationships are in there, is in these little things. So those moments that you back in the day could have met someone, you know, waiting in line somewhere at the gym, even, like, waiting at a bar for someone, we go on our phones that we're blocking off. So many of these could have been synchronistic experiences. You know, I think of how often it's like the love of your life could have driven by you a million times, but you're both in your own cars or on your phones, and you could be on the subway next to each other and not be looking at each other. And I was sharing with you that yesterday I happened to be at the grocery store and. Oh, yeah, you know, I was just waiting in line picking up a matcha for a friend. And I was just blanking out. Like I was just processing something. So I was kind of just like staring into the abyss. And then like someone who knew me that we follow each other on social media, never met before, was like Sahara. And I'm like, hey. And we ended up in this hour long conversation, had I been AirPods on my phone, even if he saw me, he probably wouldn't have come up to me because he'd be like, she's busy. So here we are, we're craving in person connection. We're craving intimacy. So we go on our phones when it's all around us, but we're blocked off to it.

Exactly, yeah. Because we're on our phones, we get to see a curated reality versus this outside world. Seems kind of chaotic. There's people coming and going and there's a lot going on. So we want to go somewhere that we can control that feels safe and predictable, that, oh, I don't like the music that they're playing, so I'm gonna listen to my own music that I want to play. So there's value to that. But there's also this massive separation that's caused. I saw this reel the other day, someone sent it to me and it was this guy. I mean, a father, probably like 55. And it was just a video of him sitting there in the airport, just kind of looking all around. And the caption said, here's my dad about to like raw dog this six hour flight. No phone, no book, no AirPods, no nothing. Like no pillow, no nothing. And he's just going to take this flight and he's just, you know, just looking around the airport, looking around. And that's exactly what we're talking about. That generation, they are more present to this reality. So yes, there's a gift in how we can be financially independent. We can be creatively expressed with our phones and it's amazing. We can create these realities and we're living in it.

Yeah.

Like we're already living in the game. The game's right here. So I think that's living in this reality. More opening more. Let's open, open, open more to where we are so you can have that. Oh my God, I've followed you for so long and bam, now we're talking for hours.

Exactly. And I think we're so afraid of boredom.

Yeah.

So the reason why no one sits on their airplane, which by the way, when we came back from Costa Rica, remember I didn't have a phone.

Oh, yeah, yeah, yeah.

Because my phone died in the waterfall. Which these iPhones are supposed to be waterproof and you're not. It was an iPhone 14.

I almost want to take blame for that because I was like, get a video of me jumping in.

And then I was like, for sure. I was underwater with it, this and that. And Then it starts bugging out. And then by Saturday I had no phone. So the last two days of Costa Rica, I was just raw docking it random taxi driver. And then I was like, how am I going to get back to America with no phone? And I was like, you know what? I'll take a taxi, I'll check in. I have a passport. Once I, I got to the airport, I luckily had my laptop. I was able to call an Uber, but I had to sit on that plane. Super freaking sick. No music, no nothing. Just sit there. And it was such a great like. And I was in such stomach pain too, but like sitting with the thing rather than escaping. Did I made love of my life? Unfortunately not. But I was able to like really sit in this meditative process that, that I feel so many of us are afraid of. We're afraid of boredom, but we have to. It's like think about for us. It's like, am I more likely to have a conversation with someone who's has AirPods on and is looking down versus someone who is sitting Even just the act of looking up? You know, my, my friend gave me the strategy. She says when she goes out, she takes a lap. So she walks around, yeah, the restaurant or the bar or the club or whatever and pretends she's looking for someone. So then instead of looking down, she's looking up. And she says she always has people approach her because it's just imagine for two minutes you did that and you have someone approach you. Imagine we lived our lives this way.

Yeah, because you're open, you're available, and that's where you're then available to be tested by energies that you don't want in your field. But that builds your resilience and your clarity with what you do and don't want. It builds your ability to communicate to the person that you don't feel resonance with versus avoiding that and not building those skills and having that confidence, not having the courage to be able to decide what you do and don't want. Because if you're just closed down, then you're not tested, but then you're also not open to what could be.

And the way the universe responds is like that person coming up to you. There is some sort of shared resonance there. You know, I can't say every single person that comes up to you, but yeah, there's. There are these, you know, hey, shouting what up? Exactly. Which have been interesting, but it tends to be. There is a vibrational alignment. The thing is, we are so obsessed with. They have to Look a certain way because of the dating apps. And beyond that, I feel we're in an Amazon culture. I want it my way. The color that I want shipped overnight. No, same day delivery, same day.

Yeah, actually.

And bring it to me right now at the lowest cost possible. And so we're to my.

To my door and don't knock and don't bother me. Do all the work.

Exactly. Don't exist. In fact, bring one of those little machines so I don't have to like, have a little conversation. That's the level that we're at. I want my Uber Eats put the priority shipping so it comes even. It's like we're so used to having it our way, our time, our whatever. So we think that a relationship is that way. These dating apps make it seem like, oh, what height would you like? What ethnicity? You know, I'm surprised they don't even have income things. I'm actually surprised that they haven't done that yet, you know?

Yeah, we'll just.

But there are certain apps that are supposed to be for higher income or whatever, but so. And then all we're doing is we're just looking at their pictures. That's it. You're not feeling their energy and nothing to it. So it's literally just, are you my type and are you good looking enough for me? Then it's extremely unnatural because you're face to face with this person. You think I'm hot. I think you're hot. Now we're supposed to talk.

Yeah.

Women are like, I want him to approach me first. Men are like, a lot of the girls on here are catfish or they're these OnlyFans bots. They're not even real girls. So I'm gonna wait for her to message me first. So a lot of them don't even end up talking, you know, especially on these apps like Raya. No one talks. Then let's say they do talk. I would say 90% of the conversations fizzle out. Hey, what are you up to this week? Oh, I'm just working. How about you? Oh, I'm just doing the. Because you feel nothing.

You feel nothing. Well, it's all built on dopamine. Because when you're looking and searching, you see someone that triggers your reticular activating system of what you think you want and need and will feel safe with and a lot more alive with dopamine. Swipe. Right. Orbital activating system. Nope. Swipe. So that triggers these again. Hormones.

Yeah, it's like gambling.

Yeah, it's like gambling. But Then it's not built on. And if you're sitting in an airport again and someone walks by and you see them walk by and they're sitting to your left and you're like, oh, okay, notice them. And then they notice you noticing them. And then it happens to be that sitting on the plane, you're one row apart and there's a complete empty row in front of you. And so you have the ability to see all those details, put it together and shift your seat and say, and make that contact.

And those things are actually creating the.

Turn on, turn on. Serotonin. It's, it's, it's your, your. The hormones, the hormones that are present are completely different. Of course there's a doping, but it's not strictly dopamine. You're not looking at your phone. Have a spike. Attraction, not attraction. Right. And this is where I think a lot of people will be really frustrated because they'll just keep seeing the same thing that they don't want to see. So they build frustration versus waiting for that moment of alignment. And again, I've met someone that I dated and had a semi successful relationship with that did not work, but we met on an app and I was shocked. I was completely shocked. This is quite a few years ago. So, yeah, I know by experience you can meet amazing partners on there. And yeah, so there's nothing to diminish that. But there is something to the rawness, the realness of being able to feel in your body. How do I feel next to this person? Physically present in your body. That's. And yes, you can feel through the app and you can tap into the quantum field and you can feel them beyond that experience. And yes, but not everyone has that attunement or skill.

Reiki connection.

Yes, exactly.

The thing is, it's like even as intuitive as I am, it's like sometimes the person presents themselves on app totally different way than how they are because we're all marketing.

Well, then you're just not reiki ing enough.

I know. It's happening a little more now. I've deleted all the apps. I'm done permanently. Goodbye. But what I noticed with the apps, because I was on the apps for like a year and I had not had one successful thing come out of there. And anyone that I even dated, I met them in person. And I was like, why? Because easy come, easy go. There's something around, like we just met on an app that I feel, at least in my experience, has made the man not really value the relationship that much because Think about it. He's on that app all the time. You know, he's not just talking to you and he's Amazon just dating you. Exactly. And there's no shared interest, necessarily, or community that's, like, keeping you together that you're gonna see. You might have an interest, but it's like. And it's often, like, they live on one side of the town, you live on another side of town. So a lot of commitment to come see each other, and then there may be something that shows up. So I find a lot of these interactions end up with. Well, first of all, 30% of online dating interactions end up with ghosting. So straight up, someone just not responding, like, fawning, like, or freeze response, which is so harmful for you. Like, at first, when I got on these apps, when I was first single, I was like, oh, wow, I'm talking to someone. This is so exciting. Like, in my mind, of course we're gonna meet. Were talking.

