The Hard Stuff Is OK! With Sherry Belul

Yeah, we're live!

Shawn! Holy moly!

Sherry! Welcome to the Hard Stuff Is Okay debrief, everyone. Sherry and I just had an intense meeting for the first part on growth day. A very, very sweet person. Had a lot of hard stuff, I think, that was pent up for for years and years and years and is maybe a little bit more extroverted than I'm usually like, I don't wanna say comfortable with, but it was a lot of energy and a lot of tough things this person was going through to the point where we couldn't interrupt, which is as coaches is a very interesting thing because that's a tricky business in itself to acknowledge someone, to hold the space, and to get to the coaching things or the group task things that we need to do. So Sherry and I started this group years ago over the book Bittersweet from Susan Cain, talking about the hard things. And I think we're gonna just start with how do we handle and take care of ourselves after an emotional meeting where it's really intense?

Yeah, but I'm going to add to that, Shawn, um, that, you know, not only were we, um, you know, coming from a group, and there are a lot of people in the world right now feeling a lot of hard stuff, right? And I don't think it's uncommon. I, over the weekend, had encountered several other people, really a lot of— there's just, there's a lot going on. And we were, we were laughing before we went live about like Yeah, the hard stuff's okay, but it's also like, what happens when it's just like pummeling? Whether it's— yeah, us or someone else is being pummeled and we're witnessing it. I think, I think probably anyone listening to this might have this experience. Maybe not. I keep wondering, are there some people in the world who maybe aren't, aren't going through hard stuff? It seems like almost everyone I know is.

Yeah, I'm not sure if it's like we're just aware of more of it because of how information is exchanged now, or— but it has felt like probably since COVID it's a constant, like, things are going wrong everywhere, or things are going wrong, like, personally, you know? Like, this year has been a trial of personal tests of How are you going to handle family stuff? How are you going to handle health? How are you going to handle— and I think maybe this is what I've noticed, maybe you have a thought on this. It's one thing if it's like one person getting pummeled, but like I had a friend have a house burned down and now his wife might be getting laid off. And like, yeah, you know, a colleague get injured at work. Like, it's just like everyone around me is also going through a constant series of these hard things where like one or not, one would be enough. Like one would be great. Like, you know, I think as coaches we train to handle those kind of episodic moments, but it's a different game when it's consistent. You know, how do you, how are you thinking about through that?

Yeah, I love, and I love that we're talking about this because part of it, right, is like I was just on the phone for a long time with a friend this morning Transparency, I was bawling my eyes out, right? Like so many things, so many losses. And one of the things that we kept coming back to is this is what is. Like no matter how much, like, so when we say the hard stuff is okay, it's kind of a funny name because it has to be okay, right? Because what else is there? I mean, you know, there's, there's just a lot of things that we as humans we don't have control over. We can control— control— we can, um, look at how we respond to things. We can look at how we are with each other. We can look at how we take care of ourselves. But the— yeah, so yeah, and I, I'm gonna circle back to what you were just saying about what happens when it's not even in our— just in our own lives, but the people that we know It feels like a very consistent sort of pummeling. Maybe to me, Shawn, this is the first step. To me, the first step is just being able to say, wow, wow, this is a lot. And it's not just me, it's a lot of people I know, and feeling my heart open to that.

Mm-hmm. Yeah, I think that that's spot on. And, you know, actually, one of the things we've had in this group has been being okay with the emotions that come with the hard stuff. You know, it's like that permissiveness. But I almost wonder if there's still this, like, idea I'm noticing for me that, like, oh, I just wish I was back in the phase of my life when, like, everything was going happily, you know? And how do we get back to there? And, like, the idea of the group is like, you don't ever get back to there. You know, it's that these are the human experiences we have to deal with in order to move forward, you know?

Well, and I love what you just said because I was just— this is one of the things I was saying to my friend. I kept saying, I just want to go back. And of course, that's— I mean, it's actually a ridiculous thing to say. There's no going back. And I do wonder, I noticed for myself how much that resistance to what is adds to the suffering, right?

Absolutely. Yeah. The wanting to change the situation so desperately so you don't feel bad or you don't, you know, aren't experiencing the negative feelings, I'll put in air quotes, um, actually increases the friction of it. It's putting more weight on it, so it's causing more, um, pain. Like you said, I just restated what you said, but no, no, no, but that was great, you know.