Yeah.

And then I remember the first time I got unmatched in the middle of the conversation, I was like. I was devastated for, like, three days. I was like, why did they unmatch me?

Oh, my God, I see it so good. Like, little lover girl.

Like, yeah. I was like, what? I was, like, thinking, like, did I.

Say what did I do? Yeah, first question, what did I do? It must be me.

Yeah, yeah. There's some, like, male nurse, which I probably would have never did in real life, but I was just like, no, shade. It's just not. Not my thing. But I don't know, like, who. Who knows? Like. But when that kept happening of, like. And it wouldn't necessarily be ghosting, but, like, you would talk and it would fizzle out or it would even get to a point that you text, but then they never make a plan or, you know, you get on a face. This happens so many times that you can't even be a lover girl because then you get your hopes up and down, up, down, up, down. That eventually I'd be like, I can't start feeling feelings for someone I've never met. You know, now, like, honestly, the dating advice that I've received that I still can't practice because I'm too much of a lover girl. Still is. Don't even have feelings for them until the third date.

Oh, wow.

Because here's the thing. Women start with men at 100, and men start with women at 0.

Yeah.

So women biologically meet a man or even see a guy on a dating app, and we put him at 100. I found him.

The one.

He's it. He is exactly what I've been looking for. And this is what our life is going to look like together. And, oh, my gosh, my God, he's going to come with me to Coachella and, you know, our friends and our children and, you know, we're going into the full fantasy. Right. So we started as. This is going to work out. Your biggest crush. You know, they say a crush is just a lack of information, so there's nothing like that crush before you actually get to know them.

And then the information comes and you get crushed.

So then you start him at 100, you start to get to know him, and you're like, oh, he's not perfect. Oh, his communication's really bad. Oh, he's not really acknowledging me. Oh, he's not really meeting me. And then it starts to go down. Men, what I find. Start women at zero. Really?

Yourself?

Yeah. They're like, whatever. Another one. Yeah, sure, sure. I've heard men say yes to everyone on these apps. In fact, there are some apps on dating apps that automatically swipe right, which is yes for everyone. And a lot of men do this to just see who matches them and then decide, wow. So think about a woman's relationship on a dating app is no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no. A man's is yes, yes, yes, yes. Because kind of anything will suffice. And then I'll. I'll leave. I'll figure it out later.

Figure it out.

Yeah. You know, so then they're like. Because they don't really have feelings for us.

I just realized something.

Yeah.

This is the product of 1950s advertisements and massive amounts of excess to quantity and not quality. Quality. Is there the good people, the one who. Then you can choose to be the one that. Then you can continue to choose to be within the relationship. So you have a healthy, long standing, amazing union. They're there, they exist. But we're surrounded and drowning in this ocean of quantity.

Yeah. Perceived quantity.

Exactly. Perceived. Yeah, it's. It's digital quantity.

Just pictures of people.

Yeah.

Who are mostly never even going to meet up with you.

Yeah. You know, and then if we're operating from that, from this inherited sense of lack and survival and the inherited disconnection of community and the inherited hyper individualism. It's a tough place to be in, but there are ways through. And there it's a. It's like it's an ocean.

But I have found that being on the apps creates this illusion of options that is not real, that I realize I don't even want to date someone that's on these apps because how it's shifted even my brain. I'm someone so conscious of these things that I've noticed that I don't value a conversation the same way that I used to, that I was like, I don't want to be this person.

Yeah.

I would rather wait longer and meet someone who. Why are you laughing right now?

I can't say it. I can't say it.

But I would rather wait longer and meet someone who life brings me to then, like, go on all of these dates that are, like, realistic even just have these stupid conversations that don't even go anywhere, you know, so. But what was funny about the woman starting at 100, men starting us at 0 is there was someone that I. I dated that's probably my most successful dating experience over the past year and a half. And he's a very nice person. We're friends, and we decided to just be friends after, like, one month. But I was like, when I first met you, I had biggest crush on you, and da, da, da. I was like, when did you start liking me? He's like, oh, it wasn't until, like, like, I, like, visited him and like, it was like, way later on when by that point I was pretty over it.

Yeah.

That's when he started like me. I was like, what do you. Amazes me sometimes is, like, the fact that, like, men can, like, say all of these things and actually not feel it.

Yeah.

It's crazy. Yeah.

Well, that's where, like, when you're intimate with someone, for you as a woman, your oxytocin is instant. And for us, it builds over time. So for us to have that same level of oxytocin, it's not just immediate.

Right.

So I want to say the reason. The thing I couldn't say earlier. Okay, so I was laughing. What?

We're an open book here.

Yeah. Well, I just laughed because the way I was thinking about it was not appropriate. But the. The you said that you're not even going to find your person on the dating apps. And there's this thing. It's like a lot of people could find a great match, but because of what you've cultivated in your life and what you have resonance with, it ain't there.

Well, When I was 24 years old, I met someone on an app, and we ended up getting married, you know, and that's someone I met on an app. And I was very grateful for the app that it brought us together because I Was like, wow, if it wasn't for this app, I would have never met him.

Totally.

Until I had the realization of, if it wasn't for this app, I would have never met him.

Exactly.

Which says everything right there. Because we would have never. We were not in the same world, the same circles, the same anything. And that was the struggle in the relationship. We didn't like doing the same things, you know, whereas now I would never want to have a relationship like that again, that I would much rather build a relationship with someone that, like, we have shared friends, we like to go to the same place, because the fact that we even ended up in that same place room says so much about us.

Yeah. Something I just. Again, another revelation. This is what always happens when we're talking, right? Go through the layers and find them is the. If you take part in the game, meaning the algorithm game of social media and online dating, there is a consequence because that's been created and overlaid on top of our reality. So base reality. That's not base reality. And then of course, there's the whole thing, like, oh, this reality, you and I talking, this is a simulation and we're being controlled by other. Like, right, you can go through that rabbit hole. But you and I know that this is, this is. We can. There's cause and effect in this reality. We can put energy into something and we receive something. And so in this game, which is this reality, if you're present to it, then you will physically align with, physically see and match with the people that are actually fully meant for you. When we overlay this access and this digital layer to it, there's consequences to that. And it's like, yes, you may meet someone in that augmented reality that then you can ground within base reality. And you may have never met them had it been for this layer and access. But like you said, the massive amount of potential doesn't mean that it's always the best thing for you. You can figure it out, you can make it work. But I personally am not someone who likes to figure out my reality or make it work. I like it to be flow. I like it to be alignment, feel, feeling in my body, feeling present and know what's happening here and now and be connected to that versus, like, oh, I guess I'll figure this thing out now that I'm here. But that's where that shift in your choice to get off the apps and ground yourself in this reality, see who you're open to, and then going through the necessary grief that that may happen longer than you think. And then, since this is base reality, you go through that grief, and then it comes to you. Yeah, you feel that emotion fully. You actually feel the grief that you're feeling. You're feeling the scarcity and the lack. Like, oh, it's not gonna. It's gonna take so long. And then once you feel that, it can come to you because you just made space for it, versus always being in the video game, always being on the dating apps, always going around in that realm and suffering the consequences.

Yeah, it's such a shift in consciousness. A couple single girlfriends of mine were like, yeah, these dating apps aren't working. Let's go to, like, Nobu Malibu and do a little Sunday lunch there. And, like. Like, we'll meet someone. Like, so we're going in, we're dressed cute, and we look around the restaurant, and, you know, everyone just, like, sitting at their table. No one's really talking. And there's. Our types aren't there? And it was so interesting. My friend instantly just gets on hinge, and I'm like, the irony. We go out, but it's like, we're like, no, my guy's not here. Let me go on an app. I'm like, there's two parts to it. We're so my way that even the one time I go out, I expect, well, I went out one time. He should be here this time. You know, that's not how it works. Think about our parents and just that generation, how many places they went for years until they found that person. But then it's like this cutoff that happens that, like, when that person's not there, we're like, well, I'm gonna find. And here's the thing that these apps provide us with is it gives you a gateway to start talking. So it's like, you know, let's say I'm at a restaurant, and there is someone that I would be maybe interested in speaking to. What am I doing? So go up to their table. Hey, I have no idea if you're married or anything, and you're in the middle of a conversation. But, like, you're my type. Like, you would never do that, you know?

So I think that's actually the problem.

Yeah, but we need to have more shared community spaces, which we have that in Europe. America doesn't really have that. That much, and Europe's even losing it. But, like, I remember in, like, Italy, like, every sunset, everyone would go into, like, the piazza, and, like, they're all, like, talking and getting to know each other. So it's like back in the day, relationships were built over time that you would always see the same person there every day, and you start to notice her. And then you would maybe talk a little bit and go away. And you were building a crush. Building a crush. Building a crush. Whereas now what's happening with these apps is, I think you're hot. You think I'm hot. We're face to face. There's all this pressure of, are we going to go on a date or not? Biologically, men, when they are face to face next to someone, actually go into a fight state. Did you know this? So they've done psychological studies that when men are side by side next to someone, they're actually much more able to open up.

Side by side.

Side by side.

Wow.

When they are face to face, it's almost like you're about to quarrel.

Okay.

Because throughout history, if a man was face to face like this with someone, it means you're about to fight, you know, or you're about to fuck, you know, it's like this really intense thing. So that's why with little boys, when they're working with them in therapy, they sit next to them, they often have them draw and do something so they're kind of distracted, and that's when they start to open up. Whereas women have no problem sitting face by face and talking next to someone. But even just the nature of the app is very face to face, which is a lot of pressure for the man. And then the man's like, I don't even know you.

I wonder if that's why there's so many. And I only know this because of seeing yours.

Yeah.

Like, why are there so many guys that are, like, their pictures with him, like, side to the side or like.

Because men feel weird about, like, just taking a picture of them.

Face picture.

That's exactly. And then there's also that. Do I come off as gay if I take pictures to selfies of myself and that kind of thing? So I think men are also trying to show, like, I don't care about my looks. And. And so.

Yeah.

But then a lot of their pictures are there in hats, hiding themselves.

Exactly.

I have a friend that she dated this guy and he shared that his hinge pictures were his wedding photos. That was the only photo shoot he had. And it was like seven years ago. Like, just, like, crop out the wife.

You know, like me in a suit. That's good enough.

Yeah, it's fine. But just the nature of that is so high pressure that when I talk, because I talk to so many couples and the ways that a lot of couples happen was like there was a shared space. So when I was single, that first year of being single, when I was just traveling, I was like, why aren't I meeting someone in London and Portugal? And this. I wasn't in the communities there. No. I was just going to one place, one time.

Yeah.

Thinking I must meet him there. But I bet you if I went to the same place, the same coffee shop every day for six months, I would build a relationship with someone.

Yeah.

You know, and that's why in a way, relationships in small towns are easier because you're continuing to see the same people. What I realized was happening in London is everyone's going out, meeting tons of new people. So even if you meet and they ask you on a date, they're. They're likely not even going to follow through because the next night they go and they meet someone else. And it's again this illusion of eternal options. But then there's this deep sense of loneliness because no one's actually meeting you. Who do you call at 3am if you need help? Who do you process the things in your life with? And that's why friendships are so important too, because most friendships do outlast relationships these days. Besides, if you really have a long term marriage. So I find that just how fast moving we are on and off the apps and the fact that we're continuously traveling is also preventing us from being in relationship.

Yeah, that's the question. Oh, there's no good people. Yes, there are, but which reality are you operating in? Can you see them? And do you want to be seen? Do you really want to be seen? Do you really want to be heard? Do you really want to be valued? Or is there closure there? Waiting for waiting, which is a whole portal of conversation, just waiting and waiting and waiting for the one who will come in. And then it's, oh, you'll. Oh, that's the one. Now I'll open versus being open and being in a place of trust and confidence to be able to discern when people come in and out versus waiting closed down for this idealized version that's going to come and then everything's going to make sense. And that's just, it's. It takes work though. Especially after being hurt, especially after going through many layers or any layers of trauma or heartache or heartbreak or the resentment of this whole process or the byproduct of these, of this culture that we live in. It takes a tremendous amount of courage to be open and that's has to happen in our own time, in our own way. And there is a level of like our grandparents era which is like, get. Get it. Kind of get over it. Like, get to it and get through it. Not in this like tough love kind of way, but feel it fully and like, actually give yourself the space and time with friendship, with therapists, with coach, with community to feel things fully so you can get over it. Because that's like, I talk to people, right? High operating executives, and they're like, yeah, I don't feel anxiety. Like, that's a new generation. It's so hard to find good workers now because everyone talks about anxiety and it's because they're operating in the world of it doesn't exist. That's. You're. You're making a problem. Our generation is like, no, this is a real thing. And then those two butt heads. But then if you merge those two things, there's this flow between the awareness of the trauma, the awareness of the anxiety, the awareness of the pain, and the having the space, the confidence to feel it fully, go through it to where you can get over it to where you are in that place where it's like, oh, yeah, I've felt that and experienced that. But it takes. It takes a village. Like, it's not something you do on.

Your own is like, we think the way to get rid of anxiety is just like. I don't know, just like. Just like go to therapy and like, yes, that's a part of it. The thing that made me really dissolve most of my. I would say I very rarely use. I really rarely feel anxious. I can feel sad, but not anxious. What did that. Going through heartbreak.

Yeah.

Really the thing that made me no longer. Because once you go through something so big, you stop giving a. About little things.

Little things.

Yeah, yeah, that I'm just like, oh, like. Like I used to put out a book and I would be like, so nervous for like months before. Oh my God, what are the Amazon reviews gonna say? What if people don't like it? What if nothing. So well, am I gonna hit the New York Times as this? I put out a whole album, like, rapping. I'm like dancing with serpents and stuff. I never once even had a thought of, what if people don't like it? I don't give a if people don't like it. I'm doing this for me. You know why? Because I went into my pain fully. Fully.

And you. You have done things in your life to position yourself around people who see you value and care for you and you see and value and care for others to where there's that reciprocity. Like when I first met you, I kind of barely knew you. And then over the next few years, especially the last year and a half, I've gotten to see the ways that you sacrifice. And that's the difference is you're not sacrificing. It's not self sacrificing in a way where you're abandoning yourself. But I've seen the way that you value people and how and when you show up for them and you pour into people in a way that you build those deep bonds. But you're not losing your integrity by making a sacrifice. It's that you're accessing that highest level of love through actually through sacrifice. But you yourself aren't abandoned in the process. So since I've witnessed you doing that, I've seen and I've felt the relationships that you have. Obviously me being one of them. And the network that you have to. When you go through that thing, what you're able to create expands. You go from writing books to making an album and now a show and maybe this and that, and that's the scale of creativity, expands in direct proportion of your ability to feel things fully and go through it, which is a reflection of being in community, valuing other people and of course, evaluating yourself. But most, I think the theme through all of this is putting yourself in the position to be vulnerable and to be seen. Do you really want to be seen?

And also that topic of choice that you just mentioned of. I decided the day after I found out that betrayal that this is going to be the best thing that has ever happened to me. I had zero evidence of this. You know, it was so far the worst thing that ever happened to me. But I'm like, I'm not going to be one of those people who make this close down my heart and never trust love and become angry and pessimistic and hate men and hate relationships and you know, those bitter, resentful, divorced people. I'm gonna make this the reason why I have the most love in my life, the most joy of my life, like the greatest relationship, the greatest self love of my life. That's what my story is going to be. And I just made that the choice and the rest followed and it became true. And so what I've realized is a lot of times we're so afraid of being in relationship because we're afraid of heartbreak. But if heartbreak ends up being the best thing that ever happened to you, then why would you be afraid of this thing? So then you're so much more. More open to trying different, you know, types of relationships and meeting new people and seeing where things go. Because the worst case is your heart is broken and it just makes you.

Better because you're operating from the fundamental truth that whatever happens is going to be for the best.

Yes.