And I'm gonna give it— I'm gonna give a really simple example because this is probably one of the most— like, there's absolutely nothing to be done that we had to put our cat to sleep last week, right? Like, and we had her for 16 and a half years. Her sister— her sister, she wasn't really a sister, but her best friend died last year. So it's hardly— I've hardly gotten over that. And I was thinking about like, so I walk in the house and I'm like, oh, you know, I— and I realized today that it's like, I could walk in the house and be like extra kind to myself. Oh honey, I know this is hard. Instead of like walking the house and being like, I wish she were here, I wish she were here. There's a big difference, right? Because one of them, I'm just like fighting it. Like, I miss her, I want to hold her, where is she, I wish you were here. She's not coming, she's not coming back. And I think that what I could be doing is just being like more like, I know, I know this is hard. I mean, that's what we do for each other, right? Like, I know, I hear you, it's hard.

Yeah, yeah. And you know, we often talk about like grief reminding you of other grief. You know, I had a cat years ago, his name was Slider. Oh, but he was a great, great little fuzzy guy. Long-haired, like wake up and have the bed head thing. Um, but what struck with me, instead of feeling sad for him passing this time around, I remember that he would surprise me sometimes where I'd like fall asleep without like a shirt on and he'd like lick my armpits, which is the worst way to get woken up. Because the cat song is very rough. And like the split second of panic and confusion of like, what is going on on my body? And he's just like looking at me like, hey, what's up? You know, I'm like, uh, you know, I need like snuggle up. Uh, I just remembered of that like joyful moment, you know, of like, you know, these pets never really leave us too, you know. He's, he's gone, but he's still I still guard my armpits at night. Like, it's Shawn, little weirdo.

Yeah, well, and you know, and so I think, I think this is like the real crux of it, right? Like, it's that, um, it's allowing ourselves the feelings. I think we always go away allowing ourselves the feelings but not drowning in them. But not pretending they don't exist, but also acknowledging the love. And you know, it's like, it's like a big old club sandwich of stuff, right?

And yeah, it's the multitudes.

Thank you. I love that you say— I just wait every time for you to say that, right?

I, I kind of, I kind of felt we were leading people up to that, so Um, yeah, and I think it's tricky, right?

It's really tricky because also, well, like, one of the things— let's go back to, like, so for me, it's like going through like a series of losses. And yeah, and a lot of people that I know happen to be going through some hard stuff. And I think the other question, and this comes back to us as coaches, you know, and I think about this a lot, like, what am I doing for my energy? You know, what am I doing to take care of myself? Because it's exhausting. And I think we can't separate out, um, we can't separate out self-care from the hard stuff, right?

Yeah, I think they're one and the same, you know. I, I think I mean, something you said that was really interesting is like to not sit in the feelings. I think feelings are action indicators that the energy needs to go somewhere. And that could be a conversation with a good friend, a piece of art, a quiet evening reading a book, you know, double down and putting it into your work. I think feelings are a call for movement. Either spiritually, physically, emotionally, but like something needs to get transferred because when it gets stuck in you, that's when I feel, for me, that's when I have the hardest times.

Yeah.

And being conscious of that. And so like, I have like a checklist of like, when I'm really feeling down, it's like go for a walk, it's read a book, it's play some music, it's listen to music, it's, you know, talk to Ashley. I have a couple of good friends on my, like, and it's a long list. And these times where we're getting pummeled by everything, right? Sometimes that list doesn't work and what do you do? And like, there was a time a month ago where I got through my list and everything that I was trying to do just made me angrier about what was going on, you know? And so you could feel but the energy is supposed to go out into that long walk, and now I feel worse. Like, what's, what's kind of going on there? And like, I don't have a good answer for what to do in those situations. I'm not sure if you—

I do.

You do? All right.

Well, I— the only reason I do is because this is what I was talking to my friend about this morning, because I have a very long list of things that I can do, right? Like the same as you. I'm not feeling very you know, well, I'm feeling grief, whatever. Here's some things to do, right? And there's a lot of things. And my friend said, that sounds tiring. And I said, immediately, I was like, I'm really tired. And she said, on that list, do you ever just have do nothing? Like, try nothing, stop trying, just be. And I realized, like, sometimes going for a walk or meditating or running or talking to a friend, those are all great. And then sometimes what those are is my system saying, I don't want this, save me, get me out of this. And maybe in those times— it's not always going to be that, but maybe in those times it's like just to surrender. I don't know, I'm certainly open to trying it because I think, yeah, I think sometimes, sometimes the frantic grabbing for the tool to feel better is in itself exhausting.