So there's this super cheesy movie. I don't remember what it is, but there's this, like, motivational speaker in the movie and he talks about fear. And I would. I think it's pain. Pain and gain. It's like Mark Wahlberg and. But the fear. The motivational speaker talks about fear as false evidence appearing real. And he says it really fast. But there's something super deep in that truth, that fear is false evidence appearing real. What you said is you had no evidence yet if it's going to work out for me in the best possible way was real, but you made that your truth. So then it was true evidence appearing real. So then your nervous system and your reticular activating system and your entire being, body, life and creativity and your full power as a human was aligned to find that truth, to create, to discover that truth. So fear is false evidence appearing real. You're looking for something to confirm reality, and it's based in falsehood. It's based in not truth. It's based in fear, pain. That's that shadow. Yes. Go there, but don't stay there. No, like you did, you had the power to switch and say, this is what my reality is going to be and go through the journey of discovering that that's beautiful. Like, that's life. Right. Like being anxious and being depressed and being suicidal, which personally, that's been like anxiety and depression. Yes. For me, in my past, it was mostly suicide or more not like actually making a plan, but just that sense of, like, wake me up when it's over, just get me out of here. That was more my shadow, like where I went to. And then I shifted into let's create a different reality. I have the power to create a different reality. So I'm going to. And then can I grieve whenever what I want my reality to be doesn't meet my expectations? Can I grieve that fully? Yes. Oh, I grieve that fully. Wow. I just manifested and made space for what I truly want. That's that. That's the game. Like, that's the video game that's playing out in this dimension. Feel the grief fully. Allow that Energy to move and release the expectation and embrace what's actually meant for us based on this fundamental truth that I'm going to experience all things to work out for my highest.

I think we're so afraid of feeling that thing that we spend our whole lifetime actually feeling it because we didn't fully feel it.

Exactly.

You know, we never fully felt the loneliness of, you know, that marriage is down, is done. Go into the loneliness. Go into like, why am I so afraid of being alone? Go into the grief, the sadness, the anger, the disgust. Feel it all fully for however long that it takes. And then once you rode that wave, it's like, okay, thank you. I just wanted mic, you know, and then it moves on. You know, you guided me through this process that I want you to share about at Envision Festival when, you know, I had just done my album launch party and it was, you know, my DJ said I shot a music video and it was like, peak life experience of like, the whole crowd is singing along to my music. And it was like, so incredible of like, I'm. Because when I first DJ Envision Festival last February, which was like three months after my divorce, that was my first real tangible feeling of self love, of like, holy shit, I am the person of my dreams. And music became the greatest, like, healer for me then coming a year later and like, literally, as you have an.

Album in a year, by the way, amazing.

Yeah. I didn't even know I could produce music, let alone sing and rap and make an album and. And have an audience that knows the words to my songs. And it was so freaking cool. Life high. And then what happens right after is this deep sadness of I don't have a partner to celebrate these moments with. And I noticed because that happened to me last year too, and it was even a bigger wave of like, that more sadness. And you and our friend Christine were processing this and you had me go into that feeling. So can you share a little bit what this process processes?

You remember your piece, your feelings of it. What I remember was the attachment that I felt from you to it needing to be more, it needing to be different, and it needing to be better. So, yes, it was the peak. But then there was this.

And I want a life partner to share it with.

Yes. Which is this, like, for me, knowing you, of course, this childhood vision, dream and implanted in this notion that a successful and fulfilled life is with somebody else. So. And that's true. That's. That's. It's true. That's amazing. And it just, it could and should add to that experience. Right. So what I was feeling was this strong attachment to it's not good enough. Which still deep within that is okay. What part of you felt like you weren't good enough? So what I guided you through was envisioning. And I actually don't remember which. I just remember that I guided you to die completely. To what It. What was the part that you died.

To let go of ever meeting someone.

Oh, that's it. Yeah. Literally let go. That you would never.

I just might be single for the rest of my life and to accept that.

Yep. So, yeah, that's.

Which I was so resistant to. But it's like. But then it was like, even if I'm single for the rest of my life, I have a great life.

Yes. But that's what we went into as fully as we could. Sitting on a golf cart like 100ft.

Away when there's like dubstep music. I felt like I was. I was like tripping on something. I was dead. So you were like turning into a crocodile. It was like a life changing moment.

Totally. Yeah. No, it was very intense, but it was so powerful. That's also what festivals can do, which is really cool. Personally down to festivals, but they can be pretty amazing for those kinds of things. But the. Yeah, that process was. If you truly want to manifest something, grieve it fully and actually. And die into it, never happening. And. And fully embrace that reality. And this part of the conversation can go very deep. Because what is death but rebirth? Right. So if we want to create something, we want to experience something new. Who we are now and who experiences that is not the same person. And we can talk about it biologically. We generate. We're a new. Everything about it is new. We're regenerating constantly. Therefore, for me to arrive at that place, I have to die into myself. Who I am now in full surrender and trust that whenever I surrender and release, that whenever I wake up or when you arise back into that reality, you'll have that thing, but you have to die into it fully. Not. Yes, the affirmations work. Yes. There's layers to this. Of course. Creating, even knowing what you want. That's what affirmations are. You just even telling yourself what you value and what you want. But that's not how you're going to manifest that thing. To manifest that it's dying fully. To be reborn as the person that wants and experiences and has that. So that's kind of what I guided you through was kind of the death process really. Of manifestation.

Because if there's still this part of me, that thinking part of my life is incomplete until I find partnership, then I'm operating from a space of not enoughness and from a space of a void, of something's missing in my life. And that's not the. Even if I attract a relationship, that's not the quality. That relationship will have that quality in it. There will be this inherent codependency in it.

Exactly.

So part of us, and I can speak to it, is like, I didn't want to accept the reality that I might be single forever. I have friends that are almost 50 years old, and they've been single this whole time. And I'm like, I never want to be that. You know? And even the part of me that's like, the such a lover girl is like, I'd rather even be in an okay relationship than be single forever. But I know I didn't get this far to be in an okay relationship. But it's because there is this biological thing that's like, I am not safe when I'm single, especially for women. You know, Especially, like, after in London, my place being broken into and I was targeted for that robbery because I was a single woman is like, holy. I'm literally a target because I'm single. And I was, like, telling you, like, that week, I was like. I was telling you. I was like, like, I need a military man.

Yeah.

I need a man to protect me.

Yeah.

Because it was like my soul kind of knew, but it was like. But at the end of the day, like, I wasn't home, and my friend was with me, and she helped me move out, and the police were there, and they were so helpful, and, like, I was okay. I was fully okay. You know, even the worst thing that could happen as a single woman, I was fully okay. And it led to me leaving London and moving to LA and having this gorgeous podcast studio. It upgraded my life in every way. And I would have never left London had it not been for that. You know, I was applying for a visa and everything, even though I didn't even like the weather there.

Yeah.

You know, because I had this idea of, like, I just need to start a new life in London now. You know, just what people do after the divorces, you know?

You know, I remember that phase, and I didn't. I didn't process, like, how everyone's like.

Why are you in London? I'm just like, I'm just Harry Potter now.

Yeah. That was one part where I didn't. Maybe I didn't Realize, like, how deeply invested you were with that being your new life.

I was like, I just need to make, you know, part of me. The good thing is, like, I'll just, like, make a rebirth out of anything.

Well, that's what. Yeah, I was just, like, saw you through Bali, and then things changed so quickly that then when you went to the uk, I probably. I thought I was like, oh, that's gonna happen in, like, a month or two.

And sure enough, and then I was just like, I'm just gonna stay here, you know, And. But in a way, it's like, I wouldn't have never left it unless it was something so extreme. And I do think it was a very karmic lesson, because my family had to leave the war in the middle of the night and all the things related to that. But saying that as it did trigger this survival core wound of being single is being vulnerable. So I need to be with someone for my safety, which, again, thank God, I overcame that limiting belief and found the safety within myself, because what kind of relationship would I have manifested? Some guy with a big old gun, you know, who's like, you stay in the room, woman. I'm gonna protect you.

You know, so you had a military man, but that's like PTSD control and. Yeah, exactly.

I'd be like, now on the podcast, we're gonna talk about knitting. You're gonna go homestead, taking a turn, you know?

Yeah.