It can be, I agree with that. And That hard day that I was talking about, like, I just eventually gave up and was like, I'm just going to feel how I feel for the rest of the day. Oh, and like, I took— I think I took 3 naps that day, you know, had like— I basically looked like a depressed person because that's how I felt. And I'm like, I'm going to like put on the armor of how— or reflect how I'm feeling. Went for like a 2.5 meandering— like, I went for a walk because it's on my checklist, but I didn't go because it's on the checklist. It's just, I'm just gonna go and see where my legs take me. Yeah, I want to be— I want to be in nature and like listen to birds and like, you know. So I went to a place and sat on the bench for a while and just kind of existed.

Yeah.

And the next day I was able to kind of like, okay, ready to get going. So yeah, there's something to that surrendering or that accepting without resistance. It's like, I'm gonna float on this stream for a little bit because everything that I'm trying to do to swim is pulling me further down. Towards the waterfall.

Yes.

Let's, let's relax.

You know what, I love, I love that because I think what you're saying, yeah, is, is one way to respond. I think that the, the trick, right, is that we have to be really present in the moment to know what, you know, like, because sometimes that, that's exactly, I think, what we need to do. But then if it happens 3 or 4 or 5 days in a row, we might have to say to ourselves, oh wait, you know, do I need to do something else? There's no like one right answer, which I think is part of this, right? Yeah. But I love— I mean, for me, I know that we're almost at our time, but I think doing these with you To me, it's like opening up the conversation is the first step, like, because it helps, you know, it helps us understand, like, well, where am I in this? If somebody's listening right now, or later, they might be like, yeah, do I want to take a walk? Do I want to take a nap? Do I want to just sit and do nothing until it comes to me? Do I— am I resisting? Am I trying? Am I not trying? Like, just to get a sense, like, what's going on for me?

Yeah. And yeah, through that understanding, I think you can have acceptance or you can have a, oh, this is what I really need right now.

Yeah.

Excuse me. In the moment.

Yeah.

And that changes and that's different for everyone. It's different, you know, for me in a day, you know, it's like, oh, I might feel more pressure in the morning, like, oh, I got to get some work done. And then By lunchtime, if I'm like fighting it, it's like, you know what, trying to hang on to this idea of what I have to get done today maybe isn't the best strategy. So yeah.

Yeah. I mean, what I'm hearing underneath all of this is like really a compassion and a spaciousness for ourselves. That's what I'm hearing. Like, there's not an answer. We don't know. But how can we just show up for ourselves or with a friend and like I'm doing with you right now. Like, you know, I'm talking to you and I'm thinking, I'm gonna go lie down for 15 minutes after this and just give myself a rest, you know, just until my system feels overloaded. Um, that's the next step, and then I'll see after that, you know.

Yeah, and sometimes it's just the next best step, is what our friend Brendan would say, you know. And 15 minutes with your eyes closed can change the world.

It honestly, yeah.

Or it could not, but that's what makes living life fun.

What are you gonna do for yourself after we go?

I have another call.

Okay.

And so I'm gonna go do that. And then, yeah, I think I might get outside, you know? Ashley and I had a thing this morning that I think went well and I'll say this code of these, I don't want to say it on the internet, but we'll know later this week, Sherri, and you know what that means.

Awesome.

About next steps. Awesome.

All right. Shawn, thank you so much. Talking to you always, it always lifts my energy. It's great to have friends.

Likewise. I appreciate you so much, Sherri. My heart's with you with the kitty, you know. And if you feel too sad, just imagine a cat licking my armpit. I know! And me jumping awake because it's hilarious, you know, and weird. Like, I don't recommend you have that experience, but if at my expense.

Oh my gosh, I love that. Thank you. Thank you. And anyone who's listening now, who listens later, Be good to yourself, be kind to yourself, and always remember to ask for help if you need it.

Yeah, we're here.

Thank you, Shawn.

Thanks, Sherri.

See you next time.

You got it.

Yay!