And I noticed, like, any time that I would be in these states of, like, oh, my God, I. I really want a relationship and that, like, yearning for it. And that feminine yearning is real, and it's also very beautiful. And, you know, David Data writes about that feminine yearning. Is it. I never want to kill that yearning. And I think. So the part of me that's, like, resistant to accepting that I'm always single feels like then I'm killing the hope.

Yeah.

You know, of, like, if I accept I'm always single, then I'll just be one of those people who's happy, always single, and then I'll never find it.

That's. Yeah, that's what you said on the golf cart. You're like, I don't really. That was. I don't know if you said that or felt it psychically. It was. No, I don't want to do that, but.

Because if I'm happy with this, then I'll be it.

Yes.

And I don't wanna be this.

Yeah. And that's that. You're like. You wanted to hold on to this idea, which is control.

Right. I wanted to hold on to the not having. Cause it's the only way that I knew how to manifest something of I don't have this thing. So I'm gonna go get it.

Yep.

And I was sharing with you that that is how I've manifested my books and my business. And not fully, but like, there has been an element of doing work. You know, if I wanna write a book, I can't wait for the book to be written. I have to.

To go out there, hustle from the heart.

Right.

That's what it is.

Get the book done, create the business, create the podcast. This shit doesn't do itself.

No.

This hair doesn't do itself. You know, though, then. Then I do the work and I get to flow. What I have found in relationships is it's not that, you know, I can do my inner work, but me, I. I don't believe personal belief. I don't think modern dating is natural, you know, Like, I don't think going on 100 first dates is going to lead to you finding your partner. It's just going to be a hundred meetings with random people who you probably are not going to go anywhere with. And so I think that the hard thing when you are someone that's created your own reality is like, then this thing in partnership, which you want more than anything. It's almost like there's no action I can take. But I actually really enjoyed that process of just grieving it to realize, like, I just trust that, you know, even if it's when I'm 50 years old, you know, like our shared friend is 50 having her first wedding, you know, and. And I'm sure she's so happy that she didn't marry any of those previous people because she's a different person now. So it's like I would rather be focused on my Dharma and my truth and continuing to progress towards my truth and not in a relationship, and then find a relationship that's just going to enhance and quantum leap my truth. Rather than can go on a hundred different dates that might lead to a hundred different types of relationships, which are just time suckers and just may keep me in this loop, which I find what most people are in and dating of dating the same person again and again and again, that sometimes you just need to like grieve, sit with your thoughts, change your consciousness. And then you would have just been in a different timeline.

Totally. Yeah. Well, you did actually said another thing there, which is change your consciousness. And that's one thing that we as humans have is the ability to say, I'm going to rapidly change my consciousness. And the key is, I'm going to do it fully so it's integrated. Not, I'm going to rapidly change my consciousness and choose a new idea. And then it's just another loop you go around. But I'm going to do it rapidly and deeply. And so that way it integrates into our life. So that's something like whenever I left the Air Force, this is like a. Some context is like, I knew that the reality I was living in was the opposite of what I believed in. I knew that I joined specifically because my story was, I'm not making a big enough impact. I'm going to join the Air Force and make a bigger impact. I joined, and I'm like, wow, I just went from being 16, 17 years old, being a firefighter, working emergency room, saving people's lives, like, directly, to potentially taking people's lives or being in the machine. So my desire was, I'm going to make a bigger impact. And I went from saving to taking so quickly. It's like, well, this is the opposite of what I believe, and I have to get out. But I was struggling with deep wounding from childhood addictions, suicide, suicidal. Almost like a lust for the idea of suicide. Not even, like, actually planning it out, but just the idea. It's this ultimate escapism. Struggling with that deeply to the point where then I realized I have to, like, no one's going to get out for me, and I can just wait out my time. But if we truly live in a quantum reality where I'm in control of my reality and I can shift and change it, I'm going to so rapidly change my consciousness that I'm not someone who belongs here. I'm not someone who can resonate here. Like, I literally have to evolve so quickly and authentically that I literally vibrate out. And I did. And I went through a very unique process to do that. And there's a whole backstory there. But it worked. And that, Pat, there was one path to do it, and I found it. Or more, it found me in both. And I used that process to rapidly and authentically elevate my consciousness to shift my reality. And it worked, and I ended this pattern. Later in my life, there was another situation that was similar. But I was free from any actual contracts, like the military contract. Literally made it to where I was a piece of property of them. I shifted my reality to where then whenever I experienced, I wasn't like, in contract to someone else, but I was in More control of my reality. But that shift happened because I said, or like getting out of a unhealthy, toxic relationship or shifting relationship with family members, I have to completely, rapidly and authentically change my consciousness to where I'm a different person and grieve the loss that comes from that transformation from one place to another. And then trust that I'm going to meet people, a new friends, new work, new dharmic opportunities. Trust that that's going to be waiting, because it just is. We all know it is. We have the fear of the waiting and kind of resisting. We all know that it only gets better. Like, I've yet to meet someone that has gone through a really, really difficult process and has gone through it fully and life hasn't gotten better. Met a lot of people who are going through difficult things or who have gone through them and haven't felt it fully and they don't experience that truth, that life just keeps getting better, yet that opportunity exists for all of us. That is the fundamental truth that if we do this work, but really, if we move this energy, if we feel our feelings, life just keeps getting better.

I think we're in such resistance to emotion. And then when you realize it's like you just like, you cry and you, you, you scream, you feel whatever the thing is and it passes. And then when it comes, you just like welcome it without resistance. Because you just know if I don't feel it now, I'm just gonna keep holding onto it for the rest of my life. And I would say what a lot of women struggle with is like, men are less willing to do that. So. So I find what's happening right now is like, there are so many women who are processing and feeling. So what advice do you have for a woman who maybe is in a relationship with a man that she can tell him, feel your feelings, and he's just like, he doesn't even know what that means. He doesn't want to. How can we encourage or be muses for men to go through this process?

There's this. You have to be the thing that you want. And when you are the thing that you want, you'll be a match for it or you'll shift out of resonance of it. So I think this goes back to the recreation piece, the leisure piece. It goes back to men being able to go through these rites of passages and doing that by themselves. That's the foundation, being able to do that by themselves. And then that way they're open up to doing it with other people. They're Curious. They want to know, oh, do other men have this experience? And I think meditation is, of course, we've heard, we all know about it. But true meditation, in the process of fully sitting and being in the discomfort and going into the void and witnessing whatever comes up and meditating is like. It's not. Not thinking. It's like sitting on the highway and watching cars go by. And sometimes a thought, like a car will get in and it'll zoom us down part of the road, and then we'll realize, like, oh, my God, I was just in this car for so long. And you wake up from that thought and you get out of the car again, and then you witness all the cars going by. But then once you really start sitting in that witnessing, you start to witness that, but you also start to. Your perception starts to witness that whole scene. So you start accessing other layers and other layers and other layers. And that's where the openness to a random emotion may come. So that's where, sitting in a meditation, you just may be overwhelmed with sadness and you don't know what it is. And for men especially is threat detection. Logical thinking. What is this coming from? I need to figure it out and put it in a box and place and categorize it. The beauty of meditation is it gives us the space to be in that experience. It washes over us and it moves and it's transient into something else. So I think since women have experienced so much trauma from men who don't hold that space with themselves, then they hold the space of, I'm going to be this surrendered but empowered open being, and I'm going to be the invitation for them to do that. And then they never take it. So that's where there's this paradox of, yes, all of us have to be able to sit in our emotions. And yes, a woman who's in relationship has to have that foundation. And it's the communication to the partner that they desire them to meet them in that space. They need that. That. That has to be a sacred agreement that. That is written down in agreements of the foundations of the relationship, that you're able to meet each other in that place. Because if you can't meet each other there, you pretend everywhere else. You can pay the bills together, you can be companions, you can do all the things together. But if, when reality comes, when the random emotion of anger, grief, sadness comes over, and if any part of that's wrong or any part of that is trying to be thought about or figured out or put in a place Then there's disconnection there. You're not authentically being with each other. And I mean, it's hard because the solution is not for women to do more. The solution is for all of us to do less. Do less. Find more stillness, find more space. Yes, we're in this world where hustle from the heart. Let's grind. Let's manifest our dreams. Let's do the work. Yes, let's dream bigger. Let's create more, let's expand. Yes, all of that's true. All of that's real. And all of that is only real at the highest levels of creation available to us. Making a movie, making an album, writing a book, making. These things come from actually doing less. So when we do less, we make space for God to move through us to where we channel something that's far beyond our own hustle, our own ideas. So that's where in that co creation of a relationship, it's about doing less. And the husband's not always on the video game. He's not always going out with the boys to the bar to watch the Kansas City Chiefs win their eighth super bowl in the last eight years. Right? Like, cool, who cares? Right? Taylor Swift, Great. Love that. For you, however, what if you did less, you spent more time together and your leisure was meditation? What if your leisure was simplicity? What if your leisure was ease? So when the hard times come, we're together, we're united, we got this.

It's funny because when I didn't have my phone for those few days, I just went on a walk with no phone. I came up with so many melodies for songs from one walk. And I was like, imagine again, if I just did this every day. Like, this is how people used to live. So even forget meeting someone, just you would come up with creative ideas. Even my book discover your Dharma came to be. I didn't think, oh, I'm going to write a book about living your dharma. I met some random person and he invited me to a dinner and his friend happened to be there. This person's dad happened to be Deepak Chopra's like, like one of his best friends. So him and I are going to this, like, deep conversation about like, Vedic spirituality and this and that. I was so jazzed up by the conversation that I came home and in four hours wrote the entire book proposal.

Wow.

So it just shows. It's like that moment of just like surrendering, going with the flow. I didn't really know this person. It led to this conversation and boom, boom. Of course, then I had to write the book. And that's where more of that consistent effort came in. But the actual seeds of. Of all of these things come when you're doing nothing. You know, the melody, the relationship, the book, the idea that big thing comes from something beyond us, you know, and we don't allow that liminal boredom white space for it to come through. And I feel if. If people get anything from that, conversations to do this. Another thing I've noticed between, like, male and like, female, like, versions of spirituality is again, with brain science. Like, men do have less access to feeling their emotions and intuition stuff than the female brain. So what I have found for a lot of men, it's. Well, meditation, first of all, is definitely really imperative. Vision quests, you know, something where like a traditional vision quest is four days and four nights, like out in the desert. In some practices, you don't even have food. And it's this kind of like sacrificial energy of being at one with just yourself without any distractions around you. And I think that men used to have these rites of passages. And that is the appeal of sports. You know, it's like, gives you the sense of tribe and camaraderie, but also the masculine desires, solitude. You know, if you ask most men, what do you really want? They say peace. I want to feel a relief. That feeling of orgasm for a man is a relief. He's releasing energy. And finally, for a moment, he can just be still. Now, for the feminine, if you ask the woman, what does she want? She's like, I want everything.

Yes.

She's like, I just want to be filled up with God. I want to be filled up with life. I want to be filled up with beauty. I want to be filled with love, with community, with children, with animals, with. With gardens, with oceans, with food, with all, you know. Cause we have this void inside of ourselves, our womb space that literally wants to be filled. That's what's happening sexually. So for us, that orgasm is feeling of fullness, you know, so we're always on this quest of, like, when we don't have that. I notice in myself those times I'm like eating all the chocolate and all the things. I'm trying to fill myself up with something. So. And then I. What I find that a lot of women gravitate to. Towards spiritually are practices of, like, embodiment and movement and conversation and connection, which come more naturally to us, as well as systems of control such as astrology. The times in my life that are out of control are the times I'm on the astrology. I'm like, oh, it's because of this, the Jupiter conjunct, Saturn conjunct, you know, like, you know, and then when things are going well, I'm like, oh, that's cool, you know, and it's like, like I think because as the feminine we try to like know. It's like that's our shadow side. We try to like micromanage and control for the masculine. I've noticed psychedelics are a very big pathway. You know, I saw this meme once and it was like a guy taking shrooms has the same realization I had when I was 8 years old.

Yeah, exactly.

He's like, empathy matters.

We're like, yeah, here's why I say meditation.

Yeah.

Because meditation is the integration of reality. So yes, psychedelics. But if it's not built upon the ability to integrate it, then the psychedelics become another recreational experience and it becomes this total escapism. Another.

And you think you're, you know, healing and doing all the spiritual work, but you're actually not because you, when you're in that experience you are, but you're not actually making any changes in your life. You know. I am pro people using psychedelics and how helpful ways I've seen it be. Very helpful. It has helped me on my path. It's not been a large part of my path, but I do feel it can help you have these quantum realizations that like especially some people are so dense that like they need this like wakeup call that sometimes only a psychedelic can provide them with. I am much more a fan of earth based medicines such as mushrooms or you know, grandmother grandfather medicine. Ayahuasca. San Pedro Hoppe.

Because you're speaking in in rather than like ketamine or mdma. Exactly, yes.

Which can be therapeutic. But for, for me the times I've tried them, I can very much feel the chemical and man made effects. Like even the difference between LSD consciousness and true consciousness lsd. I feel very in my masculine ego, massive ego. Well, for me, yeah, I could solve any problem on earth.

You know, hero.

Yeah, savior. And it is very beautiful at the same time. But I'm not, I don't feel called to really do it again. You know, whereas mushrooms, I'm like, whoa, my body's so wavy. And also at this point I don't, I don't really do any medicines. But it was, it was definitely helpful in my early 20s. So I have found that with men or like sitting with ayahuasca, especially it being such a grandmother, feminine Energy. They're like, wow, I've been abusing the feminine my entire life.

Yeah.

Completely using her womb as a commodity and never respecting her. And it like takes that slap in the face or San Pedro of like, you know, I've been doing a lot of deceitful things for a very, very long time. And it takes getting to that point.

Yeah.

And I've also seen people have realizations, think they're going to change and go back to it. So I think meditation, you know, in Vedic spirituality, it's like meditation is the pathway to God that you have to keep doing. I think psychedelics take you straight to God. You see it right there. And so we need both.

Yes. That's where also, like building upon meditation, there's tai chi, qigong, there's then the. That's the dance of the. With your prana, with your life force, where you move from the foundation of the meditation of the stillness. And then you take that and you bring it out and you emote that, you feel that and you express that. That's where building on those practices is so important. Whereas for you, a feminine, you're naturally in your dance, you're naturally in your flow, you're naturally in that state. I think that's why it's essential for men to cultivate that root, that the integration of base reality, meditation, and then building from that place to where they're integrated and they can see. And that's the beauty of the masculine. It is the architect. Right. It is that the ability to see, witness and mold something. And whereas, like the feminine is just this raw creative potential. It's like taking something and literally creating out of nothing. You have that void in the womb, you receive this energy and you create something to its not fullness, but in terms of a child in its fullness, you create a book or project, but then that's where other people are so essential to support you in that creation. So it does come to its fullness. Right. So that's where there's different access points. Dance, meditation, dancing while meditating, meditating while dancing. Like there's all the different sides. But something I wanted to share is a process that you and I have done before. Not that one night where I turn into an alligator, but one is a polarity integration. And so we hear a lot of talk about relationships being polarized. And polarity is. It has to be polarized for the charge for there to be. Oh, yes, that's true. Yet. And this is the point is for us to do polarity integration within ourself what we'll find is we'll find an unpleasant something and a pleasant something, a desired state and in a state we're avoiding. So unsafety and freedom, lack, abundance, fear, courage. There's a million different iterations of this, of these polarities that we feel. I think a lot of us have a, like a core polarity that we have, especially in seasons of our life, and then we go into a new season. But in our life, if we really sit with it and explore, we can journal it through, we can talk about it, we go to many ways to find them. But if we find our core polarities for our phase of life, where we're at the process of polarity integration is you feel one fully.

So let's give an example of, like what, like what are your polarities?

Fear and curiosity. So curiosity is obviously what I want more of. Yet there's this fear that. And that fear is fear of failure. Like, I don't even want to be curious because I may find something and then fail at it. So there's so many tendrils and you can go into it, but once you find those. So let's say fear and curiosity, for me, I would feel that fear fully. What does that feel like? And then what does that look like? Do I fetal position? Do I sit in the corner? Do I fight something? Do I want to punch a pillow? Do I want to run? So how do I want to express that fear? Fight, flight or freeze, right? And I'll allow myself to freeze. Like, I'll allow myself to feel that, knowing that I'm in a process, right? So I'll feel that, and then I'll feel that fully. And then I know that the next step is I'm going to feel curiosity fully. So I'll crawl, hands and knees, and I'll look under the couch. I'll like, look out of the window. I'll look and get binoculars and I'll be curious and I'll feel curiosity fully. Or sitting in meditation, I'll explore the quantum with curiosity and explore that. So feeling those fully independently, and then it's kind of takes imagination, but I'll actually feel both of them fully at the same time. So what does it feel like to feel fear and curiosity fully? And I may emote it, I may move it, I may be moving or I may be sitting with my eyes closed, but I feel both fully. And when you feel both things fully and you truly do, you move through that energy, the. The contrasting energy through it, and you arrive somewhere and I'm not Going to say where you arrive, because it's different for every person in terms of how that energy moves. But we all arrive somewhere and we arrive at a depolarized place, but that's where we'll find love, we'll find awareness, we'll find joy, peace in enlightenment, so that we'll find that there. But we find it in the nothingness. We find it in the void. So that's what we all have to do independently, by ourselves in that. That's that work. So it's very supportive to have someone guide you through that. It's supportive to be witnessed doing that. So that's that. However, then what that does is that we could then go into the void of. Of being enlightened and in peace. And that's beautiful. But then when it comes to connecting with a person in a relationship, you want there to be that charge. So some people will go into that place and they're so safe there because they feel all of these beautiful emotions. Yet for this polarity in a relationship, for this charge and for this dance, there has to be this positive and negative that the pursuant and the receiver. So that's where independently we all have to do that. Polarity, integration. Yet we also all want to stay in our natural polarity, whatever that is, depending it's irrespective of gender or sexual orientation. Whatever polarity we have. Am I in my masculine or am I in my feminine receiving. That's where the magic of relationship happens. Happens. But how we show up in that relationship is a reflection of how integrated are we as a being, as a soul, within our own experience, which is made up of these polarities. So that's the process that I've. I go through and I've gone through. And it's hard also to take the time to get off the phone, to get off the computer.

Yeah. How can we identify what these polarities are for us? Because I'm curious. I'm like, what are. I wonder what mine are.

For me, exploring the fear. Right. So going through the portal of fear, I was able to find heavier emotion and I was able to find a hope, a curiosity, a lighter emotion, something. But yeah, so find. So it's finding this time, space and stillness and the intention and then exploring. And if you want to go just in your. What's happening in your daily life, but if you want to go more on your overarching polarities, it's often found in childhood experiences. So, like, what's the overarching feeling you felt as a child or what's the overarching feeling you wanted to feel as a child. So, like, for you, what was the overarching feeling that you felt? That was unpleasant. That was hard.

I felt unimportant to my dad, especially like that he has better things going on and I'm not important enough for his time and by my whole family, like, misunderstood.

Misunderstood.

Yeah.

Yeah.

So then I believe that's why I created a career where I'm sharing and sharing and sharing to get people to understand how I feel. That's the way I've, like, transmuted it.

Yeah.

However, I have been in relationships with people that are very different to me, where I don't feel understood. And often people who are working all the time. So I don't feel important, you know?

So let's explore the not being understood. And then. So it's like not being heard. If you feel right now not being heard fully, what emotion do you feel?

Aloneness.

Loneliness and aloneness.

Yeah.

So the process would be essentially feel that fully.

And that loneliness has been the core feeling that I had tried to escape, especially the first year of being single, of like, I need to keep doing things to not feel lonely, you know?

So then what did you want to feel? Connected.

Yes.

What's. What are other words?

Connected. Held.

Held. So what's the emotion?

Chosen is a big one. Supported. Held. Like, literally, like imagining, like someone, like holding you from behind and like having. Having.

And what do you feel when you're held?

An exhale, A relief.

What emotion do you feel?

Love.

Love. So loneliness and love.

Yes.

You could explore that polarity. And this is the beauty of this polarity integration. You could feel or you could discover infinite tendrils of loneliness. And I'll give, like, the kind of the. What the process does. You could actually spend the rest of your life searching for loneliness within yourself and then having this. Oh, I feel it in my body here. And it's a red square. And then you feel loneliness. And now it's a blob. So you could always find some way that loneliness is manifesting. And then you could feel love fully and you could feel that and you find that it's. You grow wings or you have a memory when you're a child of chasing after a dragonfly. So you could spend again the rest of your life feeling that fully. But there's a moment when you actually feel it fully, that there's nothing left to feel. You transcend the emotion and you arrive at the nothingness. That's where the magic is when I.

Can fully go Back to all of my experience of feeling loneliness and all of my feelings of experiencing love, then I've thought of them all and I will transcend it.

No, it's like you could, like, you could possibly spend hours. Like if you and I did a polarity integration session, you and I could sit and you could. I could ask you about your loneliness and you could just continue to find loneliness and you could use your thinking mind or feeling your body, and it could constantly show you loneliness. However, there is a moment, and it only happens when you're going through the process, where you transform and we return to our natural state, which is into the nothingness that actually holds that emotion. So we use that emotion as the doorway in. We go through it and then we find kind of that base.

And I actually had that realization last year. So last year I was working with the hape, the medicine hape a lot because it would take me to, to, for me, the way it works is if I felt some kind of like anxiety or loneliness or sadness or whatever, the thing was, I would be so present with that thing that I could dissect it.

Yeah.

So I sat with, like, why am I so afraid? Because I would notice the pattern was some this like yearning feeling would come over me and then I would be like, oh my God, I really want to be in a relationship or I want partnership connection. The thing, the action was go on Instagram, go on a dating app, do something. But then it's coming from that place of loneliness. So I recognize that pattern. So I sat with, Imagine I'm just completely alone and this is the rest of my life. I'm here in the mountains and no one knows who I am and where I am. And this is just the rest of my existence. Like, what am I so afraid of?

Yeah.

And underneath it was, well, then I won't exist. And I'm like, well, is it true that I won't exist if I don't have relationships with other people? And it's like, well, of course not. I still exist. But so much of my identity was entwined with my relationships. Other people, family, friends, part, everything. So when I even got to a deeper level of that of like, you know, if a tree falls in the forest and no one hears it, did it fall? Like, if I just live here alone for the rest of my life and I'm good, I'm self sufficient, then do I exist? But what was even deeper than that was this feeling of I don't deserve to exist if I am not productive, if I am not Giving value. If I am not pouring into other people, then I don't deserve to take up space on this planet. And that was the deep existential thing that was driving my. So I need to connect, because without it, I don't deserve to live. Which was not a conscious thought in any way, but that I had to sit with myself long enough to keep questioning and going deeper and deeper and deeper. And then I was just like, of course I deserve to exist if I'm not adding value. People's lives and interacting with people and stuff. And I would say the beauty of that that you see is I pour into people a lot. But the shadow side of that is when I'm not pouring into someone. And it was almost like I don't even know who I am.

Yes.

You know, which is massively ancestral with the woman in my lineage. So then I.

And ancestral from what you felt from your father, which is, you're not worthy unless you're performing.

Exactly.

Which is that fundamental. From the.

And he would always tell me, you got to work hard. You got to be the best. You got to be this. That it was this overarching. So if you're not doing amazingly in your grades, in your life, in this, you don't deserve to exist. You're not part of this family, because we are winners here. So I was completely. It made. Makes sense that I would feel this way of. I. And in a way, I've definitely been an overachiever in this lifetime. But I think the shadow side of that is, then who am I when I'm not, you know, and then. And then finding the light of just creating things for the sake of creating. And that's why I've transitioned to more art, you know. So then when I sat with. What does it feel like to be completely alone? Let me just fully feel it. I am alone indefinitely. What I realized, it was just peace.

Yeah.

And I was so afraid of that feeling because so much of my identity was wrapped up. And I love conversation. I love connection. I definitely have a core feminine thing. So then I would just sit with, like. And I'm just alone. And that took me deeper into my sacred masculine energy.

Yes.

Which I believe, you know, we. I think the best place to start doing the spiritual work for men is to do the masculine work, the vision quest quests and meditation for women. Do the embodiment work, the feeling. But to get the full spectrum for women, we need to. We need to do the vision quests. We need to do the meditation. We need to be in our aloneness we need to be in our sacred solitude for the men. Y' all need to feel. Y' all need to dance. Y' all need to be in connection and community and vulnerability. If we don't have both, we're just gonna keep creating relationships that are gonna come from the space of not enoughness.

Yes.

You know, and it's like, how do I expect to be in a relationship with a man who's emotionally available and intelligent, can talk to me for hours if I can't be by myself? You know?

Exactly.

I will just magnetize my counterpart. So that's when I really started to, like, you know, I was living in the mountains by myself and just like, not try to do. Just. I would just sit and do nothing and just, like, look at the birds, look at the trees, and just do nothing. And then even I was traveling. I stopped really even doing things. I just. Just. And. And that's when I started just hearing things, coming up with music, and led.

To that journey, you know, doing less. You got to do more of what you've always wanted to do.

But here's the thing. I just don't want you guys to get attached to. So I'm going to do less so I can come up with my. No, that was not my intention. My intention was I'm so afraid of feeling this thing that if I don't just feel it right now, I'm going to. I'm going to create from it. And I would say that, like, even now, moving into this apartment, like, I remember, like, the first few nights of just, like. Like, doing nothing. And I was like, this is so nice. This is amazing. Like, I get to. And now I'm so excited when I get to hang out with myself. I love being with myself. I'm at this point that I'm just like, yo, I want to live alone forever. You know, because I've become such great friends with, not just. You know, I think a lot of people are like, I love being alone, but they're on their phones.

Yeah, they're not.

Yeah, exactly. To be alone and actually straight up not have a phone with you, it's the most confronting thing because it's going to bring up all your things. But once you get through the muck, it's the most liberating feeling. And then for men, being vulnerable. Being vulnerable, being with your emotions, feeling those feelings, like, moving, like. Like locking eyes with someone for a little bit longer, it's gonna feel like you're dying at first. And then you're gonna have the greatest freedom on the other side. And I think ultimately, like, these polarity teachings of the masculine and feminine are a bit outdated, you know, of like, the true polarity is. Are these finer textures of them. Because if my forever goal is just to be more in my feminine, I'm not going to reach the full spectrum of who I am. If your goal is just to be in your masculine, you're not going to reach the full spectrum. So I think it's helpful. But all of these things only take us to a point. And I think no one's talking about this new space that we're in, and that's the space of, like, full integration.

Full integration, yes. Transcendence. Like David. David Data talks about Level three, which we could have a whole other podcast, which we probably will. I think that's the great.

Oh, I refer to the levels all the time. They know the levels.

Yeah, Level three. That's what it is. So. Yeah. And what's beautiful is that consciousness is shifting more into that. But we see the massive amount of separation which defines Level two through politics. And I mean, there's so many levels of separation which everything that we talked about, the addictions, the porn use, the all of the vile, tragic aspects of current experience, reality, are all products of level 2 consciousness. Which is to say that it's essential.

Just a little recap for people who don't know the levels. How would you define them?

Level one is like being naive and being open and being curious and being. Yeah, everything's fresh, everything's new. Actually, the best way to describe it is through analogy. And it's the analogy I heard, which is there's three groups of students, Level one, two, and three. Level one, when the Buddha died, they all cried because they were sad that they were never going to see the Buddha again. Level 2 didn't cry because they knew that emotions are temporary and not real. And so they were. Transcendence of awareness that emotions aren't real. Level three cried because they were human and they were grieving and they were feeling. And Level one looks like level three, but level three has gone through the hustle and grind of I'm not enough. I need to do more. I'm going to work more to achieve more. And then being unfulfilled by that, to actually move out of that phase into this transcendent phase. But we all have to go through that phase at level two, because if we stay in level one, we're naive and we're vulnerable and vulnerable to other powers and other energies influencing us versus us being the Creator of our reality.

And even in relationships, I would say level one is I need a relationship because I'm not enough. That's what you're supposed to do. That's what a man does, a woman does, does society does. Level two is I don't need a relationship. Relationships just hold me back. I'm totally good and totally self sufficient on my own. And you know, the gender wars, you know. And then level three is I allow and also choose.

Yes, a relationship. Exactly.

I allow it to happen. And I know I also must choose it because if I'm just in allowance, well then when there's conflict, I'm gonna say, I guess we're just not meant to be. You know, I'm also, I'm allowing what comes into my field. And then I'm feeling my response, and then my response is causing me to choose, which leads me to higher levels of allowing. And I feel that's where we're heading to as a society. And I do feel there's a big gap. There's a gap, you know, and I think that split is happening. I think in Covid it just became super, super obvious. And, and so what I'm recognizing is a lot of relationships where they were in the gap that one person's in new paradigm, one person's old paradigm. These relationships just can't work anymore, you know, because we're literally in different dimensions of seeing and being. And there's a lot less of us in the new paradigm. But it's almost like it's really hard to leave those relationships because you might see the potential in that person and you might know they have glimpses of this. But it takes, takes them getting to their own unique dark night of the soul if and when they choose. And by the way, not every person's lifetime is this. Not everyone's having these conversations. Not everyone's two hours deep into these conversations. So it's having that patience. I think the level 3 is like the patience of like divine timing.

Yes.

You know, and that's what this Amazon culture has us forgetting, you know, that relationships aren't my way, Burger King style, you know, extra pickles. But it's trusting the divine timing and unfoldment that like, maybe this person's like going through a divorce right now. Maybe they're your friend, maybe they're, you know, in their own journey. And like in divine timing, you will find each other and then it will all make sense.

Yes.

And there will be their own unique set of hardships because we've incarnated on this, which means we have karma to burn. And it will just show you that and the heartbreak will just make you better. Yes, period.

Perfect.

Case in point. There you have it. So where can people connect with you and also learn how to write a book from you?

So my website, CyrusKingClem.com or also Instagram, same name spelled S Y, R I S. No one thinks that. And I have one course, it's Evergreen, and I do live runs of it. It's called so youo Want to Write a Book. Because last year I helped with over eight books get traditionally published and even more self published. So that's been one main outlet that I've had and ways that I've supported people. And yeah, anyone that's interested in the course can reach out there. Anyone who's interested in learning more. What does it take? What does it look like to write a book? I've done it a lot and so I know the whole process and I've actually put that whole process into that course. And if you feel like you want the support of someone to go through that with you, I have some availability for consulting and work. So that's, that's one way and one big way that I give back and connect with people.

Well, I highly recommend. He's an amazing writer, just like he is a speaker. So we will have those links below. Well, thank you so much for coming on, guys. This was a fucking master's dissertation. Ph. Ph.D. in one. What? Like, this is like the conversation of conversations of relationship. So go back re listen to it, share it with your friends, share it with your partner, share with your ex, share it on your Instagram stories. Like, this is how we have better conversations is to be like, oh my God, listen to this podcast. I just had tons of aha moments. DM me after. Let's have a conversation. If we want to have these types of conversations, we need to show people, this is the level I'm fucking with. You know, this is where, this is where I'm on. I'm on new paradigm territory. If you're talking to someone, like romantically, send them this podcast. Just like, just imagine the depth that you'll go through. Like here, here's one thing. Back when I was on the dating apps, do you know what my opening question was to people? I would say, do you believe in free will or destiny? Not that their answer mattered, but because I wanted to know, could they have that level of conversation? So I feel like sharing podcasts like this show, like, can we have this kind of level of conversation? Because the thing is, if we make decisions of relationship out of scarcity, well, we're just going to end up with this exact same problems that we had in our previous relationships, that if we put ourselves out there, that this is the level of conversation and depth that I am at. Well, then you're weeding out the people who are not and inviting people who, they may not be wearing the poncho, you know, but they actually have a great amount of depth to them. So share this and also leave a review for it on the iTunes Store and share with me like your thoughts, any other things that you would love us to dive into on the podcast, what you're loving. It's super supportive. And as a free gift, I will send you my Womb meditation, which is a meditation to connect to your sacred womb space. Super helpful for the feminine. So just take a write a review, take a screenshot of it and email it over to me@saharaamsaharose.com we will send you that meditation. Thank you so much for tuning in. You're like a OG that you're here till the very end. So kudos to you. We're all, we're all gonna hang out in Lemuria together. It's happening. So I really appreciate you being here. Cheers to creating more love in this new paradigm and I'll see you on the next episode. Trust your intuition, trust your inner wisdom. Trust your inner guidance. So trust your intuition, intuition, Trust your inner wisdom. Trust you in the guidance.